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On October 23 2011 11:40 WhiteDog wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2011 11:37 nazdrovie wrote:On October 23 2011 11:26 WhiteDog wrote:On October 23 2011 11:20 nazdrovie wrote:On October 23 2011 11:18 WhiteDog wrote:On October 23 2011 11:16 nazdrovie wrote:On October 23 2011 11:08 canikizu wrote:On October 23 2011 10:42 nazdrovie wrote:On October 23 2011 10:38 Scribble wrote:On October 23 2011 10:36 nazdrovie wrote:
[quote]
It's rather hard to walk out of a fungal... some would say impossible. "Why not just spread your units out." Maybe you can't walk out of a cloud while fungaled, but you can just avoid getting everything fungaled and blinded at once. (= It's not this simple  even by spreading your units out you can't stop your opponent from dropping a couple of nice fungals and completely negating those units by placing a cloud over it.. "just walk out" "just spread your units out" just lol, its like saying you can survive storm with lings as long as you spread them out... Or you can, you know, replicate the those dudes, then cloud and fungal them back. Better yet, cloud, fungal, and storm their asses. Thats the point though, this is completely retarded: having a unit which can only be countered properly by a replica of that same unit makes no sense, it's probably the worst way you could possibly balance things out. You make vipers, okay so I have to get replicants to clone your vipers so I have a chance against them? Am I the only one who thinks this pants on retarded? Seriously, the replicant is retarded, but you're idea that the viper is imba is retarded too. The protoss community on TL should stop crying ho my god, that's worst than ever. When did I call it imba? never. I'm just saying it's terrible design to have to copy a unit from another race to counter it properly...
Actually that's what Protoss having been complaining about for the past year.
OMG VIKING IMBA WE SHOULD HAVE OUR LONG RANGE UNIT TOO.
OMG INFESTOR IMBA THEY STOLE OUR MASS CONFUSION AND MIND CONTROL
You obviously don't understand a word I've said No I think you obviously don't understand what I've said. Nowhere it is said that you will have to use the replicant to counter the viper. Aside from feedback and killing the viper, the only way save a unit that has been hooked is to have your own vipers and hook it back... I thought this was obvious. You whole idea of "omg you can go out of the cloud because of the fungal" is also kinda retarded. If you get fungalled then cloud, just put a wall of FF between you and the zerg army until the end of the fungal then reposition yourself ? have you forgotten about baneling + overlords? There is a ton of ways to prevent the scenario you are talking about from happening. The viper is a air unit ? Fenix could be useful ? It's all idea, what I'm saying is, you don't know shit about the specific, why whining already? Judge only the idea behind units, the unit design, the specific are still in progress and can / could be balanced. I didn't whine, and "judge only the idea behind units, the unit design" thats exaclty what I'm doing, I'm saying that the hook ability the way it was shown, pulling massive units for instant kills has no place in sc2. The hook unit is basically the exact same thing as the neural parasite. (yes it is) And it cost half the mana of the viper. Actually, the best unit of the viper is most certainly the cloud. About the baneling drop I'm just baffed at your comment, you know fungal, bane and overlord already exist in SC2 and they are not imba against stalker. I don't really understand in what way the cloud make it imba.
Will you stop putting words in my mouth? I never called any unit imba.
Actually, you realise cloud stopps units from using spells? So what you suggested of using forcefields to defend it is retarded and doesnt work
Also I don't know what you're smoking, but the hook ability and neural parasite are two completely different spells.
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On October 23 2011 11:41 Daralii wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2011 11:39 Reaper51 wrote:On October 23 2011 11:38 Ghola wrote:
Is it me or does the swarm host look like the most useless unit in the game? It is just a ground broodlord... That spawns units that are superior to zerglings.
But really slowly, slow enogh to kill them before they spawn again.
I rather see lurkers back imo.
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Don't chronoboost any more? Or at least save it for when you attack? I'll miss chrono but having recall instead is obviously Superior.
Not using CB in the first 8 minutes of the game will put you in a hole you won't get out of. I agree though that in lategame recall will generally be a lot more useful than cb...but not so much to render it useless.
Put it this way, you're in a tough, key engagement with your entire army. It looks like you might win, but its not certain. You have a choice:
Recall out of there. Pick another spot. You don't win, but you live to fight another day.
