[Patch 1.0.0.128: Shyvana] General Discussion - Page 5

On November 01 2011 21:14 -Zoda- wrote:

Forgot about this one yeah. But the ball can't autoattack.

Also some ideas given are already in the geme like :
Skill that makes temporary brush (kind of opposite of graves) = Akali's shroud
Skill which fires pattern of small projectiles that you have to dodge raiden style = TF's Q
skills which deal damage based on distance target traveled over X time = old Taric stun.

On November 01 2011 21:14 BlueBird. wrote:
Phrost you misinterpreted some of those, like the "nidalee spear or dot one" Is supposed to be like blood hunter/blood seeker's ult, the aoe skill would be a toggle like mummy, the safe zone would be next to the mummy instead of slightly outside mummy's aoe though. Temporary brush is kind of like the guy from Hon who can make mounds and stand on them(not like akali cause standing with akali in shroud doesn't reveal her). Then again he uses them to travel as well.

Overall the ideas weren't the best but no reason just to shut them all down, I honestly haven't been happy with latest heroes in LOL either, haven't really felt like I liked one much other than Riven. I thought Xerath was kind of cool until I tried him, and then I just didn't really enjoy playing him, just not my thing.

And yes Syllabear would be fucking awesome, they would just need to let us deselect our champ and use control groups instead of ctrl. -_-

On November 01 2011 21:22 Phrost wrote:



Blood seeker's ult is one of the worst designed skills in the entire game. I thought everyone knew this as it has been brought up many times with Riot's designers. That skill is so binary in its effects that it's either super over powered or its super under powered, depending on how much the person knows what the skill does.

If the player knows how the skill works, they stand still and take no damage. If they don't know how it works, they start moving and die, and then get pissed off because they don't know why they died. There is no "good" way to show what's happening to the player.

Okay, so you want it to be singed's poison but in an aoe? that sounds like fun! Singed has a dead zone, its basically not directly behind him.

I don't know why everyone is ragging on the newer champions not being "unique." I'm fairly certain if you played all 3 of the ranged AD champions released this year then you will all get a very different feel for how they play (Graves, Caitlin, and Vayne). Similarly most of the mages play fairly differently (some of the support ones fall in this weird place where they can play like existing mages or be supports). You can't honestly say Xerath, Veigar, Brand, Malzahar, and Annie have the same strategy when playing. Even with Xerath's stupid passive he's still very different than most caster's before him

On November 01 2011 21:22 Phrost wrote:



Blood seeker's ult is one of the worst designed skills in the entire game. I thought everyone knew this as it has been brought up many times with Riot's designers. That skill is so binary in its effects that it's either super over powered or its super under powered, depending on how much the person knows what the skill does.

If the player knows how the skill works, they stand still and take no damage. If they don't know how it works, they start moving and die, and then get pissed off because they don't know why they died. There is no "good" way to show what's happening to the player.

Okay, so you want it to be singed's poison but in an aoe? that sounds like fun! Singed has a dead zone, its basically not directly behind him.

I don't know why everyone is ragging on the newer champions not being "unique." I'm fairly certain if you played all 3 of the ranged AD champions released this year then you will all get a very different feel for how they play (Graves, Caitlin, and Vayne). Similarly most of the mages play fairly differently (some of the support ones fall in this weird place where they can play like existing mages or be supports). You can't honestly say Xerath, Veigar, Brand, Malzahar, and Annie have the same strategy when playing. Even with Xerath's stupid passive he's still very different than most caster's before him

On November 01 2011 21:14 -Zoda- wrote:

Forgot about this one yeah. But the ball can't autoattack.

Also some ideas given are already in the geme like :
Skill that makes temporary brush (kind of opposite of graves) = Akali's shroud
Skill which fires pattern of small projectiles that you have to dodge raiden style = TF's Q
skills which deal damage based on distance target traveled over X time = old Taric stun.

On November 01 2011 21:39 Requizen wrote:

Xypherous already said a pet would be absurd to balance and any type of pet champ would end up being worthless or broken. I agree, actually, look how good zoning is already, you add a pet into that equation and they'd never lose the lane.

Unless it was like a melee champ with no abilities and just autos, and all abilities came from the pet, it would be too good, sad to say.

On November 01 2011 21:14 BlueBird. wrote:
Also by hero that gets buffs in river, why can't a certain hero get a terrain buff, nidalee already gets brushes speed, why couldn't a big water themed guy get + armor/mres when fighting in the water. Or + damage, he could be like a giant talking fish, what do i care.

