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On August 14 2014 20:00 LeeJohnDong wrote:
Still, it was raised by this tournament, and the only reason it was "left over" is because of the communities contribution. Imho, it should go straight into this 10k tourny idea tbh. realistically, id say most of the community who donated was under the premise that all the money raised would go into the next one. I mean, there would be No sponsorship deals if they hadn't contributed anyway.
On August 14 2014 20:45 LeeJohnDong wrote:Show nested quote +On August 14 2014 20:09 ObviousOne wrote:On August 14 2014 20:00 LeeJohnDong wrote:On August 14 2014 19:28 NovemberstOrm wrote:On August 14 2014 19:25 LeeJohnDong wrote:
imho, you should have asked the community what to do with the leftover cash (Their money). if they voted on a poll or something to say "keep it, you earned it" then yes, it would sit nicer with 90% of the people you have pissed off.. I mean, its their money at the end of the day, they donated it to your tournament that was 100% "crowd funded", at no point did you say you'd take 30% of it for yourself. I for one think that most of that money if not all should have been put forward to the next tournament (which is unlikely to happen now as your inability to take criticism is astounding and just makes things worse).
Plus saying its "2 weeks work" is complete bs too. I mean, he'd of been doing the same shit anyway, and inviting players/etc is not something that takes 8 hours a day. having sleep issues is personal and shouldnt come into a work environment ever.
I'm not even going to comment on the absolute shambles you've made with Kespa.
</rant> The event was fully crowd funded the extra money came from the sponsors he had for the event, clarifying just in case theirs some confusion.
I was able to raise $1,800 from sponsorships for this event. Since the tournament was fully funded via the Indiegogo, this is money that I can essentially pocket as my "take home" pay for organizing/casting the tournament.
Still, it was raised by this tournament, and the only reason it was "left over" is because of the communities contribution. Imho, it should go straight into this 10k tourny idea tbh. realistically, id say most of the community who donated was under the premise that all the money raised would go into the next one. I mean, there would be No sponsorship deals if they hadn't contributed anyway. Just to clarify your position, you believe that Destiny should earn zero dollars for running this tournament. Is this correct? Funding goals/distribution
My budget for this tournament is $5,000.
$200 will go towards the Korean/English bilingual admin I have chosen. He'll be responsible for doing vetos/setting up games and doing post game/post group interviews, if we decide to do them.
$200 will go towards art work from the artist. This includes branding/logo, slides between games, and overlays for in game.
$600 will go towards casters. I will be paying each invited caster $100 for casting 1 day, meaning I will need 6 different casters for the tournament. If I'm not able to find 6, I'll repeat some casters. So far I've confirmed Incontrol, ToD, Nathanias and Minigun as casters.
$500 goes towards Indiegogo fees for fundraising.
$4000 will go towards the prize pool. The distribution will be as follows: 1st place $1,600, 2nd place $800, 3rd-4th place $400, 5th-8th place $200.
Extra money raised from the Indiegogo will be put towards future tournaments (Destiny II). Nope, never made that point. Im simply saying the community should decide whats deserved + a going about it a different way/smarter way with a poll or something would definitely have silenced alot of people here. taking a sum of that amount for something like that is unjustified by many people here, as you can see from the thread. Makes sense to me.
If all money left over go to the next tournament, how much money does he get in salary?
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On August 14 2014 21:39 kiLen wrote:Show nested quote +On August 14 2014 21:31 LeeJohnDong wrote:On August 14 2014 21:18 kiLen wrote:On August 14 2014 21:07 LeeJohnDong wrote:On August 14 2014 21:02 ObviousOne wrote:On August 14 2014 20:45 LeeJohnDong wrote:On August 14 2014 20:09 ObviousOne wrote:On August 14 2014 20:00 LeeJohnDong wrote:On August 14 2014 19:28 NovemberstOrm wrote:On August 14 2014 19:25 LeeJohnDong wrote:
imho, you should have asked the community what to do with the leftover cash (Their money). if they voted on a poll or something to say "keep it, you earned it" then yes, it would sit nicer with 90% of the people you have pissed off.. I mean, its their money at the end of the day, they donated it to your tournament that was 100% "crowd funded", at no point did you say you'd take 30% of it for yourself. I for one think that most of that money if not all should have been put forward to the next tournament (which is unlikely to happen now as your inability to take criticism is astounding and just makes things worse).
Plus saying its "2 weeks work" is complete bs too. I mean, he'd of been doing the same shit anyway, and inviting players/etc is not something that takes 8 hours a day. having sleep issues is personal and shouldnt come into a work environment ever.
I'm not even going to comment on the absolute shambles you've made with Kespa.
</rant> The event was fully crowd funded the extra money came from the sponsors he had for the event, clarifying just in case theirs some confusion.
I was able to raise $1,800 from sponsorships for this event. Since the tournament was fully funded via the Indiegogo, this is money that I can essentially pocket as my "take home" pay for organizing/casting the tournament.
Still, it was raised by this tournament, and the only reason it was "left over" is because of the communities contribution. Imho, it should go straight into this 10k tourny idea tbh. realistically, id say most of the community who donated was under the premise that all the money raised would go into the next one. I mean, there would be No sponsorship deals if they hadn't contributed anyway. Just to clarify your position, you believe that Destiny should earn zero dollars for running this tournament. Is this correct? Funding goals/distribution
My budget for this tournament is $5,000.
$200 will go towards the Korean/English bilingual admin I have chosen. He'll be responsible for doing vetos/setting up games and doing post game/post group interviews, if we decide to do them.
$200 will go towards art work from the artist. This includes branding/logo, slides between games, and overlays for in game.
$600 will go towards casters. I will be paying each invited caster $100 for casting 1 day, meaning I will need 6 different casters for the tournament. If I'm not able to find 6, I'll repeat some casters. So far I've confirmed Incontrol, ToD, Nathanias and Minigun as casters.
$500 goes towards Indiegogo fees for fundraising.
$4000 will go towards the prize pool. The distribution will be as follows: 1st place $1,600, 2nd place $800, 3rd-4th place $400, 5th-8th place $200.
