EPTNew Maps in 1v1 Pool - Page 42
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PPTouch
99 Posts
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ShadowWolf
United States197 Posts
Metal: ~30 seconds Slag: ~24 seconds Steppes: ~27 seconds So basically there's no real way for anyone to respond to anything in close position slag pits. | ||
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MK4512
Canada938 Posts
... Not happy... | ||
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mishimaBeef
Canada2259 Posts
On February 27 2011 11:59 MK4512 wrote: Can someone explain to me how to FE on these new maps as protoss? Multiple entrances to natural (which are as wide as a whale), backdoor rocks to natural, even a 3gate sentry expand can't do anything! ... Not happy... get creative bro... block some chokes... | ||
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ch33psh33p
7650 Posts
On February 27 2011 11:59 MK4512 wrote: Can someone explain to me how to FE on these new maps as protoss? Multiple entrances to natural (which are as wide as a whale), backdoor rocks to natural, even a 3gate sentry expand can't do anything! ... Not happy... I've been noticing this as well. It's become SIGNIFICANTLY easier to crush expanding 3 gate sentry play just using speedlings. Trapping is so much harder, and speedlings can just pull out, wait out ff's, and deny nexus again. | ||
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MK4512
Canada938 Posts
On February 27 2011 12:00 mishimaBeef wrote: get creative bro... block some chokes... With say, a 15 nexus [or any really early expand], there's no way you can get buildings up in time to block both chokes, and even then rocks pose the same problem that blistering sands did... (Backwater Gulch) With a sentry expand, defending early stim pushes, or early zerg aggression takes like 1000 forcefields, it's almost impossible! | ||
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mishimaBeef
Canada2259 Posts
On February 27 2011 12:02 MK4512 wrote: With say, a 15 nexus [or any really early expand], there's no way you can get buildings up in time to block both chokes, and even then rocks pose the same problem that blistering sands did... (Backwater Gulch) With a sentry expand, defending early stim pushes, or early zerg aggression takes like 1000 forcefields, it's almost impossible! I don't recommend a 15 nexus... but against zerg (assuming bottom position) i would try walling off the bottom entrance to the natural and keep like 1 ranged unit behind it and make a tight entrance (slight wall off not total) on the other side and keep army there... (to clarify, wall the bottom entrance to the natural so ur ramp is contained inside the walloff) vs terran if u 3 gate expand u shouldnt even need to use chokes if u macro well and use forcefields properly... though with 3 sentries early on saving up energy you could probably do something with the fat ramp... (backwater gulch) | ||
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FrostOtter
United States537 Posts
On February 27 2011 12:02 MK4512 wrote: With say, a 15 nexus [or any really early expand], there's no way you can get buildings up in time to block both chokes, and even then rocks pose the same problem that blistering sands did... (Backwater Gulch) With a sentry expand, defending early stim pushes, or early zerg aggression takes like 1000 forcefields, it's almost impossible! It is almost as though you might have to learn multiple build orders and do different strategies in different positions on different maps. You might even *Gasp* have to be creative and find something new that works! User was temp banned for this post. | ||
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MK4512
Canada938 Posts
On February 27 2011 12:06 mishimaBeef wrote: I don't recommend a 15 nexus... but against zerg (assuming bottom position) i would try walling off the bottom entrance to the natural and keep like 1 ranged unit behind it and make a tight entrance (slight wall off not total) on the other side and keep army there... vs terran if u 3 gate expand u shouldnt even need to use chokes if u macro well and use forcefields properly... though with 3 sentries early on saving up energy you could probably do something with the fat ramp... (backwater gulch) Well, that's the problem vs. z, I can't get the buildings up fast enough to block speedling aggression vs. terran, if theres nothing to pin them against, you can't engage unless you have like 8 sentries to make a huge box... In either case, it makes an FE much, much harder than it was, which was the exact opposite idea of these new maps... It is almost as though you might have to learn multiple build orders and do different strategies in different positions on different maps. You might even *Gasp* have to be creative and find something new that works! I'm not saying I know every build order, but if a sentry expand, basically the most safe opening vs. zerg, can't hold down an expo, then I think that there is a problem. Thanks for being snarky tho, appreciate it. | ||
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mishimaBeef
Canada2259 Posts
On February 27 2011 12:09 MK4512 wrote: Well, that's the problem vs. z, I can't get the buildings up fast enough to block speedling aggression vs. terran, if theres nothing to pin them against, you can't engage unless you have like 8 sentries to make a huge box... In either case, it makes an FE much, much harder than it was, which was the exact opposite idea of these new maps... how fast of a speedling aggression are we talking? 10 pool? expo into speedling? i would just go and make all the buildings on low ground maybe and do the wall off i said vs terran u only really need like 5 good forcefields when they engage to let your zealots go up and slice em up... just gotta micro properly | ||
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MK4512
