Anytime <Arcadia II> Midas Anytime <Arkanoid> Midas Anytime <Tau Cross> Midas Anytime <Sin Peaks of Baekdu> Anytime <Arcadia II> Midas
My personal prediction?
Ode to the DT
(Original song by Monty Python)
I'm a lurkerjack and out of sight I sleep all day and I work all night He's a lurkerjack and out of sight He sleeps all day and he works all night
/ G - CE7 Am7 / D D7 GC G / :
I cut down lings, I eat my lunch I go to the hatchery On Wednesdays I go dropping And have buttered drones for tea He cuts down lings... He's a lurkerjack...
/ G - C Am7 / D D7 G - / G - C A7 / D7 - GC G /
I cut down lings, I skip and jump I love to press with sairs I put on women's clothing And hang around by lairs He cuts down lings... He's a lurkerjack...
I cut down lings, I wear high heels Suspendies and a bra I wish I'd been a girlie Just like our Tassadar He cuts down lings... He's a lurkerjack...
I have mixed feelings about this.......I want Anytime to win because of Legend of the Fall and a TvP final with NaDa which would be awesome..........but on the other hand I want to root for Midas since this is his first semifinal and he worked so hard and I think he deserves it
After a seemingly crowded group stage, it's nice how the semi-finals have shaken out. Can't imagine a better group of four (ok maybe Bisu instead of GF, but what can I say Bisu just didn't cut it)
Whoever wins it would be a happy ending in some way. If Nada wins he gets his golden mouse, if midas wins thats like huge for him, and if anytime wins then thats awesome too because of the Legend of the Fall. I would like to see 2 Epic TvP series though rather than a TvT final.
whatever. Anytime is probably one of if not the best PvTer out there and he got to this point winning against a bunch of Zergs. I... like most people in this thread it seems O.o want to see him win just so Nada will crush him in the finals!
I want Midas to win but I lost confidence in him at WCG and in the games immediately following WCG (particularly vs Aqua...Mr. "TvZ is easy"...). If Anytime watched Draco and Cobo, then he probably has some ideas ready.
Could someone be kind enough to point out to this poster the link to the playsc live stream? Please don't ask me to use the search thingy, most of you most have it in your bookmarks .
i think anytime will win after all cuz we got Arcadia twice which is difficult tvsp map for terrans, but its midas we r talking about never underestimate "crybaby terran"..
On November 03 2006 01:00 Da_PlayerX wrote: i think anytime will win after all cuz we got Arcadia twice which is difficult tvsp map for terrans, but its midas we r talking about never underestimate "crybaby terran"..
Arcadia is one of the most balanced maps ever, especially in PvT.
hi one page ....... djetter style arcadia may be balanced but its still difficult for terrans to play vs toss on this map... from all the games i watched on it i reach to this conclusion
PvsT 4-4 => balanced ZvsP 8-11 => Protoss>Zerg on a macro map, huh TvsZ 10-14 => Terrans start to own Zerg on that map after a 11-0 streak in favor of Z
Anytime did a bit of damage on midas nat before lifting in the shuttle, dropping midas main and taking some turrets/machine shop/refinery out. Dt still alive...
Ok finally taken down by scan but that was successful for sure.
On November 03 2006 02:20 EmilyJieunChoi wrote: 1-0....I can't see Midas winning this. But perhaps we can see a Boxeresque (although not as sweet) come back versus protoss (PuSan vs BoxeR?)
there was a funny part where anytime stasised 5 tanks and then stormed them doing zero damage, the commentators screamed when stasis was cast and stopped screaming halfway through as storm hit, they were left confused =p
whoah the commercials are using heroes of might and magic 3 music, <3!
I feel like, Midas has started to slump somewhat. He is not the same dominating Terran he was pre-WCG. While it isn't over, I wouldn't place my bets on Midas winning either...
On November 03 2006 02:23 EmilyJieunChoi wrote: I feel like, Midas has started to slump somewhat. He is not the same dominating Terran he was pre-WCG. While it isn't over, I wouldn't place my bets on Midas winning either...
he came back and crushed iris! i'm telling you 1 game doesn't mean a thing, he's still in this
thats what i meant when i said tvsp on arcadia is so hard... and my words will be cofirmed again(if fifth game is played), nvm map stats 4:4(5:4 pvst now)!
midas looked undoubtedly happy after that, anytime's cheese didnt work, midas probably faced that strategy during practice because of how easily well prepared he was for it
Had Midas not had his hacks on, AnyTime probablyw ould have been able to break through without much of a fight. I liked AnyTime's build, but Midas showed blatant hack and countered Anytime's perfectly
Arkanoid is incredibly difficult PvT, so of course Anytime had a cheese build in mind. The strategy was smart, and it would probably have succeeded if Midas hadn't gone two-rax.
Nothing is going wrong yet for Anytime. Tau Cross, however, is the decisive game. Anytime, unless he has some good cheese, will not win on Peaks. So he needs this game.
On November 03 2006 02:42 EmilyJieunChoi wrote: Had Midas not had his hacks on, AnyTime probablyw ould have been able to break through without much of a fight. I liked AnyTime's build, but Midas showed blatant hack and countered Anytime's perfectly
Anytime got corss position correct first try? sounds liek a hack to me omg they were both hacking wtf? get real -.-;;
On November 03 2006 02:42 EmilyJieunChoi wrote: Had Midas not had his hacks on, AnyTime probablyw ould have been able to break through without much of a fight. I liked AnyTime's build, but Midas showed blatant hack and countered Anytime's perfectly
Anytime got corss position correct first try? sounds liek a hack to me omg they were both hacking wtf? get real -.-;;
On November 03 2006 02:42 EmilyJieunChoi wrote: Had Midas not had his hacks on, AnyTime probablyw ould have been able to break through without much of a fight. I liked AnyTime's build, but Midas showed blatant hack and countered Anytime's perfectly
Anytime got corss position correct first try? sounds liek a hack to me omg they were both hacking wtf? get real -.-;;
rofl, take sarcasm t.t
sarcasm doesnt travel well through text... especially since you were OMG ANYTIME = TEH PWNAGE before...
pretty stupid built for anytime imo. its just too ez to defend against that for terra with bunkers and shit on that map, i hope anytime has a better plan for next map.
I didn't say that. If i recall correctly I said I think Midas is slumping. Then when Midas won, I believe I said gg yay way to prove me wrong midas. thanks.
On November 03 2006 02:50 EmilyJieunChoi wrote: I didn't say that. If i recall correctly I said I think Midas is slumping. Then when Midas won, I believe I said gg yay way to prove me wrong midas. thanks.
okay you didnt really say it to that blatent extent, however you did imply somewhat of that message anywhoz, lets not ruin the thread eh? keep this place clean no harm done right?
anytiem just lost both reavs killing a tank in midas' main. and he has 7 gates. 2 at nat that i didn't see. midas with 2nd nat coming up and many tanks.
.. Anytime forgot psionic storm and had to morph archons during a fight <- TT
Btw, I missed game 1 and 2, were they also midas sitting with his nat + one more exp and doing nothing?
In SC2 I want a special anti-turtle function, if player X doesn't move his units in Y minutes his units get bored and start to randomly kill player X's buildings.
Awful decisions and play from late midgame and onwards by anytime, but a really cool start.
- Arbiters is not for all-in attack without stasis. - Not any obs because of this, lots shitloads to mines. - Waited too long with first attack against 2nd expo from midas. - Lost goons stupidly when pushing too deep after his zealots died. - then got hurt cause he didn't have obs and goons to deal with vults
etc etc
Very disappointing game. Midas built stuff and sieged up and waited for Anytime to self destruct against him.
On November 03 2006 03:23 Luhh wrote: Awful decisions and play from late midgame and onwards by anytime, but a really cool start.
- Arbiters is not for all-in attack without stasis. - Not any obs because of this, lots shitloads to mines. - Waited too long with first attack against 2nd expo from midas. - Lost goons stupidly when pushing too deep after his zealots died. - then got hurt cause he didn't have obs and goons to deal with vults
etc etc
Very disappointing game. Midas built stuff and sieged up and waited for Anytime to self destruct against him.
Now peaks is coming up, the map where Anytime's chances are very slim to get a win. Dang. Oh well, you don't reach a starleague final playing like that!
Our Adun, who art in Aiur... Hallowed be thy name. Thy Anytime come Fall StarLeagues won. On Peaks as it is on Gaema -Amen- The gods GARIMTO and Reach are watching you Anytime... make us proud!!
On November 03 2006 03:27 Luhh wrote: Now peaks is coming up, the map where Anytime's chances are very slim to get a win. Dang. Oh well, you don't reach a starleague final playing like that!
well, you dont reach a starleague final without winning on tough maps either
he better come up with some good shit or hes already dead
On November 03 2006 03:28 StarN wrote: PROTOSS FANS HUDDLE TOGETHER AND PRAY WITH ME!!
Our Adun, who art in Aiur... Hallowed be thy name. Thy Anytime come Fall StarLeagues won. On Peaks as it is on Gaema -Amen- The gods GARIMTO and Reach are watching you Anytime... make us proud!!