Extra money raised from the Indiegogo will be put towards future tournaments (Destiny II). Nope, never made that point. Im simply saying the community should decide whats deserved + a going about it a different way/smarter way with a poll or something would definitely have silenced alot of people here. taking a sum of that amount for something like that is unjustified by many people here, as you can see from the thread. Makes sense to me. Let's ask the sponsors what he should do with that money since that's where the money he earned came from. Then you realize how asinine the concept is and move on. "asinine" haha. Learned a new word this week bud? Get off your high horse and learn to accept that people have opinions. You can have yours too! Its incredible right?! Everyone is allowed to have their own opinion, even if its retarded one. Im guessing that you did not watch Unfiltred last evening? There Destiny clearly explained how much work it actually is. Now, just because you can't wrap your head around how much work it is doesn't mean it wanst a lot. Try imagining putting yourself in Destinys shoes, maybe you can start to realise how idiotic what you're saying really are. Nobody forced anybody to give money to Destinys tournament. hahaha, oh man. you are so deluded. When did I say that Destiny should not get anything?? nope. I'm simply making the point that its the communities funding that made that money for him. and thus, the community should decide how much a caster/organiser should make out of it OR at least let him tell people that he'll be taking the excess Before letting them donate unknowingly. Kind of sneaky just taking it without asking.... no? hidden agenda! drama! Let's get this clear, if you donate to the Red Cross you would want everyone who donated to get togheter and decide where the money should go? Cause that is what you are saying and its beyond mindboggling. In a perfect world, sure that would be great, but guess what, we don't live in one. The point that I can agree with you is that he should have stated that the excess money would be his salary. i think it is fair to say there is a slight difference between a crowdfunded tournament in a niche video game community and an international humanitarian aid charity
i understand your point but you can't just apply the same logic to totally different scenarios
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On August 14 2014 21:39 kiLen wrote:Show nested quote +On August 14 2014 21:31 LeeJohnDong wrote:On August 14 2014 21:18 kiLen wrote:On August 14 2014 21:07 LeeJohnDong wrote:On August 14 2014 21:02 ObviousOne wrote:On August 14 2014 20:45 LeeJohnDong wrote:On August 14 2014 20:09 ObviousOne wrote:On August 14 2014 20:00 LeeJohnDong wrote:On August 14 2014 19:28 NovemberstOrm wrote:On August 14 2014 19:25 LeeJohnDong wrote:
imho, you should have asked the community what to do with the leftover cash (Their money). if they voted on a poll or something to say "keep it, you earned it" then yes, it would sit nicer with 90% of the people you have pissed off.. I mean, its their money at the end of the day, they donated it to your tournament that was 100% "crowd funded", at no point did you say you'd take 30% of it for yourself. I for one think that most of that money if not all should have been put forward to the next tournament (which is unlikely to happen now as your inability to take criticism is astounding and just makes things worse).
Plus saying its "2 weeks work" is complete bs too. I mean, he'd of been doing the same shit anyway, and inviting players/etc is not something that takes 8 hours a day. having sleep issues is personal and shouldnt come into a work environment ever.
I'm not even going to comment on the absolute shambles you've made with Kespa.
</rant> The event was fully crowd funded the extra money came from the sponsors he had for the event, clarifying just in case theirs some confusion.
I was able to raise $1,800 from sponsorships for this event. Since the tournament was fully funded via the Indiegogo, this is money that I can essentially pocket as my "take home" pay for organizing/casting the tournament.
Still, it was raised by this tournament, and the only reason it was "left over" is because of the communities contribution. Imho, it should go straight into this 10k tourny idea tbh. realistically, id say most of the community who donated was under the premise that all the money raised would go into the next one. I mean, there would be No sponsorship deals if they hadn't contributed anyway. Just to clarify your position, you believe that Destiny should earn zero dollars for running this tournament. Is this correct? Funding goals/distribution
My budget for this tournament is $5,000.
$200 will go towards the Korean/English bilingual admin I have chosen. He'll be responsible for doing vetos/setting up games and doing post game/post group interviews, if we decide to do them.
$200 will go towards art work from the artist. This includes branding/logo, slides between games, and overlays for in game.
$600 will go towards casters. I will be paying each invited caster $100 for casting 1 day, meaning I will need 6 different casters for the tournament. If I'm not able to find 6, I'll repeat some casters. So far I've confirmed Incontrol, ToD, Nathanias and Minigun as casters.
$500 goes towards Indiegogo fees for fundraising.
$4000 will go towards the prize pool. The distribution will be as follows: 1st place $1,600, 2nd place $800, 3rd-4th place $400, 5th-8th place $200.
Extra money raised from the Indiegogo will be put towards future tournaments (Destiny II). Nope, never made that point. Im simply saying the community should decide whats deserved + a going about it a different way/smarter way with a poll or something would definitely have silenced alot of people here. taking a sum of that amount for something like that is unjustified by many people here, as you can see from the thread. Makes sense to me. Let's ask the sponsors what he should do with that money since that's where the money he earned came from. Then you realize how asinine the concept is and move on. "asinine" haha. Learned a new word this week bud? Get off your high horse and learn to accept that people have opinions. You can have yours too! Its incredible right?! Everyone is allowed to have their own opinion, even if its retarded one. Im guessing that you did not watch Unfiltred last evening? There Destiny clearly explained how much work it actually is. Now, just because you can't wrap your head around how much work it is doesn't mean it wanst a lot. Try imagining putting yourself in Destinys shoes, maybe you can start to realise how idiotic what you're saying really are. Nobody forced anybody to give money to Destinys tournament. hahaha, oh man. you are so deluded. When did I say that Destiny should not get anything?? nope. I'm simply making the point that its the communities funding that made that money for him. and thus, the community should decide how much a caster/organiser should make out of it OR at least let him tell people that he'll be taking the excess Before letting them donate unknowingly. Kind of sneaky just taking it without asking.... no? hidden agenda! drama! Let's get this clear, if you donate to the Red Cross you would want everyone who donated to get togheter and decide where the money should go? Cause that is what you are saying and its beyond mindboggling. In a perfect world, sure that would be great, but guess what, we don't live in one. The point that I can agree with you is that he should have stated that the excess money would be his salary.
pfft, the red cross comparison is mindboggling. haha that is incomparable man. anyway. enough flamebaiting. You see my point, you understand what i'm saying so whats the problem. simply accept that someone has other views (that are also a suggestion/improvement on the issue) and move on. You cant state that my suggestion of having a poll for the community to decide on the money would of:
A. More than likely ended in the same result anyway (The community would have voted that the excess should go to destiny. I'm almost certain of that, as rediculous as it seems).
