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On October 02 2011 11:33 Mortal wrote:Show nested quote +On October 02 2011 11:28 Mohdoo wrote:
Ugh, so tired of seeing people try to program their way into being a better player. Do it the same way all of us have for years and years. There is nothing wrong with trying to work on your mechanics. yeah, pretty much qft. stop trying to side-step the problem and just do it normally.
Dude. I'm so tired of seeing people pretending that they are too high and mighty to learn starcraft by doing anything but mass ladder games. More importantly, I doubt either of you are grandmasters zergs (sorry if im wrong) and so you're talking out your ass if you think you know about high level practising methods.
Are you opposed to coaching? If I paid Destiny to coach me, he would do exactly what this addon does. There are indeed custom maps that do similar things.
Do you think that if you spend hours practising with this, and then take it away, that suddenly you wouldn't be able to macro? It's a practising aid... a lot of players use things like this. Real life timers. There are cell phone applications you can run outside of your computer totally.. As someone else said, it's like someone practising music using a metronome.
Just seems like this community is full of bitter, unhelpful elitists sometimes.
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There's nothing wrong with using programs like this when you're laddering and whatnot, but it doesn't really help you become a better player. People are good players because they remember the little things like larva injects while doing all the other things extremely well, that's what separates good players from great players.
Who do you think is the better player - Someone who hits all their larva injects because of hours of practicing their mechanics, or a player who uses a program to tell them when to inject? Do we really want to promote even less skill in this game?
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On October 02 2011 11:40 darkscream wrote:Show nested quote +On October 02 2011 11:33 Mortal wrote:On October 02 2011 11:28 Mohdoo wrote:
Ugh, so tired of seeing people try to program their way into being a better player. Do it the same way all of us have for years and years. There is nothing wrong with trying to work on your mechanics. yeah, pretty much qft. stop trying to side-step the problem and just do it normally. Dude. I'm so tired of seeing people pretending that they are too high and mighty to learn starcraft by doing anything but mass ladder games. More importantly, I doubt either of you are grandmasters zergs (sorry if im wrong) and so you're talking out your ass if you think you know about high level practising methods. Are you opposed to coaching? If I paid Destiny to coach me, he would do exactly what this addon does. There are indeed custom maps that do similar things. Do you think that if you spend hours practising with this, and then take it away, that suddenly you wouldn't be able to macro? It's a practising aid... a lot of players use things like this. Real life timers. There are cell phone applications you can run outside of your computer totally.. As someone else said, it's like someone practising music using a metronome. Just seems like this community is full of bitter, unhelpful elitists sometimes.
Or you could, you know, use the in game clock as a timer instead of relying on random programs.
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On October 02 2011 12:04 Pisko. wrote:Show nested quote +On October 02 2011 11:40 darkscream wrote:On October 02 2011 11:33 Mortal wrote:On October 02 2011 11:28 Mohdoo wrote:
Ugh, so tired of seeing people try to program their way into being a better player. Do it the same way all of us have for years and years. There is nothing wrong with trying to work on your mechanics. yeah, pretty much qft. stop trying to side-step the problem and just do it normally. Dude. I'm so tired of seeing people pretending that they are too high and mighty to learn starcraft by doing anything but mass ladder games. More importantly, I doubt either of you are grandmasters zergs (sorry if im wrong) and so you're talking out your ass if you think you know about high level practising methods. Are you opposed to coaching? If I paid Destiny to coach me, he would do exactly what this addon does. There are indeed custom maps that do similar things. Do you think that if you spend hours practising with this, and then take it away, that suddenly you wouldn't be able to macro? It's a practising aid... a lot of players use things like this. Real life timers. There are cell phone applications you can run outside of your computer totally.. As someone else said, it's like someone practising music using a metronome. Just seems like this community is full of bitter, unhelpful elitists sometimes. Or you could, you know, use the in game clock as a timer instead of relying on random programs.
That's silly to say. If you can remember to look at the clock every 29 seconds, then why wouldn't you just be injecting your hatches instead of looking at the clock?
