EPTInvite TEAMS only as we've already heard there is a maximum amount of each team that can participate. So only invite the top tier clans, OGS, IM, etc.
NASL: Koreans? Top Koreans? - Page 58
| Forum Index > SC2 General |
|
emc
United States3088 Posts
Invite TEAMS only as we've already heard there is a maximum amount of each team that can participate. So only invite the top tier clans, OGS, IM, etc. | ||
|
AxionSteel
United States7754 Posts
On March 16 2011 16:36 cheesemaster wrote: 10-15 koreans is totally reasonable i dont think anyone is expecting/ wanting anymore than that. I dunno, reading the topic seems like everyone is bitching about something. Some want the whole league to be Korean as they're the best players, others want none. Basically there will almost certainly be a limit, I just know it! Can even remember Intcontrol or someone saying it. whether it's 5,10 or 15 there will be one! NASL will decide what they want for their league and we'll have to deal with it  Can't wait to see NA/Europe and Koreans battling it out! | ||
|
cheesemaster
Canada1975 Posts
On March 16 2011 16:46 emc wrote: invite errybody, I see no reason for discrimination. Let the best of the best compete and lets see who truly are the best. I think a lot of NA players don't/can't go to GSL because 1.) it's in korea and is expensive as hell and 2.) they are scared to fail. I think with NASL we'll be able to see NA players actually compete with koreans on their home turf and I think those fears will be alleviated. Invite TEAMS only as we've already heard there is a maximum amount of each team that can participate. So only invite the top tier clans, OGS, IM, etc. They took out the rule of cap on number of members in a team that can participate ^^ | ||
|
TheButtonmen
Canada1403 Posts
| ||
|
cheesemaster
Canada1975 Posts
On March 16 2011 16:48 AxionSteel wrote: Agree 10 is fine, dunno, reading the topic seems like everyone is bitching about something. Some want the whole league to be Korean as they're the best players, others want none. Basically there will almost certainly be a limit around 10 or so, which is fine. Can't wait to see NA/Europe and Koreans battling it out! I think thats what we all want >=) or most of us at least XD Any limit set for korea would have to be set for europe as well i presume, otherwise it would really feel like discrimination. | ||
|
Parcelleus
Australia1662 Posts
NASL reminds me of the American soccer league, while they may get Pele, Maradona or Beckham to play in the league, everyone knows it isnt the strongest league in the world no matter how the americans sensationalize it. IMO NASL should drop the sensationalistic language like 'best players in the world' as its plain untrue and doesnt help e-sports. If the NASL just was it's own tournament , where the best players from Korea (who ARE the best players in the world) could try to qualify for the main draw of NASL, then the NASL would have alot better credability. As it is, its cute and a welcomed e-sports tournament, but nothing what it claims to be. | ||
|
SwizzY
United States1549 Posts
I personally think: hell fucking no. For NASL to even consider such a proposal destroys the very definition of healthy competition and damages the prospect of the future of a more globalized E-sports community. Sure, if you NASLr's are that insecure over your SC2 skills in comparison to that of KR, whether in macro,micro, gimmicks, what have you, then the decision to limit or even BAR top KR players from playing would make perfect sense. Even though I'm not a fan of the quota idea either, it'd be the middle ground for those wanting make an exclusively NA/EU tourney. All in my humble opinion. NOTE - I thought the idea was to make NASL a legit, worldwide, prestigious tournament that actively involved all serious sc2 players around the globe? Not just a glorified LAN party. | ||
|
doihy
668 Posts
| ||
|
Excomm
United States152 Posts
On March 16 2011 16:40 cheesemaster wrote: I think most people just want to see the highest quality players playing the best possible games, a vocal majority seems to think this way over the almost 60 pages in this thread. No one is saying it has to be GSL in the united states but as ive stated previously even without any korean invites they will penetrate into the league anyways, the open tournament is just that open i dont think it will discriminate based on nationality and lots of top korean players that participate will make it through so even if you dont want to see koreans in the tournament they will be there! I don't think anyone is disputing the dominance of the GSL participants (especially Koreans) in SC2. The point I am trying to make is that the players should have to choose between playing in the GSL and the NASL. Otherwise the NASL will simply be funneling more money into the Korean pro SC2 economy with little support to the NASL itself. I would not be surprised if the majority of the money in the NASL was won by GSL participants (in effect making the NASL the GSL of the United States). By excluding the GSL participants, the NASL is free to attract the best players (even some current GSL players) through promotion and prize money and this will help promote SC2 in the United States (as Korea currently has a stranglehold on top SC2 talent). The point is not to exclude Koreans, the point is to create a situation where players have to choose between playing in the GSL and playing in the NASL. This will dilute the SC2 talent across the two leagues (regardless of whether all of the participants in both leagues are Korean or otherwise). | ||
|
dizzy101
Netherlands2066 Posts
| ||
|