And B, most if not all of the negative feedback regarding the issue with the money he took would have never happened. And everyone would be happier... It was just the smarter option
I'm not talking at all about the Kespa thing. There would have been comments around that regardless, as the email was posted very very very unprofessionally.
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On August 14 2014 22:10 Catbus wrote:Show nested quote +On August 14 2014 20:00 LeeJohnDong wrote:
Still, it was raised by this tournament, and the only reason it was "left over" is because of the communities contribution. Imho, it should go straight into this 10k tourny idea tbh. realistically, id say most of the community who donated was under the premise that all the money raised would go into the next one. I mean, there would be No sponsorship deals if they hadn't contributed anyway. Show nested quote +On August 14 2014 20:45 LeeJohnDong wrote:On August 14 2014 20:09 ObviousOne wrote:On August 14 2014 20:00 LeeJohnDong wrote:On August 14 2014 19:28 NovemberstOrm wrote:On August 14 2014 19:25 LeeJohnDong wrote:
imho, you should have asked the community what to do with the leftover cash (Their money). if they voted on a poll or something to say "keep it, you earned it" then yes, it would sit nicer with 90% of the people you have pissed off.. I mean, its their money at the end of the day, they donated it to your tournament that was 100% "crowd funded", at no point did you say you'd take 30% of it for yourself. I for one think that most of that money if not all should have been put forward to the next tournament (which is unlikely to happen now as your inability to take criticism is astounding and just makes things worse).
Plus saying its "2 weeks work" is complete bs too. I mean, he'd of been doing the same shit anyway, and inviting players/etc is not something that takes 8 hours a day. having sleep issues is personal and shouldnt come into a work environment ever.
I'm not even going to comment on the absolute shambles you've made with Kespa.
</rant> The event was fully crowd funded the extra money came from the sponsors he had for the event, clarifying just in case theirs some confusion.
I was able to raise $1,800 from sponsorships for this event. Since the tournament was fully funded via the Indiegogo, this is money that I can essentially pocket as my "take home" pay for organizing/casting the tournament.
Still, it was raised by this tournament, and the only reason it was "left over" is because of the communities contribution. Imho, it should go straight into this 10k tourny idea tbh. realistically, id say most of the community who donated was under the premise that all the money raised would go into the next one. I mean, there would be No sponsorship deals if they hadn't contributed anyway. Just to clarify your position, you believe that Destiny should earn zero dollars for running this tournament. Is this correct? Funding goals/distribution
My budget for this tournament is $5,000.
$200 will go towards the Korean/English bilingual admin I have chosen. He'll be responsible for doing vetos/setting up games and doing post game/post group interviews, if we decide to do them.
$200 will go towards art work from the artist. This includes branding/logo, slides between games, and overlays for in game.
$600 will go towards casters. I will be paying each invited caster $100 for casting 1 day, meaning I will need 6 different casters for the tournament. If I'm not able to find 6, I'll repeat some casters. So far I've confirmed Incontrol, ToD, Nathanias and Minigun as casters.
$500 goes towards Indiegogo fees for fundraising.
$4000 will go towards the prize pool. The distribution will be as follows: 1st place $1,600, 2nd place $800, 3rd-4th place $400, 5th-8th place $200.
Extra money raised from the Indiegogo will be put towards future tournaments (Destiny II). Nope, never made that point. Im simply saying the community should decide whats deserved + a going about it a different way/smarter way with a poll or something would definitely have silenced alot of people here. taking a sum of that amount for something like that is unjustified by many people here, as you can see from the thread. Makes sense to me. If all money left over go to the next tournament, how much money does he get in salary?
IMHO none for this one lol (as he never said he would take any and i find that sneaky and misleading.. as he sold it to the community as everything raised would be going to the tourny, not to his pockets.). but he probably does deserve a bit, but should be "transparent" to the donators to let them know at least beforehand. anyway heres a question to answer your question - Who should decide that?? (the community)
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You did a great job Destiny.
Try not to listen to people who seem to enjoy nitpicking about every little detail. Nobody is perfect.
And about KeSPA, they can hog their precious players to themselves if that's what they want. As shown by the poll, half of the voters do not care about their arrogant attitude.
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On August 14 2014 22:25 LeeJohnDong wrote:Show nested quote +On August 14 2014 22:10 Catbus wrote:On August 14 2014 20:00 LeeJohnDong wrote:
Still, it was raised by this tournament, and the only reason it was "left over" is because of the communities contribution. Imho, it should go straight into this 10k tourny idea tbh. realistically, id say most of the community who donated was under the premise that all the money raised would go into the next one. I mean, there would be No sponsorship deals if they hadn't contributed anyway. On August 14 2014 20:45 LeeJohnDong wrote:On August 14 2014 20:09 ObviousOne wrote:On August 14 2014 20:00 LeeJohnDong wrote:On August 14 2014 19:28 NovemberstOrm wrote:On August 14 2014 19:25 LeeJohnDong wrote:
imho, you should have asked the community what to do with the leftover cash (Their money). if they voted on a poll or something to say "keep it, you earned it" then yes, it would sit nicer with 90% of the people you have pissed off.. I mean, its their money at the end of the day, they donated it to your tournament that was 100% "crowd funded", at no point did you say you'd take 30% of it for yourself. I for one think that most of that money if not all should have been put forward to the next tournament (which is unlikely to happen now as your inability to take criticism is astounding and just makes things worse).
