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On April 01 2013 03:18 iGrok wrote:Show nested quote +On April 01 2013 02:59 sciberbia wrote:On March 31 2013 14:41 ThePeashooter wrote:On March 31 2013 14:39 Keirathi wrote:On March 31 2013 14:37 Kenpachi wrote:
isnt town win condition to just eliminate all mafia Someone asked and DrH told them that town had to eliminate all non-town. Yeah I remembered reading that but couldn't find it anywhere. I sent a PM to DrH:
Is it possible for this game to contain non-town entities that are not considered "threats to town" as specified by the town win condition? Or would that fall outside the realm of possibilities in a "Normal game"?
Threats to town is meant to be taken as anyone who is not town aligned.
I was going to include this in my deadline post but that was the night DrH ended night 5 minutes early :/ spiel about recruiter role that you will probably find uninteresting + Show Spoiler +
I didn't follow a lot of the conversation about this third party recruiter role, but one thing that I really don't like about it is how the win condition of the mirror image works. The mirror image starts with either the town win condition or the mafia win condition. Then, in order for him to get converted, he must play against his original win condition. Once, he is converted, he essentially has two alternate win conditions, which makes mirror image quite an imba role. He essentially has two chances to win. I recommend that future hosts take things like this into consideration if you want to include a similar role in a future game.
long spiel on closed setups that you will probably find uninteresting + Show Spoiler +
On a side note, I don't like closed setups, "hidden" mechanics, or even to a lesser extent semi-open setups in general. Because it greatly benefits a player to be able to guess what kind of setups the host would be likely to make.
For example, VE made the poor decision to out the mirror and not accept the conversion because VE had no information on the setup. In reality, he would have done much better to accept. But how was VE supposed to know this? He just had to guess.
On the other hand, layabout made the good strategic decision to get converted. So did layabout "outplay" VE? Did layabout demonstrate that he is better at the game of mafia? In my opinion, no. He just correctly guessed that it would help him win if he accepted the conversion. "Closed" mechanics introduce a factor of "guess the setup" to mafia, which is otherwise very much a game of skill.
I like setups like C9++, like 4of6, or like that of Nomination Mafia, or Hydra Mini Mafia. Where everybody knows EXACTLY how the setup was created. And it is not a matter of "guess what the host did".
Speaking of which, if there's one thing I really hate about setups, its when hosts "balance" the teams. This is another case of "guess what the host is likely to do". Such as DrH giving GreyMist the nightmare role because GM requested it in his /in post. Anybody that knew DrH would be prone to do this is put at an advantage. And team balancing is unfair to newer players who do not know what teams the host would consider balanced. If hosts want to balance teams, then the only way to make it fair is to specify what teams would be considered balanced, and then redo the RNG until a "balanced" team is RNG'd. Something like "exactly 4 of VE, WF, kitaman, Palmar, marv, sandroba are town". But I would much prefer that teams are completely randomized. I think it would be fun to see Palmar, marv, bugs, and sandroba on a scumteam. It would make a nice change from the balancing that seems to me to be prevalent.
Also, I think that 23+1 is much better than 24 hour nights. 24 hour nights is very messy. It requires everyone who wants to make a deadline post to wait until literally 5 seconds before the deadline and make their post, if they want to be sure that nobody else will read it before the deadline. And it requires that the host is EXACTLY on time with the day post. In theory, it could work. But in practice, it is unlikely to happen. I think 23+1 silent and the standard 23+1 action resolution are both good, and both have a slight flaw. 23+1 silent has the drawback that everyone with night actions has to be online an hour before the deadline, read all the deadline posts, and then decide if they want to change their night action. 23+1 action resolution has the drawback that night actions have to be submitted before deadline posts. This introduces a "randomizing" factor into NK decisions and other night action decisions. Not all the information is available to the people making the decisions. Mafia has to choose who to NK without knowing what final reads people will push etc. 23+1 silent is no different than 24 from a player perspective. That's why GreY and I did that. Either the players have to be online at hour 23, or they have to be online at hour 24. What's the difference? 23+1 non-silent is terrible and should never be used, unless you were playing Last Will and Testament perhaps.