On November 03 2006 03:28 StarN wrote: PROTOSS FANS HUDDLE TOGETHER AND PRAY WITH ME!!
Our Adun, who art in Aiur... Hallowed be thy name. Thy Anytime come Fall StarLeagues won. On Peaks as it is on Gaema -Amen- The gods GARIMTO and Reach are watching you Anytime... make us proud!!
anytime is not confused according to me.i think he is determined to win watching his aggresive attacks and drops , but its baekdu which follows so maybe that's the end maybe not well see..
On November 03 2006 03:28 StarN wrote: PROTOSS FANS HUDDLE TOGETHER AND PRAY WITH ME!!
Our Adun, who art in Aiur... Hallowed be thy name. Thy Anytime come Fall StarLeagues won. On Peaks as it is on Gaema -Amen- The gods GARIMTO and Reach are watching you Anytime... make us proud!!
huh ?
lol what huh? its starN's legend of the fall uh..rally. song thing.
On November 03 2006 03:28 StarN wrote: PROTOSS FANS HUDDLE TOGETHER AND PRAY WITH ME!!
Our Adun, who art in Aiur... Hallowed be thy name. Thy Anytime come Fall StarLeagues won. On Peaks as it is on Gaema -Amen- The gods GARIMTO and Reach are watching you Anytime... make us proud!!
huh ?
lol what huh? its starN's legend of the fall uh..rally. song thing.
I knew what he was talking about. It's just that it was so geek... It's just a game, not a religion. What's the matter with you?
On November 03 2006 03:28 StarN wrote: PROTOSS FANS HUDDLE TOGETHER AND PRAY WITH ME!!
Our Adun, who art in Aiur... Hallowed be thy name. Thy Anytime come Fall StarLeagues won. On Peaks as it is on Gaema -Amen- The gods GARIMTO and Reach are watching you Anytime... make us proud!!
huh ?
lol what huh? its starN's legend of the fall uh..rally. song thing.
Fuck fuck fuck, I'm disappointed that Anytime had a seizure last game. He'd better do something absolutely magical now, or we won't see one last macrofest on Arcadia II.
On November 03 2006 03:28 StarN wrote: PROTOSS FANS HUDDLE TOGETHER AND PRAY WITH ME!!
Our Adun, who art in Aiur... Hallowed be thy name. Thy Anytime come Fall StarLeagues won. On Peaks as it is on Gaema -Amen- The gods GARIMTO and Reach are watching you Anytime... make us proud!!
huh ?
lol what huh? its starN's legend of the fall uh..rally. song thing.
I knew what he was talking about. It's just that it was so geek... It's just a game, not a religion. What's the matter with you?
Congratulations on making a post as retarded as your signature! Go Midas
On November 03 2006 03:28 StarN wrote: PROTOSS FANS HUDDLE TOGETHER AND PRAY WITH ME!!
Our Adun, who art in Aiur... Hallowed be thy name. Thy Anytime come Fall StarLeagues won. On Peaks as it is on Gaema -Amen- The gods GARIMTO and Reach are watching you Anytime... make us proud!!
huh ?
lol what huh? its starN's legend of the fall uh..rally. song thing.
I knew what he was talking about. It's just that it was so geek... It's just a game, not a religion. What's the matter with you?
Congratulations on making a post as retarded as your signature! Go Midas
Oh, come on! What is more retarted. My post or: "PROTOSS FANS HUDDLE TOGETHER AND PRAY WITH ME!!" Ha Ha And btw, I also hope Midas wins.
On November 03 2006 03:28 StarN wrote: PROTOSS FANS HUDDLE TOGETHER AND PRAY WITH ME!!
Our Adun, who art in Aiur... Hallowed be thy name. Thy Anytime come Fall StarLeagues won. On Peaks as it is on Gaema -Amen- The gods GARIMTO and Reach are watching you Anytime... make us proud!!
huh ?
lol what huh? its starN's legend of the fall uh..rally. song thing.
I knew what he was talking about. It's just that it was so geek... It's just a game, not a religion. What's the matter with you?
Congratulations on making a post as retarded as your signature! Go Midas
Oh, come on! What is more retarted. My post or: "PROTOSS FANS HUDDLE TOGETHER AND PRAY WITH ME!!" Ha Ha And btw, I also hope Midas wins.
Your post, his was meant to be funny (and it was)!
On November 03 2006 03:43 Cbreaker wrote: yes his build was efficient in three ways - rush potential, tech, AND economy
yes except hes teching in the wrong direction, he can't go m&m entire game, teching would be the disadvantage of that build. rush potential and economy is the point of gundam
after some kills anytime moves out with a moderate zeal/goon army toward top left, carrier harass still working there but many tanks so midas cant attack yet
On November 03 2006 03:54 Cbreaker wrote: wow, it seemed like midas went afk for a few minutes....not nearly the amount of anti air he should have with his first econ advantage
yeah either that or the carriers did wayyyy more damage than i thought
On November 03 2006 03:55 Ketama)Djin( wrote: it was such a bad decision of midas to push vs the carriers because he lost so many tanks and kills nothing
GG
FINAL GAME !!!!!111
it was better than just sitting there and letting anytime expo freely
The reaver anytime dropped at the 2 o clock expo = ART. Made it so if midas had sent goliaths to attack the carriers from behind (when they were attacking midas' cc), the reaver + carriers would have raped :D
On November 03 2006 03:55 Plexa wrote: nooo dont give up the fight midass!!!
On November 03 2006 03:55 Ketama)Djin( wrote: it was such a bad decision of midas to push vs the carriers because he lost so many tanks and kills nothing
it was better than just sitting there and letting anytime expo freely
but he didnt kill a single unit with 2 control groups of metal
On November 03 2006 03:57 Cbreaker wrote: these players dont even look at their coaches during the pep talk..some relationship
Why? It's like an iron rule - athletes never look at their coaches. They're supposed to drink water and look far away into the horizon staring right the eye of the tiger.
On November 03 2006 03:57 FrozenArbiter wrote: The reaver anytime dropped at the 2 o clock expo = ART. Made it so if midas had sent goliaths to attack the carriers from behind (when they were attacking midas' cc), the reaver + carriers would have raped :D
On November 03 2006 04:06 One Page Memory wrote: OMG, my boss wonders what happening, because I should have left work before 15 mins, but I can't unstick from live reports ...
If Midas loses this, he will earn the nickname as "4th game choke" - remember his 4th game vs savior on 815 where he had a very good chance to take the series...
1. Midas saw the gates. But what was he going to do? He had already invested in FD (1-fac, mines first, late siege) when what he needed was two-fac tanks with seige.
2. Call Anytime's 4-gate goon push "cheese" if you will, but it takes balls of steel to do such an extreme build on the fifth and deciding game of a major semi-finals, after coming back from 1-2.
3. As I write this, Anytime has left his booth, but Midas is lingering. Again. Aww breaks my heart.
On November 03 2006 04:16 HonestTea wrote: 1. Midas saw the gates. But what was he going to do? He had already invested in FD (1-fac, mines first, late siege) when what he needed was two-fac tanks with seige.
better placed mines, more mines, cancel cc, build 2 rines, bunker on ramp, scv blocking, build cc in base and he still wouldve been up. I know this is wild guessing but I think that game was thrown and maybe the entire series was thrown
On November 03 2006 04:16 HonestTea wrote: 1. Midas saw the gates. But what was he going to do? He had already invested in FD (1-fac, mines first, late siege) when what he needed was two-fac tanks with seige.
2. Call Anytime's 4-gate goon push "cheese" if you will, but it takes balls of steel to do such an extreme build on the fifth and deciding game of a major semi-finals, after coming back from 1-2.
3. As I write this, Anytime has left his booth, but Midas is lingering. Again. Aww breaks my heart.
wow that was 4 gate? i thought it was someting like 1 gate, robo, 2 more gates then gogogogo
See, gentlemen, what we have here is the difference between a true champion and a player who loses the deciding games of semifinals against true champions like Savior and Anytime.
Added: Anytime has made me seriously reconsider my sexuality.
Anytime won because of Testie and Lx ahahah so now we have Anytime vs Nada final omg Anytime did nothinng after he won OSL last year and now just come from nowhere LOL !
On November 03 2006 04:16 HonestTea wrote: 1. Midas saw the gates. But what was he going to do? He had already invested in FD (1-fac, mines first, late siege) when what he needed was two-fac tanks with seige.
better placed mines, more mines, cancel cc, build 2 rines, bunker on ramp, scv blocking, build cc in base and he still wouldve been up. I know this is wild guessing but I think that game was thrown and maybe the entire series was thrown
Why on earth would he throw a god damn semi-final match...
On November 03 2006 04:17 PoP wrote: I wonder why Midas or anyone keeps going FD. It ALWAYS fails.
Just keep your damn rines at nat, make a bunker at choke and take your nat.
the more you push toss back the more time, map control you have, the safer your expo will be, the better integelligence you'll have of toss by how many goons he has. If midas wanted to just expand he couldve just built vultures, mined, expoed, and skipped the tank, i think arcadia is big enough to do that.
