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Russian Federation81 Posts
Lets discuss ultralisk
From what i seen and my experience noone actually uses ultras even late game. And there is thouthands of reasons why:
1) its Hive tech. Once you get hive tech, why no to make BL instead?
2) Ultra is VERY big. little less than thor. Are you ready for such big ass?
3) Ultra deals pathetic 20dmg. Well maybe he attacks once per every 0,6 seconds or so, its not too bad, but definately not too much something over exciting. I believe 4 zerligns can deal more dps than 1 ultra
Even with buildings his 60 attack cant be much comparedto Immortal
4) He is tankish, thats good. 600 hp its like battlecruiser; same goes for armor. he can survive lots of marines.
But who uses marines that much?
another, and maybe biggest problem of this "tank" is that he actually have "armored" type, which means most army combinations should own him, i.e. M&M/Immos/stalkers +wow sentries // and wll yeah not amror bonused but pure masses of roachers/hydras in paper.
5) without upogrades he is really LOL, i think even maradeurs can kite him?
so only use for him "in paper" is just a some meat shield instead/with roachers to take out some zealotos or ltake 2-3 shoots from M&M balls while your hydras killing enemies.
whats your opinions? have you tried this guy and it worked good for you?
//my rank is ~60 plat at the moment.
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I like the suggestion (not my idea originally) to make the slow ability on marauders not affect massive units. That would be a big boost to ultras in tvz.
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On April 07 2010 05:06 petered wrote:
I like the suggestion (not my idea originally) to make the slow ability on marauders not affect massive units. That would be a big boost to ultras in tvz.
Slow ability DOESN'T affect massive units.
And yeah, ultras blow, they need to give it an ability or buff its damage or something. There's no reason to get it in a regular games besides to BM cause they suck so much.
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Guys... marauders slow doesn't slow massive targets already... geez
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On April 07 2010 05:01 chinaski.chinaski wrote:
maybe biggest problem of this "tank" is that he actually have "armored" type, which means most army combinations should own him, i.e. M&M/Immos/stalkers +wow sentries // and wll yeah not amror bonused but pure masses of roachers/hydras in paper.
5) without upogrades he is really LOL, i think even maradeurs can kite him?
so only use for him "in paper" is just a some meat shield instead/with roachers to take out some zealotos or ltake 2-3 shoots from M&M balls while your hydras killing enemies.
whats your opinions? have you tried this guy and it worked good for you?
//my rank is ~60 plat at the moment.
Isn't ultra massive type? Isn't that why maruader slow doesn't affect it?
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They are waaay to big imo,getting blocked and blocking off your own units , not cool dawg not cool
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Posted reasons in the old thread, but the gist is:
1. hydras/roaches are very powerful, so most people skip melee upgrades in favor of ranged/carapace.
2. ultras are only good once they get all of their upgrades, meanwhile broodlords are also available at hive and are great without any upgrades.
3. no dark swarm means zerg late-game melee units are not nearly as effective as they were in SC1
4. Ultras are hard-countered fairly easily compared to SC1 ultras; marauders, thor, & immortal counter them very well.
5. considering all of the above, their 200 gas cost makes them situational at best.
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just want to add:
ultra counters masses of ravens very well, since marauder count is low and hsm don't do nearly as much damage. I've learned not to mass so many ravens else i will get runover TT
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Calgary25996 Posts
I don't have a suggestion to fix it. The Ultralisk sucks, is way too slow and I never build them.
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Gief ultralisk with heat seeking missile and storm. ASAP
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Also, ultra ling seems to suffer because lings block the ultras from even attacking. The ling autosurround goes off so fast that you can't really do much to get ultras to even attack until the lings die.
IMO, the attack should be range like .5 such that it can attack over a ling.
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their speed needs to be drastically increased with the speed upgrade.
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Ultralisks would need a TON of armor to be useful. Simply because in SC2 some key units deal so much damage that 6 armor is barely helping at all.
