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On December 18 2015 16:41 Lappen.464 wrote:
i did not read all 23 pages. but doesnt this mean, that the total price-money decreases? iem finals alone had 100.000 bucks on the line. now instead of wcs and the other events it is put together. has anyone calculated that?
aaaand. still no points for being top on the ladder. could have reduced the barcode problem
total WCS prizepool increases from 1.6 to 2 million. AND they can be boosted by Blizzard additional at any DH, IEM tournament.
But the distribution for non-koreans looks more like winner gets more and remaining players get less money.
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This thing is really convoluted, to the point that it took me like three readings of the requirements table to understand that a class of events for korean-foreigner competition still exists, so sorry for misleading comments earlier.
However, how much of these can we really expect, if there are supposed to be like 8 "WCS Circuit" events and these are done "with ESL and DH"? How many IEMs+DHs with SC2 are there going to be altogether, and how much is that number minus 8?
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How many times do we see foreigners vs koreans? Only at Blizzard and non-wcs tournaments?
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Did I understand it correctly that there will not be any week to week tournament for foreigners like WCS has been? That's the biggest shame for me as it drastically reduces the amount of play we'll see.
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Czech Republic12125 Posts
On December 18 2015 17:05 SC2Toastie wrote:Show nested quote +On December 18 2015 17:04 deacon.frost wrote:On December 18 2015 15:11 Diabolique wrote:On December 18 2015 14:48 Inflicted wrote:
PartinG seems pretty screwed at this point
Skipped SSL qualifier and now he can't play overseas or in Proleague. He only has one GSL tournament for the next 6 months... (oh there is KeSPA Cup but still) 1. PartinG is screwed and all those similar to him outside of Kespa are screwed. 2. TOP9-TOP12 Koreans are screwed, e.g. sOs, as he never won a GSL or SSL league and is great just in big international offline tournaments, which he will not be able to attend anymore. 3. All the second tier Koreans are screwed. In the past, they were beaten heavily in Proleague, but then they went to some DreamHack, won it and it gave them enough confidence to start performing in Korea as well. This is gone now. I understand, that western players are happy about it, as they can have Ronaldo's and Messi's salary while being on the level of an average Spanish league player without the necessity to play against Ronaldo and Messi. Of course, in this case, they will never ever reach the level of Ronaldo and Messi. It is more probable, they will get the idea to establish "WCS Welfare player's Unions" and will negotiate with Blizzard every year higher prize pool for WCS Welfare Circuit, or they stop playing. Because it is them, Blizzard needs. Not Messi and Ronaldo. Right? But I am angry at all the professional people in the SC2 business, who are lying to the fans and painting it nicely so that they can get their share of money from their employers. Fuck Apollo! http://apollosc2.tumblr.com/post/135405158638/my-thoughts-on-wcs-2016 He's getting money thanks to Blizzard, without Welfare money ESL isn't doing anything SC2 related and Apollo is fucked. Of course he would write something like this. No one ever publicly criticized Blizzard. Day 9 was always overwhelmingly positive about Blizzard until he stopped doing SC2 "suddenly". Same applies for others. Everyone from these people always was positive and never said anything bad about Blizzard. The only exception is TB but he doesn't give a fuck about any big name in the industry. Stop being naive  To throw a Dutch expression into the mix which perfectly fits to this: Don't bite the hand that feeds you. No clue whether that makes any sense to any non-Dutch-speaker ^^+ Show Spoiler +On December 18 2015 17:14 Chaggi wrote:Show nested quote +On December 18 2015 17:05 SC2Toastie wrote:On December 18 2015 17:04 deacon.frost wrote:On December 18 2015 15:11 Diabolique wrote:On December 18 2015 14:48 Inflicted wrote:
PartinG seems pretty screwed at this point
Skipped SSL qualifier and now he can't play overseas or in Proleague. He only has one GSL tournament for the next 6 months... (oh there is KeSPA Cup but still) 1. PartinG is screwed and all those similar to him outside of Kespa are screwed. 2. TOP9-TOP12 Koreans are screwed, e.g. sOs, as he never won a GSL or SSL league and is great just in big international offline tournaments, which he will not be able to attend anymore. 