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Very much agreed about Clannad, I think one of the big reasons I liked the anime so much was how well they managed to incorporate all the different routes.
No. You have no soul.
I didn't play the VN, and I heard a lot was left out (how much exactly? probably not too much, or were the different routes actually fleshed out that far past just dating?) but it's nice to hear that :D
I tried to watch Kanon (watched like 13 episodes or so on request of friend, claiming it was great) but I got bored... the arcs weren't smooth, but in Clannad they did a good job focusing on each arc while also developing the other characters and plot etc.
In all seriousness, when you've both watched the anime and read the VN it feels like that your feelings about the anime depends on which characters you liked in the VN. I for one really disliked Nagisa so the anime ends up really meh to me, especially as my fave heroine (Kotomi) has her route violently raped and then fed to the dogs, with no chance of being saved. I feel like I'm the only person that really liked Kotomi though, lol. Just get a lot of hate from people when I mention her, especially from people who only watched the anime.
I liked Kotomi's arc in the anime, and basically whenever she gets any screen time. Never played the VN though. \o/
On April 30 2012 06:07 Yoshi Kirishima wrote: I think the main thing that disappoints me of people not liking Code Geass as much as me is not that they don't like it, but that they seem SO surprised that people like me like it so much. The majority of its viewers thought it was a master piece, or close to it. Just check its ratings on anime sites, it has one of the highest ratings in all 3500+ or so notable anime works out there.
So really, the people who don't think it's good or didn't like it much are in the minority.
The reason CG R2 is rated so high on MAL and lots of other anime sites is because /a/ thought it would be funny to do that.
And there's definately not 3500+ notable anime.
That's a matter of opinion. When I mean notable I mean notable enough for ANN to have on its list of anime. Also I can't believe if you really think /a/ effected the score that much. Look at the ratings 5 and below, even without /a/, it would be rated high. You think /a/ really contributed anything significant to the 3200 votes of 10/10? Also if they really thought it was funny to do that, they probably all voted for Masterpiece. So even if all 3200 were /a/ users, it would still be rated highly. A BAD rating is like 5 or lower average. 8 is not bad, 7 is not bad, 6 is not bad. 6 is usually "ok" or "mediocre" or something like that.
Also, look at Code Geass season 1. It has 7000 ratings, and most of us here say that, if you just look at Code Geass season 1, it wasn't bad. I doubt /a/ voted there and made its ratings really high as well, do you?
Now if 3000 of the votes for Code Geass R2 were all from /a/, the show would still average out to be an 8 or 9, which is still a high rating. However that means that only a third of the people who watched and rated Code Geass watched and rated R2, which seems quite unlikely.
So unless if I'm missing some other bit of info or reasoning here, my claim still stands that people who think Code Geass is bad bad are the minority.
On April 30 2012 06:07 Yoshi Kirishima wrote: I think the main thing that disappoints me of people not liking Code Geass as much as me is not that they don't like it, but that they seem SO surprised that people like me like it so much. The majority of its viewers thought it was a master piece, or close to it. Just check its ratings on anime sites, it has one of the highest ratings in all 3500+ or so notable anime works out there.
So really, the people who don't think it's good or didn't like it much are in the minority.
Masterpiece (or chef d'œuvre) in modern usage refers to a creation that has been given much critical praise, especially one that is considered the greatest work of a person's career or to a work of outstanding creativity, skill or workmanship.
Well what do you mean by critical praise here? I'm just using masterpiece in the way that it is, relative to other similar works, one of the best, and/or is one of the best works of that creator. Which I think everyone should be able to agree is Goro Taniguchi's best.
If you want to use that definition in terms of "critical" praise, as in, does this show "deserve" to be praised, rather than whether people like it or not (for example, lots of people like naruto but it sucks), then Code Geass has won numerous awards. So, yes, it is still a masterpiece. Not many anime win several awards, let alone one, especially considering how many meidocre anime there are that people don't even know about cus... well, they're not notable xD
On April 29 2012 21:50 FreudianTrip wrote: Let me prefix this with the fact that I'm not a huge anime guy, I just watch the main ones (Champloo, Trigun, Bebop etc.)
So after consulting the reccomendation image I watched Darker Than Black, started off thinking it was awful but it got pretty good towards the end.
I've finished the first series and I notice there seems to be a season 1.5 and 2. Is it worth watching either of these? I kind of feel like I've experienced the arc of the story and don't really know where it can go that's any good. Just Hei being chased for 23 episodes doesn't seem very exciting.
Should I bother with it or just move on to something else?
Move on to something else.
S2 is terrible, as is the OVA.
Sent, why the fuck did you start reading hoshizora. That's like the exact opposite of anything you'd ever like.
It's like if you read Da Capo.
But! But! Those blonde chicks! Really hot!
On April 30 2012 05:12 mcimba42 wrote: I don't think I've ever posted in this thread but I occasionally lurk around for a couple of pages and I happened to see the Code Geass discussion above, and I think there are a lot of people who just try to take that show way more seriously than they should.
I see people here watching and enjoying those generic moe moe "cute girls doing cute things" shows that air every season, but then they claim Code Geass is awful for having a bunch of plot holes and a generally pants on head retarded plot. But is that all there is to anime? Do you really watch cartoons for the amazing literary value they're well known to have? I don't think anyone will say they liked Geass because of the deep psychological themes, or the intricate plot, or the interesting and well developed characters. I personally enjoyed it because of stuff like the brilliant military tactics from the brilliant military mastermind that is Lelouch (such as baiting people onto a bridge and making it collapse, baiting people into a building and making it collapse, or baiting people onto a bridge and making a building collapse on top of it), all of the fabulous and the borderline homo, the pretty mechas, the jumbled mess it called plot (like going through the "sword of akasha" and into the "world of c", where he met his deceased mother and did something to God, thus choosing the future instead of the past), the ridiculous chess metaphors (complete with illegal chess moves), the "Haha, I just predicted every word you would have said in a 20 minute long conversation and prepared a video of me replying perfectly with 100% exact timing to fool you. For the second time!", the "who is this guy, hasn't he died twice alrea--LOYALTY!!", the completely bullshit cliffhangers every other episode, the YAMATO DAMASHII NIHON BANZAI, etc, etc. It doesn't deserve any awards, not is it revolutionary (or even good, in terms of "objective" quality), but I found it really fucking enjoyable to watch. Sure, it was a trainwreck, but as any self respecting trainwreck, it's bloody entertaining to watch. It's definitely no masterpiece (in fact, I'd love to try whatever the guy who said that has been smoking recently), but I found it a hell of a lot more entertaining and enjoyable than anything in these last couple of seasons.
But that is wrong, laughably horribly wrong. Have you never read what people who love Code Geass say about the show??? The praise it for EXACTLY those reasons.
>brilliant tactics from brilliant military mastermind Stopped reading there.
Well it is a masterpiece, relatively. How many anime can you name that are better than Code Geass in its genre, or what it does? (Extremely stylistic anime hitting a bunch of audiences with a unique ending).
