EPTcan you explain why?
Anime Discussion Thread - Page 2045
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Yoshi Kirishima
United States10292 Posts
can you explain why? | ||
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Kaal
Djibouti2466 Posts
This part is just wrong... Again, majority of Code Geass viewers THOUGHT CODE GEASS WAS GOOD, at least according to the ratings on ANN. I hope that is clear for you this time, it is the third time I've said this. Go look at the ratings for japanese viewership. It's great for episodes one and two, and then slides into oblivion until episode 23 when it hikes up again. R2 starts in oblivion, and ends in a deep black abyss of no one is bothering to watch this shit. You probably think it's a masterpiece because you and most english-only anime viewers haven't actually seen any of the real anime masterpieces. | ||
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Requizen
United States33802 Posts
On April 30 2012 16:22 Yoshi Kirishima wrote: I don't prefer to read manga over anime, so i haven't heard of it xD can you explain why? Psyren was a series that was actually a lot more successful in the states than in Japan. It was kind of a non-standard action series with a bit darker undertone and a lot of mystery to it. The story is great, the characters were pretty interesting (mostly), the only issue was that it got sacked, so the ending was sort of rushed. Otherwise, top 5 manga imoimo. | ||
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Yoshi Kirishima
United States10292 Posts
On April 30 2012 16:24 Kaal wrote: Go look at the ratings for japanese viewership. It's great for episodes one and two, and then slides into oblivion until episode 23 when it hikes up again. R2 starts in oblivion, and ends in a deep black abyss of no one is bothering to watch this shit. You probably think it's a masterpiece because you and most english-only anime viewers haven't actually seen any of the real anime masterpieces. I'm surprised to see the ratings to be so different, but now that i think of it, I can see why (for example, viewers of popular titles in the west like naruto and bleach make a large portion of ratings of shows, maybe more so than in japan, or etc.) Though I that's quite cold of you to generalize me like that  I've already taken back my opinion of calling it a masterpiece anyways.I'm actually not sure of where to look for japanese ratings or such. Can you link me to some pl0x? On April 30 2012 16:26 Requizen wrote: Psyren was a series that was actually a lot more successful in the states than in Japan. It was kind of a non-standard action series with a bit darker undertone and a lot of mystery to it. The story is great, the characters were pretty interesting (mostly), the only issue was that it got sacked, so the ending was sort of rushed. Otherwise, top 5 manga imoimo. Ah, that's a pity... I only recently learned about the process people have to go through to get their manga published and whatnot, and that must suck to be forced to end your own work abruptly like that =/ | ||
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Sentenal
United States12398 Posts
5000 isn't a significant sample size. Let me use sales numbers to illustrate. Take Gundam SEED for example. In 2004, Bandai announced the SEED DVDs had sold 1 million copies of it in Japan. Volume 1 alone sold over 100,000 copies. This means that, for volume 1 at least, 8 years ago, 100,000 people liked Gundam SEED enough to spend money on it (not to mention that shit is expensive in Japan). Gundam SEED has 3000 ratings on ANN. Which is the more significant number, 100,000+ people willing to spend money on it, or 3000 people who took 5 seconds out of their day to give it a number? | ||
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Kaal
Djibouti2466 Posts
I'm surprised to see the ratings to be so different, but now that i think of it, I can see why (for example, viewers of popular titles in the west like naruto and bleach make a large portion of ratings of shows, maybe more so than in japan, or etc.) Though I that's quite cold of you to generalize me like that I'm actually not sure of where to look for japanese ratings or such. Can you link me to some pl0x? You'd have to bug aers, he would know. Or ask in #gg or some other big channel on rizon, I personally steer clear of such places. And viewers of naruto/bleach/OP are definately higher in Japan than in the USA. One Piece being the far more popular show. | ||
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biology]major
United States2253 Posts
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Southlight
United States11761 Posts