The units I am thinking about are roaches, marauders and immortals (hey it's you three again). Terran also got tanks AND thors now both of which barely suffer from armor, Protoss got the Void Ray and who wants his own Ultralisks Neural Parasited?
Another issue is that melee units seem to be weaker in SC2 in general. In mid/lategame Zealots and Zerglings are usually only built to get at least something for all those minerals (and to deal with each other).
But, if you incrase Ultralisk armor (would need a base value of 3-4 imo), they become absolutely impossibe to kill with anything but their hard counters.
Maybe a good solution would be to make Ultralisks "biological - massive", dropping the "armored". But this wouldn't make sense from a design perspective.
Oh, putting 10 spine crawlers on the back of each ultralisk would be awesome too.
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On April 07 2010 05:01 chinaski.chinaski wrote:
Lets discuss ultralisk
From what i seen and my experience noone actually uses ultras even late game. And there is thouthands of reasons why:
1) its Hive tech. Once you get hive tech, why no to make BL instead?
2) Ultra is VERY big. little less than thor. Are you ready for such big ass?
3) Ultra deals pathetic 20dmg. Well maybe he attacks once per every 0,6 seconds or so, its not too bad, but definately not too much something over exciting. I believe 4 zerligns can deal more dps than 1 ultra
Even with buildings his 60 attack cant be much comparedto Immortal
4) He is tankish, thats good. 600 hp its like battlecruiser; same goes for armor. he can survive lots of marines.
But who uses marines that much?
another, and maybe biggest problem of this "tank" is that he actually have "armored" type, which means most army combinations should own him, i.e. M&M/Immos/stalkers +wow sentries // and wll yeah not amror bonused but pure masses of roachers/hydras in paper.
5) without upogrades he is really LOL, i think even maradeurs can kite him?
so only use for him "in paper" is just a some meat shield instead/with roachers to take out some zealotos or ltake 2-3 shoots from M&M balls while your hydras killing enemies.
whats your opinions? have you tried this guy and it worked good for you?
//my rank is ~60 plat at the moment.
The problem with the ultralisk is that they have a too large size (i know that it is how they are supposed to be) in closed combat there is no space for zergling..so the ultralisk cannot be a tank to absorbe damage while zergling don't make damage :|
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They are so useless...
Thats the problem with Zerg's units. They have less ( just 9, compared to 12 of P and T ) units, and Ultralisks are pretty much useless as well :D The only reason to get hive now is Broodlord, or Upgrades. You wont be getting hive to upgrade roaches regeneration anymore ( nerfed to the ground ), zerglings attack speed ( worthless crap at this point in the game, and very expensive ) , or Ultralisks ( they suck so badly I prefer to make 4 roaches all day long instead of 1 ultralisk. ).
The fact that they are insanely slow even after upgrade, very big ( try having 5-6 of them in a large supply battle, they will most likely get stuck with the current maps and chokes everywhere ), and they need 2 upgrades + another building to be usefull, lol.
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Honestly the Ultra should be able to have lings walk under it, kinda like how units can walk under the colossus.
Ultra/ling would be a great meat shield/damage dealer but most of the time, the few ultras you actually make, spend most of their time running around like idiots trying to find a place to hit units.
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no mention of ultras splash damage or their ability to headbutt buildings? ultras and extremly effective vs zealots lings and marine comps
problem is roach/hydra is really synergistic and strong to say the least and it completly overshadows the ultralist. there are no lurkers to delay as you upgrade and hit hive tech you simpley need to always have a strong ground army.
I would really consider getting ultras vs a protoss who seems to be favoring heavv zealot play
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On April 07 2010 05:23 Chill wrote:
I don't have a suggestion to fix it. The Ultralisk sucks, is way too slow and I never build them.
I agree, it almost seems like you would need a combination of slugs(infestors) and creep to make them fast enough and get some hits in without being raped by faster units like marines and every single protoss unit
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EPT