On April 30 2012 06:07 Yoshi Kirishima wrote: I think the main thing that disappoints me of people not liking Code Geass as much as me is not that they don't like it, but that they seem SO surprised that people like me like it so much. The majority of its viewers thought it was a master piece, or close to it. Just check its ratings on anime sites, it has one of the highest ratings in all 3500+ or so notable anime works out there.
So really, the people who don't think it's good or didn't like it much are in the minority.
Popularity is not an indication of quality, please stop using that argument. Or are you going to start telling me Naruto and Bleach are masterpieces?
Well I'd have to disagree, and the majority of viewers do as well, according to many anime websites and reviews. Also, Code Geass is not just a mecha anime. I did not watch it for the mecha. It balances quite a lot of different things, but the thing that made it unique was its high dramatization and style. How many shows are out there that can hit so many different audiences?
I did not note popularity as quality. I never used that, so how about you not put words into my mouth and talking like a (excuse me) smart ass? Now if I were to say, Code Geass has so many ratings compared to other shows, then you could have said that. But that's not what I said.
Naruto and Bleach, as you should know, have bad reviews, and bad ratings. Bad means like, below 6 on average.
On April 30 2012 08:18 Zergneedsfood wrote: Code Geass is basically an anime where you turn off your brain and enjoy everything, because if you actually thought about it, all you'd think about is how bad most of the characters are and how nonsensical the plot is (hey look, 19th century battle tactics with robots! \o/ )
This is why everyone thought Guilty Crown was garbage. It's because they forgot that when you have Code Geass writers, the best way to enjoy is to just not think about it. If you threw all of that away, it was actually pretty entertaining.
Hm, I heard many bad things about GC. When the show was halfway done, I checked its ratings on ANN, it was very very mixed... some were rating masterpiece, but the same number were rating 2/10, 4/10, 6/10, etc. But towards the end, its ratings got decent.
I saw the first two episodes, which were alright. They were enjoyable, but I wasn't hooked. Actually the first episode was wtf and was like a direct copy of CG's first episode, but I could actually understand what was going on in the second episode, though it still seemed like Code Geass but just smashed up and remixed though with better animation quality. I heard it gets bad in the middle, but then the MC mans up and the show gets better again.
Anyway, so if you were like me and turned off our brains and were able to enjoy it, how would you rate GC in comparison to CG? Worth the watch or not?
(Btw actually the main writer Goro Taniguchi wasn't on it, only the other guy ichiro or something.)
Okey I guess ill try to explain this as best I can. This may not make sense tho.There are 2 kinds of people. Those who can watch a show and not think about it and really be entertained and those who watch a show and think alot on what they are seeing. And one of the most important things to person #2 is "Believably". Some people like a well thought out plot and maybe take away something from a show.
I watched CG in like 3 days. And all I thought was meh. It bothered me on how lazy the writting was. It felt like the creators had a meeting and just thought of anything that would shock ppl or cause some emotion to the audiance. The thing is it seemed like it was just executed on the fly with no build up or anything. It was almost insulting to the viewers. Instead of fanservise in the sense of nudity they gave fanservice in the since of drama. They just throw it in there and let the audience go fucking bonkers. It didnt have to make any sense at all.
If you want to call somthing a masterpeice then it has to apeal to both a regular and critical audiance.
Well I'd have to disagree, and the majority of viewers do as well, according to many anime websites and reviews. Also, Code Geass is not just a mecha anime. I did not watch it for the mecha. It balances quite a lot of different things, but the thing that made it unique was its high dramatization and style. How many shows are out there that can hit so many different audiences?
You have to disagree? Really? How many of those have you watched? "Not just a mecha anime"? Do you even know what you are fucking talking about? What is "just" a mecha anime??? Gundam?? Say that, please. Show how ignorant you are.
Majority of viewers? You think Code Geass is more popular that Mobile Suit Gundam, an anime franchise that has been going strong for over 30 years, is a cultural icon in Japan? Why don't you check out some of the sales numbers for Gundam Unicorn, or Gundam SEED HD Remaster? Or Mazinger Z, which regularly had ratings in the 20% and 30% range, which was one of the most influential anime of all time? Code Geass never even came CLOSE to that! Oh wait, I forgot, you are using ANN and MAL as your gold standard, for some retarded reason.
How many shows are out that can hit so many different audiences? What the fuck are you even talking about? Lets see, what audience does Code Geass appeal too...? I guess, boys and men, with primary focus on boys. Hmm, I wonder how many shows there are out there that hit both of those?
I did not note popularity as quality. I never used that, so how about you not put words into my mouth and talking like a (excuse me) smart ass? Now if I were to say, Code Geass has so many ratings compared to other shows, then you could have said that. But that's not what I said.
Naruto and Bleach, as you should know, have bad reviews, and bad ratings. Bad means like, below 6 on average.
lol this guy, he doesn't even remember points he made. How many times have you mentioned it being rated well on shit like ANN, in the past few pages? As if you are using that as a crutch it say Geass isn't actually terrible? In terms of popularity, Naruto and Bleach shit on like all other anime. Just look at the viewership numbers they get.
Very much agreed about Clannad, I think one of the big reasons I liked the anime so much was how well they managed to incorporate all the different routes.
No. You have no soul.
I didn't play the VN, and I heard a lot was left out (how much exactly? probably not too much, or were the different routes actually fleshed out that far past just dating?) but it's nice to hear that :D
I tried to watch Kanon (watched like 13 episodes or so on request of friend, claiming it was great) but I got bored... the arcs weren't smooth, but in Clannad they did a good job focusing on each arc while also developing the other characters and plot etc.
In all seriousness, when you've both watched the anime and read the VN it feels like that your feelings about the anime depends on which characters you liked in the VN. I for one really disliked Nagisa so the anime ends up really meh to me, especially as my fave heroine (Kotomi) has her route violently raped and then fed to the dogs, with no chance of being saved. I feel like I'm the only person that really liked Kotomi though, lol. Just get a lot of hate from people when I mention her, especially from people who only watched the anime.
Wait whoa whoa that is seriously what happens in the kotomi route? i didn't know a romance/drama could be so... cruel? or is that just one of her endings?
Also, I also didn't like Nagisa that much, though I didn't play the VN. In the anime I liked tomoyo the most, so I was quite disappointed to see no "arc" for her. How much of the game, would you say, is Nagisa compared to each of the other heroines?
I, having only watched the anime, will say that I liked Kotomi too ^^. Sunohara was the best though ! kekek
I didn't mean literally...it was figuratively speaking. >_> Though what they did was about as bad.
In the VN Nagisa is still the main heroine and she usually plays a part in other routes (for no reason at all, seriously fuck her can't she gtfo she just pisses me off lol) but the other ones actually don't get hella friendzoned in their routes (obviously) and they cut out a lot of things,even a whole route though it wasn't really relevant to the main plot anyway. It's obvious why they did it but still sucks.
