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On April 26 2014 02:39 SirPinky wrote:Show nested quote +On April 26 2014 02:29 Big J wrote:On April 26 2014 02:11 Thieving Magpie wrote:On April 26 2014 01:47 Big J wrote:On April 26 2014 01:31 Thieving Magpie wrote:On April 26 2014 01:26 Big J wrote:On April 26 2014 01:24 Thieving Magpie wrote:On April 26 2014 01:18 YyapSsap wrote:On April 26 2014 01:09 Thieving Magpie wrote:On April 26 2014 01:05 YyapSsap wrote:
[quote]
And pre patch hellbats! Pre-Patch hellbats is not the reason you have a cannon with the range of a siege tank. Actually--would a shorter ranged cannon be up for discussion? Imagine if Nexus cannon only had say 8-9 range? Long enough for everything but allows Terran timing attacks with tanks in the early game? It would allow the Nexus cannon to defend everything except siege weapons forcing increased unit production but only if the opponent went fast factory. Dont take it out of context. I was replying to the part where SirPinky said "Did you play WoL? I only ask because Terran has absolutely no new units in HoTs to really change gameplay in the first 10 minutes (anything that had potential was nerfed into oblivion)" which is infact not true. But yes you do have an interesting point. The nexus PO range is slightly reduced so that tank based aggression could be viable. But Im afraid this might make literally all terrans to do this if Protoss does the normal 1 gate expand or something along those lines. Technically that's good. Its important to have lines of play that can be transitioned into upon new scouting information. Bio play was non-existent in BW PvT, for example, in which case all terrans went fast Factory. Some of them defensively to protect a FE, others to hit siege timings. Giving Terrans an aggressive option from factory tech would give terrans the ability to threaten a huge push and "force units" out of Protoss even if they don't intend to do a timing attack. It would encourage early to midgame tank play, etc... Hmm... I wonder.... You mean like the widow mine aggression that we see in half of the current TvP games? Widow Mine aggression is different than parking a siege tank at range and poking. The terran army can't advance in fear of PO, and the Protoss Army does not push out until they get enough tech (usually immortals) to break the siege. The goal is to force Protoss to either suffer minor infrastructure damage or force Protoss to commit to units to defend their base. That is very different from "Oh god oh god does he have an observer?" You mean you want your own stupid brute force rush. No thanks, not more blink and immortal bullshit than we already have. What the hell are you talking about? I'm asking for a push that is slow enough to be scouted, weak enough to be deflected, effective enough to force superficial damage, and strong enough that if ignored can kill the opponent.I'm asking for a situation wherein it is possible to apply pressure with expensive enough units that it takes time to amass the numbers. I want it to be defensible enough that they can't just march into your base and is forced to siege out of range of your defenses. I want it to be able to apply pressure but at a slow enough rate that Protoss can amass enough troops to stop it. And I want it strong enough to be able to kill them if ignored. I want a proactive game where both players care about what the other does. That's basically impossible in the early game with the build times we have in the game. Early game frontal pushes have to rely on scouting missinformation/speed. If it is "slow enough to be scouted", it needs to be extremely powerful to not just get roflstomped by an opponent that thus had enough time to get prepared. Else it is exactly what Terran has right now. You can try to 1-1-1 or 2-3rax of 1base. It's easily identifiable and slow. And thus gets crushed very hard because the opponent will simply be prepared. The only time when something like this exists in SC2 is when you play a mirror matchup and both sides invest into a similar push at similar times. You say, "And thus gets crushed very hard because the opponent will simply be prepared." But that is exactly our point - Protoss DO NOT need to prepare for a tank push. They right click on the Nexus and it is held b/c of its absurd range. In WoL a tank push could be very strong against a greedy Protoss if they didn't scout or make at least 1 immortal. Now you don't even need a robotics bay to hold it.
