• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 09:32
CEST 15:32
KST 22:32
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL21] Ro16 Preview Pt1: Fresh Flow5[ASL21] Ro24 Preview Pt2: News Flash10[ASL21] Ro24 Preview Pt1: New Chaos0Team Liquid Map Contest #22 - Presented by Monster Energy21ByuL: The Forgotten Master of ZvT30
Community News
MaNa leaves Team Liquid13$5,000 WardiTV TLMC tournament - Presented by Monster Energy5GSL CK: More events planned pending crowdfunding7Weekly Cups (May 30-Apr 5): herO, Clem, SHIN win0[BSL22] RO32 Group Stage5
StarCraft 2
General
MaNa leaves Team Liquid Team Liquid Map Contest #22 - Presented by Monster Energy Quebec Clan still alive ? BGE Stara Zagora 2026 cancelled Blizzard Classic Cup @ BlizzCon 2026 - $100k prize pool
Tourneys
Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament $5,000 WardiTV TLMC tournament - Presented by Monster Energy RSL Revival: Season 5 - Qualifiers and Main Event GSL CK: More events planned pending crowdfunding Sea Duckling Open (Global, Bronze-Diamond)
Strategy
Custom Maps
[D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3 [A] Nemrods 1/4 players [M] (2) Frigid Storage
External Content
Mutation # 521 Memorable Boss The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 520 Moving Fees Mutation # 519 Inner Power
Brood War
General
ASL21 General Discussion [ASL21] Ro16 Preview Pt1: Fresh Flow BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ JD's Ro24 review The Korean Terminology Thread
Tourneys
[ASL21] Ro16 Group A Escore Tournament StarCraft Season 2 [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [ASL21] Ro24 Group F
Strategy
Any training maps people recommend? Fighting Spirit mining rates Muta micro map competition What's the deal with APM & what's its true value
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread Battle Aces/David Kim RTS Megathread General RTS Discussion Thread Starcraft Tabletop Miniature Game
Dota 2
The Story of Wings Gaming Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
G2 just beat GenG in First stand
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas TL Mafia Community Thread Five o'clock TL Mafia
Community
General
Canadian Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread US Politics Mega-thread The China Politics Thread
Fan Clubs
The IdrA Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
[Manga] One Piece [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books Movie Discussion!
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion Cricket [SPORT] Tokyo Olympics 2021 Thread
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
[G] How to Block Livestream Ads
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
lurker extra damage testi…
StaticNine
How Streamers Inspire Gamers…
TrAiDoS
Broowar part 2
qwaykee
Funny Nicknames
LUCKY_NOOB
Iranian anarchists: organize…
XenOsky
ASL S21 English Commentary…
namkraft
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 2508 users

Magic: The Gathering - Page 76

Forum Index > General Games
Post a Reply
Prev 1 74 75 76 77 78 665 Next
Judicator
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
United States7270 Posts
October 06 2011 17:22 GMT
#1501
Has anyone tried the non-draw go version of Solar Flare? Basically, the Doom Blades/GftTs over Leaks/Dissipate?
Get it by your hands...
slyboogie
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States3423 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-06 18:26:14
October 06 2011 18:12 GMT
#1502
First, I should preface this by saying that my constructed play skill and deck building is lame. But I did help the owner at my local store play test a while. He had me play RDW and Tezzeret against his Solar Flare with: 4 Mana Leaks, 1 Dissipate, 4 Doomblades.

Why would a Solar Flare player tap out in the first 2-3 turns? Isn't there room enough for the counters and the black removal? What goes in place of the counters in the non-draw-go version of Solar Flare?

EDIT: Oh, I guess you could Ponder turn 1 or 2? That's not too bad.

EDIT EDIT: And Dead Weights against RDW? That's not the worst thing ever either. I think you'd still run the counters though >_>
"We dug coal together." Boyd Crowder, Justified
Judicator
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
United States7270 Posts
October 06 2011 19:25 GMT
#1503
The reason I ask is because the match up against Tempered Steel is like a free win for Tempered unless I draw the nuts. BSZ/Dead Weight/Day does shit against them post-board if they board correctly. Literally right now, none of the other aggro decks give me fits, but the TS matchup is #terrible. I feel like if take out the control cards, my matchups against some of the control decks go way down.

In either case, when I am boarding against aggro, my counters come out (all of them).

After thinking about it, I think I just need to tune my board for more anti-TS aggro.

