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[WC3] DotA beginners guide - Page 2

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Manit0u
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
Poland17868 Posts
December 25 2005 22:19 GMT
#21
Strafe: note that the beggining post was made by me quite some time ago and some of my thoughts on the matter changed (like slithern not being my favourite hero any more but magina - this might change however since I want to try out the new dota as I stopped at 6.23 I think) but most of the advice I give there will be good for younger players I think, will give them some basic clues.
Time is precious. Waste it wisely.
oPtioNaLk
Profile Joined September 2004
Korea (South)564 Posts
December 25 2005 22:41 GMT
#22
On August 20 2005 15:55 Manit0u wrote:
Due to recent requests from uidf and my lack of time I will make here a brief (at least I'll try to make it as brief as possible)guide for those who recently started/wish to start playing DotA. Everything in this guide is based solely on my own experience and some more experienced players may not agree with some parts. I'm not some uber gosu here and I am fully aware that I don't do everything as some people got used to.
This guide is only to help others start, it's not strict 'howto' that should be fallowed by word. Just read it, try it and adjust it any way it suits you.

For starters, the most important rule some tend to forget when action gets stiff: DO NOT DIE!!!
It's ok if you don't kill as long as you don't die too (the final result of 1-0 is much better than say 5-7).
It may seem hard in the beginning (especially in -ar games) so if you're not very familiar with the game yet just run away when your hero is in red and go heal (if you consider yourself slow or the pressure is big it's better to start running in orange).
The only exception for this rule is when your friend needs help and you're able to give it. This is for more experienced players though since those of less skill tend to get killed along with their teammates which is very bad.

Now the second most important part: hero choice. (we'll consider it to be an -ap game)

Most beginners after few games think that most powerful heroes are:
Lich
Venomancer
Crystal Maiden
Lion
Slayer
(remind me if I forgot any)

You can't be more wrong, those are the weakest heroes late game, very easy to counter mid game and moderately easy to avoid early game (more on this in tactics).

When picking a hero try get your hands on some melee hero (preferably with str as primary attribute). Yes, they are the hardest to master and play but they pwn late game and by playing them you'll learn faster (after playing melee early, later on when you get ranged hero it'll be extremely easy for you to play it).

Some good choices:
Slithern guard - my personal favourite, 2 disablers, speed increase for running away or chasing wounded foe
Sven - needless to say this guy deals the most damage in the game
Leoric - good for beginners, easily countered by magina though
Naix - supreme pwnzor, very hard to play early game, requires different build

Another important issue: items

This will be hard to explain since most heroes require different items to work at their best. What I usually buy for melee hero is:

Boots of speed
Ring of health
Sange (only if hero hasn't got some orb effect himself)
Power treads

From now on things differ for matchup and hero.

If enemies have many casters go for black king bar instead of sange.
After buying your first weapon go for some defence, blademail (good vs sven and melee), aegis of the immortal (just pwns but awfully expensive), heart of torrasque etc.
and then more weapons.
Do not buy stuff you won't use later in the game (ring of regeneration, etc. - unless of course you're playing a hero that requires to do so - Naix and Magina for instance) it's waste of cash, go straight for the goodies.
As an example I'll give here the list of items I had in my last game (played slithern guard)
power treads, sange & jasha, aegis of the immortal, blademail, cranium basher, burize do-kyanon

You'll have to experiment a bit with items to see how it works.

Now some basic tactics:

Early game - try to stay out of the fight, just farm. When you're hurt go heal (better to lose some exp by not being there than lose cash, feed oponent and not be there too). Whenever you see more than one enemy going for you: run.

Countering casters - early game: nothing you can do about them, just try to avoid them. mid game: get black king bar, it makes all their skills useless. late game: laugh at them as they try to do something to you with their ~500dmg spells.

Countering melee - blademail, disablers (stunning is best, bashers work wonders, also sange with maim is good).

Countering invisible - those are real pain in the ass but simple gem rends them useless (if you think you'll die anyway then don't buy gem, go for wards).

Switching lines - something most beginners forget, when you see you can't deal with enemies on your line - switch with teammate who's got hero better suited for the job.

