• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 22:26
CEST 04:26
KST 11:26
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Power Rank - Esports World Cup 202552RSL Season 1 - Final Week9[ASL19] Finals Recap: Standing Tall15HomeStory Cup 27 - Info & Preview18Classic wins Code S Season 2 (2025)16
Community News
BSL Team Wars - Bonyth, Dewalt, Hawk & Sziky teams7Weekly Cups (July 14-20): Final Check-up0Esports World Cup 2025 - Brackets Revealed19Weekly Cups (July 7-13): Classic continues to roll8Team TLMC #5 - Submission re-extension4
StarCraft 2
General
The GOAT ranking of GOAT rankings Power Rank - Esports World Cup 2025 RSL Revival patreon money discussion thread Jim claims he and Firefly were involved in match-fixing RSL Season 1 - Final Week
Tourneys
Esports World Cup 2025 Master Swan Open (Global Bronze-Master 2) Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament Sea Duckling Open (Global, Bronze-Diamond) FEL Cracov 2025 (July 27) - $8000 live event
Strategy
How did i lose this ZvP, whats the proper response
Custom Maps
External Content
Mutation #239 Bad Weather Mutation # 483 Kill Bot Wars Mutation # 482 Wheel of Misfortune Mutation # 481 Fear and Lava
Brood War
General
BSL Team Wars - Bonyth, Dewalt, Hawk & Sziky teams BW General Discussion [Update] ShieldBattery: 2025 Redesign BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Ginuda's JaeDong Interview Series
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues CSL Xiamen International Invitational [CSLPRO] It's CSLAN Season! - Last Chance [BSL 2v2] ProLeague Season 3 - Friday 21:00 CET
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers I am doing this better than progamers do.
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread [MMORPG] Tree of Savior (Successor of Ragnarok) Path of Exile CCLP - Command & Conquer League Project
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Post Pic of your Favorite Food! Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Russo-Ukrainian War Thread The Games Industry And ATVI
Fan Clubs
SKT1 Classic Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
[\m/] Heavy Metal Thread Anime Discussion Thread Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece Korean Music Discussion
Sports
Formula 1 Discussion 2024 - 2025 Football Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 NBA General Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Installation of Windows 10 suck at "just a moment" Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Ping To Win? Pings And Their…
TrAiDoS
momentary artworks from des…
tankgirl
from making sc maps to makin…
Husyelt
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Socialism Anyone?
GreenHorizons
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 702 users

Team Melee Mini Mafia - Couples Therapy - Page 16

Forum Index > TL Mafia
Post a Reply
Prev 1 14 15 16 17 18 82 Next
sandroba
Profile Joined April 2006
Canada4998 Posts
November 03 2011 18:55 GMT
#301
You are wrong GM, sorry. Lynching is only good for town when it hits scum. The process is good for town regardless, but going ahead with it is only favorable depending on results.
From an optimization stand point regarding the setup I guarantee you town's chances are higher if we prolong the game by one night.
GMarshal
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States22154 Posts
November 03 2011 18:55 GMT
#302
On November 04 2011 03:49 sandroba wrote:
That's why I waited until now to sugest this. We already know who pushed for what day one and got a bunch of reactions. Going ahead with the lynch with the info we have right now has a low chance of hitting scum imo. This is only anti-town if the team we end up lynching amongst those that have a chance of getting lynched based on this day one (your team, team edward and team viking) end up being scum. If you think the odds of us hitting scum today are favorable, then go ahead and consider this anti-town. I don't and I will do my part to ensure we no lynch today, unless someone comes up if a more convincing case. Your case on prpl is no where near good enough and you know it. You'd rather lynch him on this flimsy evidence?

I'd rather do anything but shut down the discussion 8+ hours before the day ends.

If you think there isn't a good enough case against anyone then take the initiative and find one. Do not sit down and say "huh, I don't like any of the cases so far, I guess I'll give up the town's number one advantage, and sit here and twiddle my thumbs". I'll even go as far as to say that I'd be happy to be the one lynched, as long as there was productive discussion around it and a flip at the end of the day, you know, something to base things of when you try to analyze tomorrow?

