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On March 20 2013 16:09 TranceStorm wrote:
The implication you were driving at was that there were several mafia members driving the lynch. There is no need to be so vague in your questions. Just out your suspicions.
Why? I dont know the scum team, so not inferring any knowledge of the sort.
Anywho:
Since when does scum infer plurality;
Since when do scum have to be present at all times in the day to coordinate bandwagons TOGETHER?
(Thats rhetorical if you choose to reply)
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On March 20 2013 16:35 sciberbia wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2013 16:34 DarthPunk wrote:
Hmmm. That is really solid. And you picked up on some stuff I completely missed. I'm very happy you think so. I have other stuff to share about WoS too. Taking a quick food break though.
When I read WoS filter (as per my post to Geript)
I noticed the same things actually.
Made me doubt WoS very much.
The meta argument i made on wos doesnt hold. because he did not actually grow a pair of balls until AFTER the case.
WoS commented as if he had done it all game, so when i looked back at this last 2 pages of filter i was like ohh ok, hes got balls all good.. and made a leap of faith it was in his other 4 pages.
My meta case now actually supports Kita case.
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On March 20 2013 16:25 sciberbia wrote:
WoS seems to be painting glurio in a scummy light despite supposedly leaning town on him. He does this again later where he says he thinks my list looks like I'm scum trying to pick out easy targets, but then it turns out he has a town read on me. I don't think townies are likely to spend time making the thread see their own null/town reads as scummy.
I feel like I should provide quotes for reference here:
On March 19 2013 16:02 WaveofShadow wrote:Show nested quote +On March 19 2013 16:01 sciberbia wrote:
alright i feel compelled to make a deadline post in case I am shot. But I don't think that's especially likely.
I did one readthrough of everyone's filter during night-phase. Here are the people I felt best about being town:
vivax, DP, DYH
And here are people I think have a decent chance of being scum:
geript
WoS
BH
glurio
zarapeth
trancestorm
cosmicomics
Meh not sure I should even post this. Well if I die, at least look into the filters I listed for possible scum. Aside from BH, I see a common theme in your scum list, that is, players who either have barely contributed or could be seen as newbies. I don't like it, and not just because I'm included.
On March 19 2013 16:16 WaveofShadow wrote:Show nested quote +On March 19 2013 16:14 Mocsta wrote:On March 19 2013 16:11 WaveofShadow wrote:
You have, I don't know how much of a vet GK is, Mr Wiggles, Mocsta.... THnx, but i am certianly not a vet.. check my profile. Started playing in the new year 2013 More so than me and most of the other 'newbies' named on his list, Mocsta. The list just looks to me like he's looking for easy scumreads to throw out there with minimal chance of being called out if he's wrong because they're either new/bad or lurky.
And then later.
On March 20 2013 12:41 WaveofShadow wrote:
Scib:
I read you as town. You've been sticking to your reads (a few too many lists for my liking but whatever) and I especially like that you've been attempting to keep zare in the spotlight, who also looks incredibly scummy to me and has for most of the game. Bring the aforementioned case against me if you must; I'll do my best to shut it down along with the rest, sigh.
Like what as the point of trying to convince people that ONE of my posts is scummy if he overall has a town read on me? It doesn't seem townie-motivated.
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@Scib. I don't think so. The two strangest things about it to me are:
1. The "Is this the town I'm going to have to put up with?" comment. It looks like he's internally distanced himself from the town. I want to look at the context and timing of this.
2. WoS giving a town leaning read on Glurio based on meta despite the fact that at multiple points he's said that he's not good at meta reads and doesn't put too much stock in meta reads (or similar comments IIRC).
@Moc I want an answer to my last post before I come back. Fristed.
Either way, I'm done studying for tonight and need some sleep. I'm going to be back after my exams to reread ~8-10 hours prior to lynch and post some more comments then.
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VOTE COUNT! Day 2
ThePeashooter (2): Wade Fell, TranceStorm
goodkarma (1): Kenpachi
Wade Fell (1): Vivax, geript, VisceraEyes
Mr. Wiggles (4): zarepath, goodkarma, VisceraEyes, WaveofShadow, Coagulation
zarepath (0): Vivax
WaveofShadow (5):: glurio, kitaman27, ThePeashooter, DarthPunk, zarepath, Mocsta , Mr. Wiggles
VisceraEyes (2): cosmicomics, DoYouHas
Voting is compulsory
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+ Show Spoiler +On March 20 2013 16:48 geript wrote:
@Scib. I don't think so. The two strangest things about it to me are:
1. The "Is this the town I'm going to have to put up with?" comment. It looks like he's internally distanced himself from the town. I want to look at the context and timing of this.
2. WoS giving a town leaning read on Glurio based on meta despite the fact that at multiple points he's said that he's not good at meta reads and doesn't put too much stock in meta reads (or similar comments IIRC).
@Moc I want an answer to my last post before I come back. Fristed.
Either way, I'm done studying for tonight and need some sleep. I'm going to be back after my exams to reread ~8-10 hours prior to lynch and post some more comments then.
@geript
What is the "I don't think so" in response to?
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@Oatsmaster
you have 4 names on the Wiggles wagon but the votecount shows only 3
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On March 20 2013 16:25 sciberbia wrote:
DP/Mocsta/ whoever is online, I'd like some unbiased opinions here. Am I reading too much into this?
That quote. Sorry it wasn't clear.
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@Sciberbia
To re-enforce your "case" on WoS.. this post in particularly stands out for me
On March 20 2013 06:02 WaveofShadow wrote:Alright there we go, so there goes one of cosmic's points against you...that wasn't so hard.The other point (I don't care about the DP nonsense) that struck home for me was you fingering GK earlier on and then assuming he was town to make the case against BH. I'll link for your convenience: Show nested quote +Ok. VisceraEyes' hypothesis is that Wade Fell is a scum mason trying to manipulate townies. Where in this post does VisceraEyes consider goodkarma as scum? He doesn't. Let me hash that out again. In the starting sections of my post I demonstrated that VisceraEyes considered goodkarma scum. Additionally he disparaged Wade Fell's play in defending goodkarma (another contradiction), but now he is trying to push Wade Fell as scum on the basis that he is masoning goodkarma, which is one of his town reads? How is Wade Fell masoning goodkarma supporting evidence that Wade Fell is a scum mason attempting to manipulate townies? It isn't. VisceraEyes is getting muddled up in his pile of lies. Either you think goodkarma is town and that Wade Fell's mason choice was to manipulate him, or you think goodkarma is scum and that Wade Fell fake masoned a scum partner. What VisceraEyes is doing is calling both goodkarma and Wade Fell scum, and using "town goodkarma" as evidence of Wade Fell scum. Only scum do this. Do you agree with both BH and GK being scum partners and that the logs were faked?
