EPTDating: How's your luck? - Page 998
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We are extremely close to shutting down this thread for the same reasons the PUA thread was shut down. While some of the time this thread contains actual discussion with people asking help and people giving nice advice, it often gets derailed by rubbish that should not be here. The moderation team will be trying to steer this thread in a different direction from now on. Posts of the following nature are banned: 1) ANYTHING regarding PUA. If your post contains the words 'alpha' or 'beta' or anything of that sort please don't hit post. 2) Stupid brags. You can tell us about your nice success stories with someone, but posts such as 'lol 50 Tinder matches' are a no-no. 3) Any misogynistic bullshit, including discussion about rape culture. 4) One night stands and random sex. These are basically brags that invariably devolve into gender role discussions and misogynistic comments. Last chance, guys. This thread is for dating advice and sharing dating stories. While gender roles, sociocultural norms, and our biological imperative to reproduce are all tangentially related, these subjects are not the main purpose of the thread. Please AVOID these discussions. If you want to discuss them at length, go to PMs or start a blog. If you disagree with someone's ideologies, state that you disagree with them and why they won't work from a dating standpoint and move on. We will not tolerate any lengthy derailments that aren't directly about dating. | ||
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sc-darkness
856 Posts
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GoTuNk!
Chile4591 Posts
On August 07 2018 00:36 L_Master wrote: I think you're exaggerating quite a bit, or more likely it's a combination of other factors if that dramatic of a difference happened. More likely, you got a little better looking and got a little more attention than before. Only way I see this really happening like you described is if you lost a ton of fat of your face while simultaneously getting an absolute top tier body. If that's the case, yea you probably get a decent number of people checking you out. I disagree that the physical aspect is the "most important by far". Online, where you're being judged left or right by some pics, sure. In real life, not so much. Especially in real life the way most people are meeting women. If you're just picking women up for casual sex from clubs or bars, I agree to an extent. Physical attractiveness makes a bigger difference there again because you're not talking that much in those environments. However, the majority of people as far as I can tell aren't really looking for these things and are meeting women more conventionally through various social channels: friend groups, classes, shared activities, etc. In these places where you have plenty of time to get to know each other, physical attractiveness is far, far less important. The idea you don't need "game" or "personality" if you're good looking is ridiculous in any normal context for any normal guy. If you're a top tier looking guy, I'm talking like 1 in a 100k type looks or something, then yes many women will throw themselves at you, especially in online/club/bar/hookup environments. However, you won't be able to get anything long term if you're personality is trash. For just normal "good looking" people, personality matters quite a bit, even if trying to hookup. A typical 1 in 10 good looking dude that goes to the club would get nowhere if his personality/confidence were shit. Nowhere. It would be even more of a disaster if he was looking for a girlfriend through more traditional social circle means. Tl;dr: Looks matter, especially online/bar/club/hookup goals. Personality matters, significantly, for all but ridiculously attractive actor tier dudes looking exclusively for hookups. The idea that personality doesn't matter if you're "good-looking" is ridiculous. My experience with lifting and dating. + Show Spoiler + ![[image loading]](https://i.redditmedia.com/dhhxYXwQoT29csnJnu9pZ6ZMXHPhAc_AFMd6a76xmv0.png?w=480&s=cb9e2ccf08396e1d7af780209b970fbc) | ||
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Uldridge
Belgium4985 Posts
But why would you want to play out the intro to pick up artistry in this hypothetical scenario of yours? It's just manipulation of social settings to get what you want anyway. | ||
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LegalLord
United States13779 Posts
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sc-darkness
856 Posts
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ThunderJunk
United States721 Posts
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Uldridge
Belgium4985 Posts
You could always train into being "hard to get" over time, but that will only mold you into someone you're not, unless you want to be someone that's hard to get. You know what I'm trying to say here? If putting someone on ignore once in a while because that's what you like to do to tease someone and make them want your attention (more than before), then that's simply one of your social cues you've picked up on doing over the years and feel comfortable with. There's a lot to say about body language and social knowledge you could pick up and practice on and master, but for what cause? Unless you can do it on the spot and do it perfectly (and by that I mean, you picking the right time to do it, the right amount of it and understanding the people involved are "vulnerable" for said play, which is by no means an easy feat) it'll take too much time and your window will most likely have passed. Do what LegalLord says and just have fun with the girl. Can't go wrong with making women laugh, or by impressing them with your vast knowledge of pro-game related trivia. | ||