Of course they need to prepare for it. We have seen exactly that today. Maru did a tank/marine/medivac+raven push from 2bases after the initial mine drops. San bought a ton of time with blink stalkers and chronoboosted out 2 or 3 immortals and stayed two bases. And then he held and all of Maru's lead was gone. And that's why we don't see any such pushes.
Protoss sees them, reacts to them (because they are slow) and gets ahead by defending them.
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On April 26 2014 03:57 TheDwf wrote:Show nested quote +On April 26 2014 03:50 Salient wrote:
Terran isn't weak. It's just boring. MMM maybe plus VG since 2010. Indeed, it's not like WoL was Marines/Tanks in TvT (and some mech) and TvZ (and some mech). Marauders are not central at all in those match-ups, but whatever. Thanks for the umpteenth hollow "MMM spam since 2010!" comment.
You know Bio (MMM spam since 2010) has been dominant in all three matchups for much if not most of the history of SC2.
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On April 26 2014 03:57 TheDwf wrote:Show nested quote +On April 26 2014 03:50 Salient wrote:
Terran isn't weak. It's just boring. MMM maybe plus VG since 2010. Indeed, it's not like WoL was Marines/Tanks in TvT (and some mech) and TvZ (and some mech). Marauders are not central at all in those match-ups, but whatever. Thanks for the umpteenth hollow "MMM spam since 2010!" comment.
Oh how I miss Marine/Tank TvZ
It felt like how one imagines Starcraft to be.
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On April 26 2014 04:00 Salient wrote:Show nested quote +On April 26 2014 03:57 TheDwf wrote:On April 26 2014 03:50 Salient wrote:
Terran isn't weak. It's just boring. MMM maybe plus VG since 2010. Indeed, it's not like WoL was Marines/Tanks in TvT (and some mech) and TvZ (and some mech). Marauders are not central at all in those match-ups, but whatever. Thanks for the umpteenth hollow "MMM spam since 2010!" comment. You know Bio (MMM spam since 2010) has been dominant in all three matchups for much if not most of the history of SC2.
You know using Tanks or not with your bio composition makes a huge difference?
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On April 26 2014 03:50 y0su wrote:Show nested quote +On April 26 2014 03:34 TheDwf wrote:On April 26 2014 03:19 DinoMight wrote:
EDIT - and I think Terrans need to be a bit more creative in how they approach the game. Smashing face first into Photon Overcharge and then complaining about it is silly. TY vs. CJherO on Outboxer was awesome. Yeah, because CC rax gas on a 2p map into a Tank drop can completely be a standard way to play... The map also played a big part in that strategy (being able to hit the natural mineral line AND being out of PO range with tanks)
And being able to knock down the collapsible rocks to protect the Tank position.
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On April 26 2014 03:50 Salient wrote:
Terran isn't weak. It's just boring. MMM maybe plus VG since 2010. Zerg and Toss have many diverse and interesting builds. Terran really doesn't. Any Terran tech opening is almost considered cheese. IMO, the problem is not with Zerg or Toss. Those races are diverse and interesting. The problem is with Terran. MMM is so incredibly powerful and versatile that it becomes dangerous to buff other units that could synergize with the MMM. Example: pre-nerf Widow Mines and Hellbats. IMO, Terran is the worst-designed race in SC2. It is quite powerful, despite all the QQ. But it seems tedious and boring.
You're contradicting youself when you say Terran isn't weak but then claim, "Zerg and Toss have many diverse and interesting builds. Terran really doesn't." The fact that Terran has so little options is a weakness in itself. The inability to have any early and innovate builds in this current STOG (which are strong) makes them predictable; Protoss can pretty much do whatever they want in the first 8-10 minutes by making one unit...MSC. And, yes, I agree, it is getting very boring to watch.