The reason I have a problem with this is because VE and I had the exact same interchange in the hydra scum QT
Im not actually implicating VE here as scum; I am more so stating, this type of mindset has a much higher likelihood of originating from scum. (i.e. I noticed you did these scummy things.. but no one has picked up on it.. let me ask you some easy questions in the thread, so you can explain yourself nonchalantly and remove any suspicion)
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Anywho.. im voting WoS now
relooking at the "defense"
I cant believe he attributed 3/4 lines to defending the case.. and an equal amount of lines on subsequent posts.
i.e. the amount he wrote, should have just been for the kita case
Even the points 2-5 based on subsequent posts.. some of the defense is just not fleshed out.
##Vote: WoS
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On March 20 2013 16:37 sciberbia wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On March 20 2013 16:34 Mocsta wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2013 15:46 geript wrote:On March 20 2013 15:18 Mocsta wrote:On March 20 2013 15:06 geript wrote:
Moc could you explain that logic more clearly. I'm not understanding that post at all. I can, if you let me know what you're struggling to follow. Surely its not the "whole thing" Here's what I mean: your problem with WoS as you summarize it is that in non-newb (non-first game) games he has more balls. You confront him on it. He turns on the 'balls factor.' You unvote based on said 'having balls' town read. Then you excuse the kita case essentially based on experienced player reading an experienced player when you say WoS isn't experienced and thus the whole case is invalid. There's nothing damning there and I can follow that at least. That said, I can't help but feel that this whole exchange is fishy because it comes off as you telling him how to act, then he acts that way, then you dismiss your vote and the case with a wave of the hand. (Pun intended). I categorize this as "Moc-type logic" but it still feels artificial to me. The last part is my real issue: For me, the case is upheld *ONLY IF* WoS hasnt pushed a lynch agenda during Day1. Thats when a sheep vote to me is scummy. From the quick filter browse i did, it looked like he satisfied the above, thus, making the case invalid to me. You say the case is upheld only if WoS doesn't push a lynch agenda D1. Honestly, I didn't remember a lynch agenda from him D1 and the only points re:lynch are a +1 on DP and a preference on GM over Zare. He even noted his meta reads are crap; I think he also called my meta reads as crap (based on previous games where Zare had at least softclaimed town early). However, I don't remember him commenting on DYH's meta read at all. I don't see a real case push from WoS D1 which makes the case still stand then right? Wow Geript.. I wrote this whole post and said fuck it. im not gonna be lazy, I will read 6 pages of WoS. It changed everything. You are right. Kita case still stands.I was wrong. this fucker did not do anything until the Kita case (which is the only stuff I read when WoS asked me to look @ his filter  my derp) I was under the impression he had pushed Mr.Wiggles all of Day 1.. obviously wrong. I dindt realise the majority of his filter came from late Night1/early Day 2. And also that the majority of his filter is just talking shit. There is not a clear agenda. I need to read WoS defense of Kita case one more time, because I wasnt satisfied the first time around; but was giving undue credit for pushing a case Day1. For your reference, the below is the post i was about to make before reading WoS filter. + Show Spoiler +
(1) "Balls"
Now for what you raised:
I didnt unvote WoS because he turned the balls factor on... that would be invalid (cos i gave him a way out)..
The way it went down: I skipped to the most recent page, saw that limp post of him and was like WTF, WoS doesnt play like that and made my meta validation vote post. It was that simple. I think its pretty obvious when i voted him, it was with intention to lynch.
He then identified to me, that he had "balls" before the meta case. As such, the meta case post in my opinion became his saving grace.
(2) Why lynch push is important
I know you love poker. so let me me analogous to that.
Pros expect a certain level of play, and can actually struggle against newbies, because they dont understand/conform to the "rules' of the game and make unpredicatable/stupid plays.
I believe that was the basis of kitaman case on WoS. Those tells on someone like DP would indeed be the nail in the coffin. Unfortunately I dont find them as strong on newbies, because typically they are not as aware of what constitutes good play; or the ramifications of their own play.
Hence why I said, Kita case points are indeed valid scum tells; but to me only point to a scum WoS if he hasnt pushed a lynch candidate hard. (That would be the turning point for me to consider the tells as scum, and not newbie town being unaware/stupid).
(3) Is the case invalid - i.e. did WoS push anyone hard
I need to do a proper read of his filter, instead of just a couple pages.
Based on Day2 play, I thought he pushed ppl; hence my retraction of vote.
Based on Day1 play, I havent read it (yet.. planning to tonight)
If WoS indeed only discussed "Im not familiar to know these meta reads" and didnt push a lynch vote, then I would give serious consideration to Kita case, and most likely lead to a vote on WoS.
Unfortunately, I am making a leap of faith currently that the targets WoS pushed today (i.e. Mr.Wiggles etc) are the same ppl from Day1. If that is the situation at hand, then I think Kita case is invalid in full.
err no he didn't push any agenda D1. I was going to point this out too: In fact as of N1 Wiggles was one of his "strongest town reads". By early D2, Wiggles was the scummiest person in the thread to WoS. The conversion does not look convincing to me. Look into this as well as my post above and tell me what you think.
Good spot, its an astonishing 180 degree turnaround. Moreover, in the posts you quoted earlier, he acts in a very arrogant manner as if to suggest the town is playing poorly; now he wants us to believe that he has been playing a poor townie all along. I can't buy the emotional appeals he's making.
I think that you are making a little too much of the cosmicomics connection at the moment though. That can be looked into if WoS does indeed flip red.
Mind you, if WoS is scum, then my suspicions against TPS are probably completely wrong.
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Sweet. DP, are you down with a WoS lynch? I know you said you think he's town before, but you didn't say why. I'm feeling pretty good about it. I think I will try to consolidate all of my evidence against him into one post because that will probably prove more effective for the purpose of convincing the rest of the thread.
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Up to you Sci, but I think its conclusive and no need is required + he is leading vote , and most of the us guys prob asleep (which is why they havnt responded)
im more saying, if you want to get some sleep: i dont think a consolidated post is needed. WoS is going down.
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Anyways.. this was what I was working on before Geript shocked my world  *hes town for bringing that forward - yes im looking at you BH.*
This is an alignment null contribution.. but those logs were such a bitch to read i had to format them so we could actually read them properly.
