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Active: 1518 users

We Must Fight For The Carrier - Page 16

Forum Index > SC2 General
Post a Reply
Prev 1 14 15 16 17 18 94 Next
Sprouter
Profile Joined December 2009
United States1724 Posts
January 28 2012 11:04 GMT
#301
I think the carrier is one of those great signature units from BW but unfortunately this is not a democracy
HiSi
Profile Joined October 2011
United States68 Posts
January 28 2012 11:54 GMT
#302
On January 28 2012 13:05 BlueBoxSC wrote:
I don't play Protoss, and a lot of the complaints I generally hear are based around the 'limited' tech path of P, or rather, the rigidity.

So, what if...

Say the Cybernetics Core is a T1 building.

Robo, Stargate, Council = T2
Bay, Beacon, Archives/Dark = T3

Building any T2 building allows toss to build any T3 building? Then the units are built from the level three buildings. Upgrades would need to be reworked... ;~;

Just a random idea.


The real issue with this idea is it doesn't actually give protoss any added flexibility. The cyber core already acts in this manner, but if you unlocked the tier 3 tech with any of the tier 2 buildings, you couldn't utilize the buildings. A robo bay needs a robo to be worthwhile same with the fleet beacon. Personally I would really like to see the dark shrine merged with the Templar archives like in was in broodwar. I feel like this would help Templar openings quite a bit.
Hypatio
Profile Joined September 2010
549 Posts
January 28 2012 12:48 GMT
#303
Unit build times:

Ultralisk: 55 seconds
Battlecruiser: 90 seconds
Carrier: 120 seconds

I think I know why we never see carriers in game.
Jakkerr
Profile Joined December 2010
Netherlands2549 Posts
January 28 2012 12:54 GMT
#304
The carrier is cool but it doesn't need tweaking.

It needs a complete remake since it's so terribly broken atm.
Ballack
Profile Joined April 2010
Norway821 Posts
January 28 2012 13:00 GMT
#305
It wouldn't be removed from the game, just the multiplayer, I'm sure you can play around with the carrier in Legacy of the Void. I do not get it's appeal really. Yes it's a staple unit in SC, but there are no firebats, dragoons (Fenix), Vulture (Raynor) or goliaths in WoL MP, why is the Carrier so special? This is nostalgia over the top, because carrier usage is really complacent and boring in SC2 as opposed to BW, and its role is severely watered down. So why not get a new flyer that actually has a useful niche?
Just when I thought I was out, Blizz pulled me back in..
Mohdoo
Profile Joined August 2007
United States15743 Posts
January 28 2012 19:49 GMT
#306
On January 28 2012 21:48 Hypatio wrote:
Unit build times:

Ultralisk: 55 seconds
Battlecruiser: 90 seconds
Carrier: 120 seconds

I think I know why we never see carriers in game.


Yeah, its so weird how Blizzard looked at underused units, identified them, then drastically reduced the build time on (almost) all of them. Reduce the build time and make it attack while moving and I guarantee it'll be seen in competitive play.
m3rciless
Profile Joined August 2009
United States1476 Posts
January 28 2012 19:54 GMT
#307
White-Ra just crushed at T with a carrier switch, for what its worth. he was 90 times better than him anyway though.
White-Ra fighting!
v3chr0
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States856 Posts
January 28 2012 20:00 GMT
#308
On January 29 2012 04:49 Mohdoo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 28 2012 21:48 Hypatio wrote:
Unit build times:

Ultralisk: 55 seconds
Battlecruiser: 90 seconds
Carrier: 120 seconds

I think I know why we never see carriers in game.


Yeah, its so weird how Blizzard looked at underused units, identified them, then drastically reduced the build time on (almost) all of them. Reduce the build time and make it attack while moving and I guarantee it'll be seen in competitive play.


QFT.

My sentiment exactly.

Don't get rid of it! The Carrier just needs attention, at least try to fix it and give it a run before it goes to HotS. We haven't seen Protoss users fully utilize Carriers, or even Phoenix for that matter. Can't a few Phoenix with great micro kill any amount of Mutas? This is hardly ever played out as such. Keeeeep it!
"He catches him with his pants down, backs him off into a corner, and then it's over." - Khaldor
Incognoto
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
France10239 Posts
January 28 2012 20:01 GMT
#309
+1! Long live the carrier. Screw the silly tempest.
maru lover forever
RogerChillingworth
Profile Joined March 2010
Chad3132 Posts
January 28 2012 20:06 GMT
#310
you'd just see stronger deathballs.

wouldn't mind if zerg got scourge. otherwise....
Pyre
Profile Joined July 2010
United States1940 Posts
January 28 2012 20:07 GMT
#311
Let it die, It doesn't work in this game. Everyone hates the tempest but atleast it has a roll as decent air to air unit.
Belha
Profile Joined December 2010
Italy2850 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-01-28 20:14:57
January 28 2012 20:12 GMT
#312
Agree 100%

The key to the success of the carrier is how micreable was in Bw. Now in sc2 is useless cose is mainly another 1a unit.