Where is this passive attitude coming from sandroba? You just said there are a bunch of reactions, well take them and make a case! Do something other than sit down and no-lynch! Who do you think is scum? Why? Why are you not making a concerted push to get them lynched?
Moderator
kitaman27 *
Profile Blog Joined April 2009
United States9245 Posts
November 03 2011 18:59 GMT
#303
7v2
Mislynch
5v2
Mislynch
3v2
LYLO

7v2
No lynch
6v2
No lynch
5v2
Mislynch
3v2
LYLO

Essentially we are trading 1 mislynch for 48 hours of disccusion, during which nobody is threatened because they know there won't be a lynch. The odds of hitting scum statistically are unfavorable every day. That doesn't mean you don't try.

I will do my part to ensure we no lynch today, unless someone comes up if a more convincing case


Or you could try to come up with a more convincing case yourself. We agree the prpl one is bad, how about the other 6 teams?
I'm better than dirt. Well, most kinds of dirt. I mean not that fancy store bought dirt. That stuffs loaded with nutrients. I... I can't compete with that stuff.
sandroba
Profile Joined April 2006
Canada4998 Posts
November 03 2011 18:59 GMT
#304
You got wrapped around your head that there is only one way to play all mafia games. You don't even consider the setup when deciding which is the best course of action and this is proven by you not even knowing how many players were in this game to start with. This setup is extremelly unforgiving for mislynches and town benefits from more night actions. All possible roles have a chance of producing good info. Sit back and think for a bit instead of preaching general advice.
GMarshal
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States22154 Posts
November 03 2011 18:59 GMT
#305
On November 04 2011 03:55 sandroba wrote:
You are wrong GM, sorry. Lynching is only good for town when it hits scum. The process is good for town regardless, but going ahead with it is only favorable depending on results.
From an optimization stand point regarding the setup I guarantee you town's chances are higher if we prolong the game by one night.

Wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong. Lynching makes people take stances and react, things like last minute vote switches, counter bandwagons, ect can *only* be seen with a lynch, and usually in the last 2 or so hours of the lynch.

My brain hurts. Seriously. You are giving the mafia team the momentum, you are letting them pick who dies. I might be more ok with this, had you pulled it out 1 hour before the lynch with the main targets looking like townies, but not only is it bad, but your timing is atrocious. You've posted this before any cases have solidified or any wagons really formed, you've basically killed any wagons scum might try to start and sabotaged the will of any townies to do analysis because "a no lynch is better".

Would you be arguing this if the setup were 7 vts vs 2 reds?
Moderator
sandroba
Profile Joined April 2006
Canada4998 Posts
November 03 2011 19:00 GMT
#306
If I thought I had a case with high enough chance of hitting scum, I assure you it would already be posted.
GMarshal
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States22154 Posts
November 03 2011 19:02 GMT
#307
On November 04 2011 03:59 sandroba wrote:
You got wrapped around your head that there is only one way to play all mafia games. You don't even consider the setup when deciding which is the best course of action and this is proven by you not even knowing how many players were in this game to start with. This setup is extremelly unforgiving for mislynches and town benefits from more night actions. All possible roles have a chance of producing good info. Sit back and think for a bit instead of preaching general advice.

I refuse to play follow the blue. That's how towns go to hell in a handbasket, when scum decide to fake claim. If we have blues great, but I'm going to work on the assumption that we have one blue who is going to get shot night 1, because that's the only way to make sure we stand a chance. Remember the more townies we lose, the easier it is for scum to control the lynch.
Moderator
redFF
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States3910 Posts
November 03 2011 19:02 GMT
#308
an idiotic sandroba plan! ofcourse!

we are lynching today lol
sandroba
Profile Joined April 2006
Canada4998 Posts
November 03 2011 19:03 GMT
#309
On November 04 2011 03:59 GMarshal wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 04 2011 03:55 sandroba wrote:
You are wrong GM, sorry. Lynching is only good for town when it hits scum. The process is good for town regardless, but going ahead with it is only favorable depending on results.
From an optimization stand point regarding the setup I guarantee you town's chances are higher if we prolong the game by one night.

Wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong. Lynching makes people take stances and react, things like last minute vote switches, counter bandwagons, ect can *only* be seen with a lynch, and usually in the last 2 or so hours of the lynch.

My brain hurts. Seriously. You are giving the mafia team the momentum, you are letting them pick who dies. I might be more ok with this, had you pulled it out 1 hour before the lynch with the main targets looking like townies, but not only is it bad, but your timing is atrocious. You've posted this before any cases have solidified or any wagons really formed, you've basically killed any wagons scum might try to start and sabotaged the will of any townies to do analysis because "a no lynch is better".

