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iFU.pauline
France1556 Posts
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
On July 26 2014 14:27 Gen.Rolly wrote: Like I mentioned in the previous thread, an unnecessary political statement and a slap in the face of those who contribute to the site that do not share the same political views. Life is hard, get helmet. Sometimes you have to see things you don't like. Like I had to see this post and I'm totally gunna make it. | ||
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QuanticHawk
United States32051 Posts
hahahahahahahahaha On July 26 2014 14:27 Gen.Rolly wrote: Like I mentioned in the previous thread, an unnecessary political statement and a slap in the face of those who contribute to the site that do not share the same political views. haahahahahahahahahah | ||
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Ayaz2810
United States2763 Posts
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zdfgucker
China594 Posts
On July 29 2014 23:33 Ayaz2810 wrote: Good job TL. And I'm actually shocked that there are still people who argue and rant, instead of simply appreciating the message. Just because you choose to support one cause doesnt mean you ignore the rest. If TL had something on the site for every cause, there wouldn't be any room for content. Right now, the global issue of rights for LGBT is a big thing, and something worth getting behind. All you people lipping off need to just accept that this is the cause chosen by TL in support of its members. Online activism is laughable at best and sad at worst. By looking at a shiny banner you change pretty much nothing. If anybody cared enough, they'd be protesting in the streets. Also, this is a "big thing", according to whom? A few internet people? I'm sure those people are vastly outnumbered by people who live in real poverty. I blocked the whole banner, I don't want politics on TL, sorry. | ||
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
On July 29 2014 23:56 zdfgucker wrote: Online activism is laughable at best and sad at worst. By looking at a shiny banner you change pretty much nothing. If anybody cared enough, they'd be protesting in the streets. Also, this is a "big thing", according to whom? A few internet people? I'm sure those people are vastly outnumbered by people who live in real poverty. I blocked the whole banner, I don't want politics on TL, sorry. Yet you clicked on this thread and felt the need to comment. Its almost like you do want them on TL, but only if you agree with them. | ||
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marvellosity
United Kingdom36161 Posts
On July 30 2014 00:05 Plansix wrote: Yet you clicked on this thread and felt the need to comment. Its almost like you do want them on TL, but only if you agree with them. Shitting on a gesture of equality and support is totes where it's at, though. | ||
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
On July 30 2014 00:09 marvellosity wrote: Shitting on a gesture of equality and support is totes where it's at, though. I don’t like getting involved with politics or issues about equality, to the point where I don’t want any community to I am involved with to become involved ever. Even if its passively, I still don’t want to see it because that’s who I am and what I want is most important. | ||
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marvellosity
United Kingdom36161 Posts
On July 30 2014 00:15 Plansix wrote: I don’t like getting involved with politics or issues about equality, to the point where I don’t want any community to I am involved with to become involved ever. Even if its passively, I still don’t want to see it because that’s who I am and what I want is most important. Careful, reading between the lines is a dying skill. | ||
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QuanticHawk
United States32051 Posts
On July 29 2014 23:56 zdfgucker wrote: Online activism is laughable at best and sad at worst. By looking at a shiny banner you change pretty much nothing. If anybody cared enough, they'd be protesting in the streets. Also, this is a "big thing", according to whom? A few internet people? I'm sure those people are vastly outnumbered by people who live in real poverty. I blocked the whole banner, I don't want politics on TL, sorry. maybe it's just a little tough for you to understand, but the banner simply means that tl is supposed to be a friendly space for lbgt people. ie. you waltz into a thread about scarlett and say something stupid, you get disciplined. that's important. no one is saying that the banner is going to have any impact beyond that but ok lol | ||
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r.Evo
Germany14080 Posts
On July 29 2014 21:32 Liquid`Drone wrote: Thirdly, pride rallies. I'm actually shocked that you tried to make an analogy equating homosexuality to beating your girlfriend, but I'll chalk that up to "linguistic unconsciousness" because I don't actually think you think that homosexuality is anything like that. Maybe what you meant to do was equate it to some type of SM-fetish thing where your girlfriend was actually very happy and even sexually aroused through being slapped around the city, but you didn't say that and I need to base my reply around what you wrote rather than what you possibly could have meant to say that would make it less stupid. And it would be pretty stupid anyway. Either way though, there are multiple reasons why pride rallies are important. Why do I have to attach "...which we both consensually agree to and enjoy"? That is exactly what I meant by there being other minorities that are way less accepted in our western societies than gays and lesbians, I'll give you both that you added a possible distinction but that's a clear cut example from two people I consider way ahead of the general population when