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On June 17 2011 06:48 abunai wrote:Show nested quote +On June 17 2011 05:14 jimmyjingle wrote:
have you played it? unless you really want to convince yourself otherwise, every aspect of the UI is tailored for consoles. dialog options are a Dpad. to buy something from a store you have to use wasd. cover systems, yeah. level design isn't that of a PC game.
e: still gonna buy it, i like the game. wasn't expecting something as ground breaking as DE1. Yeah, I've played it. You do not need to clone Deus Ex to re-create the experience. I really hope you aren't one of those people who consider Deus Ex perfect, there are many flaws within the game. The design is brilliant, yes, and exceeds 99% of games today, but it was far from perfect. It's a leaked beta. Maybe the dialogue UI isn't final, even if it is, you would class a game as a console game because the shape somewhat resembles a dpad? Honestly? I'll give you the store one, but they've promised integrated mouse support in the game so I'm going to assume it will be in the final build as well. Hell, towards the end of Deus Ex the branching of the levels got rather constricted and linear compared to Hell's Kitchen etc. If the beta is anything to go by, it'll take the DX formula, consistently, all the way to the end of the game.
unless you really want to convince yourself otherwise
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So after playing the leaked preview, I have to say there are lot of things great about it.
But you have all read the great reviews, so here I am to say what is wrong about the game so far.
1. The lighting is bad. Not all the parts are bad, just the dark parts (or the lack of). For example, the blinds going up in the apartment is pretty awesome. But on the other hand, there are no shadows!!! Even DX:IW had implementation of a dynamic lighting, shadows move according the light source. I don't understand why a game in 2011 will not have this feature. Another thing is vents, they are not dark at all, there are no flashlight type scenarios. That really added to the sneaky type feel to the game for me. I really hope they stripped down the graphics for the preview.
2. No physics, objects don't need all to be interactable but at least they should be movable. They are like solid lead objects that don't even move if you set off an explosion next to them. It seems a bit strange to see books and little things anchor themselves to shelves or desks when something like a rocket goes off on it. Again, games almost a decade ago had this one incorporated.
3. Needs more interactable objects. I want to buy snacks from vending machines, I want to turn on the shower. I want to use the phone etc.. Stuff you could do in DX. Right now DX:HR seems like a stripped down version of DX in the object department.
4. Levels are a tad small. Maybe because it's filled with stuff that gives that illusion. Liberty Island was pretty giantic.
If they fix up these things it'll be way more of an immersive game.
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Somewhere, TotalBiscuit is roaring in joy!
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Wait ... the levels are smaller than liberty Island and you can't move the objects ???
Wow i'm really shocked.
I expected levels at least as big than in DX and even more interaction with items and stuff :/
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On June 17 2011 07:46 Boblion wrote:
Wait ... the levels are smaller than liberty Island and you can't move the objects ???
Wow i'm really shocked.
I expected levels at least as big than in DX and even more interaction with items and stuff :/
A lot of the space in the game is just open space, it could become more Metal Gear Solid-esch.
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Well the thing is the levels seem smaller because of all the loading points. And also depends on what you call a 'level'. For example the Detroit city Hub is probably on par with the size of liberty island. Also as well it was said that Liberty Island had a lot of open space so it seems large.
They aren't small by any means by the way.
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To the people talking about how the UI is tailored for consoles, I'm pretty sure the leak is is of a PS3 version. I'm sure the PC version will have more mouse support. It's not a beta by the way, it's a leaked development build. Some features (such as lighting, vending machines etc) may not have been implemented in that build or whatever.
Reserve judgement on little things like that till release.
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well, mouse support does not a PC game make. I want to elaborate on how exactly deus ex is not a PC game and exactly why a PC is different from a console (?), but no one has asked and I feel like if i do it'll spark a fucking debate over whether PCs are different from consoles.