Would you be arguing this if the setup were 7 vts vs 2 reds?

Probably not right now, but I could try to do it either way if I didn't like the leading candidate as scum.
Radfield
Profile Joined September 2009
Canada2720 Posts
November 03 2011 19:30 GMT
#310
I agree 100% with GM. No-lynch discussion, at THIS point in the day, is terrible. We still have 24+ hours till lynch.

Sandro, how can you bail out of scum-hunting at this point in the day?

+ Show Spoiler +
On November 03 2011 21:40 GMarshal wrote:
@Kita
Show nested quote +
On November 03 2011 07:28 prplhz wrote:
On November 03 2011 07:01 Sevryn wrote:
On November 03 2011 06:06 Palmar wrote:
Welcome to Couples Therapy mafia






[image loading]

Everyone knows that pairs is the ultimate form of human interaction. Much more so than larger groups and yet not down to a single induvidual, the lovers, the brothers, the master and his servant, the husband and wife, the father and son. It's in couples that humans greatest relationships are created.

It takes two to tango!

And now there is one less pair in liquidville, after discovering a long lasting affair with Jackal58, OriginalName was completely defeated. Just as our strongest relationships come in pairs, it's also the biggest disappointment when those fail. Blinded by rage OriginalName murdered both Palmar and the third wheel in the relationship Jackal58, before taking his own life.

Incidentally, there's also some mafia guys in liquidville that you have to hunt down and lynch.



OriginalName The Loving Husband has taken his own life
Jackal58 The Playboy has been murdered
Palmar The Unfaithful Wife has been murdered


It is now Day 1, it ends Friday, Nov 04 10:00pm GMT (GMT+00:00). With 9 alive it takes 5 votes to secure a lynch. Yes I know I'm starting an hour early. Deal with it.


The teams are as follows:


1. sandroba & Sevryn - TEAM SS
2. Forumite & prplhz - TEAM VIKING (aka TEAM DERP)
3. Radfield & wherebugsgo - TEAM CHEZINU
4. Kurumi & RebirthOfLeGenD - TEAM NIPPLE
5. Crofty & Gmarshal - TEAM LIQUID
6. supersoft & GreYMisT - TEAM S&G CONSULTING
7. chaoser & hyshes - TEAM EDWARD
8. iGrok & Katzeleute - TEAM SWITZERLAND
9. redFF & kitaman27 - TEAM RED21


I thought this was couples therapy not love triangle mafia


way to quote a huge post with a oneliner

how do u feel about the setup? theres been lots of talk already and stuff what do u think? do you like being paired with sandro?

Woo! Lets talk about the setup and our partners, which helps us find scum... how again?


Show nested quote +
On November 03 2011 08:18 prplhz wrote:
i think redff only says good things


Yay! Relevance! Not


Show nested quote +
On November 03 2011 08:39 prplhz wrote:
On November 03 2011 08:35 Crofty wrote:
Well hi there.

So, its been a couple of hours since the day started, and already two votes on Team Liquid, due to "Crofty is silent" and Crofty is an unknown factor.

Which, frankly, is fair enough. Since I am a newcomer to these forums, and since you haven't had the pleasure of playing mafia with me before, I am a decent enough safe first vote. This also would provoke me to respond by posting, and hopefully giving you some data to work with. Had the tables been turned, I would likely do the same thing, so I'll let this slide for now.

What would you like to know?


i would like to know how you like playing with gm so far is he being nice to u? what kind of stuff is he telling you in your qt?


Once again, why are we discussing the interactions inside the team? How does this help us locate scum or do anything of relevance? How does this lead to meaningful discussion?


Show nested quote +
On November 03 2011 09:43 prplhz wrote:
On November 03 2011 09:40 redFF wrote:
the only combination of 2 good players is

3. Radfield & wherebugsgo

and ME AND KITA OF COURSE



Any combination of bad players?

Also, here's the punctuation that I've been forgetting in my first couple of posts, insert at your own discretion: .-. .- .-. .. - -.-- | .. ... | -... . ... - | .--. --- -. -.--


Once again, lets have a conversation about... teams? How is that helpful? Why is he obliging this tangent?

This is the derailment I'm talking about, he has all these posts about worthless things, that want to go off topic for no apparent reason.

I will admit, I like his last few posts a lot better though.