On November 01 2011 21:47 Sabin010 wrote:
Is Dragon lady the Nine tailed fox or are we still gettin a nine tailed fox champ too?

For example, temp brush is similar to akalis shroud in that it blocks vision of your character, but its different in that the character shrouded is revealed if you enter it making it innefective at melee range and much more effective at range. Also the temp brush would hide any character, not just akali, so It could be used on fleeing allies, or to provide better positioning to a ranged character just laning normally.

Also by hero that gets buffs in river, why can't a certain hero get a terrain buff, nidalee already gets brushes speed, why couldn't a big water themed guy get + armor/mres when fighting in the water. Or + damage, he could be like a giant talking fish, what do i care.

On November 01 2011 21:20 mr_tolkien wrote:
Those 2 Caitlyn nerfs seem totally random. Not like her abilities where what made her strong :/

On November 01 2011 21:47 ItsFunToLose wrote:
They were not intended to be earth shattering revelations, he was simply demonstrating that its not absofuckinglutely impossible to think of new abilities.

On November 01 2011 21:55 Craton wrote:

I'm under the impression that their hubris is preventing them from just nerfing her range.

On November 01 2011 21:03 Phrost wrote:

Pickpocket hero that steals gold
-- this is stupid, why don't you just kill them instead? Because it is hard to kill other hero, this is a different kind of herass instead of the same ol' cone spell etc. Imagine this used as a counter pick to a hero that is really farm depended. Use your imagination a little?

Support hero who lays down neutral buffs on the ground (stand in it to get effect) (maybe can blow them up as ult/trap)
--Mobility is king, soraka already has very little and look how easy she is to kill? ... this example is a support that lay down buffs ala rally. So your team have to decide if it's good to stand on it. Also the other team can try and steal the buff by getting themselves into a better position. And at last you can bait with a buff on the ground. Sounds fun to me.

Hero who can disguise as a creep
--Why not just make it stealth and call it a day? It would be even more obvious than stealth to detect. Yeah, this is kind of stealth but why only have one, think out of the box ffs. It could also be that it exhange itself with a creep so the creep looks like the hero and the hero looks like the creep. And you can of course control both. It's a fun decoy.

Hero who can reflect/rebound skills
--how shitty does it feel if you play against characters that you cant reflect their spells? This is incredibly niche ( sivir's spell shield is very similar but it wouldn't make sense for some of the stuff it absorbs to be reflected ) I don't even udnerstand how you can compare to sivir spell shield. This mechanic would be so much fun, and imagine a pro game where a skillshot is reflected back to another low hp enemy (like angle in = angle out) and kills him. Potential for so really fun/cool moments.

Trap skill that fires in a direction
-- what does this mean? Do things not usually fire in a direction? Really that is your reply? This of course means a turret ala herimerdinger that only shoot in front of it for example but deals more dmg. So you can dogde it but then it have the benefit of more dmg. Many possibilites here.

Skill that slows down all time in a bubble
--You want an aoe slow instead of stun? Again, you completely misunderstand. In this bubble also projectiles etc slows down. Easy dogde of all non instant spells. Fun mechanic imo

Hero that buffs and sacs creeps
--We learned from gangplank that this is a fucking terrible idea. Finally I agree. Denying does not fit in LoL when you cannot attack deny.


Skill that reduces other heroes skill range
--Graves and nocturne already do this. Ehh? He is writing skill range not sight range. Wow.

Skill that turns a damaging enemy spell into a heal
--We learned from essence flux, this is a shitty idea. LOL, no we did not. What he means is an ENEMY spell dmg turned into dmg. This is like sivirs spell shield just with health instead of mana. Obviously it should not block CC just dmg.

Skill that makes temporary brush (kind of opposite of graves)
--That would be a pain in the ass to code and I don't see any particular benefit. You will know someone is inside and just not facecheck. Why talk about coding? Your other argument I can relate to.

Hero who doesn't lane and gets money from walking
--So junglers and roaming support, already in the game. Roaming is in the game yes, but it is too weak atm to be used in almost all levels of play. Could be fun if there actually were some natural roaming heros to add to the list of Carry/bruiser/jungle/ap carry etc. If balanced would give more variaty in the games.