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L_Master
United States8017 Posts
On August 07 2018 04:21 sc-darkness wrote: Hypothetical question, if you're with 2 or more girls and you like one of them, is it a good idea to pay more attention to others to tease her? Does that work most of the time? I'm curious if there is some data to back it up. This to me does sound like old school PUA stuff. I think it's unlikely to do much. If she already likes you, it might get her to chase...but she already likes you anyway so... If she doesn't, I don't see it making a difference unless she is an extreme center of attention type girl or something that can't bear to not be fully focused on. Long story short, I wouldn't do it. Minimal to no gain, and it also probably get you in your heard and thinking "mathematically" like I gotta X and then after Y minutes do Z before I finally move on to B. At that point you're not really present in the conversation, and it's often noticeable. On August 07 2018 04:59 sc-darkness wrote: Well, that scenario would pretty much be "hard to get", and you know that saying that you shouldn't be too available.. I can see it backfiring, yes. I guess I was curious when this could ever work unless you know the person very well as you say. I personally don't think being "hard to get" is that great. What you don't want to be is way to available or needy. You know the guy who is sitting next to his phone all day immediately ready to respond the second the girl texts him with a paragraph response. I just play it naturally with things like text/Tinder/social media. If someone texts me and I'm sitting there doing nothing, I text back right away. Even if it happens 5 times in an hour and I respond immediately because I'm watching a movie on the couch that's OK. If I'm doing other things though, I just don't look at my phone so it might be 1,2,3, or 8 hours before I respond. I tried intentionally playing hard to get, longer time to reply than she replied to you, etc. and never saw any benefit. I also felt stupid so I stopped doing that. | ||
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L_Master
United States8017 Posts
On August 07 2018 02:38 Excludos wrote: I agree for the most part that these terms aren't clearly defined, but there are few cases where they can be legitimately used as well so you're better off steering away from them in the first place. If you want to define someone who's attractive, charming and socially adept as "alpha" then sure, but just proclaiming someone as "alpha" doesn't actually tell anyone anything, and 99% of the use cases for that word is meant to degrade someone else, so it's much better to just steer clear of it. Incel is pretty much the same, except the exact opposite. It's never a word to use if you want to give someone an actual advice, as it doesn't tell anyone anything, and the vast majority of people who uses it tends to either view it negatively or be in the group you described above with a lacking grasp of reality. Those are fair points. Incel especially is a word I wouldn't use in an advice context. I'd use it in a descriptive context if I wanted to refer to someone or a group of people quickly without having to write out "this guy would like to get laid but is having no success". One is a mouthful, the other is succinct. Alpha for sure has issues because of an inconsistent definition and past history regarding it's connotation making it a very loaded word. The reason I'm purposefully "rather useless soundbite" is because I didn't want to contribute to a conversation which should be stopping. This thread is on thin ice already, and throwing around these bad phrases and words are a great way of getting it locked again. I feel like there is some history here I don't know. I've seen no indications of a thread on thin ice, aside from a longstanding warning at the top not to delve into PUA or misogynistic discussion. I would assume if the thread were truly moving off appropriate course a mod would give a warning to the thread to move away from such discussion, but judging from how people seem to be on eggshells about certain topics or phrases that may not be the case. And yes, I have been reading the posts, and I stand by my original first "useless soundbite": The world isn't nearly as black and white as half of you seem to think it is. You can't just proclaim that "girls like alphas" or "after lifting I'm swimming in pussy". It's not very helpful advice. I agree. I may not have been, but at least in my comments I felt like I've been pretty clear in steering away from universals. The world is definitely not black and white as you rightly say. At the same time, I believe it would also be unreasonable to say that there are not characteristics that are generally attractive (i.e. sizeable portion of women find them attractive) or generally unattractive. Anybody saying something to the effect of "girls like alphas" is silly. Saying that "many girls are attracted to confidence, leadership, and good social skills" is not. The former statement is black and white everyone is like that. The latter explicitly acknowledges that this does not apply to all women. If I was making statements that certain things apply to all women, then I apologize for being unclear. All of my points have been made with general, what I see as "majority trends" in mind. | ||