+ Show Spoiler [with GK] + 1
Blazinghand 03-17-2013 08:52 PM ET (US)
Mason QT between GoodKarma and Wade Fell for D1 of The Game. 2
Blazinghand 03-17-2013 09:07 PM ET (US)
Okay so the hosts are dragging their feet with setting up the Mason QT so I'll drop some stuff in here since I have to step out for a moment. My power works on a per-phase basis and I was hoping to mason you for D2 but the chance you can be lynched is too high, so instead I'm masoning you for D1 so I can work with you while you're still alive.
In any case, I currently have two strong scumreads I want to push, besides my tiff with Testsubject and with TPS (which I need to step back from due to emotional issues, at least for today). I suggest we pool our thoughts and reads since you are a pretty good scumhunter when you have someone to bounce ideas off of.
Mainly I am concerned with Mr. Wiggles. He is an aggressive scumhunter and a capable asset as town, but his scum play isn't as good, and I'm pretty sure this is scum Wiggles. He didn't seriously follow-up on his attack on you, and only when prodded has he posted in the thread. When he DOES post, he composes his posts quite well-- they look and smell like cases-- but he doesn't back them up and press them the way a town player who really wanted to lynch his target would. For example, he calls up Coag's meta to defend coag, then utterly ignores meta to attack you. I jumped through all kinds of hoops to deflect it and even now he's trying to get a mislynch off on you, despite admitting you're playing to your town meta.
The other player that bothers me is Geript, but I think I might be emotionally against him and seeing things I shouldn't-- I'd like you to check my logic here. Geript has been actively opposing attempts of town to organize and scumhunt, but not in a way that relays concerns for town complacency or other dangers of VE's gambit. furthermore, he is focusing his attacks on the most productive and useful townies rather than try to develop cases or even push his main targets. Whenever there's pushback, he changes who he's attacking.
Normally I'd be on him like white on rice, but I mislynched him last game and am worried I am misreading him now.
I'm going to be rolling out an attack on Wiggles shortly. Do you have any thoughts? 3
goodkarma 03-17-2013 09:25 PM ET (US)
Coaching session #2?
My first thought is I'd hesitate to bring up another lynch candidate right now. There's only like a billion out there, and we need to be striving toward consolidating our votes on (hopefully) two candidates. We're late in the cycle, so as long as you have a decent scum read on one of the candidates (Greymist, Zeriph, or Darthpunk), I would recommend you push your vote on one of them instead.
But as far as Mr. Wiggles is concerned, I don't have the meta read benefit that you do. I can look into him more in a bit, but my impression at this point is similar to your assessment insofar as I haven't seen him be very invested in this game. If he is a strong town player, then I would agree there's a decent chance he's scum.
I'll also look at Geript in a little bit. 4
Blazinghand 03-17-2013 09:32 PM ET (US)
Given the difficulty in getting this town to consolidate, I'm going to be pushing on GreyMist, since he's playing so far from his normal, useful meta (and has been also unwilling to follow up on his reads). I still am not convinced by the cases on Zarepath. I think he's a flailing townie who doesn't really know how to contribute-- the recklessness in his early posts tell me this.
Regarding Wiggles, if he's town there's also a good chance he'll be shot tonight, so it could be more prudent to begin to pressure him tonight, then try to lynch him tomorrow if he's still not performing to his town standard. In any case, this QT and our ability to communicate will last until the end of today. I'm thinking of masoning with VE tonight, even though I don't have the strongest townread on him. Reason 1) if VE is town he's almost certainly the #1 mafia shot for tonight and this will be my only chance to talk to him in a QT Reason 2) if i get shot tonight ahead of a couple of the other head scumhunters, that (possibly) means that VE is scum and shot me to stop me from using my power more.
So yeah I'll get my thoughts together for a defense of zarepath and an attack on greymist. 5
Blazinghand 03-17-2013 09:44 PM ET (US)
Okay, I think I slammed GM pretty hard with that case. I am not 100% on Zarepath being town but defending him a bit should help get GM lynched. I'm gonna grab some dinner then come back and see if I can change some minds. 6
goodkarma 03-17-2013 10:16 PM ET (US)
Yeah there's a chance Zerepath is a noobie townie. Though I don't like how he likes to bring up his newness to the format...
I think that's a good approach to take with Mr. Wiggles. Looking at a town game, his play seems at least somewhat similar, so I would be inclined to give him time to prove if he's town or not.
Geript could be scum. But with players that play as poorly as he does I tend to like to take in the big picture before coming to conclusions. After a few flips, it should be much clearer for me.
As far as who you bring in, it's definitely up to you. But if it were me I'd focus on bringing in my strongest townreads. If you bring in a scum you'd become a high priority kill target. Just my two cents. 7
Blazinghand 03-17-2013 10:45 PM ET (US)
On the other hand, I only have a couple strong townreads. I think I'll have to take a risk if I want to get rewards from this power. I get the feeling I'll be shot during the first few nights anyways, as always happens to me-- so I might as well try to make the most of my power. I still have some time to think it over.
GreYMisT's martyring isn't particularly helpful. It kind of makes me think he's town, but I know I shouldn't think he's town just because he's martyring. I personally like the guy a great deal which is part of why. If he's scum though it's a clever low-cost way to sow doubt. 8
goodkarma 03-17-2013 11:11 PM ET (US)
Martyring also happens to be against the rules...
That aside, I don't see how martyring makes Greymist town. He hasn't tried at all to defend himself. Maybe if he was tired of defending endless accusations or something I could see a townie Greymist doing it, but he can't be bothered to lift a finger in his defense... It seems more like a scumtell to me for that reason. 9
Blazinghand 03-17-2013 11:25 PM ET (US)
Yeah, that's a good point. I know intellectually that martyring is not a towntell obviously-- and the fact that he's not even writing cases in his final hours is the final nail in the coffin tbh. If I were town at least I'd try to get in a last word right 10 goodkarma 03-18-2013 01:48 AM ET (US)Since our QT time is almost up, let me take this opportunity to say it was a pleasure to share a QT with you again I wish I could have been more helpful with reads but tbh with the upcoming flips imho it's most prudent to look at everyone's filters again with a fresh mind. I'm going to be especially mindful of those who ignored/disregarded Greymist as a lynch candidate this cycle (I'm assuming he's going to flip scum). People like Hopeless and VE come to mind in that regard. The lack of resistance from Grey could also be from a pre-planned bus from scum. Something also I'm going to need to think about. It's a theory that at least would partially explain why Grey would ACTIVELY be in thread while not defending himself... Anyway, best of luck with your next guy. It's been fun
Blazinghand 03-18-2013 01:51 AM ET (US)
You too GK. I suspect there's some possibility you'll be up as a lynch candidate for D2 but realistically speaking most people have figured out you're town by now. Once I see this flip and the flips from night kills I'll probably be going for Mr. wiggles (unless something weird happens) or geript.
