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On December 15 2011 12:04 chinese_paladin wrote:Show nested quote +On December 15 2011 12:03 deadmau wrote:
I dunno how these kids whining on TL didn't see this before, it was unprofessional & immature behavior, there was never a problem whatsoever with GOM's response. It was warranted, I'm sure anyone that has an education can see the merit in GOM's decision it's just PLAINLY obvious. When I see tons of responses crying foul, they seem to come from the reaction of children, not to say they are children. Just childish mindset, supporting Naniwa's amateur behavior.
How can any of you defend Naniwa, and still expect outsiders to see the legitimacy of SC2 as an e-Sport please tell me children, would this type of behavior ever be acceptable in any LEGITIMATE competition?? It's disrespectful plain and simple. Thank you.
Oh you know, Naniwa is a foreigner and foreigners should get special treatment if not GOM is not sympathetic to the plight in playing in Korea cause its too expensive/not worth it blah blah blah. And also GOM doesnt understand player emotions, they're tyrannical, expecting players to be robots and that they could be banned by typing "g" instead of "gg" etc. Oh! and also that koreans doing this might get a "lesser punishment" (....okay) compared to the punishment that naniwa is getting etc.
Stuff like that.
After all, your "favourite player" getting denied a Code S seed that was rightfully his (was it ever?) means that GOM is backing down on their promises etc. Doesn't matter that GOM wouldnt be able to answer to the other players/sponsors if they lack Naniwa off the hook, all that matters is the whinning and crying of these people posting on TL.
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On December 15 2011 12:07 RogerX wrote:
I just can't help but disagree with the punishment.
You have stated that what he has done wasn't against the rules but it only got you DISSAPOINTED; same as fans and other professional players. It was NOT against the rules therefore a punishment should not be necessary, the best you could've done was give him a warning. Please if you want to punish someone, add or change the rules.
Lemme also say this, how much worse is a cheese than a probe rush? As a personal fan I find that cheesing is a huge disapointment on my favourite players.
This is an unfair judgement, Naniwa is already under huge pressure and lost a lot of his fans, dissapointed his friends and his teammates.
And I find that your way of suddenly tricking the public on your promises very disrespectful, that ordeal is as bad as Naniwas action.
A rule judging how a player should play is not what this game is about.
Well most Cheesing requires thought and micro right? Didn't Naniwa just A move his workers to Nestea and watch his probes die? It wasn't probe rushing cheese. It was Naniwa showing he didn't care.
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On December 15 2011 12:07 RogerX wrote:
You have stated that what he has done wasn't against the rules but it only got you DISSAPOINTED; same as fans and other professional players. It was NOT against the rules therefore a punishment should not be necessary, the best you could've done was give him a warning. Please if you want to punish someone, add or change the rules.
I don't understand the sentiment that you need to explicitly have a rule against they isn't okay to do.
If there isn't a rule saying your tournament is a "joke tournament" in the chat are you not allowed to do anything about it?
If someone refuses to try and makes a point that he isn't doing so you need a rule to do anything about it?
If someone punches someone after they exit the booth can you not do anything if it's not in the rulebook?
etc. etc. reductio ad absurdum.
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On December 15 2011 12:11 diophan wrote:Show nested quote +On December 15 2011 12:07 RogerX wrote:
You have stated that what he has done wasn't against the rules but it only got you DISSAPOINTED; same as fans and other professional players. It was NOT against the rules therefore a punishment should not be necessary, the best you could've done was give him a warning. Please if you want to punish someone, add or change the rules.
I don't understand the sentiment that you need to explicitly have a rule against they isn't okay to do. If there isn't a rule saying your tournament is a "joke tournament" in the chat are you not allowed to do anything about it? If someone refuses to try and makes a point that he isn't doing so you need a rule to do anything about it? If someone punches someone after they exit the booth can you not do anything if it's in the rulebook? etc. etc. reductio ad absurdum.
if someone punches someone, that's against a different set of rules. like actual laws. examples like this are ridiculously silly
not to mention punching falls pretty cleanly under "abusive behavior" (there's a rule about that) in a way this doesn't
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On December 15 2011 12:05 teamsolid wrote:Show nested quote +On December 15 2011 11:55 LighT. wrote:On December 15 2011 11:48 teamsolid wrote:On December 15 2011 11:46 DeliCiousVP wrote:
Well now its official GOMTV looks down on foreigners, Who is more moneyhungry then Gom charging all the money in the world while having the "Free" view hours on the most inconvienent American hours? you think thats not intentional but maybe. This was an EMOTIONAL reaction from GOM.
