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On June 02 2011 04:39 Basher_ wrote:
Using the N-word is not cool. Its not gamer slang. Destiny should read a book.
Agreed with this. I also hate the use of the word "rape" in the way gamers and now mainstream people use it, to describe domination of one person over the other, because I think that it makes light of something that's really terrible and serious. I don't mean "in light of" in teh sense that it makes it funny, just that it makes it seem more casual and less serious of a subject than it should be. Otherwise I agree with Destiny, if you want to say "fuck" or whatever on your own stream go ahead, just in general I dislike the casual use of words that actually describe terrible things.
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I'm a big supporter of iNcontroL but I think leaving SotG is a mistake. It's one of his best venues and great exposure. Inside the Game is great but not the same kind of show and I think we won't be seeing a certain side of him anymore.
For me it's like Don Cherry leaving Hockey Night in Canada.
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On June 02 2011 03:56 SiguR wrote:Show nested quote +On June 02 2011 01:11 iNcontroL wrote:
FXO has literally 0 team accomplishments except losing to EG in ESEA and taking I think 4th.
Where the HELL do people get it in their mind that they are a better team? It absolutely cannot be through results. Arbitrary considerations with players? Qxc hasn't been his former self since MLG of last year when he still placed lower than several EG players. Moonan? No accomplishments. Slog? Filthy? Tgun or w/e... all lower level than Machine, Strifecro and Lz. Sheth is great. But still has fewer / less accomplishments than I do in big tourneys (MLG). Then we compare super-stars.. IdrA vs Moonglade. Need I say more? And all this without mentioning Axslav who won MVP for crota invitational going undefeated against players like Jinro and the other top players from top teams.
Emphasis on the bolded part... I don't care for the argument that's taking place here on which team is better, but blatant falsehoods tickle my fancy. Moonan has no accomplishments but you do? At MLG Dallas, you were seeded into pool play. You took fourth place by: In group play: beating TLO, Mihai, and slush Losing to painuser In the championship bracket: You beat TLO in an extended series You lost to Select 0-2 You lost to Kiwikaki 0-2 You won two best of threes and one best of five. You lost three best of threes. That got you fourth place.At MLG Dallas, Moonan took 8th. He started in the open bracket. Got knocked into the losers bracket by huk and did not make group play, but proceeded to the championship bracket by beating Naama. In the championship bracket he beat spades, painuser, mihai, machine, slush, and eventually lost to socke.
Moonan won 11 best of threes, and lost two best of threes. That got him 8th place. If you'll notice, three of the players he beat were the ones that were in your pool (essentially the same players you beat to secure your fourth place spot, minus TLO).In summary: Incontrol : Wins: 2 bo3's, 1 bo5. Losses: 3 bo3's 4th place Moonan: Wins: 11 bo3's Losses: 2 bo3's 8th place The catch is that Moonan played almost literally the same players that you did, plus naama, spades, machine, and a number of lesser known players. Saying Moonan has zero accomplishments and you have more accomplishments than him or sheth seems kind of moronic. You benefited from a very skewed seeding system. That is all fine and good in itself. I'm happy for your success. But don't go waving your dick around saying you have more accomplishments than other people who arguably performed just as well if not better than you. I want to be clear that i'm not saying you didn't do well. I'm saying that arguably Moonan did better and you're sitting on your 4th place "accomplishment" and saying Moonan has zero accomplishments. It seems silly.
I think this highlights a problem with the MLG seeding system. Seeding players into tournaments is fine and all, but the best players aren't getting the places they deserve and the "padding" so to speak for seeded players is too much. I'd like to see a re-evaluation of their tournament system to stop this from happening in the future.
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On June 02 2011 04:53 iNcontroL wrote:Show nested quote +On June 02 2011 04:02 Azide wrote:On June 02 2011 03:56 SiguR wrote:On June 02 2011 01:11 iNcontroL wrote:
FXO has literally 0 team accomplishments except losing to EG in ESEA and taking I think 4th.