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Can't wait to hit the streets of Shanghai
I do wish there was more interaction, but we'll see in the actual game
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I was skeptical at first but the preview build is extremely promising. The third person stuff integrates very well with the sneak but most importantly the conventional fps-style shooting aspects, it really adds a fluidity to the motion which is hard to get in a straight up fps. The Detroit hub reminded me of a combination of VtM:Bloodlines and the original Deus Ex, which is great.
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Does anybody else experience terrible performance problems?
I don't have a new PC, quite the opposite, but it's able to run most games (like SC2, ME2,...) just fine. But Deus Ex is completely unplayeable. No matter the setting, the game lags and stutter like hell. I could play with settings all day but the result is almost the same for all kinds of resolutions, shadows, whatever.
Only if I look directly to the ground (ie there is almost nothing to display), I can move around decently...
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On June 19 2011 11:37 L0thar wrote:
Does anybody else experience terrible performance problems?
I don't have a new PC, quite the opposite, but it's able to run most games (like SC2, ME2,...) just fine. But Deus Ex is completely unplayeable. No matter the setting, the game lags and stutter like hell. I could play with settings all day but the result is almost the same for all kinds of resolutions, shadows, whatever.
Only if I look directly to the ground (ie there is almost nothing to display), I can move around decently...
it was mentioned earlier in this thread that you can't actually lower settings, but the games graphic quality also isn't finished (lol sprites where particles should be) resulting in simply shitty performance in every area. compounded with that the game hasn't been optimized and is in fact a console port, you can expect better framerates and looks after release.
mostly better framerates though.
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On June 19 2011 11:37 L0thar wrote:
Does anybody else experience terrible performance problems?
I don't have a new PC, quite the opposite, but it's able to run most games (like SC2, ME2,...) just fine. But Deus Ex is completely unplayeable. No matter the setting, the game lags and stutter like hell. I could play with settings all day but the result is almost the same for all kinds of resolutions, shadows, whatever.
Only if I look directly to the ground (ie there is almost nothing to display), I can move around decently...
Tell us your specs. I can barely run it on lowest res and all additional features turned off with:
2.4GHz Intel Core 2 Quad Q6600
4GB DDR2 RAM
256mb ATI Radeon HD 2400 Pro
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On June 17 2011 07:39 viletomato wrote:
So after playing the leaked preview, I have to say there are lot of things great about it.
But you have all read the great reviews, so here I am to say what is wrong about the game so far.
1. The lighting is bad. Not all the parts are bad, just the dark parts (or the lack of). For example, the blinds going up in the apartment is pretty awesome. But on the other hand, there are no shadows!!! Even DX:IW had implementation of a dynamic lighting, shadows move according the light source. I don't understand why a game in 2011 will not have this feature. Another thing is vents, they are not dark at all, there are no flashlight type scenarios. That really added to the sneaky type feel to the game for me. I really hope they stripped down the graphics for the preview.
2. No physics, objects don't need all to be interactable but at least they should be movable. They are like solid lead objects that don't even move if you set off an explosion next to them. It seems a bit strange to see books and little things anchor themselves to shelves or desks when something like a rocket goes off on it. Again, games almost a decade ago had this one incorporated.
3. Needs more interactable objects. I want to buy snacks from vending machines, I want to turn on the shower. I want to use the phone etc.. Stuff you could do in DX. Right now DX:HR seems like a stripped down version of DX in the object department.
4. Levels are a tad small. Maybe because it's filled with stuff that gives that illusion. Liberty Island was pretty giantic.
If they fix up these things it'll be way more of an immersive game.
Great points all.
1. Is the reason why this is a leak and no sort of proper demo or beta even. Simply put, you are not meant to see it and they didnt want you to see it because they do not want you drawing incorrect negative conclusions.
2.Im not sure this will change but it might. To be honest, I would be loathe to have to dig up a key item out of garbage because I decided to blow up a small office room. Certain things need to be anchored IMO.
3. I totally see this being expanded in the final release and agree with you on this. I spent a LOT of time experimenting with what is and isnt interactable.
4. I think graphics limitations in gaming in general is sort of to blame. As Yahtzee has said in todays gaming it takes a billion dollars just to animate a character across the fucking room. Also "size" is relative.