Dump all your energy into CB on gateways to lower cooldown, remax midfight faster, potentially win right then and there...but if you dont you wont have recall to get out.
It creates a judgement call.
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On October 23 2011 11:16 nazdrovie wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2011 11:08 canikizu wrote:On October 23 2011 10:42 nazdrovie wrote:On October 23 2011 10:38 Scribble wrote:On October 23 2011 10:36 nazdrovie wrote:On October 23 2011 10:35 Scribble wrote:On October 23 2011 10:29 Sightbain wrote:
So protoss cant do shit vs zerg now? cast defile on the colossi + stalkers and then auto lose when they cant hit anything, combine this with a fungal or two and its gg protoss army. Guess protoss arent meant to have more then 5 units clumped up at a time vs zerg in HotS Why not just spread your units out and simply walk the ones you need to out of a cloud? It's rather hard to walk out of a fungal... some would say impossible. "Why not just spread your units out." Maybe you can't walk out of a cloud while fungaled, but you can just avoid getting everything fungaled and blinded at once. (= It's not this simple even by spreading your units out you can't stop your opponent from dropping a couple of nice fungals and completely negating those units by placing a cloud over it.. "just walk out" "just spread your units out" just lol, its like saying you can survive storm with lings as long as you spread them out... Or you can, you know, replicate the those dudes, then cloud and fungal them back. Better yet, cloud, fungal, and storm their asses. Thats the point though, this is completely retarded: having a unit which can only be countered properly by a replica of that same unit makes no sense, it's probably the worst way you could possibly balance things out. You make vipers, okay so I have to get replicants to clone your vipers so I have a chance against them? Am I the only one who thinks this pants on retarded? Not to mention theres no way you can possibly have enough gas to support colossi, storm, sentries and that many repplicants in a normal game... You're just oversimplifying like the dude who said "just walk out of it" and "just spread your units"...
It's a joke. The reality is viper may not be that strong against protoss. With the new Tempest and old pheonix, Protoss may have air superior vZ for all we know, and since viper is a flying unit, it may never ever put cast the cloud without being shot, so it's just a battle of positioning.
That being said, can viper pull air unit? because it would be hilarious to have tempest pulled and shred apart by corruptor.
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On October 23 2011 11:38 Reaper51 wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2011 11:36 RushtheFront wrote:On October 23 2011 11:30 Reaper51 wrote:On October 23 2011 11:27 RushtheFront wrote:
I dont like the new nexus abilities. I for one hope they have extreme tech requirements or extremely low effectiveness. First of all there are terrible things already being suggested about arc shield for offensive possibilities, this will be patched, then there will be the problem of never being able to touch/harass a protoss base (a planetary defense for protoss) which doesn't seem very creative or meaningful. We already have warp gates for defense, and any decent toss already cannons the crap out of his hard to defend bases.
Moving mass recall to the nexus is just stupid, in the Q A they said they hoped this would solve problems with sentries being caught in a retreat and only being able to escape with stalkers, and this would change that. That comment pissed me off more than anything else, for one sentries have forcefield, which in a decent position will allow them to block of enemy movements and allow an escape, this is a good mechanic that promotes good micro and competitiveness. I would hate to see protoss devolve into an "oops i moved out at the wrong time, good thing I can just recall and lose absolutely nothing for a fundamental mistake that /should/ be punished."
Just give us back the fucking arbiter and give us back fucking kydarian amulet, it solves both of those problems for the late game and doesn't involve some stupid easy mechanic that instantly provides a defense.
As for the units, just work on the warhound, that thing looks like shit. In fact, just bring back the Goliath, after you rework ITS sc2 skin TOO. I am going to love my oracle, and the tempest looks like it will synergize amazingly with late game armies instead of how carriers are now. Yelling and swearing to bring sc1 units to sc2 won't get you anywhere You did a pretty good job of completely avoiding my points, here let me fix my post by removing the obscenities and still have the exact same amount of information. Actually no, you're not worth it. On October 23 2011 11:30 Mereel wrote:
u realize that mass recall costs 75 energy?
thats 75 from 100 that u will never have when u use chrono all the time. Don't chronoboost any more? Or at least save it for when you attack? I'll miss chrono but having recall instead is obviously Superior. You know that blizzard has a slim to nil chance of ever adding sc1 units back into sc2.