Where the HELL do people get it in their mind that they are a better team? It absolutely cannot be through results. Arbitrary considerations with players? Qxc hasn't been his former self since MLG of last year when he still placed lower than several EG players. Moonan? No accomplishments. Slog? Filthy? Tgun or w/e... all lower level than Machine, Strifecro and Lz. Sheth is great. But still has fewer / less accomplishments than I do in big tourneys (MLG). Then we compare super-stars.. IdrA vs Moonglade. Need I say more? And all this without mentioning Axslav who won MVP for crota invitational going undefeated against players like Jinro and the other top players from top teams.
Emphasis on the bolded part... I don't care for the argument that's taking place here on which team is better, but blatant falsehoods tickle my fancy. Moonan has no accomplishments but you do? At MLG Dallas, you were seeded into pool play. You took fourth place by: In group play: beating TLO, Mihai, and slush Losing to painuser In the championship bracket: You beat TLO in an extended series You lost to Select 0-2 You lost to Kiwikaki 0-2 You won two best of threes and one best of five. You lost three best of threes. That got you fourth place.At MLG Dallas, Moonan took 8th. He started in the open bracket. Got knocked into the losers bracket by huk and did not make group play, but proceeded to the championship bracket by beating Naama. In the championship bracket he beat spades, painuser, mihai, machine, slush, and eventually lost to socke.
Moonan won 11 best of threes, and lost two best of threes. That got him 8th place. If you'll notice, three of the players he beat were the ones that were in your pool (essentially the same players you beat to secure your fourth place spot, minus TLO).In summary: Incontrol : Wins: 2 bo3's, 1 bo5. Losses: 3 bo3's 4th place Moonan: Wins: 11 bo3's Losses: 2 bo3's 8th place The catch is that Moonan played almost literally the same players that you did, plus naama, spades, machine, and a number of lesser known players. Saying Moonan has zero accomplishments and you have more accomplishments than him or sheth seems kind of moronic. You benefited from a very skewed seeding system. That is all fine and good in itself. I'm happy for your success. But don't go waving your dick around saying you have more accomplishments than other people who arguably performed just as well if not better than you. I want to be clear that i'm not saying you didn't do well. I'm saying that arguably Moonan did better and you're sitting on your 4th place "accomplishment" and saying Moonan has zero accomplishments. It seems silly. well said I got seeded into the top 16 because I spent 3 MLG's beating people of / higher level than what you listed for Moonan. Saying he did well in open play and then placed lower in the same bracket I placed higher in as some kind of "he did better" is stupid. I have NO IDEA why so many people hate on slush / TLO it really is a shame.. they are fucking good. Mihai came from the same open stage btw as Moonan and he too lost 0-2 to me. It sucks cause I have to defend my 4th place finish which comes off as "wow he thinks it was so amazing" but I am only doing that in response to the idiots that go "his 4th place finish was vs scrubs lololol" Sigur I understand you are a moonan fan boy and all but I'm sorry...
You are getting too heated in here, just step away and leave the thread man. Sigur isn't being a blind fanboy. He's just showing that Moonan had a freaking sick run at the last mlg and shouldn't just be discarded like toilet paper. You had a good run at the mlg too. You placed high and did get seeded because of consistency.
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I remember back in the beta days Tyler made a post about the Rape/gamer lingo thing that I thought was so good I had to save it:
A year or so ago, Liquid`Tyler wrote:
From an intellectual perspective, I think you would recognize that a language that has certain words with the power to provoke powerful emotions is superior to a language that does not have such words. If 'rape' was used only to describe the sexual act, and if every time it was used, extreme care was exercised so that anyone hearing it would have an intimate understanding of what rape is, then 'rape' could be a very powerful word. When people are desensitized to the word because they have a poor understanding of its meaning (knowing a few lines from the dictionary is not truly knowing the meaning) and because the word takes on other meanings and is used in other situations, especially light-hearted and harmless situations, then the language is robbed of a unique and powerful word. Would you censor yourself to make your language better? It would go against your principle but perhaps this would be a case where you are capable of understanding the merit.
