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Interesting Discovery (Terran) - Page 2

Forum Index > SC2 General
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rA.BreeZe
Profile Blog Joined April 2008
Canada56 Posts
February 27 2010 22:19 GMT
#21
*waits for someone to complain about how this will make sc2 suck*
baeracaed
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
United States604 Posts
February 27 2010 22:20 GMT
#22
Dude! Great find, props.
(☞゚ヮ゚)☞ Cookies! ☜(゚ヮ゚☜)
sob3k
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
United States7572 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-02-27 22:27:29
February 27 2010 22:24 GMT
#23
On February 28 2010 07:19 rA.BreeZe wrote:
*waits for someone to complain about how this will make sc2 suck*


you only had to wait negative 2 posts!

On February 28 2010 07:18 azndsh wrote:
I would worry about things like this "dumbing" down the game a lot more than auto-mine or MBS


I confess, I don't really understand how an advanced micro trick will "dumb down the game", but whatever...
In Hungry Hungry Hippos there are no such constraints—one can constantly attempt to collect marbles with one’s hippo, limited only by one’s hippo-levering capabilities.
Liquid`Jinro
Profile Blog Joined September 2002
Sweden33719 Posts
February 27 2010 22:36 GMT
#24
You don't see how the game making micro decisions for you is dumbing down the game......? I hate this - it's a skill to not overkill units but instead split fire when you need to =/
Moderatortell the guy that interplanatar interaction is pivotal to terrans variety of optionitudals in the pre-midgame preperatories as well as the protosstinal deterriggation of elite zergling strikes - Stimey n | Formerly FrozenArbiter
-orb-
Profile Blog Joined September 2007
United States5770 Posts
February 27 2010 22:36 GMT
#25
Wow that sounds really misguided to have in the game.

I guess when you have masses of ranged units the thing to do is to shiftclick attack through every one of the enemy's units on your way to the battle and if your opponent didn't do the same thing you'll win?

jeez if everyone starts doing this it will be like whoever engages first wins
'life of lively to live to life of full life thx to shield battery'
how sad that sc2 has no shield battery :(
Rothbardian
Profile Joined January 2010
United States497 Posts
February 27 2010 22:37 GMT
#26
On February 28 2010 07:36 -orb- wrote:
Wow that sounds really misguided to have in the game.

I guess when you have masses of ranged units the thing to do is to shiftclick attack through every one of the enemy's units on your way to the battle and if your opponent didn't do the same thing you'll win?

jeez if everyone starts doing this it will be like whoever engages first wins


Tanks aren't that great.
"A tax-supported, compulsory educational system is the complete model of the totalitarian state." - Isabel Paterson <3
sob3k
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
United States7572 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-02-27 22:41:20
February 27 2010 22:39 GMT
#27
Oh, I see what you mean, yeah...

hmmm, I'm not sure what to think about this one, the game is taking away overkill prevention micro (keep in mind this ONLY occurs in units whose projectiles do not take time to reach a target), but you can sort of use this tendancy as a micro trick in itself...we will see
In Hungry Hungry Hippos there are no such constraints—one can constantly attempt to collect marbles with one’s hippo, limited only by one’s hippo-levering capabilities.
Liquid`Jinro
Profile Blog Joined September 2002
Sweden33719 Posts
February 27 2010 22:42 GMT
#28
On February 28 2010 07:36 -orb- wrote:
Wow that sounds really misguided to have in the game.

I guess when you have masses of ranged units the thing to do is to shiftclick attack through every one of the enemy's units on your way to the battle and if your opponent didn't do the same thing you'll win?

jeez if everyone starts doing this it will be like whoever engages first wins

I mean, you already do this (at least if you have long ranged units), but this removes the step of making sure you don't overkill.

Meh, I don't see it as a HUGE deal but it's not something I like. Is the zergling vs probe problem still in the game? (I don't play zerg - but the one where if you told 6 lings to attack a probe in a mineral path, they would spread out and attack different ones)?
Moderatortell the guy that interplanatar interaction is pivotal to terrans variety of optionitudals in the pre-midgame preperatories as well as the protosstinal deterriggation of elite zergling strikes - Stimey n | Formerly FrozenArbiter
IceCube
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
Croatia1403 Posts
February 27 2010 22:46 GMT
#29
Nice find! It will be useful when I get my hands on original upon release. Hope this doesn't change till then tho.
Forever Vulture.. :(
Jazriel
Profile Joined April 2008
Canada404 Posts
February 27 2010 22:50 GMT
#30
On February 28 2010 07:17 Rothbardian wrote:It's not even that, but tanks get taken out by blink and chargelots...since they are so gas heavy you won't have much support, and the little support you do have will be killed by your splash. One siege tank shot obliterates marines, and chargelots are on your MM in a sec. It's hard to support 2-3 Facs early before Toss gets up immortals/Colossus, and if you go heavy tank, Colossus will rape you.

You need that gas for Medivacs/Vikings and Ghosts. Gas comes much slower in SCII than in SCI.

Anyways, take that as you will from 55-31 Plat player. I actually find my Terran matchups the hardest since I have no fucking clue what I should do. Sometimes I 2 Fac if I don't see the opponent is going Banshee. Then it turns into SCI with mass siege tank lines and drops...which isn't exactly my strong point (Siege Lines) since I'm an Age/RA95 player :p

Once the game gets to that point drops are nullified by Vikings and Thors and Turrets which are a lot better in SCII than in SCI. What I've found if you can't kill off the Terran early/mid game it's going to be a long ass game 45Min-1Hr and end up in BC battles.