Keep on scumhunting.
+ Show Spoiler [with VE] +1
Oatsmaster 03-18-2013 07:06 AM ET (US)
hey 2
VisceraEyes 03-18-2013 12:33 PM ET (US)
Well shit sir. Another Nightmare? Perhaps one that's not quite so town-aligned? You talkin about shooting me at the end of this conversation? You talkin about ending my life BH? 3
VisceraEyes 03-18-2013 12:36 PM ET (US)
I'm confident DP is scum - the way he reacted to my case (strict OMGUS) is a town tell with newer players but not with DP I think. That guy is smart and I think his reaction to my case was an act.
Look at the way he defended it. He never explained proper town motivations or tried to make me understand his point, he immediately was all "Did you hear what VE said?! He said townies never pressure people!" 4
VisceraEyes 03-18-2013 12:40 PM ET (US)
But I have nothing concrete on him. Only my case and my feels. :/
You've been very very absent from the thread, because this happened at night I have to assume that you didn't mason anyone during the day. What's going on in the would of Blzinghand? 5
Blazinghand 03-18-2013 12:46 PM ET (US)
It's almost certain that one of us will be shot tonight, so this is likely our only chance to talk. I'm a masoner who can mason a new person every phase, and I cannot remason someone I've already masoned. During D1 I masoned with GK, which is part of why I became very sure he was town. I'm reasonably confident you're town, but if you're scum well you were probably gonna shoot me tonight anyways.
In any case, I currently have two strong scumreads I want to push. I'll admit I never super looked into DP since I was more focused on other candidates for D1, so I'll add him to my "stuff to post just before daybreak" list, but right now I'm more worried about Geript and TPS. I've talked a lot about TPS in thread already but mainly I'm concerned about his attempts to _look_ like he's contributing without actually doing it. I'm like 90% sure his "anger" at my spamming is faked given that you had the same filter length as me at the time and his response to it was to just quote a bunch of my posts. He's done a pretty slick job of not contributing to the game and looking like an "emotional townie"
Geript might be just me being mad, but it really just looks like he's attacking anything constructive that tries to happen. I still don't like his RNG discussion at the start of the day, but even ignoring that, he never made a really good case for why zare was scum other than "he worded things differently this game", and he switched to GM when the heat was on. What really makes me think he's scum though is his weird attack on me at the start of this night. Now MAYBE Geript is just butthurt because people didn't reread his filter in LX but I think he's legitimately trying to disrupt town from being useful. 6
Blazinghand 03-18-2013 12:48 PM ET (US)
Also FWIW I've been skiing this weekend which is why I've been only really posting between 6 pm and midnight every day. Don't expect me to be mentioning IRL excuses in thread though, I have way more balls than that. 7
VisceraEyes 03-18-2013 12:52 PM ET (US)
I don't wanna run with that geript read. I want to engage him on his actual suspects, without fear of him losing his shit and looking even scummier if he's town. Like...if he's town, we gotta handle with care because you and I both are gonna probably think he's scum. I want to engage him personally on his reads, and we'll see what we see then.
TPS I can run with. I didn't like that post quoting your posts at all, and it didn't make any sense singling you out.
So you can pick a new target every cycle? Every cycle? Why didn't you pick me during the longer cycle? Why did you pick GK for the first cycle? 8
Blazinghand 03-18-2013 12:58 PM ET (US)
The problem with town Geript is he'll act like Geript in LX under pressure and become useless and probably mislynched. It's frustrating that that's the man's meta, but that's what it is. I don't want to let that dissuade me from pushing him though or else he's some horrible unlynchable scum player who is worthless as town. I'll finish up a case on TPS a bit later today to share. Ideally I'll chuck it up just before daybreak.
I picked GK about halfway through the first day because I had a townread on him. If I mason a scum player, the chance of me getting shot goes up a lot, and I know GK pretty well-- he was, and is, almost certainly town. I'm masoning with you tonight because if scum is smart at least one of us won't be around tomorrow. 9 VisceraEyes 03-18-2013 01:00 PM ET (US)AND you can't remason. I'm offended. Officially.  10
Blazinghand 03-18-2013 01:00 PM ET (US)
Like, you get why the "Geript might lose his shit" argument isn't reasonable right. The guy can't just hold our analysis hostage to a threat of flipping out 11
VisceraEyes 03-18-2013 01:01 PM ET (US)
Stop that line of thinking. I'm not saying don't pressure him. I'm saying don't out and out call him a scum read or he'll be all "WELP THATS FUCKING GAME CAUSE VETS THINK I'M SCUM" 12
VisceraEyes 03-18-2013 01:02 PM ET (US)
I'm saying give me a bit first. Let me talk to the guy. THEN we'll talk about geript scum, and if necessary, bring it to the thread in full force. 13
Blazinghand 03-18-2013 01:03 PM ET (US)
Also as a secondary scumread: Vivax. This whole "yeah I'm gonna be shot for my good play, please protect me medic" thing really rubs me the wrong way. Not even countering the scumslip (which anyone could make), he hasn't been pushing a real town-motivated objective for most of D1. This is admittedly a softer read than I'd like but something intuitively is telling me that Vivax is scum, and I do well when I listen to that voice in my head. 14
Blazinghand 03-18-2013 01:04 PM ET (US)
Okay I'll lay off Geript for now, that's reasonable enough. We can goodcop-badcop this shit 15
VisceraEyes 03-18-2013 01:05 PM ET (US)
Yeah Vivax seems to be playing more sane this game than usual too...that's not a scumtell for him though is it?
e: like the rules have manner laws and anti-spam laws in place. Could he not just be trying to abide?
Edited 03-18-2013 01:09 PM 17 VisceraEyes 03-18-2013 01:11 PM ET (US) Also I feel like this post is dissonant. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=18078961He states that he thinks "scum would have no need to switch off to a mislynch" and then concludes that two people who switched from DP to GM are scum. At least, that's what it looks like to me. I just skimmed it because I'm trying to work fast before I go to work. XD Edited 03-18-2013 01:12 PM 18
VisceraEyes 03-18-2013 01:40 PM ET (US)
Hrm @ Mocsta immediately jokingly buddying me. 19
Blazinghand 03-18-2013 01:51 PM ET (US)
You already pointed out that post in-thread. Vivax either is scum or has no idea who his scumreads really are, since he claims scum are pushing a wagon but is marking people not on said wagon as scum. That's definitely a scumtell because a town player would probably remember who his own scumreads are, whereas a scum player would have trouble keeping his lies straight. It's the same thing that happens in his post-vote analysis. Basically, Vivax doesn't have consistent scumreads, and his analysis isn't pointing at the people who he says is scum. It's like he has a set of reads he feels some need to push, then writes analysis that isn't really related, rather than having a thought process that connects scumhunting to scumreads.
