EPT[Champion] Irelia - Page 19
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Revive
United States10 Posts
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Sponkz
Denmark4564 Posts
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NotSorry
United States6722 Posts
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Slayer91
Ireland23335 Posts
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Revive
United States10 Posts
On January 23 2012 17:26 NotSorry wrote: So I bought Irelia the other night and have been watching wickd's stream for a few days now, and he seems to go against every guide I've seen posted, uses a 1/22/7 masteries and a few different rune pages but mostly "Irelia vs Bruiser" which is a 24MR at 18, 13Armor, 15AD page, haven't seen him make a wriggles once in probably 30 games that I've seen, almost always boot+pots into phage+wards on first back and scores a lvl3/4 kill more often than not, rarely farms his tower mostly stands mid lane and just harasses anyone who dares try to come last hit. Now the issue, I can barely even stay in lane and if I couldn't farm my tower for 90% of cs I would probably fall behind the other laner, but seems like I can never get out of this state, the game is either won or lost in other lanes while me and the other top just go at it never seems like either of us have a chance to join in team fights or anything cause the second one leaves the tower dies. Here is a video of Wickd explaining why/how he uses the build you're describing. Regarding your issue, if you feel isolated from the rest of the lanes, apply more pressure at top by pushing your waves to the enemy tower giving you small windows to roam mid without losing too much xp. Best way to do this is pop W to clear the first wave in lane, then use your ult to clear the next wave arriving at the enemy tower. That gives you 30 seconds to roam before the next waves reaches the middle of the lane. But honestly, unless you're at 1700-1800+ elo, I doubt you'll need to strategize counter builds like he's doing. You could just run the 31% attack speed and be a force in the lane until you start facing people smart enough to run Malphite/Nasus/Leesin counter picks. | ||
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Sponkz
Denmark4564 Posts
On January 23 2012 20:55 Revive wrote: Here is a video of Wickd explaining why/how he uses the build you're describing. So i saw the pantheon started meki pendant and i think the interviewer stated he had loads of armor runes. That's just plain bad i don't see how you will ever benefit from AS against someone like pantheon in the early levels. Sure later on it might get better, but by that time someone like pantheon will have denied you out of lane. | ||
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Slayer91
Ireland23335 Posts
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Revive
United States10 Posts
On January 23 2012 21:29 Sponkz wrote: So i saw the pantheon started meki pendant and i think the interviewer stated he had loads of armor runes. That's just plain bad i don't see how you will ever benefit from AS against someone like pantheon in the early levels. Sure later on it might get better, but by that time someone like pantheon will have denied you out of lane. If that pantheon had +25 armor pen/+19 armor runes and ran 21/2/7 then at level 1 his spearshot does roughly 56 damage to you if you have 55 armor. With attack speed runes you have .899 AS and can potentially heal for 36 hp in 4 seconds (spearshot CD) just off continuously attacking creeps. Without those runes you'd have .665 AS and would heal for 26 hp in 4 seconds. Now if you use one of your five health pots, that's another 10 hp/s regained. I just don't see how Irelia would get denied out of lane. Now an extra 2.3 hp/s at level 1 might not seem like a lot, but attack speed is the only thing that scales with your W. At level 9 you heal for an extra 6.1 hp/s (1.069 AS * 26 hp/hit = 27.81 hp/s vs 0.835 AS * 26 hp/hit = 21.71 hp/s) which is the equivalent of a _free_ 30 health regen/5. As for dealing with pantheon's shield with attack speed runes, Wickd's build is all about bursting pantheon down when his shield is down. But from a logical point of view, building attack speed rather than attack damage negates his shield more. For example, Irelia build "A" has 2.00 AS, 100 AD while Irelia build "B" has 1.00 AS, 200 AD. Assuming his shield is up every 4 seconds, during a 4 second period "A" does 700 damage while "B" does 600. Obviously Wickd's AD runes worked for him, but that doesn't mean it's the only way to approach a pantheon. | ||
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Hyren
United States817 Posts
