EPTWhy are Tanks so bad in SC2? - Page 4
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RUFinalBoss
United States266 Posts
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coolcor
520 Posts
beta patch 15 Siege Mode damage decreased from 60 to 50. Glad blizzard had all those small beta maps to lead to changes like this. But how do the people claiming blizzard hates tanks explain these changes? Patch 8 (version 0.10.0.14803) Build time decreased from 50 seconds to 45 seconds. [hide]Patch 11 (version 0.13.0.15250) Life increased from 150 to 160. Siege Mode splash damage now originates from the center of the target, rather than the impact location near the unit in order to maintain more reliable splash damage. | ||
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Fluid
Canada136 Posts
It was because that 10:30 second tank push you would lose most of your ling army with 3 tank blasts and then you had to fight marine on Muta it wasn't cause of Hydras. No, think even more back than that, back to the beta. Back when people thought sc2 was going to be like sc1, and zergs used brood war strategies : lings,mutas, hydras. They also used pure roach once they saw how many they could make but that was nerfed too. | ||
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Taku
Canada2036 Posts
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LimeNade
United States2125 Posts
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stormssc
Poland125 Posts
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Moosegills
United States558 Posts
On August 25 2012 05:26 Buchan wrote: Tanks are supposed to be space controlling units. In an RTS game as fast as SC2 the fact they cannot move and shoot at the same time is a huge detriment. We've all seen how useless tanks are against Protoss after the early game. In TvZ tanks become a liability in the late game since they cost 3 supply and are terrible against Ultras and useless against Broodlords. The fact that tanks are so bad is a large reason to why mech is not viable versus Protoss. If they just buffed the tank and added the battle hellion, mech would actually be mech against Toss in HoTS instead of what will likely be the 1a Warhound BH fest. All this post really says is I hate the way tanks are designed because they cannon move and shoot at the same time and I hate that broodlords counter them and they aren't good vs protoss. Just because you can't blindly mass tanks in every situation vs every race doesn't make them bad. This is just a balance QQ | ||
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tedster
984 Posts
On August 25 2012 05:32 Zandar wrote: Hydralisks are supposed to be high dps units. In an RTS game as fast as SC2 the fact they cannot move fast enough to even be able to shoot anything is a huge detriment. We've all seen how useless hydralisks are against Protoss after the mid game. In ZvT hydralisks are only good for base defense. Since terran upgrades are always ahead of zerg upgrades they do not even 1 shot anything. Hydralisks become a liability in the late game since they cost so much and are terrible against anything. If Terran has 10+ siege tanks spread and sieged in one area (plus a bunch of other units) it should be impossible for Zerg to break that area with just ground units without having a ton of ultras. But I've seen over and over again where terran spreads well to soak up the first baneling blasts and then bring in the marines and marines and marines and marines before you know it everything zerg had is bad. The fact that hydralisks are so bad is a large reason to why zerg not viable versus Protoss. If they just buffed the hydralisk and added more armor, dps, movement speed, burrow movement, hydralisks would actually be viable against Toss in HoTS instead of what will likely be the 1a roach fest. Sweet strawman bro | ||
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Aquila-
516 Posts
On August 25 2012 05:58 System42 wrote: LOL Tanks are really good I don't know what your talking about but youre obviously really dumb notice how no pro players have said one bad thing about hem they are still used in like every game as terran your probably 12 and in silver league for saying such a stupid thing please don't make another thread. Yea I forgot how every standard TvP involves tanks... | ||
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dabom88
United States3483 Posts
On August 25 2012 05:49 Esportsfanatic wrote: And like why the fuck can´t Broodlords shoot with Ultralisks? Because they're called Brood Lords, not Ultra Lords. | ||
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CrtBalorda
Slovenia704 Posts
But its true that they are not as iconic as they were in brood war. In fact nothing in starcraft 2 is iconic aside from the ultralisk. No I dont think the collossus is iconic, its a shitty unit. | ||
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Moosegills
United States558 Posts
