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On September 21 2011 01:37 Gooey wrote:What's not so sad about this, is that when you contrast this with what HuK did, it just makes Liquid look that much better. TL gave him the opportunity to make it big, nurtured him and watched him grow into one of the best protoss players in the world. When a life-changing financial offer came his way to take him to the next step in his career, Liquid said "hey man, go for it, no hard feelings, you deserve it". Just to brighten the mood  <3 TL
Liquid has been showing these other teams up with regard to trading players. Do you remember when EG took Puma and the controversy that came with it? What about when Liquid took hero? Lol.
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On September 21 2011 01:21 Medrea wrote:Show nested quote +On September 20 2011 22:21 Whiplash wrote:
Col released a transparent statement of their view of everything that happened, you guys still haven't. Seriously. What the fuck is wrong with you Millenium. Can we stop with the flowery meta-speech?
I don't know... maybe they want to said they don't care about all this drama
You said coL made a transparent statement ? well, no one besides Stephano can tell if it's true or not. For me it's doesn't make sense. They obviously didn't contact Mill about this.
Who is to blame? Everyone !
- coL, for not contacting Millenium about this contract before Stephano signing it
- Stephano, for signing and then changing is mind
- Millenium, for trying to protect their player when he has already sign something and poor communication
So, personally I admire Millenium, they are not afraid of the "Flee in fear of our US lawyer power !!" coL is making.
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On September 20 2011 22:29 Boardin wrote:Show nested quote +On September 20 2011 22:21 Whiplash wrote:
Col released a transparent statement of their view of everything that happened, you guys still haven't. This. Sounds like what you did was take Stephano into a room and call him a traitor to your country until he signed with you
I think that's probably close to the truth.
It sounds like Stephano was offered a better deal by complexity, but Millenium pressured him into staying for nationalistic reasons.
Stephano is just a kid who probably had no idea what to do and went with the guys who pressured him the most.
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On September 21 2011 01:38 tyCe wrote:
Some organizations don't want to take their confidential legal issues to the battleground of the Internet. Stop blaming Millenium for being coy on the matter when in fact it is probably better that this thing is sorted out by the two teams and their mutual position finalized before a clear statement is released. Not everyone is impressed by EG or iNcontroL style "announcements" which later turn out to be half truths swallowed by bullshit and hype.
I don't think SC2 esports needs more drama about unprofessionalism, so I think we should congratulate Millenium for keeping the gossip to the trash mags and the other parts of the internet. I'm sure a real statement will be forthcoming once everything or initial negotiations have been resolved.
Yeah people asking for explanation are really funny, why do you even think you deserve more informations ? All that this forum has been doing is troll about some absurd french patriotism and shit like that, like they stated clearly they don't really give a fuck about what a bunch of trolls think about the situation, just take a look at the thread of 150 pages...ridiculous
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Amazing how many ESPORTS freaks there are on these forums now, this isn't the end of the world guys. Although I agree there should be more transparency between teams and the public in regards to players and contracts this kind of thing is really not stopping ESPORTS getting mainstream and to even say it is is ridiculous.
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On September 21 2011 01:46 bmml wrote:
Amazing how many ESPORTS freaks there are on these forums now, this isn't the end of the world guys. Although I agree there should be more transparency between teams and the public in regards to players and contracts this kind of thing is really not stopping ESPORTS getting mainstream and to even say it is is ridiculous.
Actually a world where players sign contracts with a team one day and then completely ignore them the next day is kinda the end of esports.
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On September 21 2011 01:43 Gwal wrote:Show nested quote +On September 21 2011 01:21 Medrea wrote:On September 20 2011 22:21 Whiplash wrote:
Col released a transparent statement of their view of everything that happened, you guys still haven't. Seriously. What the fuck is wrong with you Millenium. Can we stop with the flowery meta-speech? I don't know... maybe they want to said they don't care about all this drama You said coL made a transparent statement ? well, no one besides Stephano can tell if it's true or not. For me it's doesn't make sense. They obviously didn't contact Mill about this. Who is to blame? Everyone ! - coL, for not contacting Millenium about this contract before Stephano signing it - Stephano, for signing and then changing is mind - Millenium, for trying to protect their player when he has already sign something and poor communication So, personally I admire Millenium, they are not afraid of the "Flee in fear of our US lawyer power !!" coL is making.
This is absolute nonsense, you're making an assumption based on no response from Millenium. That means nothing. Complexity has given their side of the story, Millenium have basically said, Complexity are assholes, they disoriented Stephano and he now realized his mistake. They're not explaining anything, they're not elaborating on whether they were actually contacted, and they aren't doing anything but straw-maning and slinging mud.