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On April 26 2014 04:00 Salient wrote:Show nested quote +On April 26 2014 03:57 TheDwf wrote:On April 26 2014 03:50 Salient wrote:
Terran isn't weak. It's just boring. MMM maybe plus VG since 2010. Indeed, it's not like WoL was Marines/Tanks in TvT (and some mech) and TvZ (and some mech). Marauders are not central at all in those match-ups, but whatever. Thanks for the umpteenth hollow "MMM spam since 2010!" comment. You know Bio (MMM spam since 2010) has been dominant in all three matchups for much if not most of the history of SC2.
There was this brief but glorious period where ZvT was marine,tank,medivac vs muta,ling,bling. Imo it remains to this day the best the game has ever been. Then blizzard screwed it up.
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On April 26 2014 04:04 royalroadweed wrote:Show nested quote +On April 26 2014 04:00 Salient wrote:On April 26 2014 03:57 TheDwf wrote:On April 26 2014 03:50 Salient wrote:
Terran isn't weak. It's just boring. MMM maybe plus VG since 2010. Indeed, it's not like WoL was Marines/Tanks in TvT (and some mech) and TvZ (and some mech). Marauders are not central at all in those match-ups, but whatever. Thanks for the umpteenth hollow "MMM spam since 2010!" comment. You know Bio (MMM spam since 2010) has been dominant in all three matchups for much if not most of the history of SC2. There was this brief but glorious period where ZvT was marine,tank,medivac vs muta,ling,bling. Imo it remains to this day the best the game has ever been. Then blizzard screwed it up.
I remember Stephano developing the Ling/Infestor style, not David Kim...
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On April 26 2014 04:07 Big J wrote:Show nested quote +On April 26 2014 04:04 royalroadweed wrote:On April 26 2014 04:00 Salient wrote:On April 26 2014 03:57 TheDwf wrote:On April 26 2014 03:50 Salient wrote:
Terran isn't weak. It's just boring. MMM maybe plus VG since 2010. Indeed, it's not like WoL was Marines/Tanks in TvT (and some mech) and TvZ (and some mech). Marauders are not central at all in those match-ups, but whatever. Thanks for the umpteenth hollow "MMM spam since 2010!" comment. You know Bio (MMM spam since 2010) has been dominant in all three matchups for much if not most of the history of SC2. There was this brief but glorious period where ZvT was marine,tank,medivac vs muta,ling,bling. Imo it remains to this day the best the game has ever been. Then blizzard screwed it up. I remember Stephano developing the Ling/Infestor style, not David Kim...
+2 range queens. Otherwise ling/infestor dies to hellions.
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On April 26 2014 04:02 SirPinky wrote:Show nested quote +On April 26 2014 03:50 Salient wrote:
Terran isn't weak. It's just boring. MMM maybe plus VG since 2010. Zerg and Toss have many diverse and interesting builds. Terran really doesn't. Any Terran tech opening is almost considered cheese. IMO, the problem is not with Zerg or Toss. Those races are diverse and interesting. The problem is with Terran. MMM is so incredibly powerful and versatile that it becomes dangerous to buff other units that could synergize with the MMM. Example: pre-nerf Widow Mines and Hellbats. IMO, Terran is the worst-designed race in SC2. It is quite powerful, despite all the QQ. But it seems tedious and boring. You're contradicting youself when you say Terran isn't weak but then claim, "Zerg and Toss have many diverse and interesting builds. Terran really doesn't." The fact that Terran has so little options is a weakness in itself. The inability to have any early and innovate builds in this current STOG (which are strong) makes them predictable; Protoss can pretty much do whatever they want in the first 8-10 minutes by making one unit...MSC. And, yes, I agree, it is getting very boring to watch.
Terran is basically a one-trick pony. It only knows one trick, but it's a really good one! IMO the "standard" Terran openings have always been the most stable of the "standard" builds. In WoL, you could literally open 1 fax FE every single game without scouting and still hold anything your Zerg or Toss opponent threw at you. Marines + repair + bunker + scans + turrets. I saw MKP beat a 6 pool with CC First in GSL! It was absurd. Zerg and Toss had to be more reactive.
