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We are extremely close to shutting down this thread for the same reasons the PUA thread was shut down. While some of the time this thread contains actual discussion with people asking help and people giving nice advice, it often gets derailed by rubbish that should not be here. The moderation team will be trying to steer this thread in a different direction from now on. Posts of the following nature are banned: 1) ANYTHING regarding PUA. If your post contains the words 'alpha' or 'beta' or anything of that sort please don't hit post. 2) Stupid brags. You can tell us about your nice success stories with someone, but posts such as 'lol 50 Tinder matches' are a no-no. 3) Any misogynistic bullshit, including discussion about rape culture. 4) One night stands and random sex. These are basically brags that invariably devolve into gender role discussions and misogynistic comments. Last chance, guys. This thread is for dating advice and sharing dating stories. While gender roles, sociocultural norms, and our biological imperative to reproduce are all tangentially related, these subjects are not the main purpose of the thread. Please AVOID these discussions. If you want to discuss them at length, go to PMs or start a blog. If you disagree with someone's ideologies, state that you disagree with them and why they won't work from a dating standpoint and move on. We will not tolerate any lengthy derailments that aren't directly about dating. | ||
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Harris1st
Germany6860 Posts
On December 20 2018 21:04 farvacola wrote: Don’t think so, that looks accurate to me lol Probably a solid 90% The other 10% are if both are somewhat socialy awkward and the courting process takes twice as long ^^ | ||
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LegalLord
United Kingdom13775 Posts
On December 20 2018 17:40 Acrofales wrote: Question for the thread veterans: any time someone has started a post with "this girl confuses me", has the answer ever *not* been "she's just not that into you"? Didn't post it, but yeah, once - but it was because I was dumb enough not to see clear signs she was interested, rofl. Although, you're right, mixed signs generally just mean "not that interested, potentially stringing you along for the fun of it." On December 20 2018 21:20 Harris1st wrote: Probably a solid 90% The other 10% are if both are somewhat socialy awkward and the courting process takes twice as long ^^ This is pretty much exactly right. | ||
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TheFish7
United States2824 Posts
On December 20 2018 15:24 evilfatsh1t wrote: seems like she keeps you around just to entertain herself and boost her confidence. youre in the friendzone and seems to me shes one of those textbook slags that treat men as toys. shes made it evident that she has no use for men in her life because shes not interested in long term partners or having a family therefore the only value men provide to her is entertainment. the fact that she knows you were interested in her romantically but would then go and hook up with your friend and nonchalantly talk about him with you is just being her being a bitch tbh. theres no way shes so ignorant to the point that she wouldnt realise youre not the best person to be speaking about your friend with. and lastly the fact that she hasnt made any "moves" on you or agreed to even just hook up (which is the only thing shes interested in with guys apparently) just means she has zero interest in you sexually. id wager a guess that youre right about her lying to herself, but not about what she wants but who she is. the impression you got from her is that shes open to hooking up with a number of guys as long as its all no strings attached (ie a slag). but when you suggest it to her she probably didnt want to admit to herself that the above is true and so rejected you to protect her pride or something. thats my take on it, although ill admit i am a pretty conservative guy. cut her loose would be my opinion. unless you think shes a person that provides so much value in your life even at a platonic level, i dont see why you should give yourself headaches over a woman like that. This explanation makes good sense - when she got pissed at me for suggesting we hook up, I could've sworn I saw a hint of satisfaction on her face before she got mad. Basically she was using me for validation (and perhaps also for comradery and/or my social circle). It also explains why she lied to me about certain things (2 years of working in sales made me fairly good at detecting lies). One place I think you're a little off though is she doesn't seem to actually be promiscuous; this was validated by her female friend who encouraged me to ask her out in the first place, she told me she hadn't been laid in months and hadn't had a bf in a long time. We also shared a lot of our sexual histories with each other and I did not get the idea that she was lying about any of that. She even admitted to turning bi/lesbian for a while out of frustration but said "women are just as bad as men, and some are worse". Another bit of info is that the reason I went for her in the first place is because my female friend told me "I saw how she looks at you, she's into you, you should talk to her dude." I guess she was wrong or that changed. This girl just seems determined to make herself miserable though, and I don't get it, because she's pretty intelligent - I suspect some kind of emotional issue. And yea, I'm not trying to get with her - just trying to do a post-mortem to avoid future similar mistakes, and thought it was worth sharing with my fellow starcraft nerds. | ||