On August 25 2012 05:32 Zandar wrote: Hydralisks are supposed to be high dps units. In an RTS game as fast as SC2 the fact they cannot move fast enough to even be able to shoot anything is a huge detriment. We've all seen how useless hydralisks are against Protoss after the mid game. In ZvT hydralisks are only good for base defense. Since terran upgrades are always ahead of zerg upgrades they do not even 1 shot anything. Hydralisks become a liability in the late game since they cost so much and are terrible against anything. If Terran has 10+ siege tanks spread and sieged in one area (plus a bunch of other units) it should be impossible for Zerg to break that area with just ground units without having a ton of ultras. But I've seen over and over again where terran spreads well to soak up the first baneling blasts and then bring in the marines and marines and marines and marines before you know it everything zerg had is bad. The fact that hydralisks are so bad is a large reason to why zerg not viable versus Protoss. If they just buffed the hydralisk and added more armor, dps, movement speed, burrow movement, hydralisks would actually be viable against Toss in HoTS instead of what will likely be the 1a roach fest. LOL this post.. wp sir :D | ||
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DinoMight
United States3725 Posts
Tanks are still very good when used correctly. If you have the right number of stim MMM in front of them, they can be effective even against protoss. Tanks in defensive positions on the high ground shred Protoss units. Comparing them to Colossi is not fair for several reasons. First of all, Colo are significantly more expensive, and the upgrade costs twice as much. Secondly, Vikings can fly over an entire ground army and attack the Colossus head on. This is different than with tanks, where the Terran's bio ball is physically standing between your units and the tanks. Versus Zerg, tanks are amazing. I don't know what SC2 games you have been watching. Same with TvT. | ||
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[Azn]Nada
United States275 Posts
Everytime I see this, I want to punch my monitor. Gone are the hilariously amazing BW days of 70 Damage Siege tanks that cost 2 supply; now they do HALF the damage, shitty as fuck upgrades, cost 3 supply, and 25 more gas. And on the Blizzard site, it still says SC2 tanks are more expensive but "all the greeeaaattttt development the Dominion has done makes the tank worth it" what the FUCK did they spend all the time upgrading the tanks to do? Deal less damage, get countered by more units, and have more resource cost? It's simply rediculous. Legit, Dustin balder probably got shot in the face with one when he was a kid. I'm really amazed when terrans try to pull out tanks; other than TvT, their only current legitamate use is vs. banelings. In HOTS, think about what counters them: zerglings, swarm hosts (induces constant friendly-fire), vipers with abduct and dark swarm, mutalisks, broodlords, etc. More than HALF THE ZERG ARSENAL IS BUILT TO COUNTER TANKS. Protoss have immortals and zealots (which is why tanks are pretty useless in PvT in the first place), and now we get to see the 22 range tempest make tanks look like little shits. Tanks are simply retarded atm. useless + retarded | ||
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Holgerius
Sweden16951 Posts
 I'm not even nearly good enough at Sc2 to even begin to analyze what's missing or whatever, but the fact that the sound of sieging tanks doesn't make Protoss players piss their pants makes me sad. | ||
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OkStyX
Canada1199 Posts
On August 25 2012 06:00 Fluid wrote: No, think even more back than that, back to the beta. Back when people thought sc2 was going to be like sc1, and zergs used brood war strategies : lings,mutas, hydras. They also used pure roach once they saw how many they could make but that was nerfed too. I did play in the beta and I remember , but still I think it was mostly cause tanks basically 1 or 2 hit most of Z's ground units except for roachs which made it near impossible to actually engage a terran. | ||
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nakam
Sweden245 Posts
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setzer
United States3284 Posts
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Sandermatt
Switzerland1365 Posts
On August 25 2012 06:04 dabom88 wrote: Because they're called Brood Lords, not Ultra Lords. We need a "Greatest Spire" that will allow you to morph Brood Lords into Ultra Lords ;-) . | ||
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[Azn]Nada
United States275 Posts
On August 25 2012 06:08 DinoMight wrote: Saying tanks are bad because a unit that is designed precisely to counter them counters them is pretty silly IMO. Tanks are still very good when used correctly. If you have the right number of stim MMM in front of them, they can be effective even against protoss. Tanks in defensive positions on the high ground shred Protoss units. Comparing them to Colossi is not fair for several reasons. First of all, Colo are significantly more expensive, and the upgrade costs twice as much. Secondly, Vikings can fly over an entire ground army and attack the Colossus head on. This is different then with tanks, where the Terran's bio ball is physically standing between your units and the tanks. Tanks would be AMAZING if "a unit" was designed to counter them. The problem is, 50% of the zerg units directly counter them (other than banelings, everything is cost-effective against tanks) and protoss have zealots, immortals, and tempests, all of which are designed to rape tanks. It's rediculous | ||
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