On January 23 2012 21:29 Sponkz wrote: So i saw the pantheon started meki pendant and i think the interviewer stated he had loads of armor runes. That's just plain bad i don't see how you will ever benefit from AS against someone like pantheon in the early levels. Sure later on it might get better, but by that time someone like pantheon will have denied you out of lane. Yeah the Panth in that video has to have Smash and Loci turning in their graves :/ I couldn't believe how many Chalice+Atmogs Pantheons I saw during free week lol. | ||
Chill
Calgary25986 Posts
I'm pretty bad and only level 25 but Irelia is my favourite champ. I was 100% following the top-rated guide on mobafire, which was magic penetration reds. Regrowth Pendant, Healt Potion, Philosopher's Stone, Merc Treads, Sheen -> Trinity Force, bla bla bla. Skills were Q W E and then max W. I was useless until late game with this build, almost always lost my lane if the opponent had half a brain. Since then I changed to AD runes. Cloth Armor, 5 Health Potions, Wriggles, Merc Treads (or Ninja Tabi), Recurve Bow -> Wit's End, Phage -> Trinity Force, bla bla bla. Skills I like to do Q W E max W vs ranged. I find it's way too hard to last hit without Q vs ranged as you each so much damage every time you move in. VS melee I like E W W Q then max W or W E W Q. If you get pushed to your tower at level 3 you can W E Q and it's no big deal. You can do a lot of annoying damage if you E W and then smack them a few times when they come to last hit. Once you get up to Recurve Bow your W is super annoying. Anyways, just writing my experience because I was terrible for like 50 games and finally with these changes I feel like I'm not an auto-loss on my lane. I watched that Wick3d video guide and don't really agree with it. I know he's way way better than me but some of the justification he gave and some of the things he did (like hiding in the brush missing last hits and going back endlessly) didn't make sense to me. | ||
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Chiharu Harukaze
12112 Posts
On January 24 2012 03:06 Chill wrote: Just my personal experience: I'm pretty bad and only level 25 but Irelia is my favourite champ. I was 100% following the top-rated guide on mobafire, which was magic penetration reds. Regrowth Pendant, Healt Potion, Philosopher's Stone, Merc Treads, Sheen -> Trinity Force, bla bla bla. Skills were Q W E and then max W. I was useless until late game with this build, almost always lost my lane if the opponent had half a brain. Since then I changed to AD runes. Cloth Armor, 5 Health Potions, Wriggles, Merc Treads (or Ninja Tabi), Recurve Bow -> Wit's End, Phage -> Trinity Force, bla bla bla. Skills I like to do Q W E max W vs ranged. I find it's way too hard to last hit without Q vs ranged as you each so much damage every time you move in. VS melee I like E W W Q then max W. You can do a lot of annoying damage if you E W and then smack them a few times when they come to last hit. Once you get up to Recurve Bow your W is super annoying. Anyways, just writing my experience because I was terrible for like 50 games and finally with these changes I feel like I'm not an auto-loss on my lane. I watched that Wick3d video guide and don't really agree with it. I know he's way way better than me but some of the justification he gave and some of the things he did (like hiding in the brush missing last hits and going back endlessly) didn't make sense to me. Mobafire... well... it's not the best place to get guides because there's a lot of low level hive mind there and you can have an "updated" guide without changing anything in it. That build was fine like 10 patches ago but play style top lane has changed since. Probably also copied of Chaox's guide on SoloMid, lol. Wick3d plays a very different style of Irelia. He's been doing funky things for ages. It's probably influenced by arranged play. For example he goes back a lot to keep using up his banked gold and to give him an item advantage in lane. Wickd's playstyle is also one of the reasons g/10 fell out of favour on Irelia because Wickd just went "Well, if you're investing in g/10 I'll invest in items and just kill you straight up." Also where Chalice-Phage-Atma was first run iirc. The dodging into brush also means that the enemy can't be sure if he's purposefully doing it or actually backed and gone somewhere else which helps if he wants to put pressure. It also means it's harder to be right-click harassed, especially against say Nidalee. It's probably not a great way to play solo-queue though but each to their own. | ||
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Slayer91
Ireland23335 Posts
