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Please discuss IdrA and Sen in Code S January in this thread. |
On December 14 2011 19:54 Lior wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 19:53 aebriol wrote:On December 14 2011 19:49 Lior wrote:
If Gom bans Nani for this, I expect EVERY SINGLE PERSON WHO CHEESES TO BE BANNED FROM NOW ON.
... even if they win the matches? How stupid are you? Does all caps make it smarter? What Naniwa did wasn't a cheese, it was a forfeit. There's a difference. The point is, they aren't trying their 'hardest'.
at least they're trying
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Look how they throw you all a bone to make you dance after their pipe. Just shows you what condescending and cynical attitude they have to their "foreign" market.
SC 2 is dying in Korea and it can't die soon enough.
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On December 14 2011 19:52 Ryuu314 wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 19:49 Lior wrote:On December 14 2011 19:44 Ghanburighan wrote:On December 14 2011 19:41 Lior wrote:On December 14 2011 19:40 aebriol wrote:On December 14 2011 19:37 Serpico wrote:On December 14 2011 19:37 Lior wrote:On December 14 2011 19:31 BloodThirsty wrote:On December 14 2011 19:28 Redox wrote:On December 14 2011 19:26 BloodThirsty wrote:
[quote]
because you don't care enough about the sc2 esports growing potential is why you dont understand, if you did you would be offended. He needs to grow up and when invited to one of the biggest tournaments of the year. YOU PLAY YOUR HEART OUT NO MATTER WHAT. If hes not punished then he possibly could do it again in something to do with code s if he goes down 1-0 he just throws the match because he wants to go home and cry There are numerous examples of people NOT playing their heart out no matter what in high profile tournemants. This includes Idra btw, who has just been invited for unclear reasons into code S. BECAUSE you are being completely IGNORANT to the korean culture and pro gaming. They CANNOT show weakness on this issue with the background issues they have had lately in the industry. Pro gaming is a SPORT in korea its televised, its still growing, THEY are trying to still GET fans from brood war to come over to Sc2 and dont need some little brat not even giving them a show to get fans to pay for PRIZES that naniwa needs to even have anything to play for. So...why haven't they taken action against Choya, Byun or Coca? Who have done far worse things than Nani? Please do explain, since you know so much about Korean culture. Probably because what naniwa did was more visible even if it was much less severe than what choya did (purposefully cheating the system). I'd argue that what Choya did wasn't purposefully cheating the system, it was childish and immature and him thinking it was perfectly fine at that time because he didn't do anything but make sure he got placed where the actual system meant for him to be (skill wise), and it was just meaningless ladder (as we all refer to it). Much like I think what Naniwa did was childish and immature. I'd argue that ladder actually has more meaning than that game did. I'd argue against you because of: a) Hyped storyline b) Tons of viewers tuning in for that scheduled match c) GSL points being on the line d) Determining the loser of the group. I probably missed something just because I've had to write it so many times. And what Choya did was to influence his qualification into GSL. Same for the Coca/Byun incident. You think this is worse than what can be pretty much considered match fixing? In both cases? What was basically a meaningless game that was either a 4 gate, nexus first or probe rush? Wow. If Gom bans Nani for this, I expect EVERY SINGLE PERSON WHO CHEESES TO BE BANNED FROM NOW ON. There's a difference between cheese and worker rush. Cheese has a chance to win. Worker rush does not. Only way worker rush wins is if your opponent is lower than bronze. I agree with Naniwa's ban. GOM has banned people for childish and immature behavior with a 1 season ban before. I don't agree with the public humiliation of Naniwa by Mr. Chae and I don't agree with Idra and Sen invite as it's completely undeserved.
Sure, worker rush and cheese are different. But the point is that the player cheesing, technically isn't trying their hardest. You see how banning someone because of such stupid shit leads to a slippery slope?
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I can understand the reasoning behind kicking naniwa out, but inviting idra in the same breath is a joke - he regularily throws games away just like naniwa did (he may ask for def win or build some stuff just to ragequit once his first scouting informations come in, but it is absolutely the same) and he often stated that he doesn't enjoy the game and is only in it for the money - so why would you replace one "amateur price money hunter" with another?