Shame on you GOM be above the status quo. Yea, because if a Korean player pulled the same stunt, he wouldn't have gotten banned straight out from GSL... sigh First of all, you aren't following this issue quite informatively because naniwa isnt banned. He ended up being reconsidered a Code S sponsor spot which they were CONTEMPLATING On giving him. Naniwa WASNT a Code S player neither before or after the event... And he wouldn't have been banned from the GSL? Outside of the fact that he wasn't banned...That's your own personal opinion... So essentially what you're implying is that koreans are highly biased because of the fact that he's different nationalities.. Are you really bringing up the race card? You make me sick. Before you take that giant sigh, you might want to re-evaluate what post and what you want to say because this is the sort of posts which riles up people, ends up creating unnecessary drama in this forum. What you stated is such ignorant illogical/irrational comment...*shakes head* .... I feel embarrassed for you that you never learned what sarcasm is. I apologized like 5-6 posts up, again sorry ^^
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I agree with Jinro in that Naniwa should have been docked some of the money he got paid to play in the Blizzard Cup, not punished in an unrelated tournament. I also have a problem with the fact that if Naniwa instead did a two gate proxy at nestea's ramp or a retarded cannon rush which he then put no effort in and failed, then gg'd, nothing would have happened. His intent would have been the same, he just would have hidden it or "lied" better as Tyler put it. So basically at the end of the day Naniwa is being punished for not being subtle. There are plenty of other examples at other tournaments where it's fairly obvious players aren't putting in 100% and doing stupid things in dead rubber matches (including Nestea), but they manage to put in a bare minimum of effort and they get away with it.
So basically yeah what Naniwa did was wrong, but the reaction of GOMTV didn't fit the crime imo and they have to take even a *small* modicum of responsibility for putting those players in that situation. Frankly those comments by Mr Chae were pretty unprofessional as well and just made the whole thing worse.
Also deamau, stop being a prat. Anyone who disagrees with me is uneducated? Wtf man.
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Anyone waiting for a reply from MLG shouldn't hold their breath. And even if they do reply they are going to side with GOM wether they agree or not about the situation.
GOM has MLG by the balls and they know this. MLG will follow suit to whatever GOM decides to do, they have no choice and even if they did none of us would want them to go against GOM.
The Korean players are the reason MLG has gotten so big, without them all we would have is a better produced NASL
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On December 15 2011 12:02 karis wrote:Show nested quote +On December 15 2011 11:58 Vorenius wrote:On December 15 2011 11:54 hunts wrote:On December 15 2011 11:52 BlindSight754 wrote:On December 15 2011 11:51 mrtomjones wrote:On December 15 2011 11:42 Tyrant0 wrote:On December 15 2011 11:39 FallDownMarigold wrote:On December 15 2011 11:35 skipgamer wrote:
This was bad PR GSL, you should have just come out and said "yes, we revoked Naniwa's code S status."
Now MLG/Quantic/Lawyers have a chance to fight back and say, "he earned his spot, he has to be let play."
This could get veeeery veeeery interesting Haven't bothered to check but is MLG/Quantic actually bringing legal action against Gom? Or is this just totally random/meaningless? It's completely speculation on what they COULD do. It's way too late, they'll never go back now. They're going to salvage whatever PR they can and take GOM up the ass, which sucks because GOM is basically standing firm over their fuck ups and aren't being held accountable. gom made vitually no fuckups. Except for the lying about the Code S spot. they didn't lie, you should probably get your facts straight or wait for a statement from MLG before accusing a company of lying. It's clear from the announcements that GOM promised a Code S spot from all Pro Circuit competitions in 2011. No they are suddenly saying there was no Code S spot on the line at Providence. That is lying. in my opinion it reads that gom promised a code s spot guaranteed for 2011 events. since the gsl season is over i don't have a problem with them deciding they were going to change the format.
It's not really open to interpretation so it doesn't matter what your opinion is.
It clear states that a Code S invite will be given "At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus"
Providence is a 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition yet no Code S invite will be given.
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Naniwa just got slapped a bbc [co.uk - lol wut] (GOM TV) jk
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This statement is very good, but I still feel like there was fault on both sides and right now only Naniwa is taking consequences.
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GOM laying down the law. I find this explanation quite satisfactory.
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On December 15 2011 12:13 DrunkenTemplar wrote:
I agree with Jinro in that Naniwa should have been docked some of the money he got paid to play in the Blizzard Cup, not punished in an unrelated tournament. I also have a problem with the fact that if Naniwa instead did a two gate proxy at nestea's ramp or a retarded cannon rush which he then put no effort in and failed, then gg'd, nothing would have happened. His intent would have been the same, he just would have hidden it or "lied" better as Tyler put it. So basically at the end of the day Naniwa is being punished for not being subtle. There are plenty of other examples at other tournaments where it's fairly obvious players aren't putting in 100% and doing stupid things in dead rubber matches (including Nestea), but they manage to put in a bare minimum of effort and they get away with it.
So basically yeah what Naniwa did was wrong, but the reaction of GOMTV didn't fit the crime imo and they have to take even a *small* modicum of responsibility for putting those players in that situation. Frankly those comments by Mr Chae were pretty unprofessional as well and just made the whole thing worse.
Also deamau, stop being a prat. Anyone who disagrees with me is uneducated? Wtf man.
