EPTBut he's damn good for stomping newbies, I'll give you that.
[Patch 1.0.0.128: Shyvana] General Discussion - Page 4
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Want to rage about your latest loss? Use the QQ thread. If you whine in GD, you'll get warned. - Neo, 9:49 KST, Nov 9th | ||
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beef42
Denmark1037 Posts
But he's damn good for stomping newbies, I'll give you that. | ||
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JackDino
Gabon6219 Posts
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R04R
United States1631 Posts
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dnastyx
United States2707 Posts
On November 01 2011 19:51 beef42 wrote: Am I the only one who thinks Graves wasn't such hot shit in the first place? I mean an AD carry with frontloaded burst? Once he blows his load isn't he pretty shit compared to other carries like Vayne and Kog'Maw? All you really gotta do is buy a Banshee's Veil and you're basically nullifying the main feature of Graves. But he's damn good for stomping newbies, I'll give you that. Buying Bveil against an AD carry seems less than optimal. Especially considering that once he unloads his initial burst, he still has a dash, and you have to deal with his autoattacks hitting you for. Not to mention his bruiser stats and ridiculous passive, which made most early game trades very much in your favor. Dragon Chick's W reminds of pre-nerf Rumble Q. | ||
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Shikyo
Finland33997 Posts
On November 01 2011 14:43 Two_DoWn wrote: The free crit staying if you break stealth to drop a box is pretty big imo. Much more freedom in box placement without losing that burst. Pretty much back to how it was when Shaco was turbo-OP(you can deceive -> E -> crit) | ||
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sob3k
United States7572 Posts
On November 01 2011 19:19 JackDino wrote: If you design a competely unique champion that isn't any like the other 82? I'll give you 2k euros. Karma's Q? Annie was one of the first champs and she has a cone attack... Man, there are so many cool concepts for heroes and abilities out there that havent been touched by LOL.... Pickpocket hero that steals gold Support hero who lays down neutral buffs on the ground (stand in it to get effect) (maybe can blow them up as ult/trap) Hero who can disguise as a creep Hero who can reflect/rebound skills Trap skill that fires in a direction Skill that slows down all time in a bubble Hero that buffs and sacs creeps Skill that reduces other heroes skill range Skill that turns a damaging enemy spell into a heal Skill that makes temporary brush (kind of opposite of graves) Hero who doesn't lane and gets money from walking Hero who fucks with the minimap skills which deal damage based on distance target traveled over X time Low CD skill which greatly speeds and then greatly slows target hero (can be used on enemies and allies) Skill which fires pattern of small projectiles that you have to dodge raiden style big round Aoe skill whose only safe zone is right near the caster (minimum range) circle skill which if you cross the edge moves you to the opposite edge like going off the screen in asteroids Hero who consumes and stores buffs and debuffs from other heroes for later use (maybe only debuffs to prevent trolling) Hero who passively powers up by standing still Hero who targets all their skills to areas and then releases ("run program") them with another skill (have to predict enemies) Hero who can turn invisible to all heroes except one (I SWEAR HE'S RIGHT HERE, AOE TO MY LEFT!) Skill which tags enemies with parasitic vision like queen in BW Skill which makes enemies lose control of movement and "slide" in the direction they were going at increased speed Hero who gets buffs in River Support hero who carries Items to other heroes Heroes with non-expiring controllable minion Hero who places portals, go ontop of one---> tele to the other, can stealth them to trick enemies into them. Hero who burns mana (still not in LOL) Hero who can switch their mana and health Hero who can force other heroes to use skills (spell taunt) Thats just some cool shit off the top of my head....I wanna see this kind of stuff instead of "herp, durp, imma dragon now my skills do AOE" | ||
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Goshawk.
