On April 08 2014 18:31 Froadac wrote: I wish there were more NA players, but it does to some degree fall onto them.
I do take issue with the fact we're still talking about regions, when in reality it might be the most fun to just combine all the WCS regions into one entirely global thing. It's so korean dominated that to call it WCS America is hardly genuine.
One of the main reasons I've 99% stopped watching pro starcraft is no westerners, no hype. I came back to watch shoutcraft, and apart form that have watched a couple streams rarely.
I"d much rather watch some random NA dota teams than a bunch of noname koreans in WCS america. I wish we could get some more americans to the top, but as the system is it seems unlikely they will get to the top. We're at a place where WCS America is really WCS Sponsored korean in hte Ro8+, and I don't see that changing. (for good reason). But trying to reconcile it being WCS 'america' with that fact is the sticking point for me.
If you look at the people who made the Ro8 this season and also at some of those who got eliminated and can say with a straight face and genuine seriousness that they're "a bunch of noname koreans" then perhaps we are better off without you watching.
rofl. Shoot, it was late. Not noname, so much as relatively flat personality wise. (for hte most part, I like polt etc)
On April 08 2014 22:12 TitusVI wrote: I wonder who is the guy who makes the decisions about region lock etc. He should maybe look around how other esports handle it and maybe get an idea of what goes wrong.
Well he's made the Ro8 of WCS AM something people outside of America will actually watch :/
He should invite the most popular players, imagine how many people would watch that.
What kind of viewership numbers did the Enders Game on Blu-ray tournament draw?
On April 08 2014 20:25 gold_ wrote: Viewer base will continue to drop due to no home town heros to cheer for. I am not bashing the koreans at all, but WCS America should've been at least people LIVING in any part of the Americas only. I personally have stopped watching, Koreans have their own WCS FFS.
Polt
1/8 then that actually live in the Americas? :/
Noone would watch if WCS NA was actually NA only. Except Totalbiscuit
I'd be an undefined amount more likely to watch it than I am at the moment
On April 08 2014 22:12 TitusVI wrote: I wonder who is the guy who makes the decisions about region lock etc. He should maybe look around how other esports handle it and maybe get an idea of what goes wrong.
Well he's made the Ro8 of WCS AM something people outside of America will actually watch :/
He should invite the most popular players, imagine how many people would watch that.
What kind of viewership numbers did the Enders Game on Blu-ray tournament draw?
no idea, why?
Because that's essentially what they did with that tournament. They invited a bunch of established names in the NA scene for most of the participants. If inviting popular NA players is guaranteed to bring in better viewership than a Korean dominated WCS NA, then surely the Enders Game on Blu-ray tournament would proven that. Right?
On April 08 2014 20:25 gold_ wrote: Viewer base will continue to drop due to no home town heros to cheer for.
I just don't buy that explanation for declining viewership. If that was the case, we should hear about how WCS EU and WCS Korea viewership is either holding steady or even going up. Nothing I've read suggests that overall SC2 viewership is being pulled down by WCS NA's lack of home town heroes.
Viewership is declining because fewer and fewer people are playing the game. This game lacks the "fun factor" and just doesn't have much staying power with the masses. You could have a tournament full of NA based players, but that won't fix the problem that the game just isn't fun for most people.
On April 08 2014 20:25 gold_ wrote: Viewer base will continue to drop due to no home town heros to cheer for.
I just don't buy that explanation for declining viewership. If that was the case, we should hear about how WCS EU and WCS Korea viewership is either holding steady or even going up. Nothing I've read suggests that overall SC2 viewership is being pulled down by WCS NA's lack of home town heroes.
Viewership is declining because fewer and fewer people are playing the game. This game lacks the "fun factor" and just doesn't have much staying power with the masses. You could have a tournament full of NA based players, but that won't fix the problem that the game just isn't fun for most people.
On April 08 2014 22:12 TitusVI wrote: I wonder who is the guy who makes the decisions about region lock etc. He should maybe look around how other esports handle it and maybe get an idea of what goes wrong.
Well he's made the Ro8 of WCS AM something people outside of America will actually watch :/
He should invite the most popular players, imagine how many people would watch that.
What kind of viewership numbers did the Enders Game on Blu-ray tournament draw?
no idea, why?