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On December 14 2011 19:54 Oktyabr wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 19:52 Ace.Xile wrote:On December 14 2011 19:48 aebriol wrote:
... I think people are again confusing separate issues.
1) It's up to the team to give additional penalties. Huk writing that they would get kicked out of team house etc ... maybe sure but that's the right of the team. They can do whatever they want.
2) GOM has previously punished childish and immature behavior (Choya) by ban of 1 season (next tournament). They did the exact same thing with Naniwa for pretty much the same behavior (childish and immature).
If anything, that's being consistent and fair. Choya 100% cheated the GSL system if i remembe and was subsequently banned from GSTL Naniwa doesn't care about a meaningless game and gets banned from GSL. They are two entirely different things. He didn't need to cheat to get into the GSL. The ladder incident was in Janurary and he was in the GSL all the way until May when he got knocked out,.
It's irrelevant to say that he didn't need to cheat, because... he did. Savior didn't need to cheat... but he did.
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On December 14 2011 19:24 Angelbelow wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 19:19 Talin wrote:On December 14 2011 19:12 Angelbelow wrote:On December 14 2011 19:08 Talin wrote:On December 14 2011 19:04 Angelbelow wrote:On December 14 2011 19:03 Talin wrote:On December 14 2011 19:00 Gezz wrote:
A suspension was definitely the right choice. People are saying IdrA forfeits meaningless games regularly but I can never see him doing it for a planned BROADCASTED grudge match. Seeing as its broadcasted it matters to all the viewers and makes GOM look bad. 100% standing behind GOM on this one. Naniwa is under no obligation to make GOM look good, nor is it his business to care about how they will look. If GOM is going to pick players based on which players they like the most and which players make them look good and bring them more money then that is a show, not a legitimate competition. GOMTV has rules (albeit ambiguous) to argue that naniwa does have to make them look good. Recalling some of your posts in the past, its surprises me that you side with naniwa THIS heavily. GOM would still look good if they didn't make beginners' mistakes in designing their tournament format. Which posts specifically? As far as I remember, I always support the players over organizations (teams/tournaments). Whether I like their behaviour and decisions or not is another issue entirely, and I don't like Naniwa's attitude either in other circumstances, but that's not the point here. You have a lot of post so I cant recall them specifically, but my point is that I generally get a positive impression of your posts. Meaning that they are well thought out and not over/unreasonably biased. Its okay to support players over tournaments but there should be a limit. I like Naniwa a lot too and I honestly think him getting banned from code s is too harsh. However he fucked up with his behavior so I was expecting some kind of punishment. A lot of fans have argued that what he did was okay given the format or his emotion, but I havent seen any professional player, caster, management condone his behavior.. and thats something we should take into consideration here. They find it unacceptable for a big reason. My opinion is really similar to Tyler's for this specific issue, so yeah in a way there are people involved with the scene that think the same thing. Even Idra tweeted the same thing (according to this thread, somebody mentioned it). Naniwa came off as an ass far too many times, but this really wasn't an issue of behaviour - he didn't act maliciously towards anyone, he didn't directly offend anyone, it wasn't like when he typed "this tournament is a joke" at MLG. He just played out a game in a way that he found the most natural given his mindset and psychological state as a player in that moment. The most important thing in Starcraft is to respect the competitor's integrity, which is why I heavily support Naniwa in this specific incident - because that's really what the incident was all about - a competitor having to "fake" playing a meaningless game just for show (fans/viewers/sponsors) when he's not psychologically capable of playing a game. The moment the entertainment / business side takes priority because that's what generates money is the moment competitive Starcraft loses any meaning whatsoever. Agreed on Tyler, i thought his opinion was the best response to the situation. I don't feel like he should have been suspended from Jan. But Tyler also said that he wouldn't condone what Naniwa did. But I actually think what Naniwa did goes against a competitors integrity. In this department, I thought incontrol had solid points as well. This is not the best way for naniwa to dispute the tournament format and what he did was detrimental to his reputation. Business entertainment side is taking over if you want SC2 to be sustainable. Whether you like it or not, progamers do what they do BECAUSE a business and entertainment aspect exists. Your point of view is a very honorable and idealistic approach to sc2, which makes me even more curious why youre supporting naniwas disrespectful behavior.
