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On May 23 2012 16:46 Dodgin wrote:
It's hard to say yes or no because there are no predefined terms for being a bonjwa, when the fans decide a player is one is when it happens. Some people say after he won that he is, some people say no.
It's not important really, the term doesn't have to carry over from Brood War. All that matters is that he is the most accomplished Starcraft 2 player of all time in terms of championships and prize money earned, it doesn't need a fancy title.
Best definition of Bonjwa,
ever.
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On May 23 2012 16:46 Dodgin wrote:
It's hard to say yes or no because there are no predefined terms for being a bonjwa, when the fans decide a player is one is when it happens. Some people say after he won that he is, some people say no.
It's not important really, the term doesn't have to carry over from Brood War. All that matters is that he is the most accomplished Starcraft 2 player of all time in terms of championships and prize money earned, it doesn't need a fancy title.
Part of being a bonjwa is the elo point ranking though. Mvp consistently has the most points in the GSL, he was at the top since 2011.
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4 GSL Championships along with all his other tournament wins I think qualify him as a bonjwa IMO. If he continues to dominate 2012 like he did in 2011 you have to call him one for sure.
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On May 23 2012 19:56 Aunvilgod wrote:Show nested quote +On May 23 2012 16:46 Dodgin wrote:
It's hard to say yes or no because there are no predefined terms for being a bonjwa, when the fans decide a player is one is when it happens. Some people say after he won that he is, some people say no.
It's not important really, the term doesn't have to carry over from Brood War. All that matters is that he is the most accomplished Starcraft 2 player of all time in terms of championships and prize money earned, it doesn't need a fancy title. Part of being a bonjwa is the elo point ranking though. Mvp consistently has the most points in the GSL, he was at the top since 2011.
Being a bonjwa is not just being at the top consistently. It's being an absolute monster over a period of time to the point where other progamers cry if they have to play you. Jaedong is not a bonjwa, why? The guy was never dominant enough. He fought in an era where Bisu and Flash were just as good as he was. Now take a look at savior, the original bonjwa. In his era, particularly 2006, the guy had something like an 80% win rate. He had no equals, only victims. Imagine every single game he was in being a forgone conclusion for over a year. EVERY SINGLE GAME/SERIES you knew he was gonna win, why even bother watching right? Savior came before my time, but I've had a friend put it in perspective for me. Just imagine Nestea back when he was unstoppable zvz, when every zvz of his you knew was gonna be an auto win for him. Now multiply that aura by 3, and add it to his zvt and zvp as well, that's saviors dominance. While jaedong has surpassed savior in everyway possible, in every stat possible, he has not surpassed that aura of dominance.
Mvp, while being the best in sc2 history so far, has not had that aura of "shit...well this games over" half a year before that game is even played. mvp is my favorite sc2 player by far, but he's not a bonjwa, he's simply the best player in sc2.
Simple answer is...you will know when mvp is a bonjwa when you don't have to ask whether you can call him one or not. When he develops that aura you will know.
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On May 24 2012 06:21 rysecake wrote:Show nested quote +On May 23 2012 19:56 Aunvilgod wrote:On May 23 2012 16:46 Dodgin wrote:
It's hard to say yes or no because there are no predefined terms for being a bonjwa, when the fans decide a player is one is when it happens. Some people say after he won that he is, some people say no.
It's not important really, the term doesn't have to carry over from Brood War. All that matters is that he is the most accomplished Starcraft 2 player of all time in terms of championships and prize money earned, it doesn't need a fancy title. Part of being a bonjwa is the elo point ranking though. Mvp consistently has the most points in the GSL, he was at the top since 2011. Mvp, while being the best in sc2 history so far, has not had that aura of "shit...well this games over" half a year before that game is even played. mvp is my favorite sc2 player by far, but he's not a bonjwa, he's simply the best player in sc2.
I agree so much with this part, when you see a player like MVP enter a tournament you can't really say "yeah he's gonna win this for sure, unless something really unexpected happens". You just know he's got a good chance to win, but so do alot of other players like MKP, MMA, MC etc...
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On May 24 2012 06:25 sereniity wrote:Show nested quote +On May 24 2012 06:21 rysecake wrote:On May 23 2012 19:56 Aunvilgod wrote:On May 23 2012 16:46 Dodgin wrote:
It's hard to say yes or no because there are no predefined terms for being a bonjwa, when the fans decide a player is one is when it happens. Some people say after he won that he is, some people say no.