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LemOn
United Kingdom8629 Posts
On December 20 2018 17:40 Acrofales wrote: Question for the thread veterans: any time someone has started a post with "this girl confuses me", has the answer ever *not* been "she's just not that into you"? Yep, she can just be a structured person Or one with hangups from the past Or simply an introvert And people in general do all sort of confusing shit even when they like you hah | ||
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Malinor
Germany4721 Posts
On December 14 2018 08:56 LemOn wrote: I was thinking about this And next time I date someone like that If I'd give them my time of day that is Who isn't reaching out first after weeks yet everything else is going well Is just grab my balls and directly and firmly call them out on that if they are thinking about me and miss me they just have to let me know so I know that or it's not going to work out. You can't really complain about the person if you haven't done that, you either do that Accept that you always initiate and don't see her very often Or realise this isn't what you want, you want an effortless dating and relationship and you move on Short update. We are on the phone again regularly plus texting. This morning I just received a message "How are you?". Still a massive mountain to climb, but it seems there is definitely hope :-) @Lemon: What do you mean by "She is a structured person". Is there some kind of definition for that? Maybe my english fails me here. | ||
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bloodwhore~
1010 Posts
She only wants to see him for drinks (I'm guessing he has been buying drinks, at least the first "dates"). She fucks his friend and talks to him about what kind of a guy he is. To me that seems like a fucking power move from her side. Basically keeping him on a leash. It's of course possible that you're not telling the whole story and we only get to hear the bad parts, but when I read that text I just kept thinking "what the fuck dude, wake up". | ||
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TheFish7
United States2824 Posts
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GoTuNk!
Chile4591 Posts
On December 22 2018 20:31 bloodwhore~ wrote: I do agree with your sentiment that people do confusing shit Lem0n. People might not always know what they're after etc. But this instance I think it's fairly safe to say that she wanted nothing to do with him romantically or sexually. She only wants to see him for drinks (I'm guessing he has been buying drinks, at least the first "dates"). She fucks his friend and talks to him about what kind of a guy he is. To me that seems like a fucking power move from her side. Basically keeping him on a leash. It's of course possible that you're not telling the whole story and we only get to hear the bad parts, but when I read that text I just kept thinking "what the fuck dude, wake up". Good old times, when fucking your friend was a deal breaker. | ||
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Shalashaska_123
United States142 Posts
I disagree with evilfatsh1t's assessment, but I do agree that you shouldn't spend anymore time with this girl. On December 20 2018 14:49 TheFish7 wrote: I've been confused by this one girl, I've been trying to figure her out. Note this whole story is from a while back. Earlier this year I met her through some friends, got her number, asked her out for dinner and drinks. We had some good conversation, made her laugh, we hugged goodnight. I go on a 2nd and 3rd date with her, and it's a similar situation, good time, but she always claims she has something to do after the date - gym, work whatever. I take this as "I'm not ready to sleep with you yet". No big deal, I think. On the 4th get-together, we have a few too many drinks, and I'm trying to escalate. She asks "where do you see us going" I say I am interested in her romantically, as more than a friend. She says she sees me as a drinking buddy only, and leaves pretty soon after, and seems slightly angry/upset with me. To be honest, I was expecting you to answer, "to my bedroom," but I guess you're not that kind of guy. I feel like she thought the reason you were taking her out for drinks was to make her less inhibited so you could get laid. Since that wasn't your intention, she was annoyed that you tried to escalate things. On December 20 2018 14:49 TheFish7 wrote: Fast forward 2-3 months. She starts texting me to hang out again, which we do a few times. I don't try anything at this point and as far as I can tell she doesn't give me any signals. We have some mutual friends and hang out in a group sometimes. One night she texts me at midnight on a Thursday - I am already in bed - to go get drinks. I say it's too late and I'm sleepy, but she should come over on Saturday because I'm having friends over to my apartment to drink. (was this a missed opportunity?) Maybe it was a missed