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On October 02 2011 13:27 Xanbatou wrote:Show nested quote +On October 02 2011 12:04 Pisko. wrote:On October 02 2011 11:40 darkscream wrote:On October 02 2011 11:33 Mortal wrote:On October 02 2011 11:28 Mohdoo wrote:
Ugh, so tired of seeing people try to program their way into being a better player. Do it the same way all of us have for years and years. There is nothing wrong with trying to work on your mechanics. yeah, pretty much qft. stop trying to side-step the problem and just do it normally. Dude. I'm so tired of seeing people pretending that they are too high and mighty to learn starcraft by doing anything but mass ladder games. More importantly, I doubt either of you are grandmasters zergs (sorry if im wrong) and so you're talking out your ass if you think you know about high level practising methods. Are you opposed to coaching? If I paid Destiny to coach me, he would do exactly what this addon does. There are indeed custom maps that do similar things. Do you think that if you spend hours practising with this, and then take it away, that suddenly you wouldn't be able to macro? It's a practising aid... a lot of players use things like this. Real life timers. There are cell phone applications you can run outside of your computer totally.. As someone else said, it's like someone practising music using a metronome. Just seems like this community is full of bitter, unhelpful elitists sometimes. Or you could, you know, use the in game clock as a timer instead of relying on random programs. That's silly to say. If you can remember to look at the clock every 29 seconds, then why wouldn't you just be injecting your hatches instead of looking at the clock?
That's not how you use the clock lol
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On October 02 2011 11:58 SkimGuy wrote:
There's nothing wrong with using programs like this when you're laddering and whatnot, but it doesn't really help you become a better player. People are good players because they remember the little things like larva injects while doing all the other things extremely well, that's what separates good players from great players.
Who do you think is the better player - Someone who hits all their larva injects because of hours of practicing their mechanics, or a player who uses a program to tell them when to inject? Do we really want to promote even less skill in this game?
This is just false. A big part of multi-tasking is being able to do things without having to think twice about them. Once you get in the "habit" of doing things, it becomes second nature. This device allows you get in the habit of injecting constantly, any people who are opposing it are just being ignorant.
You guys basically sound like "You need to learn how to inject like a man through hours and hours of games! Not through more efficient methods of training!" - Do you know how ridiculous this sounds?
Now I'll try this out, but I already have injects down pretty pat so it might not help especially since I'll have to reset the timer which will use up costly APM but for lower level players, I definitely recommend this.
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While I think for use as a training tool something like this doesn't hurt...a lot will use it as a laziness tool in game which is actually cheating. If blizzard ever felt like adding a program such as this to their detection software built into battle.net, using such a thing 'could' get you banned while laddering.
Not to say the OP doesn't have his thought in the right place, just that it's really obvious a bunch of people will abuse this on ladder to make up for lack of skill/awareness.
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or you can just watch the left of your screen for the larva icon to pop up...? it seems like most people still don't even realize it's useful even a year after release lol
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Lol anyone who thinks this wont help... You never learned to ride a bike with training wheels? Learning aids help. If you use this for a week, at the end of the week you could turn it off and your brain will naturally remember when it needs to inject.
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The point of this timer (or any time of the sort) is to train your brain to be aware when you need to re-inject larva. Eventually, you will get use to the timings of when you need to inject and then you won't need the program.
Why are so many people against programs that obviously help you. If you don't have something nice to say then piss the fuck off.
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On October 02 2011 11:28 Mohdoo wrote:
Ugh, so tired of seeing people try to program their way into being a better player. Do it the same way all of us have for years and years. There is nothing wrong with trying to work on your mechanics.
I'm confused, I thought this was helping with mechanics o.o Its reminding you to inject meaning that you get used to injecting on time.
When I play piano I use the metronome to practice and when I get used to the rhythm I stop. Basically the same isn't it?