It's not important really, the term doesn't have to carry over from Brood War. All that matters is that he is the most accomplished Starcraft 2 player of all time in terms of championships and prize money earned, it doesn't need a fancy title. Part of being a bonjwa is the elo point ranking though. Mvp consistently has the most points in the GSL, he was at the top since 2011. Mvp, while being the best in sc2 history so far, has not had that aura of "shit...well this games over" half a year before that game is even played. mvp is my favorite sc2 player by far, but he's not a bonjwa, he's simply the best player in sc2. I agree so much with this part, when you see a player like MVP enter a tournament you can't really say "yeah he's gonna win this for sure, unless something really unexpected happens". You just know he's got a good chance to win, but so do alot of other players like MKP, MMA, MC etc...
Actually during 2011 this is exactly what you could say about MVP, he was the favourite in every match, even against MMA.
Bonjwas in the past have had their up and downs, if MVP starts to win everything again, and recovers from his wrist condition, I'm pretty sure that's a bonjwa.
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On May 24 2012 09:28 InoyouS2 wrote:Show nested quote +On May 24 2012 06:25 sereniity wrote:On May 24 2012 06:21 rysecake wrote:On May 23 2012 19:56 Aunvilgod wrote:On May 23 2012 16:46 Dodgin wrote:
It's hard to say yes or no because there are no predefined terms for being a bonjwa, when the fans decide a player is one is when it happens. Some people say after he won that he is, some people say no.
It's not important really, the term doesn't have to carry over from Brood War. All that matters is that he is the most accomplished Starcraft 2 player of all time in terms of championships and prize money earned, it doesn't need a fancy title. Part of being a bonjwa is the elo point ranking though. Mvp consistently has the most points in the GSL, he was at the top since 2011. Mvp, while being the best in sc2 history so far, has not had that aura of "shit...well this games over" half a year before that game is even played. mvp is my favorite sc2 player by far, but he's not a bonjwa, he's simply the best player in sc2. I agree so much with this part, when you see a player like MVP enter a tournament you can't really say "yeah he's gonna win this for sure, unless something really unexpected happens". You just know he's got a good chance to win, but so do alot of other players like MKP, MMA, MC etc... Actually during 2011 this is exactly what you could say about MVP, he was the favourite in every match, even against MMA. Bonjwas in the past have had their up and downs, if MVP starts to win everything again, and recovers from his wrist condition, I'm pretty sure that's a bonjwa.
I remember when he won the WCG Korean qualifiers and the Arena of Legends team ace thing one day apart, or on the same day even. I forget which.
Everyone was like " how does Mvp win everything "
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On May 24 2012 09:28 InoyouS2 wrote:Show nested quote +On May 24 2012 06:25 sereniity wrote:On May 24 2012 06:21 rysecake wrote:On May 23 2012 19:56 Aunvilgod wrote:On May 23 2012 16:46 Dodgin wrote:
It's hard to say yes or no because there are no predefined terms for being a bonjwa, when the fans decide a player is one is when it happens. Some people say after he won that he is, some people say no.
It's not important really, the term doesn't have to carry over from Brood War. All that matters is that he is the most accomplished Starcraft 2 player of all time in terms of championships and prize money earned, it doesn't need a fancy title. Part of being a bonjwa is the elo point ranking though. Mvp consistently has the most points in the GSL, he was at the top since 2011. Mvp, while being the best in sc2 history so far, has not had that aura of "shit...well this games over" half a year before that game is even played. mvp is my favorite sc2 player by far, but he's not a bonjwa, he's simply the best player in sc2. I agree so much with this part, when you see a player like MVP enter a tournament you can't really say "yeah he's gonna win this for sure, unless something really unexpected happens". You just know he's got a good chance to win, but so do alot of other players like MKP, MMA, MC etc... Actually during 2011 this is exactly what you could say about MVP, he was the favourite in every match, even against MMA. Bonjwas in the past have had their up and downs, if MVP starts to win everything again, and recovers from his wrist condition, I'm pretty sure that's a bonjwa.
If mvp can win the next 3 gsls in a row or some crazy shit like that. Yes he is a bonjwa
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On May 24 2012 09:45 rysecake wrote:Show nested quote +On May 24 2012 09:28 InoyouS2 wrote:On May 24 2012 06:25 sereniity wrote:On May 24 2012 06:21 rysecake wrote:On May 23 2012 19:56 Aunvilgod wrote:On May 23 2012 16:46 Dodgin wrote:
It's hard to say yes or no because there are no predefined terms for being a bonjwa, when the fans decide a player is one is when it happens. Some people say after he won that he is, some people say no.
