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This looks real bad for PvT. Where is protoss supposed to expand on this map after the initial three? The min only and low ground at ~1 are siegeable, and the push comes along the red arrow which will take out the bases at 7 o'clock.
There's no way to play this map on the ground as toss because if terran gets to 7 o'clock he'll control 5 base to 4. The only build I'd recommend playing is some kind of reaver to quick carrier to take advantage of the immense distance and multiple highgrounds for stalling if the terran has to attack your main.
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Needs more pepprica. Also, PM me for games if you want someone to play it with you 
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What's the title mean, kona?
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I don't know, i think this would be hard in pvt simply because the terran would quickly turtle off of 3 gas and push out at 200/200 3 3 3 and ggnore.
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I think Zerg can abuse muta's here. Also long walking path no?
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cool map layout but you need to game on it so you can fix the balancing issues
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I would personally add a stacked mineral a'la destination/heartbreak on the backyard expo, so you could mine it by mid-game and provide another exit for flanking. This would also introduce the DT sneak attack and general ling runbys.. though i see a possible flaw on that where you would not be able to FE without a canon on the backside. Maybe stacked destructable buildings like Medusa?
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On August 05 2009 19:00 TheFoReveRwaR wrote:If P is forced to go carriers to compete, than the map is very tough for them 
katrina?
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United States17042 Posts
On August 06 2009 05:05 YPang wrote:Show nested quote +On August 05 2009 19:00 TheFoReveRwaR wrote:On August 05 2009 18:53 arb wrote:
carriers... If P is forced to go carriers to compete, than the map is very tough for them katrina?
flash showed T how to kill carriers on katrina - carriers are now pretty terrible in PvT.
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Yo, make the back nat into water.
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On August 06 2009 05:20 GHOSTCLAW wrote:Show nested quote +On August 06 2009 05:05 YPang wrote:On August 05 2009 19:00 TheFoReveRwaR wrote:On August 05 2009 18:53 arb wrote:
carriers... If P is forced to go carriers to compete, than the map is very tough for them katrina? flash showed T how to kill carriers on katrina - carriers are now pretty terrible in PvT.
Agreed, I can't remember the last time that I've seen carriers, it must have been Rock since he always goes carriers.
They aren't terrible if you can catch your opponent off guard, but it's really hard to do that since people are better now with scouting/scanning and have 2/2 gols ready to rape your interceptors =/
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Forge FE looks hard on this map, like Carthage 1. Might want to move the mineral formation closer to the choke points. Might not matter because of the distances though.
Distances are too long. The whole map is too big in general. Smaller size would be better imo.
Terran Flash build. Protoss just dies because it's too hard to secure more than 3 expos. Zerg likewise dies to Protoss and Terran
-Mineral only: Vulture raids ftw
-Corner expo: Only viable fourth expo location, still vulnurable to drops and is relatively far away.
-Other gas expo: Either tankable from other players main or too far.
Carriers aren't that effective because the Flash build is made to counter carriers.
PvZ is like heartbreak ridge on crack. Fourth gas is impossible for Zerg and third gas is impossible for Zerg to deny a Protoss from taking.
I would make the forward natural a mineral only and make the mineral only a gas expo that is a little more defendable. Reducing the size to 128x96 would help.
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this is like. HBR + katrina
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Comments from the games I've played with Kona
Terran Mech is very strong on this map. MnM suck shit because the middle is so huge, Zerg has no problems getting a run by without the Terran ever seeing it.
The shortcut is a cute feature, you can potentially screw the protoss from gaystealing your gas by putting your initial scout on top of it for a bit. Discovered this one by accident when Kona's probe got blocked by my SCV and couldn't go up the ramp.
It's a very macro intensive map, you can hit 200/200 very easily seeing the huge amount of resources you are given.
The map is (quoth kona) "Like Bluestorm". If you rally your units to the battlefront in the middle, your units' pathing will screw up and stop them at the shortcut, so be careful.
The expansions in the middle of the map are very susceptible to storm/tanks/guardians, whatever that can shoot across cliffs from afar. This is because it is right next to your opponent's base. The CC/Nexus/Hatchery might be out of range of tanks, but I'm not clear about the map.
Carriers are quite reliable because of the cliffs around the main base and backyard expansions.
There does not seem to be enough space to proxy something in the backyard, the base is a bit too small for your proxy to go unseen. Furthermore, your opponent would definitely be fast expanding, due to the huge map.
Your scout (sent at correct timing) would reach your opponent's base around the time he puts down his expansion in the backyard.
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2 base carriers anyone? But the last time I saw carriers was Fantasy vs Stork on Outsider..
Well looks like a 2 base play can get a macroing terran off guard at some point..
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the center plain should be open ended so the players have more than 1 exit from their base. they already have a choke at their first expo. might as well be an island map ><
seems like a fun map though!
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konadora
Singapore66063 Posts
HUGE update! Comments please~
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Comments:
Okay, new version looks really really cool, with only a couple issues that jump out at me. It looks like getting to 4base v 4base macrofests is the name of the game, which, come on, fuck yeah. I'd say offhand that it's Z=T>P now, because of the now-an-island and bunker rushes to fuck the hell out of greedy builds. On the other hand, it looks like flanks would be really easy to execute with the awesome new center design, especially with zeals/lings. The air distance is a lot shorter than the ground distance, and the latter winds all over the place, so sairs/wraiths/mutas could rape. I'd love to see how it would play out - please stream your playtests if possible, or let me know so I can obs or something!
Questions:
Can vultures fit across the ramp shortcuts?
Is there room on top of the ramp shortcuts to drop a large unit (specifically thinking ultra here)?
Am I the only one who thinks this looks incredibly cool for mirrors, regardless of its relative balance?
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konadora
Singapore66063 Posts
Questions:
Can vultures fit across the ramp shortcuts?
Is there room on top of the ramp shortcuts to drop a large unit (specifically thinking ultra here)?
Am I the only one who thinks this looks incredibly cool for mirrors, regardless of its relative balance?
Nope
Yes
Maybe :p
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Expos at 3 and 9 would look better/work better.
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EPT![[image loading]](http://img197.imageshack.us/i/tvpt.png/)