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On September 21 2011 01:43 Gwal wrote:Show nested quote +On September 21 2011 01:21 Medrea wrote:On September 20 2011 22:21 Whiplash wrote:
Col released a transparent statement of their view of everything that happened, you guys still haven't. Seriously. What the fuck is wrong with you Millenium. Can we stop with the flowery meta-speech? I don't know... maybe they want to said they don't care about all this drama You said coL made a transparent statement ? well, no one besides Stephano can tell if it's true or not. For me it's doesn't make sense. They obviously didn't contact Mill about this. Who is to blame? Everyone ! - coL, for not contacting Millenium about this contract before Stephano signing it - Stephano, for signing and then changing is mind - Millenium, for trying to protect their player when he has already sign something and poor communication So, personally I admire Millenium, they are not afraid of the "Flee in fear of our US lawyer power !!" coL is making.
This is not about US Law, it's about having been wronged and trying to make it right again (even though I'm pretty sure everyone will lose something if the law is involved, in this case)
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Even if Millenium/Stephano are correct in that they have done nothing wrong legally this will most definitely make people think less of them, and rightfully so.
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Im gonna go with nazgul on this one. A real explanation is due. From Stephano as well would be pretty cool.
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On September 20 2011 23:31 Liquid`Nazgul wrote:
I would like to see a real explanation. From Stephano too. It's simple really.
0. Stephano wants to become a pro gamer for one year, and starting early september, enters negotiations with pretty much every other European team, as well as his current team (Millenium) and some non-European teams (including Complexity).
1. Complexity signs a contract with Stephano at ~3am French time and anounce it publicly.
2. The Millenium League of Legend staff discovers Complexity's statement on the internet at 5am and make their own surprised statement.
3. During the following day, Millenium staff realizes that said contract is most likely an illegal employment contract in the eyes of French law, and persuades Stephano to ignore it, signing a (legal) employment contract with them instead.
4. Millenium anounces their signing of Stephano publicly, while doing snide remarks about the illegality of Complexity's contract (and disregarding the fact that said contract was not merely a French employment contract, but an international contract - some of the snide remarks would later be retracted upon realizing that). Some TL posters become infuriated, because they don't like the dirty laundry exposure.
5. Complexity publicly states that their own contract is legally binding, which it most likely is in the eyes of US law, and that they are investigating their legal options. They add their own snide remarks about the mediocrity of the Millenium legal staff (and failing to acknowledge that getting legal advice knowledgeable in French law *before* signing a French player would have been a prudent decision).
6. Millenium issues a statement according to which they are now attempting to cut the dirty laundry exposure, and resolve the matter in private with Complexity. Some TL posters become infuriated, because they like the dirty laundry exposure.
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Ahh the old say lots without saying anything tactic.
Did Alex Garfield write this?
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On September 21 2011 01:51 Apom wrote:Show nested quote +On September 20 2011 23:31 Liquid`Nazgul wrote:
I would like to see a real explanation. From Stephano too. It's simple really. 1. Complexity signs a contract with Stephano at ~3am French time and anounce it publicly. 2. The Millenium League of Legend staff discovers Complexity's statement on the internet at 5am and make their own surprised statement. 3. During the following day, Millenium staff realizes that said contract is most likely an illegal employment contract in the eyes of French law, and persuades Stephano to ignore it, signing a (legal) employment contract with them instead. 4. Millenium anounces their signing of Stephano publicly, while doing snide remarks about the illegality of Complexity's contract (and disregarding the fact that said contract was not merely a French employment contract, but an international contract - some of the snide remarks would later be retracted upon realizing that). 5. Complexity publicly states that their own contract is legally binding, which it most likely is in the eyes of US law, and that they are investigating their legal options. They add their own snide remarks about the mediocrity of the Millenium legal staff (and failing to acknowledge that getting legal advice knowledgeable in French law *before* signing a French player would have been a prudent decision). 6. Millenium issues a statement according to which they are now attempting to cut the dirty laundry exposure, and resolve the matter in private with Complexity.
You skipped the part where there was a half month of negotiations, offers and counter offers before Stephano signed with complexity. As stated by complexity and not refuted by Mil
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If I had to say anything in Millenium or complexity, I would just stop releasing statements from now on until the issue is solved. The Fans know that shit got mixed up and that is enough. Now it`s time for some behind-closed-doors discussions which hopefully lead to a solution both parties can live with.
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On September 21 2011 01:53 zul wrote:
If I had to say anything in Millenium or complexity, I would just stop releasing statements from now on until the issue is solved. The Fans know that shit got mixed up and that is enough. Now it`s time for some behind-closed-doors discussions which hopefully lead to a solution both parties can live with.
I guess. I dunno Im inclined to believe complexity at this point because Millenium and Stephano have yet to say anything regarding this. Millenium being really slippery here.
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So annoying and sad to see all of these appearing recently on the scene. So much open mud-slinging and inability to follow contracts =/
Kudos to Liquid on releasing HuK and acquiring HerO in a respectable and admirable manner.
