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Simple Questions, Simple Answers - Page 175

Forum Index > Brood War Strategy
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Foxxan
Profile Joined October 2004
Sweden3427 Posts
December 19 2013 12:14 GMT
#3481
Does marines have overkill in bw?
Bakuryu
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
Germany1065 Posts
December 19 2013 14:37 GMT
#3482
On December 19 2013 15:52 Rlentless wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 19 2013 09:56 fencer wrote:
Look att ForGG repairing his bunker here at 4:51


His SCV:s are wiggling around, as if he's spamming the repair command or something. If anything I thought that might only slow them down as they're given new commands all the time. Is he actually spamming rightclicks on the bunker, and if so for what purpose?


Spamming right click can increase repair rate. You can set repair rate by how fast you click albeit your resources will be depleted faster. I think you can also make the scv attack faster by spamming attack though at a lesser effect.


i hope im not too late....
"spamming right click can increase repair rate" = this is 100% wrong.
the vod u found is from a small time between something which koreans were doing because it LOOKED like it was effective, and actually testing if it really was effective at all. (the other pretty famous example would be the "sim city break at hbr natural by using a drone making an extractor", which doesnt work because extractor has the same size as a geysir)

if u use scvs to fight enemy workers/units and if u spam attack that units, you are able to reduce the acceleration/deceleration needed to connect the attack + u will trigger another attacking animation which make it look like it is attacking faster than normal.
i never tested if it really is attacking faster than usual if both the scv and the enemy is standing still and honestly i dont really care, scvs too strong anyways.

now if u use scvs to repair stuff normally, your minerals will (for example) deplete by like 1 mineral every second, while repairing at a constant rate.
if u spam click repair something, everytime u start repairing again, u start with losing 1 mineral and because u click faster than once per second, u will lose minerals about 2-3 times faster than normal.
what about the repair amount?, basically thats hard to test alone unless u slowly check the replay....
best way to explain it: everytime u order a new repair command, u interrupt the constant repairing rate with a very small break and if u spam it, u have many breaks.

in the end, by spamming repair on something, u will use about 2-3 times as many minerals, but u only repair about 40-50% of the standard amount, which means that u will only have about 20% efficiency compared to just letting it repair..... YES, ITS THAT BAD
and thats why people stopped spam repairing, because its only helping the zerg.

On December 19 2013 21:14 Foxxan wrote:
Does marines have overkill in bw?


every unit in bw (that has an attack) can overkill, even melee units like zerglings or suicide units like scourge.
Jealous
Profile Blog Joined December 2011
10353 Posts
December 19 2013 21:24 GMT
#3483
^ I read in a thread in the BW section (or perhaps a post) that was dedicated to answering the SCV attack question. Apparently, spamming attack has no added damage, what it does is allow you to more effectively chase the enemy and deal damage. Standing still, it does not have any effect whatsoever. Someone tested it.
"The right to vote is only the oar of the slaveship, I wanna be free." -- бум бум сучка!
XsebT
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
Denmark2980 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-12-19 22:23:03
December 19 2013 22:16 GMT
#3484
On December 19 2013 21:14 Foxxan wrote:
Does marines have overkill in bw?

Since there's no projectile animation, I'd guess no.
Though, as Baku said, obviously every attacking unit can overkill in a sense, but I believe the definition "overkill" is specific to ranged units, no?
화이팅
Bakuryu
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
Germany1065 Posts
December 20 2013 03:43 GMT
#3485
i thought overkill means "units wasting their attack on units which already received enough damage to die", so their attack is completely wasted (unless u can use the additional splash damage, like using 3-4 tanks to attack your own marine in order to kill a burrowed lurker).
and that happens with any unit in bw if they attack more or less at the same time.
traceurling
Profile Joined December 2012
United States1240 Posts
December 20 2013 05:06 GMT
#3486
In SC2 I believe they have an antioverkill thing where units wikk smart target so that no shot is wasted. Yes bw has overkill if that's the case.

I'm coming up on my 1000th post, any ideas for what I should do that would be awesome and appreciated?
"Appreciate the things you have before they become the things you had."
Jealous
Profile Blog Joined December 2011
10353 Posts
December 20 2013 08:19 GMT
#3487
On December 20 2013 14:06 traceurling wrote:
In SC2 I believe they have an antioverkill thing where units wikk smart target so that no shot is wasted. Yes bw has overkill if that's the case.

I'm coming up on my 1000th post, any ideas for what I should do that would be awesome and appreciated?

Whatever you find interesting, are really good at, or can help others on the forum with. Then you spend a few hours perfecting it in format, content, grammar, etc. Instant self-gratification for your time investment, and most likely a positive forum response.
"The right to vote is only the oar of the slaveship, I wanna be free." -- бум бум сучка!
fencer
Profile Joined October 2011
122 Posts
December 22 2013 01:10 GMT
#3488
Do people use space (last event) a lot?

Personally I've never come to use it because you never know if something else might happen inbetween. For example: your forces are being attacked so you hit space, but right then a worker spawned for you and you get vision of your Nexus/CC/hatch instead.

But I'm open to other opinions as well. Do you use it much?
Disc Golf is Awesome! Thought I'd throw that out there =)
Golgotha
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Korea (South)8418 Posts
December 22 2013 04:08 GMT
#3489
On December 22 2013 10:10 fencer wrote:
Do people use space (last event) a lot?

Personally I've never come to use it because you never know if something else might happen inbetween. For example: your forces are being attacked so you hit space, but right then a worker spawned for you and you get vision of your Nexus/CC/hatch instead.