United Kingdom5338 Posts
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Tabbris
Bangladesh2839 Posts
On November 01 2011 20:16 sob3k wrote: Man, there are so many cool concepts for heroes and abilities out there that havent been touched by LOL.... Pickpocket hero that steals gold Support hero who lays down neutral buffs on the ground (stand in it to get effect) (maybe can blow them up as ult/trap) Hero who can disguise as a creep Hero who can reflect/rebound skills Trap skill that fires in a direction Skill that slows down all time in a bubble Hero that buffs and sacs creeps Skill that reduces other heroes skill range Skill that turns a damaging enemy spell into a heal Skill that makes temporary brush (kind of opposite of graves) Hero who doesn't lane and gets money from walking Hero who fucks with the minimap skills which deal damage based on distance target traveled over X time Low CD skill which greatly speeds and then greatly slows target hero (can be used on enemies and allies) Skill which fires pattern of small projectiles that you have to dodge raiden style big round Aoe skill whose only safe zone is right near the caster (minimum range) circle skill which if you cross the edge moves you to the opposite edge like going off the screen in asteroids Hero who consumes and stores buffs and debuffs from other heroes for later use (maybe only debuffs to prevent trolling) Hero who passively powers up by standing still Hero who targets all their skills to areas and then releases ("run program") them with another skill (have to predict enemies) Hero who can turn invisible to all heroes except one (I SWEAR HE'S RIGHT HERE, AOE TO MY LEFT!) Skill which tags enemies with parasitic vision like queen in BW Skill which makes enemies lose control of movement and "slide" in the direction they were going at increased speed Hero who gets buffs in River Support hero who carries Items to other heroes Heroes with non-expiring controllable minion Hero who places portals, go ontop of one---> tele to the other, can stealth them to trick enemies into them. Hero who burns mana (still not in LOL) Hero who can switch their mana and health Hero who can force other heroes to use skills (spell taunt) Thats just some cool shit off the top of my head....I wanna see this kind of stuff instead of "herp, durp, imma dragon now my skills do AOE" Most of the things on that list are lame lol. | ||
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JackDino
Gabon6219 Posts
On November 01 2011 20:16 sob3k wrote: Man, there are so many cool concepts for heroes and abilities out there that havent been touched by LOL.... Pickpocket hero that steals gold - Breaks the game lol Support hero who lays down neutral buffs on the ground (stand in it to get effect) (maybe can blow them up as ult/trap) - how original that's like playing sona buffing your team Hero who can disguise as a creep - too much like shaco's ult/stealth not really original Hero who can reflect/rebound skills - Rammus curling ball sort off, too much like spellshield not really original Trap skill that fires in a direction - Shaco box is a trap skill that fires ina direction, not sure what you mean with this Skill that slows down all time in a bubble - Kinda like Lee Tempest Hero that buffs and sacs creeps - Aegis and GP used to do this, both got changed Skill that reduces other heroes skill range - Reduce vision, reduce range it's all teh same Skill that turns a damaging enemy spell into a heal - kinda like spellshield but a bit better, not really that original either Skill that makes temporary brush (kind of opposite of graves) - Kinda like graves and stealth, not really original Hero who doesn't lane and gets money from walking - GP10 Hero who fucks with the minimap - Not sure what you mean with this. skills which deal damage based on distance target traveled over X time - Nidalee spear Low CD skill which greatly speeds and then greatly slows target hero (can be used on enemies and allies) - Derived from zilean/nasus/lee, not really original Skill which fires pattern of small projectiles that you have to dodge raiden style - not sure what raiden is but it'sreminds me too much of talon ult big round Aoe skill whose only safe zone is right near the caster (minimum range) - liek any other aoe ult but with a safe zone circle skill which if you cross the edge moves you to the opposite edge like going off the screen in asteroids - like a big trap Hero who consumes and stores buffs and debuffs from other heroes for later use (maybe only debuffs to prevent trolling) Hero who passively powers up by standing still - Xerath gets free range and mpen by "standing still" Hero who targets all their skills to areas and then releases ("run program") them with another skill (have to predict enemies) Hero who can turn invisible to all heroes except one (I SWEAR HE'S RIGHT HERE, AOE TO MY LEFT!) - kinda like the new stealth Skill which tags enemies with parasitic vision like queen in BW - Malz targets enemy with visions not original Skill which makes enemies lose control of movement and "slide" in the direction they were going at increased speed - Poppy E does this Hero who gets buffs in River Support hero who carries Items to other heroes - Too much like buying aura items. Heroes with non-expiring controllable minion - Not really original either, take any of the champs with a pet and make it permanent Hero who places portals, go ontop of one---> tele to the other, can stealth them to trick enemies into them. - Makes no sense Hero who burns mana (still not in LOL) - manaburning was removed from the game actually, so yeah not really original Hero who can switch their mana and health - Sort of like blittzcrank passive Hero who can force other heroes to use skills (spell taunt) - taunt is in the game, doesn't make you use skills but not really original Thats just some cool shit off the top of my head....I wanna see this kind of stuff instead of "herp, durp, imma dragon now my skills do AOE" So yeah either your ideas were as original as a dragon that does AoE damage, or they just sucked. | ||
