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On March 23 2011 00:56 MassHysteria wrote:Show nested quote +On March 22 2011 23:43 pinkranger15 wrote:sad to see Rudy Gay out for the rest of the season.  just watched True NBA about Bill Russell and Brian Shaw (candidate for the next head coach of the LA Lakers). really love the quote of Bill Russell "if you like to, don't give it up, you don't have to give it up. because inspite of everything, i want you to remember one thing, you can do anything that you wanna do, if you wanna do it bad enough. "just knew that Bill Russell gave the Celtics 6 consecutive rings and 2 back-to-back championship as the Celtic Head Coach. and i might add that Russell just recently received a Medal of Freedom (highest medal a civilian can have). the first NBA player to receive such honor. Bill Russell, you are my new hero And he was also a player-coach for his last few years (don't know if that is what you meant). First African-American coach in fact. He was an awesome defender and shot-blocking machine from what I have seen. He got like 40 rebounds in the finals, twice.
yup, that's what i meant :p i wish i'd seen him play in his prime and watch his success. very very inspirational.
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On March 22 2011 10:38 cLutZ wrote:
The real problem with the DRose debate is that the fact is that LeBron is the real MVP, but no one wants to give it to him for 3 reasons, 2 of which are objective.
1. He is "evil" for leaving Cleveland (subjective).
2. He has not won a ring despite having the best record in the NBA 2 seasons running (objective).
3. This would be an NBA 3-Peat, the only others who have done this are Bill Russel, Wilt Chamberlain, and Larry Bird. The first two 3-peats were earned during a time in the league when it was basically uncompetitive and Bird had won a title already. Some greats who were denied a 3-peat as MVP: Jordan, Kareem, Magic (objective).
Also, if you take Lebron off the heat, they aren't terrible.
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LeBron is the best player in the NBA, but he isn't the MVP this season. If Miami would of won had the best record in the NBA this season or 2nd he would of won it again IMO.
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On March 23 2011 02:26 iDoMiNaTe2.0 wrote:
LeBron is the best player in the NBA, but he isn't the MVP this season. If Miami would of won had the best record in the NBA this season or 2nd he would of won it again IMO.
How can you seriously say that in the fact of Malone's 1997 MVP? Jordan was better that year than any of Lebron's years, and Malone was worse than the other MVP candidates this year.
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this whole, "His teammates were injured and they are still winning !" is getting old, okay yea, Boozer and Noah both went down, but guess who went down for the other great teams, Dirk, Bynum, Perkins (Shaq). Other front courts for 50 win teams were also injured, and injuries are a common part of sports, shut the fuck up about injuries and their impact on a team/mvp chances, it should have no bearing whatsoever.
How about d-rose shooting an abysmal 26% from three point land lately, those are Rondo numbers right there. How about Rose shooting under 40% for march? He is a great player, but theres nothing outside of michael wilbons hype that says Rose deserves MVP over other true contenders (Durant, Dirk, Lebron)
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On March 23 2011 04:36 Holcan wrote:
this whole, "His teammates were injured and they are still winning !" is getting old, okay yea, Boozer and Noah both went down, but guess who went down for the other great teams, Dirk, Bynum, Perkins (Shaq). Other front courts for 50 win teams were also injured, and injuries are a common part of sports, shut the fuck up about injuries and their impact on a team/mvp chances, it should have no bearing whatsoever.
How about d-rose shooting an abysmal 26% from three point land lately, those are Rondo numbers right there. How about Rose shooting under 40% for march? He is a great player, but theres nothing outside of michael wilbons hype that says Rose deserves MVP over other true contenders (Durant, Dirk, Lebron)
Alright alright jeez we'll give it to dwight this year, happy?
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On March 23 2011 04:16 cLutZ wrote:Show nested quote +On March 23 2011 02:26 iDoMiNaTe2.0 wrote:
LeBron is the best player in the NBA, but he isn't the MVP this season. If Miami would of won had the best record in the NBA this season or 2nd he would of won it again IMO. Malone was worse than the other MVP candidates this year.
