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On June 02 2011 21:18 Zorkmid wrote:
I don't have the inclination to watch the whole episode myself, but was Dentisy a guest on the most recent episode? Or was he a topic of conversation. SoTG battle report gogo.
Yes, there was a discussion about streaming and what makes a good stream, obviously Destiny came up and he later joined in the call and gave a few points, albeit quite unneeded but it was interesting to hear his thoughts.
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Northern Ireland2557 Posts
@The KY calm down champ and do some squats, if you don't think 4gating and 3gate voidray is cheese then I dunno what to say to you :p
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I honestly do not know why you people are bothering to discuss this still, this brings nothing but negativity to the board, but still you keep on doing it, can't you just try, for once, to actually listen to what people say, dont judge it into something you can troll, and move on?
SOTG has been and I think it will continue to be a great show, it is good entertainement with smart people who go out of their way to bring said entertainement to you guys, Incontrol is a humanbeing, while not being perfect, he is just honest and gives 100% of himself, some of you will hate, some will love, but most of you should atleast have respect enough to listen to whats actually being said before you start hatin. He will be missed in the show, but will continue to bring us lots of content in other ways, the guys that is left in the show are still the same, smart, good nerds that love the game, like us. Cant we just start enjoying this without debating it to death? :S
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TL is rapidly turning into a Politics board, jesus christ. One can't say a wrong word or two and two hundred people jump on him right away, relax holy cow.
Besides, most people are arguing against the opinions of people that are hundreds of times better than them at this game and hundreds of times more informed of the SC2 scene overall, you should give them some credit
Relax and have fun
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man i wish sotg ended after MLG, would have been a good discussion on games and results
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as gamers treat profanity as a non issue. Never compromise, not even in the face of armageddon.
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On June 02 2011 19:33 turdburgler wrote:Show nested quote +On June 02 2011 19:02 aquanda wrote:
if anyone seriously believes fuck is on the same offensive level as nigger you're an idiot. as an internet neck beard virgin i find the idea of anyone having sex just as offensive as black skin, as i dont have either. hurr more seriously though, calling people an idiot for disagreeing with your baseless opinion is kinda ironic Show nested quote +On June 02 2011 16:25 Doodsmack wrote:
Funny how many people on the Destiny side of teh debate like to pretend that nigga (said when addressing friends) and nigger are the same thing. thats destinys whole point though? wording is all about context and situation. it should be ok for destiny to say what he wants on his stream, within that context and setting its ok.
Yah, because calling someone nigger really just means that you are simply telling someone that they have black skin. Thank you for calling yourself an idiot by replying to my statement.
But you are the same person that trolled my earlier post though, so I'll just keep my statement at that, because it's obvious you are just here for your own personal amusement and nothing more.
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On June 02 2011 20:50 The KY wrote:Show nested quote +On June 02 2011 10:34 Pekkz wrote:On June 02 2011 09:48 The KY wrote:On June 02 2011 03:06 GuiMontag wrote:On June 02 2011 02:59 The KY wrote:On June 02 2011 01:24 -_- wrote:On June 02 2011 01:16 iNcontroL wrote:
I'm sorry if you think 4th place isn't an accomplishment. I'm sorry if you think it is telling that I am happy with that finish.
I will comfort myself by knowing you aren't anywhere near a progamer and literally have 0 grasp of what it takes to place that high in anything competitive. So I know without a shadow of doubt that you are 100% a completely irrelevant perspective on the matter. Calm down. I understand where you're coming from, but you don't know about my competitive background. Just because I'm not a progamer doesn't mean I haven't been succesful in my life. And just because you angry, doesn't mean you can proclaim that my perspective is irrelevant. Let's use a sports analogy. If Lebron James loses in the finals, do you think he'll be happy with his 2nd place finish? Do you think Derrick Rose is happy with his 3rd/4th place finish? And if they were, it would certainly speak to how good they think they are (not the best), and what their goals were (not to be a champion). Allow me to use another analogy. My football team is Tottenham Hotspur in the Premier League. In the 2009/2010 season they finished fourth. And I was fucking ECSTATIC. Fourth in what is probably the most prestigious league in the world? Above teams like Man City and Liverpool, coming within a hairs breadth of Arsenal? BEATING Arsenal and Chelsea along the way? Fourth was a fucking dream. Is that because Spurs are a lesser team than Chelsea, who would be unhappy with 4th? Yeah sure. Does that make the achievement any lesser for Tottenham? Er, no. It's still an amazing result for any team except for maybe 3. Being a lesser team than Chelsea and Man United is absolutely nothing to be ashamed of, if you're ahead of everyone else. The analogy is that for, say, IdrA, 4th is a disappointment. For iNcontroL it's astoundingly good. Is it because he's a lesser player than IdrA. Yep. Don't think he'd disagree with that (at least not right now, maybe after his wins his MLG  ). Is being proud of 4th at MLG mean that he is a SECOND RATE player? Fuck no. After that win did your team then shit all over other teams that you didn't beat but placed lower in ranking, and then hide behind that ONE 4th place win every time someone critisized your play? Wtf, who was Inc shitting on? Someone said EG were bad except for IdrA and he used facts and results to demonstrate that EG are objectively better than FXO. It fucking baffles me that you think he was shitting on anyone. As for using his result as some kind of shield to deflect criticism, this thread is the only time I've ever seen him bring it up. And above and beyond that it was the most recent MLG. When talking about MLG results, why not reference the previous fucking event? Go read the posts by SiguR and you may get a better understanding about the so called facts he used. Here I'll help. + Show Spoiler +On June 02 2011 03:56 SiguR wrote:Show nested quote +On June 02 2011 01:11 iNcontroL wrote:
FXO has literally 0 team accomplishments except losing to EG in ESEA and taking I think 4th.
Where the HELL do people get it in their mind that they are a better team? It absolutely cannot be through results. Arbitrary considerations with players? Qxc hasn't been his former self since MLG of last year when he still placed lower than several EG players. Moonan? No accomplishments. Slog? Filthy? Tgun or w/e... all lower level than Machine, Strifecro and Lz. Sheth is great. But still has fewer / less accomplishments than I do in big tourneys (MLG). Then we compare super-stars.. IdrA vs Moonglade. Need I say more? And all this without mentioning Axslav who won MVP for crota invitational going undefeated against players like Jinro and the other top players from top teams.
Emphasis on the bolded part... I don't care for the argument that's taking place here on which team is better, but blatant falsehoods tickle my fancy. Moonan has no accomplishments but you do? At MLG Dallas, you were seeded into pool play. You took fourth place by: In group play: beating TLO, Mihai, and slush Losing to painuser In the championship bracket: You beat TLO in an extended series You lost to Select 0-2 You lost to Kiwikaki 0-2 You won two best of threes and one best of five. You lost three best of threes. That got you fourth place.At MLG Dallas, Moonan took 8th. He started in the open bracket. Got knocked into the losers bracket by huk and did not make group play, but proceeded to the championship bracket by beating Naama. In the championship bracket he beat spades, painuser, mihai, machine, slush, and eventually lost to socke.
