EPT[Patch 1.0.0.131: Viktor] General Discussion - Page 43
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Brees
Marshall Islands3404 Posts
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Tooplark
United States3977 Posts
kass gets no cs but swain isn't gonna be hurting kass much if kass has good micro | ||
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Promises
Netherlands1821 Posts
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Alaric
France45622 Posts
I still feel there's too much to see from him, the simple choice between Gravity or another augment does hips to his playstyle, since without it it's hard to stun offensively for example. Also, even tho the Hexcore's not bad, you can easily stuff him with Rabaddon, WotA, Rylai, RoA, void staff... and a mp5 item if you pick a non-gravity augment... considering the hexcore and boots take 2 slots, you've really got a lot of room to fiddle with regarding how you'd build him (in the order too, some rush raba, some RoA, some prefer revolver... ). Since you've got those choices to make and an enemy comp to influence you, I wouldn't call his lategame "bad" but he's still got issues in it, and his laning can be rough against a handful of common AP mids. Other than that, his full combo in a teamfight can get ugly if you catch people clumped, he's got kiting power, and a lot of fun to bring to the table. | ||
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Cloud9157
United States2968 Posts
On January 03 2012 04:22 wei2coolman wrote: Okay, Seriously. How do I lane against a Kass as a Swain? or do I just say fuck it, and go another lane? Laning against him is simple. Go boots pot against him and heal whenever you get low. This lane is about surviving till 6. Once you do, stay at near full health to survive his burst. He'll do plenty of damage with R>Q>E so don't panic because Swain is more than tanky enough to take the damage. Feel free to try and kill him pre 6. Land a W and trade E+Q with his Q. Kassadin cannot deal with champs that sustain like Swain. | ||
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anmolsinghmzn2009
India1783 Posts
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Noocta
France12578 Posts
On January 03 2012 04:10 jcarlsoniv wrote: I'm watching Bob's stream atm, and he's playing top Poppy. Granted, the Talon he's laning against is pretty bad, he's doing very well. Poppy was one of my favorite champions leveling up, but I haven't played her in a long time because I couldn't really see her being viable anywhere. Her passive is absolutely amazing. Her Q hits like a fucking truck once she gets sheen. As soon as she gets Triforce, she's really good. It's just that her laning seems very week. Has anyone figured out a way to make her viable (runes and masteries) so that she can get to her insane phase? hp5 is the key on her. Play with defensive rune and defensive masteries, start with a regrowth pendant, get a philo. Philo + hp5 quints is enough to regen a lot in lane. Then farm a hell off your lane to get Trinity. Get an IE and zeal after. You're now able to 1v5 their team. :d It work against certain top heroes, and in bot lane with a soraka or an Alistar. | ||
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JackDino
Gabon6219 Posts
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Shikyo
Finland33997 Posts
On January 03 2012 05:21 JackDino wrote: Could poppy work vs a trondomere? how could she possibly work? Tryndamere destroys poppy totally horribly o_o if you mean solotop | ||
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r.Evo
Germany14081 Posts
I actually must say that I start to like Trist more than Cait against Kass. The ability to W/E into his face while Q comes at you is just too good. Also since you're pretty much permapushing early I feel Trist has the stronger escape against early ganks. :> Post 6 Cait has some trouble cause, yes, she can autohit him in the face, but he can still get a full RQE combo off without her hurting him THAT much. Do that to trist and you die to her W/E/R+auto combo right afterwards. | ||
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Shikyo
Finland33997 Posts
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WhiteDog
France8650 Posts
On January 03 2012 02:46 mustaju wrote: The Vayne/Graves tips help a lot, mostly because I really get owned as AD. It's frustrating to get yelled at when forced to play a role you didn't really want in the first place. As for champions I really like playing, I mained singed from 800 ELO to 1200 ELO and then started noticing that everyone suddenly wanted top instead of being the carry bot or mid. I have little to no experience with a lot of roles, jungling and AD in particular are weird. I specifically mentioned GP because I feel he forces Signed out of lane or kills him outright, but that may just be me playing him badly at this ELO. I have about 200 games under my belt, for frame of reference, about 140 of them either Singed or Shen. If you get owned as AD, just play graves or caitlyn. Graves tank more than any other, and cait has a great range. Tristana is good too for new ad carry but I will never takes seriously a hero with such skin. | ||
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overt