But he didn't do it to dispute the tournament format. I don't think Naniwa is an idealist to the point where he would do something like that just to show how much of a joke the format was. He did it because at that moment he just wasn't capable of playing a proper game and that was the most intuitive way for him to play that game out. I can't imagine a way in which you can force somebody who is both mentally and physically exhausted to sit down and play out a good game for no competitive reason whatsoever, and asking them to fake it for the sake of the show is really disrespectful to begin with.
Nani's actions are just a consequence of a horrible situation he was forced into by the tournament organizer. Again, I'm not supporting his behaviour, I"m supporting my own principle that GOM's actions disagree with and Naniwa's actions (kind of) agree with. The only angle of Naniwa's actions that I dislike is that what he did was very disrespectful to NesTea - that's really the ONLY thing that stung about it for me. I don't think it was disrespectful to anyone else. Even if I were to entertain the notion that it was, the whole situation happened because he wasn't being respected as a competitor in the first place and was put into a booth just to play for show.
As for the business side taking over, how good that is is very debatable. Most conventional sports existed for decades, if not over a hundred of years, before tons of cash started being thrown into them. It's much more difficult for businesses to change or twist the rules, standards and conventions established in other sports just to bring in more viewers and income. Starcraft as a scene (separate from the business side) is really young and fragile. If we just let the companies that want to profit off of it have their way with it and do whatever they want and whatever makes things more profitable for them without consequences, Starcraft 2 will not last very long at all. It's not like the western esports "industry" is known for long lasting commitments to a game - they take a title, chew it, spit it out, and move over to the next one.
On a personal level don't really care to be honest. I still watch foreign Brood War (more than the Korean one even) with occasional $100 tournaments, and I was just as super pumped when Sziky beat a Korean ex-progamer in the clan league recently as when Hero won DH in front of 4k people cheering in the arena. Being popular is cool, having an audience of that size is awesome, and I do appreciate the fact that players are getting paid for the work they put into the game. But at the same time, if such a high level of sponsorship undermines the core values of competitive Starcraft and when we have an example Naniwa who worked his way there and showed amazing games has to step down and someone gets to replace him because he has a strong Taiwanese following and brings in viewers, and if players are supposed to be entertainers as well as athletes - it's just not worth it for me as a fan any more.
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On December 14 2011 19:55 Dr.Dragoon wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 19:54 Lior wrote:On December 14 2011 19:53 aebriol wrote:On December 14 2011 19:49 Lior wrote:
If Gom bans Nani for this, I expect EVERY SINGLE PERSON WHO CHEESES TO BE BANNED FROM NOW ON.
... even if they win the matches? How stupid are you? Does all caps make it smarter? What Naniwa did wasn't a cheese, it was a forfeit. There's a difference. The point is, they aren't trying their 'hardest'. at least they're trying
Well, Nani did walk his probes all the way to Nestea's base instead of killing his own Nexus. So he was trying.
Funny how that works, huh?
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Seeker
Where dat snitch at?37025 Posts
On December 14 2011 19:54 Lior wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 19:53 aebriol wrote:On December 14 2011 19:49 Lior wrote:
If Gom bans Nani for this, I expect EVERY SINGLE PERSON WHO CHEESES TO BE BANNED FROM NOW ON.
... even if they win the matches? How stupid are you? Does all caps make it smarter? What Naniwa did wasn't a cheese, it was a forfeit. There's a difference. The point is, they aren't trying their 'hardest'.
-_- Naniwa "a" moved to NesTea's base, didn't bother microing. He wasn't playing to win. He played so the game would end quick so that he can leave.
Other players realize, "hey, this strat can get me the victory! And, I can catch my opponent off guard!"
big difference....
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On December 14 2011 19:52 Ace.Xile wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 19:48 aebriol wrote:
... I think people are again confusing separate issues.