But obviously they're willing to re-add units that cover the same roles as sc1 units, the warhound is a pretty obvious example. Honestly the unit will probably work completely different in the way the goliath did than in sc1, but thats a pretty clear example that even if they re-add sc1 units then they won't fill the same role that they once did.
If not the arbiter, then let us keep the mothership, if not the goliath, then whatever you're giving us basicly the same unit in a shittier model anyway.
On October 23 2011 11:45 awesomoecalypse wrote:Show nested quote +Don't chronoboost any more? Or at least save it for when you attack? I'll miss chrono but having recall instead is obviously Superior. Not using CB in the first 8 minutes of the game will put you in a hole you won't get out of. I agree though that in lategame recall will generally be a lot more useful than cb...but not so much to render it useless. Put it this way, you're in a tough, key engagement with your entire army. It looks like you might win, but its not certain. You have a choice: Recall out of there. Pick another spot. You don't win, but you live to fight another day. Dump all your energy into CB on gateways to lower cooldown, remax midfight faster, potentially win right then and there...but if you dont you wont have recall to get out. It creates a judgement call.
8 mintues of chrono =/= 75 energy, 75 energy =/= equal a loss of more than 3 units. Yeah its a judgement call, if but anyone who is able to make that kind of judgement call should also be able to tell when they're going to lose the fight and recall out before any critical damage is taken.
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On October 23 2011 11:45 awesomoecalypse wrote:Show nested quote +Don't chronoboost any more? Or at least save it for when you attack? I'll miss chrono but having recall instead is obviously Superior. Not using CB in the first 8 minutes of the game will put you in a hole you won't get out of. I agree though that in lategame recall will generally be a lot more useful than cb...but not so much to render it useless. Put it this way, you're in a tough, key engagement with your entire army. It looks like you might win, but its not certain. You have a choice: Recall out of there. Pick another spot. You don't win, but you live to fight another day. Dump all your energy into CB on gateways to lower cooldown, remax midfight faster, potentially win right then and there...but if you dont you wont have recall to get out. It creates a judgement call.
Exactly what sc2 needs!
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On October 23 2011 11:43 Reaper51 wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2011 11:41 Daralii wrote:On October 23 2011 11:39 Reaper51 wrote:On October 23 2011 11:38 Ghola wrote:
Is it me or does the swarm host look like the most useless unit in the game? It is just a ground broodlord... That spawns units that are superior to zerglings. But really slowly, slow enogh to kill them before they spawn again. I rather see lurkers back imo.
But if you have 5 swarm hosts in a 200/200 army, you just got an extra 10 supply worth of units that are significantly bulkier than their counterpart that costs supply. If nothing else, a group of them will keep an opponent from moving out, or can easily keep a base from mining.
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Everyone else see Protoss fast expands being way easier in every matchups, thanks to the Arc shield? It defends early pressure nicely. Would that be too powerful?
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On October 23 2011 11:27 RushtheFront wrote:
I dont like the new nexus abilities. I for one hope they have extreme tech requirements or extremely low effectiveness. First of all there are terrible things already being suggested about arc shield for offensive possibilities, this will be patched, then there will be the problem of never being able to touch/harass a protoss base (a planetary defense for protoss) which doesn't seem very creative or meaningful. We already have warp gates for defense, and any decent toss already cannons the crap out of his hard to defend bases.
Moving mass recall to the nexus is just stupid, in the Q A they said they hoped this would solve problems with sentries being caught in a retreat and only being able to escape with stalkers, and this would change that. That comment pissed me off more than anything else, for one sentries have forcefield, which in a decent position will allow them to block of enemy movements and allow an escape, this is a good mechanic that promotes good micro and competitiveness. I would hate to see protoss devolve into an "oops i moved out at the wrong time, good thing I can just recall and lose absolutely nothing for a fundamental mistake that /should/ be punished."
Just give us back the fucking arbiter and give us back fucking kydarian amulet, it solves both of those problems for the late game and doesn't involve some stupid easy mechanic that instantly provides a defense.