Gangbangs - you must remember that mid-late game it's all gangbangs, you'll rarely have a chance to fight 1on1. Just try to stay together with your team at all times and be ready to run at any sign of enemy.

It's all just a bunch of loose advice. If I forgot about anything and anyone would have any questions then ask them here and I'll try to answer them.

Good luck and have fun >


Manitou, I disagree with a lot of stuff in this guide. For instance, those intel heroes you mentioned in the beginning can be extremely powerful mid and late game. Almost all of those heroes have disabling abilities, which are quite useful when in ganking and teaming situations. The Naix just plain sucks. It's good in public games where there's no teamwork and all you do is go around killing people one on one.

About items; Ring of Regen is actually extremely useful even if you're not going to keep it for late game. The item is great for melee heroes because with ranged heroes constantly harassing early game, you will lose exp and gold going back to heal. With RoR you can stay, gain exp and even harass the ranged heroes a bit.
Heen
Profile Blog Joined November 2003
Korea (South)2178 Posts
Last Edited: 2005-12-25 23:02:34
December 25 2005 22:57 GMT
#23
Don't play Sven; he's a boring slow ass bitch. He's such a faggot. I can honestly say he's the most boring hero in dota and that he should be taken out next patch.

It's true that heroes have their strengths throughout the different stages of the game but if you play well the whole game, you usually overcome those 'disadvantages' with items/lvl.

how to end a game in 5 min:

pick chen and teleport your allies if they are green or yellow

and having lot of hp is far less important than damage/attack speed. so to anyone who suggested getting 4 heart of tarrasques.. don't ever do that again. 1 heart is enough.]

edit/ps: sven's an ugly cocksucker
('''(G_G/'''')
LastWish
Profile Blog Joined September 2004
2015 Posts
December 26 2005 03:06 GMT
#24
Base Play :
As u start the first(or one of the first) thing u should buy is Boots of speed.
Next u should buy eigher healing potions or save money for ring of health.
For heroes that do not need Battle Fury or Perserverence for something I suppose it much better to get Headdress of Rejuvation, which is cheaper but does regenerate as much Hp as ring + aura effect (+2 regen, +2 aura regen).
Corridors with 2 heroes may go for both Headdress of Rejuvation and Ring of Bassilus to get as much aura to maximize effect.
Next Items usually depend on heroes, but if u are not sure making Power threads almost never hurts(unless u are int hero and plan to go Boots of Travel). Another thing that is good for everyone is Hands of Midas(can turn creep into gold(+100 gold) and +25% increased attack speed) - this item repays itself when u use it a longer time.
Tactic - don\'t try to fight too much at the start, rather than gaining money for killing creeps(try to make killing hits only if u are not ranged) or trying to kill an enemy hero, try to stay alive with as much hp as possible as long as u can. With some heroes (like Naix) there is no other way, u must just stay behind and exp for higher levels(sometimes even up to 10 if opponents hero is too abusing).
Bracer vs Wraithband vs Null talisman - I think Wraithband is useless, it is eigher u need more mana or more Hp; +6 agi makes almost no difference(even for agi hero); don\'t make null talisman for Intelligence heroes rather go for eul\'s sceper, perserverence or oblivion staff.
Remember if u die a few times at the beginning(hopefully to bad luck and skilled enemies not to your own lameness) it is not that bad and u may recover. But if u die many times around higher levels it may put u behind seriously.