Well there are mirrors between elements in Code Geass and tons of media, its not like Code Geass was ground breaking in terms of drama. You spelt it out pretty well in your previous post. The thing that makes Code Geass "unique" (aka bad) is how it just bombards you with constant twists and shocks, few of which make any senses.
On April 30 2012 12:29 Ecael wrote: a lulzy comparison that I'd just like to throw out, probably both Uta and I would put LB>S;G simply because of Refrain being better than Kurisu route into true end.
Mmm, perhaps when comparing the routes as a whole... I was thinking more along the lines of comparing the + Show Spoiler +
plot-reset-go-back-and-fix-it moment. S;G has the entire story dedicated to explaining how it happens whereas LB is basically, oh that wasn't quite the ending you wanted? Here, try again! I mean, I still liked LB, just saying that for me at least, the concrete explanations for the plot reset and time looping in S;G made the moment more epic compared to the standard Key magic arm-waving business in LB
Personally, I consider them both to be happy endings just for the sake of having a happy ending. The majority of Steins;Gate's story is about Kyouma's quest to save whats-her-face from dying. He then learns that in order to do this, he has to undo all of the changes he's made to the timeline. This, of course, hints at and leads to the revelation that if he returns to the original timeline, Kurisu is gonna die. At which point he promptly breaks down, recovers, and goes through with the deed.
And then it turns out that there's a loophole he can abuse to save Kurisu as well. This development isn't strictly bad, but considering the emotional scene he just had, and considering that every other time he tried to change past/future events it fucked him over, it feels like a cheap way to get a happy end.
Now compare that with Little Busters magic. Certainly, the reasoning that Steins;Gate gives for the happy end is more concrete due to the well defined rules they've established for the universe. Little Busters, on the other hand, has no such rules in place. I mean they didn't really explain how they made their fictional world, so in that sense, rewinding is also fair game. In the end, the sequences in both VNs are more or less the same thing.
On April 30 2012 12:29 Ecael wrote: Jokes aside, Kanon was standard early works of Key, all emotion and drama but weak thematically. Clannad was strong w/ the family theme and was an excellent adaptation of the Key formula up to that point into their new style but ultimately fell a bit short from point to point. Neither can really match up to LB in terms of how the VN wraps up, though far as individual routes go Clannad trumps LB hard.
MLA...well Sent would kill me if I bitched about it, but it is just not my thing.
Very much agreed about Clannad, I think one of the big reasons I liked the anime so much was how well they managed to incorporate all the different routes. I've tried to go back to the VN a few times after watching the anime, but couldn't really get back into it.
If Eca's issues with MLA are anything like mine, it has a lot to do with the fact that almost all the deaths are telegraphed far in advance. It basically follows the oft-used formula of whoever gets character development is gonna die. For instance, Isumi has a heart to heart conversation with Takeru at one point. She promptly dies in the very next battle. With the four main girls, I felt it was made pretty clear that they weren't going to die in at least the first three quarters of the story. And once the first of them died, it was only natural that the rest would follow suit.
Basically, the way deaths were written into the story had a major detrimental effect on the emotional impact they had for me. I also wasn't overly attached to any of the characters. If Sent is to be believed, that's because I skipped over a fair amount of Extra, but I hardly think that cliche plot and petty drama would make me like them any better.
Also, the sci-fi and associated technobabble is borderline retarded. For the most part, I enjoy it when a writer puts some time into researching whatever they're writing about so that it makes some modicum of sense. What I do not enjoy is having 10-15 minute segments of science talk that is barely relevant to the story. Short, concise explanations would have sufficed.
That said, the action scenes were pretty enjoyable, and the story has its fair share of epic moments. I feel it was still a worthwhile read, but wouldn't rank it as one of my favorite VNs.
On April 30 2012 12:29 Ecael wrote: a lulzy comparison that I'd just like to throw out, probably both Uta and I would put LB>S;G simply because of Refrain being better than Kurisu route into true end.
Mmm, perhaps when comparing the routes as a whole... I was thinking more along the lines of comparing the + Show Spoiler +
plot-reset-go-back-and-fix-it moment. S;G has the entire story dedicated to explaining how it happens whereas LB is basically, oh that wasn't quite the ending you wanted? Here, try again! I mean, I still liked LB, just saying that for me at least, the concrete explanations for the plot reset and time looping in S;G made the moment more epic compared to the standard Key magic arm-waving business in LB
Personally, I consider them both to be happy endings just for the sake of having a happy ending. The majority of Steins;Gate's story is about Kyouma's quest to save whats-her-face from dying. He then learns that in order to do this, he has to undo all of the changes he's made to the timeline. This, of course, hints at and leads to the revelation that if he returns to the original timeline, Kurisu is gonna die. At which point he promptly breaks down, recovers, and goes through with the deed.
And then it turns out that there's a loophole he can abuse to save Kurisu as well. This development isn't strictly bad, but considering the emotional scene he just had, and considering that every other time he tried to change past/future events it fucked him over, it feels like a cheap way to get a happy end.
Now compare that with Little Busters magic. Certainly, the reasoning that Steins;Gate gives for the happy end is more concrete due to the well defined rules they've established for the universe. Little Busters, on the other hand, has no such rules in place. I mean they didn't really explain how they made their fictional world, so in that sense, rewinding is also fair game. In the end, the sequences in both VNs are more or less the same thing.
On April 30 2012 12:29 Ecael wrote: Jokes aside, Kanon was standard early works of Key, all emotion and drama but weak thematically. Clannad was strong w/ the family theme and was an excellent adaptation of the Key formula up to that point into their new style but ultimately fell a bit short from point to point. Neither can really match up to LB in terms of how the VN wraps up, though far as individual routes go Clannad trumps LB hard.
MLA...well Sent would kill me if I bitched about it, but it is just not my thing.
Very much agreed about Clannad, I think one of the big reasons I liked the anime so much was how well they managed to incorporate all the different routes. I've tried to go back to the VN a few times after watching the anime, but couldn't really get back into it.
If Eca's issues with MLA are anything like mine, it has a lot to do with the fact that almost all the deaths are telegraphed far in advance. It basically follows the oft-used formula of whoever gets character development is gonna die. For instance, Isumi has a heart to heart conversation with Takeru at one point. She promptly dies in the very next battle. With the four main girls, I felt it was made pretty clear that they weren't going to die in at least the first three quarters of the story. And once the first of them died, it was only natural that the rest would follow suit.
Basically, the way deaths were written into the story had a major detrimental effect on the emotional impact they had for me. I also wasn't overly attached to any of the characters. If Sent is to be believed, that's because I skipped over a fair amount of Extra, but I hardly think that cliche plot and petty drama would make me like them any better.
Also, the sci-fi and associated technobabble is borderline retarded. For the most part, I enjoy it when a writer puts some time into researching whatever they're writing about so that it makes some modicum of sense. What I do not enjoy is having 10-15 minute segments of science talk that is barely relevant to the story. Short, concise explanations would have sufficed.