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ShambhalaWar
United States930 Posts
On August 02 2018 15:16 ThunderJunk wrote: Yeah man. I would love to know how to change myself to avoid having this happen again. With no specific feedback, it's really tricky. I think it is a good thing to let it go, not overthink it, and just try again with other people. If I connect sincerely, then losing that connection hurts. No way around that. I went over in my mind a few times what might have went wrong, but at the end of the day if it was meant to work out it would, and it didn't, so I need to let it go. No other choice. I've come to this conclusion: The mature thing is generally to provide feedback, but it's also tricky because so many men tilt towards anger to dominate. So, how is she supposed to know I'm not that kind of guy? With no mutual friends, I can't expect to learn anything from anyone. I can just be what I am and get what I get from that. Deeper relationships require shared perspectives, like from mutual friends, to keep things consistent enough off which to base meaning through an adaptive use of trust. Or blind dumb luck, as in a leap of faith. Australian girl was not willing to make such a leap for me for reasons I will never be sure of. I 100% agree with your conclusion, feedback and clear communication is a super mature response and the sign of a conscious human being (a real keeper). Not to devalue this woman, but her approach to relationship seems in it's infancy, not evolved interaction. And you are right about men having ridiculous responses that could cause a woman to be rightly afraid to openly tell someone how she feels. Keeping that in mind... *The real important (and very paradoxical thing...) is that it has nothing to do with you... you are great, and there is nothing to change. You can never be something else for someone else. And most paradoxically, it's the more you accept yourself that you will be excepted unconditionally for who you are. Nobody is good at being another person, so the pro strat is to just be yourself. | ||
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Stratos_speAr
United States6959 Posts
On August 07 2018 04:59 sc-darkness wrote: Well, that scenario would pretty much be "hard to get", and you know that saying that you shouldn't be too available.. I can see it backfiring, yes. I guess I was curious when this could ever work unless you know the person very well as you say. If you have to play "hard to get", then you're with the wrong woman. If things are overly complicated about figuring out what your relationship status is or whatnot, then you're not with the right woman. It amazes me how complicated people (both men and women) make dating. You want to find the "right" type of person? Then you need to be the right type of person yourself, and you need to pay attention to the people around you. I've been married for 3 years now and with my wife for 6, and, having married young, I can't tell you how many people I know or see that just make this way too complicated. Odds are you already know someone that is an great match for you, odds are you are dating all the wrong type of women, and odds are you aren't being a good enough person for the good women out there. (These "you's" are general and not pointed at you specifically). I agree. I may not have been, but at least in my comments I felt like I've been pretty clear in steering away from universals. The world is definitely not black and white as you rightly say. At the same time, I believe it would also be unreasonable to say that there are not characteristics that are generally attractive (i.e. sizeable portion of women find them attractive) or generally unattractive. Anybody saying something to the effect of "girls like alphas" is silly. Saying that "many girls are attracted to confidence, leadership, and good social skills" is not. The former statement is black and white everyone is like that. The latter explicitly acknowledges that this does not apply to all women. If I was making statements that certain things apply to all women, then I apologize for being unclear. All of my points have been made with general, what I see as "majority trends" in mind. The problem is that generalizations like that 1) are completely useless in any real context and 2) leave out a massive amount of women from the discussion. If 60% of women like a certain set of traits, that leaves tens of millions of women in the U.S. alone that like a different set of traits. | ||
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ThunderJunk
United States721 Posts