But I'm open to other opinions as well. Do you use it much?


i actually use it all the damn time. Very very useful. if you press it twice, cant you just keep going back to previous events?
evilfatsh1t
Profile Joined October 2010
Australia8913 Posts
December 22 2013 06:09 GMT
#3490
On December 22 2013 10:10 fencer wrote:
Do people use space (last event) a lot?

Personally I've never come to use it because you never know if something else might happen inbetween. For example: your forces are being attacked so you hit space, but right then a worker spawned for you and you get vision of your Nexus/CC/hatch instead.

But I'm open to other opinions as well. Do you use it much?

i only use space at the start when my workers are spawning and i have nothing else to do. later, you have too much to do meaning space isnt going to take you where you probably want to go.
fencer
Profile Joined October 2011
122 Posts
December 22 2013 07:38 GMT
#3491
On December 22 2013 13:08 Golgotha wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 22 2013 10:10 fencer wrote:
Do people use space (last event) a lot?

Personally I've never come to use it because you never know if something else might happen inbetween. For example: your forces are being attacked so you hit space, but right then a worker spawned for you and you get vision of your Nexus/CC/hatch instead.

But I'm open to other opinions as well. Do you use it much?


i actually use it all the damn time. Very very useful. if you press it twice, cant you just keep going back to previous events?


When do you find it the most useful compared to other ways (minimap, locations, hotkeys)? When do you save the most time?
Disc Golf is Awesome! Thought I'd throw that out there =)
puppykiller
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
United States3137 Posts
December 22 2013 09:51 GMT
#3492
Space is great for responding to "your forces are under attack".
Why would I play sctoo when I can play BW?
puppykiller
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
United States3137 Posts
December 22 2013 10:45 GMT
#3493
I want to be as good as Sero, I have hit a wall... how do I become as good as Sero?
Why would I play sctoo when I can play BW?
Hoender
Profile Joined March 2011
South Africa382 Posts
December 22 2013 10:53 GMT
#3494
On December 22 2013 19:45 puppykiller wrote:
I want to be as good as Sero, I have hit a wall... how do I become as good as Sero?

devise a plan to make Sero play worse
Die ou swepe sê: "daar's 'n raat vir elke kwaal," maar watse pil kou jy as die donker jou kom haal?
KameZerg
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
Sweden1772 Posts
December 22 2013 14:15 GMT
#3495
How does protoss macro work? How do you know how many gateways you could or should be having, and when is a good time to build them?
asdasdasdasdasd123123123
endy
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
Switzerland8970 Posts
December 23 2013 03:44 GMT
#3496
On December 22 2013 23:15 ICanFlyLow wrote:
How does protoss macro work? How do you know how many gateways you could or should be having, and when is a good time to build them?


You should not be afraid of adding more gateways right after you expand. A common mistake I was making for a while is that right after your new expo completes, the eco benefit hasn't kicked in yet, so I was waiting a bit to add gateways. But you need to take in account the gateways construction time, and by then the eco boost from the new base will have kicked in and if you haven't built the gateways promptly after the expansion you'll be floating tons of minerals.

Really important in PvT when terrans have timing windows that take advantage of new expansions.
ॐ
Birdie
Profile Blog Joined August 2007
New Zealand4438 Posts
December 23 2013 04:40 GMT
#3497
On December 22 2013 23:15 ICanFlyLow wrote:
How does protoss macro work? How do you know how many gateways you could or should be having, and when is a good time to build them?

I'm no protoss player but no one's really answering, as far as I know Protoss will usually have 6 gateways on 2base, 8-12 on 3base, and about 800 after 4th and 5th base. It depends on the matchup though, as in PvT particularly, you want to have the ability to remax quickly. Whereas in PvZ you should never be losing your main army so remaxing isn't a problem, you just rebuild to its old size.
Red classic | A butterfly dreamed he was Zhuangzi | 4.5k, heading to 5k as support!
fencer
Profile Joined October 2011
122 Posts
December 23 2013 06:22 GMT
#3498
Protoss gateways are also very cheap compared to factories and hatcheries, so especially if your macro isn't always perfect you might want to have one extra gateway compared to what's "optimal". Having high resources in the middlegame and no way to spend them is far more detrimental than spending 150 more minerals in the first place.
Disc Golf is Awesome! Thought I'd throw that out there =)
sjukungen1
Profile Joined November 2006
Burkina Faso59 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-12-23 15:02:07
December 23 2013 14:59 GMT
#3499
On December 19 2013 04:39 Birdie wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 19 2013 03:39 Larvator wrote:
Is there a guide for zergs how they need to react to make sure they don't die against 2 gate protoss (how many drones I need to stop protoss when I'm playing 9/over/12 pool/12 hatch; should I save larvae until I find out what protoss build is; do I need to cancel hatch; how to react if gates spotted on protoss main/natural/ or proxy etc)?

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=434554 is the best one probably.


I really don't like this opening. Your hatch gets blocked to eternity if the protoss scouts you early. You stack up to 600-700 minerals with a simple pylon block, not worth it.

Best IMO and what the koreans are using -> overpool 11 hatch 14 extractor 13 hatch
lol
ninazerg
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States7291 Posts
December 23 2013 16:50 GMT
#3500
On December 22 2013 10:10 fencer wrote:
Do people use space (last event) a lot?

Personally I've never come to use it because you never know if something else might happen inbetween. For example: your forces are being attacked so you hit space, but right then a worker spawned for you and you get vision of your Nexus/CC/hatch instead.

But I'm open to other opinions as well. Do you use it much?


I use it quite a bit in the early game, but once stuff really starts picking up, it's not very useful.
"If two pregnant women get into a fist fight, it's like a mecha-battle between two unborn babies." - Fyodor Dostoevsky
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