Yes, I'd definitely take 2011 Dirk or Rose over Malone's 27/10/5 (55% FG) with first-team All-NBA defense and 0 games missed. Get real.
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On March 23 2011 04:42 BalliSLife wrote:Show nested quote +On March 23 2011 04:36 Holcan wrote:
this whole, "His teammates were injured and they are still winning !" is getting old, okay yea, Boozer and Noah both went down, but guess who went down for the other great teams, Dirk, Bynum, Perkins (Shaq). Other front courts for 50 win teams were also injured, and injuries are a common part of sports, shut the fuck up about injuries and their impact on a team/mvp chances, it should have no bearing whatsoever.
How about d-rose shooting an abysmal 26% from three point land lately, those are Rondo numbers right there. How about Rose shooting under 40% for march? He is a great player, but theres nothing outside of michael wilbons hype that says Rose deserves MVP over other true contenders (Durant, Dirk, Lebron) Alright alright jeez we'll give it to dwight this year, happy?
He could honestly get it, its the worst team he has had to deal with in years, and he will somehow make them reach the 50 win plateau, when you look at the fact he is only 6 games behind with a much worse bench, and a much worse coach, you can make a damn good argument to why dwight deserves the award.
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On March 23 2011 04:44 city42 wrote:Show nested quote +On March 23 2011 04:16 cLutZ wrote:On March 23 2011 02:26 iDoMiNaTe2.0 wrote:
LeBron is the best player in the NBA, but he isn't the MVP this season. If Miami would of won had the best record in the NBA this season or 2nd he would of won it again IMO. Malone was worse than the other MVP candidates this year. Yes, I'd definitely take 2011 Dirk or Rose over Malone's 27/10/5 (55% FG) with first-team All-NBA defense and 0 games missed. Get real.
Stockton was the best player on that team.
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On March 23 2011 04:57 cLutZ wrote:Show nested quote +On March 23 2011 04:44 city42 wrote:On March 23 2011 04:16 cLutZ wrote:On March 23 2011 02:26 iDoMiNaTe2.0 wrote:
LeBron is the best player in the NBA, but he isn't the MVP this season. If Miami would of won had the best record in the NBA this season or 2nd he would of won it again IMO. Malone was worse than the other MVP candidates this year. Yes, I'd definitely take 2011 Dirk or Rose over Malone's 27/10/5 (55% FG) with first-team All-NBA defense and 0 games missed. Get real. Stockton was the best player on that team.
even if that was true how does that diminish Malone's MVP year? What a team only deserves 1 top of the line guy and having 2 "diminishes" the other? Who started that nonsense anyway.
@Holcan: I agree with everything except much worse coach. Stan Van Gundy is one of the best.
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On March 23 2011 05:07 Ace wrote:Show nested quote +On March 23 2011 04:57 cLutZ wrote:On March 23 2011 04:44 city42 wrote:On March 23 2011 04:16 cLutZ wrote:On March 23 2011 02:26 iDoMiNaTe2.0 wrote:
LeBron is the best player in the NBA, but he isn't the MVP this season. If Miami would of won had the best record in the NBA this season or 2nd he would of won it again IMO. Malone was worse than the other MVP candidates this year. Yes, I'd definitely take 2011 Dirk or Rose over Malone's 27/10/5 (55% FG) with first-team All-NBA defense and 0 games missed. Get real. Stockton was the best player on that team. even if that was true how does that diminish Malone's MVP year? What a team only deserves 1 top of the line guy and having 2 "diminishes" the other? Who started that nonsense anyway. @Holcan: I agree with everything except much worse coach. Stan Van Gundy is one of the best.
Because it was Jordan's MVP year and Malone winning was a travesty.
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I just looked at the standings, did you guys know that the Bulls are 19-15 on the road and 31-4(!) at home? Does any contending team need home court more than them? Also, I'm a little lazy right now, but I'd love to see their strength of schedule numbers.