Show nested quote +
On November 03 2011 18:02 supersoft wrote:

okay next point is GM accusing team Viking. Prplhz is from denmark and hes no anglistic expert. i dont mind some minor mistakes and i do them, too. i know you say he's doing that interpunctuation mistakes on purpose, and you say that a townie has no reason to be hard to understand.
i think however, that scum has no reason to be hard to understand, too. therefor...



I think you are being deliberatly daft here supersoft. Use your brain, why is Chezinu a great asset to a scum team? Because half the people don't even read his posts because they are nonsense. Smart scum could achieve a similar effect through atrocious use of spelling and grammar. As a rule townies want to be transparent, while scum want to muddle the waters.


GMan, you don't get off that easy though. You built a case on Prp, then wibble-wobbled at the end of it. Your next post basically says the same thing: he might be scum, but he might not. Yet, you're vote remains squarely on Team Viking(Prp & Forumite). Do you think Team Viking is worthy of lynching right now?


On November 03 2011 10:19 sandroba wrote:
I don't really like your jailer usage GM. The chance of making a save or roleblocking a useful role is the same wether you "aim" it at scum or not. Only difference is that it saves a lot of trouble for scum in choosing their shots since they wouldn't bother shooting people that are considered scummy overall, since they are more easily pushed as a lynch. If there is a jailer he should definetely aim for a save as this makes things overall harder for scum. The chance of there being a doc or a jailer is 5/6, while having a doc is only 1/2. Having both aiming for a save is the best in making they choose non-optimal shots.


I agree with this, but NOT for the reasons Sandro posted. The reason we can't use the jailkeeper offensively is because mafia can choose which team shoots, so they will automatically make the more pro-town team fire the gun. That means the shooter will basically never be roleblocked.
Radfield
Profile Joined September 2009
Canada2720 Posts
November 03 2011 19:35 GMT
#311
On November 04 2011 04:02 GMarshal wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 04 2011 03:59 sandroba wrote:
You got wrapped around your head that there is only one way to play all mafia games. You don't even consider the setup when deciding which is the best course of action and this is proven by you not even knowing how many players were in this game to start with. This setup is extremelly unforgiving for mislynches and town benefits from more night actions. All possible roles have a chance of producing good info. Sit back and think for a bit instead of preaching general advice.

I refuse to play follow the blue. That's how towns go to hell in a handbasket, when scum decide to fake claim. If we have blues great, but I'm going to work on the assumption that we have one blue who is going to get shot night 1, because that's the only way to make sure we stand a chance. Remember the more townies we lose, the easier it is for scum to control the lynch.



Not to mention that the only real 'followable' blue we may have is a parity cop. No-lynching as policy only loses us townies, while gaining us potential parity cop nights.
wherebugsgo
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Japan10647 Posts
November 03 2011 19:35 GMT
#312
Hey guys, I've been sleeping and at class. I have plenty of time to procrastinate before all my work is due tomorrow (oh the joys of Fridays)

Anyway, let's get into this.

First of all, I like some of the ideas that have been put forth since I've been gone. I also like some of the reactions, since they obviously indicate a decent level of involvement in this game. However, I still think the hyshes/chaoser is a good bet for a lynch today, and I'll elaborate on this in a bit. First, some background:

On November 04 2011 03:55 sandroba wrote:
You are wrong GM, sorry. Lynching is only good for town when it hits scum. The process is good for town regardless, but going ahead with it is only favorable depending on results.
From an optimization stand point regarding the setup I guarantee you town's chances are higher if we prolong the game by one night.


I think sandro is right that lynching is only good if it hits scum (for really obvious reasons). As Kita pointed out, we have this:

On November 04 2011 03:59 kitaman27 wrote:
7v2
Mislynch
5v2
Mislynch
3v2
LYLO

7v2
No lynch
6v2
No lynch
5v2
Mislynch
3v2
LYLO

Essentially we are trading 1 mislynch for 48 hours of disccusion, during which nobody is threatened because they know there won't be a lynch. The odds of hitting scum statistically are unfavorable every day. That doesn't mean you don't try.

Show nested quote +
I will do my part to ensure we no lynch today, unless someone comes up if a more convincing case


Or you could try to come up with a more convincing case yourself. We agree the prpl one is bad, how about the other 6 teams?