Because that's essentially what they did with that tournament. They invited a bunch of established names in the NA scene for most of the participants. If inviting popular NA players is guaranteed to bring in better viewership than a Korean dominated WCS NA, then surely the Enders Game on Blu-ray tournament would proven that. Right?
I wasn't talking about inviting popular NA players, i was talking about popular players period. People complain that without koreans there aren't enough viewers. By that logic, shouldn't they just invite the most popular players from all around the world (that didn't chose another "region") as that would raise numbers the most? Why even have regions when people only care about the best players worldwide? Just call it "WCS 25, live from Cologne" or whatever.
TLDR: Name one reason why we need WCS NA/EU if it's not about players from that region.
On April 08 2014 20:25 gold_ wrote: Viewer base will continue to drop due to no home town heros to cheer for.
I just don't buy that explanation for declining viewership. If that was the case, we should hear about how WCS EU and WCS Korea viewership is either holding steady or even going up. Nothing I've read suggests that overall SC2 viewership is being pulled down by WCS NA's lack of home town heroes.
Viewership is declining because fewer and fewer people are playing the game. This game lacks the "fun factor" and just doesn't have much staying power with the masses. You could have a tournament full of NA based players, but that won't fix the problem that the game just isn't fun for most people.
The game has had a competitive scene for what, four years now, and you say it doesn't have staying power? I don't understand that logic..
On April 08 2014 22:12 TitusVI wrote: I wonder who is the guy who makes the decisions about region lock etc. He should maybe look around how other esports handle it and maybe get an idea of what goes wrong.
Well he's made the Ro8 of WCS AM something people outside of America will actually watch :/
He should invite the most popular players, imagine how many people would watch that.
What kind of viewership numbers did the Enders Game on Blu-ray tournament draw?
no idea, why?
Because that's essentially what they did with that tournament. They invited a bunch of established names in the NA scene for most of the participants. If inviting popular NA players is guaranteed to bring in better viewership than a Korean dominated WCS NA, then surely the Enders Game on Blu-ray tournament would proven that. Right?
TLDR: Name one reason why we need WCS NA/EU if it's not about players from that region.
WCS Europe is played out in Europe, WCS America is played out in America, WCS Korea is played out in Korea. Seems fairly clear-cut.
TLDR: Name one reason why we need WCS NA/EU if it's not about players from that region.
Reason #1: So that people in those regions have a tournament that they can watch live during a time of day that they are available to watch (i.e. not during middle of the night, or during the day when they are at work). Reason #2: So that people can attend those tournaments in person with a reasonable amount of travel.
On April 08 2014 22:12 TitusVI wrote: I wonder who is the guy who makes the decisions about region lock etc. He should maybe look around how other esports handle it and maybe get an idea of what goes wrong.
Well he's made the Ro8 of WCS AM something people outside of America will actually watch :/
He should invite the most popular players, imagine how many people would watch that.
What kind of viewership numbers did the Enders Game on Blu-ray tournament draw?
no idea, why?
Because that's essentially what they did with that tournament. They invited a bunch of established names in the NA scene for most of the participants. If inviting popular NA players is guaranteed to bring in better viewership than a Korean dominated WCS NA, then surely the Enders Game on Blu-ray tournament would proven that. Right?
I wasn't talking about inviting popular NA players, i was talking about popular players period. People complain that without koreans there aren't enough viewers. By that logic, shouldn't they just invite the most popular players from all around the world (that didn't chose another "region") as that would raise numbers the most? Why even have regions when people only care about the best players worldwide? Just call it "WCS 25, live from Cologne" or whatever.
TLDR: Name one reason why we need WCS NA/EU if it's not about players from that region.
You're implying that most popular players = best players. Why are players like Polt/Bomber are popular to begin with? Because of their SICK PLAY. To your question : Yes it it about players from that region. There're plenty of them in PL. They just didn't advance to Ro8.
TLDR: How many people complaining about WCS NA actually watched the tournament?
On April 08 2014 22:12 TitusVI wrote: I wonder who is the guy who makes the decisions about region lock etc. He should maybe look around how other esports handle it and maybe get an idea of what goes wrong.
Well he's made the Ro8 of WCS AM something people outside of America will actually watch :/
He should invite the most popular players, imagine how many people would watch that.