That said, the action scenes were pretty enjoyable, and the story has its fair share of epic moments. I feel it was still a worthwhile read, but wouldn't rank it as one of my favorite VNs.
I actually don't remember Eca's problems with MLA, although I know I've talked with him about it before. \Well I might disagree with Ecael on alot of stuff, but at least when we do, he normally has rational reasons for it.
[01:48] <Elem> then you bust in going like [01:48] <Elem> THERE ARE MUCH BETTER [01:49] <Elem> BUT NOT TRANSLATED
Just now, the child there died Do you remember? The orphan boy, from the cafe... He, who you spoke to about "Justice" Against the Western Army, who'd ripped his parents away, he rose up with but a single stone, challenging them with more bravery than anyone else in the world. Without understanding the meaning of courage. And then... he died, as expected Ichijou, I'll say it once more. This is the last time I'll say it. I will not stop you from believing in "justice" and fighting for it. But stop "decorating" battle with the word "justice." To avoid hiding the disgusting truth about battle. To avoid bringing about a battle to follow that battle.
What you say is the truth. Battle is just a disgusting slaughter, not something that can be called "justice." To then spout "justice," dragging third parties into the conflict to continue fighting, is probably the worst of evils. It cannot be... forgiven. Even so. I will fight under the name of "justice"! I will destroy evil under that one word! And I will believe that at the end, there is a world where there exists no fighting.
-There was once a suit named Muramasa.
If I meet an ogre, I will slay the ogre. If I meet a saint, I will slay the saint.
The crimson suit hated battle, which brought forth the pointless deaths of people. At the apex of its hatred, it swore an oath that it would expose to people the disgusting truth of battle.
-There was once a suit named Masamune.
If there are ogres in the world, I will destroy ogres. If there is evil in the world, I will destroy evil.
The deep blue suit hated the evil that seduced otherwise peaceful people. At the apex of its hatred, it swore an oath that it would bring forth the ultimate enemy of evil, justice.
The reason of the suit -- is found here!
There was once a suit named Muramasa. There was once a suit named Masamune.
Together they sought. Suits that wished for peace.
Well I'd have to disagree, and the majority of viewers do as well, according to many anime websites and reviews. Also, Code Geass is not just a mecha anime. I did not watch it for the mecha. It balances quite a lot of different things, but the thing that made it unique was its high dramatization and style. How many shows are out there that can hit so many different audiences?
You have to disagree? Really? How many of those have you watched? "Not just a mecha anime"? Do you even know what you are fucking talking about? What is "just" a mecha anime??? Gundam?? Say that, please. Show how ignorant you are.
Majority of viewers? You think Code Geass is more popular that Mobile Suit Gundam, an anime franchise that has been going strong for over 30 years, is a cultural icon in Japan? Why don't you check out some of the sales numbers for Gundam Unicorn, or Gundam SEED HD Remaster? Or Mazinger Z, which regularly had ratings in the 20% and 30% range, which was one of the most influential anime of all time? Code Geass never even came CLOSE to that! Oh wait, I forgot, you are using ANN and MAL as your gold standard, for some retarded reason.
How many shows are out that can hit so many different audiences? What the fuck are you even talking about? Lets see, what audience does Code Geass appeal too...? I guess, boys and men, with primary focus on boys. Hmm, I wonder how many shows there are out there that hit both of those?
I did not note popularity as quality. I never used that, so how about you not put words into my mouth and talking like a (excuse me) smart ass? Now if I were to say, Code Geass has so many ratings compared to other shows, then you could have said that. But that's not what I said.
Naruto and Bleach, as you should know, have bad reviews, and bad ratings. Bad means like, below 6 on average.
lol this guy, he doesn't even remember points he made. How many times have you mentioned it being rated well on shit like ANN, in the past few pages? As if you are using that as a crutch it say Geass isn't actually terrible? In terms of popularity, Naruto and Bleach shit on like all other anime. Just look at the viewership numbers they get.
I haven't watched much Gundam at all, but there's no point in me trying to compare CG to all those mecha anime if I, similarly, could point to a bunch of <insert any other genre that CG falls under> anime and list them to be below CG, and have you try to argue against it.
By not just a mecha anime, I mean it can be categorized under other genres as well. As we should both know, many animes have different elements from different genres, same with anything that could remotely be called a literary work. I'm not trying to say it's some kind of superior mecha anime that is better than the norm. I was saying I didn't watch Code Geass just because it was a mecha anime to show that its mechas was not the main reason the show appealed to me or got me to watch it.
Now, you are contradicting yourself. You said I said CG was popular, and hence good. But now you are making the same mistake. You are saying that because so many watch Gundam, it is better than Code Geass? Who is the one forgetting now? (Note: Actually maybe it was because I was unclear about "majority of viewers". I mean the majority of CG's viewers, not the majority of mecha viewers, or anime viewers, etc. etc.)
I am not using it as a gold standard, but referring to it is a better piece of support than that of which you have used, which include your own list of favorite mechas, as if you were expecting me to not have watched any of them, then attack me as you did now for not having watched many of them. Again you put words into my mouth. It is simply a piece i used for evidence. If you wish, I could probably look for other pieces of evidence to try to persuade you. Also, I did not even mention MAL.
Code Geass hits yaoi fangirls as well. It has mecha, drama, some comedy, lots of fanservice for those who like it, shiny mechas and fights for those who like it, a sexy bishounen male lead for those who like it, a cute dude with a cute butt ( or something ) which fangirls like (?). It's sci-fi but got some fantasy themes as well with the geass and magic and stuff.
Once again you're not understanding what I'm saying, so let me clarify. I am not saying Code Geass is popular, and hence is good.
"In terms of popularity, Naruto and Bleach shit on like all other anime. Just look at the viewership numbers they get."
Now what does this have to do with anything? I can't understand the point there. Or are you going to claim to me that I'm still saying that popularity = quality? Oh wait, that's something that you claimed, or I guess rather, implied, with the gundam stuff and sales.
Now, if you would actually put up a good argument instead of just rejecting my points without properly explaining why you disagree or why my argument is weak, invalid, baseless, or whatever you may be trying to do, that would be great.
How many times have you said Code Geass is bad? Does it even matter how many times? I kept bringing up the point that the majority of viewers like Code Geass and/or thought it was good for multiple arguments. If it bothers you that I'm posting so much, then sorry. If it really bothers you though that I keep using Code Geass's ratings and good reviews as evidence/support for my points, maybe you should just stop reading my arguments.
Your hostility is annoying, taunting me to insult the Gundam series or whatnot, let alone immature. Are you trying to get me to flame at you? You call ANN shit for no good reason. Then you are attacking me for supporting my argument.
You really need to just calm down and take things slower... I already explained to you that I am not saying that popularity = quality, yet in your last response, you still say that I have, just because I've quoted CG getting good ratings on ANN. Again, I said ratings, not number of votes, not number of viewers. Before laughing at me, you should first respect my argument, opinion, and points, unless you're just going to rage, in which I'm going to try my best to ignore. If you want me to respect your opinions, then I expect you to be able to respect mine.