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On April 26 2014 04:08 royalroadweed wrote:Show nested quote +On April 26 2014 04:07 Big J wrote:On April 26 2014 04:04 royalroadweed wrote:On April 26 2014 04:00 Salient wrote:On April 26 2014 03:57 TheDwf wrote:On April 26 2014 03:50 Salient wrote:
Terran isn't weak. It's just boring. MMM maybe plus VG since 2010. Indeed, it's not like WoL was Marines/Tanks in TvT (and some mech) and TvZ (and some mech). Marauders are not central at all in those match-ups, but whatever. Thanks for the umpteenth hollow "MMM spam since 2010!" comment. You know Bio (MMM spam since 2010) has been dominant in all three matchups for much if not most of the history of SC2. There was this brief but glorious period where ZvT was marine,tank,medivac vs muta,ling,bling. Imo it remains to this day the best the game has ever been. Then blizzard screwed it up. I remember Stephano developing the Ling/Infestor style, not David Kim... +2 range queens. Otherwise ling/infestor dies to hellions.
Oh really? Then Stephano did not win 3 Premier Tournaments (against Koreans) before that patch and placed second in another one.
DRG did not switch to ling/infestor for most (or all) of his TvZ games in the last GSL before the queen patch.
Hell, I got BMed by (Master) Terrans on the EU ladder for playing Muta/ling/bling in early 2012, because I was "playing a stupid style that noone does anymore" (or whatever that guy said back then), when they all tried to blindcounter with double port banshee bullshit.
Muta/ling/bling was on its deathbed before the queenpatch and only came back for the 2-2 Muta/ling/bling timings in late 2012. And when Leenock and DRG wanted to be gimmicky.
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On April 26 2014 04:12 Salient wrote:Show nested quote +On April 26 2014 04:02 SirPinky wrote:On April 26 2014 03:50 Salient wrote:
Terran isn't weak. It's just boring. MMM maybe plus VG since 2010. Zerg and Toss have many diverse and interesting builds. Terran really doesn't. Any Terran tech opening is almost considered cheese. IMO, the problem is not with Zerg or Toss. Those races are diverse and interesting. The problem is with Terran. MMM is so incredibly powerful and versatile that it becomes dangerous to buff other units that could synergize with the MMM. Example: pre-nerf Widow Mines and Hellbats. IMO, Terran is the worst-designed race in SC2. It is quite powerful, despite all the QQ. But it seems tedious and boring. You're contradicting youself when you say Terran isn't weak but then claim, "Zerg and Toss have many diverse and interesting builds. Terran really doesn't." The fact that Terran has so little options is a weakness in itself. The inability to have any early and innovate builds in this current STOG (which are strong) makes them predictable; Protoss can pretty much do whatever they want in the first 8-10 minutes by making one unit...MSC. And, yes, I agree, it is getting very boring to watch. Terran is basically a one-trick pony. It only knows one trick, but it's a really good one! IMO the "standard" Terran openings have always been the most stable of the "standard" builds. In WoL, you could literally open 1 fax FE every single game without scouting and still hold anything your Zerg or Toss opponent threw at you. Marines + repair + bunker + scans + turrets. I saw MKP beat a 6 pool with CC First in GSL! It was absurd. Zerg and Toss had to be more reactive.
Vs suhohin on ohana? That was a once-in-a-lifetime thing.