HOWEVER, I highly disagree with this:

On November 04 2011 03:55 sandroba wrote:
I will do my part to ensure we no lynch today, unless someone comes up if a more convincing case


Sandro why are you so passive? You should be working toward getting a lynch, not ensuring that we no-lynch. We have to lynch two scum at some point. Sitting around and advocating a no-lynch takes pressure off scum, because while a no-lynch guarantees that town will not get lynched, it guarantees scum won't either!

What do scum have to fear if they know that the town is not seeking a lynch today? It's not beneficial for town at all unless we have lynch candidates we're discussing. The no-lynch should be employed, in my opinion, by putting votes on a suspicious person, and then removing them when it's clear that they have reacted in a townie manner under that pressure.

So far, hyshes and chaoser are under very little pressure. I voted for them, and I think one other team did. When chaoser came in, he didn't say very many things to establish he is town. He attempted to defend his partner but kinda failed and got really mad:


On November 04 2011 03:10 chaoser wrote:
Thanks for summarizing my stance and posting nothing here. Also, are you trying to say that you know what hyshes' motive are in posting that? I didn't realize you were psychic. How do you know for a fact that hyshe wasn't trying to draw mafia out? How do you know he's NOT bad at making plans? How do you know what he was thinking when he posted that plan? Have you played with him before? Are you talking to him in PMs? Oh right, you're not and you've never played a game with him. What shitty logic.


From what I have experienced, townies get hostile and mad when defending themselves, but chaoser is an exception. As town he is generally calmer than this, and he uses reason.

In this instance, of course we knew hyshes's objectives. Hyshes wanted to be hailed in the thread (as he said himself.) What purpose does this serve? Well, if he's scum, it takes a lot of early game pressure off him because he submitted a "good plan" and then isn't receiving pressure for not providing much later on, or even purposely misleading town. Right now, hyshes has been MIA for a while, letting chaoser take the pressure for a bit. I imagine they will switch turns again soon.

I already posted why I think hyshes's post came off with scum motivation, so I'm not going to bother repeating that here.

Regarding the No-lynch Plan


I give the hyshes/chaoser team a very good chance to flip scum. As I said earlier, I think a no-lynch would be good in the case that we're gunning for a townie. However, I sincerely believe that we are not dealing with that right now.

I imagine that even if hyshes and chaoser aren't scum, we stand to gain a lot just by looking at how the vote unfolds. Day 1 information is vital, and with a good candidate for lynch we should only avoid lynching them when we're absolutely certain the information lost will be outweighed by the benefit of having that extra townie, and the extra day.

So, to answer this:


On November 03 2011 18:02 supersoft wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 03 2011 12:00 chaoser wrote:
On November 03 2011 11:52 redFF wrote:
On November 03 2011 11:08 chaoser wrote:
On November 03 2011 09:56 supersoft wrote:
okay nothing interesting came up, yet. one thing i want to point out.
if you're town, save all your conversations with your teampartner. if you're getting lynched, these conversations may provide something that speaks in favor of you.
I know scum will do that, too now... BUT it's a lot of work to fake logs. and why should we be gentle with these guys?!


Yeah I'm going to have to disagree with that. This isn't post-conversation-to-try-to-make-people-trust-you. This is mafia. Let's try NOT using shit like this to "confirm" one another. I thought we already covered this topic in PYPI

NICE TRY SCUM WHO DOESN'T WANNA DO EXTRA WORK


I really hope you're kidding about this. I'm 100% serious about my point. Are we really going to try to exploit every single mechanic in place in a game to try to avoid the actual point of a mafia game which is to analyze and use scum hunting skills? Not to mention this doesn't even work. Look at Kita escaping lynch for a hilarious amount of days because of his "PM convo" with Radfield. It took me two days of setup to finally convince people that he was mafia and should be voted for.


yes okay i agree. my "plan" is a bit lame. it's a process that uses the game mechanics in an unfair way. but i guess, posting the logs to avoid a lynch will happen anyway, unless it's forbidden. no further discussion needed.
(do the extra work, scummers!)

okay next point is GM accusing team Viking. Prplhz is from denmark and hes no anglistic expert. i dont mind some minor mistakes and i do them, too. i know you say he's doing that interpunctuation mistakes on purpose, and you say that a townie has no reason to be hard to understand.
i think however, that scum has no reason to be hard to understand, too. therefor...

@wbg: who is the scummiest team in your eyes right now?


Hyshes and chaoser.