opportunity. But who cares. If she's attracted to you, she'll give you plenty more. I suggest turning off your phone at night so you can sleep peacefully. Reply to peoples' texts in the morning. On December 20 2018 14:49 TheFish7 wrote: That saturday she comes over, i introduce her to a bunch of my friends, we all get drunk on some strong cocktails I've made and go out to a bar. After a bit I go have a chat with one group and when I come back to where she's at, see her making out with my male friend. They leave together like 15 mins later. The next morning she texts me saying "I can't believe I went home with (friend) last night, I was so drunk lol". I feel pretty badly and rejected but play along like it was nothing. I realize that I've had feelings for her all along. I think you have only yourself to blame for this one. You serve everyone strong cocktails and go out to a bar and expect her not to hookup with someone? If some other attractive guy is making moves on her, why should she turn him down? You and her are not in a relationship. On December 20 2018 14:49 TheFish7 wrote: We meet up again a few days later, she asks about my friend saying they might hang again, what is he like etc. I don't say anything bad. Long story short she finds out things she does not like about him, but keeps having him over anyway to hook up. He then tries to date her instead of just making it a hook-up, and she stops the relationship once she realizes he wants to actually date her. Hmmmm, you say nothing bad, but she finds out things she doesn't like about him. I'll just assume she broke up with the friend because she wasn't interested in a serious relationship with him. On December 20 2018 14:49 TheFish7 wrote: When I talk to her again about it, she says she does not want a relationship, she only wants someone to have sex with. She also says she never wants children and doesn't want to get married. We spend a lot of time then talking about relationships and sex etc. She asks for very detailed info like, how many people have I made out with, what kind of things did I do with previous gfs in bed. We have too many drinks again and I say I'm also looking for someone to have sex with and then I make the mistake of suggesting that we go back to my apartment. She gets very mad at me for suggesting this and storms off. I can understand if she's not into me at all, but I don't get her attitude. I have a strong impression that she's lying to me about what she wants, and maybe also lying to herself about it. Anyone ever experience someone like this? I just don't get her and it's nagging at me. Ah, so she doesn't want a serious relationship with anyone. That's why she didn't want to date you or your friend. I feel like you made a big mistake here trying to come off as someone only looking for sex like her. You already admitted to her at the beginning that you had romantic feelings for her. You were trying to deceive her, telling her what she wanted to hear to extend your relationship with her, and I think that's why she got mad and stormed off. I feel like she was attracted to you initially, but you didn't take the initiative in a reasonable amount of time. She was clearly looking for sex all along (if not with you, then with one of your friends), not a serious relationship as you were. There's nothing confusing about her. As I said, cut off all ties with her or be prepared for a whole lot more of this: "I can't believe I went home with (friend) last night, I was so drunk lol". I feel pretty badly and rejected but play along like it was nothing. | ||
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Slydie
1913 Posts
-A new flame who looks very into him, but he does not know where he stands, and they are still in a (promising) beginning of things. They are almost officially together. -A longterm "soulmate" ex, who dumped him harshly a while ago, but they are somehow back to being friends. She does not get her act together to move to his city. They just hang out. -An extremely beautiful rebound girl (after girl #2) he went all in with before they knew eachother. It turned out she wasn't perfect after all, and she did very little to fit him into her life. She just wrote a him after a long silence. To me, the two last girls who hurt him in the past are getting in the way of what could be something beautiful with the new one. For an outsider, it is obvious to tell him to cut all ties with the 2 of them, but his feelings seem to go in every direction, and he is super confused and exhausted. He is no kid and has with plenty of experiences. Whoever he ends up with (if any) should be the one he settles with. Is there any way to help him out? | ||
Naib
Hungary4843 Posts
I was in a similar situation once, a very, very long time ago. I was a young adult with not much dating experience (a few GF's for a few months). I don't think there is anything you could do apart from being there when / if he wants to talk about it. I was also all over the place, one day thinking I should choose girl A, and then a few hours later I felt like girl B is definitely the one to go for... Ultimately, he will come to a decision, good or bad, but it should be his. It is his life afterall. The best friends could do in that situation imo is to be there to listen. | ||
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GoTuNk!