Moonan won 11 best of threes, and lost two best of threes. That got him 8th place. If you'll notice, three of the players he beat were the ones that were in your pool (essentially the same players you beat to secure your fourth place spot, minus TLO).In summary: Incontrol : Wins: 2 bo3's, 1 bo5. Losses: 3 bo3's 4th place Moonan: Wins: 11 bo3's Losses: 2 bo3's 8th place The catch is that Moonan played almost literally the same players that you did, plus naama, spades, machine, and a number of lesser known players. Saying Moonan has zero accomplishments and you have more accomplishments than him or sheth seems kind of moronic. You benefited from a very skewed seeding system. That is all fine and good in itself. I'm happy for your success. But don't go waving your dick around saying you have more accomplishments than other people who arguably performed just as well if not better than you. I want to be clear that i'm not saying you didn't do well. I'm saying that arguably Moonan did better and you're sitting on your 4th place "accomplishment" and saying Moonan has zero accomplishments. It seems silly. The problem with this is it's a total misrepresentation of what happened in this thread. At no point did iNcontroL come in here and go 'Moonan? Well that guy's fucking BAD, did you hear I got 4th at MLG way above him? He sucks and I don't! HAHAHAHAHAHA.' That seems to be the imaginary post people have dreamed up. What actually happened; Inc says on SOTG that although it's good that FXO have this oppurtunity, it's kind of a shame because they are not a top tier foreign team and it is likely that they are going to get stomped. Now personally I would call this overly negative and pessimistic. But ok. Then several people come into this thread and claim that FXO are better than EG. Inc defends EG, as above. Perfectly reasonable response. He says that Moonan has no accomplishments to speak of, which is technically true. He then seperately compares his and Sheth's MLG performances. This idea that he put down Moonan compared to himself? Never fucking happened. Now I seem to remember SiguR as a decent poster so it's kind of disappointing that he'd blatantly misrepresent the position of a professional player like that. + Show Spoiler +On June 02 2011 03:56 SiguR wrote:
I don't care for the argument that's taking place here on which team is better, but blatant falsehoods tickle my fancy.
Moonan has no accomplishments but you do?
Besides that, you can argue that the championship bracket system is skewed, which they have repeatedly agreed with on SOTG. But regardless of that, Inc earned his place there with his results in the previous MLGs. I find it pretty sad that I'm copying and pasting what people have said and then having to explain what they said. But I feel it's necessary seeing as I guess people in this thread have trouble reading? EDIT: Gonna reply to a couple of posts then finally gtfo out of this cesspit. I'm almost certainly wasting my time, but fuck it. Show nested quote +On June 02 2011 17:19 Maliris wrote:On June 02 2011 17:14 freetgy wrote:On June 02 2011 17:05 Maliris wrote:
incontrol is definitely not on the same level as demuslim and idra, make all the excuses you want for him
mlg says otherwise, but i guess that due to imbalance top4 mlg after cheesing everyone is the same as top8 in the GSL? Interesting Hey thanks. When I made my list of random bullshit people use to hate on iNcontroL I totally forgot 'top 4 by cheesing'. You know, where iNcontroL uses a proxy pylon against TLO, which is totally cheese and definitely not entirely TLO's fault. Let me ask you something. If I play protoss and attack a terran at the 5 minute mark and he's forgotten to build anything but 1 marine and I win the game, am I a cheesy player? Did I cheese the win? If I play terran and kill the zerg with marines in the early game because he made shitloads of drones and no lings or spines, have I cheesed him out? NO I FUCKING WON THE GAME BECAUSE MY OPPONENT FUCKED UP. You know, the point of the game? Yeah I did that thing. EDIT NO.2 Show nested quote +On June 02 2011 14:28 Blitz Beat wrote:On June 02 2011 14:12 aquanda wrote:On June 02 2011 10:13 The KY wrote:
ESPORTS IS SERIOUS BUSINESS YO.
Ok I just read through the recentposts in this thread and yeah it's pretty fucking awful. Inc defends his team when someone claims FXO are better and suddenly you've got 10-20 people jumping down his throat, trying to delegitimise his results, basically insulting him as a player which is his livelihood, then when he reacts angrily he gets a smug little 'hey calm down I was only calling you fucking terrible, you're the one who was shitting on other players, why are you playing the victim.'
For some unknown reason there's a fucking legion of arseholes who feel the need to put iNcontroL under far more scrutiny than is necessary, then take any opportunity to shit on him.
Every MLG last year; Inc is fucking awful!
MLG Dallas; Inc got an easy bracket!
MLG groups announced; Inc gets another easy group what a joke! (this one was particularly weird...so many people were saying it. Where's the people saying 'TLO gets the easiest group again guess he gets an easy road to 5th again!'. Why single out Inc from the 20 people in the groups?)
Inc streaming; He just lost a bunch of games, guess he's fucking shitty!
And now Inc defends his team and himself and the vultures fucking descend again. No wonder he got pissed and left the thread and the show on such a sour note.
I call bullshit on the iNcontroL hate. Just fucking stop. Yup I agree with everything you've said. I am glad he left SotG now, fuck the community to be honest. He puts himself out there every week to make a great show and people shit on him over and over. I'm so goddamn sick of the overwhelming bullshit in every single aspect of the Starcraft community I just don't see a reason to visit this site except to view streams and tournament information. The rest of it can just fuck off. The whole 'our community is great' thing applies to a very small minority, as well as in real life. Most people just post to make themselves feel and look important, and it's pretty apparent. you do realize that the public is doing to him what he does to others right? Geoff openly mocks his friend Kelly Milkies and says that gom made a bad choice hiring her. He totally screws with totalbiscuit to the point where totalbiscuit calls out geoff. it was geoff who called out FXO saying "EG is better than them". EG was NOT criticized until geoff said this. He could have said "Congratulations to FXO. They're going to have it hard in Korea but best of wishes and luck" but rather shitted all over their opportunity. just as much as he misrepresents others, others misrepresent him. Theres a reason why Geoff is a love / hate guy. his latest soap box episode didn't help it any and the fact that he lectures the community on verbal ethics and then follows up by telling someone to "shut the fuck up" does not help either. (regardless of context or level of words, the hypocrisy and irony is still there). you can't say that the community has gone to shit without criticizing geoff as well. golden rule: do unto others as you would like done unto you. 1. Inc did an impression of Kelly that he later apologised for. He made some constructive criticisms about her casting in Code A. 2. Are you referencing where he made some comments about Totalbiscuit's casting of (I think) Assembly? Where he was given the wrong information and made some fair comments on what he thought had gone down? It's not his fault the information was incorrect, and it's not like he was hating on TB...he was just saying 'this thing TB has done is childish and he shouldn't have done it'. 3. OMG HOW SCANDALOUS. Inc thinks his own team is better than someone elses. Can we just clarify why the FUCK that's an issue at all? More to the point, in the actual cast there was no point where he was shitting on FXO...he just gave his honest opinion, that he doesn't think they are a top tier foreign team right now. An opinion shared by many. I've already said that he could have been slightly more positive about it, but what kind of cast is it where everyone reacts to every bit of news with 'Hey good for that guy! great! That guy is an excellent player! This is good news! I am happy. Everyone is happy. Yaaaaay.' 4. The argument on verbal ethics centered mainly on context...the SOTG thread is a perfectly acceptable context for telling people to stfu. Nothing ironic about that. OK done wasting my time now, got that out of my system.
All I said was I respectfully disagree that EG is a better team then FXO, and that it was not cool to put FXO down like that in sotg. Im then brushed off as a EG hater.
More people joins in with the same opinion and incontrol feels it necessary to throw moonan under the buss, while comparing his own accomplishments to be better then Sheths. Any starcraft fan knows that Incontrol isnt even in same league as Sheth.
People again jumped in to explain to incontrol, that hiding behind a 4th finish at MLG would be fine if the system at MLG wasnt so fucking stupid. Moonan had argueably a better run then Incontrol and still ended up behind.
Incontrol then explains thats he deserved to be in that position with how well he had done in 3 previous MLG's. Some countered that not even finishing in top 16 in any of them really wasnt anything to brag about.
At this point, everyone and their mother are idiots,trolls and haters, but really has no counter arguement to why he thinks he has good accomplishments and moonan has none.
I watch starcraft alot. Every major tournament, player streams and SC shows. In my opinion Incontrol is nowhere near a top player, and I should be able to voice my honest opinion without getting called a hater. I loved him on Sotg, and I think his a hilarious charismatic person, but I just dont think he is a good player.