On November 03 2006 04:17 PoP wrote: I wonder why Midas or anyone keeps going FD. It ALWAYS fails.
Just keep your damn rines at nat, make a bunker at choke and take your nat.
Anyway I didn't watch the series but it looked like no one really won a game without the other screwing up, which kinda sucks. :/
And yeah, Midas heavily choking when he's leading 2-1 and the 4th game is deja-vu.
Great great finals upcoming though!
Isn't it interesting? A year ago FD was unbeatable. I think because strategies are cyclical, Midas keeps trying to catch Tosses with their pants down by using an outdated strategy.
Or, Midas is as mechanical as we all suspected he is. You almost never see him do anything daring. I think Midas strains too hard to play within his comfort zone. Players with solid fundamentals will have consistent success that way (GoodFriend, Midas, etc.) but without that extra dash of daring and the willingness to take creative risks, they will never make it to the top. (which is what makes StarCraft great)
I think this series was really good and dramatic, there were a lot of good plays, not just screwups
So let's all sing along now. You know the melody!!!
Ode to the DT
(Original song by Monty Python)
I'm a lurkerjack and out of sight I sleep all day and I work all night He's a lurkerjack and out of sight He sleeps all day and he works all night
/ G - CE7 Am7 / D D7 GC G / :
I cut down lings, I eat my lunch I go to the hatchery On Wednesdays I go dropping And have buttered drones for tea He cuts down lings... He's a lurkerjack...
/ G - C Am7 / D D7 G - / G - C A7 / D7 - GC G /
I cut down lings, I skip and jump I love to press with sairs I put on women's clothing And hang around by lairs He cuts down lings... He's a lurkerjack...
I cut down lings, I wear high heels Suspendies and a bra I wish I'd been a girlie Just like our Tassadar He cuts down lings... He's a lurkerjack...
On November 03 2006 04:17 PoP wrote: I wonder why Midas or anyone keeps going FD. It ALWAYS fails.
Just keep your damn rines at nat, make a bunker at choke and take your nat.
the more you push toss back the more time, map control you have, the safer your expo will be, the better integelligence you'll have of toss by how many goons he has. If midas wanted to just expand he couldve just built vultures, mined, expoed, and skipped the tank, i think arcadia is big enough to do that.
Well I'm not sure losing 6 rines and one/two vults is "safer" than just putting down a bunker while expanding and going vults/spider mines. That's what Nada often does when he goes FD btw, and I think it's far more effective.
On November 03 2006 04:22 HonestTea wrote: Or, Midas is as mechanical as we all suspected he is. You almost never see him do anything daring. I think Midas strains too hard to play within his comfort zone. Players with solid fundamentals will have consistent success that way (GoodFriend, Midas, etc.) but without that extra dash of daring and the willingness to take creative risks, they will never make it to the top. (which is what makes StarCraft great)
EXACTLY, I have been saying this about Midas for the entire time he has been playing. He has absolutely NO pizazz in his game whatsoever. When he wins, it is because his build out muscles his opponent.
On November 03 2006 04:17 PoP wrote: I wonder why Midas or anyone keeps going FD. It ALWAYS fails.
Just keep your damn rines at nat, make a bunker at choke and take your nat.
the more you push toss back the more time, map control you have, the safer your expo will be, the better integelligence you'll have of toss by how many goons he has. If midas wanted to just expand he couldve just built vultures, mined, expoed, and skipped the tank, i think arcadia is big enough to do that.
True, but the whole idea of FD is to pressure the toss and perhaps even cripple them with the initial push. If you're not going to push all the way and just take the safe nat, you're better off if you just skip the marines and go siege before mines.
FD is not trying to catch toss with their pants down, the point of F anything is to expand as soon as you can, not to kill toss. 1 fact = expand, 2 fact = rush
On November 03 2006 04:25 zulu_nation8 wrote: FD is not trying to catch toss with their pants down, the point of F anything is to expand, not to kill toss. 1 fact = expand, 2 fact = rush
But actually moving out with your rines/tank does suck if your opponent builds more than one gate. From what I've seen Nada scouts quite early and puts a bunker at choke against 2 gates and moves out vs 1 gate, which sounds like the most reasonable idea to me. You just can't do shit vs 5-6 goons unless the P forgets to micro.
Actually, FD is a two pronged strategy. The point is to pressure the toss, and if they are not prepared for the pressure (like one gate robo or micro slip) you can end the game there with rallied units and mines. If not, you contain with mines (because 2 gate goon has slow obs) and expo.
On November 03 2006 04:17 PoP wrote: I wonder why Midas or anyone keeps going FD. It ALWAYS fails.
Just keep your damn rines at nat, make a bunker at choke and take your nat.
the more you push toss back the more time, map control you have, the safer your expo will be, the better integelligence you'll have of toss by how many goons he has. If midas wanted to just expand he couldve just built vultures, mined, expoed, and skipped the tank, i think arcadia is big enough to do that.
True, but the whole idea of FD is to pressure the toss and perhaps even cripple them with the initial push. If you're not going to push all the way and just take the safe nat, you're better off if you just skip the marines and go siege before mines.
that was a very successful FD, he pushed anytime all the way back to his base and saw the inside
On November 03 2006 04:27 Manifesto7 wrote: @ zulu
Actually, FD is a two pronged strategy. The point is to pressure the toss, and if they are not prepared for the pressure (like one gate robo or micro slip) you can end the game there with rallied units and mines. If not, you contain with mines (because 2 gate goon has slow obs) and expo.
yes, but nowadays no decent toss that goes one gate robo dies to 1 fact fd, two fact maybe, one fact impossible, because you can't get vult speed that fast and is only producing from one fact. And with two gate toss should have enough goons to not get pushed back far enough so they can't even expo. Either way expo timing should be the same, but FD is def the better opening than tank siege if your micro is perfect like midas'
absolutely i was more than sure midas will lose but he actually showed amazing defence skills, of course if we put away Arcadiall games which is so hard for the terrans vs tosses
On November 03 2006 04:30 mrmin123 wrote: I'm going to get less than 2 hours of sleep because I stayed up to watch this but it was fucking worth it. God fucking damn it was worth it.
On November 03 2006 04:16 HonestTea wrote: 1. Midas saw the gates. But what was he going to do? He had already invested in FD (1-fac, mines first, late siege) when what he needed was two-fac tanks with seige.
better placed mines, more mines, cancel cc, build 2 rines, bunker on ramp, scv blocking, build cc in base and he still wouldve been up.
is there a respectable terran player here that can comment on this. I do not believe that midas saw his gates and didn't do anything about it. Something feels wrong
im not a respectable terran, but im terran but i dont want to comment on if this possibility would have worked. all i want to say is: he saw the gates warping. while midas was pressuring with his first push -> rinez,vults (mines) and tank he was up the ramp and saw 3 GWs...
FD was developed because of maps like Luna, where Terrans cannot wall their ramp.
1. Build up to 6 marines and close choke. 2. Fac->Shop->Tank while researching Mines 3. Send your marines and your tank (and one SCV) to push 4. Rally vulture to your forces 5. When you reach toss base, your vulture should have caught up. 6. Attack with rines, mines, and tanks 7. AND THIS IS MOST CRITICAL - Expand at nat
FD Terran is most definetly not an anti-DT build. It is, when most effective, a counter to 1-gate expanding tosses (which was the trend a year ago). But the beauty of the strat is, even if it fails, with your mines and early pressure you can contain the toss and take your nat very, very safely while denying Toss nat.
It's not even that big of a deal if you lose your initial push forces (although retreat your tank if you can). A successful FD will make it so Terran takes their nat with no pressure, while Toss is cut off from their nat and contained.
This terrorized Tosses last year, until opening with two-gates became the norm.
Midas' FD failed because 1. Anytime went ranged 3-gate goon 2. Anytime got quick obs, rendering Midas' mines useless. 3. Midas was formulaic
I understand zulu is in disbelief, but I honestly think Midas just failed to react quickly enough. Even if he had reacted quickly he was in trouble, but his wits failed him I think. You can tell that he was desperate to do something, because he had his tanks and SCVs out at his ramp to make a last stand against the goon onslaught
yea and theres no way in hell midas has never practiced vs 3/4 gate (same thing) ob rush vs fd opening on arcadia. If he just stopped it even losing maybe 5 scvs he still would've been up. But by the time anytime's goons killed 2 (?) mines and arrived at midas' nat, midas' tank was getting repaired by 5 scvs on the ramp while his cc was still building. I know he built his rax kinda far in his base, didn't see where it was but at least couldve flown it back or something. He just shouldve done so much better to defend vs that rather than just having two tanks killed for no reason and defending with scvs in the end. He's the best tvp player in the world. I just, again, don't believe he did pretty much nothing to stop that.
All i was able to say after Midas's gg , was " YUPIIIIII ! " Day(9) expressed exactly what i am feeling : "All my favorite players are protoss" But i wont be sad if NaDa take the Golden Mouse . May the best "," win .
On November 03 2006 04:50 DeathBlow wrote: All i was able to say after Midas's gg , was " YUPIIIIII ! " Day(9) expressed exactly what i am feeling : "All my favorite players are protoss" But i wont be sad if NaDa take the Golden Mouse . May the best win .
lol yeah omg i cant fuckin wait for nada vs anytime finals now ><
i want the old nada times back, huge macro wars and a billion tanks running over everything.