Basically a town player wouldn't make this mistake because he'd be aware of who his scumreads actually are. 20
VisceraEyes 03-18-2013 01:54 PM ET (US)
I did point it out in thread, but to my knowledge you never commented. 21
Blazinghand 03-18-2013 01:56 PM ET (US)
Fair enough. Whatever case is made against Vivax though should hinge on his town/scum mentality and not on the "Scumslip" about Yamato77 imo. Scumslips generally aren't actually real. 22
VisceraEyes 03-18-2013 01:57 PM ET (US)
No, they're very real. Very. But that Vivax thing is not a scumslip. 23
VisceraEyes 03-18-2013 05:28 PM ET (US)
I'm going to assume that you're not a Nightmare...because your communication only lasts a phase. Why has GK not claimed you masoning with him was that at your request? 24
Blazinghand 03-18-2013 05:34 PM ET (US)
Yeah I didn't want it to be confirmed I was a blue. If you want you can ask him to confirm it and I'm sure he will but ideally we don't let scum know this 25
VisceraEyes 03-18-2013 05:52 PM ET (US)
You're here and not commenting on the case I'm making against Ryu in the thread. Care to comment here if you're trying to let it develop organically in the thread or something? Ryu is essentially claiming scum in the thread from my perspective. 26
Blazinghand 03-18-2013 06:02 PM ET (US)
I'm playing dota
ryu looks like shit, we lynch him tmr imo. his claim that he wasn't "afk" or whatever during the development of the greymist case is crap. weird contradictions
also evidence for DP being scum but wont' comment on assoc between unflipped, will wait to see ryu flip
will write more once i'm done doating 27
VisceraEyes 03-18-2013 06:04 PM ET (US)
I wish I could DOTA. *dustkick* 28
Blazinghand 03-18-2013 06:04 PM ET (US)
alt theory: ryu geript zarepath scumteam, but I think DP was under more pressure than zare so this theory less plausib. ryu wanted to setup a GM lynch then hang back and see if it got steam without comitting, which is why his case is weak and explains thread absence after inital bad setup 29
VisceraEyes 03-18-2013 06:06 PM ET (US)
Suppose Zare picked up steam? I neglected to comment on Zare what if I had commented and the wagon swung? 30
Blazinghand 03-18-2013 06:07 PM ET (US)
regardless the common factor here is Ryu = scum in either theory, so we lynch him first 31
VisceraEyes 03-18-2013 06:26 PM ET (US)
WTF? I don't even care about association theories. LOL 32
Blazinghand 03-18-2013 06:30 PM ET (US)
I don't understand the Zare question then. Overall the ryu thing seems pretty straightforwards: he shifted stance on sandro, he let the wagon push itself, and has given contradictory reads and not backed anything up. How does Zare or you commenting on wagon swings have to do with that? 33
VisceraEyes 03-18-2013 06:34 PM ET (US)
I was spitballing with you but you stated it as reasoning for wanting to lynch Ryu. For my part I just don't care what that says about anyone else yet. XD
So I'm not crazy then? That's logical and I'm not losing my shit here? 34
Blazinghand 03-18-2013 06:51 PM ET (US)
You're entirely non-crazy. I'll slap down a patented (link)-filled blazinghand style case on Ryu before the end of the night and see how he reacts to it. 35
VisceraEyes 03-18-2013 06:59 PM ET (US)
To be frank you're entirely non-existant this game as compared to LX. I'm not really concerned about geript suspecting you because honestly before this conversation I was suspicious of you too. Being in a QT with someone pretty much excuses that though.
Can you go into detail about your read on TPS? 36
Blazinghand 03-19-2013 12:21 AM ET (US)
Fair enough. I'll be responding in thread. You wouldn't try to pull this as scum, so at least there's that. I don't think outing me as a Mason is the right move. DrH and Oats have both repeatedly privately threatened me with modkill due to spamming, which is why I have decreased my post count.
The thoughts in here if I get shot tonight will corroborate your story that I did in fact mason you. 37
VisceraEyes 03-19-2013 12:40 AM ET (US)
It's the right move. If you're town you'll be able to prove it. I just don't think so based on the contents of this QT. And because you're "actively decreasing your post count" that's all I have to go on. Sorry dude. 38
Blazinghand 03-19-2013 12:44 AM ET (US)
TBH it's probably what I'd do if the situations are reversed. I'll never admit to setup speculation in public, but given a flipped mason, there's higher-than-average chance of other masons being scum. But at least, if I should die tonight for some reason, don't let geript walk free. That miserable cunt is laughing at me, VE. Laughing.
VisceraEyes 03-19-2013 12:55 AM ET (US)
You will be avenged.
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On March 20 2013 17:00 sciberbia wrote:
Sweet. DP, are you down with a WoS lynch? I know you said you think he's town before, but you didn't say why. I'm feeling pretty good about it. I think I will try to consolidate all of my evidence against him into one post because that will probably prove more effective for the purpose of convincing the rest of the thread.
Yeah. I reckon I could lynch him. The main thing though is that he was very co-operative under pressure when I spoke with him rationally and then he did a reasonably good job of assessing the Kita case objectively. I don't know. How do you guys feel about his large analysis of kita's post?
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On March 20 2013 17:36 DarthPunk wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2013 17:00 sciberbia wrote:
Sweet. DP, are you down with a WoS lynch? I know you said you think he's town before, but you didn't say why. I'm feeling pretty good about it. I think I will try to consolidate all of my evidence against him into one post because that will probably prove more effective for the purpose of convincing the rest of the thread. Yeah. I reckon I could lynch him. The main thing though is that he was very co-operative under pressure when I spoke with him rationally and then he did a reasonably good job of assessing the Kita case objectively. I don't know. How do you guys feel about his large analysis of kita's post?
I can go into more detail of what I felt was missing if you want
On March 20 2013 16:55 Mocsta wrote:
Anywho.. im voting WoS now
relooking at the "defense"
I cant believe he attributed 3/4 lines to defending the case.. and an equal amount of lines on subsequent posts.
i.e. the amount he wrote, should have just been for the kita case
Even the points 2-5 based on subsequent posts.. some of the defense is just not fleshed out.