Plus saying its "2 weeks work" is complete bs too. I mean, he'd of been doing the same shit anyway, and inviting players/etc is not something that takes 8 hours a day. having sleep issues is personal and shouldnt come into a work environment ever.
I'm not even going to comment on the absolute shambles you've made with Kespa.
</rant> The event was fully crowd funded the extra money came from the sponsors he had for the event, clarifying just in case theirs some confusion.
I was able to raise $1,800 from sponsorships for this event. Since the tournament was fully funded via the Indiegogo, this is money that I can essentially pocket as my "take home" pay for organizing/casting the tournament.
Still, it was raised by this tournament, and the only reason it was "left over" is because of the communities contribution. Imho, it should go straight into this 10k tourny idea tbh. realistically, id say most of the community who donated was under the premise that all the money raised would go into the next one. I mean, there would be No sponsorship deals if they hadn't contributed anyway. Just to clarify your position, you believe that Destiny should earn zero dollars for running this tournament. Is this correct? Funding goals/distribution
My budget for this tournament is $5,000.
$200 will go towards the Korean/English bilingual admin I have chosen. He'll be responsible for doing vetos/setting up games and doing post game/post group interviews, if we decide to do them.
$200 will go towards art work from the artist. This includes branding/logo, slides between games, and overlays for in game.
$600 will go towards casters. I will be paying each invited caster $100 for casting 1 day, meaning I will need 6 different casters for the tournament. If I'm not able to find 6, I'll repeat some casters. So far I've confirmed Incontrol, ToD, Nathanias and Minigun as casters.
$500 goes towards Indiegogo fees for fundraising.
$4000 will go towards the prize pool. The distribution will be as follows: 1st place $1,600, 2nd place $800, 3rd-4th place $400, 5th-8th place $200.
Extra money raised from the Indiegogo will be put towards future tournaments (Destiny II). Nope, never made that point. Im simply saying the community should decide whats deserved + a going about it a different way/smarter way with a poll or something would definitely have silenced alot of people here. taking a sum of that amount for something like that is unjustified by many people here, as you can see from the thread. Makes sense to me. If all money left over go to the next tournament, how much money does he get in salary? IMHO none for this one lol (as he never said he would take any and i find that sneaky and misleading.. as he sold it to the community as everything raised would be going to the tourny, not to his pockets.). but he probably does deserve a bit, but should be "transparent" to the donators to let them know at least beforehand. anyway heres a question to answer your question - Who should decide that?? (the community)
Why the community should decide about money that isn't theirs? Seriously.
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On August 14 2014 22:50 Faust852 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 14 2014 22:25 LeeJohnDong wrote:On August 14 2014 22:10 Catbus wrote:On August 14 2014 20:00 LeeJohnDong wrote:
Still, it was raised by this tournament, and the only reason it was "left over" is because of the communities contribution. Imho, it should go straight into this 10k tourny idea tbh. realistically, id say most of the community who donated was under the premise that all the money raised would go into the next one. I mean, there would be No sponsorship deals if they hadn't contributed anyway. On August 14 2014 20:45 LeeJohnDong wrote:On August 14 2014 20:09 ObviousOne wrote:On August 14 2014 20:00 LeeJohnDong wrote:On August 14 2014 19:28 NovemberstOrm wrote:On August 14 2014 19:25 LeeJohnDong wrote:
imho, you should have asked the community what to do with the leftover cash (Their money). if they voted on a poll or something to say "keep it, you earned it" then yes, it would sit nicer with 90% of the people you have pissed off.. I mean, its their money at the end of the day, they donated it to your tournament that was 100% "crowd funded", at no point did you say you'd take 30% of it for yourself. I for one think that most of that money if not all should have been put forward to the next tournament (which is unlikely to happen now as your inability to take criticism is astounding and just makes things worse).
Plus saying its "2 weeks work" is complete bs too. I mean, he'd of been doing the same shit anyway, and inviting players/etc is not something that takes 8 hours a day. having sleep issues is personal and shouldnt come into a work environment ever.
I'm not even going to comment on the absolute shambles you've made with Kespa.
</rant> The event was fully crowd funded the extra money came from the sponsors he had for the event, clarifying just in case theirs some confusion.
I was able to raise $1,800 from sponsorships for this event. Since the tournament was fully funded via the Indiegogo, this is money that I can essentially pocket as my "take home" pay for organizing/casting the tournament.
Still, it was raised by this tournament, and the only reason it was "left over" is because of the communities contribution. Imho, it should go straight into this 10k tourny idea tbh. realistically, id say most of the community who donated was under the premise that all the money raised would go into the next one. I mean, there would be No sponsorship deals if they hadn't contributed anyway. Just to clarify your position, you believe that Destiny should earn zero dollars for running this tournament. Is this correct? Funding goals/distribution
My budget for this tournament is $5,000.
$200 will go towards the Korean/English bilingual admin I have chosen. He'll be responsible for doing vetos/setting up games and doing post game/post group interviews, if we decide to do them.
$200 will go towards art work from the artist. This includes branding/logo, slides between games, and overlays for in game.
$600 will go towards casters. I will be paying each invited caster $100 for casting 1 day, meaning I will need 6 different casters for the tournament. If I'm not able to find 6, I'll repeat some casters. So far I've confirmed Incontrol, ToD, Nathanias and Minigun as casters.
$500 goes towards Indiegogo fees for fundraising.
$4000 will go towards the prize pool. The distribution will be as follows: 1st place $1,600, 2nd place $800, 3rd-4th place $400, 5th-8th place $200.
Extra money raised from the Indiegogo will be put towards future tournaments (Destiny II). Nope, never made that point. Im simply saying the community should decide whats deserved + a going about it a different way/smarter way with a poll or something would definitely have silenced alot of people here. taking a sum of that amount for something like that is unjustified by many people here, as you can see from the thread. Makes sense to me. If all money left over go to the next tournament, how much money does he get in salary? IMHO none for this one lol (as he never said he would take any and i find that sneaky and misleading.. as he sold it to the community as everything raised would be going to the tourny, not to his pockets.). but he probably does deserve a bit, but should be "transparent" to the donators to let them know at least beforehand. anyway heres a question to answer your question - Who should decide that?? (the community) Why the community should decide about money that isn't theirs? Seriously.