On January 24 2012 03:06 Chill wrote: Just my personal experience: I'm pretty bad and only level 25 but Irelia is my favourite champ. I was 100% following the top-rated guide on mobafire, which was magic penetration reds. Regrowth Pendant, Healt Potion, Philosopher's Stone, Merc Treads, Sheen -> Trinity Force, bla bla bla. Skills were Q W E and then max W. I was useless until late game with this build, almost always lost my lane if the opponent had half a brain. Since then I changed to AD runes. Cloth Armor, 5 Health Potions, Wriggles, Merc Treads (or Ninja Tabi), Recurve Bow -> Wit's End, Phage -> Trinity Force, bla bla bla. Skills I like to do Q W E max W vs ranged. I find it's way too hard to last hit without Q vs ranged as you each so much damage every time you move in. VS melee I like E W W Q then max W or W E W Q. If you get pushed to your tower at level 3 you can W E Q and it's no big deal. You can do a lot of annoying damage if you E W and then smack them a few times when they come to last hit. Once you get up to Recurve Bow your W is super annoying. Anyways, just writing my experience because I was terrible for like 50 games and finally with these changes I feel like I'm not an auto-loss on my lane. I watched that Wick3d video guide and don't really agree with it. I know he's way way better than me but some of the justification he gave and some of the things he did (like hiding in the brush missing last hits and going back endlessly) didn't make sense to me. It was because of the jungler. If you're low health like that in a lane pushed that far you're basically free kill, but panth had to go back as well so if he goes back he stills retains advantage. Also from watching wickds video and from all the irelia play in Kiev I'm under the impression you can play kinda agressive with early Q and W so you don't get owned by agressive laners, otherwise people wouldn't play her so much. Well, maybe not vs panth and gp. | ||
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NotSorry
United States6722 Posts
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Kaneh
Canada737 Posts
with wit's, If you carry ignite, you can potentially burst him down if he wastes his abilities pushing and doesn't keep his shield high. he's still squishy if he's rushing revolver/will, and he can't tank true damage/magic from wits. | ||
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Doctorbeat
Netherlands13241 Posts
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Revive
United States10 Posts
On January 24 2012 22:46 Doctorbeat wrote: Can anyone give me some tips vs GP? I've started cloth+5 and still got outlaned. I have a hard time deciding when to go in and stun him, since I'm afraid of the Q crit. Bring ignite instead of teleport if you haven't already. Don't let him bully you away from the creep line, as long as you're not attacking creeps, you're not regaining health. If you start with cloth armor+5 pots, try to 625 gold and sneak in a quick base while your creeps are pushed to his tower. If you've done a decent job last hitting you'll have that amount by the 5 minute mark right after the 2nd cannon minion wave. Once you have ninja tabi and a ward, you should be able to take him easy in a 1v1 standoff. If he buys gp/5s then you should buy phage/wit's end and pressure the lane. Even if he has wriggle's he'll be considerably weaker than you in a 1v1. Don't be afraid to be aggressive because the passive sustain from W is OP. | ||
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theMarkovian
Netherlands183 Posts
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xDaunt
United States17988 Posts
On February 18 2012 02:14 theMarkovian wrote: How do you deal with Yorick? Is he killable 1v1, eventually? I survived a yorick earlier today, but I lost every trade I tried to do, even in midgame on equal cs. I think I only kept up by better mechanics. Is it just a farm off? Buy lots of armor early and try not to fight him? I haven't done the match up for a while, but my recollection was that Yorick was really easy for Irelia if you specced defensively and opened leveling W first with a vamp scepter. You won't give two shits about his ghost harassment because you can continuously heal off of them. | ||
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Mogwai
United States13274 Posts
On February 18 2012 02:14 theMarkovian wrote: How do you deal with Yorick? Is he killable 1v1, eventually? I survived a yorick earlier today, but I lost every trade I tried to do, even in midgame on equal cs. I think I only kept up by better mechanics. Is it just a farm off? Buy lots of armor early and try not to fight him? Assuming you make it to wriggle's without too much difficulty you beat him in my experience. | ||
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Alaric
France45622 Posts
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