1) It's up to the team to give additional penalties. Huk writing that they would get kicked out of team house etc ... maybe sure but that's the right of the team. They can do whatever they want.
2) GOM has previously punished childish and immature behavior (Choya) by ban of 1 season (next tournament). They did the exact same thing with Naniwa for pretty much the same behavior (childish and immature).
If anything, that's being consistent and fair. Choya 100% cheated to get into GSL and was subsequently banned from GSTL Naniwa doesn't care about a meaningless game and gets banned from GSL. They are two entirely different things.
Choya may have cheated, but my view is, he didn't want to play a lot of meaningless matches to get rid of his bonus pool and he was - by far - able to qualify for the GSL. He simply didn't want to waste his time playing 50 or so meaningless matches to get rid of his bonus pool.
You may call that cheating, but to me, it was just childish and immature because he didn't think it mattered. He didn't cheat to get higher points than he had earned, he just got rid of his bonus pool to get placed where the actual battle.net system decided he was when just considering his skill.
Naniwa threw a televised hyped and anticipated match in an official tournament because he was childish and immature and didn't think it mattered.
While they are not the same, I think they are - mostly - about the same thing. Stupid immature and childish behavior by players not smart enough to realize that it's wrong, because 'they know' that the match is meaningless, they assume no one will care - even though they should know better.
So I think GOM is punishing them the same way (ban for the next season) is treating them the same ... because, GOM doesn't have a lot of other ways to punish them. What else can they do? Ban them for multiple seasons? Do nothing? What else?
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The punishment to Naniwa is pretty harsh, but I think one of the big reasons they did it is to make an example of it. Players aren't gonna risk a Code S spot just so they don't have to play a game they don't want/have to.
I'm excited to see Sen and IdrA, though. Sen had a good run in Code S until he ran into Nestea's ZvZ, which at the time was literally unbeatable. Sen was pretty close to taking games. And IdrA is IdrA. Almost everyone likes watching his games.
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On December 14 2011 19:56 Seeker wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 19:54 Lior wrote:On December 14 2011 19:53 aebriol wrote:On December 14 2011 19:49 Lior wrote:
If Gom bans Nani for this, I expect EVERY SINGLE PERSON WHO CHEESES TO BE BANNED FROM NOW ON.
... even if they win the matches? How stupid are you? Does all caps make it smarter? What Naniwa did wasn't a cheese, it was a forfeit. There's a difference. The point is, they aren't trying their 'hardest'. -_- Naniwa "a" moved to NesTea's base, didn't bother microing. He wasn't playing to win. He played so the game would end quick so that he can leave. Other players realize, "hey, this strat can get me the victory! And, I can catch my opponent off guard!" big difference....
Nope. Imagine if Nestea went for a six pool and Nani got there with his workers? Maybe this was a strat Nani planned!...
And it's the same thing you're talking about.
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So GOM just turns a blind eye to the game Nestea threw against MVP at blizzcon? I also fail to see how this is any different when a team in football takes a knee when they are in the lead with a few minuets left in the 4th quarter.
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On December 14 2011 19:54 trucane wrote:
What a joke giving the spot to someone like IdrA. Not only is Idra playing horrible bad lately but he is also so bad mannered and racist that i don't see why GOM would give the spot to him.
GOM quickly turning out to be the bigger joke between Kespa and GOM
Did you just call Idra a racist?