Mmm, you apparently don't understand fans of any sports anywhere. The drama around Destiny is a grain of sand in comparison to the conclusion of the saga of transferring ownership of the Los Angeles Clippers from one billionaire to another.
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On August 14 2014 22:50 Faust852 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 14 2014 22:25 LeeJohnDong wrote:On August 14 2014 22:10 Catbus wrote:On August 14 2014 20:00 LeeJohnDong wrote:
Still, it was raised by this tournament, and the only reason it was "left over" is because of the communities contribution. Imho, it should go straight into this 10k tourny idea tbh. realistically, id say most of the community who donated was under the premise that all the money raised would go into the next one. I mean, there would be No sponsorship deals if they hadn't contributed anyway. On August 14 2014 20:45 LeeJohnDong wrote:On August 14 2014 20:09 ObviousOne wrote:On August 14 2014 20:00 LeeJohnDong wrote:On August 14 2014 19:28 NovemberstOrm wrote:On August 14 2014 19:25 LeeJohnDong wrote:
imho, you should have asked the community what to do with the leftover cash (Their money). if they voted on a poll or something to say "keep it, you earned it" then yes, it would sit nicer with 90% of the people you have pissed off.. I mean, its their money at the end of the day, they donated it to your tournament that was 100% "crowd funded", at no point did you say you'd take 30% of it for yourself. I for one think that most of that money if not all should have been put forward to the next tournament (which is unlikely to happen now as your inability to take criticism is astounding and just makes things worse).
Plus saying its "2 weeks work" is complete bs too. I mean, he'd of been doing the same shit anyway, and inviting players/etc is not something that takes 8 hours a day. having sleep issues is personal and shouldnt come into a work environment ever.
I'm not even going to comment on the absolute shambles you've made with Kespa.
</rant> The event was fully crowd funded the extra money came from the sponsors he had for the event, clarifying just in case theirs some confusion.
I was able to raise $1,800 from sponsorships for this event. Since the tournament was fully funded via the Indiegogo, this is money that I can essentially pocket as my "take home" pay for organizing/casting the tournament.
Still, it was raised by this tournament, and the only reason it was "left over" is because of the communities contribution. Imho, it should go straight into this 10k tourny idea tbh. realistically, id say most of the community who donated was under the premise that all the money raised would go into the next one. I mean, there would be No sponsorship deals if they hadn't contributed anyway. Just to clarify your position, you believe that Destiny should earn zero dollars for running this tournament. Is this correct? Funding goals/distribution
My budget for this tournament is $5,000.
$200 will go towards the Korean/English bilingual admin I have chosen. He'll be responsible for doing vetos/setting up games and doing post game/post group interviews, if we decide to do them.
$200 will go towards art work from the artist. This includes branding/logo, slides between games, and overlays for in game.
$600 will go towards casters. I will be paying each invited caster $100 for casting 1 day, meaning I will need 6 different casters for the tournament. If I'm not able to find 6, I'll repeat some casters. So far I've confirmed Incontrol, ToD, Nathanias and Minigun as casters.
$500 goes towards Indiegogo fees for fundraising.
$4000 will go towards the prize pool. The distribution will be as follows: 1st place $1,600, 2nd place $800, 3rd-4th place $400, 5th-8th place $200.
Extra money raised from the Indiegogo will be put towards future tournaments (Destiny II). Nope, never made that point. Im simply saying the community should decide whats deserved + a going about it a different way/smarter way with a poll or something would definitely have silenced alot of people here. taking a sum of that amount for something like that is unjustified by many people here, as you can see from the thread. Makes sense to me. If all money left over go to the next tournament, how much money does he get in salary? IMHO none for this one lol (as he never said he would take any and i find that sneaky and misleading.. as he sold it to the community as everything raised would be going to the tourny, not to his pockets.). but he probably does deserve a bit, but should be "transparent" to the donators to let them know at least beforehand. anyway heres a question to answer your question - Who should decide that?? (the community) Why the community should decide about money that isn't theirs? Seriously.
Because the money went to an entity (tournament) which is mainly funded by the community.
Seriously people, there are arguments supporting both sides and there is no objective reason, why one side is more right than the other. You people are arguing in a circle based on the ground that you prioritize certain reasons differently. Destiny pocketed the sponsorship money from the tournament that came from outside Indiegogo. Some people think the money is well-deserved, some people are irritated by that move, there is some truth to both reasonings. Either way, he didn't do anything against his words and it's time to move on.
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On August 14 2014 23:01 JustPassingBy wrote:Show nested quote +On August 14 2014 22:50 Faust852 wrote:On August 14 2014 22:25 LeeJohnDong wrote:On August 14 2014 22:10 Catbus wrote:On August 14 2014 20:00 LeeJohnDong wrote:
Still, it was raised by this tournament, and the only reason it was "left over" is because of the communities contribution. Imho, it should go straight into this 10k tourny idea tbh. realistically, id say most of the community who donated was under the premise that all the money raised would go into the next one. I mean, there would be No sponsorship deals if they hadn't contributed anyway. On August 14 2014 20:45 LeeJohnDong wrote:On August 14 2014 20:09 ObviousOne wrote:On August 14 2014 20:00 LeeJohnDong wrote:On August 14 2014 19:28 NovemberstOrm wrote:On August 14 2014 19:25 LeeJohnDong wrote:
imho, you should have asked the community what to do with the leftover cash (Their money). if they voted on a poll or something to say "keep it, you earned it" then yes, it would sit nicer with 90% of the people you have pissed off.. I mean, its their money at the end of the day, they donated it to your tournament that was 100% "crowd funded", at no point did you say you'd take 30% of it for yourself. I for one think that most of that money if not all should have been put forward to the next tournament (which is unlikely to happen now as your inability to take criticism is astounding and just makes things worse).