And Ponders are ass without someway of consistently shuffling. I smile every time someone plays that card turn 1 right now. Also, Revokes are ass, it doesn't hit the one card I need to hit in Solar, which is that Inkmoth Nexus.
Get it by your hands...
Orpheos
Profile Joined April 2010
United States1663 Posts
October 06 2011 19:32 GMT
#1504
what percentages do you think you have against TS game one? and how much can sideboarding help against them?

you might just want to pray for game one and then go all in on game 2+3.

then again it seems RDW is going to be a big part of the new meta, so Im sure you can find some overlap hate to put in the maindeck
slyboogie
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States3423 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-06 19:46:24
October 06 2011 19:45 GMT
#1505
If you are literally dying all the time to Inkmoth Nexus, then you should just bite the bullet and board in Divine Offering. And I guess Misstep might have a place in the matchup, dunno, I don't play Tempered Steel.
"We dug coal together." Boyd Crowder, Justified
Judicator
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
United States7270 Posts
October 06 2011 19:48 GMT
#1506
On October 07 2011 04:32 Orpheos wrote:
what percentages do you think you have against TS game one? and how much can sideboarding help against them?

you might just want to pray for game one and then go all in on game 2+3.

then again it seems RDW is going to be a big part of the new meta, so Im sure you can find some overlap hate to put in the maindeck


Game 1 is free, I know that already unless I turn 3 Alchemy the nuts. RDW isn't a problem and I can actually squeeze out wins at times against them game 1 and post-board it's actually like 6-4 in my favor (I bring in at least 6 hate cards depending on the build).

Tempered is completely different namely because the number of cards that dodges sorcery speed removal, especially post-board.

I'll tweak it some more.
Get it by your hands...
Risen
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States7927 Posts
October 06 2011 20:04 GMT
#1507
On October 07 2011 04:48 Judicator wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 07 2011 04:32 Orpheos wrote:
what percentages do you think you have against TS game one? and how much can sideboarding help against them?

you might just want to pray for game one and then go all in on game 2+3.

then again it seems RDW is going to be a big part of the new meta, so Im sure you can find some overlap hate to put in the maindeck


Game 1 is free, I know that already unless I turn 3 Alchemy the nuts. RDW isn't a problem and I can actually squeeze out wins at times against them game 1 and post-board it's actually like 6-4 in my favor (I bring in at least 6 hate cards depending on the build).

Tempered is completely different namely because the number of cards that dodges sorcery speed removal, especially post-board.

I'll tweak it some more.


This is going to sound bad. I feel like this is bad, but you sound desperate and I can sympathize with Revoke being ass against TS b/c of inkmoth. So you killed the TS, great, you're still on one hell of a clock, and odds are if TS resolved you're now at minimum 3 poison b/c inkmoth got in as a 3/3.

Now onto the bad. Side rebuke? God it's a 3 mana removal, though T_T There's so many Tempered steel decks where I play...
Pufftrees Everyday>its like a rifter that just used X-Factor/Liquid'Nony: I hope no one lip read XD/Holyflare>it's like policy lynching but better/Resident Los Angeles bachelor
Judicator
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
United States7270 Posts
October 06 2011 20:11 GMT
#1508
Nah, if I was that worried, I would just board hard against Tempered. Go Virulent Wound/Grim Affliction. I am just wondering if anyone tried a different from of Solar Flare than the pass-go version I was playing.
Get it by your hands...
DCLXVI
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
United States729 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-06 20:55:40
October 06 2011 20:50 GMT
#1509
On October 07 2011 05:11 Judicator wrote:
Nah, if I was that worried, I would just board hard against Tempered. Go Virulent Wound/Grim Affliction. I am just wondering if anyone tried a different from of Solar Flare than the pass-go version I was playing.

I have been messing around with 4x leak 1x dissipate if that counts as draw go..
2x timely 2x Day main deck make the red match up fine as long as they don't get too many koths/phoenixes. I don't see much tempered steel as RDW in my area so I keep the hate in the sideboard - Divine offering and O ring. I do play doom blades instead of GftT as i can answer grave titan with most of my other spells.
I don't see the advantage of going more aggressive than reactionary early game as it is quite nice to sit on 2/3 mana with leak/think2 and dissapate/forbidden. As nice as turn 3 lilliana is, unless I have a answer for what they might play I would rather wait. I don't think the deck can go over the top fast enough to not warrant playing counters.