Canada938 Posts
On February 27 2011 12:10 mishimaBeef wrote: how fast of a speedling aggression are we talking? 10 pool? expo into speedling? i would just go and make all the buildings on low ground maybe and do the wall off i said vs terran u only really need like 5 good forcefields when they engage to let your zealots go up and slice em up... just gotta micro properly speedling expo, and I do make buildings on the low ground, but they can't get up fast enough and the lings can run by... | ||
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Deleted User 108965
1096 Posts
On February 27 2011 12:10 mishimaBeef wrote: how fast of a speedling aggression are we talking? 10 pool? expo into speedling? i would just go and make all the buildings on low ground maybe and do the wall off i said vs terran u only really need like 5 good forcefields when they engage to let your zealots go up and slice em up... just gotta micro properly if you invest all of your money into structures to make chokes then you dont have enough units to defend anything against any type of speedling aggression. the way i see it you cant safely take the expansion unless you are either A. doing aggression to keep the zerg at their base instead of attacking or B. wait until you have enough units to handle any pressure while attacking or C. take a huge risk and just expand anyways without proper protection whether thats good or bad i dont know, but its definitely different and feels really weird compared to the usual way that games play out on old maps | ||
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mishimaBeef
Canada2259 Posts
On February 27 2011 12:12 MK4512 wrote: speedling expo, and I do make buildings on the low ground, but they can't get up fast enough and the lings can run by... look at the botom right position, i believe if u make a pylon gateway and cy core u can wall off the ramp inside ur wall with a 1 zealot slot on the fat ramp side... yes they can go around so you might have to make another little wall off on the other side with pylon and gateways for another zealot to hold on the other side (or make it tight on the side towards natural)... if buildings aint gettin up fast enough... i would suggest to do a tight wall off somewhere when u move off ur ramp... im sure it's possible you just gotta be extremely careful and have it well planned out... maybe just practice good wall off locations and how you will place your army vs computer | ||
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Stymie[SC]
Canada10 Posts
4)Shakuras Plateau This map we decided to remove for a different reason. There isn't a huge problem with this map, but we felt there aren't enough interesting features of this map. The natural expansion is easy to take and defend; there are only two possible attack paths only one of which is generally used, and main bases aren't easy to harass. For a change, we wanted to replace this relatively plain map with something new. Interesting games don't come from "interesting maps". Blizzard needs to check there definition of "interesting maps"as there doesn't need to be destructible rocks into every corner of every base to create interesting maps. -_- Shakuras Plateau was fine and had some of the most interesting and exiting games on it because of the fact that you could take your natural easily and the game could actually get further than all-in two base pushes. | ||
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uSnAmplified
United States1029 Posts
On February 27 2011 11:59 MK4512 wrote: been reviewing the maps with my protoss partner, any standard 14/14 speedlings is going to make taking a 2nd base with 3 gate sentry or forge expand near impossible on some maps.Can someone explain to me how to FE on these new maps as protoss? Multiple entrances to natural (which are as wide as a whale), backdoor rocks to natural, even a 3gate sentry expand can't do anything! ... Not happy... | ||
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Oxyoxygen
United States68 Posts
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/2sf4al.jpg) | ||
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Feb
98 Posts
and is typhon peaks supposed to be a replacement for shakuras plateau? cuz superficially they look similar but it's like it took the worst elements of shakuras and put them on one map. blizzard clearly needed to do something with all the qq over the map pool, didn't expect something so huge though. though the thought of some of the gsl maps making it i thought was a pipe dream, neutral buildings, one geyser expos, rich geysers, and rocks blocking half a ramp (with non-standard health amounts), just didn't seem blizzard's style. | ||
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Zim23
United States1681 Posts
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monitor
United States2409 Posts
On February 27 2011 12:33 Zim23 wrote: Wow, the reasons they made the map changes are actually scary to me. They removed Shakuras because there weren't enough features? Complexity isn't the reason people like playing maps, sometimes (usually) simple macro is a good thing. Haha now I too am realizing the irony of Blizzard's decision. They originally said that maps were too complicated for players... now they take maps out because they're too simple? | ||
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uSnAmplified
United States1029 Posts
On February 27 2011 12:38 monitor wrote: The fact that they want maps to be overcomplicated with stupid features like destructible rocks but think actually good maps like shak are to boring is quite scary.Haha now I too am realizing the irony of Blizzard's decision. They originally said that maps were too complicated for players... now they take maps out because they're too simple? | ||
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