23 +1 silent removes the possibility of writing a last will that mafia cannot see before deciding their NK. So for any VT that just wants to give some "last reads" during the night, there is no obligation to be online at any particular time using 23 +1 silent.
But under 24 hour night, it would benefit them to wait until the final seconds. So there is an obligation for them to be online at a particular time.
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On April 01 2013 03:35 sciberbia wrote:Show nested quote +On April 01 2013 03:18 iGrok wrote:On April 01 2013 02:59 sciberbia wrote:On March 31 2013 14:41 ThePeashooter wrote:On March 31 2013 14:39 Keirathi wrote:On March 31 2013 14:37 Kenpachi wrote:
isnt town win condition to just eliminate all mafia Someone asked and DrH told them that town had to eliminate all non-town. Yeah I remembered reading that but couldn't find it anywhere. I sent a PM to DrH:
Is it possible for this game to contain non-town entities that are not considered "threats to town" as specified by the town win condition? Or would that fall outside the realm of possibilities in a "Normal game"?
Threats to town is meant to be taken as anyone who is not town aligned.
I was going to include this in my deadline post but that was the night DrH ended night 5 minutes early :/ spiel about recruiter role that you will probably find uninteresting + Show Spoiler +
I didn't follow a lot of the conversation about this third party recruiter role, but one thing that I really don't like about it is how the win condition of the mirror image works. The mirror image starts with either the town win condition or the mafia win condition. Then, in order for him to get converted, he must play against his original win condition. Once, he is converted, he essentially has two alternate win conditions, which makes mirror image quite an imba role. He essentially has two chances to win. I recommend that future hosts take things like this into consideration if you want to include a similar role in a future game.
long spiel on closed setups that you will probably find uninteresting + Show Spoiler +
On a side note, I don't like closed setups, "hidden" mechanics, or even to a lesser extent semi-open setups in general. Because it greatly benefits a player to be able to guess what kind of setups the host would be likely to make.
For example, VE made the poor decision to out the mirror and not accept the conversion because VE had no information on the setup. In reality, he would have done much better to accept. But how was VE supposed to know this? He just had to guess.
On the other hand, layabout made the good strategic decision to get converted. So did layabout "outplay" VE? Did layabout demonstrate that he is better at the game of mafia? In my opinion, no. He just correctly guessed that it would help him win if he accepted the conversion. "Closed" mechanics introduce a factor of "guess the setup" to mafia, which is otherwise very much a game of skill.
I like setups like C9++, like 4of6, or like that of Nomination Mafia, or Hydra Mini Mafia. Where everybody knows EXACTLY how the setup was created. And it is not a matter of "guess what the host did".
Speaking of which, if there's one thing I really hate about setups, its when hosts "balance" the teams. This is another case of "guess what the host is likely to do". Such as DrH giving GreyMist the nightmare role because GM requested it in his /in post. Anybody that knew DrH would be prone to do this is put at an advantage. And team balancing is unfair to newer players who do not know what teams the host would consider balanced. If hosts want to balance teams, then the only way to make it fair is to specify what teams would be considered balanced, and then redo the RNG until a "balanced" team is RNG'd. Something like "exactly 4 of VE, WF, kitaman, Palmar, marv, sandroba are town". But I would much prefer that teams are completely randomized. I think it would be fun to see Palmar, marv, bugs, and sandroba on a scumteam. It would make a nice change from the balancing that seems to me to be prevalent.
