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Shafanhow
United States47 Posts
On January 10 2012 23:08 Velr wrote: That allows you not to fucking stab someone with a knive. Yes, the kid probably had it rough... But the answer is not to fucking kill your bully. The law says otherwise and rightly so. | ||
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paralleluniverse
4065 Posts
On January 10 2012 22:55 Miss_Cleo wrote: Nobody deserves to be killed for bullying someone. Jose had other options to diffuse the situation, but he decided the best course of action was to stab someone to death. Nobody deserves to be bullied each day, then surrounded by 10 punks who then beat the shit out of you. | ||
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Miss_Cleo
United States406 Posts
On January 10 2012 23:05 Black[CAT] wrote: Yes. there are other options. But this was probably his last minute desperation attempt at not getting beaten up for no good reason for the unknown how many times of his life. Seriously, its not like you can have a police bodyguarding you all the time. OR CAN YOU?! Sorry, had to. Maybe not a bodyguard but telling someone could have helped. Even if it meant him changing schools to avoid further abuse, which is infinitely better than stabbing someone to death. Don't get me wrong, I'm not sticking up for the bully, but death is a big price for such a crime, even if the person was complete trash. | ||
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teamamerica
United States958 Posts
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Jibba
United States22883 Posts
Also not mentioned in the OP is that Saavedra is a special ed student. | ||
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Miss_Cleo
United States406 Posts
On January 10 2012 23:10 paralleluniverse wrote: Nobody deserves to be bullied each day, then surrounded by 10 punks who then beat the shit out of you. I agree with you there. But my point still stands. | ||
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shizna
United Kingdom803 Posts
On January 10 2012 23:02 Black[CAT] wrote: I would be mad if my kid bullied someone. Besides, it was self defense. Being bullied for a year. That is really painful for that kid. And honestly, if some d-bag just bullied people for years and no contribution to society, would you deem him worthy to live? Of course we should not judge who should live or die. That bully will prolly turn into some useless criminal in the end or just trash of society. i haven't seen any evidence that shows that 100% of bullies have no contribution to society? i can empathize with people who have been bullied, i was bullied (being threatened, punched, kicked etc) by a few during secondary school years. from the same people who were my good friends in early school. but i would never wish harm upon them, even in self defense.. i have this thing called 'guilt', which makes me different from the bully. but i guess the 'victim' in the news story didn't have that. | ||
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paralleluniverse
4065 Posts
On January 10 2012 23:19 Miss_Cleo wrote: I agree with you there. But my point still stands. Self-defense. The kid got bashed, he defended himself, the bully got killed. There is nothing wrong here. The kid was legally allowed to defend himself, and the courts agreed. Could the situation have ended more ideally without someone being killed? Maybe, or maybe he would get beat up more. But regardless of whether there was a better ending, there is, again, nothing wrong here. | ||
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Fleshcut
Germany592 Posts
The victim is not guilty at all for what the society did to him. | ||
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Shafanhow
United States47 Posts
On January 10 2012 23:21 shizna wrote: i haven't seen any evidence that shows that 100% of bullies have no contribution to society? i can empathize with people who have been bullied, i was bullied (being threatened, punched, kicked etc) by a few during secondary school years. from the same people who were my good friends in early school. but i would never wish harm upon them, even in self defense.. i have this thing called 'guilt', which makes me different from the bully. but i guess the 'victim' in the news story didn't have that. Turn the other cheek only goes so far. Not everyone is such a saint.The kid that was bullied was just an imperfect human being. Thankfully here in the US there are laws that allow a weak person being beaten and tormented to defend themselves when pushed to the brink. It's sad that the kid died, but it was a necessary evil. | ||
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GreEny K
Germany7312 Posts
On January 10 2012 23:16 Jibba wrote: Nuno's parents think he was a saint. He was the popular kid and complete douche bag. Also not mentioned in the OP is that Saavedra is a special ed student. That's a big something to miss... Should really be added in. | ||
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FantaFanta
Germany225 Posts