As for the units, just work on the warhound, that thing looks like shit. In fact, just bring back the Goliath, after you rework ITS sc2 skin TOO. I am going to love my oracle, and the tempest looks like it will synergize amazingly with late game armies instead of how carriers are now.
I think the new nexus abilities are the best thing about HotS. Mass recall will allow the toss to actually be agressive and we won't have these dumb games where toss turtles on three base and then attacks. Arc shield will be good to shut down the many cheeses toss faces when they go for a macro game. Both abilites could be overpowered, but as long as blizz balances it right I think it will be great for the game.
Could you explain how having khadarian amulet and arbiter would fix protoss? Both would be made in the late game, and toss is already there.
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On October 23 2011 11:48 ZenithM wrote:
Everyone else see Protoss fast expands being way easier in every matchups, thanks to the Arc shield? It defends early pressure nicely. Would that be too powerful?
Not really, first it costs energy which is almost always used on chronoboosts early game, and the Arc shield is just a photon cannon which lasts 20 seconds.
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On October 23 2011 11:43 Reaper51 wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2011 11:41 Daralii wrote:On October 23 2011 11:39 Reaper51 wrote:On October 23 2011 11:38 Ghola wrote:
Is it me or does the swarm host look like the most useless unit in the game? It is just a ground broodlord... That spawns units that are superior to zerglings. But really slowly, slow enogh to kill them before they spawn again. I rather see lurkers back imo.
the benefit of a swarm host, is that it's range is effectively longer than a lurkers. A lurker could only attack units in range. The swarm host can rally units in a direction that move further than the lurker can attack. This is really going to help breaking siege tank pushes at your natural by using swarm hosts to gradually reduce your opponents numbers. It will also be useful against protoss with FFE, think about it, a couple swarm hosts rallying up a ramp on shakuras would eventually destroy their buildings or make the protoss waste forcefields.
I think the swarm host has a lot of great options but I am concerned with how useful it will be after a certain point in the game. Will they be enough to stop mass drops in the mid-late game? Would they be powerful enough in a 200/200 engagement? Would they even be worth it after you get broodlords? Could there be an upgrade that increases the frequency of unit spawn at hive to compensate for this?
All questions we have no answer to. I think whats great is that it fills in the gaps at lair tech and gives some offensive options for zerg.
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On October 23 2011 11:50 Reaper51 wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2011 11:48 ZenithM wrote:
Everyone else see Protoss fast expands being way easier in every matchups, thanks to the Arc shield? It defends early pressure nicely. Would that be too powerful? Not really, first it costs energy which is almost always used on chronoboosts early game, and the Arc shield is just a photon cannon which lasts 20 seconds.
It will certainly help against ling/marine pressure, though. If you know a 1/1/1 is coming, you could get a robo, get a replicant to become a tank, and stockpile enough energy for a few arc shields. The scariest part of the push(the marines) just evaporated.
The arc shield will help significantly against banshees, too.
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On October 23 2011 11:46 canikizu wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2011 11:16 nazdrovie wrote:On October 23 2011 11:08 canikizu wrote:On October 23 2011 10:42 nazdrovie wrote:On October 23 2011 10:38 Scribble wrote:On October 23 2011 10:36 nazdrovie wrote:On October 23 2011 10:35 Scribble wrote:On October 23 2011 10:29 Sightbain wrote:
So protoss cant do shit vs zerg now? cast defile on the colossi + stalkers and then auto lose when they cant hit anything, combine this with a fungal or two and its gg protoss army. Guess protoss arent meant to have more then 5 units clumped up at a time vs zerg in HotS Why not just spread your units out and simply walk the ones you need to out of a cloud? It's rather hard to walk out of a fungal... some would say impossible. "Why not just spread your units out." Maybe you can't walk out of a cloud while fungaled, but you can just avoid getting everything fungaled and blinded at once. (= It's not this simple even by spreading your units out you can't stop your opponent from dropping a couple of nice fungals and completely negating those units by placing a cloud over it.. "just walk out" "just spread your units out" just lol, its like saying you can survive storm with lings as long as you spread them out... Or you can, you know, replicate the those dudes, then cloud and fungal them back. Better yet, cloud, fungal, and storm their asses. Thats the point though, this is completely retarded: having a unit which can only be countered properly by a replica of that same unit makes no sense, it's probably the worst way you could possibly balance things out. You make vipers, okay so I have to get replicants to clone your vipers so I have a chance against them? Am I the only one who thinks this pants on retarded? Not to mention theres no way you can possibly have enough gas to support colossi, storm, sentries and that many repplicants in a normal game... You're just oversimplifying like the dude who said "just walk out of it" and "just spread your units"... It's a joke. The reality is viper may not be that strong against protoss. With the new Tempest and old pheonix, Protoss may have air superior vZ for all we know, and since viper is a flying unit, it may never ever put cast the cloud without being shot, so it's just a battle of positioning. That being said, can viper pull air unit? because it would be hilarious to have tempest pulled and shred apart by corruptor.