Actually from the sound of it this is pretty much the *exact* same scenario as Midas vs Savior last MSL: Game 1: Midas doesn't play very well, gets crushed after a mid-long game (Arcadia 2 both games) Game 2: Both go for weird builds and Midas' opponent totally fails, Midas wins (Arkanoid today, The Eye vs Savior) Game 3: Pretty standard game with Midas winning with rock-solid play (Tau Cross today, RH3 vs Savior) Game 4: Midas takes a comfortable lead then gets overconfident, doesn't attack at the right timings and screws up his micro when he does, ends up losing (Sin Peaks today, 815 vs Savior) Game 5: Midas loses badly (Arcacia 2 both games).
On November 03 2006 04:58 PoP wrote: By the way, that time Savior won the finals 3-1 vs Nal_rA who was making a huge comeback and who'd won his semi 3-0 in a mirror matchup.
On November 03 2006 04:58 PoP wrote: By the way, that time Savior won the finals 3-1 vs Nal_rA who was making a huge comeback and who'd won his semi 3-0 in a mirror matchup.
lol sorry what do u mean ? dont get ur post ><
who won his semi in a 3-0 mirror matchup?.. ra?
Yeah. Well I'm being contaminated by Plexa probably, seeing coincidences/"patterns" everywhere. :D
On November 03 2006 04:40 HonestTea wrote: Midas' FD failed because 1. Anytime went ranged 3-gate goon 2. Anytime got quick obs, rendering Midas' mines useless. 3. Midas was formulaic
I understand zulu is in disbelief, but I honestly think Midas just failed to react quickly enough. Even if he had reacted quickly he was in trouble, but his wits failed him I think. You can tell that he was desperate to do something, because he had his tanks and SCVs out at his ramp to make a last stand against the goon onslaught
I just don't think you lose cuz you're "formulaic". I could be completely mistaken on this but I really don't think I am. There's no build that "counters" FD that well, especially on arcadia since the starting positions are pretty much as far as they could be. There's really not THAT many variations in tvp openings. At least there shouldn't be so many as to midas as not practiced 100 times vs them all. Something went wrong that game. Either midas didn't research siege at all, which i have no idea when you're supposed to, but i'm guessing right after you start your cc, midas lost on purpose, or midas got really really nervous and just forgot to react which is highly highly highly highly highly unlikely unless he's never seen the build before which is impossible, and even if he hadn't, it's 1 gate robo with another gate plus 2 more gates, I think even players like us could figure out the timing and how fast goons will get to your base. In other words, I don't think Midas failed to react quickly enough, he just didn't react. Midas is a progamer, his multitasking even for a progamer is excellent, anytime got observer before those goons, that rush was slow as hell, Midas had enough time to set up a defense. And I'm 1000% certain he knows that if he stopped the rush and built cc in base he still would've been up. So it's either, midas didn't research siege cuz I have no idea why, or Midas didn't react cuz i have no idea why. I'm confused, i don't know what just happened.
On November 03 2006 04:16 HonestTea wrote: 1. Midas saw the gates. But what was he going to do? He had already invested in FD (1-fac, mines first, late siege) when what he needed was two-fac tanks with seige.
better placed mines, more mines, cancel cc, build 2 rines, bunker on ramp, scv blocking, build cc in base and he still wouldve been up.
is there a respectable terran player here that can comment on this. I do not believe that midas saw his gates and didn't do anything about it. Something feels wrong
i believe that not losing 6 marines and a vulture like a moron would have helped, at least he then could have built a bunker at his nat, 4-rine bunker+2 tanks+scvs > goons
after losing those units it was pretty hard to stop those goons and even if he stopped them, shuttle + 4 zealot would follow
And to back up my case, watch midas vs cobo on azalea. That was same build anytime did minus robo and ob and with a proxy gate. Which means, anytime's build was a loooooooooooot slower since he actually had to get the observer out. Yet when Cobo got to Midas' base Midas' siege was almost done, just like last game when anytime was at Midas' base. Except anytime got to midas' base certainly later than cobo. wtf happened?
On November 03 2006 04:16 HonestTea wrote: 1. Midas saw the gates. But what was he going to do? He had already invested in FD (1-fac, mines first, late siege) when what he needed was two-fac tanks with seige.
better placed mines, more mines, cancel cc, build 2 rines, bunker on ramp, scv blocking, build cc in base and he still wouldve been up.
is there a respectable terran player here that can comment on this. I do not believe that midas saw his gates and didn't do anything about it. Something feels wrong
i believe that not losing 6 marines and a vulture like a moron would have helped, at least he then could have built a bunker at his nat
On November 03 2006 04:16 HonestTea wrote: 1. Midas saw the gates. But what was he going to do? He had already invested in FD (1-fac, mines first, late siege) when what he needed was two-fac tanks with seige.
better placed mines, more mines, cancel cc, build 2 rines, bunker on ramp, scv blocking, build cc in base and he still wouldve been up.
is there a respectable terran player here that can comment on this. I do not believe that midas saw his gates and didn't do anything about it. Something feels wrong
i believe that not losing 6 marines and a vulture like a moron would have helped, at least he then could have built a bunker at his nat, 4-rine bunker+2 tanks+scvs > goons
after losing those units it was pretty hard to stop those goons and even if he stopped them, shuttle + 4 zealot would follow
if he didn't lose the 6 rines and vulture he wouldn't have seen anytime's base let alone prepare for the rush. I don't think you can expand and defend a 1 base 4 gate bulldog and i'm sure midas knows that too so he would've used the ramp to help.
On November 03 2006 05:27 zulu_nation8 wrote: And to back up my case, watch midas vs cobo on azalea. That was same build anytime did minus robo and ob and with a proxy gate. Which means, anytime's build was a loooooooooooot slower since he actually had to get the observer out. Yet when Cobo got to Midas' base Midas' siege was almost done, just like last game when anytime was at Midas' base. Except anytime got to midas' base certainly later than cobo. wtf happened?
i haven't seen the cobo game, but maybe midas researched siege instea dof mines that game? ;o
On November 03 2006 04:16 HonestTea wrote: 1. Midas saw the gates. But what was he going to do? He had already invested in FD (1-fac, mines first, late siege) when what he needed was two-fac tanks with seige.
better placed mines, more mines, cancel cc, build 2 rines, bunker on ramp, scv blocking, build cc in base and he still wouldve been up.
is there a respectable terran player here that can comment on this. I do not believe that midas saw his gates and didn't do anything about it. Something feels wrong
i believe that not losing 6 marines and a vulture like a moron would have helped, at least he then could have built a bunker at his nat, 4-rine bunker+2 tanks+scvs > goons
after losing those units it was pretty hard to stop those goons and even if he stopped them, shuttle + 4 zealot would follow
if he didn't lose the 6 rines and vulture he wouldn't have seen anytime's base let alone prepare for the rush. I don't think you can expand and defend a 1 base 4 gate bulldog and i'm sure midas knows that too so he would've used the ramp to help.
Well he would have had at least one bunker, 2/3 tanks and spider mines layed by his first 1/2 vults (some of them near the bunker), which is I think enough to defend vs any kind of rush (maybe with scvs help). Anytime had to wait for obs so his attack probably didn't happen that early either.
And not moving out doesn't mean you can't scout, it's harder but you can at least check the goons count with your first vults and try to sneak one (or a scv) into the P's main.
Last post before bed. Maybe I haven't tvped in a long time, maybe i'm tired and didn't watch the games carefully, maybe i'm overanalyzing, maybe i missed something that was very important. But from what I saw, the timing just does, not, work, out. When the vod comes out I'm gonna test the two builds and see for myself. But if it doesn't work out, then there's about a 10-20 second gap in which midas was not doing anything at all which is just unexplainable. I'm really not usually the conspiracy theorist type but I have a more than vague feeling that, with the wandering not aiming at carriers goliaths from game 4 and the weird timing in game 5, this might've been staged. But I know that Midas chokes and chokes hard, so my rational feeling is that Midas just chokes a lot. So hopefully after the vod comes out I can get a better answer. Until then, good series and good night.
On November 03 2006 05:40 zulu_nation8 wrote: Last post before bed. Maybe I haven't tvped in a long time, maybe i'm tired and didn't watch the games carefully, maybe i'm overanalyzing, maybe i missed something that was very important. But from what I saw, the timing just does, not, work, out. When the vod comes out I'm gonna test the two builds and see for myself. But if it doesn't work out, then there's about a 10-20 second gap in which midas was not doing anything at all which is just unexplainable. I'm really not usually the conspiracy theorist type but I have a more than vague feeling that, with the wandering not aiming at carriers goliaths from game 4 and the weird timing in game 5, this might've been staged. But I know that Midas chokes and chokes hard, so my rational feeling is that Midas just chokes a lot. So hopefully after the vod comes out I can get a better answer. Until then, good series and good night.