By not just a mecha anime, I mean it can be categorized under other genres as well. As we should both know, many animes have different elements from different genres, same with anything that could remotely be called a literary work. I'm not trying to say it's some kind of superior mecha anime that is better than the norm. I was saying I didn't watch Code Geass just because it was a mecha anime to show that its mechas was not the main reason the show appealed to me or got me to watch it.
...But its still a mecha anime, and mecha is a very large focus in Code Geass. Whats wrong with calling it what it is? No mecha show is "just" a mecha show, they all have their drama, action, comedy, etc etc.
I haven't watched much Gundam at all, but there's no point in me trying to compare CG to all those mecha anime if I, similarly, could point to a bunch of psychological anime and list them to be below CG, and have you try to argue against it.
So you have barely seen any of them, yet decide that you disagree those shows are better? Shouldn't you know what shows you are comparing a "masterpiece" to before you start declaring it a "masterpiece"? How would you even know that if you haven't watched them? I've watched them all, and I've watched Geass, enabling me to compare them. It would be like if the only movies I've ever watched in my entire life was Star Wars Episode 1, and then a bunch of Michael Bay shit, and declared SW ep1 as a masterpiece. People would call me foolish, right?
You are contradicting yourself. You said I said CG was popular, and hence good. But now you are making the same mistake. You are saying that because so many watch Gundam, it is better than Code Geass. Who is the one forgetting now?
You were using popularity as an argument ("majority of viewers think Geass is better than all those anime!!!"), so I showed you that you were wrong. I'd be happy to not have use such arguments, since popular opinion is meaningless in discussions on how good something is, but if you want to use it, then so be it.
(Note: Actually maybe it was because I was unclear about "majority of viewers". I mean the majority of CG's viewers, not the majority of mecha viewers, or anime viewers, etc. etc.)
Source?
I am not using it as a gold standard. Again you put words into my mouth. It is simply a piece i used for evidence. If you wish, I could probably look for other pieces of evidence to try to persuade you. Also, I did not even mention MAL.
Uhhh, thus far thats been your only argument for it being a masterpiece. How many times have you mentioned "ratings on anime sites"? "Majority opinion" or "reviews and ratings on anime sites" don't mean anything at all to me. English anime review sites aren't even the best indicators of popularity.
Code Geass hits yaoi fangirls as well. It has mecha, drama, some comedy, lots of fanservice for those who like it, shiny mechas and fights for those who like it, a sexy bishounen male lead for those who like it, a cute dude with a cute butt ( or something ) which fangirls like (?). It's sci-fi but got some fantasy themes as well with the geass and magic and stuff.
Gundam hits yaoi fangirls as well. Look no farther than how long Jesus Yamato the God was #1 on the Newtype Character polls for evidence. Hits mecha fans as well, obviously. Hits drama fans as well, obviously. Has some comedy in it, some more than others. Has fanservice, some more than others. Often has sexy bishounen male leads. Has sci-fi as well, plus fantasy (newtype magic). So tell me again how Geass is unique in that it hits so many arguments? I'm just using Gundam here as an example, but there are plenty of other shows I could use that would fit even better, like Macross Frontier, for example.
Now, if you would actually put up a good argument instead of just rejecting my points without properly explaining why you disagree or why my argument is weak, invalid, baseless, or whatever you may be trying to do, that would be great.
Uhhh, you said it was a masterpiece. I disagree. You provide popularity as a reason. Popularity is pointless. You say it appeals to a ton of audiences, as a reason. So do alot of shows (meaning Geass is hardly unique in that). And here we are. Looking for more reasons as to why its a masterpiece.
On April 30 2012 15:10 Spazer wrote: Episode two of Hyouka. Time to pass judgement: + Show Spoiler [Hyouka 2] +
The story this time was a lot better than episode one.
I enjoyed the formula alot more than I expected to for some reason. Although if its just the same reluctant smartass getting dragged around in every episode and bad stories Im going to rage. As for the bro, hes every bit the guy you'd want to be if you were forced to pick.
On April 30 2012 06:07 Yoshi Kirishima wrote: I think the main thing that disappoints me of people not liking Code Geass as much as me is not that they don't like it, but that they seem SO surprised that people like me like it so much. The majority of its viewers thought it was a master piece, or close to it. Just check its ratings on anime sites, it has one of the highest ratings in all 3500+ or so notable anime works out there.
So really, the people who don't think it's good or didn't like it much are in the minority.
The reason CG R2 is rated so high on MAL and lots of other anime sites is because /a/ thought it would be funny to do that.
And there's definately not 3500+ notable anime.
That's a matter of opinion. When I mean notable I mean notable enough for ANN to have on its list of anime. Also I can't believe if you really think /a/ effected the score that much. Look at the ratings 5 and below, even without /a/, it would be rated high. You think /a/ really contributed anything significant to the 3200 votes of 10/10? Also if they really thought it was funny to do that, they probably all voted for Masterpiece. So even if all 3200 were /a/ users, it would still be rated highly. A BAD rating is like 5 or lower average. 8 is not bad, 7 is not bad, 6 is not bad. 6 is usually "ok" or "mediocre" or something like that.
Also, look at Code Geass season 1. It has 7000 ratings, and most of us here say that, if you just look at Code Geass season 1, it wasn't bad. I doubt /a/ voted there and made its ratings really high as well, do you?
Now if 3000 of the votes for Code Geass R2 were all from /a/, the show would still average out to be an 8 or 9, which is still a high rating. However that means that only a third of the people who watched and rated Code Geass watched and rated R2, which seems quite unlikely.
So unless if I'm missing some other bit of info or reasoning here, my claim still stands that people who think Code Geass is bad bad are the minority.
On April 30 2012 07:00 solidbebe wrote:
On April 30 2012 06:37 Tabbris wrote: Naruto is a masterpiece
Are you trying to turn this into nuclear warfare?
Haha that made me laugh xD
On April 30 2012 06:36 Tabbris wrote:
On April 30 2012 06:07 Yoshi Kirishima wrote: I think the main thing that disappoints me of people not liking Code Geass as much as me is not that they don't like it, but that they seem SO surprised that people like me like it so much. The majority of its viewers thought it was a master piece, or close to it. Just check its ratings on anime sites, it has one of the highest ratings in all 3500+ or so notable anime works out there.
So really, the people who don't think it's good or didn't like it much are in the minority.
Masterpiece (or chef d'œuvre) in modern usage refers to a creation that has been given much critical praise, especially one that is considered the greatest work of a person's career or to a work of outstanding creativity, skill or workmanship.
Well what do you mean by critical praise here? I'm just using masterpiece in the way that it is, relative to other similar works, one of the best, and/or is one of the best works of that creator. Which I think everyone should be able to agree is Goro Taniguchi's best.
