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On July 23 2013 21:56 FLuE wrote:
I was so pumped about the viper it is a shame it turned out worthless.
Maybe it needs to be tier 2 w/ spire?
I'm not trying to balance whine, just discussion about how the game could be more interesting by making more units viable in all matchups. My biggest complaint about SC2 is the number of units that are either worthless in general or worthless in a certain matchup.
Nobody just uses it against bio, for whatever reason.
If Soulkey had blinded all that terran army during his huge flank in game 3, he might've crushed it.
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Austria24417 Posts
On July 23 2013 21:57 bo1b wrote:Show nested quote +On July 23 2013 21:54 virpi wrote:On July 23 2013 21:49 Douillos wrote:
The only thing I hope for is that Blizzard doesn't touch the game for a while. I don't think we've ever had an sc2 build this balanced, all match ups are fun to watch and to play.
ZvP is absolutely terrible to play imho. It's either a turtlefest or someone allins. Even though there are tons of different all-ins out there, the matchup doesn't feel very dynamic - especially if you compare it the other ones. Every once in a blue moon you get that hyun vs hero game though.
I didn't like it that much tbh. I mean it was good and flashy and all but the game was basically over after HerO threw his army away (which was the only timing he could have hit) and HerO just did what he does which is being unkillable as long as he has anything to outcontrol people with
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Aphrodite, Kim Carrier, Aphrodite > Eve, GoRush, OldTimer.
:D!!! Yay!
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On July 23 2013 21:48 sibs wrote:Show nested quote +On July 23 2013 21:43 double1185 wrote:
I don't complain about WM or hellbat, but from the look of all the game i watched so far (this is purely observation w/out any statistic), the role of additional unit in HoTS in term of usage and important: T>>P>>Z, for Z the only function/unit is used frequently is the ability to fast regenerate of Muta, the role Swarm host or viper is miles below the contribution of Mothership core to P and miles miles behind window mines or hellbat (bfore nerf) or even medivac boost to Terran. Call me OP whiner but Blizzard really love T Yea, this is a fact, Z in hots is a lot weaker than in WoL comparing directly, double infestor nerf was pretty harsh, they should revert some nerfs on the infestor.
I'm zerg and I really don't want to see that. The unit was way too strong in WoL, and it has found his right place now.
What I would like to see is a slight buff to the overseer and/or to the viper, maybe if the blinding cloud affect the widow mine it would gives zerg more control to the map and would be able to break out the bio+mines position.
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On July 23 2013 21:58 DidYuhim wrote:Show nested quote +On July 23 2013 21:56 FLuE wrote:
I was so pumped about the viper it is a shame it turned out worthless.
Maybe it needs to be tier 2 w/ spire?
I'm not trying to balance whine, just discussion about how the game could be more interesting by making more units viable in all matchups. My biggest complaint about SC2 is the number of units that are either worthless in general or worthless in a certain matchup. Nobody just uses it against bio, for whatever reason. If Soulkey had blinded all that terran army during his huge flank in game 3, he might've crushed it.
2 WM and your flank isnt happening. Why should bio stand in the clouds when it could stuttering back to the mine field. Also its expensive and slow and could get sniped by 4 stimmed marines.
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Ahhhh Maru, Liquibet killer!
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Zergs cry about balance every time a Zerg loses. If Terran loses 30 marines to 3 banelings people blame him for not microing. When Zerg loses mutas to mines it's mines OP.
When innovation was leading 3-0 in the first season finals, Zergs were having the same discussions. When Soulkey won the next 4 games to win 4-3, then all balance complaints stopped. Coincidence? Or just normal Zerg balance whine?
When Zergs stop whining, that's when you know Zerg is OP.
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lol the clear best player in the world wins...nerf more terran units. You realize outside of the top 3-5 terrans in the world the rest of the race in the pro scene is dying off? Look at how many terrans have been in the foreign events top 8 or so, and how many started in Code S this season even with hellbats being good (the lowest number ever in history of Korean indiv sc2 leagues)...I'm not saying terran is underpowered at the pro level, but it clearly is more the player than the race. And it comes down to a few small errors in engagements either way. a few extra good splashes with the banelings in game 3 that game looks totally different. Soulkey kept very calm and well executed defense for a while but never was able to get the medivacs with his mutas( those mutas basically did nothing in any capacity) and then slowly was worn down in the micro battles. innovation literally made like 0 errors, and soulkey went muta but didnt commit enough to them to even be able to harass his opponent. Game 2 was a poorly executed roach attack, but even still i dont think most terrans would have held that off because innovation paid so much attn to detail with the target firing and positioning of his marines. Small things easily change any of those games.