On January 10 2012 15:10 Detwiler wrote: I dont know if I buy this. I got in fight in school and i never killed anyone. I dont think he should just get off free. Ok i get it he was bullied. That sucks but he KILLED the other kid. You could go even as far as to call it premeditated murder. The kid had a ton of options to choose from. What he choose was to get a knife and kill the guy. he probably only saw the choice between killing himself and killing the threath. He manned up. I respect him for that decision. | ||
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Miss_Cleo
United States406 Posts
On January 10 2012 23:21 shizna wrote: i haven't seen any evidence that shows that 100% of bullies have no contribution to society? i can empathize with people who have been bullied, i was bullied (being threatened, punched, kicked etc) by a few during secondary school years. from the same people who were my good friends in early school. but i would never wish harm upon them, even in self defense.. i have this thing called 'guilt', which makes me different from the bully. but i guess the 'victim' in the news story didn't have that. "Guilt" won't dissuade you from murder, because it usually comes after murder, in both contexts. You mean you wouldn't kill him because of your conscious. Maybe his conscious told him to defend his life with the knife. | ||
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DreamChaser
1649 Posts
On January 10 2012 23:24 paralleluniverse wrote: Self-defense. The kid got bashed, he defended himself, the bully got killed. There is nothing wrong here. The kid was legally allowed to defend himself, and the courts agreed. Could the situation have ended more ideally without someone being killed? Maybe, or maybe he would get beat up more. But regardless of whether there was a better ending, there is, again, nothing wrong here. There is almost 99% of the time a better solution than meeting violence with violence. He just killed someone...I'm not defending the bullies but seriously he took another persons life. Is the law so just and perfect that we understand that this person deserves to die. His life cut down when he wasn't even 20 years old. Although a bit more extreme i would also propose that if the Columbine High School shooting victims were ONLY the bullies would we still be ok with it? (if it was in florida) | ||
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Volkspanzer
United States83 Posts
If anything, the bully had far more room and options, and decided not to take the smart path. He could have backed off at ANY time he chose. It's one thing to hold a criminal in chains and basically have him neutralized after incarceration, but if a threat is neutralized in the process of a crime? That's a different story. Praise be the day that a criminal realizes that retribution can come from more than a badge. The biggest reason that people actually go through with harming others is that they think they can get away with it. | ||
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Miss_Cleo
United States406 Posts
On January 10 2012 23:24 paralleluniverse wrote: Self-defense. The kid got bashed, he defended himself, the bully got killed. There is nothing wrong here. The kid was legally allowed to defend himself, and the courts agreed. Could the situation have ended more ideally without someone being killed? Maybe, or maybe he would get beat up more. But regardless of whether there was a better ending, there is, again, nothing wrong here. I have stated before that legally, this kid did nothing wrong, and I agree with the ruling. But you see nothing wrong with the fact that a fourteen year old kid had to stab someone as a last resort? | ||
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shizna
United Kingdom803 Posts
On January 10 2012 23:26 Shafanhow wrote: Turn the other cheek only goes so far. Not everyone is such a saint.The kid that was bullied was just an imperfect human being. Thankfully here in the US there are laws that allow a weak person being beaten and tormented to defend themselves when pushed to the brink. It's sad that the kid died, but it was a necessary evil. a necessary evil for 'the greater good' ? well other than being a famous quote by various fictitious supervillains, it doesn't mean much to me. there have always been bullies, there will always be bullies. some kids don't mix well with other kids. it's not their fault that they're forced by law to mix with other kids. at the end of the day, bullies don't deserve any sympathy. but if they get murdered, they're not a bully anymore... they're just a dead kid like any other dead kid. | ||
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paralleluniverse
4065 Posts
On January 10 2012 23:33 Miss_Cleo wrote: I have stated before that legally, this kid did nothing wrong, and I agree with the ruling. But you see nothing wrong with the fact that a fourteen year old kid had to stab someone as a last resort? I would agree that perhaps more could have been done to prevent bullying in the first place. Or to prevent the situation from escalating to this unfortunate point. However, bullying seems to be one of those problems which no one has figured out how to fix. | ||
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dUTtrOACh
Canada2339 Posts
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GohgamX
Canada1096 Posts
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