##Vote: WoS
They key point for me, was id ont think he actually addressed the main case. instead he chose to focus on the subsequent posts with kita, and even then.. some of it wasnt detailed enough
(e.g. "its relevant")
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WoS is quite likely scum and should be today's lynch
@Mocsta
Thanks a lot for that last post. I was going to request that somebody do that.
I will just say everything that hasn't already been said in this post. To anyone reading this, please filter me for a few other reasons I think WoS is scum. I encourage everyone to thoroughly read at the very least, kita's case, and the last couple pages of discussion about WoS.
His 180 on Wiggles in not convincing
+ Show Spoiler ++ Show Spoiler +On March 19 2013 11:00 WaveofShadow wrote:Show nested quote +On March 19 2013 10:44 zarepath wrote:
So after looking through Wiggle's filter, he starts off not liking GreyMist or goodkarma, both of which were already under suspicion by other players. After that, everything else he says is defending a player -- he defends Coag's meta, he suggests that people's arguments against TPS aren't good enough (while also stating that he doesn't know how he feels about the guy himself -- wait and see), when asked specifically to talk about Coag he makes a super long post that ends up with a tl;dr of "wait and see", says he's going to take some time to digest goodkarma's defense, defends Vivax against the suggestion of a scumslip, says that VE's case on DP isn't that strong, then criticizes a DYH lynch.
His final vote/read that he actually sticks to is one he only makes after sciberbia specifically asks him what he thinks about GM and GK, and he ends up picking GM, and his first reason why is "as I stated earlier in the thread;" ie, I was totally thinking he was scum the whole time even while I was voting for GK, the guy I no longer thing is scum. BTW, he really likes Ryu's case on him, and uses that in his argument.
Then you have the post that Trance brought up. It looks a lot like he spent most of D1 criticizing arguments and not actually going after scum, and when he finally had to pick, he was apologetic for it and seems to be prepping himself for a town flip.
I read him as scum until he provides some cases or reads, because so far he has only suspected two people, one of which he unvoted and the other one he was almost apologetic about voting for. Strike 100 zare. Mr. Wiggles is probably one of my strongest townreads at the moment. His analysis is actually quite strong and he is not afraid to go against popular opinion (he shut down VE's read on DP just as it was gaining traction amongst the town), risking being seen as soft defending a scumbuddy. He stuck with his reads on GK and GM throughout the day, if you read his posts, with his opinions changing slightly as more information cropped up. This post of yours on the other hand is just a summary of Mr. Wriggle's filter with a weak case against him at the end; which you assume to be scummy when in fact he read correctly into GreYMist's lack of caring. He did call him scummy in the end but I would argue is unapologetic about it; much like my tunneling of geript last game he points out the GM put us in a bad position essentially looking really scummy during the day and his lack of attendance and giving up with regards to his lynch forced the town's hand. Looking mroe into your recent posts: Show nested quote +On March 19 2013 10:08 zarepath wrote:On March 19 2013 09:06 Vivax wrote:On March 19 2013 09:01 zarepath wrote:
Vivax I stop reading your posts as soon as you make reads on others based on the fact that I am scum.
Like, you are wasting tons and tons of time and energy based off of my poor play. Please do yourself and everyone else a favor and make cases on people without me being scum as the prime argument.
Back to work now. What should I do, you guys defended each other so obviously it becomes evident to those who start by looking at your voting. FYI though, my case on you, GK and cosmicomics isn't centered on the connection to you, that is just what links you together in the bigger picture and actually gave away TPS and glurio to me. Why do you refer to your play as poor though? Because I'm town and too many people think that I'm not. I didn't have much time to play over the weekend and wasted it by saying noncommittal things and then bouncing, making it look worse. This is what makes me really think you're scum. In NMM 37 this was not your style of play at all even when you weren't around. You would pop in from time to time and take strong stances and PUSH your reads rather than sit back (aside from the fake case on me at the start). You've played in enough games to know better than this; hell it would have been better for you to lurk than to do what you're doing, you'd draw less attention to yourself. So during N1, WoS made the above post where he said Wiggles was probably one of his strongest town reads. Not only this, but he gave some explicit reasoning such as "strong analysis", "stuck with reads", and "not afraid". Then at 09:45 TL time on D2, WoS votes Wiggles. This is less than 24 hours from when Wiggles was one of his strongest town reads. Wiggles made five reasonably sized posts in between. WoS's justification for voting Wiggles was that 'he just didn't seem to give a shit'. Also keep in mind that the Wiggles wagon looked like it might roll into a lynch at this point. Now ask yourself if this really seems like a townie. He went from "probably one of strongest townreads" to "im hopping on the wiggles weapon" over the course of 22 hours during which Wiggles made 5 reasonable posts. And the justification was that "Wiggles didn't seem to give a shit". I don't buy it.
WoS piles suspicion on zarepath for D2 but doesn't push the lynch
+ Show Spoiler +See these posts from WoS during N1 and D2 concerning zarepath: + Show Spoiler +On March 18 2013 23:35 WaveofShadow wrote:Show nested quote +On March 18 2013 23:26 zarepath wrote:On March 16 2013 16:22 ThePeashooter wrote:
I have no idea how the quoting got messed up, but Devil and Nightmare should both be red. I imagine Devil would be some type of Godfather-ish role. I am re-reading through the thread right now, but this makes me think that TPS is town. What? Why? Zare you REALLY have to start giving more than that to alleviate suspicion. I don't see how mis-speculating on roles is anything but null. On March 19 2013 11:00 WaveofShadow wrote:Show nested quote +On March 19 2013 10:44 zarepath wrote:
So after looking through Wiggle's filter, he starts off not liking GreyMist or goodkarma, both of which were already under suspicion by other players. After that, everything else he says is defending a player -- he defends Coag's meta, he suggests that people's arguments against TPS aren't good enough (while also stating that he doesn't know how he feels about the guy himself -- wait and see), when asked specifically to talk about Coag he makes a super long post that ends up with a tl;dr of "wait and see", says he's going to take some time to digest goodkarma's defense, defends Vivax against the suggestion of a scumslip, says that VE's case on DP isn't that strong, then criticizes a DYH lynch.
His final vote/read that he actually sticks to is one he only makes after sciberbia specifically asks him what he thinks about GM and GK, and he ends up picking GM, and his first reason why is "as I stated earlier in the thread;" ie, I was totally thinking he was scum the whole time even while I was voting for GK, the guy I no longer thing is scum. BTW, he really likes Ryu's case on him, and uses that in his argument.