Also, I think that 23+1 is much better than 24 hour nights. 24 hour nights is very messy. It requires everyone who wants to make a deadline post to wait until literally 5 seconds before the deadline and make their post, if they want to be sure that nobody else will read it before the deadline. And it requires that the host is EXACTLY on time with the day post. In theory, it could work. But in practice, it is unlikely to happen. I think 23+1 silent and the standard 23+1 action resolution are both good, and both have a slight flaw. 23+1 silent has the drawback that everyone with night actions has to be online an hour before the deadline, read all the deadline posts, and then decide if they want to change their night action. 23+1 action resolution has the drawback that night actions have to be submitted before deadline posts. This introduces a "randomizing" factor into NK decisions and other night action decisions. Not all the information is available to the people making the decisions. Mafia has to choose who to NK without knowing what final reads people will push etc. 23+1 silent is no different than 24 from a player perspective. That's why GreY and I did that. Either the players have to be online at hour 23, or they have to be online at hour 24. What's the difference? 23+1 non-silent is terrible and should never be used, unless you were playing Last Will and Testament perhaps. 23 +1 silent removes the possibility of writing a last will that mafia cannot see before deciding their NK. So for any VT that just wants to give some "last reads" during the night, there is no obligation to be online at any particular time using 23 +1 silent.
I don't understand?
If the night was 23+1 silent, why wouldn't the townies just make their last will posts at 22.999 instead of the 23.999 they do on 24 hour nights? Scum still can't change their night actions in the 1 extra hour.
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On April 01 2013 03:40 Keirathi wrote:Show nested quote +On April 01 2013 03:35 sciberbia wrote:On April 01 2013 03:18 iGrok wrote:On April 01 2013 02:59 sciberbia wrote:On March 31 2013 14:41 ThePeashooter wrote:On March 31 2013 14:39 Keirathi wrote:On March 31 2013 14:37 Kenpachi wrote:
isnt town win condition to just eliminate all mafia Someone asked and DrH told them that town had to eliminate all non-town. Yeah I remembered reading that but couldn't find it anywhere. I sent a PM to DrH:
Is it possible for this game to contain non-town entities that are not considered "threats to town" as specified by the town win condition? Or would that fall outside the realm of possibilities in a "Normal game"?
Threats to town is meant to be taken as anyone who is not town aligned.
I was going to include this in my deadline post but that was the night DrH ended night 5 minutes early :/ spiel about recruiter role that you will probably find uninteresting + Show Spoiler +
I didn't follow a lot of the conversation about this third party recruiter role, but one thing that I really don't like about it is how the win condition of the mirror image works. The mirror image starts with either the town win condition or the mafia win condition. Then, in order for him to get converted, he must play against his original win condition. Once, he is converted, he essentially has two alternate win conditions, which makes mirror image quite an imba role. He essentially has two chances to win. I recommend that future hosts take things like this into consideration if you want to include a similar role in a future game.
long spiel on closed setups that you will probably find uninteresting + Show Spoiler +
On a side note, I don't like closed setups, "hidden" mechanics, or even to a lesser extent semi-open setups in general. Because it greatly benefits a player to be able to guess what kind of setups the host would be likely to make.
For example, VE made the poor decision to out the mirror and not accept the conversion because VE had no information on the setup. In reality, he would have done much better to accept. But how was VE supposed to know this? He just had to guess.
On the other hand, layabout made the good strategic decision to get converted. So did layabout "outplay" VE? Did layabout demonstrate that he is better at the game of mafia? In my opinion, no. He just correctly guessed that it would help him win if he accepted the conversion. "Closed" mechanics introduce a factor of "guess the setup" to mafia, which is otherwise very much a game of skill.
I like setups like C9++, like 4of6, or like that of Nomination Mafia, or Hydra Mini Mafia. Where everybody knows EXACTLY how the setup was created. And it is not a matter of "guess what the host did".
Speaking of which, if there's one thing I really hate about setups, its when hosts "balance" the teams. This is another case of "guess what the host is likely to do". Such as DrH giving GreyMist the nightmare role because GM requested it in his /in post. Anybody that knew DrH would be prone to do this is put at an advantage. And team balancing is unfair to newer players who do not know what teams the host would consider balanced. If hosts want to balance teams, then the only way to make it fair is to specify what teams would be considered balanced, and then redo the RNG until a "balanced" team is RNG'd. Something like "exactly 4 of VE, WF, kitaman, Palmar, marv, sandroba are town". But I would much prefer that teams are completely randomized. I think it would be fun to see Palmar, marv, bugs, and sandroba on a scumteam. It would make a nice change from the balancing that seems to me to be prevalent.