What should proberly be discussed more though is the MLG tournament setup. It couldnt possibly be more rewarding to the top 16-20. And that made some of the pillars extreamly worried when they found out koreans where getting seeded streight into that position.
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On June 02 2011 23:15 Pekkz wrote:
What should proberly be discussed more though is the MLG tournament setup. It couldnt possibly be more rewarding to the top 16-20. And that made some of the pillars extreamly worried when they found out koreans where getting seeded streight into that position.
I couldn't agree more. The MLG seeding process is pretty fucking retarded. Maybe if MLG was a year long event it would be better, but because of the frequency of the event the relevance the rankings is depressing. As much as I like many of the people who are currently in the coveted top 16 spots, several of them are no where near the caliber of player they were in the first MLG season.
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On June 02 2011 23:15 Pekkz wrote:Show nested quote +On June 02 2011 20:50 The KY wrote:On June 02 2011 10:34 Pekkz wrote:On June 02 2011 09:48 The KY wrote:On June 02 2011 03:06 GuiMontag wrote:On June 02 2011 02:59 The KY wrote:On June 02 2011 01:24 -_- wrote:On June 02 2011 01:16 iNcontroL wrote:
I'm sorry if you think 4th place isn't an accomplishment. I'm sorry if you think it is telling that I am happy with that finish.
I will comfort myself by knowing you aren't anywhere near a progamer and literally have 0 grasp of what it takes to place that high in anything competitive. So I know without a shadow of doubt that you are 100% a completely irrelevant perspective on the matter. Calm down. I understand where you're coming from, but you don't know about my competitive background. Just because I'm not a progamer doesn't mean I haven't been succesful in my life. And just because you angry, doesn't mean you can proclaim that my perspective is irrelevant. Let's use a sports analogy. If Lebron James loses in the finals, do you think he'll be happy with his 2nd place finish? Do you think Derrick Rose is happy with his 3rd/4th place finish? And if they were, it would certainly speak to how good they think they are (not the best), and what their goals were (not to be a champion). Allow me to use another analogy. My football team is Tottenham Hotspur in the Premier League. In the 2009/2010 season they finished fourth. And I was fucking ECSTATIC. Fourth in what is probably the most prestigious league in the world? Above teams like Man City and Liverpool, coming within a hairs breadth of Arsenal? BEATING Arsenal and Chelsea along the way? Fourth was a fucking dream. Is that because Spurs are a lesser team than Chelsea, who would be unhappy with 4th? Yeah sure. Does that make the achievement any lesser for Tottenham? Er, no. It's still an amazing result for any team except for maybe 3. Being a lesser team than Chelsea and Man United is absolutely nothing to be ashamed of, if you're ahead of everyone else. The analogy is that for, say, IdrA, 4th is a disappointment. For iNcontroL it's astoundingly good. Is it because he's a lesser player than IdrA. Yep. Don't think he'd disagree with that (at least not right now, maybe after his wins his MLG ). Is being proud of 4th at MLG mean that he is a SECOND RATE player? Fuck no. After that win did your team then shit all over other teams that you didn't beat but placed lower in ranking, and then hide behind that ONE 4th place win every time someone critisized your play? Wtf, who was Inc shitting on? Someone said EG were bad except for IdrA and he used facts and results to demonstrate that EG are objectively better than FXO. It fucking baffles me that you think he was shitting on anyone. As for using his result as some kind of shield to deflect criticism, this thread is the only time I've ever seen him bring it up. And above and beyond that it was the most recent MLG. When talking about MLG results, why not reference the previous fucking event? Go read the posts by SiguR and you may get a better understanding about the so called facts he used. Here I'll help. + Show Spoiler +On June 02 2011 03:56 SiguR wrote:Show nested quote +On June 02 2011 01:11 iNcontroL wrote:
FXO has literally 0 team accomplishments except losing to EG in ESEA and taking I think 4th.
Where the HELL do people get it in their mind that they are a better team? It absolutely cannot be through results. Arbitrary considerations with players? Qxc hasn't been his former self since MLG of last year when he still placed lower than several EG players. Moonan? No accomplishments. Slog? Filthy? Tgun or w/e... all lower level than Machine, Strifecro and Lz. Sheth is great. But still has fewer / less accomplishments than I do in big tourneys (MLG). Then we compare super-stars.. IdrA vs Moonglade. Need I say more? And all this without mentioning Axslav who won MVP for crota invitational going undefeated against players like Jinro and the other top players from top teams.
Emphasis on the bolded part... I don't care for the argument that's taking place here on which team is better, but blatant falsehoods tickle my fancy. Moonan has no accomplishments but you do? At MLG Dallas, you were seeded into pool play. You took fourth place by: In group play: beating TLO, Mihai, and slush Losing to painuser In the championship bracket: You beat TLO in an extended series You lost to Select 0-2 You lost to Kiwikaki 0-2 You won two best of threes and one best of five. You lost three best of threes. That got you fourth place.At MLG Dallas, Moonan took 8th. He started in the open bracket. Got knocked into the losers bracket by huk and did not make group play, but proceeded to the championship bracket by beating Naama. In the championship bracket he beat spades, painuser, mihai, machine, slush, and eventually lost to socke.
Moonan won 11 best of threes, and lost two best of threes. That got him 8th place. If you'll notice, three of the players he beat were the ones that were in your pool (essentially the same players you beat to secure your fourth place spot, minus TLO).In summary: Incontrol : Wins: 2 bo3's, 1 bo5. Losses: 3 bo3's 4th place Moonan: Wins: 11 bo3's Losses: 2 bo3's 8th place The catch is that Moonan played almost literally the same players that you did, plus naama, spades, machine, and a number of lesser known players. Saying Moonan has zero accomplishments and you have more accomplishments than him or sheth seems kind of moronic. You benefited from a very skewed seeding system. That is all fine and good in itself. I'm happy for your success. But don't go waving your dick around saying you have more accomplishments than other people who arguably performed just as well if not better than you. I want to be clear that i'm not saying you didn't do well. I'm saying that arguably Moonan did better and you're sitting on your 4th place "accomplishment" and saying Moonan has zero accomplishments. It seems silly. The problem with this is it's a total misrepresentation of what happened in this thread. At no point did iNcontroL come in here and go 'Moonan? Well that guy's fucking BAD, did you hear I got 4th at MLG way above him? He sucks and I don't! HAHAHAHAHAHA.' That seems to be the imaginary post people have dreamed up. What actually happened; Inc says on SOTG that although it's good that FXO have this oppurtunity, it's kind of a shame because they are not a top tier foreign team and it is likely that they are going to get stomped. Now personally I would call this overly negative and pessimistic. But ok. Then several people come into this thread and claim that FXO are better than EG. Inc defends EG, as above. Perfectly reasonable response. He says that Moonan has no accomplishments to speak of, which is technically true. He then seperately compares his and Sheth's MLG performances. This idea that he put down Moonan compared to himself? Never fucking happened. Now I seem to remember SiguR as a decent poster so it's kind of disappointing that he'd blatantly misrepresent the position of a professional player like that. + Show Spoiler +On June 02 2011 03:56 SiguR wrote:
I don't care for the argument that's taking place here on which team is better, but blatant falsehoods tickle my fancy.
Moonan has no accomplishments but you do?