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Divine-Sneaker
Denmark1225 Posts
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shinarit
Hungary900 Posts
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-Zoda-
France3578 Posts
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sob3k
United States7572 Posts
On November 01 2011 20:34 JackDino wrote: So yeah either your ideas were as original as a dragon that does AoE damage, or they just sucked. Im not trying to pluck perfectly original ideas from the mind of god, in fact many of those are already implemented In other DOTA games, I'm just trying to give the game something not exactly the same as the skillset we are seeing now. Plus many of your critiques are just silly like: Hero who doesn't lane and gets money from walking - GP10 Yeah, no, thats not even similar at all. Thats like saying Zileans bombs and Veigars W are the same because they both do a fat lump of AOE damage on time delay. The point is that the differences in the skills create completely different gameplay for the person using them and the person they are used against. big round Aoe skill whose only safe zone is right near the caster (minimum range) - liek any other aoe ult but with a safe zone Well no shit, thats the whole point. It creates a situation where the opposing players have to decide if its more beneficial to sit in the damage or walk up and crowd around the casting character, which could result in them being out of position or being hit with something even worse while they are clumped up. A good champ design would be someone with good up close damage to create a tension for players not wanting to get into his effective range while while also wanting to avoid the nuke. I'm not saying these ideas are something that should be implemented 100%, but they are going to result in some interesting gameplay that isn't in the game right now. The difference between Sona buffing allies in an area by rolling her face on QWER and someone laying down buffs on the ground is a huge one in terms of changing the dynamics of the lane or fight based on positioning. Why isn't Anivia's wall just a root? They both serve the same eventual purpose...(Holding a enemy champ in place for other attacks), its because they are implemented and used completely differently and result in completely different positioning decisions from the players involved. Its differences like this that keep the game deep and interesting. | ||
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BlueBird.
United States3890 Posts
On November 01 2011 20:58 -Zoda- wrote: Tho I like the idea of having a controllable minion. Yet we have Tibbers, Malz's spiders and Yorick's gouls, but they all disappear. Having a character with a pet which would react with the champs skills (like jump on the ennemy, push a target (could be used as an escape)) would be some fun imo. No hotkey bindings and no way to deselect hero like Dota,Hon, rts games, etc have kind of put the hold on this idea, ctrl is just not a realistic way to control a pet imo, feels really clunky. Honestly multi-unit control is about as complex as I think LoL will allow it to be. | ||
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Neos
United States400 Posts
On November 01 2011 20:58 -Zoda- wrote: Tho I like the idea of having a controllable minion. Yet we have Tibbers, Malz's spiders and Yorick's gouls, but they all disappear. Having a character with a pet which would react with the champs skills (like jump on the ennemy, push a target (could be used as an escape)) would be some fun imo. Orianna says hi | ||
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Phrost
United States4008 Posts
On November 01 2011 20:16 sob3k wrote: Pickpocket hero that steals gold -- this is stupid, why don't you just kill them instead? Support hero who lays down neutral buffs on the ground (stand in it to get effect) (maybe can blow them up as ult/trap) --Mobility is king, soraka already has very little and look how easy she is to kill? Hero who can disguise as a creep --Why not just make it stealth and call it a day? It would be even more obvious than stealth to detect Hero who can reflect/rebound skills --how shitty does it feel if you play against characters that you cant reflect their spells? This is incredibly niche ( sivir's spell shield is very similar but it wouldn't make sense for some of the stuff it absorbs to be reflected ) Trap skill that fires in a direction -- what does this mean? Do things not usually fire in a direction? Skill that slows down all time in a bubble --You want an aoe slow instead of stun? Hero that buffs and sacs creeps --We learned from gangplank that this is a fucking terrible idea Skill that reduces other heroes skill range --Graves and nocturne already do this Skill that turns a damaging enemy spell into a heal --We learned from essence flux, this is a shitty idea Skill that makes temporary brush (kind of opposite of graves) --That would be a pain in the ass to code and I don't see any particular benefit. You will know someone is inside and just not facecheck. Hero who doesn't lane and gets money from walking --So junglers and