| Forum Index > TL Mafia |
|
Vivax
21691 Posts
Bring the arguments against Wiggles and TranceStorm then. Bring other reads when you use them for association or to stop pressure on townreads. You also forgot to include previous arguments you used to say GK played scummy in your list, why do you forget your own arguments for saying people might be scum and instead say he's just scummy for activity now? Others are far less active. | ||
|
TranceStorm
1616 Posts
And think about it this. If I were scum, I could have simply given a bogus justification or repeated someone else's argument to 'appear as if I had made a contribution'. I didn't do that, I gave my opinion without writing a paragraph about why I felt that way. Unfortunately, I was unable to participate in the later brouhaha regarding the GM lynch so I couldn't make any extended push against any particular player. | ||
|
zarepath
United States1626 Posts
| ||
|
TranceStorm
1616 Posts
| ||
|
zarepath
United States1626 Posts
On March 19 2013 23:44 Vivax wrote: Why do you post a list of all your reads when your only argument should be to get scum lynched if you are town. Bring the arguments against Wiggles and TranceStorm then. Bring other reads when you use them for association or to stop pressure on townreads. You also forgot to include previous arguments you used to say GK played scummy in your list, why do you forget your own arguments for saying people might be scum and instead say he's just scummy for activity now? Others are far less active. 1. Because there's a chance I'm lynched today, and I started this reads post for a N1 post but didn't have time to finish it. Also: I don't see why it's unhelpful. 2. What do you think about Wiggles and TranceStorm? I'll be looking into them more deeply as the day goes, but I think there's a good enough amount to suspect and pressure them right now already -- Wiggles refuses to give reads, and Trance did a weird dance for yesterday's lynch. Now Trance still thinks that Wiggles is "super scummy" but has actually voted instead for TPS based off of someone else's case. His opening post is a whole lot of nothing, and so are his next few posts. 3. If you're talking about the quote I pulled with goodkarma basically giving a resume of how townie he's been, yes, that's still a strike against him in my book. But his interaction with BH in the QT has evened my read out to Null. | ||
|
zarepath
United States1626 Posts
On March 20 2013 00:04 TranceStorm wrote: I didn't vote for you though, and I didn't drop my case against DoYouHas. I just said that I would be willing to vote for you. I didn't have any unique reasons why; they had all been outlined beforehand by people like sciberia. If I were to switch my vote to you, I might have given a brief 2 liner about how lackluster your D1 posts seemed to be. I guess that's true; you didn't. It just looked a lot like "Sheep for hire! Any case will do!" | ||
|
TranceStorm
1616 Posts
First, as to my lynch choice today. I have a choice to make between the case against TPS and against Mr. Wiggles (which I had pointed out first last night). For me, the compelling evidence against TPS seems to be his behavior in his very flimsy vote for GM last night and hasn't paid any lip service to the accusations leveled at him. My case against Wiggles has been responded to somewhat, if unconvincingly. In a decision between two scummy candidates, I have to the most likely one, in my opinion it is TPS. As to your second point, you are overgeneralizing. I was asked specifically for the case of zarepath, which I had read over and agreed with. That doesn't mean that any case that's presented to me will be something I agree with. | ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
On March 19 2013 21:42 sciberbia wrote: + Show Spoiler [snip] + Guess I'm just not sleeping tonight :/ @Kitaman I believe you are referring to DYH doing some meta research on Zerapath. And he did indeed follow up on it. Just filter DYH @Mocsta While filtering you I found this. On March 19 2013 17:08 Mocsta wrote: Indulge me.. why are guys like Coagulation being allowed to fly under the radar? I'm actually leaning town on Coag. Hence, no need to bring him up. And I suspect the rest of the thread lives in terror of having their head bitten off if they dare try to make a read on him. Anyway, if you've played with Coag before, what say you to this: I would say that such behavior is within my expectations. What do you make of keirathi's take on zarepath? | ||
|
ThePeashooter
United States100 Posts
On March 19 2013 21:39 kitaman27 wrote: To be clear, are you inferring that you believe VE isn't town because a town VE would have no reason to claim vet or are you lecturing VE for a poor decision? Unless someone else claims a hit, I see no reason to doubt the hit with only one flip. Keirathi could have been a doublestack, but its pretty unlikely. Unless VE is still around 5 cycles from now I imagine the claim will take care of itself. I'll get back to you after I get a chance to read through the logs. If I don't, remind me. I'm having trouble looking for a post if someone recalls it. There was a player who posted a bunch of links to a past game, without commenting on the content. I looked 3 times through the thread and couldn't find it, so I might just be crazy, but I was hoping to see if they ever followed up with it. @TPS. If you can confirm/deny your identity as yamato, I believe it will give me a clue to your alignment based on one of your earlier posts and it is something not related to the Vivax guess. If you are town, you would surely be willing to reveal this small piece of information. I'll come up with a much larger post tonight when I actually have more time, without getting interrupted every 3 minutes. This is the only indulging I am going to do and it is solely because I like Kitaman. I actually don't even know who he is. I have purposely ignored every question pertaining to this because I don't find it relevant and any other guesses will be firmly ignored. | ||