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On December 14 2011 19:51 Lior wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 19:48 Oktyabr wrote:On December 14 2011 19:39 Lior wrote:On December 14 2011 19:37 Serpico wrote:On December 14 2011 19:37 Lior wrote:On December 14 2011 19:31 BloodThirsty wrote:On December 14 2011 19:28 Redox wrote:On December 14 2011 19:26 BloodThirsty wrote:On December 14 2011 19:05 Blardy wrote:On December 14 2011 18:56 Confuse wrote:
To all the people announcing you won't pay for GSL anymore: There are probably more viewers who were offended enough by what Nani did to say the same thing if he was still invited. It was probably a correct business decision. With that said, strict professionalism in BW (as ridiculous as it was) worked, I'm sure some discipline won't hurt the SC2 community. I just can't comprehend how someone could be offended by the Naniwa vs Nestea game. because you don't care enough about the sc2 esports growing potential is why you dont understand, if you did you would be offended. He needs to grow up and when invited to one of the biggest tournaments of the year. YOU PLAY YOUR HEART OUT NO MATTER WHAT. If hes not punished then he possibly could do it again in something to do with code s if he goes down 1-0 he just throws the match because he wants to go home and cry There are numerous examples of people NOT playing their heart out no matter what in high profile tournemants. This includes Idra btw, who has just been invited for unclear reasons into code S. BECAUSE you are being completely IGNORANT to the korean culture and pro gaming. They CANNOT show weakness on this issue with the background issues they have had lately in the industry. Pro gaming is a SPORT in korea its televised, its still growing, THEY are trying to still GET fans from brood war to come over to Sc2 and dont need some little brat not even giving them a show to get fans to pay for PRIZES that naniwa needs to even have anything to play for. So...why haven't they taken action against Choya, Byun or Coca? Who have done far worse things than Nani? Please do explain, since you know so much about Korean culture. Probably because what naniwa did was more visible even if it was much less severe than what choya did (purposefully cheating the system). Oh, so it's ok to do it if fewer people notice? Go GOM. Because none of what they did happened in the GSL? The only punishment that GOM could give Coca was already given by the Slayers house, and Byun wasn't even in the GSL. Choya got banned for 1 season in the GSL when his actions didn't even affect the GSL, if anything, GOM was unduly way more harsh on Choya than Naniwa. It affected the qualification system for the GSL, this matters way more for the GSL than what Nani did. Read up, understand the issues, then you can talk, until then, please stop posting misinformation.
How about YOU read up a little bit?
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=184044
Talk about posting misinformation, lol.
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On December 14 2011 19:58 Qaatar wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 19:51 Lior wrote:On December 14 2011 19:48 Oktyabr wrote:On December 14 2011 19:39 Lior wrote:On December 14 2011 19:37 Serpico wrote:On December 14 2011 19:37 Lior wrote:On December 14 2011 19:31 BloodThirsty wrote:On December 14 2011 19:28 Redox wrote:On December 14 2011 19:26 BloodThirsty wrote:On December 14 2011 19:05 Blardy wrote:
[quote]
I just can't comprehend how someone could be offended by the Naniwa vs Nestea game.
because you don't care enough about the sc2 esports growing potential is why you dont understand, if you did you would be offended. He needs to grow up and when invited to one of the biggest tournaments of the year. YOU PLAY YOUR HEART OUT NO MATTER WHAT. If hes not punished then he possibly could do it again in something to do with code s if he goes down 1-0 he just throws the match because he wants to go home and cry There are numerous examples of people NOT playing their heart out no matter what in high profile tournemants. This includes Idra btw, who has just been invited for unclear reasons into code S. BECAUSE you are being completely IGNORANT to the korean culture and pro gaming. They CANNOT show weakness on this issue with the background issues they have had lately in the industry. Pro gaming is a SPORT in korea its televised, its still growing, THEY are trying to still GET fans from brood war to come over to Sc2 and dont need some little brat not even giving them a show to get fans to pay for PRIZES that naniwa needs to even have anything to play for. So...why haven't they taken action against Choya, Byun or Coca? Who have done far worse things than Nani? Please do explain, since you know so much about Korean culture. Probably because what naniwa did was more visible even if it was much less severe than what choya did (purposefully cheating the system). Oh, so it's ok to do it if fewer people notice? Go GOM. Because none of what they did happened in the GSL? The only punishment that GOM could give Coca was already given by the Slayers house, and Byun wasn't even in the GSL. Choya got banned for 1 season in the GSL when his actions didn't even affect the GSL, if anything, GOM was unduly way more harsh on Choya than Naniwa. It affected the qualification system for the GSL, this matters way more for the GSL than what Nani did. Read up, understand the issues, then you can talk, until then, please stop posting misinformation. How about YOU read up a little bit? http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=184044Talk about posting misinformation, lol.
You don't remember how the GSL had that pre-requisite for the offline quals that was based on ladder, do you?..