it comes to such a topic. If I said "Where we would have sex in the streets" you wouldn't assume that it's rape, if I said "having sex with my boyfriend in the streets" you wouldn't assume it either. Beating someone isn't any less wrong than putting your penis in another man's ass. Both are illegal without consent, both are legal with consent. Besides that, why is it a stupid comparison anyway? I actually think the way the LGBT "scene" handles their things could learn a lot from the kink scene. Overall the way things get handled there is a lot less, well, flamboyant and therefor much less of a deal to the general public. Because it's like, we on the teamliquid staff know that teamliquid is a webpage dedicated to computer games, and that we don't actually dictate global policy. We understand that countries where homosexuality is illegal will not suddenly make it legal because we changed our logo. Still though, I think it's nice to show our support, even knowing that it will not immediately convince any policy makers of anything. Furthermore, it seems like you are somehow very positive towards homosexuality and homosexuals, but you don't support us voicing our support of homosexuality and homosexuals' ability to freely showcase their sexuality because there are still other sexual or other minorities that need our support more? A place like TL has many ways to directly influence opinion via the things it does best: Providing great content and information. An interview with Scarlett with questions that maybe go under the hood for your average interview. Gay staff blogging about their trips with their loved ones with pictures and stuff. Hell, TL staff blogging about the fun they had at the Amsterdam Pride Week with pictures and then link it through the Rainbow logo. An article about gay starcraft player x in place y where he actually is struggling because of public opinion and/or laws. Do all of the above and link the logo to the entire series, make an entire event out of it for a week or two to show support with words and actions! TL already has one of the most awesome moderation policies (aka zero tolerance) when it comes to these topics, the next logical step isn't to post a banner like a 16 year old kid that just discovered it's cool to be pro-LGBT on Facebook. The next step is to set an example with the way a community treats LGBT-members (hint: normal) and do cool shit that with it that your userbase might enjoy. Secondly, have you ever played computer games on the internet before and have you been to other communities formed by and inhabited by males in their late teens or twenties? Most of these communities, hell, most places inhabited by male teenagers, suffer from the word "gay" being thrown around ubiquitously as some generic negative word. Faggot is certainly among the most used direct insults. Even though it might not be that big a deal to you, I don't know how linguistically conscious you are, I've talked to several homosexuals who find this hurtful, and I live in a Norwegian city - as open of a region as you could possibly find. Our community comparably being relatively free from insults deriving from sexual orientation is a consequence of our active stance in this issue. These logo changes reflect that and are very much in line with the broader site philosophy. Drone, I'm registered here since 4 years less than you, of course I have. =P - I just don't consider it as big of an issue as you do. When it comes to insults like these I have the same stance as with similars (e.g. "Nigger") which isn't what TL shares as a general idea. Since I can completely accept that idea I'm not using any of that stuff here but I do believe it's by no means the most effective stance for daily life. I am confident that it is inherently impossible to influence another persons behavior by trying to force them to something. Neither I, nor you nor anyone else on this planet can prevent people from using any word as an insult that is intended to hurt. Following this I believe it's a horrible idea to try and shame those words until no one uses them anymore (which won't happen) and instead encourage people to use them lightheartedly, jokingly and take them back that way. It's obviously way easier with audio and visual clues than via text, but there are hundreds of ways to use insults in positive ways which slowly but surely take their power as insults away. It's a lot easier to be proud of things that describe what you are than trying to eradicate it's usage. To get back on topic: What you call "active stance" is million, million times more awesome than a random banner change once in a while that somehow gets celebrated as if it's core of what makes TL awesome about it. TL as a site already shows its stance to its users with action. TL could show its more dedicated stance with even more action (e.g. see above). The last thing this world needs is people putting up flags and other people celebrating that there's now a flag (hence the Facebook comparison). Like you said, sexuality is personal. So is opening up about being gay. For many homosexuals, "leaving the closet" is about the biggest decision they ever make. It's such a difficult thing that there are still many who don't do it. It almost seems like most homosexuals try out heterosexuality because they really really want to be normal, accepted and not having to worry about people finding out who they "really" are. Pride rallies are one great, great avenue for homosexuals who have not yet had the guts to openly tell society about who they are: Firstly, they can see that other people who are homosexuals are actually parading through the streets without being beaten up and hated. Strength in numbers and all that. Secondly, it's actually possible to participate anonymously in those - which again can be really helpful for teenagers who are on the verge of accepting their "new