Besides that, you can argue that the championship bracket system is skewed, which they have repeatedly agreed with on SOTG. But regardless of that, Inc earned his place there with his results in the previous MLGs. I find it pretty sad that I'm copying and pasting what people have said and then having to explain what they said. But I feel it's necessary seeing as I guess people in this thread have trouble reading? EDIT: Gonna reply to a couple of posts then finally gtfo out of this cesspit. I'm almost certainly wasting my time, but fuck it. On June 02 2011 17:19 Maliris wrote:On June 02 2011 17:14 freetgy wrote:On June 02 2011 17:05 Maliris wrote:
incontrol is definitely not on the same level as demuslim and idra, make all the excuses you want for him
mlg says otherwise, but i guess that due to imbalance top4 mlg after cheesing everyone is the same as top8 in the GSL? Interesting Hey thanks. When I made my list of random bullshit people use to hate on iNcontroL I totally forgot 'top 4 by cheesing'. You know, where iNcontroL uses a proxy pylon against TLO, which is totally cheese and definitely not entirely TLO's fault. Let me ask you something. If I play protoss and attack a terran at the 5 minute mark and he's forgotten to build anything but 1 marine and I win the game, am I a cheesy player? Did I cheese the win? If I play terran and kill the zerg with marines in the early game because he made shitloads of drones and no lings or spines, have I cheesed him out? NO I FUCKING WON THE GAME BECAUSE MY OPPONENT FUCKED UP. You know, the point of the game? Yeah I did that thing. EDIT NO.2 On June 02 2011 14:28 Blitz Beat wrote:On June 02 2011 14:12 aquanda wrote:On June 02 2011 10:13 The KY wrote:
ESPORTS IS SERIOUS BUSINESS YO.
Ok I just read through the recentposts in this thread and yeah it's pretty fucking awful. Inc defends his team when someone claims FXO are better and suddenly you've got 10-20 people jumping down his throat, trying to delegitimise his results, basically insulting him as a player which is his livelihood, then when he reacts angrily he gets a smug little 'hey calm down I was only calling you fucking terrible, you're the one who was shitting on other players, why are you playing the victim.'
For some unknown reason there's a fucking legion of arseholes who feel the need to put iNcontroL under far more scrutiny than is necessary, then take any opportunity to shit on him.
Every MLG last year; Inc is fucking awful!
MLG Dallas; Inc got an easy bracket!
MLG groups announced; Inc gets another easy group what a joke! (this one was particularly weird...so many people were saying it. Where's the people saying 'TLO gets the easiest group again guess he gets an easy road to 5th again!'. Why single out Inc from the 20 people in the groups?)
Inc streaming; He just lost a bunch of games, guess he's fucking shitty!
And now Inc defends his team and himself and the vultures fucking descend again. No wonder he got pissed and left the thread and the show on such a sour note.
I call bullshit on the iNcontroL hate. Just fucking stop. Yup I agree with everything you've said. I am glad he left SotG now, fuck the community to be honest. He puts himself out there every week to make a great show and people shit on him over and over. I'm so goddamn sick of the overwhelming bullshit in every single aspect of the Starcraft community I just don't see a reason to visit this site except to view streams and tournament information. The rest of it can just fuck off. The whole 'our community is great' thing applies to a very small minority, as well as in real life. Most people just post to make themselves feel and look important, and it's pretty apparent. you do realize that the public is doing to him what he does to others right? Geoff openly mocks his friend Kelly Milkies and says that gom made a bad choice hiring her. He totally screws with totalbiscuit to the point where totalbiscuit calls out geoff. it was geoff who called out FXO saying "EG is better than them". EG was NOT criticized until geoff said this. He could have said "Congratulations to FXO. They're going to have it hard in Korea but best of wishes and luck" but rather shitted all over their opportunity. just as much as he misrepresents others, others misrepresent him. Theres a reason why Geoff is a love / hate guy. his latest soap box episode didn't help it any and the fact that he lectures the community on verbal ethics and then follows up by telling someone to "shut the fuck up" does not help either. (regardless of context or level of words, the hypocrisy and irony is still there). you can't say that the community has gone to shit without criticizing geoff as well. golden rule: do unto others as you would like done unto you. 1. Inc did an impression of Kelly that he later apologised for. He made some constructive criticisms about her casting in Code A. 2. Are you referencing where he made some comments about Totalbiscuit's casting of (I think) Assembly? Where he was given the wrong information and made some fair comments on what he thought had gone down? It's not his fault the information was incorrect, and it's not like he was hating on TB...he was just saying 'this thing TB has done is childish and he shouldn't have done it'. 3. OMG HOW SCANDALOUS. Inc thinks his own team is better than someone elses. Can we just clarify why the FUCK that's an issue at all? More to the point, in the actual cast there was no point where he was shitting on FXO...he just gave his honest opinion, that he doesn't think they are a top tier foreign team right now. An opinion shared by many. I've already said that he could have been slightly more positive about it, but what kind of cast is it where everyone reacts to every bit of news with 'Hey good for that guy! great! That guy is an excellent player! This is good news! I am happy. Everyone is happy. Yaaaaay.' 4. The argument on verbal ethics centered mainly on context...the SOTG thread is a perfectly acceptable context for telling people to stfu. Nothing ironic about that. OK done wasting my time now, got that out of my system. All I said was I respectfully disagree that EG is a better team then FXO, and that it was not cool to put FXO down like that in sotg. Im then brushed off as a EG hater. More people joins in with the same opinion and incontrol feels it necessary to throw moonan under the buss, while comparing his own accomplishments to be better then Sheths. Any starcraft fan knows that Incontrol isnt even in same league as Sheth. People again jumped in to explain to incontrol, that hiding behind a 4th finish at MLG would be fine if the system at MLG wasnt so fucking stupid. Moonan had argueably a better run then Incontrol and still ended up behind. Incontrol then explains thats he deserved to be in that position with how well he had done in 3 previous MLG's. Some countered that not even finishing in top 16 in any of them really wasnt anything to brag about. At this point, everyone and their mother are idiots,trolls and haters, but really has no counter arguement to why he thinks he has good accomplishments and moonan has none. I watch starcraft alot. Every major tournament, player streams and SC shows. In my opinion Incontrol is nowhere near a top player, and I should be able to voice my honest opinion without getting called a hater. I loved him on Sotg, and I think his a hilarious charismatic person, but I just dont think he is a good player. What should proberly be discussed more though is the MLG tournament setup. It couldnt possibly be more rewarding to the top 16-20. And that made some of the pillars extreamly worried when they found out koreans where getting seeded streight into that position.
Hey hey, imma let you finish, but Incontrol has one of the best accomplishment list of... well fuck that.
Just saying, I'm not an Incontrol fan, I hate him sometimes because he talks too much and that he has a bad habit of talking over someone else (pretty obvious during one of his recent argument with Tyler about a certain clash on TL) and I'm one of the few that think SotG can become better than it is now with him leaving. BUT please, stop saying Incontrol is not in the same league as Sheth... You can argue all you want, you can hate Incontrol as much as you want, he IS up there, one of the best north american starcraft 2 player at the moment.
You can hate him, but you still got to respect him for everything he does for the community (even if you don't like the way he does it) and his skill as a player. Going 6th in MLG is not a fluke, taking down Ensnare, and other good players in NASL is not a fluke.
Ok sure, Incontrol think FXO is not good enough, well then LET FXO PROVE HIM WRONG and stop arguing.
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HI! I've been listening to over 3hrs of podcast but I got offended by this 5-10 minute part, so I feel I should make this thread even more terrible by posting my point of view like it's really going to matter when hundreds of other people are going to do the same.
What self respecting guy drinks with a straw.
:D Great show as always. Sorry to see Geoff go. Keep being awesome! Looking forward to MLG.
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It's just hard to count that 4th for very much.
Congratulations to him for that achievement, but it hinged more on MLG's broken seeding system than on him winning very many games.
Which is fine, if a bit lame.
Except then he turns around and shit talks mOOnan, who placed almost as high by beating literally the same people, plus PainUser (who beat Geoff), plus another half dozen strong players.