On August 07 2018 11:34 ShambhalaWar wrote: I 100% agree with your conclusion, feedback and clear communication is a super mature response and the sign of a conscious human being (a real keeper). Not to devalue this woman, but her approach to relationship seems in it's infancy, not evolved interaction. And you are right about men having ridiculous responses that could cause a woman to be rightly afraid to openly tell someone how she feels. Keeping that in mind... *The real important (and very paradoxical thing...) is that it has nothing to do with you... you are great, and there is nothing to change. You can never be something else for someone else. And most paradoxically, it's the more you accept yourself that you will be excepted unconditionally for who you are. Nobody is good at being another person, so the pro strat is to just be yourself. Hey, I appreciate the support. I don't want to disparage you, or attack you, so don't take the following personally. "Be yourself" is a platitude. It's impossible to be anyone besides myself. So, it's not really a pro strat, it's a constant reality. I owe my successes to my ability to learn from past mistakes and improve my thoughts, words, actions, attitudes, and game in general. I'm not the same guy I was 10 years ago. I don't want to be the same guy in 10 years. I can be something else for someone else. In fact, I must be. I can learn a new skill to impress people, or I could break away from an addiction, or I could start working out. These are all completely legitimate strategies to become a better person, and so attract a better mate. And that better mate would also have decided to become a better person for the hope of meeting someone better. | ||
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bloodwhore~
1010 Posts
Asked her if she wanted to meet up this weekend today, but she is going away to another city for a while. Asked her about another day and she said "We can talk about it more when I get back.". Can't say I feel like she has been very interested since we met, so I am like 70% sure she will not want to meet up again. | ||
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IgnE
United States7681 Posts
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sc-darkness
856 Posts
On August 08 2018 03:47 bloodwhore~ wrote: Went on a date yesterday. Nothing super special but I thought it was enjoyable. No massive sparks on the first date, we basically just sat and drank wine and talked for a few hours. I thought she was cuter in real than in her pictures. She was a bit hasty when she talked though. We got into the conversation about AI and she was pretty convinced almost to the point of being scared that AI would someday take over and destroy the human race. I mean, even if you do believe that, chill, won't happen for many years to come. Asked her if she wanted to meet up this weekend today, but she is going away to another city for a while. Asked her about another day and she said "We can talk about it more when I get back.". Can't say I feel like she has been very interested since we met, so I am like 70% sure she will not want to meet up again. Well, if you're AI, I won't want to meet you as well. Joke aside, that's some weird choice of topic on a first date but who am I to judge? Good luck next time  | ||
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Artisreal
Germany9235 Posts
On August 08 2018 04:22 IgnE wrote: if you believe the apocalypse is really coming the last thing you should do is chill. I agree. She should definitely go on more dates with bloodwhore! | ||
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LegalLord
United States13779 Posts
On August 08 2018 03:27 ThunderJunk wrote: "Be yourself" is a platitude. It's impossible to be anyone besides myself. So, it's not really a pro strat, it's a constant reality. A useful platitude at least. Perhaps it’s more precisely correct to say “be comfortable with who you are and don’t try to pretend to be someone you’re not under the perception it will make you more attractive.” That, at least, is the goal. | ||
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sc-darkness
856 Posts
On August 08 2018 04:57 LegalLord wrote: A useful platitude at least. Perhaps it’s more precisely correct to say “be comfortable with who you are and don’t try to pretend to be someone you’re not under the perception it will make you more attractive.” That, at least, is the goal. I think even this is not complete. What if I'm not a funny person, but slowly try to throw a joke here and there in hope of improving my funny side? Am I not myself then? You start from somewhere. | ||
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ThunderJunk
United States721 Posts
On August 08 2018 03:47 bloodwhore~ wrote: Went on a date yesterday. Nothing super special but I thought it was enjoyable. No massive sparks on the first date, we basically just sat and drank wine and talked for a few hours. I thought she was cuter in real than in her pictures. She was a bit hasty when she talked though. We got into the conversation about AI and she was pretty convinced almost to the point of being scared that AI would someday take over and destroy the human race. I mean, even if you do believe that, chill, won't happen for many years to come. Asked her if she wanted to meet up this weekend today, but she is going away to another city for a while. Asked her about another day and she said "We can talk about it more when I get back.". Can't say I feel like she has been very interested since we met, so I am like 70% sure she will not want to meet up again. Have you tried sending her a dick pic? + Show Spoiler + Joking. | ||
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Uldridge
Belgium4985 Posts
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