Do you play Gideons? I've had people advise me to not do so or cut back on him, but since I have two and I love him I play both.
I can already see the ending
deth2munkies
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States4051 Posts
October 06 2011 21:05 GMT
#1510
Ghost Quarter also kills Inkmoth Nexus dead and fixes your mana if you have some duals that can't get played. I'd put 1-2 in.
MCMcEmcee
Profile Joined April 2008
United States1609 Posts
October 06 2011 21:32 GMT
#1511
Gut Shot.
[iHs]MCMcEmcee@UFO | のヮの
dignity
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Canada908 Posts
October 06 2011 22:33 GMT
#1512
Gut shot or even marrow shards. If they attack without any sort of defense booster marrow shards will just wipe their board.
Cel.erity
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States4890 Posts
October 06 2011 22:40 GMT
#1513
On October 07 2011 06:05 deth2munkies wrote:
Ghost Quarter also kills Inkmoth Nexus dead and fixes your mana if you have some duals that can't get played. I'd put 1-2 in.


Ghost Quarter is going to be a mandatory 2-3 of in control I think, since every land in the format crushes you harder than before. Although I suppose it depends on your build, if you have enough pressure you might be able to live without it.
We found Dove in a soapless place.
slyboogie
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States3423 Posts
October 06 2011 22:47 GMT
#1514
On October 07 2011 06:32 MCMcEmcee wrote:
Gut Shot.


No man. Mortapod.
"We dug coal together." Boyd Crowder, Justified
MCMcEmcee
Profile Joined April 2008
United States1609 Posts
October 06 2011 23:31 GMT
#1515
On October 07 2011 07:47 slyboogie wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 07 2011 06:32 MCMcEmcee wrote:
Gut Shot.


No man. Mortarpod.


mortarpod is good too but gut shot is a free instant
[iHs]MCMcEmcee@UFO | のヮの
Judicator
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
United States7270 Posts
October 06 2011 23:44 GMT
#1516
On October 07 2011 06:05 deth2munkies wrote:
Ghost Quarter also kills Inkmoth Nexus dead and fixes your mana if you have some duals that can't get played. I'd put 1-2 in.


Ghost Quarter is terrible in tri-color decks, I would just cut Days for BSZ at that point.

As for Marrow Shards/Gut Shot, the life payment is relevant in the match up and 1 damage isn't that good.

As for Gideon, I am going to try him out as a one of out of the board.

As for going reactionary, all of my counter-spells come out post-board, there's no reason to hang to them at all. They put legitimate threats on the board before counter-spells matter and the match up is terrible as is.

I don't play Timely main. My main is suited against control decks right now and the board is 13 cards of hate for aggro/pod/solar flare.

I think the answer is just Divines and go from there and just overlap the aggro hate with tempered specific hate (so e-props to whoever suggested that).
Get it by your hands...
slyboogie
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States3423 Posts
October 07 2011 00:17 GMT
#1517
On October 07 2011 08:31 MCMcEmcee wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 07 2011 07:47 slyboogie wrote:
On October 07 2011 06:32 MCMcEmcee wrote:
Gut Shot.


No man. Mortarpod.


mortarpod is good too but gut shot is a free instant


I can see why Gut Shot seems good but its a value proposition. Mortarpod is more flexible, it doesn't give Tempered Steel that bit of reach against you. It's a body on the ground and it doesn't get thrown into your yard after its primary purpose is served.

Frankly, I wouldn't play either card in Solar Flare, but I like Mortarpod.
"We dug coal together." Boyd Crowder, Justified
deth2munkies
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States4051 Posts
October 07 2011 01:43 GMT
#1518
On October 07 2011 08:44 Judicator wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 07 2011 06:05 deth2munkies wrote:
Ghost Quarter also kills Inkmoth Nexus dead and fixes your mana if you have some duals that can't get played. I'd put 1-2 in.


Ghost Quarter is terrible in tri-color decks, I would just cut Days for BSZ at that point.

As for Marrow Shards/Gut Shot, the life payment is relevant in the match up and 1 damage isn't that good.

As for Gideon, I am going to try him out as a one of out of the board.

As for going reactionary, all of my counter-spells come out post-board, there's no reason to hang to them at all. They put legitimate threats on the board before counter-spells matter and the match up is terrible as is.

I don't play Timely main. My main is suited against control decks right now and the board is 13 cards of hate for aggro/pod/solar flare.

I think the answer is just Divines and go from there and just overlap the aggro hate with tempered specific hate (so e-props to whoever suggested that).