identity". Thirdly, while you seem to think that western european societies are completely accepting of homosexuals and homosexuality, pride rallies deserve some credit for this development through normalizing behavior we previously found shocking. Two men holding hands while walking down the street - which in Trondheim would have been a fairly shocking sight 20 years ago - and something countless homosexuals have been beaten up over - just doesn't hold the same shock value when you just last week watched twenty leather-clad ultra-flamboyant homosexuals partying through the streets on some crazy gay party bus. This might be me being too open or me being too uninformed so maybe you can help me out. Why is the closet a big deal in the first place? As an example, as long as I can remember being sexually active I was into non-vanilla stuff. Obviously when you're young that scares you and obviously when you're young you don't talk to many people (or anyone) about it for that matter because you're not sure how they'll react. However you'll end up at 18+, you end up moving out and then you just go visit certain parties and meet certain not-so-vanilla people and learn that it's nothing evil and start to enjoy your actual desires. But I don't recall ever feeling the need for "a talk" with family or friends. "Yo btw I'm really into consensual rape and so is my gf here" isn't exactly anyone's concern. However, if the topic comes up among friends and/or someone saw something that made them ask there is also no huge deal in sitting down with them and explaining things. What is so different about gays that a young dude can't just live his own life, satisfy his curiosity at various parties, find a cool guy and... just start a relationship with him? Why is there a need to tell friends and family in one huge coming out: "HEY EVERYONE I NEED TO TELL YOU WHAT I'M INTO"? (I'm strictly speaking about e.g. Germany/Netherlands/Scandinavia here.). Why do young gays pressure themselves to do that? What are people actually afraid of? And don't tell me it's being beaten up in the middle of daylight or being fired by their boss if he finds out. Sure, I do know some cases where people don't talk to certain family members anymore, sure I know people who lost a couple of friends over it but that's a normal thing in life and imho just part of growing up in the first place. Basically the only point I can truly understand is that those rallies must be awesome for people still living at home and being afraid of repercussions from their parents. But even in that case (sorry for drawing a comparison to kink again) why aren't there meetings for young gays to just chill and talk? If I was a young kinkster I could google for a minute and then walk 10 minutes to find what is basically a support/curiosity group between 14-21 (or 14-27) right here in my city (half a million population). /rant, maybe that makes my position a bit more clear. tl;dr: I consider TL to be better than a rainbow banner for some special occasion. I also consider the average TL user to be better than celebrating the special rainbow banner as more than a special rainbow banner. Those expectations are clashing with what I'm seeing done with the banner and what I'm seeing from other users in this thread. Hence me being vocal about it. | ||
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andrewlt
United States7702 Posts
Personally, if you ask me to show some small token of support, I would say yes. If you ask me to take a busy day off work and march in the streets, I would say no. I feel you're making way too many demands of somebody else's time and effort. They only wanted to make a small gesture of support. You're pretty much demanding that they either go all out or not bother at all. | ||
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crms
United States11933 Posts
On July 29 2014 09:59 Darkhorse wrote: It would be nice if everyone treated it like a non issue, but a lot of people don't. There are places in the world where it is a criminal offense to be gay, so I feel it actually is an important issue to talk about. Right, I'm in support of it being talked about, I'm just sad that it must be. | ||
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levelping
Singapore759 Posts
Also I think your adherence to the comparison with kink really misses the point man. Yes being gay has a sexual content but it's much more than just the sex. There's marriage, adoption, being accepted by family and so on. While many aspects of kink can be very holistic, I don't think it approaches the pervasiveness of sexual orientation. More on point I fail to see how your consensual rape parade is at all comparable to a gay pride event, because you can set consensual rape aside and get married and adopt kids and so on, but being gay is central to many people self identity and it's not something that they just perform in the bedroom. So the idea that they should keep it private just as you keep your consensual rape fetish private is really off the mark since your comparing a small aspect of your life with the entire self identity of other people. Also please don't get angsty when we aren't sure if your saying that you beat your gf with her consent. Your post was really ambiguous. Just be clearer next time and we won't end up in this misunderstanding. Incidentally isn't consensual rape an oxymoron. | ||
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Scarlett`
Canada2385 Posts