hydra will be used more due to dark swarm and the pull ability. If you can nullify collosus, hydras will decimate gateway army.
having hydra/infestors will be good against any air units.
The big deal will be replicator. Toss with viper won't be pretty
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Is the Shedder's attack on a cooldown? It would be pretty awesome to camp a Zerg's larva with multiple Shredders.
On October 23 2011 11:43 Reaper51 wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2011 11:41 Daralii wrote:On October 23 2011 11:39 Reaper51 wrote:On October 23 2011 11:38 Ghola wrote:
Is it me or does the swarm host look like the most useless unit in the game? It is just a ground broodlord... That spawns units that are superior to zerglings. But really slowly, slow enogh to kill them before they spawn again. I rather see lurkers back imo.
Put some Infestors and Vipers behind the Swarm Hosts and a Terran army will have a hard time even getting near them.
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On October 23 2011 11:49 happyness wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2011 11:27 RushtheFront wrote:
I dont like the new nexus abilities. I for one hope they have extreme tech requirements or extremely low effectiveness. First of all there are terrible things already being suggested about arc shield for offensive possibilities, this will be patched, then there will be the problem of never being able to touch/harass a protoss base (a planetary defense for protoss) which doesn't seem very creative or meaningful. We already have warp gates for defense, and any decent toss already cannons the crap out of his hard to defend bases.
Moving mass recall to the nexus is just stupid, in the Q A they said they hoped this would solve problems with sentries being caught in a retreat and only being able to escape with stalkers, and this would change that. That comment pissed me off more than anything else, for one sentries have forcefield, which in a decent position will allow them to block of enemy movements and allow an escape, this is a good mechanic that promotes good micro and competitiveness. I would hate to see protoss devolve into an "oops i moved out at the wrong time, good thing I can just recall and lose absolutely nothing for a fundamental mistake that /should/ be punished."
Just give us back the fucking arbiter and give us back fucking kydarian amulet, it solves both of those problems for the late game and doesn't involve some stupid easy mechanic that instantly provides a defense.
As for the units, just work on the warhound, that thing looks like shit. In fact, just bring back the Goliath, after you rework ITS sc2 skin TOO. I am going to love my oracle, and the tempest looks like it will synergize amazingly with late game armies instead of how carriers are now. I think the new nexus abilities are the best thing about HotS. Mass recall will allow the toss to actually be agressive and we won't have these dumb games where toss turtles on three base and then attacks. Arc shield will be good to shut down the many cheeses toss faces when they go for a macro game. Both abilites could be overpowered, but as long as blizz balances it right I think it will be great for the game. Could you explain how having khadarian amulet and arbiter would fix protoss? Both would be made in the late game, and toss is already there.
They will balance new nexus spells by lowering stalker's base damage from 10 to 5 and zealot's health from 100/50 to 50/25.
Exactly what protoss needs.