What kind of viewership numbers did the Enders Game on Blu-ray tournament draw?
no idea, why?
Because that's essentially what they did with that tournament. They invited a bunch of established names in the NA scene for most of the participants. If inviting popular NA players is guaranteed to bring in better viewership than a Korean dominated WCS NA, then surely the Enders Game on Blu-ray tournament would proven that. Right?
I wasn't talking about inviting popular NA players, i was talking about popular players period. People complain that without koreans there aren't enough viewers. By that logic, shouldn't they just invite the most popular players from all around the world (that didn't chose another "region") as that would raise numbers the most? Why even have regions when people only care about the best players worldwide? Just call it "WCS 25, live from Cologne" or whatever.
TLDR: Name one reason why we need WCS NA/EU if it's not about players from that region.
You're implying that most popular players = best players. Why are players like Polt/Bomber are popular to begin with? Because of their SICK PLAY. To your question : Yes it it about players from that region. There're plenty of them in PL. They just didn't advance to Ro8.
TLDR: How many people complaining about WCS NA actually watched the tournament?
None because it was dominated by Koreans of course.
On April 08 2014 22:12 TitusVI wrote: I wonder who is the guy who makes the decisions about region lock etc. He should maybe look around how other esports handle it and maybe get an idea of what goes wrong.
Well he's made the Ro8 of WCS AM something people outside of America will actually watch :/
He should invite the most popular players, imagine how many people would watch that.
What kind of viewership numbers did the Enders Game on Blu-ray tournament draw?
no idea, why?
Because that's essentially what they did with that tournament. They invited a bunch of established names in the NA scene for most of the participants. If inviting popular NA players is guaranteed to bring in better viewership than a Korean dominated WCS NA, then surely the Enders Game on Blu-ray tournament would proven that. Right?
TLDR: Name one reason why we need WCS NA/EU if it's not about players from that region.
WCS Europe is played out in Europe, WCS America is played out in America, WCS Korea is played out in Korea. Seems fairly clear-cut.
So they could instead name it WCS GSL Studios or WCS ESL studios. Sounds reasonable.
On April 08 2014 22:12 TitusVI wrote: I wonder who is the guy who makes the decisions about region lock etc. He should maybe look around how other esports handle it and maybe get an idea of what goes wrong.
Well he's made the Ro8 of WCS AM something people outside of America will actually watch :/
He should invite the most popular players, imagine how many people would watch that.
What kind of viewership numbers did the Enders Game on Blu-ray tournament draw?
no idea, why?
Because that's essentially what they did with that tournament. They invited a bunch of established names in the NA scene for most of the participants. If inviting popular NA players is guaranteed to bring in better viewership than a Korean dominated WCS NA, then surely the Enders Game on Blu-ray tournament would proven that. Right?
I wasn't talking about inviting popular NA players, i was talking about popular players period. People complain that without koreans there aren't enough viewers. By that logic, shouldn't they just invite the most popular players from all around the world (that didn't chose another "region") as that would raise numbers the most? Why even have regions when people only care about the best players worldwide? Just call it "WCS 25, live from Cologne" or whatever.
TLDR: Name one reason why we need WCS NA/EU if it's not about players from that region.
You're implying that most popular players = best players. Why are players like Polt/Bomber are popular to begin with? Because of their SICK PLAY. To your question : Yes it it about players from that region. There're plenty of them in PL. They just didn't advance to Ro8.
TLDR: How many people complaining about WCS NA actually watched the tournament?
No I'm not, I'm implying that the most popular players will get the most viewers. What is the purpose of WCS NA if a player that has nothing to do with NA plays in it? You could also call it WCS ballsack. No difference.
On April 08 2014 22:12 TitusVI wrote: I wonder who is the guy who makes the decisions about region lock etc. He should maybe look around how other esports handle it and maybe get an idea of what goes wrong.
Well he's made the Ro8 of WCS AM something people outside of America will actually watch :/
He should invite the most popular players, imagine how many people would watch that.
What kind of viewership numbers did the Enders Game on Blu-ray tournament draw?
no idea, why?
Because that's essentially what they did with that tournament. They invited a bunch of established names in the NA scene for most of the participants. If inviting popular NA players is guaranteed to bring in better viewership than a Korean dominated WCS NA, then surely the Enders Game on Blu-ray tournament would proven that. Right?