Obviously posting it here takes it out of a larger context but I think you can basically figure it out 
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On June 02 2011 05:00 SMD wrote:Show nested quote +On June 02 2011 04:57 ditkaordie wrote:
Inc man, Its not just about who you beat... its the lack of matches, lack of different opponents, and the way you beat them. You honestly think you didn't have it easy? He was seeded into the top 16, was that his choice? no. MLG decided it. He won his group. Lost in the semi's and won 1 or 2 elimination matches to get back to 4th place. What is wrong with him being proud of comming 4th in this huge tournament? while nothing has been mentioned about money, 4th was what, 1200? thats a half decent chunk of change. I think he should be proud of the 4th finish, and try to build on it at columbus and shoot for the top. Everyone who goes to Columbus will want to win, that doesn't mean if they don't win and come 4th they won't be satisfied.
He is using it as some huge accomplishment. By all means he should be proud of coming in 4th as would anyone. But to say his run wasn't easy by saying "slush and tlo are awesome" is fucking stupid. TLO is really good and slush is pretty good. Every top 8 player had a tougher road than he did and he finished where the tournament allowed him to which was way above the skill level he played at. He will probably place highly again due to the structure not his play. All this waters down this result as a huge accomplishment making him more "accomplished" than Sheth or Moonan
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So basically, the last 10 pages or so have been a bunch of people who are not professional gamers trying to tell iNcontroL, who is a professional gamer, that his achievements are somehow invalid and that he's somehow bad. I'm not going to try and make a silly sports analogy to explain why this is flat absurdity. If you can't see it, you're beyond help.
Does anyone else miss the days when people who dedicated their lives to this game were afforded due respect for it? Or did I imagine those days?
Edit: I just saw this post:
On June 02 2011 05:03 StandingMan wrote:I remember back in the beta days Tyler made a post about the Rape/gamer lingo thing that I thought was so good I had to save it: Show nested quote +A year or so ago, Liquid`Tyler wrote:
From an intellectual perspective, I think you would recognize that a language that has certain words with the power to provoke powerful emotions is superior to a language that does not have such words. If 'rape' was used only to describe the sexual act, and if every time it was used, extreme care was exercised so that anyone hearing it would have an intimate understanding of what rape is, then 'rape' could be a very powerful word. When people are desensitized to the word because they have a poor understanding of its meaning (knowing a few lines from the dictionary is not truly knowing the meaning) and because the word takes on other meanings and is used in other situations, especially light-hearted and harmless situations, then the language is robbed of a unique and powerful word. Would you censor yourself to make your language better? It would go against your principle but perhaps this would be a case where you are capable of understanding the merit.
Obviously posting it here takes it out of a larger context but I think you can basically figure it out
And wanted to thank you for quoting it. One of the things that bothers me the most about the SC2 community is the fact that we fling the word "rape" around so light-heartedly. From a purely lingusitic perspective, this is a powerful argument against our usage of this word. There are other perspectives to consider, but they are hard for people (myself included) to really internalize if they have had no personal experience with the act.
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On June 02 2011 04:53 iNcontroL wrote:Show nested quote +On June 02 2011 04:02 Azide wrote:On June 02 2011 03:56 SiguR wrote:On June 02 2011 01:11 iNcontroL wrote:
FXO has literally 0 team accomplishments except losing to EG in ESEA and taking I think 4th.
Where the HELL do people get it in their mind that they are a better team? It absolutely cannot be through results. Arbitrary considerations with players? Qxc hasn't been his former self since MLG of last year when he still placed lower than several EG players. Moonan? No accomplishments. Slog? Filthy? Tgun or w/e... all lower level than Machine, Strifecro and Lz. Sheth is great. But still has fewer / less accomplishments than I do in big tourneys (MLG). Then we compare super-stars.. IdrA vs Moonglade. Need I say more? And all this without mentioning Axslav who won MVP for crota invitational going undefeated against players like Jinro and the other top players from top teams.