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I don't think it's a bad thing for people who are learning. At some point, obviously, you're going to want to break the habit or I think it could impact your play for the negative if, for whatever reason, you don't have it some time (lan party?).
I would definitely question the ethics of playing with it against somebody else, but I don't see it as a huge issue personally.
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l2p
User was temp banned for this post.
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i think this could be good for practice reasons. Just to make your mind remember how often to inject. After a while you could do it without the program probably
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I like how people reference the inability to use such programs at a lan. like 1% MAYBE ever go to a lan to play, and if you're ever going to a lan that cares about something like this, like a big tournament, obviously you've out grown it already, or you don't belong there.
All the haters are just as stupid, you don't need it, you don't download it. You don't talk shit about it, because it will help someone, and they'll probably get better than you.
I'm sure none of you new school sc2 players remember it, but all the old ones can confirm how APM live increased their APM in SC:BW. But hey, things like this don't help you learn the game faster.
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On October 02 2011 15:54 hasuwar wrote: I'm sure none of you new school sc2 players remember it, but all the old ones can confirm how APM live increased their APM in SC:BW. But hey, things like this don't help you learn the game faster.
Yeah, I'm too new school to remember this sort of thing. I imagine it helps though.
I was very critical of when there was one released here for MULE timings, so I can't say I approve of this either. I won't demand others not use it though. It's bound to help some people.
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On October 02 2011 15:54 hasuwar wrote:
I like how people reference the inability to use such programs at a lan. like 1% MAYBE ever go to a lan to play, and if you're ever going to a lan that cares about something like this, like a big tournament, obviously you've out grown it already, or you don't belong there.
All the haters are just as stupid, you don't need it, you don't download it. You don't talk shit about it, because it will help someone, and they'll probably get better than you.
I'm sure none of you new school sc2 players remember it, but all the old ones can confirm how APM live increased their APM in SC:BW. But hey, things like this don't help you learn the game faster.
If you're using it to practice it's fine, but I think most people are hating it because they're seeing it as "use this program to tell you when to inject larvae instead of actually learning the timing." I always learned timings from just looking at the clock (which IMO is the better way to learn) but if you think this is better for you then go ahead.
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guess i'll just post here one more time. people who say this won't help or it will make you worse once you let it go, etc, you're honestly 100% ignorant. you have never had a coach or trainer in your life, and if you have and you still say this is poor training, then you really must not be very bright to not see this as a version of the same thing.
say you use this for a month, and you're brand new to starcraft. after a month of using this, you never miss an inject when it tells you, then you stop. you will feel slightly weird about it not being there when you first give it up, but it will literally take only a few days for you to inject almost as well as you were when you had the trainer. compared to making no deliberate effort to improve injects whatsoever and blindly mass gaming, the help is immense.
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i play protoss but i don't see whats wrong with this. Its to keep track of timings and its not like I don't keep a beeper thing going for warpgate cooldown reminding outside of my computer system
edit - ethically at least. Id imagine it is bannable by blizzard since it is an outside program which does actually interact with sc2 since thats its whole purpose
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I'm going to post some of my own experiences with this. I actually just made this today, so I haven't had a lot of experience with it, but after a few games, it really made me realize something. Whenever I am in some sort of engagement or doing any sort of harass, I very rarely remember to inject my hatches. I get so focused on what I'm doing that I just don't even think about it. That has often lost me games. I can't even count how many games I would have won if I had another round of units at my disposal.
On October 02 2011 16:20 askTeivospy wrote:
i play protoss but i don't see whats wrong with this. Its to keep track of timings and its not like I don't keep a beeper thing going for warpgate cooldown reminding outside of my computer system
edit - ethically at least. Id imagine it is bannable by blizzard since it is an outside program which does actually interact with sc2 since thats its whole purpose
It doesn't interact with sc2 at all. In fact, it has no idea of the existence of any other programs. It's simply a window that sits on top of all other windows, which is why you can interact with it while playing. Which makes me wonder if this program works in full-screen mode. I only ever run sc2 in windowed mode.
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EPT