Plus saying its "2 weeks work" is complete bs too. I mean, he'd of been doing the same shit anyway, and inviting players/etc is not something that takes 8 hours a day. having sleep issues is personal and shouldnt come into a work environment ever.
I'm not even going to comment on the absolute shambles you've made with Kespa.
</rant> The event was fully crowd funded the extra money came from the sponsors he had for the event, clarifying just in case theirs some confusion.
I was able to raise $1,800 from sponsorships for this event. Since the tournament was fully funded via the Indiegogo, this is money that I can essentially pocket as my "take home" pay for organizing/casting the tournament.
Still, it was raised by this tournament, and the only reason it was "left over" is because of the communities contribution. Imho, it should go straight into this 10k tourny idea tbh. realistically, id say most of the community who donated was under the premise that all the money raised would go into the next one. I mean, there would be No sponsorship deals if they hadn't contributed anyway. Just to clarify your position, you believe that Destiny should earn zero dollars for running this tournament. Is this correct? Funding goals/distribution
My budget for this tournament is $5,000.
$200 will go towards the Korean/English bilingual admin I have chosen. He'll be responsible for doing vetos/setting up games and doing post game/post group interviews, if we decide to do them.
$200 will go towards art work from the artist. This includes branding/logo, slides between games, and overlays for in game.
$600 will go towards casters. I will be paying each invited caster $100 for casting 1 day, meaning I will need 6 different casters for the tournament. If I'm not able to find 6, I'll repeat some casters. So far I've confirmed Incontrol, ToD, Nathanias and Minigun as casters.
$500 goes towards Indiegogo fees for fundraising.
$4000 will go towards the prize pool. The distribution will be as follows: 1st place $1,600, 2nd place $800, 3rd-4th place $400, 5th-8th place $200.
Extra money raised from the Indiegogo will be put towards future tournaments (Destiny II). Nope, never made that point. Im simply saying the community should decide whats deserved + a going about it a different way/smarter way with a poll or something would definitely have silenced alot of people here. taking a sum of that amount for something like that is unjustified by many people here, as you can see from the thread. Makes sense to me. If all money left over go to the next tournament, how much money does he get in salary? IMHO none for this one lol (as he never said he would take any and i find that sneaky and misleading.. as he sold it to the community as everything raised would be going to the tourny, not to his pockets.). but he probably does deserve a bit, but should be "transparent" to the donators to let them know at least beforehand. anyway heres a question to answer your question - Who should decide that?? (the community) Why the community should decide about money that isn't theirs? Seriously. Because the money went to an entity (tournament) which is mainly funded by the community. Seriously people, there are arguments supporting both sides and there is no objective reason, why one side is more right than the other. You people are arguing in a circle based on the ground that you prioritize certain reasons differently. Destiny pocketed the sponsorship money from the tournament that came from outside Indiegogo. Some people think the money is well-deserved, some people are irritated by that move, there is some truth to both reasonings. Either way, he didn't do anything against his words and it's time to move on.
While the tournament is funded by the community, Destiny have no legal obligation to inject it back to the community. He've fulfilled the legal obligation of completing the event and is in the process of completing the stretch goals from Indiegogo. The cummunity isn't untitled to anything more.
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Thanks for this Destiny! If all the other tournament organizers were this transparent about what they do to organize their tournaments, there'd be a lot fewer issues in this community. You're awesome and can't wait for Destiny II!
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Gosh, let the guy earn some money for getting this show on the road. Tsk. He worked for it, obviously.
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"WE SHOULD DECIDE WHAT TO DO WITH THE SPONSORSHIP MONEY BECAUSE WE'RE THE ONES THAT ALLOWED FOR IT TO HAPPEN!" is a deluded opinion that entitled people who likely didn't even contribute to the Indiegogo have. It wasn't you guys that made the sponsors want to get on-board with Destiny. Destiny himself was as much of a factor as the actual donators.
Seriously, this thread is filled with nutjobs.
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The only suggestion that I'd make regarding this whole drama is that, for the next tournament, Destiny adds his fee in the Indiegogo campaign from the start (he can estimate how much time/effort organizing the tourney will take, hence how much money he feels he will have "earned" by doing so). Also, having a statement regarding additionnal cash (whether he gets it, invests it in another tourney, adds to the cash prize, improves the production, etc). With those two things, everything is clear from the get go, and everyone know what he gets.
But still, this tournament was great, and I especially appreciate this post-tourney report ! Thank you Destiny !
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On August 14 2014 23:17 Xiphos wrote:Show nested quote +On August 14 2014 23:01 JustPassingBy wrote:On August 14 2014 22:50 Faust852 wrote:On August 14 2014 22:25 LeeJohnDong wrote:On August 14 2014 22:10 Catbus wrote:On August 14 2014 20:00 LeeJohnDong wrote:
Still, it was raised by this tournament, and the only reason it was "left over" is because of the communities contribution. Imho, it should go straight into this 10k tourny idea tbh. realistically, id say most of the community who donated was under the premise that all the money raised would go into the next one. I mean, there would be No sponsorship deals if they hadn't contributed anyway. On August 14 2014 20:45 LeeJohnDong wrote:On August 14 2014 20:09 ObviousOne wrote:On August 14 2014 20:00 LeeJohnDong wrote:On August 14 2014 19:28 NovemberstOrm wrote:On August 14 2014 19:25 LeeJohnDong wrote:
imho, you should have asked the community what to do with the leftover cash (Their money). if they voted on a poll or something to say "keep it, you earned it" then yes, it would sit nicer with 90% of the people you have pissed off.. I mean, its their money at the end of the day, they donated it to your tournament that was 100% "crowd funded", at no point did you say you'd take 30% of it for yourself. I for one think that most of that money if not all should have been put forward to the next tournament (which is unlikely to happen now as your inability to take criticism is astounding and just makes things worse).
Plus saying its "2 weeks work" is complete bs too. I mean, he'd of been doing the same shit anyway, and inviting players/etc is not something that takes 8 hours a day. having sleep issues is personal and shouldnt come into a work environment ever.
I'm not even going to comment on the absolute shambles you've made with Kespa.
