Is Flash really invincible? - Page 8

On September 15 2010 05:13 Piste wrote:
so, you must 1rax cc vs 12 hatch 11pool and win to be a better player? since when if I may ask? :O

On September 15 2010 06:00 Tha_Docta wrote:
I can t remember where, but I remember reading an interview where a bunch of progamers were agreeing with the idea that if...

Jaedong and flash played the same race, they would be equally matched

On September 15 2010 06:26 nimoraca wrote:
What you call the most standard TvZ game is exactly what terrans are trying hard to avoid. When defilers come out, they make 95% of terran army obsolete. Combine that with plague and consume and you get the most imbalanced unit in the game. And when terrans use the only unit that is somewhat effective against the dark swarm (yes, its the tank) you call that gay play or turtling. Do you just expect all terrans to go bio against the dark swarm, and when they lose say that zerg player is mechanically better.

The whole point of TvZ for terrans is to not let zergs get to defilers easily, with 3 or more gasses, because it becomes almost impossible to win if that happens. You can not just call that scenario a standard game and say Jaedong would win in a standard game. Probably if you look at the statistics of those "standrad" TvZ games you would see that most of them are won by zerg players.

Also, MSL game 3, Flash played brilliantly for most of the game. He denied Jaedongs third for such a long time. The only mistake he made was letting Jaedong expand easily in the bottom right corner, when he had no army to defend it. If you look carefully the first game of the OSL you will see that jaedong again tried to sneak an expansion in the bottom-right, but now Flash was prepared, and denied that, winning the game easily.

Generally speaking in the last 3 finals, all the games jaedong won against flash, he was extremely lucky. It could have easily be 3:0 in the last MSL.

On September 15 2010 06:26 nimoraca wrote:
What you call the most standard TvZ game is exactly what terrans are trying hard to avoid. When defilers come out, they make 95% of terran army obsolete. Combine that with plague and consume and you get the most imbalanced unit in the game. And when terrans use the only unit that is somewhat effective against the dark swarm (yes, its the tank) you call that gay play or turtling. Do you just expect all terrans to go bio against the dark swarm, and when they lose say that zerg player is mechanically better.

The whole point of TvZ for terrans is to not let zergs get to defilers easily, with 3 or more gasses, because it becomes almost impossible to win if that happens. You can not just call that scenario a standard game and say Jaedong would win in a standard game. Probably if you look at the statistics of those "standrad" TvZ games you would see that most of them are won by zerg players.

Also, MSL game 3, Flash played brilliantly for most of the game. He denied Jaedongs third for such a long time. The only mistake he made was letting Jaedong expand easily in the bottom right corner, when he had no army to defend it. If you look carefully the first game of the OSL you will see that jaedong again tried to sneak an expansion in the bottom-right, but now Flash was prepared, and denied that, winning the game easily.

Generally speaking in the last 3 finals, all the games jaedong won against flash, he was extremely lucky. It could have easily be 3:0 in the last MSL.

9/9/2010 10:21:01 PM Jimmy Skylar if jaedong is going to win
9/9/2010 10:21:07 PM Jimmy Skylar he has to prepare some really good builds/rushes
9/9/2010 10:21:14 PM Jimmy Skylar that seems to be where he got flash
9/9/2010 10:26:08 PM Skylar Jimmy yeah that's true. jaedong doesnt seem to be able to just wing it as well as flash is able to. JD has to focus really hard to do something to do well. flash seems to be able to just be like "ill throw some of this in there, some of that. oh, he's going this? i'll do that". he's good at reacting to unexpected things. JD seems to fall apart and not expect some things that are thrown at him
9/9/2010 10:26:30 PM Skylar Jimmy like that one game he lost to sea a month or two ago
9/9/2010 10:26:55 PM Skylar Jimmy or that game vs light when he 8raxed and cheesed him
9/9/2010 10:27:05 PM Jimmy Skylar well i think flash is just so incredibly smart. i can't really explain why but he just seems to pick up on the SLIGHTEST clues whatsoever and always has units at hte right place at the right time
9/9/2010 10:27:08 PM Jimmy Skylar which makes him SUPER powerful tvt
9/9/2010 10:27:37 PM Jimmy Skylar whereas jaedong really relies on his fast mouse speed, reaction time, multitasking, and unit control
9/9/2010 10:28:23 PM Skylar Jimmy that's why it feels like JD has to have a really strong build planned. he can't just try to catch flash off guard. doesn't seem to work well imo
9/9/2010 10:29:01 PM Skylar Jimmy seems like JD can fare really well if both players were just told to do certain builds against eachother or put in to a micro tourny or something
9/9/2010 10:29:23 PM Skylar Jimmy but yeah, flash feels "smarter"
9/9/2010 10:31:35 PM Jimmy Skylar yeah i completely agre
9/9/2010 10:31:36 PM Jimmy Skylar agree*

On September 15 2010 00:38 MisteR wrote:The previous mentioned terrans all are stronger in different match-ups (Fanta and Hiya tvp, Light, Sea, and Leta tvz) while the other tvt specialists like Skyhigh, FBH, Upmagic, Baby or Mind are either slumping, retired, or too young. Fantasy lost in a close bo5 to Flash, while Light lost to Jaedong. At the moment Flash seems to be without terran rival, but that has more to do with Flash being a tvt specialist than anything else.