Emphasis on the bolded part... I don't care for the argument that's taking place here on which team is better, but blatant falsehoods tickle my fancy. Moonan has no accomplishments but you do? At MLG Dallas, you were seeded into pool play. You took fourth place by: In group play: beating TLO, Mihai, and slush Losing to painuser In the championship bracket: You beat TLO in an extended series You lost to Select 0-2 You lost to Kiwikaki 0-2 You won two best of threes and one best of five. You lost three best of threes. That got you fourth place.At MLG Dallas, Moonan took 8th. He started in the open bracket. Got knocked into the losers bracket by huk and did not make group play, but proceeded to the championship bracket by beating Naama. In the championship bracket he beat spades, painuser, mihai, machine, slush, and eventually lost to socke.
Moonan won 11 best of threes, and lost two best of threes. That got him 8th place. If you'll notice, three of the players he beat were the ones that were in your pool (essentially the same players you beat to secure your fourth place spot, minus TLO).In summary: Incontrol : Wins: 2 bo3's, 1 bo5. Losses: 3 bo3's 4th place Moonan: Wins: 11 bo3's Losses: 2 bo3's 8th place The catch is that Moonan played almost literally the same players that you did, plus naama, spades, machine, and a number of lesser known players. Saying Moonan has zero accomplishments and you have more accomplishments than him or sheth seems kind of moronic. You benefited from a very skewed seeding system. That is all fine and good in itself. I'm happy for your success. But don't go waving your dick around saying you have more accomplishments than other people who arguably performed just as well if not better than you. I want to be clear that i'm not saying you didn't do well. I'm saying that arguably Moonan did better and you're sitting on your 4th place "accomplishment" and saying Moonan has zero accomplishments. It seems silly. well said I got seeded into the top 16 because I spent 3 MLG's beating people of / higher level than what you listed for Moonan. Saying he did well in open play and then placed lower in the same bracket I placed higher in as some kind of "he did better" is stupid. I have NO IDEA why so many people hate on slush / TLO it really is a shame.. they are fucking good. Mihai came from the same open stage btw as Moonan and he too lost 0-2 to me. It sucks cause I have to defend my 4th place finish which comes off as "wow he thinks it was so amazing" but I am only doing that in response to the idiots that go "his 4th place finish was vs scrubs lololol" Sigur I understand you are a moonan fan boy and all but I'm sorry...
Nobody is hating on slush/TLO, this seems like a deliberate attempt to change the subject. And moonan did play slush and beat him 2-1. So essentially
Incontrol :
Wins: 2 bo3's, 1 bo5.
Losses: 3 bo3's
4th place
Moonan:
Wins: 11 bo3's
Losses: 2 bo3's
8th place
with the only person moonan didn't face that you beat being TLO. And we all know how you won those games. And if anyone knows what happened in those games it is clear that nobody is hating on TLO.
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On June 02 2011 05:04 Vega62a wrote:
So basically, the last 10 pages or so have been a bunch of people who are not professional gamers trying to tell iNcontroL, who is a professional gamer, that his achievements are somehow invalid and that he's somehow bad. I'm not going to try and make a silly sports analogy to explain why this is flat absurdity. If you can't see it, you're beyond help.
Does anyone else miss the days when people who dedicated their lives to this game were afforded due respect for it? Or did I imagine those days?
No basically, you who claims to have read through 10 pages, yet fails to comprehend that people are using Incontrol's very own definition of accomplishment to convince him of the fact that players like Sheth and Moonan are not that far below him in accomplishments as he believes them to be.
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Since there's a major tourney in the next few days, why not just wait a bit and give him shit afterwards, if you feel like it. Or complain to sundance or somebody.