On July 30 2014 01:08 r.Evo wrote: + Show Spoiler + On July 29 2014 21:32 Liquid`Drone wrote: Thirdly, pride rallies. I'm actually shocked that you tried to make an analogy equating homosexuality to beating your girlfriend, but I'll chalk that up to "linguistic unconsciousness" because I don't actually think you think that homosexuality is anything like that. Maybe what you meant to do was equate it to some type of SM-fetish thing where your girlfriend was actually very happy and even sexually aroused through being slapped around the city, but you didn't say that and I need to base my reply around what you wrote rather than what you possibly could have meant to say that would make it less stupid. And it would be pretty stupid anyway. Either way though, there are multiple reasons why pride rallies are important. Why do I have to attach "...which we both consensually agree to and enjoy"? That is exactly what I meant by there being other minorities that are way less accepted in our western societies than gays and lesbians, I'll give you both that you added a possible distinction but that's a clear cut example from two people I consider way ahead of the general population when it comes to such a topic. If I said "Where we would have sex in the streets" you wouldn't assume that it's rape, if I said "having sex with my boyfriend in the streets" you wouldn't assume it either. Beating someone isn't any less wrong than putting your penis in another man's ass. Both are illegal without consent, both are legal with consent. Besides that, why is it a stupid comparison anyway? I actually think the way the LGBT "scene" handles their things could learn a lot from the kink scene. Overall the way things get handled there is a lot less, well, flamboyant and therefor much less of a deal to the general public. Because it's like, we on the teamliquid staff know that teamliquid is a webpage dedicated to computer games, and that we don't actually dictate global policy. We understand that countries where homosexuality is illegal will not suddenly make it legal because we changed our logo. Still though, I think it's nice to show our support, even knowing that it will not immediately convince any policy makers of anything. Furthermore, it seems like you are somehow very positive towards homosexuality and homosexuals, but you don't support us voicing our support of homosexuality and homosexuals' ability to freely showcase their sexuality because there are still other sexual or other minorities that need our support more? A place like TL has many ways to directly influence opinion via the things it does best: Providing great content and information. An interview with Scarlett with questions that maybe go under the hood for your average interview. Gay staff blogging about their trips with their loved ones with pictures and stuff. Hell, TL staff blogging about the fun they had at the Amsterdam Pride Week with pictures and then link it through the Rainbow logo. An article about gay starcraft player x in place y where he actually is struggling because of public opinion and/or laws. Do all of the above and link the logo to the entire series, make an entire event out of it for a week or two to show support with words and actions! TL already has one of the most awesome moderation policies (aka zero tolerance) when it comes to these topics, the next logical step isn't to post a banner like a 16 year old kid that just discovered it's cool to be pro-LGBT on Facebook. The next step is to set an example with the way a community treats LGBT-members (hint: normal) and do cool shit that with it that your userbase might enjoy. Secondly, have you ever played computer games on the internet before and have you been to other communities formed by and inhabited by males in their late teens or twenties? Most of these communities, hell, most places inhabited by male teenagers, suffer from the word "gay" being thrown around ubiquitously as some generic negative word. Faggot is certainly among the most used direct insults. Even though it might not be that big a deal to you, I don't know how linguistically conscious you are, I've talked to several homosexuals who find this hurtful, and I live in a Norwegian city - as open of a region as you could possibly find. Our community comparably being relatively free from insults deriving from sexual orientation is a consequence of our active stance in this issue. These logo changes reflect that and are very much in line with the broader site philosophy. Drone, I'm registered here since 4 years less than you, of course I have. =P - I just don't consider it as big of an issue as you do. When it comes to insults like these I have the same stance as with similars (e.g. "Nigger") which isn't what TL shares as a general idea. Since I can completely accept that idea I'm not using any of that stuff here but I do believe it's by no means the most effective stance for daily life. I am confident that it is inherently impossible to influence another persons behavior by trying to force them to something. Neither I, nor you nor anyone else on this planet can prevent people from using any word as an insult that is intended to hurt. Following this I believe it's a horrible idea to try and shame those words until no one uses them anymore (which won't happen) and instead encourage people to use them lightheartedly, jokingly and take them back that way. It's obviously way easier with audio and visual clues than via text, but there are hundreds of ways to use insults in positive ways which slowly but surely take their power as insults away. It's a lot easier to be proud of things that describe what you are than trying to eradicate it's usage. To get back on topic: What you call "active stance" is million, million times more awesome than a random banner change once in a while that somehow gets celebrated as if it's core of what makes TL awesome about it. TL as a site already shows its stance to its users with action. TL could show its more dedicated stance with even more action (e.g. see above). The last thing this world needs is people putting up flags and other people celebrating that there's now a flag (hence the Facebook comparison). Like you said, sexuality is personal. So is opening up about being gay. For many homosexuals, "leaving the closet" is