I think I might try some sneaky ghost nuke play and hellion harass....


But how do stalkers get sight of tanks on a cliff? Turrets > Observers. You say Chargelots > Marines, but are Chargelots > Helions?

I see tank strats being extremely effective in SC2, just no one seems to do them right. I don't know of any hybrid bio/mech strats for SCI yet people seem to think they can mass M&M and still make tanks.
#1 LoL player
lololol
Profile Joined February 2006
5198 Posts
February 27 2010 22:51 GMT
#31
This is probably due to units dying instantly instead of on the next frame, and since dead units can't be attacked the tanks simply choose another target.
I'll call Nada.
Picture
Profile Joined August 2009
Canada75 Posts
February 27 2010 22:53 GMT
#32
So what happens when you don't target fire at all?
Chill
Profile Blog Joined January 2005
Calgary26003 Posts
February 27 2010 22:56 GMT
#33
Cool. If you just let them fire automatically wouldn't they do this anyways? What's the advantage to queuing manually?
Moderator
MorroW
Profile Joined August 2008
Sweden3522 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-02-27 23:00:24
February 27 2010 22:56 GMT
#34
great find, big tnx to u, altho im not using siege tanks so much

ye i thought the same thing as u chill :p the tanks will spread out even if ur not touching them? and same goes to all ranged units without projectiles?
Progamerpls no copy pasterino
Fallen
Profile Joined October 2005
Canada192 Posts
February 27 2010 22:58 GMT
#35
yea I dont get this at all, why would you shift queue.. if they would do it normally?
oh hay
Rothbardian
Profile Joined January 2010
United States497 Posts
February 27 2010 23:03 GMT
#36
On February 28 2010 07:50 Jazriel wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 28 2010 07:17 Rothbardian wrote:It's not even that, but tanks get taken out by blink and chargelots...since they are so gas heavy you won't have much support, and the little support you do have will be killed by your splash. One siege tank shot obliterates marines, and chargelots are on your MM in a sec. It's hard to support 2-3 Facs early before Toss gets up immortals/Colossus, and if you go heavy tank, Colossus will rape you.

You need that gas for Medivacs/Vikings and Ghosts. Gas comes much slower in SCII than in SCI.

Anyways, take that as you will from 55-31 Plat player. I actually find my Terran matchups the hardest since I have no fucking clue what I should do. Sometimes I 2 Fac if I don't see the opponent is going Banshee. Then it turns into SCI with mass siege tank lines and drops...which isn't exactly my strong point (Siege Lines) since I'm an Age/RA95 player :p

Once the game gets to that point drops are nullified by Vikings and Thors and Turrets which are a lot better in SCII than in SCI. What I've found if you can't kill off the Terran early/mid game it's going to be a long ass game 45Min-1Hr and end up in BC battles.

I think I might try some sneaky ghost nuke play and hellion harass....


But how do stalkers get sight of tanks on a cliff? Turrets > Observers. You say Chargelots > Marines, but are Chargelots > Helions?

I see tank strats being extremely effective in SC2, just no one seems to do them right. I don't know of any hybrid bio/mech strats for SCI yet people seem to think they can mass M&M and still make tanks.


Your tanks won't be on a cliff when you push.
"A tax-supported, compulsory educational system is the complete model of the totalitarian state." - Isabel Paterson <3
PredY
Profile Joined September 2009
Czech Republic1731 Posts
February 27 2010 23:04 GMT
#37
well it's better to target fire the hydras rather than let the tanks target the lings and kill half of your marines in the process
http://www.twitch.tv/czelpredy
wintergt
Profile Joined February 2010
Belgium1335 Posts
February 27 2010 23:05 GMT
#38
On February 28 2010 07:58 Fallen wrote:
yea I dont get this at all, why would you shift queue.. if they would do it normally?

He can only play vs himself but in real play you don't need to shift queue ofcourse because tanks will auto-engage and avoid overkill.
here i am
TheYango
Profile Joined September 2008
United States47024 Posts
February 27 2010 23:06 GMT
#39
I'm curious which units this is relevant for. As far as I can remember:

Terran: Marine, Reaper, Ghost, Tank, Thor, Viking (ground attack), Auto-Turret
Protoss: Immortal
Zerg: None

It seems that of those, only the Tank, Thor, and Immortal actually do enough damage for this to be of huge consequence, and even then, it's not necessarily worth using in all situations. Good to know about, but I don't think it will have an overly large impact on micro, especially since I haven't seen any of those units in large enough numbers that splitting damage manually would be especially hard.
Moderator
DeCoup
Profile Joined September 2006
Australia1933 Posts
February 27 2010 23:07 GMT
#40
Very nice. I don't think waypointing is needed tho is it? If an ally had the 10 marines in your tank range and broke alliance they would still not overkill and chain the whole lot down.
Waypoint targeting key units in a wave will be very very good with this system tho, because lack of overkill will stop wasted shots.
Exellent find!
"Poor guy. I really did not deserve that win. So this is what it's like to play Protoss..." - IdrA
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