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On March 23 2011 05:07 Ace wrote:Show nested quote +On March 23 2011 04:57 cLutZ wrote:On March 23 2011 04:44 city42 wrote:On March 23 2011 04:16 cLutZ wrote:On March 23 2011 02:26 iDoMiNaTe2.0 wrote:
LeBron is the best player in the NBA, but he isn't the MVP this season. If Miami would of won had the best record in the NBA this season or 2nd he would of won it again IMO. Malone was worse than the other MVP candidates this year. Yes, I'd definitely take 2011 Dirk or Rose over Malone's 27/10/5 (55% FG) with first-team All-NBA defense and 0 games missed. Get real. Stockton was the best player on that team. even if that was true how does that diminish Malone's MVP year? What a team only deserves 1 top of the line guy and having 2 "diminishes" the other? Who started that nonsense anyway. @Holcan: I agree with everything except much worse coach. Stan Van Gundy is one of the best.
I guess you missed the series that Stan Van decided to go with Jameer Nelson, instead of the player who got them to the finals :D.
Stan Vans offense is shit, its essentially post dwight, pass out, repost, shoot a three. Defensively he is mediocre, and doesnt really hold a candle to Lawrence Frank, Tom Thibideau, Brian Shaw or any of the other teams with great defensive schemes. I respect your opinion tons, so id like to see hear why you think Stan Van is one of the best, but personally i think he isn't good at all, and are a big reason for the failures of Orlando the past 3 years in the post season.
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Because he's gotten as much as he can out of that roster. I think he's above average as a coach in terms of teaching since you rarely see Orlando make major mistakes during the game. However my major reason for calling him one of the top is that he's very good at managing his players. An underrated skill in the NBA but super important is for a coach to be able to handle the players, the media, and the criticism. I've heard Van Gundy explain losses and wins, take blame for a lot of things himself and stand up for his players a ton.
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United States22883 Posts
I've come to the realization that caring about the MVP is a waste of time. The voters don't watch every team's games and there isn't a consistent rubric for what's deserving of it. It has very little relevance to the actual description of being most valuable to your team's success.
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On March 23 2011 05:57 Ace wrote:
Because he's gotten as much as he can out of that roster. I think he's above average as a coach in terms of teaching since you rarely see Orlando make major mistakes during the game. However my major reason for calling him one of the top is that he's very good at managing his players. An underrated skill in the NBA but super important is for a coach to be able to handle the players, the media, and the criticism. I've heard Van Gundy explain losses and wins, take blame for a lot of things himself and stand up for his players a ton.
If the last sentence is what makes you one of the best coaches, then Jay Triano is top tier. However I still stand beside my statement that its the set-ups you run on the court that distinguish a good coach from a great coach. Not being able to control your players, or being unable to use the media correctly means you shouldnt have a job, at all.
As for the strength of Orlandos mental game, it goes down in the playoffs when they play teams that are just as mentally tough, and Turkoglu, oh god, Turkoglu .
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I've never thought of Jay Triano as a player personnel kind of coach. Maybe I'm still tainted by the whole Chris Bosh scenario.
Orlando's playoffs struggles - good point I completely forgot. Some...shocking performances to say the least.
Besides, Phil Jackson, Greg P and Sloan who are your top 5 coaches in the NBA if:
1.) You have a young team
2.) You have a team in contention for the playoffs and/or title
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1. Young Team
a. Scott Skiles, but only for 2 years before he drove all my players insane
b. Tom Thibodeau
c. Rick Carlisle
d. Nate Mcmillan
e. Rick Adelman
2. Contender
a. Rick Carlisle
b. Rick Adelman
c. Nate Mcmillan
d. Flip Saunders
e. George Karl
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No Lawrence Frank anywhere on that list? 
I'd put Larry Brown strictly in the contention area.
Thibs, Carlisle, Nate are locks for young team. Adelman is good but I'm not sure where I put him.
Skiles...I think you have to give him vets for him to reach his top potential.
Flip Saunders and George Carl are locks for vets too. Good picks.
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Apparently, no one can stand Scott Skiles but he seems to drill defense really well and his players seem to remember. I don't think a veteran team would put up with him though. Yeah Lawrence Frank is good and Scotty Brooks too...didn't think about them too much.
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EPT