TLDR: Name one reason why we need WCS NA/EU if it's not about players from that region.
WCS Europe is played out in Europe, WCS America is played out in America, WCS Korea is played out in Korea. Seems fairly clear-cut.
So they could instead name it WCS GSL Studios or WCS ESL studios. Sounds reasonable.
Indeed. Doesn't have quite the same ring to it and it doesn't tell you as concisely where and when the tournament is played out, but yes.
On April 08 2014 22:12 TitusVI wrote: I wonder who is the guy who makes the decisions about region lock etc. He should maybe look around how other esports handle it and maybe get an idea of what goes wrong.
Well he's made the Ro8 of WCS AM something people outside of America will actually watch :/
He should invite the most popular players, imagine how many people would watch that.
What kind of viewership numbers did the Enders Game on Blu-ray tournament draw?
no idea, why?
Because that's essentially what they did with that tournament. They invited a bunch of established names in the NA scene for most of the participants. If inviting popular NA players is guaranteed to bring in better viewership than a Korean dominated WCS NA, then surely the Enders Game on Blu-ray tournament would proven that. Right?
I wasn't talking about inviting popular NA players, i was talking about popular players period. People complain that without koreans there aren't enough viewers. By that logic, shouldn't they just invite the most popular players from all around the world (that didn't chose another "region") as that would raise numbers the most? Why even have regions when people only care about the best players worldwide? Just call it "WCS 25, live from Cologne" or whatever.
TLDR: Name one reason why we need WCS NA/EU if it's not about players from that region.
You're implying that most popular players = best players. Why are players like Polt/Bomber are popular to begin with? Because of their SICK PLAY. To your question : Yes it it about players from that region. There're plenty of them in PL. They just didn't advance to Ro8.
TLDR: How many people complaining about WCS NA actually watched the tournament?
No I'm not, I'm implying that the most popular players will get the most viewers. What is the purpose of WCS NA if a player that has nothing to do with NA plays in it? You could also call it WCS ballsack. No difference.
I know America is probably the worst region out of the three in terms of local talent, but I'm pretty sure ballsacks tend to be worse.
On April 08 2014 22:12 TitusVI wrote: I wonder who is the guy who makes the decisions about region lock etc. He should maybe look around how other esports handle it and maybe get an idea of what goes wrong.
Well he's made the Ro8 of WCS AM something people outside of America will actually watch :/
He should invite the most popular players, imagine how many people would watch that.
What kind of viewership numbers did the Enders Game on Blu-ray tournament draw?
no idea, why?
Because that's essentially what they did with that tournament. They invited a bunch of established names in the NA scene for most of the participants. If inviting popular NA players is guaranteed to bring in better viewership than a Korean dominated WCS NA, then surely the Enders Game on Blu-ray tournament would proven that. Right?
I wasn't talking about inviting popular NA players, i was talking about popular players period. People complain that without koreans there aren't enough viewers. By that logic, shouldn't they just invite the most popular players from all around the world (that didn't chose another "region") as that would raise numbers the most? Why even have regions when people only care about the best players worldwide? Just call it "WCS 25, live from Cologne" or whatever.
TLDR: Name one reason why we need WCS NA/EU if it's not about players from that region.
You're implying that most popular players = best players. Why are players like Polt/Bomber are popular to begin with? Because of their SICK PLAY. To your question : Yes it it about players from that region. There're plenty of them in PL. They just didn't advance to Ro8.
TLDR: How many people complaining about WCS NA actually watched the tournament?
No I'm not, I'm implying that the most popular players will get the most viewers. What is the purpose of WCS NA if a player that has nothing to do with NA plays in it? You could also call it WCS ballsack. No difference.
I think a lot more people would watch a tournament called WCS Ballsack, at least initially.
On April 08 2014 22:12 TitusVI wrote: I wonder who is the guy who makes the decisions about region lock etc. He should maybe look around how other esports handle it and maybe get an idea of what goes wrong.
Well he's made the Ro8 of WCS AM something people outside of America will actually watch :/
He should invite the most popular players, imagine how many people would watch that.
What kind of viewership numbers did the Enders Game on Blu-ray tournament draw?
no idea, why?