Chile4591 Posts
On December 24 2018 07:05 Slydie wrote: A good friend of mine has great and bad luck in dating at the same time, and is an emotional mess because he does not what to do about 3 girls who have interrest in him. They are: -A new flame who looks very into him, but he does not know where he stands, and they are still in a (promising) beginning of things. They are almost officially together. -A longterm "soulmate" ex, who dumped him harshly a while ago, but they are somehow back to being friends. She does not get her act together to move to his city. They just hang out. -An extremely beautiful rebound girl (after girl #2) he went all in with before they knew eachother. It turned out she wasn't perfect after all, and she did very little to fit him into her life. She just wrote a him after a long silence. To me, the two last girls who hurt him in the past are getting in the way of what could be something beautiful with the new one. For an outsider, it is obvious to tell him to cut all ties with the 2 of them, but his feelings seem to go in every direction, and he is super confused and exhausted. He is no kid and has with plenty of experiences. Whoever he ends up with (if any) should be the one he settles with. Is there any way to help him out? For your short description, tell him to stick to A. This "follow your feelings" and giving up all power is stupid, you should pick a long term partner that you find attractive AND that has positive traits. Both B and C seem to have negative ones. I disagree with "Naib". Listening to your friend is important, but providing clear headed advice to someone clouded by feelings is an exceptional friend. To make an extreme example: Imagine he was confused between some sweet girl with a stable job who wants to start a family and doesn't drink regularly, and a crack girl with 2 children who just got out of rehab. Would a good friend "just listen" or rather point him on certain direction? | ||
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Naib
Hungary4843 Posts
For example, it is unthinkable for me as a stranger to be so full of myself to think I can tell somebody to pick a potential partner-for-life from 3 different options based on a paragraph about them. This is just made worse by the fact it is not him asking for advice for himself, but for a friend - for all we know, said friend doesn't really want help to begin with (definitely not an outwordly assumption to think he surely wouldn't want "advice" from a complete stranger however). Maybe it would be easy to offer advice in your example, but then again, in that situation one wouldn't really need the advice to begin with, would they? On one thing we definitely agree on: the friend you describe GoTuNk! is an exceptional friend - an exceptionally nosy one. It seems to me that friend in question didn't specifically ask for Slydie's help, and any "friendly advice" on which partner to choose would be unsolicited - definitely a no-go in my book. Of course, my assumption could be false, in which case fire away if he asked for your opinion - but it's his life and his (potential) partner that we are talking about here. He and him only should make a decision. Or is it normal for you guys to ask for your friends' / relatives' opinion about who you should be dating? For me it certainly isn't, because it should be my business only, and if I am conflicted, it is my job to figure it out. | ||
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GoTuNk!
Chile4591 Posts
On December 24 2018 23:16 Naib wrote: Well, I've come across your posts multiple times both on here and on LP, and no doubt we have very different values and outlook on life. For example, it is unthinkable for me as a stranger to be so full of myself to think I can tell somebody to pick a potential partner-for-life from 3 different options based on a paragraph about them. This is just made worse by the fact it is not him asking for advice for himself, but for a friend - for all we know, said friend doesn't really want help to begin with (definitely not an outwordly assumption to think he surely wouldn't want "advice" from a complete stranger however). Maybe it would be easy to offer advice in your example, but then again, in that situation one wouldn't really need the advice to begin with, would they? On one thing we definitely agree on: the friend you describe GoTuNk! is an exceptional friend - an exceptionally nosy one. It seems to me that friend in question didn't specifically ask for Slydie's help, and any "friendly advice" on which partner to choose would be unsolicited - definitely a no-go in my book. Of course, my assumption could be false, in which case fire away if he asked for your opinion - but it's his life and his (potential) partner that we are talking about here. He and him only should make a decision. Or is it normal for you guys to ask for your friends' / relatives' opinion about who you should be dating? For me it certainly isn't, because it should be my business only, and if I am conflicted, it is my job to figure it out. Yeah I'm def judging someone on a paragraph - on that ground you are correct, I'm taking his info at face value. On this part I could be wrong and would require more info. I don't meddle on others people relationship obviously, but I think I don't do it because it's the EASY thing to do, not the CORRECT one; I can think of certain situations where I should have given good advice to CLOSE FRIENDS and FAMILY members. A family member met a TOTAL PSYCHO (attempted suicide by jumping off a second floor), married her, had a kid and then divorced all in a span of 2 years. I don't think I'm close enough to try warn him, but I think other family members and friends of his where, and probably should. He was the ultimate responsable person, but we have friends and family for a reason; most people stay silent because it's the easy thing to do. Let me put you the question back at you this way: If you had a close female friend or sister getting back with a boyfriend that beat her up, would you tell her anything? Woman can be as abusive of men in other ways, and one should at least attempt to help them I believe. | ||