And as far as mines or hellbats being way more important than the new units for P and Z, i don't know how you don't think the mothership core is not just as important to protoss as the mine is to terran. the Zerg new units don't seem to be that great for ZvT except the muta change i agree, but ZvP SH and vipers are essential..and I think at some point those units will find more of a common place in ZvT too.
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LOL standard Zerg balance whine qq
But then again, Zerg players complained during broodlord winfestor, so it's hardly unexpected.
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On July 23 2013 21:48 sibs wrote:Show nested quote +On July 23 2013 21:43 double1185 wrote:
I don't complain about WM or hellbat, but from the look of all the game i watched so far (this is purely observation w/out any statistic), the role of additional unit in HoTS in term of usage and important: T>>P>>Z, for Z the only function/unit is used frequently is the ability to fast regenerate of Muta, the role Swarm host or viper is miles below the contribution of Mothership core to P and miles miles behind window mines or hellbat (bfore nerf) or even medivac boost to Terran. Call me OP whiner but Blizzard really love T Yea, this is a fact, Z in hots is a lot weaker than in WoL comparing directly, double infestor nerf was pretty harsh, they should revert some nerfs on the infestor.
Infestor is just about right at it's current state. The concept of instant Fungal- stunning units and dealing heavy damage really has no place in such a fast paced game. Currently it's a skillshot, and it requires DotA-level aiming skills to get a good one off. You can do a lot of things to zerg, but please not the infestor. I don't want to watch another race with a god-unit.
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France9034 Posts
On July 23 2013 22:04 Irre wrote:
lol the clear best player in the world wins...nerf more terran units. You realize outside of the top 3-5 terrans in the world the rest of the race in the pro scene is dying off? Look at how many terrans have been in the foreign events top 8 or so, and how many started in Code S this season even with hellbats being good (the lowest number ever in history of Korean indiv sc2 leagues)...I'm not saying terran is underpowered at the pro level, but it clearly is more the player than the race. And it comes down to a few small errors in engagements either way. a few extra good splashes with the banelings in game 3 that game looks totally different. Soulkey kept very calm and well executed defense for a while but never was able to get the medivacs with his mutas( those mutas basically did nothing in any capacity) and then slowly was worn down in the micro battles. innovation literally made like 0 errors, and soulkey went muta but didnt commit enough to them to even be able to harass his opponent. Game 2 was a poorly executed roach attack, but even still i dont think most terrans would have held that off because innovation paid so much attn to detail with the target firing and positioning of his marines. Small things easily change any of those games.
And as far as mines or hellbats being way more important than the new units for P and Z, i don't know how you don't think the mothership core is not just as important to protoss as the mine is to terran. the Zerg new units don't seem to be that great for ZvT except the muta change i agree, but ZvP SH and vipers are essential..and I think at some point those units will find more of a common place in ZvT too.
So basically, the game is balanced and the better player won this series which involved two top players that lose games because of small details thanks to the level of play. Nice recap, thanks ! 
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This forum in nutshell: terran wins one series, all zergs lose their minds, zergs chrushes terran in series all terrans are crying. Protoss wins some games, "omg nerf force fields".
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opterown
Australia54784 Posts
On July 23 2013 22:29 daskilla wrote:
This forum in nutshell: terran wins one series, all zergs lose their minds, zergs chrushes terran in series all terrans are crying. Protoss wins some games, "omg nerf force fields".
this poster: pretty inaccurate
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Guide
How to be God in sc2?
Switch your race to terran if it is not.
Develop insane mechanics with one opening that beats everything.
This is it.
User was warned for this post
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On July 23 2013 22:08 Whatson wrote:
LOL standard Zerg balance whine qq
But then again, Zerg players complained during broodlord winfestor, so it's hardly unexpected.
Hearing this from a Terran is rich. There is only one race in this game that has a legitimate complaint about other races balance whining and that is Protoss because Protoss, unlike Zerg and Terran, has never had a long spell of dominance.
And there was a lot of bullcrap from Terrans during GomTvT.
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this forum actually is somewhat decent, if compared to twitch chat
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God, I hate seeing Innovation win. I respect his skill, but I still hate it. If he wins WCS KR and WCS Season 2 I will be so unbelievably annoyed.
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On July 23 2013 21:58 DidYuhim wrote:Show nested quote +On July 23 2013 21:56 FLuE wrote:
I was so pumped about the viper it is a shame it turned out worthless.
Maybe it needs to be tier 2 w/ spire?
I'm not trying to balance whine, just discussion about how the game could be more interesting by making more units viable in all matchups. My biggest complaint about SC2 is the number of units that are either worthless in general or worthless in a certain matchup. Nobody just uses it against bio, for whatever reason. If Soulkey had blinded all that terran army during his huge flank in game 3, he might've crushed it.
huge investement, can easily be avoided by moving out of it, and takes up relatively much supply
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EPT