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On April 26 2014 04:12 Salient wrote:Show nested quote +On April 26 2014 04:02 SirPinky wrote:On April 26 2014 03:50 Salient wrote:
Terran isn't weak. It's just boring. MMM maybe plus VG since 2010. Zerg and Toss have many diverse and interesting builds. Terran really doesn't. Any Terran tech opening is almost considered cheese. IMO, the problem is not with Zerg or Toss. Those races are diverse and interesting. The problem is with Terran. MMM is so incredibly powerful and versatile that it becomes dangerous to buff other units that could synergize with the MMM. Example: pre-nerf Widow Mines and Hellbats. IMO, Terran is the worst-designed race in SC2. It is quite powerful, despite all the QQ. But it seems tedious and boring. You're contradicting youself when you say Terran isn't weak but then claim, "Zerg and Toss have many diverse and interesting builds. Terran really doesn't." The fact that Terran has so little options is a weakness in itself. The inability to have any early and innovate builds in this current STOG (which are strong) makes them predictable; Protoss can pretty much do whatever they want in the first 8-10 minutes by making one unit...MSC. And, yes, I agree, it is getting very boring to watch. Terran is basically a one-trick pony. It only knows one trick, but it's a really good one! IMO the "standard" Terran openings have always been the most stable of the "standard" builds. In WoL, you could literally open 1 fax FE every single game without scouting and still hold anything your Zerg or Toss opponent threw at you. Marines + repair + bunker + scans + turrets. I saw MKP beat a 6 pool with CC First in GSL! It was absurd. Zerg and Toss had to be more reactive.
The sad part is you're probably not trolling. Have fun holding a 6 gate or an Immortal bust without scouting it.
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On April 26 2014 04:01 TheDwf wrote:Show nested quote +On April 26 2014 04:00 Salient wrote:On April 26 2014 03:57 TheDwf wrote:On April 26 2014 03:50 Salient wrote:
Terran isn't weak. It's just boring. MMM maybe plus VG since 2010. Indeed, it's not like WoL was Marines/Tanks in TvT (and some mech) and TvZ (and some mech). Marauders are not central at all in those match-ups, but whatever. Thanks for the umpteenth hollow "MMM spam since 2010!" comment. You know Bio (MMM spam since 2010) has been dominant in all three matchups for much if not most of the history of SC2. You know using Tanks or not with your bio composition makes a huge difference?
I agree. There's a correlation between the amount of tanks a terran army has and how quickly that player loses.
Usually, the more tanks, the quicker the loss since about half of the protoss arsenal counters that specific unit.
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On April 26 2014 04:19 TheDwf wrote:Show nested quote +On April 26 2014 04:12 Salient wrote:On April 26 2014 04:02 SirPinky wrote:On April 26 2014 03:50 Salient wrote:
Terran isn't weak. It's just boring. MMM maybe plus VG since 2010. Zerg and Toss have many diverse and interesting builds. Terran really doesn't. Any Terran tech opening is almost considered cheese. IMO, the problem is not with Zerg or Toss. Those races are diverse and interesting. The problem is with Terran. MMM is so incredibly powerful and versatile that it becomes dangerous to buff other units that could synergize with the MMM. Example: pre-nerf Widow Mines and Hellbats. IMO, Terran is the worst-designed race in SC2. It is quite powerful, despite all the QQ. But it seems tedious and boring. You're contradicting youself when you say Terran isn't weak but then claim, "Zerg and Toss have many diverse and interesting builds. Terran really doesn't." The fact that Terran has so little options is a weakness in itself. The inability to have any early and innovate builds in this current STOG (which are strong) makes them predictable; Protoss can pretty much do whatever they want in the first 8-10 minutes by making one unit...MSC. And, yes, I agree, it is getting very boring to watch. Terran is basically a one-trick pony. It only knows one trick, but it's a really good one! IMO the "standard" Terran openings have always been the most stable of the "standard" builds. In WoL, you could literally open 1 fax FE every single game without scouting and still hold anything your Zerg or Toss opponent threw at you. Marines + repair + bunker + scans + turrets. I saw MKP beat a 6 pool with CC First in GSL! It was absurd. Zerg and Toss had to be more reactive. The sad part is you're probably not trolling. Have fun holding a 6 gate or an Immortal bust without scouting it.