+ Show Spoiler +
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On October 23 2011 11:46 canikizu wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2011 11:16 nazdrovie wrote:On October 23 2011 11:08 canikizu wrote:On October 23 2011 10:42 nazdrovie wrote:On October 23 2011 10:38 Scribble wrote:On October 23 2011 10:36 nazdrovie wrote:On October 23 2011 10:35 Scribble wrote:On October 23 2011 10:29 Sightbain wrote:
So protoss cant do shit vs zerg now? cast defile on the colossi + stalkers and then auto lose when they cant hit anything, combine this with a fungal or two and its gg protoss army. Guess protoss arent meant to have more then 5 units clumped up at a time vs zerg in HotS Why not just spread your units out and simply walk the ones you need to out of a cloud? It's rather hard to walk out of a fungal... some would say impossible. "Why not just spread your units out." Maybe you can't walk out of a cloud while fungaled, but you can just avoid getting everything fungaled and blinded at once. (= It's not this simple even by spreading your units out you can't stop your opponent from dropping a couple of nice fungals and completely negating those units by placing a cloud over it.. "just walk out" "just spread your units out" just lol, its like saying you can survive storm with lings as long as you spread them out... Or you can, you know, replicate the those dudes, then cloud and fungal them back. Better yet, cloud, fungal, and storm their asses. Thats the point though, this is completely retarded: having a unit which can only be countered properly by a replica of that same unit makes no sense, it's probably the worst way you could possibly balance things out. You make vipers, okay so I have to get replicants to clone your vipers so I have a chance against them? Am I the only one who thinks this pants on retarded? Not to mention theres no way you can possibly have enough gas to support colossi, storm, sentries and that many repplicants in a normal game... You're just oversimplifying like the dude who said "just walk out of it" and "just spread your units"... It's a joke. The reality is viper may not be that strong against protoss. With the new Tempest and old pheonix, Protoss may have air superior vZ for all we know, and since viper is a flying unit, it may never ever put cast the cloud without being shot, so it's just a battle of positioning.
Yes I thought about new protoss air being more efficient, but I'm pretty sure vipers still come in to play alot faster than tempest and corruptors still hard counter phoenix so Idk what to think about it untill i see it in action.
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Is it just me or does the transformed hellion attack look like a water gun lol.
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On October 23 2011 11:49 happyness wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2011 11:27 RushtheFront wrote:
I dont like the new nexus abilities. I for one hope they have extreme tech requirements or extremely low effectiveness. First of all there are terrible things already being suggested about arc shield for offensive possibilities, this will be patched, then there will be the problem of never being able to touch/harass a protoss base (a planetary defense for protoss) which doesn't seem very creative or meaningful. We already have warp gates for defense, and any decent toss already cannons the crap out of his hard to defend bases.
Moving mass recall to the nexus is just stupid, in the Q A they said they hoped this would solve problems with sentries being caught in a retreat and only being able to escape with stalkers, and this would change that. That comment pissed me off more than anything else, for one sentries have forcefield, which in a decent position will allow them to block of enemy movements and allow an escape, this is a good mechanic that promotes good micro and competitiveness. I would hate to see protoss devolve into an "oops i moved out at the wrong time, good thing I can just recall and lose absolutely nothing for a fundamental mistake that /should/ be punished."
Just give us back the fucking arbiter and give us back fucking kydarian amulet, it solves both of those problems for the late game and doesn't involve some stupid easy mechanic that instantly provides a defense.
As for the units, just work on the warhound, that thing looks like shit. In fact, just bring back the Goliath, after you rework ITS sc2 skin TOO. I am going to love my oracle, and the tempest looks like it will synergize amazingly with late game armies instead of how carriers are now. I think the new nexus abilities are the best thing about HotS. Mass recall will allow the toss to actually be agressive and we won't have these dumb games where toss turtles on three base and then attacks. Arc shield will be good to shut down the many cheeses toss faces when they go for a macro game. Both abilites could be overpowered, but as long as blizz balances it right I think it will be great for the game. Could you explain how having khadarian amulet and arbiter would fix protoss? Both would be made in the late game, and toss is already there.
I never said Protoss was broken, it just seems like they're trying to solve problems that they've caused with some wacky solution to preserve their pride (and not taking back a decision that they've made). Moving recall from the mothership to the nexus seemed like it was only because of their decision to remove the mothership, which is something I don't understand in the first place as it has just begun to become pretty useful.
What's even weirder is that they mentioned that it wasn't A-movey enough for them, thats why they're removing it and giving Terran the Odin in MP.
Like come on, what kind of logic.
On October 23 2011 11:54 ZenithM wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2011 11:49 happyness wrote:On October 23 2011 11:27 RushtheFront wrote:
I dont like the new nexus abilities. I for one hope they have extreme tech requirements or extremely low effectiveness. First of all there are terrible things already being suggested about arc shield for offensive possibilities, this will be patched, then there will be the problem of never being able to touch/harass a protoss base (a planetary defense for protoss) which doesn't seem very creative or meaningful. We already have warp gates for defense, and any decent toss already cannons the crap out of his hard to defend bases.
