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On May 03 2015 01:41 Arston wrote:
I enjoyed this game a lot. I have a couple of questions:
- why Void Ray was removed?( Terran has banshee for midgame air-to-ground pressure, zerh has muta, while toss...
- dont warp gate seem a bit useless compared to normal ones (time of accesability, recharge, no dragoons)?
- do you plan to add Ravager/Cyclone/Disruptor/Adept in the mod?
Voidray has no place in the Starbow meta right now, as it's a doublon for Scouts. Protoss has the sentinel to be anoying and "good" scout/corsair/carrier if it really wanna try a skytoss.
Warp-gate is meant to be "bad", because the advantages it gives like fast burst production, in-battle production and anywhere production, thus negating defender advantage and allowing easier harass defence, need to have some drawback in order to be a choice. That's why it's fairly higher tech and that also helps early game balance more than mamacore. Ton note that Protoss has more way to get "mobile" in SB, because of arbiter recall, kayldaring crystal recall and voidprism drop being useful (reavers OP).
SB is not SC2 nor LotV, the point is NOT to copy it and it's NOT to cramp as many units as possible, but make a balanced and enjoyable game. Not to say some similarities won't happen, heck SB "stole" the HERC/MERC idea and LotV stole and made OP everything SB invented.  But the point is adding a unit just for the sack of it will not happen.
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Russian Federation13 Posts
1) But scouts are late (and are they really better?) and sentinels are not for direct assault. And VRs had that lovely feature with 3 modes... If wraith was added for anti-capital ship function only, why not ray for specialised function too. Prices can be adjusted easily
2) I mean, in late game when you can go mass warp gate stalkers are not that useful anyway, especially vs terran
3) other units were not good enough?( for example ravager could be micro fun
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scouts are late yes, and they are indeed a terrible unit.
Dunno why voidray isnt here instead of the scout, could be a fun flying unit vs terran mech.
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How do you micro a voidray compared to a scout Foxxan?
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On May 03 2015 06:44 Uvantak wrote:
How do you micro a voidray compared to a scout Foxxan?
Key is targetfiring. If we think about the wol voidray i could see it beeing fun vs mech.
Good in small numbers, bad in higher numbers. So open it is not bad at all compared to scout which needs to be massed etc.
Just some thoughts.
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The Void Ray and the Scout share some similiarities in Terms of their AA anti-capital ship capabilities. However I think there are some problems when implementing such a strong hitting early game bomber unit like the VoidRay / old sbow Scout. Back when the hype was bigger we had the Scout deal twice as much Damage to Ground and Protoss abused it alot against Terran because you had to produce so many Goliaths which a Terran usually doesnt want to do against Protoss. (Keep in mind the Goliath probably dealt twice as much damage to ground units compared to their BW counterpart). It was basically impossible to scout and punishing the terran too hard if the protoss got 1-2 scouts out. Even when we had it a fleetbeacon requirement it felt troublesome in the game. Giving Protoss a hard hitting flying early game unit makes the matchup quite stale and turtlish. (old nullward for example). IMO!!! It felt really frustrating to play against.
Mass Warpgate Stalkers are useful vs Zerg for example and I have seen DT warpin to great affects.
I was fine with the ravager personally, however most of the current Starbow community dislike this unit for whatever reason. I think the unit is fun to play with and against in LOTV. Its probably one of the better units created by Blizzard.
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Russian Federation13 Posts
I see. However fast single Void Ray was quite beatable even in WoL, and unlike scouts VRs dont start ealing heavy damage instantly (I mean 3 mode version). And it could be made unaccesible in early game anyway if nececssary; doesnt seem to be that big of a problem. Is it just that scout reminds "goold old BW style"?
But in other matchups?..
It is a pity, Ravager would fit Starbow concept well 
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Dont think it would be the same problem with the voidray as with the scout.
*Voidray costs more(I guess atleast)
*Their dps starts low and increases over time.
*Many voidrays attacking the same unit is overkill and doesnt get a single voidray to up their stage in damage.
Voidray would feel strategic versus mech. Atleast it feels that way.
It has 7range in wol, could have the same here(Maybe, only maybe). Might turn out to abusive vs zerg and protoss etc.
The difference from the wol voidray would be that it cant walk and shoot at the same time, atleast not as the same degree as the old voidray could. Current voidray to btw. It makes it hard to micro out of the voidray, which should be encouraged.
So opening fast stargate and going a few voidrays is a bigger comittment for protoss+easier to react towards for the opponent.
Would be cool if the micro got tweaked "right" and so goliath vs voidray was different from other air vs ground units. Goliaths against carriers for example, the goliaths always want to be as close as possible to the carrier.
Against the voidray would be potential to let the goliath be the kiter. Goliath doesnt have this role against any air unit.
Just some thoughts here, ofcourse its theory.
If i was a leaddesigner i would remove scout and implement a voidray instead for sure.