On Liberty island you could just run around the back, move some crates, hope onto the statue, up a ramp into the statue itself. Go up two flights of stairs and a ladder. Done. Not very big right? Well like the DRB area in human revolution, there are many MANY short routes to the same objective.
The DRB, not the opening mission, was my Liberty island. You can get in by:
Scaling buildings:
Pounding a wall down (new!)
sewers
guns!
In fact in this area there are multiple divergence and convergence points and what you perceive that you should be doing is dependant on what your character is capable of.
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On June 19 2011 11:37 L0thar wrote:
Does anybody else experience terrible performance problems?
I don't have a new PC, quite the opposite, but it's able to run most games (like SC2, ME2,...) just fine. But Deus Ex is completely unplayeable. No matter the setting, the game lags and stutter like hell. I could play with settings all day but the result is almost the same for all kinds of resolutions, shadows, whatever.
Only if I look directly to the ground (ie there is almost nothing to display), I can move around decently...
Update:
Heh, I just tried reinstalling all drivers again and turned the settings quite high...and it started working reasonably well. It still lags and stutter when I look around in new areas, but after that it's well playable.
So far, I'm really enjoying the game, probably gonna preorder it, if something won't piss me off later.
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So after extensively playing the "unofficial" version I have to say, the game feels amazing. I will wait couple of days to get more objective insight, but so far it looks I'm going to preorder the augmented version. Some thoughs, first the positive ones:
1) The game feels like mixture of the first Deus Ex and Vampire The Masquerade: Bloodlines. Which is amazing, they are both great games and I have dreamed about cyberpunk version of VTMB since the time I've played it. It's still mostly a Deus Ex game, as it should be.
2) Graphic. I think the game looks amazing. Truth is I'm pretty benevolent when it comes to graphic and more than technical perfection I care about the feel it creates. And graphic in DE:HR does almost everything right for me. The design of weapons is brilliant (!) and the world looks simple yet great. Only some faces seems quite strange, but only in minor characters. And most importantly, the graphic actually feels like really improved graphic from DE1. I have no idea how did that happen, but the style really reminds me of original Deus Ex, much more than the second one did. All in all, after all those complaints I was only pleasantly suprised by how well the graphic enhance the atmosfere.
3) The lost of 1st person perspective in some moments. Totaly non issue for me. I really don't need 1st person to get immersed. I played the original izometric RPG (Fallout, BG, Torment,...) and I was immersed to no end, why would some occasional 3rd look bother me? I've read a lot of complaints that it's not realistic for stealth gameplay, but I could also argue that the very limited field of vision granted by your screen in 1st person is not realistic either. Specially trained (and augmented) individual like Jensen should be able to make pretty decent picture about his surroundings thanks to sound, small visual clues etc. Something player obviously cannot do, so the 3rd person view is here to help simulate that.
4) The hacking minigame. Great thing, good job to everyone who designed it! I had some problems at the beginning, but when I realized you could work with multiple nodes at once, it became wondeful experience. The carefull planing at first and then the rush to finish the hacking (and take as many bonus nodes as you can) while the time is running down, with your finger on stop worm, if something goes wrong...really, just great. My only complain is that the nuke and stop worms icon are too close to capture and fortify icons, it's not hard to misclick in the rush...
5) The social aug, which helps during conversation. Another great idea, I really like it. I only wish they expand on it more, seems like it has potential. Generaly the dialogues seemed pretty well written, with little to no facepalming moments, which is a rare quality these days.
And now for some complaints:
1) No melee weapons. One of the biggest wtf in the game. Yes, there are the takedowns, but they cannot be used half the times thanks to energy consumption. And there is nothing which could for example break down a crate...aside from projectile weapons. Seriously what the hell is that? I have metal hands able to crush through a wall, but if I face bunch of wooden crates I have to shoot them down? How stupid is that?