I'm talking about the opening. 1 rax FE was safe against anything. It could hold a one base 4 gate all in or 6 pool without scouting it! It's true that even Terran needed to eventually scout for 2 base all ins.
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On April 26 2014 04:22 Salient wrote:Show nested quote +On April 26 2014 04:19 TheDwf wrote:On April 26 2014 04:12 Salient wrote:On April 26 2014 04:02 SirPinky wrote:On April 26 2014 03:50 Salient wrote:
Terran isn't weak. It's just boring. MMM maybe plus VG since 2010. Zerg and Toss have many diverse and interesting builds. Terran really doesn't. Any Terran tech opening is almost considered cheese. IMO, the problem is not with Zerg or Toss. Those races are diverse and interesting. The problem is with Terran. MMM is so incredibly powerful and versatile that it becomes dangerous to buff other units that could synergize with the MMM. Example: pre-nerf Widow Mines and Hellbats. IMO, Terran is the worst-designed race in SC2. It is quite powerful, despite all the QQ. But it seems tedious and boring. You're contradicting youself when you say Terran isn't weak but then claim, "Zerg and Toss have many diverse and interesting builds. Terran really doesn't." The fact that Terran has so little options is a weakness in itself. The inability to have any early and innovate builds in this current STOG (which are strong) makes them predictable; Protoss can pretty much do whatever they want in the first 8-10 minutes by making one unit...MSC. And, yes, I agree, it is getting very boring to watch. Terran is basically a one-trick pony. It only knows one trick, but it's a really good one! IMO the "standard" Terran openings have always been the most stable of the "standard" builds. In WoL, you could literally open 1 fax FE every single game without scouting and still hold anything your Zerg or Toss opponent threw at you. Marines + repair + bunker + scans + turrets. I saw MKP beat a 6 pool with CC First in GSL! It was absurd. Zerg and Toss had to be more reactive. The sad part is you're probably not trolling. Have fun holding a 6 gate or an Immortal bust without scouting it. I'm talking about the opening. 1 rax FE was safe against anything. It could hold a one base 4 gate all in or 6 pool without scouting it! It's true that even Terran needed to eventually scout for 2 base all ins.
So what? FFE was safe against anything Zerg could throw, hatch first is safe against anything Terran can throw... Your point? And no, you couldn't hold a 4g without scouting it since you needed extra bunkers and pre-pulled SCVs...
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On April 26 2014 04:22 Salient wrote:Show nested quote +On April 26 2014 04:19 TheDwf wrote:On April 26 2014 04:12 Salient wrote:On April 26 2014 04:02 SirPinky wrote:On April 26 2014 03:50 Salient wrote:
Terran isn't weak. It's just boring. MMM maybe plus VG since 2010. Zerg and Toss have many diverse and interesting builds. Terran really doesn't. Any Terran tech opening is almost considered cheese. IMO, the problem is not with Zerg or Toss. Those races are diverse and interesting. The problem is with Terran. MMM is so incredibly powerful and versatile that it becomes dangerous to buff other units that could synergize with the MMM. Example: pre-nerf Widow Mines and Hellbats. IMO, Terran is the worst-designed race in SC2. It is quite powerful, despite all the QQ. But it seems tedious and boring. You're contradicting youself when you say Terran isn't weak but then claim, "Zerg and Toss have many diverse and interesting builds. Terran really doesn't." The fact that Terran has so little options is a weakness in itself. The inability to have any early and innovate builds in this current STOG (which are strong) makes them predictable; Protoss can pretty much do whatever they want in the first 8-10 minutes by making one unit...MSC. And, yes, I agree, it is getting very boring to watch. Terran is basically a one-trick pony. It only knows one trick, but it's a really good one! IMO the "standard" Terran openings have always been the most stable of the "standard" builds. In WoL, you could literally open 1 fax FE every single game without scouting and still hold anything your Zerg or Toss opponent threw at you. Marines + repair + bunker + scans + turrets. I saw MKP beat a 6 pool with CC First in GSL! It was absurd. Zerg and Toss had to be more reactive. The sad part is you're probably not trolling. Have fun holding a 6 gate or an Immortal bust without scouting it. I'm talking about the opening. 1 rax FE was safe against anything. It could hold a one base 4 gate all in or 6 pool without scouting it! It's true that even Terran needed to eventually scout for 2 base all ins.