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On May 04 2015 03:45 Arston wrote:I see. However fast single Void Ray was quite beatable even in WoL, and unlike scouts VRs dont start ealing heavy damage instantly (I mean 3 mode version). And it could be made unaccesible in early game anyway if nececssary; doesnt seem to be that big of a problem. Is it just that scout reminds "goold old BW style"? But in other matchups?.. It is a pity, Ravager would fit Starbow concept well
in WoL there is a viking which outranges it.
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Russian Federation13 Posts
AFAIK there is viking in Starbow too...
And marines still make short work of them, right?
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On May 04 2015 05:34 Arston wrote:
AFAIK there is viking in Starbow too...
And marines still make short work of them, right?
Viking works differently than in sc2. In a normal TvP noone plays alot of Marines and to build them blindly just to be safe puts you behind against toss.
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On May 04 2015 04:17 Foxxan wrote:
Dont think it would be the same problem with the voidray as with the scout.
*Voidray costs more(I guess atleast)
*Their dps starts low and increases over time.
*Many voidrays attacking the same unit is overkill and doesnt get a single voidray to up their stage in damage.
Voidray would feel strategic versus mech. Atleast it feels that way.
It has 7range in wol, could have the same here(Maybe, only maybe). Might turn out to abusive vs zerg and protoss etc.
The difference from the wol voidray would be that it cant walk and shoot at the same time, atleast not as the same degree as the old voidray could. Current voidray to btw. It makes it hard to micro out of the voidray, which should be encouraged.
So opening fast stargate and going a few voidrays is a bigger comittment for protoss+easier to react towards for the opponent.
Would be cool if the micro got tweaked "right" and so goliath vs voidray was different from other air vs ground units. Goliaths against carriers for example, the goliaths always want to be as close as possible to the carrier.
Against the voidray would be potential to let the goliath be the kiter. Goliath doesnt have this role against any air unit.
Just some thoughts here, ofcourse its theory.
If i was a leaddesigner i would remove scout and implement a voidray instead for sure.
You bring some interesting points to the table. I have never thought about the WoL void ray that much because I thought it is a stupid unit. But in a more BW´ish environement like you described it, it seems indeed more of a solid unit. You should talk to Xiphias about that.
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Problem with WoL VR is the "bounce" and destructible rocks hunt to get the lazors going.
I'm not sure how interesting an ability it really is.
Ravager, well it doesn't have a define role in SB since you don't really have Forcefield, Hydras and the new AA unit are good (and scourges) and Zerg even have ways to break "sieges" with DarkSwarm and even other options.
It was also a fucking broken* unit when it came out, and that leaved a bad taste to many people.
*Hint they reduced it's DPS by half and it's range by a third... http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/legacy-of-the-void/484023-lotv-balance-update-preview-april-27
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Russian Federation13 Posts
Vikings have splash to kill mass air though
Wait, TvP bio?
----
Not only them, there you could try to warp building closer to battlefield to use it for overheat before battle... really fun. Rocks, hallucinations, etc
But ravager could break sieges earlier than dark swarm, right? And alternatives are always nice, especially since zerh has lowest number of units to work with...
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Can we make this an extension mod? That way we are not locked to specific maps.
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On June 05 2015 07:20 DeathTBO wrote:
Can we make this an extension mod? That way we are not locked to specific maps.
Maybe... but it's hard to automatize map changes. For example SB only has 1 gas (should be consistent between maps and different symmetries.
And not all SC2 maps are good for SB anyway because of the different units, pathing and macro curves.
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Thank you op mofo morrow for showcasing starbow ladder <3 !
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Welcome to 2016, im looking for nice players to do couple VS . Join us !
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On April 20 2016 00:27 snakethebest9405 wrote:
Welcome to 2016, im looking for nice players to do couple VS . Join us !
We have a skype group with some players. PM me if you wanna join.
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Hello StarBowners
A New Patch went live just a moment ago!
This patch mostly adds polishing to the previous patch and puts the game in a stable state.
We are reparing a little surprise after the release of this patch, so stay tuned.
As for the changelog:
-Many small bug fixes and tooltip improvements
-eruptors: fixed bug that allowed their ag weapon to benefit from the enrage behavior.
-Mutalisk: weapon range back to 3 to match bw values. (new pathing allows them to stay relevant)
-Arsenal renamed academy to match bw names. scans still enabled by academy.
-fixed a bug that allowed orbital commands to start with 3 scans. now they start with 1.
-Ghost academy is named Covert ops now to match bw names.
-irradiate: overall improvement and some bug fixed that allowed units to auto spread from it's effects too efficiently. Also atm it doesnt trigger units to flee on their own. (as it was in bw)
-enforcers: nerfs across the board. balanced around less hp but also less hp cost on stim.
-ghosts: cost changed to 50m 125g. longer cast range on pdt, but added a settup timing when they first spawn (during their settup time their weapons are not active and they dont trigger aggression automatically)
-wraiths: ag weapon now shoots 2 projectiles for 5 damage each (instead of 1 projectile for 8 damage)
-sentinels: lower hp and armor type changed to medium
-nullward: 800 hp, now loses 10 each second that passes, so attacking it contributes to make them disapear faster. Forced taunt range slightly lowered.
-among others
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EPT