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On June 02 2011 23:42 WhiteDog wrote:Show nested quote +On June 02 2011 23:15 Pekkz wrote:On June 02 2011 20:50 The KY wrote:On June 02 2011 10:34 Pekkz wrote:On June 02 2011 09:48 The KY wrote:On June 02 2011 03:06 GuiMontag wrote:On June 02 2011 02:59 The KY wrote:On June 02 2011 01:24 -_- wrote:On June 02 2011 01:16 iNcontroL wrote:
I'm sorry if you think 4th place isn't an accomplishment. I'm sorry if you think it is telling that I am happy with that finish.
I will comfort myself by knowing you aren't anywhere near a progamer and literally have 0 grasp of what it takes to place that high in anything competitive. So I know without a shadow of doubt that you are 100% a completely irrelevant perspective on the matter. Calm down. I understand where you're coming from, but you don't know about my competitive background. Just because I'm not a progamer doesn't mean I haven't been succesful in my life. And just because you angry, doesn't mean you can proclaim that my perspective is irrelevant. Let's use a sports analogy. If Lebron James loses in the finals, do you think he'll be happy with his 2nd place finish? Do you think Derrick Rose is happy with his 3rd/4th place finish? And if they were, it would certainly speak to how good they think they are (not the best), and what their goals were (not to be a champion). Allow me to use another analogy. My football team is Tottenham Hotspur in the Premier League. In the 2009/2010 season they finished fourth. And I was fucking ECSTATIC. Fourth in what is probably the most prestigious league in the world? Above teams like Man City and Liverpool, coming within a hairs breadth of Arsenal? BEATING Arsenal and Chelsea along the way? Fourth was a fucking dream. Is that because Spurs are a lesser team than Chelsea, who would be unhappy with 4th? Yeah sure. Does that make the achievement any lesser for Tottenham? Er, no. It's still an amazing result for any team except for maybe 3. Being a lesser team than Chelsea and Man United is absolutely nothing to be ashamed of, if you're ahead of everyone else. The analogy is that for, say, IdrA, 4th is a disappointment. For iNcontroL it's astoundingly good. Is it because he's a lesser player than IdrA. Yep. Don't think he'd disagree with that (at least not right now, maybe after his wins his MLG ). Is being proud of 4th at MLG mean that he is a SECOND RATE player? Fuck no. After that win did your team then shit all over other teams that you didn't beat but placed lower in ranking, and then hide behind that ONE 4th place win every time someone critisized your play? Wtf, who was Inc shitting on? Someone said EG were bad except for IdrA and he used facts and results to demonstrate that EG are objectively better than FXO. It fucking baffles me that you think he was shitting on anyone. As for using his result as some kind of shield to deflect criticism, this thread is the only time I've ever seen him bring it up. And above and beyond that it was the most recent MLG. When talking about MLG results, why not reference the previous fucking event? Go read the posts by SiguR and you may get a better understanding about the so called facts he used. Here I'll help. + Show Spoiler +On June 02 2011 03:56 SiguR wrote:Show nested quote +On June 02 2011 01:11 iNcontroL wrote:
FXO has literally 0 team accomplishments except losing to EG in ESEA and taking I think 4th.
Where the HELL do people get it in their mind that they are a better team? It absolutely cannot be through results. Arbitrary considerations with players? Qxc hasn't been his former self since MLG of last year when he still placed lower than several EG players. Moonan? No accomplishments. Slog? Filthy? Tgun or w/e... all lower level than Machine, Strifecro and Lz. Sheth is great. But still has fewer / less accomplishments than I do in big tourneys (MLG). Then we compare super-stars.. IdrA vs Moonglade. Need I say more? And all this without mentioning Axslav who won MVP for crota invitational going undefeated against players like Jinro and the other top players from top teams.
Emphasis on the bolded part... I don't care for the argument that's taking place here on which team is better, but blatant falsehoods tickle my fancy. Moonan has no accomplishments but you do? At MLG Dallas, you were seeded into pool play. You took fourth place by: In group play: beating TLO, Mihai, and slush Losing to painuser In the championship bracket: You beat TLO in an extended series You lost to Select 0-2 You lost to Kiwikaki 0-2 You won two best of threes and one best of five. You lost three best of threes. That got you fourth place.At MLG Dallas, Moonan took 8th. He started in the open bracket. Got knocked into the losers bracket by huk and did not make group play, but proceeded to the championship bracket by beating Naama. In the championship bracket he beat spades, painuser, mihai, machine, slush, and eventually lost to socke.
Moonan won 11 best of threes, and lost two best of threes. That got him 8th place. If you'll notice, three of the players he beat were the ones that were in your pool (essentially the same players you beat to secure your fourth place spot, minus TLO).In summary: Incontrol : Wins: 2 bo3's, 1 bo5. Losses: 3 bo3's 4th place Moonan: Wins: 11 bo3's Losses: 2 bo3's 8th place The catch is that Moonan played almost literally the same players that you did, plus naama, spades, machine, and a number of lesser known players. Saying Moonan has zero accomplishments and you have more accomplishments than him or sheth seems kind of moronic. You benefited from a very skewed seeding system. That is all fine and good in itself. I'm happy for your success. But don't go waving your dick around saying you have more accomplishments than other people who arguably performed just as well if not better than you. I want to be clear that i'm not saying you didn't do well. I'm saying that arguably Moonan did better and you're sitting on your 4th place "accomplishment" and saying Moonan has zero accomplishments. It seems silly. The problem with this is it's a total misrepresentation of what happened in this thread. At no point did iNcontroL come in here and go 'Moonan? Well that guy's fucking BAD, did you hear I got 4th at MLG way above him? He sucks and I don't! HAHAHAHAHAHA.' That seems to be the imaginary post people have dreamed up. What actually happened; Inc says on SOTG that although it's good that FXO have this oppurtunity, it's kind of a shame because they are not a top tier foreign team and it is likely that they are going to get stomped. Now personally I would call this overly negative and pessimistic. But ok. Then several people come into this thread and claim that FXO are better than EG. Inc defends EG, as above. Perfectly reasonable response. He says that Moonan has no accomplishments to speak of, which is technically true. He then seperately compares his and Sheth's MLG performances. This idea that he put down Moonan compared to himself? Never fucking happened. Now I seem to remember SiguR as a decent poster so it's kind of disappointing that he'd blatantly misrepresent the position of a professional player like that. + Show Spoiler +On June 02 2011 03:56 SiguR wrote:
I don't care for the argument that's taking place here on which team is better, but blatant falsehoods tickle my fancy.
Moonan has no accomplishments but you do?
Besides that, you can argue that the championship bracket system is skewed, which they have repeatedly agreed with on SOTG. But regardless of that, Inc earned his place there with his results in the previous MLGs. I find it pretty sad that I'm copying and pasting what people have said and then having to explain what they said. But I feel it's necessary seeing as I guess people in this thread have trouble reading? EDIT: Gonna reply to a couple of posts then finally gtfo out of this cesspit. I'm almost certainly wasting my time, but fuck it. On June 02 2011 17:19 Maliris wrote:On June 02 2011 17:14 freetgy wrote:On June 02 2011 17:05 Maliris wrote:
incontrol is definitely not on the same level as demuslim and idra, make all the excuses you want for him
mlg says otherwise, but i guess that due to imbalance top4 mlg after cheesing everyone is the same as top8 in the GSL? Interesting Hey thanks. When I made my list of random bullshit people use to hate on iNcontroL I totally forgot 'top 4 by cheesing'. You know, where iNcontroL uses a proxy pylon against TLO, which is totally cheese and definitely not entirely TLO's fault. Let me ask you something. If I play protoss and attack a terran at the 5 minute mark and he's forgotten to build anything but 1 marine and I win the game, am I a cheesy player? Did I cheese the win? If I play terran and kill the zerg with marines in the early game because he made shitloads of drones and no lings or spines, have I cheesed him out? NO I FUCKING WON THE GAME BECAUSE MY OPPONENT FUCKED UP. You know, the point of the game? Yeah I did that thing. EDIT NO.2 On June 02 2011 14:28 Blitz Beat wrote:On June 02 2011 14:12 aquanda wrote:On June 02 2011 10:13 The KY wrote:
ESPORTS IS SERIOUS BUSINESS YO.