3. All the second tier Koreans are screwed. In the past, they were beaten heavily in Proleague, but then they went to some DreamHack, won it and it gave them enough confidence to start performing in Korea as well. This is gone now. I understand, that western players are happy about it, as they can have Ronaldo's and Messi's salary while being on the level of an average Spanish league player without the necessity to play against Ronaldo and Messi. Of course, in this case, they will never ever reach the level of Ronaldo and Messi. It is more probable, they will get the idea to establish "WCS Welfare player's Unions" and will negotiate with Blizzard every year higher prize pool for WCS Welfare Circuit, or they stop playing. Because it is them, Blizzard needs. Not Messi and Ronaldo. Right? But I am angry at all the professional people in the SC2 business, who are lying to the fans and painting it nicely so that they can get their share of money from their employers. Fuck Apollo! http://apollosc2.tumblr.com/post/135405158638/my-thoughts-on-wcs-2016 He's getting money thanks to Blizzard, without Welfare money ESL isn't doing anything SC2 related and Apollo is fucked. Of course he would write something like this. No one ever publicly criticized Blizzard. Day 9 was always overwhelmingly positive about Blizzard until he stopped doing SC2 "suddenly". Same applies for others. Everyone from these people always was positive and never said anything bad about Blizzard. The only exception is TB but he doesn't give a fuck about any big name in the industry. Stop being naive To throw a Dutch expression into the mix which perfectly fits to this: Don't bite the hand that feeds you. No clue whether that makes any sense to any non-Dutch-speaker ^^ Yeah we have that expression too Thanks ^^
We have similar Sing the song of the one who's feeding you Which is exactly what Apollo's doing 
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Mute City2363 Posts
On December 18 2015 17:30 opisska wrote:
This thing is really convoluted, to the point that it took me like three readings of the requirements table to understand that a class of events for korean-foreigner competition still exists, so sorry for misleading comments earlier.
However, how much of these can we really expect, if there are supposed to be like 8 "WCS Circuit" events and these are done "with ESL and DH"? How many IEMs+DHs with SC2 are there going to be altogether, and how much is that number minus 8?
Summary:
KR
2 x GSL
2 x SSL
2 x End of Season SSL vs GSL events
KeSPA Cup (unknown number)
Hot6ix Cup mentioned in passing somewhere - unconfirmed
WCS Circuit (Foreigners only + visa'd Koreans)
3 x Season events (Winter / Spring / Summer)
8 x Circuit events (iirc it was Apollo who mentioned the total of 11 events, giving us 8 of these smaller events)
WCS Global (Foreigner / Korean mix)
Excluding Global Finals, no events announced yet. No hint at total number of events, but given the prize pool required ($50k) and the fact that it's not as highly incentivised as WCS Circuit events by Blizzard, I can't see there being very many. It's almost guaranteed that there will be fewer of these than the total number of IEMs / DHs etc from 2015 given how the prize money breaks down.
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My inner hype just died if I understood everything
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Czech Republic12125 Posts
On December 18 2015 17:37 Heartland wrote:
Did I understand it correctly that there will not be any week to week tournament for foreigners like WCS has been? That's the biggest shame for me as it drastically reduces the amount of play we'll see.
Which means that the air time is free for some smaller local tourney. This was the biggest thing about WCS 2013. It was alway on the air so there were no free time slots.
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It is really sad that we wont have the best 16 players at the highest staked tournament. If this keeps going on like that, we will have one player from each country one day...
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Mute City2363 Posts
On December 18 2015 17:42 deacon.frost wrote:Show nested quote +On December 18 2015 17:37 Heartland wrote:
Did I understand it correctly that there will not be any week to week tournament for foreigners like WCS has been? That's the biggest shame for me as it drastically reduces the amount of play we'll see. Which means that the air time is free for some smaller local tourney. This was the biggest thing about WCS 2013. It was alway on the air so there were no free time slots.
If I've understood it correctly, there will be regional challenger tournaments to qualify for the three seasonal events
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On December 18 2015 17:46 graNite wrote:
It is really sad that we wont have the best 16 players at the highest staked tournament. If this keeps going on like that, we will have one player from each country one day...
At least change the name from WCS World Championship Series to something that doesn't imply we're going to see high skill games there.
GSL/SSL Season 1 is completely skewed to gimmicky Z/P with current maps and balance, 8 spots are lost to WCS Welfare. Essentially, our 'world hampionship' may consist of 8 completely uncompetitive 'pro'gamers, up to 4 potential flukes, and 4 Season 2 performers. At least Korean Terrans got shafted bigtime with being having lost half the points for the Nov championship ALREADY last week.
Lol.
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Germany3367 Posts
What a bummer... less Korea events. T_T
I really don't care about region-locked events, so mehhhhhh...