On April 30 2012 16:48 biology]major wrote: how many of you guys think DN is a masterpiece? just curious what others in this thread think, because its not really discussed much at all even though its pretty fucking good, its better than CG in EVERY way possible. CG is like some retarded version of DN made for younger kids with explosions. Im not even sure which is more popular in japan but it saddens me that CG (R2 especially) is even given so much attention On September 22 2011 01:48 Southlight wrote: What is Death Note, people ask, and why is it so heralded? Think Iago versus King Claudius, only King Claudius happens to be the Hyde to Hamlet's Jekyll. Imagine a match of chess being played by the most nefarious, scheming villains in literary history... against each other, amidst a contemporary sociopolitical backdrop. The pieces include the media, the power of information, the very philosophical ideals each of these monsters hold dear, and even you, the dear reader (or watcher), as you are sucked into this dizzying tale of cunning. Trod through the muddy, bloodied waters of the hundreds and thousands of corpses left behind in this intellectual duel, and look on in Ooba Tsugumi's game of bloodlust, justice, and vengeance. Edit: As for the Code Gundam vs Macross debate: On September 22 2011 00:40 Southlight wrote: Code Geass was amazing. It matched some of the most intellectually sound people, had battlefield tactics that were so intricate and thought-out that it reminded me of a cross between Legend of Galactic Heroes and Death Note. None of the characters were teenage emos, as they all were mature, driven people with their own convictions, like Shakugan no Shana. So much deep philosophy about manhood, mankind, and war, it was almost like an Evangelion version of Tengen Toppa Gurren Lagann. The story arc with Euphie was tragic, reminding me of Titus Andronicus, and was both touching and exciting, making me wish things had taken that turn much earlier. Alas, that's the only qualm I had with CG, which is that it delayed some of the best moments until too late into the season, forcing you to watch R2, which was a very Gundam-esque move. That was around when we should have realized that their lead writer was assassinated and replaced by Char Aznable. Can we RIP the fanboy shit now? | ||
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Yoshi Kirishima
United States10292 Posts
On April 30 2012 16:35 Kaal wrote: You'd have to bug aers, he would know. Or ask in #gg or some other big channel on rizon, I personally steer clear of such places. And viewers of naruto/bleach/OP are definately higher in Japan than in the USA. One Piece being the far more popular show. Ah, kk thanks  Reading back what I said, it didn't really make sense. I was trying to put into words that one reason why Code Geass may be rated higher in the west is because westerners are exposed to less anime than in Japan, so that those who don't watch many anime will feel Code Geass is a 9/10 or 10/10 since they don't have much to compare it to. On April 30 2012 16:33 Sentenal wrote: So "the majority of Code Geass viewers thought it was good. According to ANN." Now let me tell you why that is a pointless statement. Its the "according to ANN" part. Why? Are you going to try and tell me that everyone who watched Code Geass thought to rank it on ANN? Do you think only 5000 people watched Code Geass? There is no way to get any number for how many people who watched it, liked it. 5000 isn't a significant sample size. Let me use sales numbers to illustrate. Take Gundam SEED for example. In 2004, Bandai announced the SEED DVDs had sold 1 million copies of it in Japan. Volume 1 alone sold over 100,000 copies. This means that, for volume 1 at least, 8 years ago, 100,000 people liked Gundam SEED enough to spend money on it (not to mention that shit is expensive in Japan). Gundam SEED has 3000 ratings on ANN. Which is the more significant number, 100,000+ people willing to spend money on it, or 3000 people who took 5 seconds out of their day to give it a number? Well I'm guessing you didn't see my new post yet since we posted closely together, but no I'm not gonna say those things. True, there is no way to get such a number. However, when the ratings are so skewed, I would think it's "safe" in this situation to assume that most of its viewers think it's "good". Of course it is not a 100% thing, and like mentioned earlier this is only on an english site, not even a japanese site. The sales. Though, like ratings, it's impossible to know if they bought it because they liked it (more likely) or because they felt it was "critically good". However, reading your blog, you say that SEED is a pretty good series. Also it sold 1 million copies. But Code Geass also sold a lot, that is, 900,000. That's pretty close. If you were to look just on sales like that, you could also say that Code Geass is nearly as good as Gundam SEED. But of course, it is almost impossible to find out how many people actually watched both shows and how many people actually bought the sales. Now if we can somehow find the viewership number on television, that could be interesting. | ||
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Naphal
Germany2099 Posts
as i have recently started mirai nikki (waited for completion) and the blurays are coming out, i do not know wether i should continue with the gotwoot fansubs or wait for someone to do the blurays, because the tv-version is slightly censored. so my question is (i am at episode 8 and did not mind the censorship as much) does the censorship get more annoying when the show progresses? censorship so far: + Show Spoiler + 1) eye plugged out 2) slashed off hand 3) knive in child 4) NIPPLES | ||
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Requizen
United States33802 Posts