Ok I just read through the recentposts in this thread and yeah it's pretty fucking awful. Inc defends his team when someone claims FXO are better and suddenly you've got 10-20 people jumping down his throat, trying to delegitimise his results, basically insulting him as a player which is his livelihood, then when he reacts angrily he gets a smug little 'hey calm down I was only calling you fucking terrible, you're the one who was shitting on other players, why are you playing the victim.'
For some unknown reason there's a fucking legion of arseholes who feel the need to put iNcontroL under far more scrutiny than is necessary, then take any opportunity to shit on him.
Every MLG last year; Inc is fucking awful!
MLG Dallas; Inc got an easy bracket!
MLG groups announced; Inc gets another easy group what a joke! (this one was particularly weird...so many people were saying it. Where's the people saying 'TLO gets the easiest group again guess he gets an easy road to 5th again!'. Why single out Inc from the 20 people in the groups?)
Inc streaming; He just lost a bunch of games, guess he's fucking shitty!
And now Inc defends his team and himself and the vultures fucking descend again. No wonder he got pissed and left the thread and the show on such a sour note.
I call bullshit on the iNcontroL hate. Just fucking stop. Yup I agree with everything you've said. I am glad he left SotG now, fuck the community to be honest. He puts himself out there every week to make a great show and people shit on him over and over. I'm so goddamn sick of the overwhelming bullshit in every single aspect of the Starcraft community I just don't see a reason to visit this site except to view streams and tournament information. The rest of it can just fuck off. The whole 'our community is great' thing applies to a very small minority, as well as in real life. Most people just post to make themselves feel and look important, and it's pretty apparent. you do realize that the public is doing to him what he does to others right? Geoff openly mocks his friend Kelly Milkies and says that gom made a bad choice hiring her. He totally screws with totalbiscuit to the point where totalbiscuit calls out geoff. it was geoff who called out FXO saying "EG is better than them". EG was NOT criticized until geoff said this. He could have said "Congratulations to FXO. They're going to have it hard in Korea but best of wishes and luck" but rather shitted all over their opportunity. just as much as he misrepresents others, others misrepresent him. Theres a reason why Geoff is a love / hate guy. his latest soap box episode didn't help it any and the fact that he lectures the community on verbal ethics and then follows up by telling someone to "shut the fuck up" does not help either. (regardless of context or level of words, the hypocrisy and irony is still there). you can't say that the community has gone to shit without criticizing geoff as well. golden rule: do unto others as you would like done unto you. 1. Inc did an impression of Kelly that he later apologised for. He made some constructive criticisms about her casting in Code A. 2. Are you referencing where he made some comments about Totalbiscuit's casting of (I think) Assembly? Where he was given the wrong information and made some fair comments on what he thought had gone down? It's not his fault the information was incorrect, and it's not like he was hating on TB...he was just saying 'this thing TB has done is childish and he shouldn't have done it'. 3. OMG HOW SCANDALOUS. Inc thinks his own team is better than someone elses. Can we just clarify why the FUCK that's an issue at all? More to the point, in the actual cast there was no point where he was shitting on FXO...he just gave his honest opinion, that he doesn't think they are a top tier foreign team right now. An opinion shared by many. I've already said that he could have been slightly more positive about it, but what kind of cast is it where everyone reacts to every bit of news with 'Hey good for that guy! great! That guy is an excellent player! This is good news! I am happy. Everyone is happy. Yaaaaay.' 4. The argument on verbal ethics centered mainly on context...the SOTG thread is a perfectly acceptable context for telling people to stfu. Nothing ironic about that. OK done wasting my time now, got that out of my system. All I said was I respectfully disagree that EG is a better team then FXO, and that it was not cool to put FXO down like that in sotg. Im then brushed off as a EG hater. More people joins in with the same opinion and incontrol feels it necessary to throw moonan under the buss, while comparing his own accomplishments to be better then Sheths. Any starcraft fan knows that Incontrol isnt even in same league as Sheth. People again jumped in to explain to incontrol, that hiding behind a 4th finish at MLG would be fine if the system at MLG wasnt so fucking stupid. Moonan had argueably a better run then Incontrol and still ended up behind. Incontrol then explains thats he deserved to be in that position with how well he had done in 3 previous MLG's. Some countered that not even finishing in top 16 in any of them really wasnt anything to brag about. At this point, everyone and their mother are idiots,trolls and haters, but really has no counter arguement to why he thinks he has good accomplishments and moonan has none. I watch starcraft alot. Every major tournament, player streams and SC shows. In my opinion Incontrol is nowhere near a top player, and I should be able to voice my honest opinion without getting called a hater. I loved him on Sotg, and I think his a hilarious charismatic person, but I just dont think he is a good player. What should proberly be discussed more though is the MLG tournament setup. It couldnt possibly be more rewarding to the top 16-20. And that made some of the pillars extreamly worried when they found out koreans where getting seeded streight into that position. Hey hey, imma let you finish, but Incontrol has one of the best accomplishment list of... well fuck that. he IS up there, one of the best north american starcraft 2 player at the moment. You can hate him, but you still got to respect him for everything he does for the community (even if you don't like the way he does it) and his skill as a player. Going 6th in MLG is not a fluke, taking down Ensnare, and other good players in NASL is not a fluke.
LOL at praising a top 6 finish in the broken MLG system. He beat ensnare playing from KR-NA where lag, according to IncontroL´s teamate idra, is "unplayable".
The words top player and incontrol should not be used even in the same sentence, such a claim is ridiculous and unfounded. I find his attitude towards others players completely repulsive and unacceptable, especially when he claims to be a spokesperson for the community. His behaviour is completely outrageous.
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On June 02 2011 23:42 WhiteDog wrote:Show nested quote +On June 02 2011 23:15 Pekkz wrote:On June 02 2011 20:50 The KY wrote:On June 02 2011 10:34 Pekkz wrote:On June 02 2011 09:48 The KY wrote:On June 02 2011 03:06 GuiMontag wrote:On June 02 2011 02:59 The KY wrote:On June 02 2011 01:24 -_- wrote:On June 02 2011 01:16 iNcontroL wrote:
I'm sorry if you think 4th place isn't an accomplishment. I'm sorry if you think it is telling that I am happy with that finish.