Sandro is scummy because his plan makes sense but his motivations and behavior do not. This is how I felt about his plan in PYP:I (and he was scum there) but he's so passive again. At this point there isn't enough information on him; the information we have, IMO, is conflicting and unreliable. PYP:I was a PM game, this is not, and so I don't feel comfortable using that meta, but I think it's a potential lead nonetheless.

GM I thought was scummy earlier, but his recent reactions have made him look more town. His posts are like what I would've expected from him as town. If you look at SMG where he smurfed and was scum, he backed off from the spotlight a little (probably because he was afraid of being caught) instead of boldly going out there and just throwing his opinion into the thread. GM as town doesn't back off when he's faced with confrontational or conflicting opinions. You can see that here.

Finally, you need to seriously learn how to use meta. I find it hilarious how people think meta carries one to one between PM and non-PM games (and that's just one example; tons of things can affect a person's behavior from game to game)
wherebugsgo
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Japan10647 Posts
November 03 2011 19:40 GMT
#313
oh last thing I didn't post in there (fuckin posted instead of preview damn it. RAAAGE)

Hyshes has been active in the newbie game over the past few hours but not in here. So, he's around. But he's kinda "cooling off" in here. I find that pretty strange.

sandroba
Profile Joined April 2006
Canada4998 Posts
November 03 2011 19:46 GMT
#314
@radfield Where did you get that info about mafia choosing who makes the kill? I can't find it in the OP. The spoiler questions didn't lead me to that conclusion.

Can mafia choose who performs the kill?
GreYMisT
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
United States6736 Posts
November 03 2011 19:53 GMT
#315
I think it is way too early to even be discussing a no lynch plan. you know what? all this time we have been discussing a no lynch we have not been hunting scum, which will lead us to a no lynch!

Dispite my earlier reservations towards Hyshes, i doubt a newer player as scum would come right out of the gate and try to post a "mafia plan." especially with chaoser on his team.

I for one would like to see some more out of iGrok, if I am caught up properly the only thing he said was that he always lurks day1 and will post more later.
"life of lively to live to life of full life thx to shield battery" / Join TL Mafia! http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/index.php?show_part=31
Radfield
Profile Joined September 2009
Canada2720 Posts
November 03 2011 19:54 GMT
#316
Bugs just pointed that out to me as well.

Q: Can a Jailor roleblock a mafia hit?
A: Yes, one mafia (can be either one) is designated as the killer, if that guy gets jailed, he won't be able to perform the kill.


I thought this meant that mafia could designate the killer, but it could just mean that one team specifically get RNGed as the shooter.
Radfield
Profile Joined September 2009
Canada2720 Posts
November 03 2011 20:17 GMT
#317
Why a planned No-lynch is bad.

I'll preface this by stating that in the absence of any scummy players/teams, no lynch is a fine move, and isn't the end of the world.

However, playing for a no-lynch, and advocating a no-lynch is bad play. Likewise lynching for the sake of lynching is a bad play.

A no-lynch has several positive outcomes for town:

1. Possibly buys more time for the parity cop.
2. Gives an additional 72 hours of discussion before town has to use a lynch. Avoiding a potential mislynch on Day 1.

However neither of these benefits are particularly good. Parity Cop is already a weak role, and is even weaker in this set-up. Parity Cop has to survive two lynches and two nightkills to have any useful info, and chances are that info will only be confirming a single townie. Additionally, If the Parity Cop is ever targetted by the jailkeeper(unlikely but possible), it basically becomes a useless role.

Town always does much better on day 2 than day 1, because they have heaps more information. The general idea is that by delaying our lynch until day 2, we get the additional info, without the risk of a mislynch on Day 1. However this is a flawed idea. The reason town has so much additional info on Day 2 is because scum are forced to take sides on day 1, and feign scum-hunting. Any decent mafia player can blend in with a no-lynch wagon, precisely because a no-lynch is often an absence of opinion "hmm, everyone seems town to me".

The key to a valuable day 1 is getting everyone scumhunting, or feigning scumhunting. Forcing mafia out in to the open, as opposed to creating an atmosphere where weak opinions reign.

If a no-lynch happens because we can't find consensus, then so be it, it probably means we didn't have any good candidates. But actively planning for a no-lynch creates an extremely pro-scum atmosphere.
kitaman27 *
Profile Blog Joined April 2009
United States9245 Posts
November 03 2011 20:18 GMT
#318
Blues are a nice safety net, but it really doesn't benefit us that much to base our gameplan around them by no-lynching.