You couldn't hold a lot of Protoss 1 base all-ins without scouting and building bunkers in the right places. Even holding a 4gate with the standard 1 bunker on the low ground is pretty questionable. Similarly, you were unlikely to hold a Roach/Bane/Ling with 1 bunker -- which is why it was so popular.
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On April 26 2014 04:12 Salient wrote:Show nested quote +On April 26 2014 04:02 SirPinky wrote:On April 26 2014 03:50 Salient wrote:
Terran isn't weak. It's just boring. MMM maybe plus VG since 2010. Zerg and Toss have many diverse and interesting builds. Terran really doesn't. Any Terran tech opening is almost considered cheese. IMO, the problem is not with Zerg or Toss. Those races are diverse and interesting. The problem is with Terran. MMM is so incredibly powerful and versatile that it becomes dangerous to buff other units that could synergize with the MMM. Example: pre-nerf Widow Mines and Hellbats. IMO, Terran is the worst-designed race in SC2. It is quite powerful, despite all the QQ. But it seems tedious and boring. You're contradicting youself when you say Terran isn't weak but then claim, "Zerg and Toss have many diverse and interesting builds. Terran really doesn't." The fact that Terran has so little options is a weakness in itself. The inability to have any early and innovate builds in this current STOG (which are strong) makes them predictable; Protoss can pretty much do whatever they want in the first 8-10 minutes by making one unit...MSC. And, yes, I agree, it is getting very boring to watch. Terran is basically a one-trick pony. It only knows one trick, but it's a really good one! IMO the "standard" Terran openings have always been the most stable of the "standard" builds. In WoL, you could literally open 1 fax FE every single game without scouting and still hold anything your Zerg or Toss opponent threw at you. Marines + repair + bunker + scans + turrets. I saw MKP beat a 6 pool with CC First in GSL! It was absurd. Zerg and Toss had to be more reactive.
You had to scout to hold just about every all-in with 1 Rax FE in TvP and TvT, only in TvZ could you reliably hold most all-ins without scouting with the standard 1 Rax FE into Hellion Banshee.
And every race has amazing hold games, we have Jaedong vs I think Mana? Where he held an unscouted proxy 2 gate with hatch first, Classic vs Parting on Habitation Station from GSL ect.
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On April 26 2014 03:57 TheDwf wrote:Show nested quote +On April 26 2014 03:50 Salient wrote:
Terran isn't weak. It's just boring. MMM maybe plus VG since 2010. Indeed, it's not like WoL was Marines/Tanks in TvT (and some mech) and TvZ (and some mech). Marauders are not central at all in those match-ups, but whatever. Thanks for the umpteenth hollow "MMM spam since 2010!" comment.
5 units spam in TvP ohshit. Not like Zealot HT Archon Colossi and Stalkers aren't 5 units either.
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On April 26 2014 04:31 Faust852 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 26 2014 03:57 TheDwf wrote:On April 26 2014 03:50 Salient wrote:
Terran isn't weak. It's just boring. MMM maybe plus VG since 2010. Indeed, it's not like WoL was Marines/Tanks in TvT (and some mech) and TvZ (and some mech). Marauders are not central at all in those match-ups, but whatever. Thanks for the umpteenth hollow "MMM spam since 2010!" comment. 5 units spam in TvP ohshit. Not like Zealot HT Archon Colossi and Stalkers aren't 5 units either.
The popular Maru style doesn't even bother with Vikings or Ghosts. Just MMM. Literally 3 different unit types.
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EPT