United States9006 Posts
On January 03 2012 04:27 Alaric wrote: Swain is a caster innately weak against other AP mids. You don't run him against an anti caster champ.  Swain really doesn't fair that bad against other APs. He struggles against APs who push super hard early like Morgana but so does every AP who can't clear waves crazy fast. And once you have blue buff you clear pretty fast. He's an AP mid that can survive the full burst of other APs and can trade hits pretty damn well. You just have to play the lane right, including against Kassadin. Like he definitely has bad match ups and I think you should always try to run Swain solo top against a bruiser but he honestly fairs just fine mid, I dunno why people claim he doesn't. | ||
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Shikyo
Finland33997 Posts
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Kaniol
Poland5551 Posts
On January 03 2012 05:28 r.Evo wrote: I actually must say that I start to like Trist more than Cait against Kass. The ability to W/E into his face while Q comes at you is just too good. Also since you're pretty much permapushing early I feel Trist has the stronger escape against early ganks. :> Post 6 Cait has some trouble cause, yes, she can autohit him in the face, but he can still get a full RQE combo off without her hurting him THAT much. Do that to trist and you die to her W/E/R+auto combo right afterwards. Yeah, Trist sounds really awesome vs Kass, however i suck at harassing with her sooo bad, cait on the other hand is a faceroll ad carry playable to every player :x | ||
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overt
United States9006 Posts
On January 03 2012 05:43 Shikyo wrote: Meh, Swain gets completely humiliated by Viktor and that says something already I haven't played that lane yet. I don't really see how though. There are definitely champs that can be tricky for Swain mid like Morgana or Xerath (everyone has trouble with them though) but I think he can handle pretty much every other AP without getting shit on. Just sayin', I hear people say that he's weak against other APs and I just don't really see it. Maybe if you can't hit snare you'll do bad. But you have a 900 range AoE snare and hitting it first lets you easily E+Q them for a metric fuckton of damage. Not to mention you really don't run out of mana ever pre-6 and only run low post-6 if you have to pop ult a lot. Really easy to avoid fights as Swain if they won't benefit you though and it's really easy to start fights that will benefit you. | ||
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Shikyo
Finland33997 Posts
On January 03 2012 05:53 overt wrote: I haven't played that lane yet. I don't really see how though. There are definitely champs that can be tricky for Swain mid like Morgana or Xerath (everyone has trouble with them though) but I think he can handle pretty much every other AP without getting shit on. Just sayin', I hear people say that he's weak against other APs and I just don't really see it. Maybe if you can't hit snare you'll do bad. But you have a 900 range AoE snare and hitting it first lets you easily E+Q them for a metric fuckton of damage. Not to mention you really don't run out of mana ever pre-6 and only run low post-6 if you have to pop ult a lot. Really easy to avoid fights as Swain if they won't benefit you though and it's really easy to start fights that will benefit you. Viktor Qs -> Swain deals no dmg because of the shield. Repeat. At lvl 6 Viktor kills swain immediately if he's below 80%. | ||
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overt
United States9006 Posts
On January 03 2012 06:02 Shikyo wrote: Viktor Qs -> Swain deals no dmg because of the shield. Repeat. At lvl 6 Viktor kills swain immediately if he's below 80%. How is Viktor going to hit him with a 600 range Q when Swain has a 900 range snare? Swain E also outranges his Q, so I'm pretty sure you could just snare + E and then walk away. Again, I haven't played the match up but like most AP mids against Swain it probably comes down entirely to how well Swain plays. When I see most Swains lose mid it's usually because they try to play it like it's a melee lane and hit E->Q->W for easy snares and more overall damage. Against APs I think it's way smarter to just hit W first and then get in an EQ. If someone chooses to fight you after snare is done they're retarded because they're going to eat a full Q while under the effects of Swain E. You do less damage opening with W instead of E but it's way safer and works really well against lots of AP mids. | ||
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JackDino
Gabon6219 Posts
On January 03 2012 05:26 Shikyo wrote: how could she possibly work? Tryndamere destroys poppy totally horribly o_o if you mean solotop Dunno, if poppy with an armour page can lane easily against pantheon I dont see how trondomere would kill her since I'm more afraid of pant than trynd. | ||
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BlackMagister
United States5834 Posts
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there is usually a thousand people who wanna take that spot (and when I go top with Riven, I always destroy my lane, especially against GP).