Intelligence Heroes :
Usually start to dominate around 6th level and start to get weaker and weaker after 16th level(there some exceptions like Enchantress)
Items :
Scythe of Vyse - is good for every intelligence hero, not only does it give +60 dmg and a lot of mana and regen, u gain hex(turning units/heroes into sheep).
Aghanims Scepter - some heroes can have they ultimate improved by this item it also gives some mana and Hp
Dagon - There comes a certain point in a intelligence hero Life where u must chose a path of physical damage(items that do damage, note you will be behind in attack speed/Hp compared to
Agi and Strenth heroes) or u chose magic damage where Dagon is the choice. Yes It is expensive but in the end it does 800 damage with cooldown like 30 seconds.
Necromotion - If u are facing enemy mages this may be the right item. By making this item you may summon two specialized units who have kind of anti-mage spells.
Linkens Sphere - should not be the first item u build, but gives a lot of regeneration(both mana and hp), some hp and mana and spell block every 60 seconds(good for heroes who need too many mana like Tinker).
Eye of Skadi(orb) - Gives a lot of mana and Hp, frost attack. Really expensive items, if u have a lot of money and need more mana/hp, this is the item for you.
Agility Heroes :
Ranged vs Melee : Ranged are good from the beggining, Melee seem to lack power vs strenth in the end.
Items :
Damage items : Desolator(orb), Burize, Monkey Kings bar, Radiance, Battle Fury
Radiance and Battle Fury should both be build only by melee heroes
!Warning - don\'t build orb items if u have orb effect already and u are not sure which one will work!
Sange&Yasha(orb) - I say sange and yasha is good for everyone(10% movement speed bonus may come handy to anyone), but it doesn\'t give too much damage so i suppose to build only with
heroes that already have sufficient damage/attack speed to at least earn some money.
Basher - I think that every agi hero that has a decent attack speed should lategames have at least one Basher.
Manta Style(orb) - preferably vs mages with heroes that have decent attack speed and supported by basher. A must have for Phantom lancer.
Mask Of Maddness(orb) - a questionable item, gives some life steal a lot of attack speed and 15% movement speed for a short time. Can be used to catch up a weak enemy or on the other hand to escape when u are low on Hp. May be good to combine with basher. But for most heroes that urgently need attack speed and already have orb effect I suggest Hyperstone.
Strenth Heroes :
Common thinking with there heroes should be - gaining some Strenth early to even up the battle vs mages. U may gain strenth by making a few bracers and then make some Damage item, later returning to some strenth items.
Strenth Items :
Sange&Yasha(orb);
Black King Bar - Avatar; i suggest making vs pesky mages, if there is a Enchantress that is hard to kill i suggest thi item.
Heart of Tarrasque vs Satanique - Heart gives more Hp and regen, but Satanic gives a lot life steal and death pact(though not so important). I mostly prefer Heart over Satanic, and rather build some other orb effect or secondary mask of maddness. Though both Tiny(Stone Giant) and Bristleback benefit greatly from Satanic.

Lategames :
Most intelligence heroes become weak, due to Heroes have a lot of Hp and Aegis of Immortal which apart from other effects gives a 35% magic resistance.
Stuns and massive Spells are key to win. Treant Protector\'s overgrowth, Poison Nova, Reverse Polarity, Song of Siren, ChonoSphere are the spells that decide the winner.
If your team doesn\'t have any Stun, you should build a Scythe of Vyse or Basher(sometimes even two) if your attack speed is sufficient.
Defending is a good strategy, waiting for your opponent to do mistake and then taking advantege of it by destroying his base in one-attack(common ending of lategames).

Feel free to ask for advice about any hero, item, spell or ability...
- It's all just treason - They bring me down with their lies - Don't know the reason - My life is fire and ice -
{ToT}Strafe
Profile Blog Joined October 2004
Thailand7026 Posts
December 26 2005 03:22 GMT
#25
Wow lastwish, piece of crap. sorry;)
phiwha
Profile Joined June 2004
United States158 Posts
December 26 2005 03:58 GMT
#26
so many things wrong with your post Lastwish, I dont know where to start =(
oPtioNaLk
Profile Joined September 2004
Korea (South)564 Posts
December 26 2005 04:33 GMT
#27
I still miss 5.84 -_-
Heen
Profile Blog Joined November 2003
Korea (South)2178 Posts
December 26 2005 11:15 GMT
#28
Combat:

Just get damage items -_-;

power treads
basher
buriza
monkey king bar

Caster:

Aghanium if it helps you
Dagon 5
Refresher orb

both setups cast a shitload of money AND leaves you with space for other items which are usually (bracer/bands/talismans)

and boots arent all that necessary, especially for heros who dont die, like keeper of the light, who can start out with ring of basilius and a chicken (if it's ar)

dota is a simple game anyways. the only 'skill' involved is choosing when to fight.
('''(G_G/'''')
{ToT}Strafe
Profile Blog Joined October 2004
Thailand7026 Posts
December 26 2005 11:16 GMT
#29
lol heen, my team will kill you under 25 minutes
Heen
Profile Blog Joined November 2003
Korea (South)2178 Posts
Last Edited: 2005-12-26 12:35:07
December 26 2005 12:27 GMT
#30
I really doubt that.

but I'm in Korea so I'm not sure if we'll ever get to play each other fairly :-O
('''(G_G/'''')
Judicator
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
United States7270 Posts
December 26 2005 13:30 GMT
#31
On December 26 2005 07:57 Heen wrote:
Don't play Sven; he's a boring slow ass bitch. He's such a faggot. I can honestly say he's the most boring hero in dota and that he should be taken out next patch.

It's true that heroes have their strengths throughout the different stages of the game but if you play well the whole game, you usually overcome those 'disadvantages' with items/lvl.

how to end a game in 5 min:

pick chen and teleport your allies if they are green or yellow

and having lot of hp is far less important than damage/attack speed. so to anyone who suggested getting 4 heart of tarrasques.. don't ever do that again. 1 heart is enough.]

edit/ps: sven's an ugly cocksucker

4 hearts is overdoing it for some, although messing around with pudge is kind of fun, and yes I know there are better items for those slots but its fun though
Get it by your hands...
RivetHead
Profile Joined March 2005
United States842 Posts
December 26 2005 14:25 GMT
#32
shit i miss 5.84 so much, i hate this 6.27b shit. i think im too used to the old ways, although i have been playing a shitload of dota lately. there are some balance issues to fix with some of hte heros, and the agi heros seem a lot weaker then tehy used to be. plus the pathing is retarded.

as for early game items, i almost never buy boots first. usually go for some circlets and 3 agi/str/int items and a branch or water
I *heart* bisu, nada, mind, and the lakers
IntoTheWow
Profile Blog Joined May 2004
is awesome32282 Posts
December 26 2005 16:11 GMT
#33
I do the same Rivet

The ursa has been nerfed so much ; [ now hes not the low lever assasin he sued to be...
Moderator<:3-/-<
{ToT}Strafe
Profile Blog Joined October 2004
Thailand7026 Posts
December 26 2005 23:16 GMT
#34
agility heroes are still fucking good? sorry if its more balanced now
Ethenielle
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Norway1006 Posts
December 27 2005 00:34 GMT
#35
My eyes bleed when I see the word Dota
Theres a fine line between fishing and just standing on the shore like an idiot.
LastWish
Profile Blog Joined September 2004
2015 Posts
December 27 2005 01:58 GMT
#36
If u are interested Strafe we can arrange a 5v5 ar/ap dota. Just get your team and after New Year we may play. Though I still think it would be a waste of time assuming from your previous posts...
- It's all just treason - They bring me down with their lies - Don't know the reason - My life is fire and ice -
{ToT}Strafe
Profile Blog Joined October 2004
Thailand7026 Posts
December 27 2005 02:02 GMT
#37
im currently number one with my team on northrend <3
Manit0u
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
Poland17868 Posts
December 27 2005 02:43 GMT
#38
I wanna obs it
Time is precious. Waste it wisely.
OverTheUnder
Profile Blog Joined November 2004
United States2929 Posts
December 27 2005 03:05 GMT
#39
Strafe, i'm lookin for a team thats doing Cal or Esl, or is just good in general;O

I have your name and everything i just need to figure out the time zone difference so i know when to get on. I'm in US , central time.

And yes, im pretty sure i'll be good enough but we will see;)
Honor would be taking it up the ass and curing all diseases, damn how stupid can people get. -baal http://puertoricanbw.ytmnd.com/
{ToT}Strafe
Profile Blog Joined October 2004
Thailand7026 Posts
December 27 2005 03:26 GMT
#40
its like 6/7 hours earlier for you, and im usually on till 3 am so it shouldnt be a problem really;)
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