If you want to use that definition in terms of "critical" praise, as in, does this show "deserve" to be praised, rather than whether people like it or not (for example, lots of people like naruto but it sucks), then Code Geass has won numerous awards. So, yes, it is still a masterpiece. Not many anime win several awards, let alone one, especially considering how many meidocre anime there are that people don't even know about cus... well, they're not notable xD
On April 30 2012 07:05 Sentenal wrote:
On April 30 2012 00:37 Kaal wrote:
On April 29 2012 21:50 FreudianTrip wrote: Let me prefix this with the fact that I'm not a huge anime guy, I just watch the main ones (Champloo, Trigun, Bebop etc.)
So after consulting the reccomendation image I watched Darker Than Black, started off thinking it was awful but it got pretty good towards the end.
I've finished the first series and I notice there seems to be a season 1.5 and 2. Is it worth watching either of these? I kind of feel like I've experienced the arc of the story and don't really know where it can go that's any good. Just Hei being chased for 23 episodes doesn't seem very exciting.
Should I bother with it or just move on to something else?
Move on to something else.
S2 is terrible, as is the OVA.
Sent, why the fuck did you start reading hoshizora. That's like the exact opposite of anything you'd ever like.
It's like if you read Da Capo.
But! But! Those blonde chicks! Really hot!
On April 30 2012 05:12 mcimba42 wrote: I don't think I've ever posted in this thread but I occasionally lurk around for a couple of pages and I happened to see the Code Geass discussion above, and I think there are a lot of people who just try to take that show way more seriously than they should.
I see people here watching and enjoying those generic moe moe "cute girls doing cute things" shows that air every season, but then they claim Code Geass is awful for having a bunch of plot holes and a generally pants on head retarded plot. But is that all there is to anime? Do you really watch cartoons for the amazing literary value they're well known to have? I don't think anyone will say they liked Geass because of the deep psychological themes, or the intricate plot, or the interesting and well developed characters. I personally enjoyed it because of stuff like the brilliant military tactics from the brilliant military mastermind that is Lelouch (such as baiting people onto a bridge and making it collapse, baiting people into a building and making it collapse, or baiting people onto a bridge and making a building collapse on top of it), all of the fabulous and the borderline homo, the pretty mechas, the jumbled mess it called plot (like going through the "sword of akasha" and into the "world of c", where he met his deceased mother and did something to God, thus choosing the future instead of the past), the ridiculous chess metaphors (complete with illegal chess moves), the "Haha, I just predicted every word you would have said in a 20 minute long conversation and prepared a video of me replying perfectly with 100% exact timing to fool you. For the second time!", the "who is this guy, hasn't he died twice alrea--LOYALTY!!", the completely bullshit cliffhangers every other episode, the YAMATO DAMASHII NIHON BANZAI, etc, etc. It doesn't deserve any awards, not is it revolutionary (or even good, in terms of "objective" quality), but I found it really fucking enjoyable to watch. Sure, it was a trainwreck, but as any self respecting trainwreck, it's bloody entertaining to watch. It's definitely no masterpiece (in fact, I'd love to try whatever the guy who said that has been smoking recently), but I found it a hell of a lot more entertaining and enjoyable than anything in these last couple of seasons.
But that is wrong, laughably horribly wrong. Have you never read what people who love Code Geass say about the show??? The praise it for EXACTLY those reasons.
>brilliant tactics from brilliant military mastermind Stopped reading there.
Well it is a masterpiece, relatively. How many anime can you name that are better than Code Geass in its genre, or what it does? (Extremely stylistic anime hitting a bunch of audiences with a unique ending).
On April 30 2012 06:07 Yoshi Kirishima wrote: I think the main thing that disappoints me of people not liking Code Geass as much as me is not that they don't like it, but that they seem SO surprised that people like me like it so much. The majority of its viewers thought it was a master piece, or close to it. Just check its ratings on anime sites, it has one of the highest ratings in all 3500+ or so notable anime works out there.
So really, the people who don't think it's good or didn't like it much are in the minority.
Popularity is not an indication of quality, please stop using that argument. Or are you going to start telling me Naruto and Bleach are masterpieces?
Well I'd have to disagree, and the majority of viewers do as well, according to many anime websites and reviews. Also, Code Geass is not just a mecha anime. I did not watch it for the mecha. It balances quite a lot of different things, but the thing that made it unique was its high dramatization and style. How many shows are out there that can hit so many different audiences?
I did not note popularity as quality. I never used that, so how about you not put words into my mouth and talking like a (excuse me) smart ass? Now if I were to say, Code Geass has so many ratings compared to other shows, then you could have said that. But that's not what I said.
Naruto and Bleach, as you should know, have bad reviews, and bad ratings. Bad means like, below 6 on average.
On April 30 2012 08:18 Zergneedsfood wrote: Code Geass is basically an anime where you turn off your brain and enjoy everything, because if you actually thought about it, all you'd think about is how bad most of the characters are and how nonsensical the plot is (hey look, 19th century battle tactics with robots! \o/ )
This is why everyone thought Guilty Crown was garbage. It's because they forgot that when you have Code Geass writers, the best way to enjoy is to just not think about it. If you threw all of that away, it was actually pretty entertaining.
Hm, I heard many bad things about GC. When the show was halfway done, I checked its ratings on ANN, it was very very mixed... some were rating masterpiece, but the same number were rating 2/10, 4/10, 6/10, etc. But towards the end, its ratings got decent.
I saw the first two episodes, which were alright. They were enjoyable, but I wasn't hooked. Actually the first episode was wtf and was like a direct copy of CG's first episode, but I could actually understand what was going on in the second episode, though it still seemed like Code Geass but just smashed up and remixed though with better animation quality. I heard it gets bad in the middle, but then the MC mans up and the show gets better again.
Anyway, so if you were like me and turned off our brains and were able to enjoy it, how would you rate GC in comparison to CG? Worth the watch or not?
(Btw actually the main writer Goro Taniguchi wasn't on it, only the other guy ichiro or something.)
Okey I guess ill try to explain this as best I can. This may not make sense tho.There are 2 kinds of people. Those who can watch a show and not think about it and really be entertained and those who watch a show and think alot on what they are seeing. And one of the most important things to person #2 is "Believably". Some people like a well thought out plot and maybe take away something from a show.
I watched CG in like 3 days. And all I thought was meh. It bothered me on how lazy the writting was. It felt like the creators had a meeting and just thought of anything that would shock ppl or cause some emotion to the audiance. The thing is it seemed like it was just executed on the fly with no build up or anything. It was almost insulting to the viewers. Instead of fanservise in the sense of nudity they gave fanservice in the since of drama. They just throw it in there and let the audience go fucking bonkers. It didnt have to make any sense at all.
If you want to call somthing a masterpeice then it has to apeal to both a regular and critical audiance.