Hero who fucks with the minimap
--Does nocturne's ult already do that? I think it does. Agree

skills which deal damage based on distance target traveled over X time
--Nidalee's Spear. You didn't really think these out did you? Unless you want it to be a dot, then what's the point? No Nid spear does NOT do that... Nids spear deals dmg based on the distance traveled of the spear, not the target. It is a fun mechanic because the target has to decide between moving to safety and maybe die or stay and maybe get caught.

Low CD skill which greatly speeds and then greatly slows target hero (can be used on enemies and allies)
--Time Warp has like 2-3 second cooldown for a 55% slow/speed increase with sufficient levels of rewind. Agree

Skill which fires pattern of small projectiles that you have to dodge raiden style
--I dont know what this means. Could be a fun mechanic but would be hard to design to be really fun

big round Aoe skill whose only safe zone is right near the caster (minimum range)
--So all cone based aoes / skill shots? When you're really close they're really hard to aim because you came move very slightly and avoid everything. No? Its like Panths jump just opposite. Run near to the center (and get out of position) or to the enemy hero casting it to avoid dmg. Decision making spells are always fun.

circle skill which if you cross the edge moves you to the opposite edge like going off the screen in asteroids
--Why not just stun you instead and call it a day? This seems like a very confusing implementation for Veigar's stun. Anivias wall begs to differ so does oriannas ult. Displacement spells are always fun and I think there could be more in LoL.

Hero who consumes and stores buffs and debuffs from other heroes for later use (maybe only debuffs to prevent trolling)
--What is considered a buff and debuff? Can you steal steroids? Dispelling is not a really big deal in LoL like it was in dota. This could be really really overpowered without much work if its the only champion with the ability. I agree, this would be very hard to balance. But if balanced could be fun.

Hero who passively powers up by standing still
--This promotes passivity, Xerath's and Kogmaw's long range is the best example of limited mobility for increased rewards
Agree but still should be in the game. Variaty ftw.

Hero who targets all their skills to areas and then releases ("run program") them with another skill (have to predict enemies)
--This sounds incredibly confusing and the risk/reward would have to be rediculously high to make it anywhere near worth while for anyone to play. This brings a lot of power creep with it unnecessarily.

Hero who can turn invisible to all heroes except one (I SWEAR HE'S RIGHT HERE, AOE TO MY LEFT!)
--Lux's shield used to do this, it felt crappy to play against.

Skill which tags enemies with parasitic vision like queen in BW
--Nidalee and Caitlin's traps already do this.

Skill which makes enemies lose control of movement and "slide" in the direction they were going at increased speed
--Why not just knockback or stun? There are much simpler ways to get the same effect, this is purely visual. Does not have to "stun" the hero while it slides, just displacement. Also it can get enemies out of position (imagine the tank just sliding way past the fight (I would find that funny)). It could also be used to save allies due to the increased speed. Could also force dives. Alot of possibilites, I like it.

Hero who gets buffs in River
--This isnt dota, and not every map will have a river (see dominion). Again, could be a roam hero mechanic. But would be hard to balance due to dragon baron in water.

Support hero who carries Items to other heroes
--No couriers, you dont lose gold for dying. Go to base and buy it. Supports already have enough of a bitch role.

Heroes with non-expiring controllable minion
--You want a syllabear? It's going to suck if you can't aim where it's attacking. Also heimer's turrets are essentially the same except they dont move.

Hero who places portals, go ontop of one---> tele to the other, can stealth them to trick enemies into them.
--This would be either really bad or really broken, it depends on the cast range of the portal.

Hero who burns mana (still not in LOL)
--And never will be. There are too many heros without mana

Hero who can switch their mana and health
--Why? Blitz already has a mana shield and that's obnoxious to play against.

Hero who can force other heroes to use skills (spell taunt)
--How do you make this intelligent AI? What do you do with skill shots?. Yeah this would be hard to make meaningful but still sounds like fun.

Thats just some cool shit off the top of my head....I wanna see this kind of stuff instead of "herp, durp, imma dragon now my skills do AOE"

Those are some bad suggestions, as I commented.

On November 01 2011 21:56 ItsFunToLose wrote:



Nerf her range and i would't buy her for 450.

Cait needs to outfarm the enemy AD carry by at least 10% just to remain on even footing.

On November 01 2011 22:02 Craton wrote:

Please don't ignorantly pretend that you can't nerf her range and improve her scaling at the same time.

On November 01 2011 22:02 Craton wrote:

Please don't ignorantly pretend that you can't nerf her range and improve her scaling at the same time.