roaming support, already in the game Hero who fucks with the minimap --Does nocturne's ult already do that? I think it does. skills which deal damage based on distance target traveled over X time --Nidalee's Spear. You didn't really think these out did you? Unless you want it to be a dot, then what's the point? Low CD skill which greatly speeds and then greatly slows target hero (can be used on enemies and allies) --Time Warp has like 2-3 second cooldown for a 55% slow/speed increase with sufficient levels of rewind Skill which fires pattern of small projectiles that you have to dodge raiden style --I dont know what this means big round Aoe skill whose only safe zone is right near the caster (minimum range) --So all cone based aoes / skill shots? When you're really close they're really hard to aim because you came move very slightly and avoid everything. circle skill which if you cross the edge moves you to the opposite edge like going off the screen in asteroids --Why not just stun you instead and call it a day? This seems like a very confusing implementation for Veigar's stun. Hero who consumes and stores buffs and debuffs from other heroes for later use (maybe only debuffs to prevent trolling) --What is considered a buff and debuff? Can you steal steroids? Dispelling is not a really big deal in LoL like it was in dota. This could be really really overpowered without much work if its the only champion with the ability Hero who passively powers up by standing still --This promotes passivity, Xerath's and Kogmaw's long range is the best example of limited mobility for increased rewards Hero who targets all their skills to areas and then releases ("run program") them with another skill (have to predict enemies) --This sounds incredibly confusing and the risk/reward would have to be rediculously high to make it anywhere near worth while for anyone to play. This brings a lot of power creep with it unnecessarily. Hero who can turn invisible to all heroes except one (I SWEAR HE'S RIGHT HERE, AOE TO MY LEFT!) --Lux's shield used to do this, it felt crappy to play against. Skill which tags enemies with parasitic vision like queen in BW --Nidalee and Caitlin's traps already do this. Skill which makes enemies lose control of movement and "slide" in the direction they were going at increased speed --Why not just knockback or stun? There are much simpler ways to get the same effect, this is purely visual. Hero who gets buffs in River --This isnt dota, and not every map will have a river (see dominion) Support hero who carries Items to other heroes --No couriers, you dont lose gold for dying. Go to base and buy it. Supports already have enough of a bitch role. Heroes with non-expiring controllable minion --You want a syllabear? It's going to suck if you can't aim where it's attacking. Also heimer's turrets are essentially the same except they dont move. Hero who places portals, go ontop of one---> tele to the other, can stealth them to trick enemies into them. --This would be either really bad or really broken, it depends on the cast range of the portal. Hero who burns mana (still not in LOL) --And never will be. There are too many heros without mana Hero who can switch their mana and health --Why? Blitz already has a mana shield and that's obnoxious to play against. Hero who can force other heroes to use skills (spell taunt) --How do you make this intelligent AI? What do you do with skill shots? Thats just some cool shit off the top of my head....I wanna see this kind of stuff instead of "herp, durp, imma dragon now my skills do AOE" Those are some bad suggestions, as I commented. | ||
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-Zoda-
France3578 Posts
Forgot about this one yeah. But the ball can't autoattack.  Also some ideas given are already in the geme like : Skill that makes temporary brush (kind of opposite of graves) = Akali's shroud Skill which fires pattern of small projectiles that you have to dodge raiden style = TF's Q skills which deal damage based on distance target traveled over X time = old Taric stun. | ||
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sob3k
United States7572 Posts
On November 01 2011 21:03 Phrost wrote: Those are some bad suggestions, as I commented. We can sit here all day complaining about my 30min brainstorm and how hard it would be to balance or whatever, do you honestly think that there are no new mechanics or features that can be introduced to LOL? If you think my ideas are bad then throw something out there. I would argue with your assesments on many of the ideas but I think it would be better if people just contributed something other than a one line dismissal. | ||
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BlueBird.
United States3890 Posts
Overall the ideas weren't the best but no reason just to shut them all down, I honestly haven't been happy with latest heroes in LOL either, haven't really felt like I liked one much other than Riven. I thought Xerath was kind of cool until I tried him, and then I just didn't really enjoy playing him, just not my thing. And yes Syllabear would be fucking awesome, they would just need to let us deselect our champ and use control groups instead of ctrl. -_- Also by hero that gets buffs in river, why can't a certain hero get a terrain buff, nidalee already gets brushes speed, why couldn't a big water themed guy get + armor/mres when fighting in the water. Or + damage, he could be like a giant talking fish, what do i care. | ||
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mr_tolkien
France8631 Posts
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