I agree and understand I was trying to emphasize that, for CG, I assumed the role of the first example you said. And because of that, I had a looot of fun. As long as there aren't too many unbelievable things, it doesn't affect me significantly (unless it gets to the level of MN, that is the level of where it detracted from my viewing experience, though the rest of the series still made it passable for me to keep watching and enjoy, but just barely).
Now of course, a genius 17 year old mastermind who wasn't even militarily trained beating a lot of generals and vice roys and stuff through only experienced gained in less than a year or so? Yes, that's quite outrageous, but the series seems quite conscious of this, unlike some parts in Mirai Nikki where they seem to expect you to ignore some things that are actually quite important to the seriousness of the scene.
I mean, I don't think many would argue that the writers were trying to make you believe that whole Sword of Akasha and C's World stuff with such little exploration and explanation. But what it ended up in was (in my eyes) another epic moment of Lelouch, triumphing over another foe. I was able to ignore the "uh, wtf... that doesn't make any sense" and just be like "omg he just did that! lol look at him and his epic voice acting"
Now again, if you want to call it a masterpiece in that way (and maybe I'm the minority that thinks that it's ok to call something a masterpiece in this situation if it's only the creator's best work, and not one of the best works of its kind), I would once again like to point out that it has won quite a few awards. Now, I know a 3 of these aren't awards that show it being good critically, which are the "most popular" award (which probably means simply that, popular) and the two awards given to the voice actors (which is in recognition of the actors not the show), but there are still
Best Screenplay, 2 "Best TV Animation" , and nomination for "Best Media Award"
For reference and more details, if it's convenient: + Show Spoiler +
Since its premiere, Code Geass: Lelouch of the Rebellion has collected numerous awards and accolades. At the sixth annual Tokyo Anime Awards held at the 2007 Tokyo International Anime Fair, Code Geass won the best TV anime series award.[57] The second season also got the award of "Best Screenplay" in the 2009 Tokyo Anime Fair.[58] In noted Japanese anime magazine Animage's 29th Annual Anime Grand Prix, Code Geass won the most popular series award, with Lelouch Lamperouge also being chosen as the most popular male character and "Colors" being chosen as the most popular song[citation needed]. In the 30th Annual Anime Grand Prix, Lelouch won first place again and C.C. was voted most popular female character[citation needed]. At the first Seiyū Awards held in 2007, Jun Fukuyama won the award for best actor in a leading role for his performance as Lelouch Lamperouge in the series, while Ami Koshimizu won the award for best actress in a supporting role for her performance as Kallen Stadtfeld.[59] Furthermore, Code Geass won the award for Best TV Animation at the twelfth Animation Kobe event, held annually in Kobe, Hyōgo Prefecture,[60] with R2 taking the award in the following year.[61] In the 2009, Seiun Award, Code Geass R2 was a nominee in the category "Best Media Award".[62]
(and maybe I'm the minority that thinks that it's ok to call something a masterpiece in this situation if it's only the creator's best work, and not one of the best works of its kind)
Well okay if that is your definition so be it, its a really really weird one, anyway who created Code Geass anyway lets see...
Director/Storyboard/Original Creator, Goro Taniguchi: Episode director and storyboard for Gundam X Director/Storyboard for Gun x Sword Episode Director for G Gundam Director/Storyboard for Scryed
Script/Original Creator, Ichiro Okouchi: Script for Turn A Gundam Script for RahXephon
... I don't think we can be friends anymore, not when you are telling me that Code Geass is better than stuff like G Gundam, Scryed, and Turn A Gundam.
By not just a mecha anime, I mean it can be categorized under other genres as well. As we should both know, many animes have different elements from different genres, same with anything that could remotely be called a literary work. I'm not trying to say it's some kind of superior mecha anime that is better than the norm. I was saying I didn't watch Code Geass just because it was a mecha anime to show that its mechas was not the main reason the show appealed to me or got me to watch it.
...But its still a mecha anime, and mecha is a very large focus in Code Geass. Whats wrong with calling it what it is? No mecha show is "just" a mecha show, they all have their drama, action, comedy, etc etc.
I haven't watched much Gundam at all, but there's no point in me trying to compare CG to all those mecha anime if I, similarly, could point to a bunch of psychological anime and list them to be below CG, and have you try to argue against it.
So you have barely seen any of them, yet decide that you disagree those shows are better? Shouldn't you know what shows you are comparing a "masterpiece" to before you start declaring it a "masterpiece"? How would you even know that if you haven't watched them? I've watched them all, and I've watched Geass, enabling me to compare them. It would be like if the only movies I've ever watched in my entire life was Star Wars Episode 1, and then a bunch of Michael Bay shit, and declared SW ep1 as a masterpiece. People would call me foolish, right?
You are contradicting yourself. You said I said CG was popular, and hence good. But now you are making the same mistake. You are saying that because so many watch Gundam, it is better than Code Geass. Who is the one forgetting now?
You were using popularity as an argument ("majority of viewers think Geass is better than all those anime!!!"), so I showed you that you were wrong. I'd be happy to not have use such arguments, since popular opinion is meaningless in discussions on how good something is, but if you want to use it, then so be it.
(Note: Actually maybe it was because I was unclear about "majority of viewers". I mean the majority of CG's viewers, not the majority of mecha viewers, or anime viewers, etc. etc.)
I am not using it as a gold standard. Again you put words into my mouth. It is simply a piece i used for evidence. If you wish, I could probably look for other pieces of evidence to try to persuade you. Also, I did not even mention MAL.
Uhhh, thus far thats been your only argument for it being a masterpiece. How many times have you mentioned "ratings on anime sites"? "Majority opinion" or "reviews and ratings on anime sites" don't mean anything at all to me. English anime review sites aren't even the best indicators of popularity.
Code Geass hits yaoi fangirls as well. It has mecha, drama, some comedy, lots of fanservice for those who like it, shiny mechas and fights for those who like it, a sexy bishounen male lead for those who like it, a cute dude with a cute butt ( or something ) which fangirls like (?). It's sci-fi but got some fantasy themes as well with the geass and magic and stuff.
Gundam hits yaoi fangirls as well. Look no farther than how long Jesus Yamato the God was #1 on the Newtype Character polls for evidence. Hits mecha fans as well, obviously. Hits drama fans as well, obviously. Has some comedy in it, some more than others. Has fanservice, some more than others. Often has sexy bishounen male leads. Has sci-fi as well, plus fantasy (newtype magic). So tell me again how Geass is unique in that it hits so many arguments? I'm just using Gundam here as an example, but there are plenty of other shows I could use that would fit even better, like Macross Frontier, for example.
Now, if you would actually put up a good argument instead of just rejecting my points without properly explaining why you disagree or why my argument is weak, invalid, baseless, or whatever you may be trying to do, that would be great.
Uhhh, you said it was a masterpiece. I disagree. You provide popularity as a reason. Popularity is pointless. You say it appeals to a ton of audiences, as a reason. So do alot of shows (meaning Geass is hardly unique in that). And here we are. Looking for more reasons as to why its a masterpiece.