Also, I think that 23+1 is much better than 24 hour nights. 24 hour nights is very messy. It requires everyone who wants to make a deadline post to wait until literally 5 seconds before the deadline and make their post, if they want to be sure that nobody else will read it before the deadline. And it requires that the host is EXACTLY on time with the day post. In theory, it could work. But in practice, it is unlikely to happen. I think 23+1 silent and the standard 23+1 action resolution are both good, and both have a slight flaw. 23+1 silent has the drawback that everyone with night actions has to be online an hour before the deadline, read all the deadline posts, and then decide if they want to change their night action. 23+1 action resolution has the drawback that night actions have to be submitted before deadline posts. This introduces a "randomizing" factor into NK decisions and other night action decisions. Not all the information is available to the people making the decisions. Mafia has to choose who to NK without knowing what final reads people will push etc. 23+1 silent is no different than 24 from a player perspective. That's why GreY and I did that. Either the players have to be online at hour 23, or they have to be online at hour 24. What's the difference? 23+1 non-silent is terrible and should never be used, unless you were playing Last Will and Testament perhaps. 23 +1 silent removes the possibility of writing a last will that mafia cannot see before deciding their NK. So for any VT that just wants to give some "last reads" during the night, there is no obligation to be online at any particular time using 23 +1 silent. I don't understand? If the night was 23+1 silent, why wouldn't the townies just make their last will posts at 22.999 instead of the 23.999 they do on 24 hour nights? Scum still can't change their night actions in the 1 extra hour.
Oh I guess I misunderstood. I thought 23 +1 silent meant actions can still be changed in the last hour.
E: I think there is some merit to this because it removes the "race conditions" inherent in the 24 hour system. But yea if actions can't be changed then I guess it is essentially the same as 24 hour night, but just a bit easier on the host.
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On April 01 2013 03:44 sciberbia wrote:Show nested quote +On April 01 2013 03:40 Keirathi wrote:On April 01 2013 03:35 sciberbia wrote:On April 01 2013 03:18 iGrok wrote:On April 01 2013 02:59 sciberbia wrote:On March 31 2013 14:41 ThePeashooter wrote:On March 31 2013 14:39 Keirathi wrote:On March 31 2013 14:37 Kenpachi wrote:
isnt town win condition to just eliminate all mafia Someone asked and DrH told them that town had to eliminate all non-town. Yeah I remembered reading that but couldn't find it anywhere. I sent a PM to DrH:
Is it possible for this game to contain non-town entities that are not considered "threats to town" as specified by the town win condition? Or would that fall outside the realm of possibilities in a "Normal game"?
Threats to town is meant to be taken as anyone who is not town aligned.
I was going to include this in my deadline post but that was the night DrH ended night 5 minutes early :/ spiel about recruiter role that you will probably find uninteresting + Show Spoiler +
I didn't follow a lot of the conversation about this third party recruiter role, but one thing that I really don't like about it is how the win condition of the mirror image works. The mirror image starts with either the town win condition or the mafia win condition. Then, in order for him to get converted, he must play against his original win condition. Once, he is converted, he essentially has two alternate win conditions, which makes mirror image quite an imba role. He essentially has two chances to win. I recommend that future hosts take things like this into consideration if you want to include a similar role in a future game.
long spiel on closed setups that you will probably find uninteresting + Show Spoiler +
On a side note, I don't like closed setups, "hidden" mechanics, or even to a lesser extent semi-open setups in general. Because it greatly benefits a player to be able to guess what kind of setups the host would be likely to make.
For example, VE made the poor decision to out the mirror and not accept the conversion because VE had no information on the setup. In reality, he would have done much better to accept. But how was VE supposed to know this? He just had to guess.
On the other hand, layabout made the good strategic decision to get converted. So did layabout "outplay" VE? Did layabout demonstrate that he is better at the game of mafia? In my opinion, no. He just correctly guessed that it would help him win if he accepted the conversion. "Closed" mechanics introduce a factor of "guess the setup" to mafia, which is otherwise very much a game of skill.