Hate to break it to you, but BSZ is sorcery speed as well.
http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=214061
Judicator
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
United States7270 Posts
October 07 2011 03:11 GMT
#1519
Hate to break it to you...you're missing my point. If I was to run Ghost Quarters in a Solar Flare deck. I would take the Black Sun Zeniths to cut down on the double W costing cards to make my mana base not suck giant testicles.
Get it by your hands...
deth2munkies
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States4051 Posts
October 07 2011 03:33 GMT
#1520
On October 07 2011 12:11 Judicator wrote:
Hate to break it to you...you're missing my point. If I was to run Ghost Quarters in a Solar Flare deck. I would take the Black Sun Zeniths to cut down on the double W costing cards to make my mana base not suck giant testicles.

I'd cut down on the black over the white, just either cut the Grave Titan for another Sun Titan or something. Day is too important against other Solar Flare decks and if werewolves becomes a deck, it will definitely be necessary for it too. Sun Titan and Gideon are also more important than Grave Titan.

My version isn't quite as controlling and involves reanimating Praetors
Prev 1 74 75 76 77 78 665 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Wardi Open
11:00
#82
WardiTV817
OGKoka 352
Rex107
Liquipedia
Afreeca Starleague
10:00
Ro16 Group A
Soma vs YSC
Sharp vs sSak
Afreeca ASL 13360
StarCastTV_EN343
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
OGKoka 352
Lowko299
ProTech130
Rex 107
Codebar 20
LamboSC2 1
StarCraft: Brood War
Sea 23185
Calm 15877
Bisu 8332
Jaedong 3173
Horang2 1961
BeSt 1122
EffOrt 885
Mini 713
Stork 581
firebathero 527
[ Show more ]
Light 460
Zeus 385
Pusan 376
actioN 353
ZerO 234
Soulkey 227
Hyun 164
Larva 147
Mind 92
Rush 82
Killer 68
ToSsGirL 57
Barracks 48
Sea.KH 45
yabsab 37
zelot 26
Nal_rA 24
[sc1f]eonzerg 19
soO 18
Movie 17
Shinee 16
Terrorterran 15
Hm[arnc] 14
scan(afreeca) 13
GoRush 13
IntoTheRainbow 12
SilentControl 11
Noble 10
Sacsri 10
Bale 10
Icarus 8
Dota 2
qojqva1103
syndereN84
febbydoto14
Counter-Strike
olofmeister3496
fl0m2406
x6flipin430
byalli375
markeloff92
Other Games
singsing1961
B2W.Neo962
hiko703
crisheroes294
Pyrionflax175
Liquid`LucifroN101
Liquid`VortiX89
QueenE79
KnowMe55
Mew2King44
RotterdaM40
Organizations
Other Games
BasetradeTV760
StarCraft: Brood War
UltimateBattle 311
Counter-Strike
PGL302
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 14 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• StrangeGG 59
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Nemesis3082
• TFBlade1374
• Stunt587
Upcoming Events
Monday Night Weeklies
2h 28m
OSC
10h 28m
Afreeca Starleague
20h 28m
Snow vs PianO
hero vs Rain
WardiTV Map Contest Tou…
20h 28m
GSL
22h 28m
PiGosaur Cup
1d 10h
CranKy Ducklings
1d 19h
Kung Fu Cup
1d 22h
Replay Cast
2 days
The PondCast
2 days
[ Show More ]
WardiTV Map Contest Tou…
2 days
Replay Cast
3 days
Escore
3 days
WardiTV Map Contest Tou…
3 days
Korean StarCraft League
4 days
CranKy Ducklings
4 days
WardiTV Map Contest Tou…
4 days
IPSL
5 days
WolFix vs nOmaD
dxtr13 vs Razz
BSL
5 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
5 days
WardiTV Map Contest Tou…
5 days
Ladder Legends
6 days
BSL
6 days
IPSL
6 days
JDConan vs TBD
Aegong vs rasowy
Replay Cast
6 days
Replay Cast
6 days
Wardi Open
6 days
Afreeca Starleague
6 days
Bisu vs Ample
Jaedong vs Flash
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Escore Tournament S2: W2
RSL Revival: Season 4
NationLESS Cup

Ongoing

BSL Season 22
ASL Season 21
CSL 2026 SPRING (S20)
IPSL Spring 2026
StarCraft2 Community Team League 2026 Spring
Nations Cup 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
BLAST Open Spring 2026
ESL Pro League S23 Finals
ESL Pro League S23 Stage 1&2
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026
IEM Kraków 2026

Upcoming

Escore Tournament S2: W3
Acropolis #4
BSL 22 Non-Korean Championship
CSLAN 4
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
HSC XXIX
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
RSL Revival: Season 5
WardiTV TLMC #16
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
CCT Season 3 Global Finals
IEM Rio 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.