I will comfort myself by knowing you aren't anywhere near a progamer and literally have 0 grasp of what it takes to place that high in anything competitive. So I know without a shadow of doubt that you are 100% a completely irrelevant perspective on the matter. Calm down. I understand where you're coming from, but you don't know about my competitive background. Just because I'm not a progamer doesn't mean I haven't been succesful in my life. And just because you angry, doesn't mean you can proclaim that my perspective is irrelevant. Let's use a sports analogy. If Lebron James loses in the finals, do you think he'll be happy with his 2nd place finish? Do you think Derrick Rose is happy with his 3rd/4th place finish? And if they were, it would certainly speak to how good they think they are (not the best), and what their goals were (not to be a champion). Allow me to use another analogy. My football team is Tottenham Hotspur in the Premier League. In the 2009/2010 season they finished fourth. And I was fucking ECSTATIC. Fourth in what is probably the most prestigious league in the world? Above teams like Man City and Liverpool, coming within a hairs breadth of Arsenal? BEATING Arsenal and Chelsea along the way? Fourth was a fucking dream. Is that because Spurs are a lesser team than Chelsea, who would be unhappy with 4th? Yeah sure. Does that make the achievement any lesser for Tottenham? Er, no. It's still an amazing result for any team except for maybe 3. Being a lesser team than Chelsea and Man United is absolutely nothing to be ashamed of, if you're ahead of everyone else. The analogy is that for, say, IdrA, 4th is a disappointment. For iNcontroL it's astoundingly good. Is it because he's a lesser player than IdrA. Yep. Don't think he'd disagree with that (at least not right now, maybe after his wins his MLG ). Is being proud of 4th at MLG mean that he is a SECOND RATE player? Fuck no. After that win did your team then shit all over other teams that you didn't beat but placed lower in ranking, and then hide behind that ONE 4th place win every time someone critisized your play? Wtf, who was Inc shitting on? Someone said EG were bad except for IdrA and he used facts and results to demonstrate that EG are objectively better than FXO. It fucking baffles me that you think he was shitting on anyone. As for using his result as some kind of shield to deflect criticism, this thread is the only time I've ever seen him bring it up. And above and beyond that it was the most recent MLG. When talking about MLG results, why not reference the previous fucking event? Go read the posts by SiguR and you may get a better understanding about the so called facts he used. Here I'll help. + Show Spoiler +On June 02 2011 03:56 SiguR wrote:Show nested quote +On June 02 2011 01:11 iNcontroL wrote:
FXO has literally 0 team accomplishments except losing to EG in ESEA and taking I think 4th.
Where the HELL do people get it in their mind that they are a better team? It absolutely cannot be through results. Arbitrary considerations with players? Qxc hasn't been his former self since MLG of last year when he still placed lower than several EG players. Moonan? No accomplishments. Slog? Filthy? Tgun or w/e... all lower level than Machine, Strifecro and Lz. Sheth is great. But still has fewer / less accomplishments than I do in big tourneys (MLG). Then we compare super-stars.. IdrA vs Moonglade. Need I say more? And all this without mentioning Axslav who won MVP for crota invitational going undefeated against players like Jinro and the other top players from top teams.
Emphasis on the bolded part... I don't care for the argument that's taking place here on which team is better, but blatant falsehoods tickle my fancy. Moonan has no accomplishments but you do? At MLG Dallas, you were seeded into pool play. You took fourth place by: In group play: beating TLO, Mihai, and slush Losing to painuser In the championship bracket: You beat TLO in an extended series You lost to Select 0-2 You lost to Kiwikaki 0-2 You won two best of threes and one best of five. You lost three best of threes. That got you fourth place.At MLG Dallas, Moonan took 8th. He started in the open bracket. Got knocked into the losers bracket by huk and did not make group play, but proceeded to the championship bracket by beating Naama. In the championship bracket he beat spades, painuser, mihai, machine, slush, and eventually lost to socke.
Moonan won 11 best of threes, and lost two best of threes. That got him 8th place. If you'll notice, three of the players he beat were the ones that were in your pool (essentially the same players you beat to secure your fourth place spot, minus TLO).In summary: Incontrol : Wins: 2 bo3's, 1 bo5. Losses: 3 bo3's 4th place Moonan: Wins: 11 bo3's Losses: 2 bo3's 8th place The catch is that Moonan played almost literally the same players that you did, plus naama, spades, machine, and a number of lesser known players. Saying Moonan has zero accomplishments and you have more accomplishments than him or sheth seems kind of moronic. You benefited from a very skewed seeding system. That is all fine and good in itself. I'm happy for your success. But don't go waving your dick around saying you have more accomplishments than other people who arguably performed just as well if not better than you. I want to be clear that i'm not saying you didn't do well. I'm saying that arguably Moonan did better and you're sitting on your 4th place "accomplishment" and saying Moonan has zero accomplishments. It seems silly. The problem with this is it's a total misrepresentation of what happened in this thread. At no point did iNcontroL come in here and go 'Moonan? Well that guy's fucking BAD, did you hear I got 4th at MLG way above him? He sucks and I don't! HAHAHAHAHAHA.' That seems to be the imaginary post people have dreamed up. What actually happened; Inc says on SOTG that although it's good that FXO have this oppurtunity, it's kind of a shame because they are not a top tier foreign team and it is likely that they are going to get stomped. Now personally I would call this overly negative and pessimistic. But ok. Then several people come into this thread and claim that FXO are better than EG. Inc defends EG, as above. Perfectly reasonable response. He says that Moonan has no accomplishments to speak of, which is technically true. He then seperately compares his and Sheth's MLG performances. This idea that he put down Moonan compared to himself? Never fucking happened. Now I seem to remember SiguR as a decent poster so it's kind of disappointing that he'd blatantly misrepresent the position of a professional player like that. + Show Spoiler +On June 02 2011 03:56 SiguR wrote:
I don't care for the argument that's taking place here on which team is better, but blatant falsehoods tickle my fancy.
Moonan has no accomplishments but you do?
Besides that, you can argue that the championship bracket system is skewed, which they have repeatedly agreed with on SOTG. But regardless of that, Inc earned his place there with his results in the previous MLGs. I find it pretty sad that I'm copying and pasting what people have said and then having to explain what they said. But I feel it's necessary seeing as I guess people in this thread have trouble reading? EDIT: Gonna reply to a couple of posts then finally gtfo out of this cesspit. I'm almost certainly wasting my time, but fuck it. On June 02 2011 17:19 Maliris wrote:On June 02 2011 17:14 freetgy wrote:On June 02 2011 17:05 Maliris wrote:
incontrol is definitely not on the same level as demuslim and idra, make all the excuses you want for him
mlg says otherwise, but i guess that due to imbalance top4 mlg after cheesing everyone is the same as top8 in the GSL? Interesting Hey thanks. When I made my list of random bullshit people use to hate on iNcontroL I totally forgot 'top 4 by cheesing'. You know, where iNcontroL uses a proxy pylon against TLO, which is totally cheese and definitely not entirely TLO's fault. Let me ask you something. If I play protoss and attack a terran at the 5 minute mark and he's forgotten to build anything but 1 marine and I win the game, am I a cheesy player? Did I cheese the win? If I play terran and kill the zerg with marines in the early game because he made shitloads of drones and no lings or spines, have I cheesed him out? NO I FUCKING WON THE GAME BECAUSE MY OPPONENT FUCKED UP. You know, the point of the game? Yeah I did that thing. EDIT NO.2 On June 02 2011 14:28 Blitz Beat wrote:On June 02 2011 14:12 aquanda wrote:On June 02 2011 10:13 The KY wrote:
ESPORTS IS SERIOUS BUSINESS YO.
Ok I just read through the recentposts in this thread and yeah it's pretty fucking awful. Inc defends his team when someone claims FXO are better and suddenly you've got 10-20 people jumping down his throat, trying to delegitimise his results, basically insulting him as a player which is his livelihood, then when he reacts angrily he gets a smug little 'hey calm down I was only calling you fucking terrible, you're the one who was shitting on other players, why are you playing the victim.'
For some unknown reason there's a fucking legion of arseholes who feel the need to put iNcontroL under far more scrutiny than is necessary, then take any opportunity to shit on him.
Every MLG last year; Inc is fucking awful!
MLG Dallas; Inc got an easy bracket!
MLG groups announced; Inc gets another easy group what a joke! (this one was particularly weird...so many people were saying it. Where's the people saying 'TLO gets the easiest group again guess he gets an easy road to 5th again!'. Why single out Inc from the 20 people in the groups?)
Inc streaming; He just lost a bunch of games, guess he's fucking shitty!
And now Inc defends his team and himself and the vultures fucking descend again. No wonder he got pissed and left the thread and the show on such a sour note.