about the biggest decision they ever make. It's such a difficult thing that there are still many who don't do it. It almost seems like most homosexuals try out heterosexuality because they really really want to be normal, accepted and not having to worry about people finding out who they "really" are. Pride rallies are one great, great avenue for homosexuals who have not yet had the guts to openly tell society about who they are: Firstly, they can see that other people who are homosexuals are actually parading through the streets without being beaten up and hated. Strength in numbers and all that. Secondly, it's actually possible to participate anonymously in those - which again can be really helpful for teenagers who are on the verge of accepting their "new identity". Thirdly, while you seem to think that western european societies are completely accepting of homosexuals and homosexuality, pride rallies deserve some credit for this development through normalizing behavior we previously found shocking. Two men holding hands while walking down the street - which in Trondheim would have been a fairly shocking sight 20 years ago - and something countless homosexuals have been beaten up over - just doesn't hold the same shock value when you just last week watched twenty leather-clad ultra-flamboyant homosexuals partying through the streets on some crazy gay party bus. This might be me being too open or me being too uninformed so maybe you can help me out. Why is the closet a big deal in the first place? As an example, as long as I can remember being sexually active I was into non-vanilla stuff. Obviously when you're young that scares you and obviously when you're young you don't talk to many people (or anyone) about it for that matter because you're not sure how they'll react. However you'll end up at 18+, you end up moving out and then you just go visit certain parties and meet certain not-so-vanilla people and learn that it's nothing evil and start to enjoy your actual desires. But I don't recall ever feeling the need for "a talk" with family or friends. "Yo btw I'm really into consensual rape and so is my gf here" isn't exactly anyone's concern. However, if the topic comes up among friends and/or someone saw something that made them ask there is also no huge deal in sitting down with them and explaining things. What is so different about gays that a young dude can't just live his own life, satisfy his curiosity at various parties, find a cool guy and... just start a relationship with him? Why is there a need to tell friends and family in one huge coming out: "HEY EVERYONE I NEED TO TELL YOU WHAT I'M INTO"? (I'm strictly speaking about e.g. Germany/Netherlands/Scandinavia here.). Why do young gays pressure themselves to do that? What are people actually afraid of? And don't tell me it's being beaten up in the middle of daylight or being fired by their boss if he finds out. Sure, I do know some cases where people don't talk to certain family members anymore, sure I know people who lost a couple of friends over it but that's a normal thing in life and imho just part of growing up in the first place. Basically the only point I can truly understand is that those rallies must be awesome for people still living at home and being afraid of repercussions from their parents. But even in that case (sorry for drawing a comparison to kink again) why aren't there meetings for young gays to just chill and talk? If I was a young kinkster I could google for a minute and then walk 10 minutes to find what is basically a support/curiosity group between 14-21 (or 14-27) right here in my city (half a million population). /rant, maybe that makes my position a bit more clear. tl;dr: I consider TL to be better than a rainbow banner for some special occasion. I also consider the average TL user to be better than celebrating the special rainbow banner as more than a special rainbow banner. Those expectations are clashing with what I'm seeing done with the banner and what I'm seeing from other users in this thread. Hence me being vocal about it. Because unless you want to keep all your relationships a secret; coming out is something you need to do at some point. Even in countries where it is fairly accepted, a good deal of parents/friends/coworkers/etc can have terrible/harmful reactions to it. Whether it is just casually mentioned in a conversation or it's a big deal depends on the person and their situation. Who you're into is not the same as what you're into. | ||
Liquid`Drone
Norway28665 Posts
See it's like, I can get where you're coming from kinda. Because you, like most enlightened western youth, only consider homosexuals different from heterosexuals in terms of what sex they prefer. They prefer having sex with men, just like you prefer sex when it's "more exciting". But the thing is, like you're saying, sex is private. Nobody knows that you like to punch your gf when you have sex with her (or whatever your thing is, no judgement from me!), so it's not part of your identity. Being homosexual differs greatly in this one aspect. Like, right now, whether society approves of your sexual habits doesn't really matter much as long as you can find someone to enjoy them with, because nobody else has to know. Homosexuals don't have this luxury; they can only be with the ones they love as long as society approves, because everyone can immediately see that they are homosexuals. This is why "coming out" and being accepted for it is so important. And that's why fighting an active stance against slurry language is very important - one of the biggest issues for homosexual teenagers is that all their friends, who might not be homophobic at all, throw around fag and gay like insults without considering how that's hurtful to their closet homosexual friends, but it's also why pride rallies have played an important role in making gays more comfortable