On April 30 2012 16:51 Southlight wrote: Edit: As for the Code Gundam vs Macross debate: Can we RIP the fanboy shit now? I've been on the internet too long to figure out how much of this is sarcasm and how much is you actually liking the shows. Oh God, will the smarm never end on the internets? | ||
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Yoshi Kirishima
United States10292 Posts
Uh, I don't like gore and blood just for the sake of it, but they only censor nudity and intense violence. There is shooting and stabbing that is not censored. Only things like body parts falling off or being cut in half are censored. Even so, you can tell what's going on. Either they pixelize it or put some black circle over it, but you can still see the blood coming out from the edges or such. However, the BDs do have additional content. Some scenes are better animated, and there might be some new scenes (probably very minor?). @About Death Note Well it's hard to say. Yes it was very very good. Perhaps a masterpiece. But the bad thing is that, if you are to consider the whole work, it got sort of boring after + Show Spoiler + L's arc. Though again, this might be simply because the manga author was forced to keep writing more because the producers were making so much money. Then again, maybe the manga handled the stuff after L's arc better, idk. Either way, masterpiece or not, it is one of my favorites | ||
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KazeHydra
Japan2788 Posts
On July 11 2011 15:29 Buubble wrote: I can imagine some other serious anime I've watched e.g. Code Geass or Deathnote maybe?, where every action is backed up with a very solid foundation of evidence so cleverly that you can't identify a single trace of loophole. Maybe we should just ban Code Geass arguments from this thread. They seem to pop up relatively often compared to any other argument and never actually get resolved. Also Hanazawa will play Ichiko Sakura, a girl whose blissful life comes from her bountiful "happiness energy" — gained by sapping that energy from other people. lol happiness energy sounds like something that really fits her typical moe voice. Maybe Kana Hanazawa is actually a soul eating demon?! Run away Nagi, it's a trap! | ||
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Yoshi Kirishima
United States10292 Posts
kekek | ||
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solidbebe
Netherlands4921 Posts
On April 30 2012 17:08 Yoshi Kirishima wrote: Hehe, let's ask mods for a specific thread for popular debates like that. It will expand the area that this anime community occupies on TL, and maybe more will see the anime threads and get into anime kekekIf they see the debate you guys are having I doubt they'll be wanting to go into anime  | ||
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triangle
United States3803 Posts
On April 30 2012 16:33 Sentenal wrote: So "the majority of Code Geass viewers thought it was good. According to ANN." Now let me tell you why that is a pointless statement. Its the "according to ANN" part. Why? Are you going to try and tell me that everyone who watched Code Geass thought to rank it on ANN? Do you think only 5000 people watched Code Geass? There is no way to get any number for how many people who watched it, liked it. 5000 isn't a significant sample size. Let me use sales numbers to illustrate. Take Gundam SEED for example. In 2004, Bandai announced the SEED DVDs had sold 1 million copies of it in Japan. Volume 1 alone sold over 100,000 copies. This means that, for volume 1 at least, 8 years ago, 100,000 people liked Gundam SEED enough to spend money on it (not to mention that shit is expensive in Japan). Gundam SEED has 3000 ratings on ANN. Which is the more significant number, 100,000+ people willing to spend money on it, or 3000 people who took 5 seconds out of their day to give it a number? Actually, 5000 is a statistically significant sample size. The only way your argument makes sense is if the population of people on ANN is significantly different from the general population, in which this is a case of sampling error (they very well might be, but you'd need evidence for that). Using sales figures to determine whether a show is good is actually a worse measure, because that measures what is popular, not what is good. Unless you want to argue that K-On was one of the greatest shows of the decade :p You're basically arguing that it's terrible because other shows are better, but provide no evidence for that at all, besides assertions that Yoshi Kirishima hasn't seen them. All this means is that he can't assess the truth of your statements, it doesn't mean that your statements are correct. Given the number of awards Code Geass has won, claiming that it's shit puts you at odds with a bunch of people who do know what they're talking about (at least I assume they do), which only further weakens the credibility of your case. TLDR: If you think a show is shit, recommend other shows that are better and let the person decide for themselves. Edit - Of course we have no confidence interval, but 5k people is plenty large for most conventional tests of significance, assuming the sampling method is legitimate (and the population distribution isn't too wonky, blah blah). It almost certainly isn't, but that's not a problem with the number. And we do have a hypothesis: That Code Geass is shit. Either people like watching shit, or that hypothesis ought to be rejected (Or ANN viewers do not represent the general population, making the study meaningless). And wtf does "significant" mean in the colloquial sense anyway. If a sample is statistically significant, it is significant. You can't have a statistically significant study and then say "well, I didn't mean that kind of significant, I meant the colloquial significant". Edit - On April 30 2012 17:43 Kaal wrote: K-on hasn't sold anywhere near as much as SEED has. Good thing that's not what I said... I said one of the greatest shows of the decade (i.e. one of the best selling) not the greatest show of the decade. | ||