First the jailer has to block the correct shooter, then the jailer has to consider that a doctor could have prevented the shot or that the mafia decided not to shoot, then the jailer has to decide whether he roleblocked a mafia or protected a town, then the jailer has to sucessfully push his case in the thread.

Parity cop has to survive to day three to be of any use.
Assuming worse case scenario where we mislynch the first two days:
There is a 1/9 chance he gets lynched day one.
A 2/6 chance he gets discovered or shot night one.
A 1/7 chance he gets lynched day two.
A 1/3 chance he gets shot night two.

Which is only about a 10% sucess rate (correct me if I made a mistake here).

Going with a double no lynch increases the survival rate of the parity cop slightly, but it really doesn't seem worth giving up a lynch in exchange.
I'm better than dirt. Well, most kinds of dirt. I mean not that fancy store bought dirt. That stuffs loaded with nutrients. I... I can't compete with that stuff.
Radfield
Profile Joined September 2009
Canada2720 Posts
November 03 2011 20:19 GMT
#319
The difficulty every scum player faces is putting down a vote, and backing that vote. By playing for a no-lynch we deliberately remove the hardest part of the game for mafia.
chaoser
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
United States5541 Posts
November 03 2011 20:36 GMT
#320
From what I have experienced, townies get hostile and mad when defending themselves, but chaoser is an exception. As town he is generally calmer than this, and he uses reason.


In Death Factory Mafia when people falsely accused me of being mafia for shitty reasons (He's defending himself! He's mafia! Only mafia do that!) I got pissed and I pushed everyone to the edge, then mafia flipped the flames, and everyone died. And I laughed. I laughed for a good three hours. I still laugh when I go back to read that game. So your meta reads on me are completely wrong.

I give the hyshes/chaoser team a very good chance to flip scum.


@wbg: who is the scummiest team in your eyes right now?


Hyshes and chaoser.


Says my team is scummy, doesn't vote for us.

???
Haven't you heard? I'm not an ex-progamer. I'm not a poker player. I'm not an admin of the site. I'm mother fucking Rekrul.
Prev 1 14 15 16 17 18 82 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 8h 34m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Nina 272
RuFF_SC2 164
StarCraft: Brood War
sSak 150
HiyA 88
Sexy 86
NaDa 63
Icarus 6
League of Legends
JimRising 678
Counter-Strike
Coldzera 373
Other Games
summit1g13251
shahzam969
ViBE258
C9.Mang0185
Organizations
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 13 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Hupsaiya 112
• davetesta42
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• masondota2328
Upcoming Events
Esports World Cup
8h 34m
Serral vs Cure
Solar vs Classic
OSC
11h 34m
CranKy Ducklings
1d 7h
BSL20 Non-Korean Champi…
1d 11h
CSO Cup
1d 13h
BSL20 Non-Korean Champi…
1d 15h
Bonyth vs Sziky
Dewalt vs Hawk
Hawk vs QiaoGege
Sziky vs Dewalt
Mihu vs Bonyth
Zhanhun vs QiaoGege
QiaoGege vs Fengzi
FEL
2 days
BSL20 Non-Korean Champi…
2 days
BSL20 Non-Korean Champi…
2 days
Bonyth vs Zhanhun
Dewalt vs Mihu
Hawk vs Sziky
Sziky vs QiaoGege
Mihu vs Hawk
Zhanhun vs Dewalt
Fengzi vs Bonyth
Sparkling Tuna Cup
4 days
[ Show More ]
Online Event
4 days
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
5 days
The PondCast
6 days
Replay Cast
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

CSL Xiamen Invitational
Championship of Russia 2025
Murky Cup #2

Ongoing

Copa Latinoamericana 4
Jiahua Invitational
BSL20 Non-Korean Championship
Esports World Cup 2025
CC Div. A S7
Underdog Cup #2
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1
BLAST.tv Austin Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 7
IEM Dallas 2025
PGL Astana 2025
Asian Champions League '25

Upcoming

CSLPRO Last Chance 2025
ASL Season 20: Qualifier #1
ASL Season 20: Qualifier #2
ASL Season 20
CSLPRO Chat StarLAN 3
BSL Season 21
RSL Revival: Season 2
Maestros of the Game
SEL Season 2 Championship
uThermal 2v2 Main Event
FEL Cracov 2025
HCC Europe
ESL Pro League S22
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.