Yes it is a mecha anime, but it's also a fantasy anime, a sci-fi anime, etc. etc. I mean that it seemed like you were saying that it has to be better than many many mecha anime just because one of its genres is mecha. If we were to go along that line of thought, we could also look at all anime that have psychological themes in it, or war themes in it, sci-fi, etc.
Ok, it was wrong of me to say CG is better than them
"You were using popularity as an argument ("majority of viewers think Geass is better than all those anime!!!"), so I showed you that you were wrong. I'd be happy to not have use such arguments, since popular opinion is meaningless in discussions on how good something is, but if you want to use it, then so be it."
This part is just wrong... Again, majority of Code Geass viewers THOUGHT CODE GEASS WAS GOOD, at least according to the ratings on ANN. I hope that is clear for you this time, it is the third time I've said this.
I absolutely do not want to use it, and once again you are irritating me by making it sound like I still want to use it.
"Uhhh, thus far thats been your only argument for it being a masterpiece. How many times have you mentioned "ratings on anime sites"? "Majority opinion" or "reviews and ratings on anime sites" don't mean anything at all to me. English anime review sites aren't even the best indicators of popularity."
No it has not... check my other recent posts. In short, it's Goro's best work so far, it's one of the best anime of its kind and one of the best anime ever (both opinions of course, but it is still an argument).
Know the reason why I keep mentioning that? Because no one's been able to counter them, and because you keep repeating the same things over and over even though I say that you're not arguing about the right things.
If it doesn't ratings and reviewers of thousands of other people don't mean anything at all to you, then I guess we have nothing more to say, as I think it's surprising that you don't think of yourself to be in the minority that thinks CG is overall bad, but you don't think so, unless you have something else that can further this discussion, cus I can't think of anything right now.
Wait what? Once again you're saying "best indicators of popularity". Are you trolling me now?
"Gundam hits yaoi fangirls as well. Look no farther than how long Jesus Yamato the God was #1 on the Newtype Character polls for evidence. Hits mecha fans as well, obviously. Hits drama fans as well, obviously. Has some comedy in it, some more than others. Has fanservice, some more than others. Often has sexy bishounen male leads. Has sci-fi as well, plus fantasy (newtype magic). So tell me again how Geass is unique in that it hits so many arguments? I'm just using Gundam here as an example, but there are plenty of other shows I could use that would fit even better, like Macross Frontier, for example."
Ok then, let me say it a new way. CG is able to, I feel, not only hit many audiences, but do it better than many other animes and, furthermore, do it with a unique bombastic and stylistic nature.
"Uhhh, you said it was a masterpiece. I disagree. You provide popularity as a reason. Popularity is pointless. You say it appeals to a ton of audiences, as a reason. So do alot of shows (meaning Geass is hardly unique in that). And here we are. Looking for more reasons as to why its a masterpiece."
(and maybe I'm the minority that thinks that it's ok to call something a masterpiece in this situation if it's only the creator's best work, and not one of the best works of its kind)
Well okay if that is your definition so be it, its a really really weird one, anyway who created Code Geass anyway lets see...
Director/Storyboard/Original Creator, Goro Taniguchi: Episode director and storyboard for Gundam X Director/Storyboard for Gun x Sword Episode Director for G Gundam Director/Storyboard for Scryed
Script/Original Creator, Ichiro Okouchi: Script for Turn A Gundam Script for RahXephon
... I don't think we can be friends anymore, not when you are telling me that Code Geass is better than stuff like G Gundam, Scryed, and Turn A Gundam.
Hm I wouldn't say it's better than G Gundam, which is something I really loved from my childhood, but I wouldn't call it Goro's work neither. He was only an episode director, he wasn't in the main "lead" of the series, unless I'm mistaken. Same with Gundam X.
However, I haven't seen Gun x Sword, so perhaps I should check that out. I'll take back calling CG a masterpiece, since that definition of "author's best work" could mean a lot of other bad anime out there are masterpieces, which doesn't mean much unless if it's compared to others.
This part is just wrong... Again, majority of Code Geass viewers THOUGHT CODE GEASS WAS GOOD, at least according to the ratings on ANN. I hope that is clear for you this time, it is the third time I've said this.
So wait, ANN now divides up ratings based on those who liked Code Geass, and those who don't? Or do you have some other source that says that people who liked Code Geass like it more than all of those others? Because you did say that people who liked Code Geass also liked Code Geass more than all those other anime I mentioned.
No it has not... check my other recent posts. In short, it's Goro's best work so far, it's one of the best anime of its kind and one of the best anime ever (both opinions of course, but it is still an argument).
Know the reason why I keep mentioning that? Because no one's been able to counter them, and because you keep repeating the same things over and over even though I say that you're not arguing about the right things.
Have you seen Gun x Sword, Scryed, G Gundam, and Gundam X?
Counter them? You saying "OMG ANN SAYS THIS" is a completely pointless argument. You aren't gonna convince anyone with that rubbish.
If it doesn't ratings and reviewers of thousands of other people don't mean anything at all to you, then I guess we have nothing more to say, as I think it's surprising that you don't think of yourself to be in the minority that thinks CG is overall bad, but you don't think so, unless you have something else that can further this discussion, cus I can't think of anything right now.
Why should it? An even greater number of people would have me believe Naruto and Bleach are the greatest anime ever, but I won't buy it.
Wait what? Once again you're saying "best indicators of popularity". Are you trolling me now?
Japanese sales numbers and ratings are the best indicators. Because despite what you might think, Anime is sorta a billion times bigger in Japan than it is internationally.
Ok then, let me say it a new way. CG is able to, I feel, not only hit many audiences, but do it better than many other animes and, furthermore, do it with a unique bombastic and stylistic nature.
Says the guy who hasn't seen any of these "other animes". Didn't you just say in your last post that you hadn't seen any of those other anime I said were better???
Once again, I could also name many animes that I feel CG were better than, many of which you haven't watched, theoretically. That is not a good way to form an argument. No one has watched ALL anime.
Anime in japan is big, but how does that make 5000 ratings any less significant of a sample size?
Yes, but once again, Naruto and Bleach don't work here because there are also many many who say they are terrible.
You misread me agaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaain.
"Again, majority of Code Geass viewers THOUGHT CODE GEASS WAS GOOD, at least according to the ratings on ANN. I hope that is clear for you this time, it is the third time I've said this."
"Majority of Code Geass viewers" means viewers who watched Code Geass.
"though Code Geass was good" means they thought it was good, not bad.
Is that clear enough for you now? Because I can't think of a better way to clear up this misunderstanding.
EPT
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/5cuRT.jpg)
I was trying to emphasize that, for CG, I assumed the role of the first example you said. And because of that, I had a looot of fun. As long as there aren't too many unbelievable things, it doesn't affect me significantly (unless it gets to the level of MN, that is the level of where it detracted from my viewing experience, though the rest of the series still made it passable for me to keep watching and enjoy, but just barely). 