On November 03 2006 05:27 zulu_nation8 wrote: And to back up my case, watch midas vs cobo on azalea. That was same build anytime did minus robo and ob and with a proxy gate. Which means, anytime's build was a loooooooooooot slower since he actually had to get the observer out. Yet when Cobo got to Midas' base Midas' siege was almost done, just like last game when anytime was at Midas' base. Except anytime got to midas' base certainly later than cobo. wtf happened?
i haven't seen the cobo game, but maybe midas researched siege instea dof mines that game? ;o
..... no it was exact same build, in other words the FD build that's been in discussion.
On November 03 2006 05:27 zulu_nation8 wrote: And to back up my case, watch midas vs cobo on azalea. That was same build anytime did minus robo and ob and with a proxy gate. Which means, anytime's build was a loooooooooooot slower since he actually had to get the observer out. Yet when Cobo got to Midas' base Midas' siege was almost done, just like last game when anytime was at Midas' base. Except anytime got to midas' base certainly later than cobo. wtf happened?
i haven't seen the cobo game, but maybe midas researched siege instea dof mines that game? ;o
..... no it was exact same build, in other words the FD build that's been in discussion.
On November 03 2006 04:16 HonestTea wrote: 1. Midas saw the gates. But what was he going to do? He had already invested in FD (1-fac, mines first, late siege) when what he needed was two-fac tanks with seige.
better placed mines, more mines, cancel cc, build 2 rines, bunker on ramp, scv blocking, build cc in base and he still wouldve been up.
is there a respectable terran player here that can comment on this. I do not believe that midas saw his gates and didn't do anything about it. Something feels wrong
i believe that not losing 6 marines and a vulture like a moron would have helped, at least he then could have built a bunker at his nat, 4-rine bunker+2 tanks+scvs > goons
after losing those units it was pretty hard to stop those goons and even if he stopped them, shuttle + 4 zealot would follow
if he didn't lose the 6 rines and vulture he wouldn't have seen anytime's base let alone prepare for the rush. I don't think you can expand and defend a 1 base 4 gate bulldog and i'm sure midas knows that too so he would've used the ramp to help.
Well he would have had at least one bunker, 2/3 tanks and spider mines layed by his first 1/2 vults (some of them near the bunker), which is I think enough to defend vs any kind of rush (maybe with scvs help). Anytime had to wait for obs so his attack probably didn't happen that early either.
And not moving out doesn't mean you can't scout, it's harder but you can at least check the goons count with your first vults and try to sneak one (or a scv) into the P's main.
The point of FD is to see something that'll have you better prepared for midgame and also of course expoing at the same time. Losing 6 rines was 100% worth it to see the inside of anytime's base. If he didn't then it could've been dt or reaver or 1 gate expo or 3/4 gate rush or 3/4 gate rush with obs. Would you rather keep 3 rines and your tank and go back rather than getting inside and see how many gates there are? If midas wanted to turtle and just expo fast he could've researched siege right away and not bothered with mines or vults or even marines. But the point of FD is to push toss back and maybe gain some type of intelligence. There's no point to build rines, tank, vult, research mines then not come out. It would defeat the purpose of the build. And you can't just sneak an scv in or scout with your vult, it just doesnt work like that. It wouldn't work in any other situation and in that game, anytime had 3 goons blocking the min only entrance so nothing short of a gundam would've gotten by.
Going mines first while not moving out is still very good vs DTs or any kind of rush. Upgrading siege right after, while your nat CC is being built, is the logical next move.
You've got a bunker full of marines, you've planted 6ish spider mines, you've got a few tanks with siege and SCVs mining just next to your bunker and ready to repair it/help defend if necessary. It's a really safe and effective version of the FD build to me, even though I've only seen Nada do it (mostly last year, when he was sucking at everything but TvP). Of course you can also move out but I think it's better to do so only if you could scout with a SCV early and see no 2nd gate/a late one.
Anyway I definitely can't see how losing 375 minerals (6 marines + 1 vult) to scout is worthwhile. If you can kill one, preferably two goons, it's OK, otherwise it clearly sucks imho.
Oh and I'd like to add that 2 facs is totally underrated and I love GF's TvP for that reason. Midas needs to add some variety to his BOs (and not only in TvPs), because he's really really way too predictable.
On November 03 2006 06:05 PoP wrote: I just disagree.
Going mines first while not moving out is still very good vs DTs or any kind of rush. Upgrading siege right after, while your nat CC is being built, is the logical next move.
ok i lied not last post :p. You have to think in the way that every build has a purpose, why expand later when you can expand sooner, you expand later cuz you want to gain in some other area or you want to have more control early on in sacrifice of economy. 4-6 rines = 200 to 300 min + vult = another 75 min + mine research = 100 more minerals, why spend all that when you can, perfectly safe, expand with one tank and maybe 2-3 rines less? DT's don't can still be stopped by mine and turret regardless if you come out or not.
On November 03 2006 06:05 PoP wrote: Anyway I definitely can't see how losing 375 minerals (6 marines + 1 vult) to scout is worthwhile. If you can kill one, preferably two goons, it's OK, otherwise it clearly sucks imho.
Of course he would've liked to kill 1-2 goons, but it really doesn't matter. I think losing all your gundam force for seeing anytime's base in game 5 of the OSL semi-finals is a no-brainer, gundam armies get destroyed pretty often.
Just seen the vod now, bit of luck involved with AnyTime because 3 of his 4 goons were in the red, those small things play a major role in deciding the winner imo.
just watched the vod too. Midas fucked up really, unexcusably bad by trying to get his tank up the ramp and also blocking with scvs at the same time, causing him to lose the second tank because anytime had more goons than he should due to midas not killing any goons with the gundam. And more importantly midas only saw 2 gates, not the 3rd, not the robo. So in retrospect I retract all my conspiracy theory statements and will accept that midas, simply, fked up.
On November 03 2006 06:52 zulu_nation8 wrote: just watched the vod too. Midas fucked up really, unexcusably bad by trying to get his tank up the ramp and also blocking with scvs at the same time, causing him to lose the second tank because anytime had more goons than he should due to midas not killing any goons with the gundam. And more importantly midas only saw 2 gates, not the 3rd, not the robo. So in retrospect I retract all my conspiracy theory statements and will accept that midas, simply, fked up.
1. Not seeing the third gate nor robo really screwed up Midas' build. In particular, I think he decided to not cancel his nat with that (flawed) information.
2. I was wondering what he was building with his fac - why did Midas only have 3 tanks when Anytime's goons came? The answer: 3 vultures. But instead of spreading mines and stalling, Midas tried to sneak in backdoor with the vultures for what I assume is probe harrass or gateway mining. Unfortunately for him, Anytime was able to kill all the vultures with his goons before moving out. In the end, Midas' forces were seperated at the worst possible moment. If the three vultures were with the three tanks when Anytime's goons moved in, Midas probably would have put up a better fight.
On November 03 2006 06:24 zulu_nation8 wrote: You have to think in the way that every build has a purpose, why expand later when you can expand sooner, you expand later cuz you want to gain in some other area or you want to have more control early on in sacrifice of economy. 4-6 rines = 200 to 300 min + vult = another 75 min + mine research = 100 more minerals, why spend all that when you can, perfectly safe, expand with one tank and maybe 2-3 rines less?
Well it's a goon-rush-safe, dt-rush-safe build (and not particularly less fast-drop-safe than any other one, esp. tanks/CC) + you have your expo quite early and can still move out if your opponent goes 14 CC or a late second gate, meaning he can't really be too greedy either. Of course it's better if you use your marines early because they won't be nearly as useful later on (though if you plan to go for a timing push they can be handy to kill obs or even help as support).
So it's a good, solid build which can either lead to a gundam-kind of rush or to a fast nat/rush-safe situation, depending on what you see. My point is that moving out *whatsoever* is not a good idea. You've gotta adapt to what you see. Esp. when the build has been overused and every P knows how to stop it easily.
DT's don't can still be stopped by mine and turret regardless if you come out or not.
Can? Can't? Early spider mines stop DTs anyway unless you place them like a retard, that was my point.
Of course he would've liked to kill 1-2 goons, but it really doesn't matter. I think losing all your gundam force for seeing anytime's base in game 5 of the OSL semi-finals is a no-brainer, gundam armies get destroyed pretty often.
I'm not sure how helpful it is as a scouting purpose either. I don't know how Midas could scout Anytime's base in today's game but most of the time thoses FD rushes get stopped before the T even gets close to the P's main ramp.
On November 03 2006 07:10 PaleMan wrote: Midas will never be great He will always be strong (like Yellow), but never great He just don't have that "mojo"
WRONG! He definately has that Mojo. Top 4 MSL, Top 4 OSL. PL Ace... Don't worry, Midas is young. He is also consistant. Midas will not fall from Starcraft for a very disgustingly long time.
And Yeah, I talked to Zulunation on MSN and said the same things Honesttea did cept I also added Midas probably made those vultures seeing only 2 gate and expected slower obs so he chose a mine stall over Siege for his expo and it all bit him in the ass.
The problem with Midas he isnt an exciting player, he's just a solid macroer, that's all he is, with good timing and game sense, he hasn't got the flare of the likes of NaDa and JulyZerg, that's why he'll never win an OGN or MBC, to become a champion you need more than one thing, in my opinion, Midas has only got one thing, macro, nothing else.