Then you have the post that Trance brought up. It looks a lot like he spent most of D1 criticizing arguments and not actually going after scum, and when he finally had to pick, he was apologetic for it and seems to be prepping himself for a town flip.
I read him as scum until he provides some cases or reads, because so far he has only suspected two people, one of which he unvoted and the other one he was almost apologetic about voting for. Strike 100 zare.Mr. Wiggles is probably one of my strongest townreads at the moment. ... This is what makes me really think you're scum. In NMM 37 this was not your style of play at all even when you weren't around. You would pop in from time to time and take strong stances and PUSH your reads rather than sit back (aside from the fake case on me at the start). You've played in enough games to know better than this; hell it would have been better for you to lurk than to do what you're doing, you'd draw less attention to yourself. On March 19 2013 11:09 WaveofShadow wrote:Show nested quote +On March 19 2013 11:00 goodkarma wrote:On March 19 2013 10:13 zarepath wrote:On March 19 2013 09:28 goodkarma wrote:
Okay I'm back in thread now. I'm slowly going through other people's filters. But the first one I'd like to bring up is Zarepath, since it seems Vivax is eager to see what I have to say about him.
First off, before anything else, I would like to say (and I believe others have said it too) to Vivax that an association based case on multiple unflipped players is flat-out bad. Putting that aside though, Zarepath is a player I put in the category of newer, less experienced player. When such a player is town he tends to be easier to mislynch, as he has not adopted his own solid playstyle yet. Looking into Zarepath's filter, he's been quite lazy about sharing his reads. His excuses have been "I'm new to this format," and "I'll be far more active during the week." Well, he should have at least gotten orientated to the format by now, and it is now a weekday. As such, I expect to see an explosion of activity from him. I believe the concerns about him are valid, and that he indeed is acting very scummy. It's also worth noting he does seem to be much more involved in his past town games, and as such I'd say I'm leaning scum on him. Certainly, he needs to be sharing his reads much better than he is right now so we can get better insight into his thought process. What did you think of my case on Hopeless1der? Nobody has responded to it yet. In other news, I like Trance's point on Wiggles -- his post could be scum prepping for a Greymist town flip. Will be looking into that more. One reason for that might be that you spoilered the entire thing... Looking at it, as best I can tell you point out that Hopeless hasn't really provided much substantive content, and that his complete flip on his stance on Darth is odd. I could see some potential scum motivation for these actions, but honestly your case is pretty thin. You can't just go through a guy's post history and say "this and that are odd..." What we're interested in is scum motivation. As in: Why is it that this particular post is more likely for scum Hopeless to make than town Hopeless? As it stands your recent case posts sometimes read like summaries of the guy's actions. Which is just fluff that makes it ten times harder to read, and doesn't add any value... The Hopeless case was not that substantial imo, which is part of the reason people probably didn't say much about it. With a rather sparse filter and a replacement coming in, we'll have a better read on him after Ace subs in. You read his most recent cases, then read this: Show nested quote +On February 14 2013 12:20 zarepath wrote:
I don't know, so many holes here. Conveniently not believing in bread crumbs, not claiming in the hour that he himself said that the vigilante should have claimed, only killing WaveofShadow so that he could get INFORMATION on Corazon, wanting to stay "null" so scum don't have a target for tomorrow night... I mean, giving town a confirmed townie on Day 2 is HUGE, and getting picked of N2 isn't so awful because that means any active blue roles we may have get a full nother night of actions in.
Really dubious claim.
##Vote ObviousOne The rest of his filter that game is constant questioning of other with regards to his reads, and some list posts yes, but without fluff; he actually takes a stand in many of these. + Show Spoiler +On February 14 2013 04:10 zarepath wrote:Zarepath's Readsby Zarepath9-Bit + Show Spoiler +
Nothing to see. Looking forward to a modkill or replacement.
Sevryn + Show Spoiler +
I had a null read on him at the lynch -- he jumped on my fake case, added a little to it, tunneled glurio. But post-flip, he went very proactively defensive for it, saying that everybody was too focused on glurio/himself as the dichotomy. But HE was focused on glurio. Now that glurio's flipped, I want to see what his reads are on EVERYONE. If he was so certain about glurio, who does he think is scum now?
Slight scum read on Sevryn.
WaveofShadow + Show Spoiler +
I see him as being mostly proactive with a variety of reads. I don't understand what his big controversial post quoting Mocsta and Sn0_Man was about, other than the fact they wanted to go after lurkers and their plan failed. I read him as genuinely trying to help town.
Sn0_Man + Show Spoiler +
His filter's filled with a lot of theory, policy, and meta talk. He interacts directly with a lot of other posters, and is very active. But towards the end of Day 1, he was practically begging other people to make cases he could bandwagon onto, finally settling on Sevryn. He is active enough that I don't consider him scummy, but trudging through his filter doesn't make me think he's absolutely pro-town. Leaning town, but not as sure as I used to be.
ObviousOne + Show Spoiler +
His assessment of Day 1 was pretty useful. I agree with Mocsta that we need to see his reads. Null, slightly to town based on his opening, but only slightly.
Warbaby + Show Spoiler +
Starts with general policy talk, his third post is a list, needlessly antagonistic to WoS, bunch of meta, insults everybody's mafia skills, tells people to mislynch him, prefers voting lurkers over scum, constantly asserts that he has no idea who the scum are, his final top 3 are sylencia, sevryn, then glurio. Is now focused on sevryn. I don't think he's as scummy as I've thought of him now that I've read thorugh the whole filter; I have a null read on him now, depending on how his case on Sevryn develops.
geript + Show Spoiler +
Geript was one of the only ones who really dug into my fake WoS case. He bought it, but only after he went through it and actually criticized a few of the points. He now has a case on Corazon that is at least original, and it's labeled Case 1, suggesting he has another case coming. I read him as leaning town.
Mocsta + Show Spoiler +
Super active first half of Day 1, went to "actively lurking" since after pouting about knowing when he's not wanted, and has done a lot of things that I see as pro-town -- encouraging two names so we can have clear bandwagons, picking apart bad logic, etc. I read him as town. The only other thing I'll note is that it's odd how little he's contributed (although he still has tons of filter). I think he's legit going for a different strat, but will keep an eye on him, obviously.
Corazon + Show Spoiler +
His Day 1 seemed pretty typical of his town meta, but he really pushed on his WB vote but didn't actively try to persuade anyone else; he just kept re-quoting his case, and then when the lynch was getting confusing, instead of asking for consolidation onto his TOP READ that he's had all day, instead he bandwagons onto Glurio. It's hard to judge any voting motivations from the Day 1 lynch, but this is suspicious to me. He gave a pretty town response to my WoS case, though. Null, leaning town.