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On June 02 2011 05:04 Vega62a wrote:
So basically, the last 10 pages or so have been a bunch of people who are not professional gamers trying to tell iNcontroL, who is a professional gamer, that his achievements are somehow invalid and that he's somehow bad. I'm not going to try and make a silly sports analogy to explain why this is flat absurdity. If you can't see it, you're beyond help.
Does anyone else miss the days when people who dedicated their lives to this game were afforded due respect for it? Or did I imagine those days?
Its more like
*Incontrol shits all over good player/team he hasn't beaten
*people bring up Incontrols lackluster record
*Incontrol tries defending record
*Incontrol claims people can't bring up his record
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On June 02 2011 05:10 GuiMontag wrote:Show nested quote +On June 02 2011 05:04 Vega62a wrote:
So basically, the last 10 pages or so have been a bunch of people who are not professional gamers trying to tell iNcontroL, who is a professional gamer, that his achievements are somehow invalid and that he's somehow bad. I'm not going to try and make a silly sports analogy to explain why this is flat absurdity. If you can't see it, you're beyond help.
Does anyone else miss the days when people who dedicated their lives to this game were afforded due respect for it? Or did I imagine those days? Its more like *Incontrol shits all over good player/team he hasn't beaten *people bring up Incontrols lackluster record *Incontrol tries defending record *Incontrol claims people can't bring up his record
The fact that you have called inc's record "lackluster" essentially proves what I was saying.
Edit:
On June 02 2011 05:09 rotegirte wrote:Show nested quote +On June 02 2011 05:04 Vega62a wrote:
So basically, the last 10 pages or so have been a bunch of people who are not professional gamers trying to tell iNcontroL, who is a professional gamer, that his achievements are somehow invalid and that he's somehow bad. I'm not going to try and make a silly sports analogy to explain why this is flat absurdity. If you can't see it, you're beyond help.
Does anyone else miss the days when people who dedicated their lives to this game were afforded due respect for it? Or did I imagine those days? No basically, you who claims to have read through 10 pages, yet fails to comprehend that people are using Incontrol's very own definition of accomplishment to convince him of the fact that players like Sheth and Moonan are not that far below him in accomplishments as he believes them to be.
I indeed did read through all of that, and while I wasn't the biggest fan of the post that started this shitstorm, the following pages were basically people trying to tell inc that getting seeded into the top 16 at MLG and then placing 4th by overcoming a mountain of REALLY GOOD players (and as non-progamers, we basically don't have the authority to legitimately call any progamer anything but REALLY GOOD) was not really that impressive. Stop. You're being silly.
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For the way he talks down to other players and teams it is very lackluster
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On June 02 2011 05:10 GuiMontag wrote:Show nested quote +On June 02 2011 05:04 Vega62a wrote:
So basically, the last 10 pages or so have been a bunch of people who are not professional gamers trying to tell iNcontroL, who is a professional gamer, that his achievements are somehow invalid and that he's somehow bad. I'm not going to try and make a silly sports analogy to explain why this is flat absurdity. If you can't see it, you're beyond help.
Does anyone else miss the days when people who dedicated their lives to this game were afforded due respect for it? Or did I imagine those days? Its more like *Incontrol shits all over good player/team he hasn't beaten *people bring up Incontrols lackluster record *Incontrol tries defending record *Incontrol claims people can't bring up his record
i think its more like
sotg shit on people who play bad
people go lol but u suck more
sotg pilars say, you dont need to be a chef to be a food critic.
people shit on incontrol
incontrol goes lol but u suck more
people say, you dont need to be a chef to be a food critic
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I'm always amused when people try to use filthy language to be taken more seriously, and I'm even more amused by people that take those that use filthy language more seriously.
It doesn't make a difference if you have something worthwhile to say.
But what is really stupid is trying to pin offensiveness on the use of certain words. This is just plain retarded.
I myself find most gamer lingo silly and consider it stupid unoriginal posturing.