It doesn't matter whether he actually needed it or not, Savior didn't need to match fix and still he's banned from all things Starcraft.
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Seeker
Where dat snitch at?37025 Posts
On December 14 2011 19:57 Lior wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 19:56 Seeker wrote:On December 14 2011 19:54 Lior wrote:On December 14 2011 19:53 aebriol wrote:On December 14 2011 19:49 Lior wrote:
If Gom bans Nani for this, I expect EVERY SINGLE PERSON WHO CHEESES TO BE BANNED FROM NOW ON.
... even if they win the matches? How stupid are you? Does all caps make it smarter? What Naniwa did wasn't a cheese, it was a forfeit. There's a difference. The point is, they aren't trying their 'hardest'. -_- Naniwa "a" moved to NesTea's base, didn't bother microing. He wasn't playing to win. He played so the game would end quick so that he can leave. Other players realize, "hey, this strat can get me the victory! And, I can catch my opponent off guard!" big difference.... Nope. Imagine if Nestea went for a six pool and Nani got there with his workers? Maybe this was a strat Nani planned!... And it's the same thing you're talking about.
Go try it out with a friend. Tell your friend to six pool and u head over there with six probes. Tell me how it turns out. No P in their right mind would EVER do that
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On December 14 2011 19:59 Lior wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 19:58 Qaatar wrote:On December 14 2011 19:51 Lior wrote:On December 14 2011 19:48 Oktyabr wrote:On December 14 2011 19:39 Lior wrote:On December 14 2011 19:37 Serpico wrote:On December 14 2011 19:37 Lior wrote:On December 14 2011 19:31 BloodThirsty wrote:On December 14 2011 19:28 Redox wrote:On December 14 2011 19:26 BloodThirsty wrote:
[quote]
because you don't care enough about the sc2 esports growing potential is why you dont understand, if you did you would be offended. He needs to grow up and when invited to one of the biggest tournaments of the year. YOU PLAY YOUR HEART OUT NO MATTER WHAT. If hes not punished then he possibly could do it again in something to do with code s if he goes down 1-0 he just throws the match because he wants to go home and cry There are numerous examples of people NOT playing their heart out no matter what in high profile tournemants. This includes Idra btw, who has just been invited for unclear reasons into code S. BECAUSE you are being completely IGNORANT to the korean culture and pro gaming. They CANNOT show weakness on this issue with the background issues they have had lately in the industry. Pro gaming is a SPORT in korea its televised, its still growing, THEY are trying to still GET fans from brood war to come over to Sc2 and dont need some little brat not even giving them a show to get fans to pay for PRIZES that naniwa needs to even have anything to play for. So...why haven't they taken action against Choya, Byun or Coca? Who have done far worse things than Nani? Please do explain, since you know so much about Korean culture. Probably because what naniwa did was more visible even if it was much less severe than what choya did (purposefully cheating the system). Oh, so it's ok to do it if fewer people notice? Go GOM. Because none of what they did happened in the GSL? The only punishment that GOM could give Coca was already given by the Slayers house, and Byun wasn't even in the GSL. Choya got banned for 1 season in the GSL when his actions didn't even affect the GSL, if anything, GOM was unduly way more harsh on Choya than Naniwa. It affected the qualification system for the GSL, this matters way more for the GSL than what Nani did. Read up, understand the issues, then you can talk, until then, please stop posting misinformation. How about YOU read up a little bit? http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=184044Talk about posting misinformation, lol. You don't remember how the GSL had that pre-requisite for the offline quals that was based on ladder, do you?..
Again, did you read the post? Choya was already Code S when he did this. And, he was banned from the GSTL up until the end of this entire year. Granted, he was already making the switch to coaching, but that's pretty harsh.
Edit: apparently, they later ameliorated the punishment to just one season, but banning him until 12/31/2011 was the original verdict.
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On December 14 2011 19:57 Lior wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 19:56 Seeker wrote:On December 14 2011 19:54 Lior wrote:On December 14 2011 19:53 aebriol wrote:On December 14 2011 19:49 Lior wrote:
If Gom bans Nani for this, I expect EVERY SINGLE PERSON WHO CHEESES TO BE BANNED FROM NOW ON.