Mandalor + Show Spoiler +
Mandalor's filter looks very scummy. Every other post is a list, the main thrust of his case on Sylencia has to do with blue talk, and the case for his final vote is not compelling at all. He just drops a random vote and checks out, doesn't even wish town luck. (To be fair, I did something similar because of time and RL constraints.) People's reactions to my vote on Mandalor were that they had town reads on him, but I'd like to ask you all what specifically makes him look town to you, because I don't see much. Reads SCUM
Sylencia + Show Spoiler +Pretty vocal opponent of RNG there at the beginning, then his activity fades from there. He speculates HARD on warbaby's possible blue roles, not necessarily a very pro-town thing to do in public on Day 1, and that is the biggest contribution he made at all. He said he hadn't read very many filters, admitted to tunneling warbaby, then voted for him. In the end, he posted this gem: On February 13 2013 09:54 Sylencia wrote:
.. What lol, I gave my reasons before and I'm voting for him to consolidate my thoughts on him. I will have to change my vote to glurio if required to stay alive though. Town don't change their votes in order to stay alive; town believe in their scum reads or are willing to work with other people's scum reads. THey certianly don't do so just to stay alive; lynching scum is more important than a town's individual life. This quote makes it sound as though his number one concern is not being lynched. It's worth going through all the filters, apparently, because this was the last post in the final filter, and I think it's the biggest, latest scum tell. In conclusion, people I think are suspicious and would like other's thoughts on: Sevryn Warbaby Mandalor Sylencia Obv and 9-Bit's replacement also deserve scrutiny. But right now my two biggest reads are Sylencia and Mandalor. I think people should look at my brief reads on them, read their filters, and I want to hear your own conclusions. On March 19 2013 15:52 WaveofShadow wrote:
Keir you make a good point, but then if anything that points to zarepath being scummy rather than someone you don't want to focus on D2.... On March 19 2013 16:15 WaveofShadow wrote:
After a quick read-through of his (TPS) filter I don't find anything nearly as damning as you seem to find about him, BH.
I'd certainly like to see some more solid reads from him during the day though, as there won't be any excusing a second day of the bare minimum of contribution.
I'm interested to hear his thoughts on zare and whether he's changed his mind since reading him as scummy earlier in the day (without committing...) On March 19 2013 16:25 WaveofShadow wrote:
Anyway it's late as all fuck right now and I have to go to bed. I fully plan on dedicating today to closing the book on zare one way or another as the town seems to be relatively polarized regarding whether they think he's town or scum. I expect some more posting from him so we'll be able to look into it. I also have to delve into some more filters and re-read a little because I feel like I have too many town-reads and not enough scum.
Night all. On March 20 2013 04:53 WaveofShadow wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2013 04:52 Vivax wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On March 20 2013 04:51 zarepath wrote:
VE, what is the name of your role? You never said, you just claimed Vet. What's the purpose of this question? Don't you believe the claim? Zare is scum rolecop imo On March 20 2013 04:59 WaveofShadow wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2013 04:55 zarepath wrote:
I believe it for now, but there's no reason to not ask for information that can only help town at this point. It's not as if mafia will learn from the name of his role what his power is, because he's already claimed.
I just found it odd he didn't say it when the other blue claim did, and can't think of how revealing it would hurt town. How exactly would it HELP town? This looks REAL scummy zare. On March 20 2013 04:53 WaveofShadow wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2013 04:52 Vivax wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On March 20 2013 04:51 zarepath wrote:
VE, what is the name of your role? You never said, you just claimed Vet. What's the purpose of this question? Don't you believe the claim? Zare is scum rolecop imo On March 20 2013 04:59 WaveofShadow wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2013 04:55 zarepath wrote:
I believe it for now, but there's no reason to not ask for information that can only help town at this point. It's not as if mafia will learn from the name of his role what his power is, because he's already claimed.
I just found it odd he didn't say it when the other blue claim did, and can't think of how revealing it would hurt town. How exactly would it HELP town? This looks REAL scummy zare. WoS is ALL OVER zarepath throughout this timespan. But he doesn't do anything about it. I would expect a townie to be like: "Listen up bitches. Zarepath is scum. Lynch him. ##Vote: Zarepath" But instead WoS is all like: "Zarepath you so scummy. LOL Zarepath acting scummy again. Can you gus believe this? soo.... someone's gonna start a wagon for me to jump on right?" Not only does he NOT start a wagon on zarepath, but he puts his vote on Wiggles as discussed above. This seems extremely inconsistent to me with his posts throughout N1. Also note, how he is often talking to zarepath about zarepath's scumminess, instead of addressing the rest of the thread. This is further evidence that he just wanted to make zarepath look scummy without actually being the one to push his lynch.
WoS uses fear-tactics to scare people off his wagon
+ Show Spoiler +
One last minor thing I want to mention because I feel like it almost worked.
By the time I finished studying his filter, I was a bit nervous myself to announce I was suspicious of him because the thread seemed to have turned into a witchhunt for people on the WoS wagon as if for some god-ordained reason being on the WoS wagon is scummy.
To be fair, I think that this was not solely due to WoS, but also people like Mocsta (not sure if maliciously). But I think it is worth mentioning anyway.
WoS admitted the kita case was good, but he attacked everyone that sheeped onto his wagon and talked about how there were probably several scum on his wagon.
I will be in the thread to push this lynch tomorrow if necessary. Would be happy to discuss anything. Could talk about even more stuff I find suspicious in WoS's filter if you guys really need persuading.
##Vote: WaveofShadow
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On March 20 2013 17:36 DarthPunk wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2013 17:00 sciberbia wrote:
Sweet. DP, are you down with a WoS lynch? I know you said you think he's town before, but you didn't say why. I'm feeling pretty good about it. I think I will try to consolidate all of my evidence against him into one post because that will probably prove more effective for the purpose of convincing the rest of the thread. Yeah. I reckon I could lynch him. The main thing though is that he was very co-operative under pressure when I spoke with him rationally and then he did a reasonably good job of assessing the Kita case objectively. I don't know. How do you guys feel about his large analysis of kita's post?
tbh I didn't pay it much attention. It looked like he just summarized/quoted what kita said and agreed with bits and pieces of it, and explained some things that were going through his mind when he made some of those posts, such as things he heard in past games.
It looked pretty alignment-null to me. I think scum is certainly capable of writing that post.
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It wasn`t malicious sciberbia.
But yes. I shared responsibility for the witch hunt.
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P.s. sci
I know this is association, but if/when WoS flips red. I'm considering the implications for coag
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EPT
