EPTLord of the Rings Mafia - Page 47
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Archon_Toilet
65 Posts
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syllogism
Finland5948 Posts
I just got shot, as in a day vig hit me | ||
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Pyo
United States738 Posts
On September 21 2011 01:05 Radfield wrote: iGrok is a good lynch today. He has been useless, but not in a useless way. In a way that makes it look like he's trying to not be useless. GGQ, Vain, ON, Heist, Pyo: All of you need to ramp it up. Between Jackal, iGrok and Palmar, where would you place your vote? you aren't the boss of me... I don't like the fact that you're telling me that I have to vote for one of those 3. You followed/led the lynch of Erandorr and no one really gave you any shit for it. In fact you tried to spin WBG and errador both flipping town as an indicator of your townness: On September 20 2011 08:58 Radfield wrote: This means we derive very little from the day 1 lynch, as both Prp, WBG and Eradorr were town. With three townie wagons it means scum had everywhere to hide. In my opinion this makes those players staying on the WBG wagon look worst, and anyone switching votes around look more town. Mafia had no reason to flutter their votes, so I doubt they would have done so unneccesarily. I mean the other 2 lynch targets you were trying to distract from were both either killed or attempted to be killed which means scum wanted everyone to see them flip. This seems a little too convenient to me... The analysis of you independent of this fact isn't great either: You started with a day 1 policy post, wherein you say, "Step 3, avoid lynching an easy target," but then proceed to push for the Erandorr lynch... if there was ever an "easier" target than a guy who edits a post then lies about it, I haven't seen it. Then you engage DrH about confirmed townies (link) which just screams contrived nonsensical conversation to me... Confirmed townies are NOT "a voice that every town player can trust to be legit." Townies can be wrong and scum are more than happy to help propagate incorrect statements by trusted town - not to mention what happens when a scum gets on people's confirmed town list. Now you're basically leading the charge against Jackal and iGrok while calling out Drazerk, Palmar and ON as also being likely scum... So either you're some super brilliant player (except that you were totally off with Erandorr) or you're happily sheeping town around. It really doesn't sit well with me. At this point I'm more inclined to vote for you than any of the 3 you suggest (jackal, igrok, palmar). ##vote: radfield | ||
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syllogism
Finland5948 Posts
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Erandorr
2283 Posts
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Archon_Toilet
65 Posts
- on the prplhz wagon who is now confirmed townie - Defends Sauron doctorh On September 18 2011 21:07 jcarlsoniv wrote: Please share some REASONS behind your suspicions of drh, navi, and jackal. Give us a REASON to believe you other than saying "I like them for lynches". - Just crapping on about lurkers but doesnt actually say anything - Desperate to keep attention on the erandorr bandwagon rather than the one he was on. Mentions every single name on multiple occasions. This is important. It is highly likely mafia on the other big bandwagon as well, why ignore them? - Has claimed a personal interest in the ring. We know who Frodo is. Can only be Gollum or one of the nazgul. - accuses ciryandor (confirmed town) of being mafia cos he defended bugs (confirmed town) and prplhz (confirmed town) Bad votes, defends the godfather, attacks townies over and over. Has generally caused chaos, most of his post long quotewall noone can read. Vote to kill him. He is probably a nazgul. | ||
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Archon_Toilet
65 Posts
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GGQ
Canada2653 Posts
On September 21 2011 04:13 Archon_Toilet wrote: I do not understand the cipher but i say it is probably in elvish or black tongue cos we in lord of the rings game. Is likely result of a sheriff check, someone is town. It's not in any of Tolkien's languages. | ||
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syllogism
Finland5948 Posts
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Archon_Toilet
65 Posts
On September 21 2011 04:20 syllogism wrote: I don't quite understand why I would be scum day vig target over, say, radfield. Any thoughts radfield? You keep saying you shot. If you were shot how did you survive? Claiming veteran? | ||
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Archon_Toilet
65 Posts
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syllogism
Finland5948 Posts