It's not important really, the term doesn't have to carry over from Brood War. All that matters is that he is the most accomplished Starcraft 2 player of all time in terms of championships and prize money earned, it doesn't need a fancy title. Part of being a bonjwa is the elo point ranking though. Mvp consistently has the most points in the GSL, he was at the top since 2011. Mvp, while being the best in sc2 history so far, has not had that aura of "shit...well this games over" half a year before that game is even played. mvp is my favorite sc2 player by far, but he's not a bonjwa, he's simply the best player in sc2. I agree so much with this part, when you see a player like MVP enter a tournament you can't really say "yeah he's gonna win this for sure, unless something really unexpected happens". You just know he's got a good chance to win, but so do alot of other players like MKP, MMA, MC etc... Actually during 2011 this is exactly what you could say about MVP, he was the favourite in every match, even against MMA. Bonjwas in the past have had their up and downs, if MVP starts to win everything again, and recovers from his wrist condition, I'm pretty sure that's a bonjwa. If mvp can win the next 3 gsls in a row or some crazy shit like that. Yes he is a bonjwa
If the requirements were as strict as you like to believe then Nada/Boxer would have been labeled as such, just throwing it out there.
It's especially difficult to compare because sc2 has way way more tournaments.
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On May 24 2012 09:47 Dodgin wrote:Show nested quote +On May 24 2012 09:45 rysecake wrote:On May 24 2012 09:28 InoyouS2 wrote:On May 24 2012 06:25 sereniity wrote:On May 24 2012 06:21 rysecake wrote:On May 23 2012 19:56 Aunvilgod wrote:On May 23 2012 16:46 Dodgin wrote:
It's hard to say yes or no because there are no predefined terms for being a bonjwa, when the fans decide a player is one is when it happens. Some people say after he won that he is, some people say no.
It's not important really, the term doesn't have to carry over from Brood War. All that matters is that he is the most accomplished Starcraft 2 player of all time in terms of championships and prize money earned, it doesn't need a fancy title. Part of being a bonjwa is the elo point ranking though. Mvp consistently has the most points in the GSL, he was at the top since 2011. Mvp, while being the best in sc2 history so far, has not had that aura of "shit...well this games over" half a year before that game is even played. mvp is my favorite sc2 player by far, but he's not a bonjwa, he's simply the best player in sc2. I agree so much with this part, when you see a player like MVP enter a tournament you can't really say "yeah he's gonna win this for sure, unless something really unexpected happens". You just know he's got a good chance to win, but so do alot of other players like MKP, MMA, MC etc... Actually during 2011 this is exactly what you could say about MVP, he was the favourite in every match, even against MMA. Bonjwas in the past have had their up and downs, if MVP starts to win everything again, and recovers from his wrist condition, I'm pretty sure that's a bonjwa. If mvp can win the next 3 gsls in a row or some crazy shit like that. Yes he is a bonjwa If the requirements were as strict as you like to believe then Nada/Boxer would have been labeled as such, just throwing it out there. It's especially difficult to compare because sc2 has way way more tournaments.
It's not so much the tournament wins, as much as it is the time period of dominance. Lots more gsl than starleages per year. Well maybe not now that they split it into several months per gsl. So yes if he can win 3 gsls in a year with the new format that would be similar to winning 3 osl's in a year. bonjwa status
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MvP isn't a bonjwa....
If he's in a tournament it's not like everyone thinks, "Oh he'll win it, DRG, Nestea, MMA, MKP, MC, don't stand a chance!"
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On May 24 2012 11:14 cydial wrote:
MvP isn't a bonjwa....
If he's in a tournament it's not like everyone thinks, "Oh he'll win it, DRG, Nestea, MMA, MKP, MC, don't stand a chance!"
This is the biggest thing. It's the aura of invincibility that makes you a bonjwa. Like I said earlier, mvp has great stats in this game like jaedong in bw. jaedongs not a bonjwa because he never had that feeling of godliness, however consistent and strong he might have been. people like savior and oov on the other hand raped everything over the course of a year.
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On May 24 2012 06:12 Esk23 wrote:
4 GSL Championships along with all his other tournament wins I think qualify him as a bonjwa IMO. If he continues to dominate 2012 like he did in 2011 you have to call him one for sure.
