[idea]Limit practice time for progamers? - Page 3

On May 29 2009 16:41 alt.tday wrote:
So AZ whats ur argument, are you for cutting players practice times are against it?

On May 29 2009 15:50 AttackZerg wrote:


Also flash says he plays only 20 games a day and spends most of his time thinking about game situations. 20 games, 5 games an hour is only 4 hours at twenty minutes a game, not everybody is flash or bisu.

On May 29 2009 16:40 selboN wrote:
@Jumperer
You're going to have to find something else to compare to playing SC other than professional sports. Professional basketball/football players have talent. Sure, they stay in shape. But I guarantee they don't leave practice and go play more. Talent shapes professional sports, it doesn't shape Starcraft. To sum that up, you can practice your ass off and go pro in Starcraft, professional sports you can't.

On May 29 2009 17:02 ThugTerran wrote:
fame maybe but pussy? hahaha they all virgins for sure except oov ^^

On May 29 2009 15:23 Jumperer wrote:
baseball pitchers have pitch counts limit so they don't blow out their arms. These progamers need something like that as well if they want to keep playing into their 30s. Of course, they don't have anything like that now because like baseball pitchers in the 1900s, they don't know the true harmful effect of playing all day everyday.

On May 29 2009 15:47 Jumperer wrote:
Last time I check Nada still have 400 APM and boxer still has his same APM as before. But when you press keys on the keyboards and click 5000000 times a day and stare at the monitor for 10+ hours you are going to slowdown no matters how old or young you are. Age can have the effects, but why do players suddenly play like shit and go into a slump out of nowhere? that's right they simply played too many games and they can't play to the level they once played anymore because they burnt themselves out by playing too many games.

Beside, it's not like playing for 10 hours a day is going to help you beat a talented player like flash or jaedong. Look at Idra, he should be winning every foreigner tournament since he plays more than everyone else in theory(from being a progamer in korea), BUT NO.

On May 29 2009 16:41 alt.tday wrote:
So AZ whats ur argument, are you for cutting players practice times are against it?

On May 29 2009 17:22 Macavenger wrote:

Terrible analogy - at least if you want to actually make your point, rather than contradict it. Pitch counts in baseball are bullshit that's hurting the game. Back in say, the 50s-70s, long before pitch counts, pitchers used to routinely pitch complete games, and go out more often than once every five days - and they blew out their arms a LOT less than today's pitchers do. A lot of the old pitching records are never going to be touched at the rate we're going now because modern starters simply don't pitch as much as people used to. No one will ever come close to Cy Young's win total - in fact, we're probably already seeing the final generation of 300 game winners. The star power of great starting pitchers is greatly reduced as they almost never go longer than 6 innings. They don't get as much experience, they aren't as good, and it's less fun for at least some types of fans (me).

Hell even just going back into the 90s, look at the Atlanta Braves' rotation. They pretty much dominated the NL for years based on a massive starting rotation that routinely went deep, racked up CGs etc. Smoltz is the only one to have had any major injury problems, unless I'm forgetting something. That's from 15 years ago, when pitch counts were just starting to be used (I think, memory is a little fuzzy), and the technology for arm surgeries certainly existed, albeit not as effective as today's. But still, even with more pitchers pitching more then, you had less surgeries/retirements than you do today, from what I've seen.

Think Cy Young could have ever approached 500 wins if he were limited to 90 pitches a game, once every 5 days? How about Nolan Ryan and 5k strikeouts? I don't think either of those guys ruined their lives, and while they may have been exceptionally good, their workloads were relatively typical for their times. People can pitch far more than modern coaches give credit for. There's a recorded game (I'd have to go search my old baseball books for details, which I don't feel like doing atm) that ended in a 1-1 tie after 26 innings. Both starters pitched the entire game. Even if they were being exceptionally efficient, that's at least 200-250 pitches. I've also heard serious commentary by people in the sport suggesting that the severe limits put on pitchers in the minor leagues are detrimental to their long term stamina and such in their arms, and may actually be causing the (relatively) high rate of blown elbows you see today, by not allowing the body to develop under stress as it should.

I suppose the injury increase could also be a result of the "metagame" for pitchers changing to more of a fastball/power style than a control/tricky style - I would imagine throwing 95+ mph fastballs is harder on the arm than throwing 70s-mph breaking stuff. Of course, Nolan Ryan was a fireballer and his arm held up pretty well. You also don't have to pitch that way jsut because its the current trend - Greg Maddux is a great recent example of a very successful control pitcher, and I know there's a very successful closer (Trevor Hoffman?) who also pitches that way.

Obviously, limiting practice time in Brood War wouldn't have possible negative physiological impacts, but I think a lot of the other effects in terms of reducing fan enjoyment and stuff would be similar. The quality of games would definitely go down. Further, I would seriously argue whether this is necessary - the sport is developed enough now that we have a reasonable pool of retired and semi-retired gamers to look at, and their lives don't seem all that messed up. oov is married IIRC, Boxer apparently has a girlfriend, etc. Nal_Ra and The Marine are obviously doing fine as casters, etc. I haven't heard any stories of ex-pros turning into bums or permanently ruining their heads or anything.

On May 29 2009 15:23 Jumperer wrote:
baseball pitchers have pitch counts limit so they don't blow out their arms. These progamers need something like that as well if they want to keep playing into their 30s. Of course, they don't have anything like that now because like baseball pitchers in the 1900s, they don't know the true harmful effect of playing all day everyday.

look at boxer, iloveoov, xellos, yellow, reach, nada, savior, July and most old school players. Why can't they play like they play back in the day? Why is their multitasking crappier than younger players? They are burnt out, that's why. It's not because the competition got ridiculously better.

On May 29 2009 15:47 Jumperer wrote:
Last time I check Nada still have 400 APM and boxer still has his same APM as before. But when you press keys on the keyboards and click 5000000 times a day and stare at the monitor for 10+ hours you are going to slowdown no matters how old or young you are. Age can have the effects, but why do players suddenly play like shit and go into a slump out of nowhere? that's right they simply played too many games and they can't play to the level they once played anymore because they burnt themselves out by playing too many games.

Beside, it's not like playing for 10 hours a day is going to help you beat a talented player like flash or jaedong. Look at Idra, he should be winning every foreigner tournament since he plays more than everyone else in theory(from being a progamer in korea), BUT NO.