|
Vivax
21691 Posts
BAD news: Looks like one of my reads was wrong, is it you who is town TPS? Maybe rather glurio? GOOD news: BH likely scum, I have evidence that the logs are faked. As you see, BH talks about hosts dragging their feet setting up the mason qt. Since the message can't have been a PM (you see the Edit Delete?) it's clear it was written in another qt. Not hard to guess which one. + Show Spoiler + Edit Delete Okay so the hosts are dragging their feet with setting up the Mason QT so I'll drop some stuff in here since I have to step out for a moment. My power works on a per-phase basis and I was hoping to mason you for D2 but the chance you can be lynched is too high, so instead I'm masoning you for D1 so I can work with you while you're still alive. In any case, I currently have two strong scumreads I want to push, besides my tiff with Testsubject and with TPS (which I need to step back from due to emotional issues, at least for today). I suggest we pool our thoughts and reads since you are a pretty good scumhunter when you have someone to bounce ideas off of. Mainly I am concerned with Mr. Wiggles. He is an aggressive scumhunter and a capable asset as town, but his scum play isn't as good, and I'm pretty sure this is scum Wiggles. He didn't seriously follow-up on his attack on you, and only when prodded has he posted in the thread. When he DOES post, he composes his posts quite well-- they look and smell like cases-- but he doesn't back them up and press them the way a town player who really wanted to lynch his target would. For example, he calls up Coag's meta to defend coag, then utterly ignores meta to attack you. I jumped through all kinds of hoops to deflect it and even now he's trying to get a mislynch off on you, despite admitting you're playing to your town meta. The other player that bothers me is Geript, but I think I might be emotionally against him and seeing things I shouldn't-- I'd like you to check my logic here. Geript has been actively opposing attempts of town to organize and scumhunt, but not in a way that relays concerns for town complacency or other dangers of VE's gambit. furthermore, he is focusing his attacks on the most productive and useful townies rather than try to develop cases or even push his main targets. Whenever there's pushback, he changes who he's attacking. Normally I'd be on him like white on rice, but I mislynched him last game and am worried I am misreading him now. I'm going to be rolling out an attack on Wiggles shortly. Do you have any thoughts? 1 BlazinghandPerson was signed in when posted 03-17-2013 08:52 PM ET (US) Edit Delete Mason QT between GoodKarma and Wade Fell for D1 of The Game. ##Vote WadeFell huehuehueheuheuehueheuheu | ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
| ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
| ||
|
ThePeashooter
United States100 Posts
Now I know I'm a bit biased here so I'm going to ask both Ace and Kitaman for a favor here. I would like you to read WadeFall's filter. The reason I want someone else to do this is because I am without a doubt biased against Wade Fall and I feel as though it needs to be done by someone competent. I accept that Wade is stupid, however I believe he crossed the line from just being stupid to actively lying and overextending his reads on me to sway town to lynch me which is an extremely scummy thing. I noticed he was doing it yesterday but it wasn't as overt. Let me dissect his accusation post as an example of what I am talking about so there is a point of reference. On March 19 2013 15:57 Wade Fell wrote: I hate setup speculation, but yes, this is an entirely reasonable point in the context of speculating about the setup. I can understand VE's reasoning for outing me, especially given that this is the case. I don't really have an answer for this other than that I am a town-aligned mason role, and although it's weird it's not unthinkable, and DrH is a wiley fellow. Okay so lists posts are crap right so I'm gonna keep it short and simple, here are my two scumreads I want to lynch today, and why we should lynch them. I'm leaving wiggles, testsubj, geript wos ryu dp etc unmentioned because they are not my top 2 scumreads and I want to stay focused. Each of them individually has things I dislike about them but barring a something weird happenign with the daypost I won't be pushing them.If that changes and I am still alive, I will let you know. 1) thepeashooter: I've talked a lot about TPS in thread already but mainly I'm concerned about his attempts to _look_ like he's contributing without actually doing it. I'm like 90% sure his "anger" at my spamming is faked given that you had the same filter length as me at the time and his response to it was to just quote a bunch of my posts. I said this multiple times. I don't care about how many posts you have as long as they are actual content. I said this multiple times but for some reason he chooses to ignore this and continue pretending all I care about is post count. Furthermore, he is trying to say my anger is fake. He knows for a fact its not fake since I reported him to the host for spamming even after I asked him to shut the fuck up both nicely then directly. You know I was genuinely annoyed yet you are going to pretend you think I wasn't only because it serves a purpose. This is the definition of malicious intent. He's done a pretty slick job of not contributing to the game and looking like an "emotional townie". Why would he quote all my posts and complain about my filter length when at the time Ve has the same level of spam? (link) this doesn't read "angry town" to me, it reads "fake anger". Please illustrate how I have not contributed at all? You have pretty much done two things, spam and try to kill me but somehow