Moving mass recall to the nexus is just stupid, in the Q A they said they hoped this would solve problems with sentries being caught in a retreat and only being able to escape with stalkers, and this would change that. That comment pissed me off more than anything else, for one sentries have forcefield, which in a decent position will allow them to block of enemy movements and allow an escape, this is a good mechanic that promotes good micro and competitiveness. I would hate to see protoss devolve into an "oops i moved out at the wrong time, good thing I can just recall and lose absolutely nothing for a fundamental mistake that /should/ be punished."
Just give us back the fucking arbiter and give us back fucking kydarian amulet, it solves both of those problems for the late game and doesn't involve some stupid easy mechanic that instantly provides a defense.
As for the units, just work on the warhound, that thing looks like shit. In fact, just bring back the Goliath, after you rework ITS sc2 skin TOO. I am going to love my oracle, and the tempest looks like it will synergize amazingly with late game armies instead of how carriers are now. I think the new nexus abilities are the best thing about HotS. Mass recall will allow the toss to actually be agressive and we won't have these dumb games where toss turtles on three base and then attacks. Arc shield will be good to shut down the many cheeses toss faces when they go for a macro game. Both abilites could be overpowered, but as long as blizz balances it right I think it will be great for the game. Could you explain how having khadarian amulet and arbiter would fix protoss? Both would be made in the late game, and toss is already there. They will balance new nexus spells by lowering stalker's base damage from 10 to 5 and zealot's health from 100/50 to 50/25. Exactly what protoss needs. + Show Spoiler +
Its silly, but this is actually a really good point. Do we really want to give blizzard any more of a reason to make gateway units weaker?
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Strange new units, not sold on them...
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On October 23 2011 11:54 ZenithM wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2011 11:49 happyness wrote:On October 23 2011 11:27 RushtheFront wrote:
I dont like the new nexus abilities. I for one hope they have extreme tech requirements or extremely low effectiveness. First of all there are terrible things already being suggested about arc shield for offensive possibilities, this will be patched, then there will be the problem of never being able to touch/harass a protoss base (a planetary defense for protoss) which doesn't seem very creative or meaningful. We already have warp gates for defense, and any decent toss already cannons the crap out of his hard to defend bases.
Moving mass recall to the nexus is just stupid, in the Q A they said they hoped this would solve problems with sentries being caught in a retreat and only being able to escape with stalkers, and this would change that. That comment pissed me off more than anything else, for one sentries have forcefield, which in a decent position will allow them to block of enemy movements and allow an escape, this is a good mechanic that promotes good micro and competitiveness. I would hate to see protoss devolve into an "oops i moved out at the wrong time, good thing I can just recall and lose absolutely nothing for a fundamental mistake that /should/ be punished."
Just give us back the fucking arbiter and give us back fucking kydarian amulet, it solves both of those problems for the late game and doesn't involve some stupid easy mechanic that instantly provides a defense.
As for the units, just work on the warhound, that thing looks like shit. In fact, just bring back the Goliath, after you rework ITS sc2 skin TOO. I am going to love my oracle, and the tempest looks like it will synergize amazingly with late game armies instead of how carriers are now. I think the new nexus abilities are the best thing about HotS. Mass recall will allow the toss to actually be agressive and we won't have these dumb games where toss turtles on three base and then attacks. Arc shield will be good to shut down the many cheeses toss faces when they go for a macro game. Both abilites could be overpowered, but as long as blizz balances it right I think it will be great for the game. Could you explain how having khadarian amulet and arbiter would fix protoss? Both would be made in the late game, and toss is already there. They will balance new nexus spells by lowering stalker's base damage from 10 to 5 and zealot's health from 100/50 to 50/25. Exactly what protoss needs. + Show Spoiler +
Well Dimaga would be overjoyed, but I think they'll just increase the build time by 5 seconds a few dozen times.
+ Show Spoiler +Dimaga wrote a letter to Blizzard a while ago complaining that stalkers did too much DPS. >_>
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