... even if they win the matches? How stupid are you? Does all caps make it smarter? What Naniwa did wasn't a cheese, it was a forfeit. There's a difference. The point is, they aren't trying their 'hardest'. -_- Naniwa "a" moved to NesTea's base, didn't bother microing. He wasn't playing to win. He played so the game would end quick so that he can leave. Other players realize, "hey, this strat can get me the victory! And, I can catch my opponent off guard!" big difference.... Nope. Imagine if Nestea went for a six pool and Nani got there with his workers? Maybe this was a strat Nani planned!... And it's the same thing you're talking about.
nope, your reading comprehension is failing you, you don't understand what he's talking about at all.
he's clarifying the distinction between a cheese (strategic) build and a forfeit (sending probes and going afk)
and for the record, a six pool can just cancel and make 3+ drones and still beat zero micro probe rush easily.
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On December 14 2011 19:57 Amlitzer wrote:
So GOM just turns a blind eye to the game Nestea threw against MVP at blizzcon? I also fail to see how this is any different when a team in football takes a knee when they are in the lead with a few minuets left in the 4th quarter.
... he threw a game with $25 000 on the line? Or whatever it was? How fucking stupid would that be?
People just need to stop assuming NesTea always make the right and perfect choices ... he simply didn't know how far ahead he was, and got scared because he couldn't break MvP and made a couple of bad calls.
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On December 14 2011 19:59 Lior wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 19:58 Qaatar wrote:On December 14 2011 19:51 Lior wrote:On December 14 2011 19:48 Oktyabr wrote:On December 14 2011 19:39 Lior wrote:On December 14 2011 19:37 Serpico wrote:On December 14 2011 19:37 Lior wrote:On December 14 2011 19:31 BloodThirsty wrote:On December 14 2011 19:28 Redox wrote:On December 14 2011 19:26 BloodThirsty wrote:
[quote]
because you don't care enough about the sc2 esports growing potential is why you dont understand, if you did you would be offended. He needs to grow up and when invited to one of the biggest tournaments of the year. YOU PLAY YOUR HEART OUT NO MATTER WHAT. If hes not punished then he possibly could do it again in something to do with code s if he goes down 1-0 he just throws the match because he wants to go home and cry There are numerous examples of people NOT playing their heart out no matter what in high profile tournemants. This includes Idra btw, who has just been invited for unclear reasons into code S. BECAUSE you are being completely IGNORANT to the korean culture and pro gaming. They CANNOT show weakness on this issue with the background issues they have had lately in the industry. Pro gaming is a SPORT in korea its televised, its still growing, THEY are trying to still GET fans from brood war to come over to Sc2 and dont need some little brat not even giving them a show to get fans to pay for PRIZES that naniwa needs to even have anything to play for. So...why haven't they taken action against Choya, Byun or Coca? Who have done far worse things than Nani? Please do explain, since you know so much about Korean culture. Probably because what naniwa did was more visible even if it was much less severe than what choya did (purposefully cheating the system). Oh, so it's ok to do it if fewer people notice? Go GOM. Because none of what they did happened in the GSL? The only punishment that GOM could give Coca was already given by the Slayers house, and Byun wasn't even in the GSL. Choya got banned for 1 season in the GSL when his actions didn't even affect the GSL, if anything, GOM was unduly way more harsh on Choya than Naniwa. It affected the qualification system for the GSL, this matters way more for the GSL than what Nani did. Read up, understand the issues, then you can talk, until then, please stop posting misinformation. How about YOU read up a little bit? http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=184044Talk about posting misinformation, lol. You don't remember how the GSL had that pre-requisite for the offline quals that was based on ladder, do you?..
Dude, Choya was ALREADY qualified. Whose spot did he steal? Now you're pulling random shit out of your ass. The ladder argument brought up then was used as a deterrence to anyone who decided that this might be a legit way to turn up for GSL offline qualifiers. Choya was NOT such a candidate during that period of time. Please, get informed.
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EPT