I call bullshit on the iNcontroL hate. Just fucking stop. Yup I agree with everything you've said. I am glad he left SotG now, fuck the community to be honest. He puts himself out there every week to make a great show and people shit on him over and over. I'm so goddamn sick of the overwhelming bullshit in every single aspect of the Starcraft community I just don't see a reason to visit this site except to view streams and tournament information. The rest of it can just fuck off. The whole 'our community is great' thing applies to a very small minority, as well as in real life. Most people just post to make themselves feel and look important, and it's pretty apparent. you do realize that the public is doing to him what he does to others right? Geoff openly mocks his friend Kelly Milkies and says that gom made a bad choice hiring her. He totally screws with totalbiscuit to the point where totalbiscuit calls out geoff. it was geoff who called out FXO saying "EG is better than them". EG was NOT criticized until geoff said this. He could have said "Congratulations to FXO. They're going to have it hard in Korea but best of wishes and luck" but rather shitted all over their opportunity. just as much as he misrepresents others, others misrepresent him. Theres a reason why Geoff is a love / hate guy. his latest soap box episode didn't help it any and the fact that he lectures the community on verbal ethics and then follows up by telling someone to "shut the fuck up" does not help either. (regardless of context or level of words, the hypocrisy and irony is still there). you can't say that the community has gone to shit without criticizing geoff as well. golden rule: do unto others as you would like done unto you. 1. Inc did an impression of Kelly that he later apologised for. He made some constructive criticisms about her casting in Code A. 2. Are you referencing where he made some comments about Totalbiscuit's casting of (I think) Assembly? Where he was given the wrong information and made some fair comments on what he thought had gone down? It's not his fault the information was incorrect, and it's not like he was hating on TB...he was just saying 'this thing TB has done is childish and he shouldn't have done it'. 3. OMG HOW SCANDALOUS. Inc thinks his own team is better than someone elses. Can we just clarify why the FUCK that's an issue at all? More to the point, in the actual cast there was no point where he was shitting on FXO...he just gave his honest opinion, that he doesn't think they are a top tier foreign team right now. An opinion shared by many. I've already said that he could have been slightly more positive about it, but what kind of cast is it where everyone reacts to every bit of news with 'Hey good for that guy! great! That guy is an excellent player! This is good news! I am happy. Everyone is happy. Yaaaaay.' 4. The argument on verbal ethics centered mainly on context...the SOTG thread is a perfectly acceptable context for telling people to stfu. Nothing ironic about that. OK done wasting my time now, got that out of my system. All I said was I respectfully disagree that EG is a better team then FXO, and that it was not cool to put FXO down like that in sotg. Im then brushed off as a EG hater. More people joins in with the same opinion and incontrol feels it necessary to throw moonan under the buss, while comparing his own accomplishments to be better then Sheths. Any starcraft fan knows that Incontrol isnt even in same league as Sheth. People again jumped in to explain to incontrol, that hiding behind a 4th finish at MLG would be fine if the system at MLG wasnt so fucking stupid. Moonan had argueably a better run then Incontrol and still ended up behind. Incontrol then explains thats he deserved to be in that position with how well he had done in 3 previous MLG's. Some countered that not even finishing in top 16 in any of them really wasnt anything to brag about. At this point, everyone and their mother are idiots,trolls and haters, but really has no counter arguement to why he thinks he has good accomplishments and moonan has none. I watch starcraft alot. Every major tournament, player streams and SC shows. In my opinion Incontrol is nowhere near a top player, and I should be able to voice my honest opinion without getting called a hater. I loved him on Sotg, and I think his a hilarious charismatic person, but I just dont think he is a good player. What should proberly be discussed more though is the MLG tournament setup. It couldnt possibly be more rewarding to the top 16-20. And that made some of the pillars extreamly worried when they found out koreans where getting seeded streight into that position. Hey hey, imma let you finish, but Incontrol has one of the best accomplishment list of... well fuck that. Just saying, I'm not an Incontrol fan, I hate him sometimes because he talks too much and that he has a bad habit of talking over someone else (pretty obvious during one of his recent argument with Tyler about a certain clash on TL) and I'm one of the few that think SotG can become better than it is now with him leaving. BUT please, stop saying Incontrol is not in the same league as Sheth... You can argue all you want, you can hate Incontrol as much as you want, he IS up there, one of the best north american starcraft 2 player at the moment. You can hate him, but you still got to respect him for everything he does for the community (even if you don't like the way he does it) and his skill as a player. Going 6th in MLG is not a fluke, taking down Ensnare, and other good players in NASL is not a fluke. Ok sure, Incontrol think FXO is not good enough, well then LET FXO PROVE HIM WRONG and stop arguing.
While you are at it, why dont you congratulate Gretorp for his amazing top 16 finish. Its no small feat to get top 16 with the amazing set of players at MLG, even if you lose all your games.
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File the contents of this thread under the "why pro-players rarely ever post on TL.net anymore" section.
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On June 03 2011 00:58 -Frog- wrote:
File the contents of this thread under the "why pro-players rarely ever post on TL.net anymore" section.
Indeed, I totally agree. Pros should be able to come on, make controversial statements they KNOW will rile up posters, and then be immune from response.
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There have been legitimate criticisms and responses but there are some people who literally follow Inc into every thread he posts on and talk shit to him. The worst part is his statements aren't even very controversial but people get worked up over nothing or just see it as an opportunity to say something outrageous or incendiary in order to get themselves attention.
TL.net is a big pond and the little fish think that the only way to get people to recognize you is to say something crazy. I'm not saying that everyone criticizing Inc is doing that - at all - but there are enough that I can understand why the vast majority of pros don't post in or read threads on TL.
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On June 02 2011 14:56 Beef Noodles wrote:Really hope TL comes up with a Starcraft 2 drama section, so I can avoid all these threads that I thought would contain actual content. Why do legitimate threads like SOTG become gossip/flame wars? Please TL, split the Starcraft 2 forums into Single Player, Custom Maps, SC2 Strategy, SC2 Tourneys, SC2 General, and SC2 General Gossip Crap. Would really help navigating. Thanks! Poll: New Starcraft 2 "General Gossip Crap" section for derailed threads?No, your mom's an asshole! (17) 74% Yes please! (5) 22% Definitely Needed... (1) 4% 23 total votes Your vote: New Starcraft 2 "General Gossip Crap" section for derailed threads? (Vote): Yes please!
(Vote): Definitely Needed...
(Vote): No, your mom's an asshole!
its been in the forums since 2008 but they disabled it because they think a drama section would stop them monitoring whats going on and would be exploited.
when the HotTL expansion comes to the forums we hope a drama section will be added
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On June 02 2011 22:18 aquanda wrote:Show nested quote +On June 02 2011 19:33 turdburgler wrote:On June 02 2011 19:02 aquanda wrote:
if anyone seriously believes fuck is on the same offensive level as nigger you're an idiot. as an internet neck beard virgin i find the idea of anyone having sex just as offensive as black skin, as i dont have either. hurr more seriously though, calling people an idiot for disagreeing with your baseless opinion is kinda ironic On June 02 2011 16:25 Doodsmack wrote:
Funny how many people on the Destiny side of teh debate like to pretend that nigga (said when addressing friends) and nigger are the same thing. thats destinys whole point though? wording is all about context and situation. it should be ok for destiny to say what he wants on his stream, within that context and setting its ok. Yah, because calling someone nigger really just means that you are simply telling someone that they have black skin. Thank you for calling yourself an idiot by replying to my statement. But you are the same person that trolled my earlier post though, so I'll just keep my statement at that, because it's obvious you are just here for your own personal amusement and nothing more.
if you are arguing that nigger isnt just about the skin colour then its not a racial slur and should be considered equal to the word fuck.
and i didnt troll your earlier post. the only thing your comment added was basically "LOL Y U ALL MAD" while being the only one foaming at the mouth in the whole thread.
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EPT