with being publicly gay, because the pride rallies push the boundaries for what is acceptable. (for example two men holding hands is less offensive after you watched a gay orgy). Further, gaming communities are in general dominated by male teenagers/early twenties, ours is very international and has a majority of its membership base from outside north-western Europe, and I just think it's nice to subtly (at least by pride-rally standards :D) voice our support in addition to the other moderational efforts we make. You are of course entitled to think it's a useless effort, and to think that maybe it does absolutely nothing at all.. We however have evidence of that not being the case because both this year and last year, several gay members of our community stated how they were really happy to see us voice our support for their cause, and from my perspective, that alone makes it worth it. If we were doing this while our staff members called people faggot while banning them, you'd have a very good point in saying that this is just useless posturing, but us changing the color of our horses' mane does not diminish any other efforts we're making, and us focusing on homosexuals does not mean that we're blind to or uncaring about other worldly problems. | ||
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levelping
Singapore759 Posts
That said I worry for Scarlett: why are you in North Korea! | ||
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Zetter
Germany629 Posts
Of course TL could do more, but I think it'd overcharge TL's capacities and as many activist groups (be it animal rights groups, political groups, LGBT groups etc.) have experienced it's better to subtly push for your ideals than to bluntly force it on people. And that's why I don't think the rainbow is too big of a political statement. It just doesn't force gay pride on anyone as it's just a symbol, but it's a great way to say that LGBT people are welcome here. This small gesture does a lot, because as a gay/bisexual or transexual person you can never know if you're welcome anywhere and it's really emotionally supporting to know that TL is a forum where you can openly talk about this topic. | ||
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Ayaz2810
United States2763 Posts
On July 30 2014 01:47 Liquid`Drone wrote: Are you really trying to say that liking violent sex is similar to homosexuality? That it's part of your identity in the same way? See it's like, I can get where you're coming from kinda. Because you, like most enlightened western youth, only consider homosexuals different from heterosexuals in terms of what sex they prefer. They prefer having sex with men, just like you prefer sex when it's "more exciting". But the thing is, like you're saying, sex is private. Nobody knows that you like to punch your gf when you have sex with her (or whatever your thing is, no judgement from me!), so it's not part of your identity. Being homosexual differs greatly in this one aspect. Like, right now, whether society approves of your sexual habits doesn't really matter much as long as you can find someone to enjoy them with, because nobody else has to know. Homosexuals don't have this luxury; they can only be with the ones they love as long as society approves, because everyone can immediately see that they are homosexuals. This is why "coming out" and being accepted for it is so important. And that's why fighting an active stance against slurry language is very important - one of the biggest issues for homosexual teenagers is that all their friends, who might not be homophobic at all, throw around fag and gay like insults without considering how that's hurtful to their closet homosexual friends, but it's also why pride rallies have played an important role in making gays more comfortable with being publicly gay, because the pride rallies push the boundaries for what is acceptable. (for example two men holding hands is less offensive after you watched a gay orgy). Further, gaming communities are in general dominated by male teenagers/early twenties, ours is very international and has a majority of its membership base from outside north-western Europe, and I just think it's nice to subtly (at least by pride-rally standards :D) voice our support in addition to the other moderational efforts we make. You are of course entitled to think it's a useless effort, and to think that maybe it does absolutely nothing at all.. We however have evidence of that not being the case because both this year and last year, several gay members of our community stated how they were really happy to see us voice our support for their cause, and from my perspective, that alone makes it worth it. If we were doing this while our staff members called people faggot while banning them, you'd have a very good point in saying that this is just useless posturing, but us changing the color of our horses' mane does not diminish any other efforts we're making, and us focusing on homosexuals does not mean that we're blind to or uncaring about other worldly problems. Man, what a great post. I was thinking about the best way that you could possibly word an argument so the dumb dumbs would understand that the moment you compare homosexuality to anything else that isn't homosexuality, you've already fucked up. People keep making the same arguments that don't make sense from the ground up. This should shut a few folks up at least. | ||
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darthfoley
United States8003 Posts
On July 26 2014 14:27 Gen.Rolly wrote: Like I mentioned in the previous thread, an unnecessary political statement and a slap in the face of those who contribute to the site that do not share the same political views. Don't know why you find it such a slap in the face. Anyways, yay TL keep up the great work | ||
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