No, because there were 9 GSL championships (including World Championship and Super Tournament) in 2011. When you think of Bonjwa you think of guys like NaDa and iloveoov, who made every single matchup involving Terran (yes, even TvT) look downright imbalanced in their favor for well over a year. These people pretty much singlehandedly changed the way the game was played, NaDa with his macro, iloveoov with his sick strategies and builds (and even more gosu macro). And they raped, EVERYBODY, making some of the greatest players of their age, who would've been champions in another age, look like cannon fodder. They were always placed at the #1 ranking for every single tournament they attended. As good as MVP is, he doesn't hold that "Oh shit, I might as well as just leave the game right now" aura as long as any of the bonjwas did, and yes he has looked mortal many times, even in his heyday. So no, not yet a bonjwa.
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I think It's impossible to not look mortal at times in sc2 because It's not as figured out, or as balanced as BW.
Maybe once both expansions are released and blizzard stops patching the game we will see domination similar to Oov's.
I'm still in shock that Mvp was able to win a gsl winning three TvP series' in a row against top Protoss players in a time where many consider the matchup to be in the favor of Protoss. Doing this while at the same time being injured and unable to practice as much as them.
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I facepalm every time the word 'bonjwa' is brought up because no Korean uses that term anymore, so stop using it, it just makes Mvp and his fanbase look bad.
Can we just refer to him as being the GOAT? lol
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On May 24 2012 12:00 zyzq wrote:
I facepalm every time the word 'bonjwa' is brought up because no Korean uses that term anymore, so stop using it, it just makes Mvp and his fanbase look bad.
Can we just refer to him as being the GOAT? lol
MJ is not pleased
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On May 24 2012 11:39 Dodgin wrote:
I think It's impossible to not look mortal at times in sc2 because It's not as figured out, or as balanced as BW.
Maybe once both expansions are released and blizzard stops patching the game we will see domination similar to Oov's.
I'm still in shock that Mvp was able to win a gsl winning three TvP series' in a row against top Protoss players in a time where many consider the matchup to be in the favor of Protoss. Doing this while at the same time being injured and unable to practice as much as them.
That is an amazing feat. No one here is denying he's not the best sc2 player. He's just not a bonjwa.
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On May 24 2012 12:59 rysecake wrote:Show nested quote +On May 24 2012 11:39 Dodgin wrote:
I think It's impossible to not look mortal at times in sc2 because It's not as figured out, or as balanced as BW.
Maybe once both expansions are released and blizzard stops patching the game we will see domination similar to Oov's.
I'm still in shock that Mvp was able to win a gsl winning three TvP series' in a row against top Protoss players in a time where many consider the matchup to be in the favor of Protoss. Doing this while at the same time being injured and unable to practice as much as them. That is an amazing feat. No one here is denying he's not the best sc2 player. He's just not a bonjwa.
Did you not read my other post on the previous page? lol. I never said he was
On May 23 2012 16:46 Dodgin wrote:
It's hard to say yes or no because there are no predefined terms for being a bonjwa, when the fans decide a player is one is when it happens. Some people say after he won that he is, some people say no.
It's not important really, the term doesn't have to carry over from Brood War. All that matters is that he is the most accomplished Starcraft 2 player of all time in terms of championships and prize money earned, it doesn't need a fancy title.
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On May 24 2012 13:16 Dodgin wrote:Show nested quote +On May 24 2012 12:59 rysecake wrote:On May 24 2012 11:39 Dodgin wrote:
I think It's impossible to not look mortal at times in sc2 because It's not as figured out, or as balanced as BW.
Maybe once both expansions are released and blizzard stops patching the game we will see domination similar to Oov's.
I'm still in shock that Mvp was able to win a gsl winning three TvP series' in a row against top Protoss players in a time where many consider the matchup to be in the favor of Protoss. Doing this while at the same time being injured and unable to practice as much as them. That is an amazing feat. No one here is denying he's not the best sc2 player. He's just not a bonjwa. Did you not read my other post on this same page? lol. I never said he was
Directed at the others calling him one, not at you sorry.
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On May 24 2012 13:17 rysecake wrote:Show nested quote +On May 24 2012 13:16 Dodgin wrote:On May 24 2012 12:59 rysecake wrote:On May 24 2012 11:39 Dodgin wrote:
I think It's impossible to not look mortal at times in sc2 because It's not as figured out, or as balanced as BW.
Maybe once both expansions are released and blizzard stops patching the game we will see domination similar to Oov's.
I'm still in shock that Mvp was able to win a gsl winning three TvP series' in a row against top Protoss players in a time where many consider the matchup to be in the favor of Protoss. Doing this while at the same time being injured and unable to practice as much as them. That is an amazing feat. No one here is denying he's not the best sc2 player. He's just not a bonjwa. Did you not read my other post on this same page? lol. I never said he was Directed at the others calling him one, not at you sorry.
No worries :D
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EPT