ct2299
380 Posts
What happened to all the smart-alecs and wise-asses that said they "couldn't wait to see Koreans have to go to a foreign country to compete where they would be the minority" as well as all the talk about "finally foreigners finally having the home court advantage." I've heard that same line so many times the past year before SC2 was even released, and now that there is finally a league with legit prize money outside of Korea, so many people in this community are afraid to have Koreans participate. People are trembling (metaphorically) at the thought of having top Korean participate after people saw their favorite foreign players being used to mop the floor by a bunch of Code A players from Korea. It's sickening that people would even think of excluding Korean players from the NASL. Why would you do that? Just because the Korean players work harder, put more effort into their game play and take it more seriously, is not a reason to exclude them from a big tournament. You see players like Jinro and Huk do better after living with oGs not simply because they are talented players, but because they are able to adopt the Korean work-ethic and attitude towards pro-gaming. Excluding the top players right now is like taking Michael Jordan out of the NBA before because he was "too good", or taking Kobe Bryant, Kevin Durant, Lebron James, Dwane Wade and other superstars because they are "too good" compared to the average player in the league. Having superstars lifts other people's game, and makes them work harder. Excluding Koreans will just breed complacency and laziness amongst the foreign pool. Koreans as they are right now are NEEDED to show people the skill gap and provide a wake up call to foreigners to wake up and perhaps adopt a new approach towards preparation and practice. I tell you all now, simply excluding Koreans will just widen the gap that already exists. | ||
|
dredd276
United States80 Posts
| ||
|
dagene
United States75 Posts
| ||
|
nihlon
Sweden5581 Posts
| ||
|
Netsky
Australia1155 Posts
If you invite Korean teams to NASL, it needs to be accepted that it is likely that they will dominate which will result in a higher standard of play and the best players winning. If you don't invite Korean teams to NASL, it needs to be accepted that the league consists of "second-tier" players which will result in a lower standard of play and the best of the second-tier winning. GOM, very kindly I might add, provides charity spots (and a place to stay) for top-foreigner players who can't otherwise get into the league through the qualification tournament to spark interest with the foreign scene in the GSL and the Korean SC2 scene generally. Why can't NASL reciprocate this gesture? | ||
|
zerat00l
United States100 Posts
That's my opinion, anyway. Edit: I should add, by the way, that I don't think we'd be having this conversation if the general consensus was that Koreans were generally worse players than westerners. As it stands, the only reason for this discussion is that they are "too good," which seems a bit like disqualifying the fastest person in a race because they were "too fast," to me. I'm afraid I just don't understand that perspective. | ||
|
baoluvboa
743 Posts
On March 16 2011 17:30 nihlon wrote: If you'd invite "the best players in the world" we would have a league full of almost exclusively Koreans based players that except for a few english speaking once would at most interact with the community in poorly translated interviews. That doesn't sound very exciting to me... If we wanted dramas and exposures we would be watching Jersey Shore or American Idol. Highest level of tournament deserves highest level of players. | ||
|
xarthaz
1704 Posts
| ||
|
baoluvboa
743 Posts
On March 16 2011 17:39 xarthaz wrote: For the good of esports, regional limitations must exist. Without, concepts like pride, e-patriotism would disappear You can have pride and loyalty in your favorite players, not limited to race or geography. And for regional tournament in NA, we have MLG along with other smaller tourneys. NASL advertised to be the best of the best which means that regional limitation should not apply in this tournament otherwise it would just be a farce. | ||
|
Grezzz
United Kingdom78 Posts
Are europeans invited? What's the difference? It just seems ridiculous to me that you could consider excluding players because they're too good or happen to be from a certain location. This is supposed to be a top level competition, not some amateur tournament. If a korean player is willing to play in the league, has the necessary skills and is willing to do everything required of them, including flying out for the offline finals - what's the problem? I can absolutely guarantee you that if you just invited purely North American players, people would get bored. There simply aren't 50 good enough North American players that people would want to pay to watch, so you have to branch out. Nobody seems to object to inviting europeans, so why are koreans any different? Look at the TSL, there are a healthy mix of top level Korean, American and European players, and people are excited about it. There's the "Who can beat a korean" thing going on, it stirs up a lot of home support for the "foreigners" and it gives the TSL credibility as a real top level competitive tournament. If you kicked out all the Koreans and just invited a bunch of other Americans it wouldn't be anywhere near as exciting as it is. Generally I dislike the idea of invitationals, I would prefer to see some kind of qualification process to ensure fairness. I think GSL has it right at the moment. | ||
| ||