Why not make it like in Bw with even more anti air in Sc2?? Please Blizz, fix it, make it a useful unit again.

Edit:

IMPORTANT: Some people think that Carrier in bw was just a moving 1a beast. It wasn't. It was a must-micro unit.
Chicken gank op
ODKStevez
Profile Joined February 2011
Ireland1225 Posts
January 31 2012 18:59 GMT
#313
I really hope they don't remove the carrier =[
Luppa <3
Mohdoo
Profile Joined August 2007
United States15743 Posts
January 31 2012 19:06 GMT
#314
On January 29 2012 05:07 Pyre wrote:
Let it die, It doesn't work in this game. Everyone hates the tempest but atleast it has a roll as decent air to air unit.


If the Carrier was able to attack while moving, it would actually be a really great anti-air unit as well. Carriers were not afraid of mutalisks in BW. Scourge, yes, Mutas, no.

And lets not forget that the Carrier was also very micro intensive. How micro intensive does the tempest look to you? Its just aiming mini-storms.
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
January 31 2012 19:25 GMT
#315
On January 29 2012 05:12 Belha wrote:
Agree 100%

The key to the success of the carrier is how micreable was in Bw. Now in sc2 is useless cose is mainly another 1a unit.

Why not make it like in Bw with even more anti air in Sc2?? Please Blizz, fix it, make it a useful unit again.

Edit:

IMPORTANT: Some people think that Carrier in bw was just a moving 1a beast. It wasn't. It was a must-micro unit.


I think another issue people do not take into account is the smart targeting in SC2. The fighters do not mess with the unit AI like they did in BW and marines/hydras/stalker just gun them down as they fly in. I don't think the ability to micro it more would help much, since viking/ruptors maul it so well and cost so much less. Maybe longer range and make it unable to move and fire, a super siege unit.

I don't hate the tempest. Really, as a protoss I am excited for any air unit that can fire, do a burst of damage and be microed away. Both the void ray and phoenix nickle and dime their targets to death.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
winthrop
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
Hong Kong956 Posts
January 31 2012 19:28 GMT
#316
rm colo
Incredible Miracle
ooozer
Profile Joined August 2011
Germany231 Posts
January 31 2012 19:29 GMT
#317
I like the Carrier as a unit, but I don't want it anymore. Making it just like it's bw counter part would suck for me. I want diversity. The carrier is a relict of the past. I don't really thing the Tempest fulfills this role though. Seems to one dimensional to me. It needs a unique skill, not just absurd dmg.
AfricanPsycho
Profile Joined December 2011
South Africa158 Posts
January 31 2012 19:33 GMT
#318
TBO the carriers serves no purpose any time the carrier is used you can always look at the game as say those resources could have been used better on other units. The real problem is the removal of the mothership, it has become almost nessesary lategame PvZ I fear it may break the matchup for good :_(
gg no re
Scarbo
Profile Joined January 2012
294 Posts
January 31 2012 19:39 GMT
#319
I think the problem is with the Colossus. Besides being an A-move boring unit, it forces tons of anti-air, thus rendering a switch to carriers unreasonable, unless you can suddenly pop 10 carriers out of nowhere, which is not possible in a realistic scenario. I say remove the Colossus (put something else there) and give carriers the ability to fire while moving.
Kharnage
Profile Joined September 2011
Australia920 Posts
January 31 2012 20:05 GMT
#320
On February 01 2012 04:39 Scarbo wrote:
I think the problem is with the Colossus. Besides being an A-move boring unit, it forces tons of anti-air, thus rendering a switch to carriers unreasonable, unless you can suddenly pop 10 carriers out of nowhere, which is not possible in a realistic scenario. I say remove the Colossus (put something else there) and give carriers the ability to fire while moving.


Why would it even be logical to transition from colossus into carrier? If the carrier was actually good and didn't take forever to build why not open VR into carrier with air upgrades? ie; 2 viable tech paths!

The problem isn't transitioning from colossus, it's that at certain timings Z and T can almost blindly start viking/corruptor production because regardless which tech path you're going (colossus or carrier) they are countered with the same units.
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