On September 21 2011 04:22 Archon_Toilet wrote: You keep saying you shot. If you were shot how did you survive? Claiming veteran? I got shot and I survived, that's as much as you need to know | ||
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syllogism
Finland5948 Posts
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heist
United States720 Posts
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kitaman27
United States9244 Posts
On September 21 2011 05:11 heist wrote: First chance I got to be active since the night phase. I'll be reading through and posting my thoughts. But looking at the last comment, claiming is not going to do anything. Mafia all have safe claims. How do you know mafia all have safe claims? | ||
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Cyber_Cheese
Australia3615 Posts
On September 21 2011 05:16 kitaman27 wrote: How do you know mafia all have safe claims? It's in the OP that scum all have safe claims isn't it? | ||
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Cyber_Cheese
Australia3615 Posts
On September 12 2011 03:19 Curu wrote: [b]This is a closed setup. No roles or numbers will be revealed. You may not quote your role PM. You may paraphrase it if you wish. Do not rely on flavor to win the game – all non-Town players have been provided with safeclaims. Flips are not hidden. | ||
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GreYMisT
United States6736 Posts
On September 21 2011 03:54 syllogism wrote: Well this is interesting I just got shot, as in a day vig hit me anyone mind claiming this hit? | ||
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Cyber_Cheese
Australia3615 Posts
Now assuming you were the mafia, who would you assign to propose the pro-scum plan that may or may not go through? In the words of MrWiggles (notably deceased): On September 19 2011 10:46 Mr. Wiggles wrote: As well, it seems unlikely that if it was a mafia ploy they would have had Jackal deliver the plan. Even if one could give away the ring during the day, it would draw a lot of attention to the person proposing it, due to certain short-comings. It makes more sense to get one of the lesser experienced mafia members to propose it, because heat being drawn to them isn't as bad, and it can more easily be passed off as not thinking it through enough. Now, all this person really needs is a few quiet days while people slowly forget what he did day 1 if things go bad, so they *could* try to lurk until it all blew over. With that in mind, lets take a second look at TranceStorm's plan to confirm townies- On September 17 2011 14:36 TranceStorm wrote: Debating about who should get the ring and what each role can or cannot do at the moment is pointless at the current time. However, I do like one of the plans that was proposed by a few people: having the person who successfully passed on the ring claim themselves. This way, we can enable a 'chain' to be made - i.e. the first player can confirm the second player once the second player has passed on the ring themselves. This is all dependent on the assumption that evil players cannot pass the ring themselves which as Radfield pointed out, is probably a true assumption. Given this, however, this plan would probably only be effective for the first few 'passes' and perhaps near the end of the game when town circles become more clear. The risk after the first few days that the person holding the ring is killed, or has the ring stolen (which is a possible role according to the OP) makes the plan ineffective. Therefore, I think that such a plan should work for the first 2 or 3 days to confirm at least one or two people. Any thoughts or ideas about this? I haven't fully fleshed this out yet (i.e. the possibility of fake claims is strong), but its probably a better discussion than the arbitrary finger-pointing going on at the moment. This seemingly bad town plan has a ton of flaws. -Townies might not be able to further pass the ring, and therefore not safely claim after the ring was given to them. The ring is now stuck on someone who can't move it, when the previous towns person could have moved the ring if he sensed danger. -The difficulty of finding a new townie who the ring should be passed to. With every pass, the chance of the recipient being a scumbag increases. Self explanatory -Bad payoffs. A 'confirmed' townie won't be able to accomplish much. -The chance of scum lying to gain whatever town cred exsists. This admittedly could potentially force a counter claim, and get a scum lynched for one townie, but the chance of scum actually trying it is low. -The assumption seems horribly scummy, it helps pave the way for scum to confirm themselves. It also seems to rely on a town aligned role with the power to search for the ring, just in case the scum player decided not to even try to pass it. -The plan overall balances a low payoff with a rather low reward. After