I like setups like C9++, like 4of6, or like that of Nomination Mafia, or Hydra Mini Mafia. Where everybody knows EXACTLY how the setup was created. And it is not a matter of "guess what the host did".
Speaking of which, if there's one thing I really hate about setups, its when hosts "balance" the teams. This is another case of "guess what the host is likely to do". Such as DrH giving GreyMist the nightmare role because GM requested it in his /in post. Anybody that knew DrH would be prone to do this is put at an advantage. And team balancing is unfair to newer players who do not know what teams the host would consider balanced. If hosts want to balance teams, then the only way to make it fair is to specify what teams would be considered balanced, and then redo the RNG until a "balanced" team is RNG'd. Something like "exactly 4 of VE, WF, kitaman, Palmar, marv, sandroba are town". But I would much prefer that teams are completely randomized. I think it would be fun to see Palmar, marv, bugs, and sandroba on a scumteam. It would make a nice change from the balancing that seems to me to be prevalent.
Also, I think that 23+1 is much better than 24 hour nights. 24 hour nights is very messy. It requires everyone who wants to make a deadline post to wait until literally 5 seconds before the deadline and make their post, if they want to be sure that nobody else will read it before the deadline. And it requires that the host is EXACTLY on time with the day post. In theory, it could work. But in practice, it is unlikely to happen. I think 23+1 silent and the standard 23+1 action resolution are both good, and both have a slight flaw. 23+1 silent has the drawback that everyone with night actions has to be online an hour before the deadline, read all the deadline posts, and then decide if they want to change their night action. 23+1 action resolution has the drawback that night actions have to be submitted before deadline posts. This introduces a "randomizing" factor into NK decisions and other night action decisions. Not all the information is available to the people making the decisions. Mafia has to choose who to NK without knowing what final reads people will push etc. 23+1 silent is no different than 24 from a player perspective. That's why GreY and I did that. Either the players have to be online at hour 23, or they have to be online at hour 24. What's the difference? 23+1 non-silent is terrible and should never be used, unless you were playing Last Will and Testament perhaps. 23 +1 silent removes the possibility of writing a last will that mafia cannot see before deciding their NK. So for any VT that just wants to give some "last reads" during the night, there is no obligation to be online at any particular time using 23 +1 silent. I don't understand? If the night was 23+1 silent, why wouldn't the townies just make their last will posts at 22.999 instead of the 23.999 they do on 24 hour nights? Scum still can't change their night actions in the 1 extra hour. Oh I guess I misunderstood. I thought 23 +1 silent meant actions can still be changed in the last hour.
I mean, it could be like that if the host wanted it to.
But generally in 23+1, the 1 hour is an "action resolution period" in which no night actions can be changed at all. Especially useful for complex themed games that have all kinds of crazy interactions that could take time to work through.
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I knew I saw Night Action Resolution Period before! Shoulda guessed it was iGrok.
@sciberbia: What you described is just one of the few issues with Cults that make it hard to design around. Closed Setups + Cults is asking for even more drama when people get Win Conditions switched, and Town is actually playing correctly (lynching Anti-Town players) but ends up losing anyway when the hidden faction outnumbers them. Lots of rage incoming unless you just so happen to have players that don't mind that level of surprise.
Dr.H still mia but when he comes back maybe he'll chime in on it.
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Yeah the 23+1 silent thing seems like the best option.
The other option is to use robots to host, so they can do everything instantaneously at the 24th hour mark
I for one would welcome our future robot host overlords.
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On March 31 2013 14:50 Mocsta wrote:Show nested quote +On March 31 2013 14:03 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:On March 31 2013 13:58 Blazinghand wrote:
1) Layabout tells us he's masoned with CC. I think someone mentioned CC was 3p at this point? not sure
2) at some point Layabout claims 3p in scum QT, saying he was converted but is still scum
3) Kitaman tells layabout he too has been converted. Layabout isn't (???) fooled by this, and (knowing kita is in fact scum???), shared crucial information about how the 3p works, thereby giving Kita the means to shut down CC.