I am the one who has contributed nothing. You give no example apart from you saying it is so. His weird opt-out of the town discourse D1 (link) is scummy, as well as the fact he had to be forcefully prodded into contributing. This is my favorite part. His example of me "opting out" of town discourse is a link to him just saying that I did that. At no point did I ever say fuck you for not wanting to lynch Coag and ran away to my cave until the cycle was over. He was one of a couple of people (the other being Coag) who kept pointing out how I abandoned the thread and went inactive even though my most recent posts at the time indicated that I was at work. By "Forceful Prodding" he actually meant "got home from work". I don't buy his theory that he wanted to "let it play out" with GM rather than (link) actively interacting with the case. Imagine you are a townie in this situation. Do you engage and try to get an understanding of what's going on and push your own reads, or even ask questions to refine them? Or do you hang back and "let it play out"? Even if you hang back, you at least ask questions and try to learn more. This is not what town does, this think that TPS has done. A lot of his other posts aren't analysis but are just dismissals (link)(link)(link) in which he doesn't push his own ideas but just naysays what other people have to say. I will be voting for TPS when the daypost goes up based on this. The only semi legitimate point I suppose so I will elaborate on my train of thought. I know greymist is a veteran player and I was immediately suspicious of him. My notes on him are a link to his first post and a comment that "You can do better than this." I was simply waiting him out and didn't want to give him a reason to go on the defensive if he knew I was suspicious. On top of this I was already pushing Coagulation who I still wouldn't mind seeing dead. As I stated earlier, there is no reason to push all 5 of your scum candidates at once if you can only kill one at a time. I'd prefer to pressure one and see how the others respond to that pressure. The last part of that is my hopping on the band wagon to kill Greymist. As I said earlier I had been at work and got caught up that night and I wasn't exactly sure when the day post was coming. I saw Greymist thrown out as an alternative to Zare and I knew for a fact that I thought greymist was scummy and was pretty sure I had a townread on Zare at the time. So I chose to change my vote to greymist. I didn't have time to actually post a case or do analysis because I was not home. So I admit, both scenario's are possible, but I feel that I have adequately explained my reasoning for not having said anything about greymist until passively voting for him. If you want further evidence of my reasoning for not listing every single read you can find me speaking to Vivax here: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=402057¤tpage=39#763 | ||
|
ThePeashooter
United States100 Posts
On March 20 2013 00:45 layabout wrote: For starters it would make BH, VE and GK all scum since they are all telling us the logs are genuine. Yeah, you can't fake logs of someone who is still alive unless they are both scum. In this case it would mean all 3, (IE: around 50-60% of the mafia team) would have to be scum. This would be an insane ploy. | ||
|
zarepath
United States1626 Posts
So it could just be BH and GK scum, but it seems like a pretty bad claim. | ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
| ||
|
Vivax
21691 Posts
+ Show Spoiler + On March 18 2013 02:23 layabout wrote: vivax thinks TPS is yamato and started calling him yamato. So either they are both scum, masons or vivax did something "silly". Given how layabout calls this obvious slip stupid, but was pretty quick to damn me for a slip that wasn't one earlier, I'm now also suspicious of him. Layabout why do you call cosmic out of all players to look at this? | ||
|
geript
10024 Posts
| ||
|
layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
On March 20 2013 01:28 Vivax wrote: It's obvious BH is a mason, so it doesn't make VE automatically scum. It just means that part of the logs with GK have been written in the scum qt and the D1 masoning was fake, the others could be real. + Show Spoiler + On March 18 2013 02:23 layabout wrote: vivax thinks TPS is yamato and started calling him yamato. So either they are both scum, masons or vivax did something "silly". Given how layabout calls this obvious slip stupid, but was pretty quick to damn me for a slip that wasn't one earlier, I'm now also suspicious of him. Layabout why do you call cosmic out of all players to look at this? This appears to be another incident with the sarcasm. Vivax i didn't think you slipped i explained the slip but (i hope it should be obvious to most) i thought it was just you being silly. If you notice i didn't try to push you or TPS, as i should have if i believed you had slipped. As to your other point: I am not telling. Yet. | ||
|
Vivax
21691 Posts
Replacing the TPS and glurio reads with layabout and Wade now, TPS is being tunneled by wade and GK so unlikely scum imo. Zarepath, GK, cosmicomics, Wade, layabout scum probably. Layabout you said you liked my case against Zarepath earlier yet you are doing absolutely nothing to hunt scum currently, you're just defending BH, zarepath is here and you don't try to figure out if he scum? On March 19 2013 02:54 layabout wrote: Are you serious? This was dealt with forever ago. | ||
| ||
The PiG Daily
Best Games of SC
Dark vs Clem
TBD vs ByuN
herO vs SHIN
Rogue vs Classic
[ Submit Event ] |
|
StarCraft 2 StarCraft: Brood War Dota 2 League of Legends Counter-Strike Super Smash Bros Other Games |
|
SOOP
Oliveira vs Trap
HomeStory Cup
BSL: ProLeague
Dewalt vs Mihu
Bonyth vs Dandy
Replay Cast
StarCraft2.fi
OlimoLeague
StarCraft2.fi
BSL: GosuLeague
Sparkling Tuna Cup
StarCraft2.fi
[ Show More ] |
|
|
EPT