the plan is dismissed, Trance proceeds to act wishy-washy and brings up a case on anyone he believes might legitimately form a bandwagon, before deciding to join a pre-exsisting one. I don't have much to say about this part because I don't understand why all three major wagons were town, but I believe mafia have their reasons to want to flip both WBG and prphlz, and so they bandwagoned onto a convenient easy target in Errandor. For the sake of this point, I advise you read through his filter: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=264699&user=27938 What I do know, is that DocH (deceased) was willing to oversee his plan rather quickly- On September 17 2011 15:19 DoctorHelvetica wrote: TranceStorm has a bad plan. Big deal, hopefully he can be made to see the problem with it. The main problem is that this game is not about confirming townies using mechanics we don't understand the goal is to find and catch scum. If I'm not mistaken, that was among the most dismissive statements DocH said while he was alive. At the same time DocH was gaining town cred by helping to dismiss the plan after townies already had (Yet another benefit.) On September 17 2011 15:22 DoctorHelvetica wrote: We don't know anything about the ring. Passing it on to scum could have terrible consequences. If we knew exactly what the rings powers were and what powers each player had relating to it then we could maybe form some plan for its use but otherwise this discussion is pretty much off the table. In the lore of LOTR the one ring basically reflects the power of its holder. A simple hobbit like Frodo simply becomes invisible holding it. But a powerful wizard like Saruman or god forbid Sauron could use it to become basically invincible/mind control/etc. And I'm not sure the ring will have evolving powers (just speculating) but hopefully my points be simple to understand 1. We have no idea what the extent of the consequences would be if the one ring were to fall into the hands of an evil player. 2. We have no idea what the ring even does other than the player who holds it or maybe some other role has knowledge. 3. It is not worth risking getting the ring on the wrong side of the town simply to MAYBE confirm a few players. TranceStorm is Scum | ||
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GreYMisT
United States6736 Posts
On September 17 2011 15:27 TranceStorm wrote: @DrH. Fine, those are valid points. I didn't fully flesh out my plan as well as I imagined it would be and underestimated the risks. But, wouldn't it be a good idea to set the rule that if a player does ever pass on the ring, they reveal its powers? We already know that everyone wants the ring (both town and non-town) so I think it would be beneficial to town discussion to know the ring powers. (if they don't change like you fear they might). Notice how in this post he acknowledges the potential flaws and the fact that it is incompete a respectfull manner towards DrH. [QUOTE]On September 17 2011 15:52 TranceStorm wrote: [QUOTE]On September 17 2011 15:36 Cyber_Cheese wrote: [QUOTE]On September 17 2011 15:03 TranceStorm wrote: [QUOTE]On September 17 2011 14:57 Cyber_Cheese wrote: [QUOTE]On September 17 2011 14:36 TranceStorm wrote: Debating about who should get the ring and what each role can or cannot do at the moment is pointless at the current time. However, I do like one of the plans that was proposed by a few people: having the person who successfully passed on the ring claim themselves. This way, we can enable a 'chain' to be made - i.e. the first player can confirm the second player once the second player has passed on the ring themselves. This is all dependent on the assumption that evil players cannot pass the ring themselves which as Radfield pointed out, is probably a true assumption. Given this, however, this plan would probably only be effective for the first few 'passes' and perhaps near the end of the game when town circles become more clear. The risk after the first few days that the person holding the ring is killed, or has the ring stolen (which is a possible role according to the OP) makes the plan ineffective. Therefore, I think that such a plan should work for the first 2 or 3 days to confirm at least one or two people. Any thoughts or ideas about this? I haven't fully fleshed this out yet (i.e. the possibility of fake claims is strong), but its probably a better discussion than the arbitrary finger-pointing going on at the moment.[/QUOTE] I'm not sure if you realise it or not but that plan sounds awfully anti-town. How do we guarantee that even those 1-3 people can pass the ring in the first place? however in this post he defends each aspect of it quite a bit. Why concede to DrH what you won't concede to others? I'm taking my vote off vain for now and putting it on TraceStorm. | ||
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