I initially thought Kita had suckered Layabout and pumped him for info, but layabout claims he was never suckered/pumped for info, and he offered all that voluntarily and without being fooled. This is why I really hated this third party role. I felt like if scum was somehow converted he could never authentically play his new role. Either it would be too broken by posting the mafia team and GGing the game, or he would just float back to his team and try to get the third party killed which went directly against his win condition, but would also be creating a new win condition for him by allowing him to regain his former win condition. Agree in full. I think I commented a similar thing in the obsqt. Im still not sure whether layabout knew he would re-convert though?
I asked when kitaman27 mentioned chaoser in lotr but i never told my team. So around day3.
Seems like there is a lot of confusion about what actually happened to me since the scum qt is a bitch to me and that's where the information is so i will try to clarify some things:
I was masoned a few hours before the end of day1 and a few hours into day2 was told to stop talking in the mason qt and got a pm telling me i had to stop cosmic getting lynched and that he was immune to night actions.
When i was converted i wanted to bus but since that would be ruining the game i decided to keep it to myself unless cosmic became an easy lynch. So i just tried to play like mafia and wanted to help my team win with 3p.
When i was converted i had no idea it would happen. I believed that cosmic was a town mason and i didn't opt out because i forgot the OP mentioned 3p roles. I also saw it as a chance to look townie to him and thought that only scum would be scared of being masoned. We just discussed reads for a bit.
I intended to push cosmicomics if he didn't call BH scum after BH claimed mason and had said so to BH. But before he came back to thread i was recruited.
After VE outed the mirror role i realized that my team had enough information to figure out that i was recruited. But i stayed silent.
On day 3 there were a number of townies pushing cosmicomics and since my team knew he had mason powers he was the best target for us to try to lynch so i decided to tell them that i had been converted and i continue playing for a mafia + 3p win.
On day4 i would have been best off letting cosmic die and winning with mafia. But since that would have been against the spirit of the game and since my team decided to put me in that position i tried to push kitaman27, i still don't know why you ignored cc's case. I thought i was a really good case and after he claimed mirror kitaman should have been lynched.
I was not angry about being converted, it was quite fun to play and it was really nice knowing so much more about the set-up than anyone else. I held all of the cards but could use them without ruining the game. But i think that the role is broken unless you try to play it as intended. Imagine if i hadn't told my team and cosmic had mirror claimed to me like he did with VE. I could just hand him the scum team and push them without fear of them punishing cc and bus them knowing that i am secure in my wincon and he isn't in danger of being lynched for days. I think having to keep another player alive is a bad win-condition. Because the biggest factor in whether or not they die is how they play and not how i play. The win-condition reverting upon cosmics death creates situations in which mirror images are better off letting him die and i think it would be better if recruits died with him.
I also think this set-up was a hard win for mafia compared to others, town had 3 vigis, medic, cop, and it took 2(?) modkills 1 mis vig shot, 4 town mislynches and a 3p lynch vs 1 correct vig shot and a vet hit on town's side, for the mafia team to win. When you add in the 3p there are too many ways for the mafia to lose players outside of the lynch without being able to protect themselves and i think mafia medic would have been a good addition. I was also disappointed that the rolenames had such a small impact on the game.
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On April 01 2013 09:45 layabout wrote:
I also think this set-up was a hard win for mafia compared to others, town had 3 vigis, medic, cop, and it took 2(?) modkills 1 mis vig shot, 4 town mislynches and a 3p lynch vs 1 correct vig shot and a vet hit on town's side, for the mafia team to win. When you add in the 3p there are too many ways for the mafia to lose players outside of the lynch without being able to protect themselves and i think mafia medic would have been a good addition. I was also disappointed that the rolenames had such a small impact on the game.
I didnt think too much on this during the course of the obsQT, but I agree in full.
Even with the closed setup difficulty, and 5 mafia + 3P in a 25 player game, I think this was stacked in towns favour.
Through a combination of good sniping and poor play, all the blues were eliminated first.