On November 03 2006 07:56 Elsi wrote: The problem with Midas he isnt an exciting player, he's just a solid macroer, that's all he is, with good timing and game sense, he hasn't got the flare of the likes of NaDa and JulyZerg, that's why he'll never win an OGN or MBC, to become a champion you need more than one thing, in my opinion, Midas has only got one thing, macro, nothing else.
I've always believed that Midas' exceptional strength was not macro, but timing. But everything else I agree with
On November 03 2006 07:56 Elsi wrote: The problem with Midas he isnt an exciting player, he's just a solid macroer, that's all he is, with good timing and game sense, he hasn't got the flare of the likes of NaDa and JulyZerg, that's why he'll never win an OGN or MBC, to become a champion you need more than one thing, in my opinion, Midas has only got one thing, macro, nothing else.
I agree. Back when I wasn't a GoodFriend fan, I always thought they were the same when it comes to a lot of things, including their standard play. Midas has good timing in TvP though. GF does the same eventually (against Bisu in Peaks of Baekdu, and his slow aggressive push style in Arcadia 2: that play style looks like he was playing TvT, haha).
yeah i felt like that before too gf and midas pretty similar
except that gf used to own midas in tvt all the time midas' tvp is better and gf's tvz is better than midas' tvz (before at least..?)
Even if I don't like him that much I'm starting to feel really sorry for Midas. That poor dude always piss his pants in major events despite being one of the most gifted terran players along with Oov and NaDa.
On November 03 2006 07:10 PaleMan wrote: Midas will never be great He will always be strong (like Yellow), but never great He just don't have that "mojo"
WRONG! He definately has that Mojo. Top 4 MSL, Top 4 OSL. PL Ace... Don't worry, Midas is young. He is also consistant. Midas will not fall from Starcraft for a very disgustingly long time.
And Yeah, I talked to Zulunation on MSN and said the same things Honesttea did cept I also added Midas probably made those vultures seeing only 2 gate and expected slower obs so he chose a mine stall over Siege for his expo and it all bit him in the ass.
well, well, well
remember Junwi? I remember him being 4th for three consecutive OGN seasons (if memory serves) Everyone was "oh, the public enemy, next generation of zerg, watch out for this guy" etc.
Where is he now? Struggling in ODT and Survival...
On November 03 2006 06:05 PoP wrote: I just disagree.
Going mines first while not moving out is still very good vs DTs or any kind of rush. Upgrading siege right after, while your nat CC is being built, is the logical next move.
ok i lied not last post :p. You have to think in the way that every build has a purpose, why expand later when you can expand sooner, you expand later cuz you want to gain in some other area or you want to have more control early on in sacrifice of economy. 4-6 rines = 200 to 300 min + vult = another 75 min + mine research = 100 more minerals, why spend all that when you can, perfectly safe, expand with one tank and maybe 2-3 rines less? DT's don't can still be stopped by mine and turret regardless if you come out or not.
On November 03 2006 06:05 PoP wrote: Anyway I definitely can't see how losing 375 minerals (6 marines + 1 vult) to scout is worthwhile. If you can kill one, preferably two goons, it's OK, otherwise it clearly sucks imho.
Of course he would've liked to kill 1-2 goons, but it really doesn't matter. I think losing all your gundam force for seeing anytime's base in game 5 of the OSL semi-finals is a no-brainer, gundam armies get destroyed pretty often.
it is not worth it to lose 6 rine and a vult to scout
if protoss goes hardcore goon/obs or just normal gate-robo-gate obs, you need a bunker or you are dead, there is no amount of micro that can stop 6-7 goons with 2 tanks without having a bunker, siege or not is irrelevant, if midas managed to secure his ramp, the 6 goons would proceed to kill the cc freely while p expands or gets shuttle. 2 tanks are not going to stop 6 goons, and even if the p is scared he can wait for that zealot bomb shuttle, 4-5 tanks will not stop zeal bomb + many goons
midas should have properly scouted before suiciding his shit (not possible since he scouts after he starts his factory), or backed off immediately when he saw 4 goons above ramp, he would see the obs/goon attack with mines placed on anytime's nat and have enough time to build a bunker
On November 03 2006 06:52 zulu_nation8 wrote: just watched the vod too. Midas fucked up really, unexcusably bad by trying to get his tank up the ramp and also blocking with scvs at the same time, causing him to lose the second tank because anytime had more goons than he should due to midas not killing any goons with the gundam. And more importantly midas only saw 2 gates, not the 3rd, not the robo. So in retrospect I retract all my conspiracy theory statements and will accept that midas, simply, fked up.
1. Not seeing the third gate nor robo really screwed up Midas' build. In particular, I think he decided to not cancel his nat with that (flawed) information.
2. I was wondering what he was building with his fac - why did Midas only have 3 tanks when Anytime's goons came? The answer: 3 vultures. But instead of spreading mines and stalling, Midas tried to sneak in backdoor with the vultures for what I assume is probe harrass or gateway mining. Unfortunately for him, Anytime was able to kill all the vultures with his goons before moving out. In the end, Midas' forces were seperated at the worst possible moment. If the three vultures were with the three tanks when Anytime's goons moved in, Midas probably would have put up a better fight.
you dont really need to see the 4 gates, just seeing 4-5 goons is enough to guess that the guy is going hardcore goon, just back off then and wait while cc builds, if protoss moves out with obs and many goons its time to build a bunker, no need to cancel the cc (this would actually set him back too much and P would expand first while having more units)... losing the vults probably didnt help but i dont think it was the most critical thing, the marines are more important
On November 03 2006 07:56 Elsi wrote: The problem with Midas he isnt an exciting player, he's just a solid macroer, that's all he is, with good timing and game sense, he hasn't got the flare of the likes of NaDa and JulyZerg, that's why he'll never win an OGN or MBC, to become a champion you need more than one thing, in my opinion, Midas has only got one thing, macro, nothing else.
Midas has more than just Macro. His timing, execution, and some of his micro moments are insane. I will admit though his in-game build flexibility isn't as strong as most S-class.
Last semi he pushed it to five games against sAviOr. FREAKING SAVIOR man. Midas is missing something small and he can be REALLY dominant. I just can't put my thumb down on it.
It's specialized builds for finals. Come on, Anytime only won because of his versatility. Anytime didn't outmacro Midas. He didn't outmicro Midas either. Very few people ever do. He out-thought him and his builds were very typically superb Anytime-builds.
On November 03 2006 19:12 racebannon wrote: The only thing that worries me now is how malleable gold is, I'm afraid it won't stand the test of time under Nadas apm
LOL.
I terribly want NaDa to win, but I can't see it happening. I still don't see him as in the shape that he used to e.
NaDa at the end of 2002 and all through 2003 was the most dominant force progaming has ever seen. More dominant than Boxer even IMO. NaDa right now...he doesn't have that edge that he used to.
I'm disappointed in game 5 too. I thought it was even worse than the MSL rA/Savior game on the same map. I'm an Anytime fan and wanted Anytime to win, but after seeing that, I can't help but feel really disappointed.
Ah well, Nada will win the final. Midas cannot beat the legend of the fall, but Nada can sure do battle with the gods.
what im wondering is why these guys never freaking scv/probe scout anymore? by the time they decide to scout, the only information they ever get is their opponents location.
If TT can take a set from Nada... And Anytime is superior in everyway... I know for a fact Nada is taking Arkanoid. Anytime sucked on Arkanoid vs Midas too. The rest I think Anytime can do it.
Nada? Golden Mouse? Hell no. Golden Mouse is reserved for Boxer/Oov. ... or Kingdom+2 -_-;;
On November 03 2006 23:22 YoUr_KiLLeR wrote: what im wondering is why these guys never freaking scv/probe scout anymore? by the time they decide to scout, the only information they ever get is their opponents location.
You gain alot of money by having 1 more worker mining.
On November 04 2006 10:24 SuperJongMan wrote: If TT can take a set from Nada... And Anytime is superior in everyway... I know for a fact Nada is taking Arkanoid. Anytime sucked on Arkanoid vs Midas too. The rest I think Anytime can do it.
Nada? Golden Mouse? Hell no. Golden Mouse is reserved for Boxer/Oov. ... or Kingdom+2 -_-;;
On November 03 2006 22:07 Purind wrote: I'm disappointed in game 5 too. I thought it was even worse than the MSL rA/Savior game on the same map. I'm an Anytime fan and wanted Anytime to win, but after seeing that, I can't help but feel really disappointed.
Ah well, Nada will win the final. Midas cannot beat the legend of the fall, but Nada can sure do battle with the gods.
What are you talking about?
game 5 was art, Anytimes strat completely owned and suprised midas
On November 03 2006 04:19 Lukeeze[zR] wrote: if anytime can pull an ... anytime on nada like he did vs boxer, that'd be legendaaaaaaaary
Legendary would be if Anytime won the golden mouse by denying 3 times from the 3 best terrans of all time (boxer, nada and oov). That'd be tight.
yeah that'd be recorded in sc history very nicely, especially because people are saying protoss wasn't being represented in osl in the new age, due to pvz.