</rant> The event was fully crowd funded the extra money came from the sponsors he had for the event, clarifying just in case theirs some confusion.
I was able to raise $1,800 from sponsorships for this event. Since the tournament was fully funded via the Indiegogo, this is money that I can essentially pocket as my "take home" pay for organizing/casting the tournament.
Still, it was raised by this tournament, and the only reason it was "left over" is because of the communities contribution. Imho, it should go straight into this 10k tourny idea tbh. realistically, id say most of the community who donated was under the premise that all the money raised would go into the next one. I mean, there would be No sponsorship deals if they hadn't contributed anyway. Just to clarify your position, you believe that Destiny should earn zero dollars for running this tournament. Is this correct? Funding goals/distribution
My budget for this tournament is $5,000.
$200 will go towards the Korean/English bilingual admin I have chosen. He'll be responsible for doing vetos/setting up games and doing post game/post group interviews, if we decide to do them.
$200 will go towards art work from the artist. This includes branding/logo, slides between games, and overlays for in game.
$600 will go towards casters. I will be paying each invited caster $100 for casting 1 day, meaning I will need 6 different casters for the tournament. If I'm not able to find 6, I'll repeat some casters. So far I've confirmed Incontrol, ToD, Nathanias and Minigun as casters.
$500 goes towards Indiegogo fees for fundraising.
$4000 will go towards the prize pool. The distribution will be as follows: 1st place $1,600, 2nd place $800, 3rd-4th place $400, 5th-8th place $200.
Extra money raised from the Indiegogo will be put towards future tournaments (Destiny II). Nope, never made that point. Im simply saying the community should decide whats deserved + a going about it a different way/smarter way with a poll or something would definitely have silenced alot of people here. taking a sum of that amount for something like that is unjustified by many people here, as you can see from the thread. Makes sense to me. If all money left over go to the next tournament, how much money does he get in salary? IMHO none for this one lol (as he never said he would take any and i find that sneaky and misleading.. as he sold it to the community as everything raised would be going to the tourny, not to his pockets.). but he probably does deserve a bit, but should be "transparent" to the donators to let them know at least beforehand. anyway heres a question to answer your question - Who should decide that?? (the community) Why the community should decide about money that isn't theirs? Seriously. Because the money went to an entity (tournament) which is mainly funded by the community. Seriously people, there are arguments supporting both sides and there is no objective reason, why one side is more right than the other. You people are arguing in a circle based on the ground that you prioritize certain reasons differently. Destiny pocketed the sponsorship money from the tournament that came from outside Indiegogo. Some people think the money is well-deserved, some people are irritated by that move, there is some truth to both reasonings. Either way, he didn't do anything against his words and it's time to move on. While the tournament is funded by the community, Destiny have no legal obligation to inject it back to the community. He've fulfilled the legal obligation of completing the event and is in the process of completing the stretch goals from Indiegogo. The cummunity isn't untitled to anything more.
If we are talking about the legal point of view, then you are 100% right and there is no need to argue in the first place. The people arguing are obviously talking about the moral point of view.
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The money arguments on this thread... just... boggle my mind. In the real world, you aren't paid for "how much work you do." If you organize something, if you take the risk to start a business or go on a business endeavor, as this tournament was, you either sink with the ship or reap the benefits. That's kind of how capitalism works. I read the Indigogo post carefully and there's absolutely nothing that Destiny has said that was misleading. It's impossible to control how much money you get for an event if you go the route that Destiny did, and of course he can and should pocket money earned from the event in the way that he did. Remember, he would have taken a loss, perhaps a significant one, if things did not go well.
It's fantastic that people like Rifkin do tourneys and put all the money towards future tournaments. However, this implies that they have other sources of income, because otherwise how you gonna eat? Every other eSports professional (casters and players) that I can think of earns plenty of money from their participation in the scene, yet you don't see them posting how much money they earn from their contracts and tournaments. I don't see any criticism of them on this thread.
Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, and I'm entitled to mine: if you're criticizing Destiny for being transparent about how much money he made, you're a fucking idiot.
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On August 15 2014 00:01 KanoCoke wrote:
"WE SHOULD DECIDE WHAT TO DO WITH THE SPONSORSHIP MONEY BECAUSE WE'RE THE ONES THAT ALLOWED FOR IT TO HAPPEN!" is a deluded opinion that entitled people who likely didn't even contribute to the Indiegogo have. It wasn't you guys that made the sponsors want to get on-board with Destiny. Destiny himself was as much of a factor as the actual donators.
Seriously, this thread is filled with nutjobs.
Dude. Seriously. Just read the thread. I didnt donate, as I hate his attitude as a person and I kinda seen something like this coming. I mean, from his past and reputation, do you honestly think he didnt do this just to make money?? meh.. Deluded is thinking this was a selfless act to "save e-sports" and not for personal gain. I'm glad at least one person sees that here.
Peace
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The drama in this thread is why I'm not a fan of transparency. Destiny organised a tournament, people decided to donate money out of their own free will, so Destiny can do with the money whatever he pleases. Crowdfunding is not the same as buying a stake in something. Smart business sense dictates that he should invest it into the next tournament, but that depends whether he intends to make it a series or not.
On the other hand, publishing private email conversations without permission of the other party is incredibly unprofessional.
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On August 15 2014 00:49 LeeJohnDong wrote:Show nested quote +On August 15 2014 00:01 KanoCoke wrote:
"WE SHOULD DECIDE WHAT TO DO WITH THE SPONSORSHIP MONEY BECAUSE WE'RE THE ONES THAT ALLOWED FOR IT TO HAPPEN!" is a deluded opinion that entitled people who likely didn't even contribute to the Indiegogo have. It wasn't you guys that made the sponsors want to get on-board with Destiny. Destiny himself was as much of a factor as the actual donators.
Seriously, this thread is filled with nutjobs. Dude. Seriously. Just read the thread. I didnt donate, as I hate his attitude as a person and I kinda seen something like this coming. I mean, from his past and reputation, do you honestly think he didnt do this just to make money?? meh.. Deluded is thinking this was a selfless act to "save e-sports" and not for personal gain. I'm glad at least one person sees that here. Peace
You've had some of the funniest posts in this thread, just FYI.