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JoeCool
Germany2517 Posts
Unfortunately I do not know how to be flirty and exchange numbers in that situation, I think it's quite difficult since she's working and needs to be professional while I'm one of the 10.000 talking to her per year. So I was thinking next time I'll see I'll go with something like "I don't need the menue, I'll take whatever you recommend" (Obviously only if I like it) and later on Ill let her know what I thought of her choice but I don't know where to go from there... I don't even know whether this a good idea. The thing is, one of my coworkers from a couple of years ago was hot as f*** and basically got asked out on a daily basis. So I kinda know how women feel in these situations... | ||
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Excludos
Norway8038 Posts
On December 28 2018 05:15 JoeCool wrote: Has anyone here experience in flirting with a waitress? Theres this restaurant in town, pretty fancy and expensive, where I eat from time to time (like 3-4 times per year). So basically each table has it's own waitress and she's taken care of me two times now. Unfortunately I do not know how to be flirty and exchange numbers in that situation, I think it's quite difficult since she's working and needs to be professional while I'm one of the 10.000 talking to her per year. So I was thinking next time I'll see I'll go with something like "I don't need the menue, I'll take whatever you recommend" (Obviously only if I like it) and later on Ill let her know what I thought of her choice but I don't know where to go from there... I don't even know whether this a good idea. The thing is, one of my coworkers from a couple of years ago was hot as f*** and basically got asked out on a daily basis. So I kinda know how women feel in these situations... The latter is my friend's experience with this as well. Basically people confuse her doing her job and smiling as flirting, and it gets tiring really quick. Her boss would probably not her appreciate flirting with customers either, so this is just a bad idea all around. I don't know how big your city is tho, but if you see her out on town one day, then by all means go for it. | ||
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Fencar
United States2694 Posts
This is for friendships as well as dating, right now the advice my therapist is giving me is to be friends with people and then just show romantic interest if I think the other person is already interested because of body language or other signs. | ||
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Excludos
Norway8038 Posts
On December 28 2018 10:58 Fencar wrote: What’s a decent methodology to become friends with and potentially start relationships with coworkers I’m interested in? I work as a math tutor and occasionally the other tutors on shift are interesting or cool, and I’d like to get to know them better but it usually seems awkward to bring up hanging out outside of our jobs, even if we have one or two common interests (which isn’t common either). This is for friendships as well as dating, right now the advice my therapist is giving me is to be friends with people and then just show romantic interest if I think the other person is already interested because of body language or other signs. Pretty much what your therapist said. Try to meet them outside of work, be it payday beer or any other get-together, and get to know them. If you click then you can go for it. Just going straight for romance can really damage the workplace environment if it doesn't work out. | ||
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Fencar
United States2694 Posts
On December 28 2018 11:28 Excludos wrote: Right, and I totally believe in that approach. I’m just not sure on the nitty gritty of how the conversations actually go and how I can approach the individual conversations if I want to pursue hanging out with a person, after I learn some stuff about them and figure out that I like the kind of person they are.Pretty much what your therapist said. Try to meet them outside of work, be it payday beer or any other get-together, and get to know them. If you click then you can go for it. Just going straight for romance can really damage the workplace environment if it doesn't work out. | ||
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Excludos
Norway8038 Posts
On December 28 2018 11:46 Fencar wrote: Right, and I totally believe in that approach. I’m just not sure on the nitty gritty of how the conversations actually go and how I can approach the individual conversations if I want to pursue hanging out with a person, after I learn some stuff about them and figure out that I like the kind of person they are. This is one of those things where the only real way to get better is to practice. The only real tip I can give is to not try to force it. People can probably read you easier than you think, and they will probably see right through you if you try to force anything romantic (I've seen all kinds of disastrous ways people have attempted this, from buying needless gifts, unnecessary touching, staring, always talking about sex, always buying drinks at the bar, etc. And 95% of the time the girl turns to her friends and rolls her eyes). This is the root of the idea of "just be yourself", because it really is that simple: Just talk to her like you would talk to any other normal person. Talk about the weather, talk about work, talk about what your interests, ask her about hers, etc etc. If you think a question is awkward before you ask it: Don't. Let the conversation unfold naturally. | ||
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