On March 15 2013 21:44 ciox wrote: Why is Lockdown so bad all of a sudden? Lockdown was mainly counterable after it had been used, it was done like so in BW: - terran: Restoration on the disabled units - protoss: Recall disabled units to safety - zerg: unaffected
Well one of the main things in BW was that ghosts weren't really used that much (except in rare situations where the opponent masses BCs, you somehow have 12 Wraiths and have just enough ghosts to lock the opponents BCs down, for example).
Also with no smart cast, locking down things was tough (had to click and cast them individually).
Here is the thing. Both me and XiA have a busy week now. I will not have much time to spend on the editor and it is still some work left to do. I have a long list of stuff that must be fixed.
Would anyone here wanna give me a hand in the editor?
I will just PM a list of stuff that must be done together with the Starbow-file and you can spend as many hours working on this in the editor as you feel like. If none of you want to, or are not able to, check if you have any friend who can do some work!
Otherwise the next big patch will be on hold for a while and maybe be released in 1 or 2 weeks from now. So all help in the editor is appreciated!
I'll have a lot of time Monday next week (first day of easter). I know you are all working on getting tired of HoTS and waiting for the next patch, but I wanna play Starbow ... (insert whine here...)
Anyone up for some games on monday afternoon/evening? I'll make a tournament if I have to
Maybe we could get a "Starbow fight club" going. Me Vs Azelja was the first match. Now, Azelja has to face the next challenger! Anyone up forrit? (If Puccini accepts we'll have the next "HuyN")
I LOVED the BW island maps with many small islands, even though they were probably not too balanced... The further you expand towards your opponent the more risk there is. The closer bases have less ground with almost no room to place down defenses. It is really hard (or should be) to proxy a ton of stuff. The mains are HUGE so all your tech and production u'll ever need can be there. Islands are almost exclusivity for expanding. Three Xel'naga watch towers so having ground units actually gives you some map-control. The "foggy" islands are the only once without bases. They have xel-naga towers and room for buildings / turrets.
Also, does anyone knows how to make the cliffs look like they are fading down forever. Looks kinda weird how they just stop in-space.
That's about it. It is not complete unless you all say this looks fantastic.
Is the "choice" to turn hellions into hellbats at a specific time a choice, or a calculation.
Things to think about.
Great video which nicely explains the difference between calculations and choises. Previously I argued that stim duration of 9 seconds (compared to 15) seconds wasn't a very good idea of promoting skill becasue the decision it self (when to press "t") was so easy to figure out. Hellbat vs hellions suffers from the same thing I believe, and from a communication PoV its probably a lot better to characterize these kind of simiplistic decisions as calculations rather than actual choices.
If anyone has any feedback on the island map (see above) please share today. I'll have some time today to work on it if needed, but then I'll be busy for some time.
Well we don't know much about Island maps in SC2 but i guess i could share some of my hypotheses about those. They are mostly based on the RSL S3 which featured debris field.
What the above island map does right:
It got 2 bases on the main island. Should be no more, or no less.
What it does wrong:
It is 2 player. On four player island maps Terran have very limited initial scouting options meaning they can't tell what is coming and must be prepared for anything. That is a good thing.
It is too small. Terran have the strongest Late game air army but it is also almost the least mobile one(Brood lords are still slow as hell). Thus the bigger the map is the worse it is for Terran. That is the Theory anyway.
Basicly the default theories about Island maps is that Terran have a massive advantage in both expanding and in late game air army. Now i can't tell how much this applies to Starbow but if i were to take a guess in HOTS this would be a very Terran favored map. Again it is mostly based on theories, we got very little actual data on this.
I see the 4-player thing and I might make it 4 player. The only thing is that the scan will be very luck.based which I don't like, but there is really no way around that I think.
The map is actually 128 x 176 - so it is not that small. I might make it bigger if needed. Would like to try it out, but I cannot get it to work with Starbow atm since it has HoTS features. I'll just have to wait for "Heart of the Starbow" patch before it can be added as a test map.
On March 25 2013 17:02 Xiphias wrote: I see the 4-player thing and I might make it 4 player. The only thing is that the scan will be very luck.based which I don't like, but there is really no way around that I think.
The map is actually 128 x 176 - so it is not that small. I might make it bigger if needed. Would like to try it out, but I cannot get it to work with Starbow atm since it has HoTS features. I'll just have to wait for "Heart of the Starbow" patch before it can be added as a test map.
It is the hole point that scan will be luckbased and thus unreliable. Forcing the Terran to play safe rather than "Scan! Oh Nexus first, guess i make 3 more CCs then". Scouting Barracks are also an option. Chances are you won't need the early units anyway.
I do think the map is long enough but i am conserned if it is wide enough. If it gets widened up in the process of becoming a 4 player map then i think it will be fine. 176x176 is as big as Taldarim granted but with most units flying i don't see that as an issue.
I could see island maps eventually go beyond that if they end up becoming popular.
Is the "choice" to turn hellions into hellbats at a specific time a choice, or a calculation.
Things to think about.
Great video which nicely explains the difference between calculations and choises. Previously I argued that stim duration of 9 seconds (compared to 15) seconds wasn't a very good idea of promoting skill becasue the decision it self (when to press "t") was so easy to figure out. Hellbat vs hellions suffers from the same thing I believe, and from a communication PoV its probably a lot better to characterize these kind of simiplistic decisions as calculations rather than actual choices.
This video is silly. It does a bring up a few good point but doesn't define terms correctly.
All the supposed "calculations" were still choices, just easy choices. A calculation is doing the math, which helps you choose.
There is also something important to note, calculations, it is very possible for a player to calculate badly and therefore make a bad choice. This is especially prevalent in a game like starcraft with incomplete information. You don't always know what a better situation for either unit is.
This sort of choice happens all the time where it is essentially both players constantly trying to make better choices via calculations, whether good or bad, to win the game that already has incomplete information.
I don't think this video applies unless you have something like, one marine and a very similar marine who is slightly better.
What we have for this choice is a tradeoff. There isn't always a right answer for this tradeoff. Every unit you make is a tradeoff money wise.
I aim to get the new patch up in ca a week.. I am slow : / .. So you don´t think I have disappeared.
@Xiphias map
Nice to see a casual 4v4 map in the pool. The overview looks good. The ridges look interesting. Will be fun to try it when the next patch is up. (If we get 8 players together ^^ )
Even more maps (even though almost no one is in the thread atm...):
Sniper Ridge
This is kinda complete. Decembercalm wanted to see a Starbow version of this map so I made a quick one. I am not saying that this map has to make it into the pool, but I am curious about your opinions regarding it.
I tried to stick to the original texture for fun. All the crazy rocks are unpathable to prevent sigeing the high ground, same principle as in the original.
You cannot walk from your main to the strait into the first ridge as well.
Oh well. Map making is fun. Would it not be fun to have an original map just for Starbow?
Well I bring you:
The squares of Starbow
About 200 x 200 (a lot of empty space). It is still under construction but any fedback would be nice!
Pics:
Thought behind the map: - Far away third (might not be far away enough), but fairly easy to defend. - Even further away fourth but even easier to defend. - All spawn locations possible! I've made the make in such a way that the travel distance is almost the same for cross as for close spawns (175 vs 200) - Weird Island in the middle (why not). - Few key points of defense. You can grab 4 bases and a mineral only by defending 3 chokes. - I am debating whether or not to but out 4 Xel'naga watchtowers on the four high ground areas near the middle. Controlling the two close to you will equal full vision of all critical points, which I don't like, but as of now they are only useful for placing maybe tanks on. - I will texture more and add doodads once the design is complete.
EPT
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