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On March 19 2013 16:28 VisceraEyes wrote:Show nested quote +On March 19 2013 16:26 DoYouHas wrote:On March 19 2013 16:07 Mocsta wrote:On March 19 2013 16:05 DoYouHas wrote:
Gotta say, that instantly makes me like a zarepath lynch much less. Im not following? Its all WIFOM right? If you want more WIFOM, Kei just caught VE in hydra.... Yes, my thinking could be reduced to WIFOM but here it is anyways. Scum priorities for NKs tend to fall along what threatens them the most balanced with a risk/reward assessment. If zare is scum, then the people threatening him right now are myself, Scib, and Vivax (off the top of my head). Vivax might be slightly less of a threat, as people have repeatedly ignored some of the things he says. But both Scib and I are extremely hard lynches at the moment, being considered townie by practically all of the thread (if I have read correctly). This makes Scib and I, and to a lesser degree, Vivax, logical targets IF zarepath is scum, and IF he was feeling the pressure. BH is another logical target if his roleclaim is true (I think it is, but can't be 100% sure). Now consider possible Medic protections. BH has claimed blue which could likely pull a medic's attention. Scib is probably the most townie and biggest threat in general, also a good chance of protection. But that still leaves myself and Vivax as pretty safe targets. Yes, this is WIFOM, but if I was scum this is how I would sift possible targets IF I was worried about zare getting lynched D2. Instead we get a Keirathi kill. A good kill because he is a solid town player, but by killing a replacement player who had very little time to put forth his opinions my guess is that scum is less worried about the track town is currently on, and more worried about a new voice providing a course correction. This is probably best post in thread. I'm going to bed, and I read everything tomorrow.
It didn't seem to accomplish anything to respond to this when you posted it, but now that the game is over I am left wondering why you liked this post of mine so much. It seemed to me, even as I wrote it, that it was just a mix of how I pick targets and WIFOM.
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Honestly, it was 100% on track. When I saw that post I hated it. I knew if it gained any headway then we could easily be done for.
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On April 01 2013 13:38 DoYouHas wrote:Show nested quote +On March 19 2013 16:28 VisceraEyes wrote:On March 19 2013 16:26 DoYouHas wrote:On March 19 2013 16:07 Mocsta wrote:On March 19 2013 16:05 DoYouHas wrote:
Gotta say, that instantly makes me like a zarepath lynch much less. Im not following? Its all WIFOM right? If you want more WIFOM, Kei just caught VE in hydra.... Yes, my thinking could be reduced to WIFOM but here it is anyways. Scum priorities for NKs tend to fall along what threatens them the most balanced with a risk/reward assessment. If zare is scum, then the people threatening him right now are myself, Scib, and Vivax (off the top of my head). Vivax might be slightly less of a threat, as people have repeatedly ignored some of the things he says. But both Scib and I are extremely hard lynches at the moment, being considered townie by practically all of the thread (if I have read correctly). This makes Scib and I, and to a lesser degree, Vivax, logical targets IF zarepath is scum, and IF he was feeling the pressure. BH is another logical target if his roleclaim is true (I think it is, but can't be 100% sure). Now consider possible Medic protections. BH has claimed blue which could likely pull a medic's attention. Scib is probably the most townie and biggest threat in general, also a good chance of protection. But that still leaves myself and Vivax as pretty safe targets. Yes, this is WIFOM, but if I was scum this is how I would sift possible targets IF I was worried about zare getting lynched D2. Instead we get a Keirathi kill. A good kill because he is a solid town player, but by killing a replacement player who had very little time to put forth his opinions my guess is that scum is less worried about the track town is currently on, and more worried about a new voice providing a course correction. This is probably best post in thread. I'm going to bed, and I read everything tomorrow. It didn't seem to accomplish anything to respond to this when you posted it, but now that the game is over I am left wondering why you liked this post of mine so much. It seemed to me, even as I wrote it, that it was just a mix of how I pick targets and WIFOM.
It showed critical thought toward the NKs, something sorely lacking in towns these days. That post was my way of telling you that I thought you were town. Nothing more.
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EPT