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On December 18 2015 17:56 TheOneAboveU wrote:
What a bummer... less Korea events. T_T
I really don't care about region-locked events, so mehhhhhh...
Make sure not to watch and tune in, make the viewercount vote for us.
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On December 18 2015 17:01 SC2Toastie wrote:Show nested quote +On December 18 2015 16:58 NyxNax wrote:
"I hope the viewer numbers go down for Dreamhack and IEM.... I wont watch any foreign only tournaments".... Good lord... It's the only way the people who care about the level of competition over the level of drama are getting a say in all this. I'm not sitting down to watch a tournament of my average ladder game take shape. Voting with my contribution to the viewer count here. If you disagree with that, go live in North Korea. I'd rather send a clear message of disapproval and not waste my time because random internet people are afraid it kills their precious episodes of How I Met Your Mother Gone Korprulu..
WCS had higher skill level than DHs...
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On December 18 2015 17:59 SC2Toastie wrote:Show nested quote +On December 18 2015 17:56 TheOneAboveU wrote:
What a bummer... less Korea events. T_T
I really don't care about region-locked events, so mehhhhhh... Make sure not to watch and tune in, make the viewercount vote for us.
I think the majority of the TL will tune in for Korean events only. But I could be wrong.
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On December 18 2015 18:03 WrathSCII wrote:Show nested quote +On December 18 2015 17:59 SC2Toastie wrote:On December 18 2015 17:56 TheOneAboveU wrote:
What a bummer... less Korea events. T_T
I really don't care about region-locked events, so mehhhhhh... Make sure not to watch and tune in, make the viewercount vote for us. I think the majority of the TL will tune in for Korean events only. But I could be wrong.
TL is only a small amount of full viewrr numbers though
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Mute City2363 Posts
On December 18 2015 18:00 sharkie wrote:Show nested quote +On December 18 2015 17:01 SC2Toastie wrote:On December 18 2015 16:58 NyxNax wrote:
"I hope the viewer numbers go down for Dreamhack and IEM.... I wont watch any foreign only tournaments".... Good lord... It's the only way the people who care about the level of competition over the level of drama are getting a say in all this. I'm not sitting down to watch a tournament of my average ladder game take shape. Voting with my contribution to the viewer count here. If you disagree with that, go live in North Korea. I'd rather send a clear message of disapproval and not waste my time because random internet people are afraid it kills their precious episodes of How I Met Your Mother Gone Korprulu.. WCS had higher skill level than DHs...
The best players from WCS, save Hydra and Polt, all went to various Dreamhacks. They all lost.
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On December 18 2015 18:00 sharkie wrote:Show nested quote +On December 18 2015 17:01 SC2Toastie wrote:On December 18 2015 16:58 NyxNax wrote:
"I hope the viewer numbers go down for Dreamhack and IEM.... I wont watch any foreign only tournaments".... Good lord... It's the only way the people who care about the level of competition over the level of drama are getting a say in all this. I'm not sitting down to watch a tournament of my average ladder game take shape. Voting with my contribution to the viewer count here. If you disagree with that, go live in North Korea. I'd rather send a clear message of disapproval and not waste my time because random internet people are afraid it kills their precious episodes of How I Met Your Mother Gone Korprulu.. WCS had higher skill level than DHs...
WCS Korea, that is?
Pay more attention if you think the highest brackets of DH are of lower skill than the final brackets of WCS EUAM. Even considering the fact one is a 72 hr marathon.
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On December 18 2015 18:04 sharkie wrote:Show nested quote +On December 18 2015 18:03 WrathSCII wrote:On December 18 2015 17:59 SC2Toastie wrote:On December 18 2015 17:56 TheOneAboveU wrote:
What a bummer... less Korea events. T_T
I really don't care about region-locked events, so mehhhhhh... Make sure not to watch and tune in, make the viewercount vote for us. I think the majority of the TL will tune in for Korean events only. But I could be wrong. TL is only a small amount of full viewrr numbers though
TL is a vocal minority that cares about skill more than drama.
On the other hand, these are also the kind of people that have money to spend on products of sponsors. At least I do, and I know a number of others who do so. Compared to your average twitchchat dummy.
We'll see how it pans out. I can just speak for myself and say that I don't feel guilty if firms like DH/IEM stop with SC2 because their viewer numbers reflect the skill level - real fucking low. I'd be sad, but it's not my fault. This WCS Welfare farce is to blame for that.
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Any idea of the implications for players like JD ? Is he eligible for the Circuit system ?
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EPT