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On September 21 2011 01:51 Apom wrote:Show nested quote +On September 20 2011 23:31 Liquid`Nazgul wrote:
I would like to see a real explanation. From Stephano too. It's simple really. 1. Complexity signs a contract with Stephano at ~3am French time and anounce it publicly. 2. The Millenium League of Legend staff discovers Complexity's statement on the internet at 5am and make their own surprised statement. 3. During the following day, Millenium staff realizes that said contract is most likely an illegal employment contract in the eyes of French law, and persuades Stephano to ignore it, signing a (legal) employment contract with them instead. 4. Millenium anounces their signing of Stephano publicly, while doing snide remarks about the illegality of Complexity's contract (and disregarding the fact that said contract was not merely a French employment contract, but an international contract - some of the snide remarks would later be retracted upon realizing that). Some TL posters become infuriated, because they don't like the dirty laundry exposure. 5. Complexity publicly states that their own contract is legally binding, which it most likely is in the eyes of US law, and that they are investigating their legal options. They add their own snide remarks about the mediocrity of the Millenium legal staff (and failing to acknowledge that getting legal advice knowledgeable in French law *before* signing a French player would have been a prudent decision). 6. Millenium issues a statement according to which they are now attempting to cut the dirty laundry exposure, and resolve the matter in private with Complexity. Some TL posters become infuriated, because they like the dirty laundry exposure.
How is that related to what Nazgul said?
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On September 21 2011 01:55 Deshkar wrote:
So annoying and sad to see all of these appearing recently on the scene. So much open mud-slinging and inability to follow contracts =/
Kudos to Liquid on releasing HuK and acquiring HerO in a respectable and admirable manner.
As far as we can tell Complexity did everything by the book and in front of Mill.
How far do you have to go? this could have happened to Liquid EZPZ
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On September 21 2011 01:51 Apom wrote:Show nested quote +On September 20 2011 23:31 Liquid`Nazgul wrote:
I would like to see a real explanation. From Stephano too. It's simple really. 1. Complexity signs a contract with Stephano at ~3am French time and anounce it publicly. 2. The Millenium League of Legend staff discovers Complexity's statement on the internet at 5am and make their own surprised statement. 3. During the following day, Millenium staff realizes that said contract is most likely an illegal employment contract in the eyes of French law, and persuades Stephano to ignore it, signing a (legal) employment contract with them instead. 4. Millenium anounces their signing of Stephano publicly, while doing snide remarks about the illegality of Complexity's contract (and disregarding the fact that said contract was not merely a French employment contract, but an international contract - some of the snide remarks would later be retracted upon realizing that). Some TL posters become infuriated, because they don't like the dirty laundry exposure. 5. Complexity publicly states that their own contract is legally binding, which it most likely is in the eyes of US law, and that they are investigating their legal options. They add their own snide remarks about the mediocrity of the Millenium legal staff (and failing to acknowledge that getting legal advice knowledgeable in French law *before* signing a French player would have been a prudent decision). 6. Millenium issues a statement according to which they are now attempting to cut the dirty laundry exposure, and resolve the matter in private with Complexity. Some TL posters become infuriated, because they like the dirty laundry exposure.
Congrats on "making it simple" with zero knowledge of either team's internal affairs. Stop making rumors/assumptions and wait for Millenium's next "official statement" and hopefully it will actually have content.
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On September 21 2011 01:53 Snorkle wrote:Show nested quote +On September 21 2011 01:51 Apom wrote:On September 20 2011 23:31 Liquid`Nazgul wrote:
I would like to see a real explanation. From Stephano too. It's simple really. 1. Complexity signs a contract with Stephano at ~3am French time and anounce it publicly. 2. The Millenium League of Legend staff discovers Complexity's statement on the internet at 5am and make their own surprised statement. 3. During the following day, Millenium staff realizes that said contract is most likely an illegal employment contract in the eyes of French law, and persuades Stephano to ignore it, signing a (legal) employment contract with them instead. 4. Millenium anounces their signing of Stephano publicly, while doing snide remarks about the illegality of Complexity's contract (and disregarding the fact that said contract was not merely a French employment contract, but an international contract - some of the snide remarks would later be retracted upon realizing that). 5. Complexity publicly states that their own contract is legally binding, which it most likely is in the eyes of US law, and that they are investigating their legal options. They add their own snide remarks about the mediocrity of the Millenium legal staff (and failing to acknowledge that getting legal advice knowledgeable in French law *before* signing a French player would have been a prudent decision). 6. Millenium issues a statement according to which they are now attempting to cut the dirty laundry exposure, and resolve the matter in private with Complexity. You skipped the part where there was a half month of negotiations, offers and counter offers before Stephano signed with complexity. As stated by complexity and not refuted by Mil While I do not think this is relevant (as he negotiated with half the planet), I have amended my post to reflect this.
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EPT