2) No ammo for some weapons. I have sniper rifle, I also have some automatic rifle...and still I have to use the basic pistol all the time because I have no ammo for the rifles! My arms have to cost hundreds of thousands dollars, I fly everywhere in private helicopter, but my boss cannot afford to get me couple of damn bullets! It may seem like a small problem, but consider two things - your inventory space is very limited and you can find some modification for weapons. So I ended with heavily modified rifle which took lots of space in my inventory and which I almost couldn't use because there were no damn bullets. In the end I even dropped the sniper rifle, because it was useless thanks to the lack of ammo. Which is quite disheartening because the silent sniper hacker-killer is one of my favourite way to play DE. And it's not like the game is harder with the pistol, it's good enough to take out the enemy you need to, the lacks of ammo just limit your choice, which is a damn shame in a game which is otherwise filled with various choices.
3) Energy regen is implemented quite badly. It only regenerates partially depleted cells or the first cell, when everything is depleted. Which means that if you want to use invisibility, you should do it very carefully, to not deplete the whole cell. That is a good thing. Bad thing is, that one takedown deplete whole cell, efectively meaning you shouldn't use them, if you want to manage your energy effectively. Which again limits your options. They should make it that the augs allow you to regenerate more than one cell from scratch, if you decide to make the upgrade.
4) Takedowns. They are cool looking...which is good thing, DE was always cool looking, I mean look at JC Denton, trenchcoat, sun glasses and something which resemble lighsaber the most, what's not cool about that? However they are also too energy heavy and worst of all, the aren't silent. Maybe I'm doing something wrong, but they always seems too laud and disturb enemies which one bullet from silenced weapon to the head or one paralyzer shot doesn't. All in all, I used them only on very isolated enemy and only when I got one last energy cell left (because it regenerates anyway).
5) Last but not least - you cannot create a name for you save slots! I hate that crap from the bottom of my heart. When I play, I often save before some memorable moments and than after some time I can just load the position to bring back some memories. Well, it's quite hard to do that in DE, when all your saves look like "save game 1", "save game 2", etc. Very minor thing, but it pisses me off everytime I encouter it in some game.
Hmm, it seems I wrote much more than I intended and yet it feels I only scratched the surface of the game. It's really shaping up to be a great experience and while there are mistakes, they are usually very minor.
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Yea, I just found out about the dual pathing in the hacking minigame a day ago, when I hacked Mr Sarif's PC for the fun of it, was some serious business  You're right about the nuke/worm stuff, how many have i needlessly wasted in a rush, I wonder.
I don't know about your ammo dilemma but I have plenty of ammo for my sniper, as well as my other guns. There are nice secret stashes in many places, look harder 
Melee weapons, yes, that is a deep problem. Can't be helped. I heard it takes ages to animate decent animations for them on the DX forums, so they can't add it in now. I think they do regret not adding in melee weapons earlier.
I'm fine with the energy system, however, I would like some recharge bots or what not in a random corner or two, like the medbots and repair bots from number 1.
On me second playthrough (skipping last mission to avoid spoilers) on medium difficulty, found a bunch of new places, its so good  Got some good weapon mods (found a laser on this playthrough), got more praxis points this time about, experimenting with different augs (Icarus Landing System for President), this game will definitely live up to the hyperhype behind it. 2 MOAR MONTHS!!!1!
The next Facebook unlock for Deus Ex is out btw
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I don't know, I found a lot of hidden places, I'm very...obsessed with exploring everything and trying every possibility. And yet it feelt like I really don't have enough ammo to be comfortable with it. I would prefer if you could buy all types of ammo from merchants. Don't get me wrong, there are type of games which are made for scarce ammo, like survival horrors or Fallout, where is easy to imagine that postapo world wouldn't have ammo lying everywhere (yet it actually does lol). But Deus Ex is taking place in prosperous future (well, not prosperous for everybody, but you get the point). I would just prefer more easily accesible ammo for my prefered weapons, that's all.
Maybe it's not problem with the regen system, but more with the takedowns. I would appreciate if they took out only like 90% of one cell, so you could regenerate it.
Btw the last mission isn't that much spoilerific...but if you could wait for full release, props to you...I know I couldn't.
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EPT