"I seen something like this coming"...seen something like what coming? Me 100% fulfilling my promise that I would use 100% of the funds raised from the Indiegogo to pay for the tournament? Because I did.
Also the argument that "he got sponsorships off the back of the Indiegogo" lol wat..? I would have gotten sponsorships regardless, they didn't ask me how the fucking Indiegogo was doing. What if I did a $5,000 tournament with 0 crowd funding and got $10,000 in sponsorships? Would it suddenly be okay for me to keep $5k extra?
What if I did a crowd funded tournament and got more subscribers or personal donations or viewers or something "because of the crowd funding"? Should I forward all of that money "back to the community"?
Also, please, grow the fuck up. I know being 17 years old and jobless is cool and all, but stop demonizing people who want to make some fucking money. Did I want to make money during this tournament? Yeah, of course, otherwise it's not worth (in a monetary sense) my time, I have to be compensated if you ever want me to put on tournaments like this. Grow the fuck up.
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On August 15 2014 01:10 Destiny wrote:Show nested quote +On August 15 2014 00:49 LeeJohnDong wrote:On August 15 2014 00:01 KanoCoke wrote:
"WE SHOULD DECIDE WHAT TO DO WITH THE SPONSORSHIP MONEY BECAUSE WE'RE THE ONES THAT ALLOWED FOR IT TO HAPPEN!" is a deluded opinion that entitled people who likely didn't even contribute to the Indiegogo have. It wasn't you guys that made the sponsors want to get on-board with Destiny. Destiny himself was as much of a factor as the actual donators.
Seriously, this thread is filled with nutjobs. Dude. Seriously. Just read the thread. I didnt donate, as I hate his attitude as a person and I kinda seen something like this coming. I mean, from his past and reputation, do you honestly think he didnt do this just to make money?? meh.. Deluded is thinking this was a selfless act to "save e-sports" and not for personal gain. I'm glad at least one person sees that here. Peace You've had some of the funniest posts in this thread, just FYI. "I seen something like this coming"...seen something like what coming? Me 100% fulfilling my promise that I would use 100% of the funds raised from the Indiegogo to pay for the tournament? Because I did. Also the argument that "he got sponsorships off the back of the Indiegogo" lol wat..? I would have gotten sponsorships regardless, they didn't ask me how the fucking Indiegogo was doing. What if I did a $5,000 tournament with 0 crowd funding and got $10,000 in sponsorships? Would it suddenly be okay for me to keep $5k extra? What if I did a crowd funded tournament and got more subscribers or personal donations or viewers or something "because of the crowd funding"? Should I forward all of that money "back to the community"? Also, please, grow the fuck up. I know being 17 years old and jobless is cool and all, but stop demonizing people who want to make some fucking money. Did I want to make money during this tournament? Yeah, of course, otherwise it's not worth (in a monetary sense) my time, I have to be compensated if you ever want me to put on tournaments like this. Grow the fuck up.
Ladies and gentlemen,
Destiny "2014" through and through haha.
What an immature attitude man. I did see something like this coming. You have that kind of personality. Not the kind that commits selfless acts, but the kind that will do whatever it takes for personal gain, without letting the people who funded you know beforehand. And from what you said, you probably don't need "Crowd Funding" at all eh? 
Anyway, take no criticism, whine about not getting your way with Kespa (child), take no feedback seriously, get butthurt and argue with everyone, whatever. It doesnt matter. Think its time for you to change a little, for yourself. You're in the public now, not X17, put your "professional" cap on.
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On August 15 2014 01:10 Destiny wrote:Show nested quote +On August 15 2014 00:49 LeeJohnDong wrote:On August 15 2014 00:01 KanoCoke wrote:
"WE SHOULD DECIDE WHAT TO DO WITH THE SPONSORSHIP MONEY BECAUSE WE'RE THE ONES THAT ALLOWED FOR IT TO HAPPEN!" is a deluded opinion that entitled people who likely didn't even contribute to the Indiegogo have. It wasn't you guys that made the sponsors want to get on-board with Destiny. Destiny himself was as much of a factor as the actual donators.
Seriously, this thread is filled with nutjobs. Dude. Seriously. Just read the thread. I didnt donate, as I hate his attitude as a person and I kinda seen something like this coming. I mean, from his past and reputation, do you honestly think he didnt do this just to make money?? meh.. Deluded is thinking this was a selfless act to "save e-sports" and not for personal gain. I'm glad at least one person sees that here. Peace Also the argument that "he got sponsorships off the back of the Indiegogo" lol wat..? I would have gotten sponsorships regardless, they didn't ask me how the fucking Indiegogo was doing. What if I did a $5,000 tournament with 0 crowd funding and got $10,000 in sponsorships? Would it suddenly be okay for me to keep $5k extra?
Eh? Of course you got the sponsorship money off the back of the community donations? It's so fucking simple: without the crowdfunding money you don't have a tournament, and without a tournament you don't have any sponsorship.
On August 15 2014 01:10 Destiny wrote:What if I did a crowd funded tournament and got more subscribers or personal donations or viewers or something "because of the crowd funding"? Should I forward all of that money "back to the community"?
You say "what if?" as if that's not exactly what happened. Well yeah, that's exactly what I think many, if not most, assumed would be your compensation (after your casting fees) is the benefit of this tournament in raising your profile and platform and the chance to gain more subscribers. This is the win-win situation behind most community tournaments. As in I will organise this community tournament using community funds and in return for organising it I get to use it on my platform. That's kinda what I though was the case going into this. I thought that, casting fee aside, your compensation for hosting the tournament was the advantages of raising your profile, your brand and your website platform - not to make a ton of money from sponsors.
All it comes down to is people thinking that this was a community tournament not a for-profit tournament. That's all. At the end of the day it was a good event, I enjoyed it and it was well-run so that's enough for most people including me. But next time you should be more clear about these things before the event because you can see why questions are being asked.
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