On November 04 2006 10:24 SuperJongMan wrote: If TT can take a set from Nada... And Anytime is superior in everyway... I know for a fact Nada is taking Arkanoid. Anytime sucked on Arkanoid vs Midas too. The rest I think Anytime can do it.
Nada? Golden Mouse? Hell no. Golden Mouse is reserved for Boxer/Oov. ... or Kingdom+2 -_-;;
Well eventhough NaDa is a TvP master his weakness is without doubt his strategy like with Midas, while their strengths lies in the execution. Chances are AnyTime is doing like in So1 and play straight up in the final after cheesing in the semis. Only problem is NaDas straight up TvP >>> BoxeRs straight up TvP. That adventage might be nullified if NaDa goes into scared mode like BoxeR did and play overly defensive/safe though. If that happens AnyTimes chances are increased due to economical adventage if he chooses a somewhat early expansion. AnyTime should try to force a micro-intense game for his own good though, hence cheese/unorthodox strategies in at least one of the games is needed. His chances are way smaller in a macrofest.
It all comes down to the first game I think. If NaDa wins that one he'll get the sufficient confidence for him to go into tornado-mode and steamroll AnyTime. If AnyTime pulls of something and wins, I fear NaDa will get scared and play like he did vs rA at BWWI and lose horribly. Its all up to AnyTime, and I believe he will do it.
Probable scenarios Game 1 Anytime plays straight up. Nada plays straight up. Nada wins. Game 2 Anytime plays straight up. Nada plays too defensive fearing cheese. Anytime wins. Game 3 Anytime cheeses. Nada plays straight up. Anytime wins Game 4 Anytime plays straight up. Nada plays straight up. Nada wins Game 5 Anytime plays straight up. Nada cheeses. Nada wins.
Or Game 1 Anytime cheeses. Nada plays straight up. Anytime wins Game 2 Anytime plays straight up. Nada plays too defensive fearing cheese. Anytime wins. Game 3 Anytime plays straight up. Nada cheeses. Nada wins Game 4 Anytime plays straight up. Nada plays too defensive fearing cheese. Anytime wins
This being said I believe Nada WILL prepare some sort of cheese against Anytime, whether it'd be 3 rax, 8rax, hidden fac, hanbang rush, or vulture drop.
On November 04 2006 17:47 Guybrush wrote: Well eventhough NaDa is a TvP master his weakness is without doubt his strategy like with Midas, while their strengths lies in the execution. Chances are AnyTime is doing like in So1 and play straight up in the final after cheesing in the semis. Only problem is NaDas straight up TvP >>> BoxeRs straight up TvP. That adventage might be nullified if NaDa goes into scared mode like BoxeR did and play overly defensive/safe though. If that happens AnyTimes chances are increased due to economical adventage if he chooses a somewhat early expansion. AnyTime should try to force a micro-intense game for his own good though, hence cheese/unorthodox strategies in at least one of the games is needed. His chances are way smaller in a macrofest.
It all comes down to the first game I think. If NaDa wins that one he'll get the sufficient confidence for him to go into tornado-mode and steamroll AnyTime. If AnyTime pulls of something and wins, I fear NaDa will get scared and play like he did vs rA at BWWI and lose horribly. Its all up to AnyTime, and I believe he will do it.
Probable scenarios Game 1 Anytime plays straight up. Nada plays straight up. Nada wins. Game 2 Anytime plays straight up. Nada plays too defensive fearing cheese. Anytime wins. Game 3 Anytime cheeses. Nada plays straight up. Anytime wins Game 4 Anytime plays straight up. Nada plays straight up. Nada wins Game 5 Anytime plays straight up. Nada cheeses. Nada wins.
Or Game 1 Anytime cheeses. Nada plays straight up. Anytime wins Game 2 Anytime plays straight up. Nada plays too defensive fearing cheese. Anytime wins. Game 3 Anytime plays straight up. Nada cheeses. Nada wins Game 4 Anytime plays straight up. Nada plays too defensive fearing cheese. Anytime wins
This being said I believe Nada WILL prepare some sort of cheese against Anytime, whether it'd be 3 rax, 8rax, hidden fac, hanbang rush, or vulture drop.
That said...fear the cheese...cause it will eat you alive...and thou shall not disrespect it...
fucking awesome semi... the emotion was really there and i loved it. anytime sweating his balls off, midas grunting and sighing, then the final double fist pump when anytime won. i loved it. remember the days when they'd just sit there emotionless after a big victory; that gave me the shits. this series had everything i had hoped for and more - 5 games played out, unpredictable play, cheese, macrofest, dynamic style (from anytime at least), emotion, nail biting finish. it was just great to watch and i'll be keeping this series.
if the finals are as good as this i'm gonna be one happy camper.
I hope for NaDa. He used to be so great. Not the greatest but pretty close ( i only see one man.. u know .. him.. standing in between.. ) I just hope nada makes it. He deserves it. Many people already forgot how dominant and how good he used to be. Nada <3<3
Guys you have to give it to the man. Anytime is on a roll. And Anytime HAS macro. But more important than his macro he has something waaay better: he has a working brain. He understands the game is about strategy and not just pumping units like didi8. His brain is (in my opinion) what has made him the great players he is, and that's what has made him reach this stage, beating July, casy, ggplay, gorush and midas. Not many players would have done that.
Face is that even before the game starts, Anytime knows what to do in order to win.
I hope in Anytime also because protoss need a new "Great" player who can be put among the best players....there must be a new toss hero u can say pusan...stork...rock..of course but anytime is the only who can already reach 2 OSL titles and it would be just wonderful..:D
I think Anytime will beat Nada. Anytime, despite beating Midas, fucked up a bit and played inconsistantly. Midas is at least as good TvP as Nada, and there is room for improvement in Anytime's game. If Anytime plays his best, he will beat Nada 3-1.
On November 04 2006 17:47 Guybrush wrote: Well eventhough NaDa is a TvP master his weakness is without doubt his strategy like with Midas, while their strengths lies in the execution. Chances are AnyTime is doing like in So1 and play straight up in the final after cheesing in the semis. Only problem is NaDas straight up TvP >>> BoxeRs straight up TvP. That adventage might be nullified if NaDa goes into scared mode like BoxeR did and play overly defensive/safe though. If that happens AnyTimes chances are increased due to economical adventage if he chooses a somewhat early expansion. AnyTime should try to force a micro-intense game for his own good though, hence cheese/unorthodox strategies in at least one of the games is needed. His chances are way smaller in a macrofest.
It all comes down to the first game I think. If NaDa wins that one he'll get the sufficient confidence for him to go into tornado-mode and steamroll AnyTime. If AnyTime pulls of something and wins, I fear NaDa will get scared and play like he did vs rA at BWWI and lose horribly. Its all up to AnyTime, and I believe he will do it.
Probable scenarios Game 1 Anytime plays straight up. Nada plays straight up. Nada wins. Game 2 Anytime plays straight up. Nada plays too defensive fearing cheese. Anytime wins. Game 3 Anytime cheeses. Nada plays straight up. Anytime wins Game 4 Anytime plays straight up. Nada plays straight up. Nada wins Game 5 Anytime plays straight up. Nada cheeses. Nada wins.
Or Game 1 Anytime cheeses. Nada plays straight up. Anytime wins Game 2 Anytime plays straight up. Nada plays too defensive fearing cheese. Anytime wins. Game 3 Anytime plays straight up. Nada cheeses. Nada wins Game 4 Anytime plays straight up. Nada plays too defensive fearing cheese. Anytime wins
This being said I believe Nada WILL prepare some sort of cheese against Anytime, whether it'd be 3 rax, 8rax, hidden fac, hanbang rush, or vulture drop.
nada has shown much more strategical depth recently. he said in an interview the fact that he can play multiple styles and strategies makes him more dangerous, while he used to play just one strategy per map. and due to that anytime's gay dts wont do shit and nada will roll him.
On November 04 2006 17:47 Guybrush wrote: Well eventhough NaDa is a TvP master his weakness is without doubt his strategy like with Midas, while their strengths lies in the execution. Chances are AnyTime is doing like in So1 and play straight up in the final after cheesing in the semis. Only problem is NaDas straight up TvP >>> BoxeRs straight up TvP. That adventage might be nullified if NaDa goes into scared mode like BoxeR did and play overly defensive/safe though. If that happens AnyTimes chances are increased due to economical adventage if he chooses a somewhat early expansion. AnyTime should try to force a micro-intense game for his own good though, hence cheese/unorthodox strategies in at least one of the games is needed. His chances are way smaller in a macrofest.
It all comes down to the first game I think. If NaDa wins that one he'll get the sufficient confidence for him to go into tornado-mode and steamroll AnyTime. If AnyTime pulls of something and wins, I fear NaDa will get scared and play like he did vs rA at BWWI and lose horribly. Its all up to AnyTime, and I believe he will do it.