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EchOne
United States2906 Posts
On April 30 2012 17:28 triangle wrote: Actually, 5000 is a statistically significant sample size. The only way your argument makes sense is if the population of people on ANN is significantly different from the general population, in which this is a case of sampling error (they very well might be, but you'd need evidence for that). Using sales figures to determine whether a show is good is actually a worse measure, because that measures what is popular, not what is good. Unless you want to argue that K-On was one of the greatest shows of the decade :p Statistical significance isn't even the issue here. We haven't posed a research problem, so we don't have a target confidence level, confidence interval, or population. Further, a sample consisting of "People who bother to rate a show on a website" is far removed from any random sample methodology, so a significance test would hardly be applicable. To give them the benefit of the doubt I'm just assuming they're using "significant" in terms of normal, colloquial English. | ||
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Kaal
Djibouti2466 Posts
Unless you want to argue that K-On was one of the greatest shows of the decade K-on hasn't sold anywhere near as much as SEED has. | ||
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Rebs
Pakistan10726 Posts
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Yoshi Kirishima
United States10292 Posts
Though I'm glad someone understood what I was saying regarding popularity ;_; @solidbebe Hmm yeah you're probably right @triangle Thanks for the input regarding sample sizes and stuff I haven't taken statistics yet, so when I say significant, I don't mean the statistics term. Meaning, my use of the word "significant" is a vague way of describing something that I feel is important xD Also, I'm glad someone realizes that it's unlikely for a show to be bad but still win that many awards, or, at least, as you put it, it puts those who say so at odds. On April 30 2012 14:39 Elem wrote: I didn't mean literally...it was figuratively speaking. >_> Though what they did was about as bad. In the VN Nagisa is still the main heroine and she usually plays a part in other routes (for no reason at all, seriously fuck her can't she gtfo she just pisses me off lol) but the other ones actually don't get hella friendzoned in their routes (obviously) and they cut out a lot of things,even a whole route though it wasn't really relevant to the main plot anyway. It's obvious why they did it but still sucks. Oh, rofl kk xD Hm, what is this route that wasn't in the anime? Is it possibly... + Show Spoiler + The sunohara ending? xD. Or I'm guessing there is an imouto route? On April 30 2012 14:49 Tabbris wrote: Also i find it funny that you think so low of Naruto when code geas r2 shared basically the same cliches and drama. Sasuke-Lelouch Itachi-Lelouch martyr Suzaku-naruto Pretty similar in my opinion. Hell I think naruto probably did better in some areas. Well if you look at it like that, you could say the same for all anime, especially since the examples you give aren't nearly as strong as they could be. For example, Lelouch can be compared to Light, and Suzaku can be compared to L. "Lelouch martyr" isn't even a character. It's just a trope/cliche, as you say. But genres of media and literary are defined by such cliches. For example, what would happen to a school-romance shoujo story be if you couldn't introduce a pretty or manly guy who is outgoing, caring, and nice, who the girl falls in love with and then they both end up together, let alone being able to set such a romance into a high school setting? It is often less about how many cliches there actually are but rather how well a work can present them in a new/refreshing/unique manner. I mean look at Harry Potter. There are countless other stories of kids suddenly thrown into this new world they didn't know that has magic and stuff, and then they learn things and get stronger and then eventually finish some sort of coming-of-age story to defeat some evil power and save the world. Heck, this even sounds similar to the premise of Code Geass. But how good is Harry Potter? pretty darn good I say Btw you know tvtropes? It's a pretty interesting site xD (warning... it can take up many hours of precious time =O though it is definitely fun to read stuff there) | ||
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