I wish to disagree on a few points. The players were paid to just participate, and had a chance to win more, so regardless of whether wanting to play, or whether not having the chance to win more, I feel like they should put some effort because they have been paid to do so.
Secondly, any crime, not saying that what Naniwa did is a crime, is only punishable when caught. So yes, subtlety and hiding helps in all circumstances like that. At least you have an excuse.
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On December 15 2011 12:13 Vorenius wrote:Show nested quote +On December 15 2011 12:02 karis wrote:On December 15 2011 11:58 Vorenius wrote:On December 15 2011 11:54 hunts wrote:On December 15 2011 11:52 BlindSight754 wrote:On December 15 2011 11:51 mrtomjones wrote:On December 15 2011 11:42 Tyrant0 wrote:On December 15 2011 11:39 FallDownMarigold wrote:On December 15 2011 11:35 skipgamer wrote:
This was bad PR GSL, you should have just come out and said "yes, we revoked Naniwa's code S status."
Now MLG/Quantic/Lawyers have a chance to fight back and say, "he earned his spot, he has to be let play."
This could get veeeery veeeery interesting Haven't bothered to check but is MLG/Quantic actually bringing legal action against Gom? Or is this just totally random/meaningless? It's completely speculation on what they COULD do. It's way too late, they'll never go back now. They're going to salvage whatever PR they can and take GOM up the ass, which sucks because GOM is basically standing firm over their fuck ups and aren't being held accountable. gom made vitually no fuckups. Except for the lying about the Code S spot. they didn't lie, you should probably get your facts straight or wait for a statement from MLG before accusing a company of lying. It's clear from the announcements that GOM promised a Code S spot from all Pro Circuit competitions in 2011. No they are suddenly saying there was no Code S spot on the line at Providence. That is lying. in my opinion it reads that gom promised a code s spot guaranteed for 2011 events. since the gsl season is over i don't have a problem with them deciding they were going to change the format. It's not really open to interpretation so it doesn't matter what your opinion is. It clear states that a Code S invite will be given "At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus"Providence is a 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition yet no Code S invite will be given. To be fair if you really want to be strict about it MLG's side also stated
"MLG will invite four Korean pro players to each Pro Circuit Live Competition.
These players will be placed directly into the Championship Pools, one into each Pool.
Their placement in the Pools will be determined by their GSL rank.
All travel and accommodation expenses for these players will be provided by MLG."
Yet there were no pools cause it was a different format, MC, MMA & Bomber were seeded based on their own MLG points and MVP had to fight through the open bracket. (supposedly MVP's trip was also paid for by Quantic not MLG)
Clearly at Providence the exchange wasn't in full effect, if at all.
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On December 15 2011 12:07 BlindSight754 wrote:
Probe rushing = controversial game with excessive drama
All-in half hearted cheese = shitty game, no drama
eSports has now grown. Progamers now know the correct way to throw a meaningless game. Thanks GSL and Naniwa!
Oh my god. I think I just fell in love!  Really though this is so fucking done now it's not even funny, this post sums it up beautifully. We all learned from this yay!
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On December 15 2011 12:13 magnaflow wrote:
Anyone waiting for a reply from MLG shouldn't hold their breath. And even if they do reply they are going to side with GOM wether they agree or not about the situation.
GOM has MLG by the balls and they know this. MLG will follow suit to whatever GOM decides to do, they have no choice and even if they did none of us would want them to go against GOM.
The Korean players are the reason MLG has gotten so big, without them all we would have is a better produced NASL
It would be interesting to see what would happen to MLG if no Koreans turned up, actually. I think it might have established itself well enough now that it can run big events on reputation alone.
Or maybe you're right and they'd suffer a big drop in viewership.
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Umm... a lot of what the OP just said goes against all their previous press releases and all of MLG's previous press releases on the matter.
OP is literally lying.
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GOM never released a statement saying that Naniwa got code S, it was always MLG that said it. People should stop crapping on GOM for what MLG said. We need to wait for MLG's official position on this matter to get the whole picture. It is entirely possible that there was miscommunication between GOM and MLG.
Second, GOM released their new GSL format back in OCTOBER which clearly indicates two international seed invites. Nowhere does it mention the exchange program with MLG. In any case, I'm leaning towards GOM and MLG not communication this well enough to the community rather than GOM lying about it.
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On December 15 2011 12:23 hmunkey wrote:
Umm... a lot of what the OP just said goes against all their previous press releases and all of MLG's previous press releases on the matter.
OP is literally lying.
Can you please elaborate your point?
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On December 15 2011 12:23 SojuPrime wrote:Show nested quote +On December 15 2011 12:23 hmunkey wrote:
Umm... a lot of what the OP just said goes against all their previous press releases and all of MLG's previous press releases on the matter.
OP is literally lying.
Can you please elaborate your point?
here. http://www.gomtv.net/2011gslsponsors3/news/65291
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That's actually a pretty lame response, just like i expected it. They think they're 100% correct and only blame NaNiwa.
can't agree anymore
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EPT