Probable scenarios Game 1 Anytime plays straight up. Nada plays straight up. Nada wins. Game 2 Anytime plays straight up. Nada plays too defensive fearing cheese. Anytime wins. Game 3 Anytime cheeses. Nada plays straight up. Anytime wins Game 4 Anytime plays straight up. Nada plays straight up. Nada wins Game 5 Anytime plays straight up. Nada cheeses. Nada wins.
Or Game 1 Anytime cheeses. Nada plays straight up. Anytime wins Game 2 Anytime plays straight up. Nada plays too defensive fearing cheese. Anytime wins. Game 3 Anytime plays straight up. Nada cheeses. Nada wins Game 4 Anytime plays straight up. Nada plays too defensive fearing cheese. Anytime wins
This being said I believe Nada WILL prepare some sort of cheese against Anytime, whether it'd be 3 rax, 8rax, hidden fac, hanbang rush, or vulture drop.
so, according to you, if one of them cheeses they will almost always win? (because whenever someone cheesed, they always won!)
I do see alot more successfull cheese than unsuccessfull cheese in progames. Wether the cheese wins the game instantly or becomes a big adventage for the cheeser shown later in the game!
That being said if Anytimes cheese somehow get raped by a perfect defence from Nada I believe the rest of series will go in Nadas favour due to psychological adventage. Nada isnt as cheeseproof as Oov, so chances Anytimes cheese will be successful are bigger though.
Anyway cheese is the way 2 go ! ! Cheese fighting~~!
To be really honest, I don't think NaDa deserves his 3rd OSL title yet, although he must be running out of time to achieve that. He is not quite back yet. If he played Savior in a best of 5, he would lose 3-0, perhaps 3-1 if he got lucky. I know we're now talking about a protoss player, Anytime, and this matchup is completely different, but meh.
To cut a long story short, Anytime probably deserves to win this final more than NaDa. But seriously, NaDa will own him badly.
On November 07 2006 00:07 ssj100 wrote: To cut a long story short, Anytime probably deserves to win this final more than NaDa. But seriously, NaDa will own him badly.
On November 07 2006 00:07 ssj100 wrote: To be really honest, I don't think NaDa deserves his 3rd OSL title yet, although he must be running out of time to achieve that. He is not quite back yet. If he played Savior in a best of 5, he would lose 3-0, perhaps 3-1 if he got lucky. I know we're now talking about a protoss player, Anytime, and this matchup is completely different, but meh.
To cut a long story short, Anytime probably deserves to win this final more than NaDa. But seriously, NaDa will own him badly.
to cut a long story shot , what you wrote makes no sense..
On November 07 2006 00:07 ssj100 wrote: To be really honest, I don't think NaDa deserves his 3rd OSL title yet, although he must be running out of time to achieve that. He is not quite back yet. If he played Savior in a best of 5, he would lose 3-0, perhaps 3-1 if he got lucky. I know we're now talking about a protoss player, Anytime, and this matchup is completely different, but meh.
To cut a long story short, Anytime probably deserves to win this final more than NaDa. But seriously, NaDa will own him badly.
Omg the bitches of Savior are here too?...They are like a plague :/...
Umm I'm pretty sure that playing at your 100% isn't something that you can just turn on. Otherwise Nada and all the other pros would have done it a long time ago. The only difference about the finals is that there is just that much more pressure on the players. The real question is how they'll respond to the pressure.
Hah perfect example. I just saw that Nada got beat by Much[gm] in the survivor league. If he can't even take a player like Much in a bo3 then how will he be able to handle Anytime who is better in basically every way?
On November 07 2006 00:07 ssj100 wrote: To be really honest, I don't think NaDa deserves his 3rd OSL title yet, although he must be running out of time to achieve that. He is not quite back yet. If he played Savior in a best of 5, he would lose 3-0, perhaps 3-1 if he got lucky. I know we're now talking about a protoss player, Anytime, and this matchup is completely different, but meh.
To cut a long story short, Anytime probably deserves to win this final more than NaDa. But seriously, NaDa will own him badly.
Omg the bitches of Savior are here too?...They are like a plague :/...
On November 07 2006 00:07 ssj100 wrote: To be really honest, I don't think NaDa deserves his 3rd OSL title yet, although he must be running out of time to achieve that. He is not quite back yet. If he played Savior in a best of 5, he would lose 3-0, perhaps 3-1 if he got lucky. I know we're now talking about a protoss player, Anytime, and this matchup is completely different, but meh.
To cut a long story short, Anytime probably deserves to win this final more than NaDa. But seriously, NaDa will own him badly.
Omg the bitches of Savior are here too?...They are like a plague :/...
LOL. you are really funny x].
Im not trying to be funny...im trying to annoy...for example annoy you like i already did :/... jk...
Hey Guys! Do you really think Anytime is an ordinary player? He came out of nowhere from a team without any big stars (except Pusan). His understanding of the opponent and his macro+brain combination is like a reflection from the time Garimto was active. I don't know if anyone can stop Anytime when he's on a roll.
On November 07 2006 15:43 priceless wrote: Hey Guys! Do you really think Anytime is an ordinary player? He came out of nowhere from a team without any big stars (except Pusan). His understanding of the opponent and his macro+brain combination is like a reflection from the time Garimto was active. I don't know if anyone can stop Anytime when he's on a roll.
huh pusan and anytime aren't on the same team - _-;;
anytime -> lecaf oz (forgot his old team name lol) pusan -> used to be POS -> MBCHero now
lol Garim didn't even macro well.... Brain and Macro was probably Reach in his prime. The stuff he did then, especially his zealot bombings, were amazing. Maybe Kingdom when his macro was relatively strong. Garim came up with wicked builds and unit combis. Come on, his whole OSL he tore through zergs with SAIR ZEALOT!! How sick is that?!?! His builds are scary and unpredictable, like Garim. And he has really nice spurts of creativity and ZEALOTS. That is why he is like Garim. God forbid anyone macro like garim in this day and age T.T
And yeah, I remember when Pusan was performing better than Anytime, and originally, Anytime wasn't nearly as good was he is now. The current Anytime and the Anytime even 1 season before So1 are very different.
I think Nada is crushed... cept Arkanoid because Nada:Arkanoid::Xellos:Bifrost
On November 07 2006 00:07 ssj100 wrote: To be really honest, I don't think NaDa deserves his 3rd OSL title yet, although he must be running out of time to achieve that. He is not quite back yet. If he played Savior in a best of 5, he would lose 3-0, perhaps 3-1 if he got lucky. I know we're now talking about a protoss player, Anytime, and this matchup is completely different, but meh.
To cut a long story short, Anytime probably deserves to win this final more than NaDa. But seriously, NaDa will own him badly.
Omg the bitches of Savior are here too?...They are like a plague :/...
LOL. you are really funny x].
Im not trying to be funny...im trying to annoy...for example annoy you like i already did :/... jk...
STOP TYPING LIKE THIS.... ......... ........ ........ ......... GOD FUCKING DAMN
On November 07 2006 00:07 ssj100 wrote: To be really honest, I don't think NaDa deserves his 3rd OSL title yet, although he must be running out of time to achieve that. He is not quite back yet. If he played Savior in a best of 5, he would lose 3-0, perhaps 3-1 if he got lucky. I know we're now talking about a protoss player, Anytime, and this matchup is completely different, but meh.
To cut a long story short, Anytime probably deserves to win this final more than NaDa. But seriously, NaDa will own him badly.
Omg the bitches of Savior are here too?...They are like a plague :/...
LOL. you are really funny x].
Im not trying to be funny...im trying to annoy...for example annoy you like i already did :/... jk...
STOP TYPING LIKE THIS.... ......... ........ ........ ......... GOD FUCKING DAMN
On November 07 2006 00:07 ssj100 wrote: To be really honest, I don't think NaDa deserves his 3rd OSL title yet, although he must be running out of time to achieve that. He is not quite back yet. If he played Savior in a best of 5, he would lose 3-0, perhaps 3-1 if he got lucky. I know we're now talking about a protoss player, Anytime, and this matchup is completely different, but meh.
To cut a long story short, Anytime probably deserves to win this final more than NaDa. But seriously, NaDa will own him badly.
Omg the bitches of Savior are here too?...They are like a plague :/...
LOL. you are really funny x].
Im not trying to be funny...im trying to annoy...for example annoy you like i already did :/... jk...
STOP TYPING LIKE THIS.... ......... ........ ........ ......... GOD FUCKING DAMN
im glad someone feels teh same lol
Now...i feel... That CAPS are unnecessary...they are necessary only if you are angry...well...all the ones who quoted me were angry...but im not...isnt that funny? :/... Does this make sense?...Not it doesnt...but who cares?...
On November 07 2006 00:07 ssj100 wrote: To be really honest, I don't think NaDa deserves his 3rd OSL title yet, although he must be running out of time to achieve that. He is not quite back yet. If he played Savior in a best of 5, he would lose 3-0, perhaps 3-1 if he got lucky. I know we're now talking about a protoss player, Anytime, and this matchup is completely different, but meh.
To cut a long story short, Anytime probably deserves to win this final more than NaDa. But seriously, NaDa will own him badly.
Ohhh, we'll see in superfight, after Nada beats Anytime. Or we'll see Nada raping Silver.
EPT
.
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