But anyone who is still upset and surprised when he encounters stupid bravado in this world doesn't know how good he has it.
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Does anyone else find the N- Word completely offensive??? Its plain unnecessary too and you should just look up some more words in the dictionary if you can't find a good replacement for it. You guys do realize it is a derogatory term used to humiliate Blacks right? Like its part of our history, there were black slaves and people would use that term because it meant they were less than human and below everyone else in the world, the lowest of the low with no rights, you guys know this RIGHT?? Why endorse such a word then.
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On June 02 2011 05:00 SMD wrote:Show nested quote +On June 02 2011 04:57 ditkaordie wrote:
Inc man, Its not just about who you beat... its the lack of matches, lack of different opponents, and the way you beat them. You honestly think you didn't have it easy? He was seeded into the top 16, was that his choice? no. MLG decided it. He won his group. Lost in the semi's and won 1 or 2 elimination matches to get back to 4th place. What is wrong with him being proud of comming 4th in this huge tournament? while nothing has been mentioned about money, 4th was what, 1200? thats a half decent chunk of change. I think he should be proud of the 4th finish, and try to build on it at columbus and shoot for the top. Everyone who goes to Columbus will want to win, that doesn't mean if they don't win and come 4th they won't be satisfied.
I am going to use this quoted post to explain why MLG format has its flaws. Because it exemplifies how distorted the standings can look to the uninformed bystander. Here, our friend SMD thinks that by placing 4th it means he competed against hundreds of people, when in actual fact he was in top16 before the tournament even started, and ended up 4th even though he won and lost the same amount of series.
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On June 02 2011 05:14 R3demption wrote:
Does anyone else find the N- Word completely offensive??? Its plain unnecessary too and you should just look up some more words in the dictionary if you can't find a good replacement for it. You guys do realize it is a derogatory term used to humiliate Blacks right? Like its part of our history, there were black slaves and people would use that term because it meant they were less than human and below everyone else in the world, the lowest of the low with no rights, you guys know this RIGHT?? Why endorse such a word then.
Have you ever listened to rap music?
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As someone who has listened to every episode of SOTG, I will miss Incontrol being on the show. He always gave me a ton of laughs with his quips and rants.
I personally didn't find episode 41 too bad. They neglected the discussion of the current metagame, but did delve into a lot of relevant topic involving E-sports, which I find interesting considering the unique position of the guests as prominent personalities or contributors to the scene. The language discussion did run a bit long, but it wasn't too detrimental to the episode IMHO.
I really hope the hiatus doesn't last too long, as I looked forward to Tuesday nights specifically because SOTG.
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On June 02 2011 05:13 turdburgler wrote:Show nested quote +On June 02 2011 05:10 GuiMontag wrote:On June 02 2011 05:04 Vega62a wrote:
So basically, the last 10 pages or so have been a bunch of people who are not professional gamers trying to tell iNcontroL, who is a professional gamer, that his achievements are somehow invalid and that he's somehow bad. I'm not going to try and make a silly sports analogy to explain why this is flat absurdity. If you can't see it, you're beyond help.
Does anyone else miss the days when people who dedicated their lives to this game were afforded due respect for it? Or did I imagine those days? Its more like *Incontrol shits all over good player/team he hasn't beaten *people bring up Incontrols lackluster record *Incontrol tries defending record *Incontrol claims people can't bring up his record i think its more like sotg shit on people who play bad people go lol but u suck more sotg pilars say, you dont need to be a chef to be a food critic. people shit on incontrol incontrol goes lol but u suck more people say, you dont need to be a chef to be a food critic
That's not really it at all. SOTG pillars criticize players who may be better than they are (I have no authority to say if they are or aren't) and are able to do so because they have the perspective of somebody who dedicates their lives to gaming. This criticism is therefore legitimate.
Conversely, people who casually play starcraft criticize incontrol without any of the perspective that comes with being somebody whose livelihood depends on playing starcraft well. This criticism is not legitimate.
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EPT