Because that's essentially what they did with that tournament. They invited a bunch of established names in the NA scene for most of the participants. If inviting popular NA players is guaranteed to bring in better viewership than a Korean dominated WCS NA, then surely the Enders Game on Blu-ray tournament would proven that. Right?
I wasn't talking about inviting popular NA players, i was talking about popular players period. People complain that without koreans there aren't enough viewers. By that logic, shouldn't they just invite the most popular players from all around the world (that didn't chose another "region") as that would raise numbers the most? Why even have regions when people only care about the best players worldwide? Just call it "WCS 25, live from Cologne" or whatever.
TLDR: Name one reason why we need WCS NA/EU if it's not about players from that region.
You're implying that most popular players = best players. Why are players like Polt/Bomber are popular to begin with? Because of their SICK PLAY. To your question : Yes it it about players from that region. There're plenty of them in PL. They just didn't advance to Ro8.
TLDR: How many people complaining about WCS NA actually watched the tournament?
No I'm not, I'm implying that the most popular players will get the most viewers. What is the purpose of WCS NA if a player that has nothing to do with NA plays in it? You could also call it WCS ballsack. No difference.
It came down to WCS America and WCS Ballsack for Blizzard's marketing department, WCS America won by a very narrow margin.
But yes, the name is only a little more meaningful than the ostensibly Korean "Global" Starcraft League.
On April 08 2014 22:12 TitusVI wrote: I wonder who is the guy who makes the decisions about region lock etc. He should maybe look around how other esports handle it and maybe get an idea of what goes wrong.
Well he's made the Ro8 of WCS AM something people outside of America will actually watch :/
He should invite the most popular players, imagine how many people would watch that.
What kind of viewership numbers did the Enders Game on Blu-ray tournament draw?
no idea, why?
Because that's essentially what they did with that tournament. They invited a bunch of established names in the NA scene for most of the participants. If inviting popular NA players is guaranteed to bring in better viewership than a Korean dominated WCS NA, then surely the Enders Game on Blu-ray tournament would proven that. Right?
TLDR: Name one reason why we need WCS NA/EU if it's not about players from that region.
WCS Europe is played out in Europe, WCS America is played out in America, WCS Korea is played out in Korea. Seems fairly clear-cut.
So they could instead name it WCS GSL Studios or WCS ESL studios. Sounds reasonable.
Indeed. Doesn't have quite the same ring to it and it doesn't tell you as concisely where and when the tournament is played out, but yes.
On April 08 2014 22:12 TitusVI wrote: I wonder who is the guy who makes the decisions about region lock etc. He should maybe look around how other esports handle it and maybe get an idea of what goes wrong.
Well he's made the Ro8 of WCS AM something people outside of America will actually watch :/
He should invite the most popular players, imagine how many people would watch that.
What kind of viewership numbers did the Enders Game on Blu-ray tournament draw?
no idea, why?
Because that's essentially what they did with that tournament. They invited a bunch of established names in the NA scene for most of the participants. If inviting popular NA players is guaranteed to bring in better viewership than a Korean dominated WCS NA, then surely the Enders Game on Blu-ray tournament would proven that. Right?
I wasn't talking about inviting popular NA players, i was talking about popular players period. People complain that without koreans there aren't enough viewers. By that logic, shouldn't they just invite the most popular players from all around the world (that didn't chose another "region") as that would raise numbers the most? Why even have regions when people only care about the best players worldwide? Just call it "WCS 25, live from Cologne" or whatever.
TLDR: Name one reason why we need WCS NA/EU if it's not about players from that region.
You're implying that most popular players = best players. Why are players like Polt/Bomber are popular to begin with? Because of their SICK PLAY. To your question : Yes it it about players from that region. There're plenty of them in PL. They just didn't advance to Ro8.
TLDR: How many people complaining about WCS NA actually watched the tournament?
No I'm not, I'm implying that the most popular players will get the most viewers. What is the purpose of WCS NA if a player that has nothing to do with NA plays in it? You could also call it WCS ballsack. No difference.
I know America is probably the worst region out of the three in terms of local talent, but I'm pretty sure ballsacks tend to be worse.
So we agree that WCS EU & NA are pointless right now?
EPT
