EPTHardest Race Poll - Page 5
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Wizard
Poland5055 Posts
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Superiorwolf
United States5509 Posts
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Shauni
4077 Posts
Wtf guys. You know how difficult PvT actually is? Your exp is later than the terrans. Dies to a timing push. Your dts run into mines. Dies to vulture harass. Your reaver dies to a turret. Dies to an early push. All those things are inevitable. At all other matchups except maybe in ZvZ you can lose a couple of units midgame and still have a chance to win, that's not even remotely possible in PvT. A minimal macro mistake, even something like forgetting a pylon WILL lose you the game in PvT. Or not flanking your units perfectly in lategame. It's almost impossible to get back from a economical disadvatage vs a stable terran who knows when to push. I don't think I've ever won a game against a terran relatively close to my skill level who got higher supply than me midgame. Although in my opinion PvZ is pretty ez at foreigner level (most zergs doesn't know how to flank and snipe templars correctly), PvP is the most confusing matchup ever because it rewards risky play more than any other matchup. I'm pretty confident in PvP but I still haven't really grasped it, sometimes it feels impossible to master because there's always a possibility to lose against a worse player - at least when both players are teching blind. | ||
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EnergyTraction
Canada233 Posts
On May 15 2008 07:58 Shauni wrote: Wtf guys. You know how difficult PvT actually is? Your exp is later than the terrans. Dies to a timing push. Your dts run into mines. Dies to vulture harass. Your reaver dies to a turret. Dies to an early push. All those things are inevitable. At all other matchups except maybe in ZvZ you can lose a couple of units midgame and still have a chance to win, that's not even remotely possible in PvT. A minimal macro mistake, even something like forgetting a pylon WILL lose you the game in PvT. Or not flanking your units perfectly in lategame. It's almost impossible to get back from a economical disadvatage vs a stable terran who knows when to push. I don't think I've ever won a game against a terran relatively close to my skill level who got higher supply than me midgame. Although in my opinion PvZ is pretty ez at foreigner level (most zergs doesn't know how to flank and snipe templars correctly), PvP is the most confusing matchup ever because it rewards risky play more than any other matchup. I'm pretty confident in PvP but I still haven't really grasped it, sometimes it feels impossible to master because there's always a possibility to lose against a worse player - at least when both players are teching blind. I don't think you know what inevitable means. You're also missing the difference between a progamer and a D gamer | ||
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zer0das
United States8519 Posts
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OneOther
United States10774 Posts
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HotZhot
Colombia677 Posts
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FakeSteve[TPR]
Valhalla18444 Posts
On May 15 2008 08:03 zer0das wrote: I don't know why Protoss get so much crap. PvZ is not easy... the zerg has so many options and the toss has to react to it and small mistakes can mean the game is over really quickly. nah, i find pvz really easy. especially nowadays with these 100% safe FE builds. the macro is just so easy i tend to run over any zerg near my own level with my protoss, and i don't play protoss | ||
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OneOther
United States10774 Posts
whats that, you suck with all races? well fuck then welcome to team monkeyspanker+fusionsdf!!!! SIGGGGGGGGGGGGG | ||
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OneOther
United States10774 Posts
On May 15 2008 08:19 FakeSteve[TPR] wrote: nah, i find pvz really easy. especially nowadays with these 100% safe FE builds. the macro is just so easy i tend to run over any zerg near my own level with my protoss, and i don't play protoss Steve as much as much I love you I highly doubt you beat zergs of your OWN LEVEL with your off race(protoss) you are playing worse players it's not so 100% safe either because of the new popular fast speedling build. you dont know what the Z is doing til corsair balls | ||
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afdagfhds3gdg2
United States77 Posts
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OneOther
United States10774 Posts
On May 15 2008 08:01 EnergyTraction wrote: I don't think you know what inevitable means. You're also missing the difference between a progamer and a D gamer I think that applies to like C and higher gamers lol | ||
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FakeSteve[TPR]
Valhalla18444 Posts
On May 15 2008 08:20 OneOther wrote: Steve as much as much I love you I highly doubt you beat zergs of your OWN LEVEL with your off race(protoss) you are playing worse players it's not so 100% safe either because of the new popular fast speedling build. you have know what the Z is doing til corsair balls no, i'm playing people at my level. I'm not great to begin with, the point is that without really playing protoss (besides when i random vs manifesto) my pvz is almost as good as my tvz, with results mixing depending on whether the zerg is particularily good or bad at those two matchups | ||
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OneOther
United States10774 Posts
On May 15 2008 08:26 FakeSteve[TPR] wrote: no, i'm playing people at my level. I'm not great to begin with, the point is that without really playing protoss (besides when i random vs manifesto) my pvz is almost as good as my tvz, with results mixing depending on whether the zerg is particularily good or bad at those two matchups haha, well... | ||
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FakeSteve[TPR]
Valhalla18444 Posts
hahah | ||
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IzzyCraft
United States4487 Posts
Z for kor pros | ||
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phase
United States399 Posts
Your exp is later than the terrans. Dies to a timing push. T PoV: Your exp is earlier than protoss, because protoss went some kind of tech build and harasses you. Your timing push is delayed and protoss flanks you or shuttles your push. Your dts run into mines. Dies to vulture harass. T PoV: The Protoss was smart and ran a zealot in first to defuse mines. You a) lose right there to DT rush. b) counter with vulture harass, but Protoss was smart and put a DT on ramp, so you also lose to the DT rush. Your reaver dies to a turret. Dies to an early push. T PoV: The turret at the top of your CC doesn't reach the shuttle below your CC, you lose ~1 tank, 4 marines, 6-7scvs and mining time, and timing. You a) lose right there to a goon counter at your nat b) lose when you normally do your timing push because P bought some time with the reaver for his 3rd to get up All those things are inevitable. At all other matchups except maybe in ZvZ you can lose a couple of units midgame and still have a chance to win, that's not even remotely possible in PvT. No. lol. A minimal macro mistake, even something like forgetting a pylon WILL lose you the game in PvT. A minimal macro mistake, even something like forgetting a supply depot WILL lose you the game in TvP. It's almost impossible to get back from a economical disadvatage vs a stable terran who knows when to push. No, harass + flank + expo. I don't think I've ever won a game against a terran relatively close to my skill level who got higher supply than me midgame. If midgame terran had higher supply than you, then he must be at a higher skill level than you. TvP is one of the LEAST forgiving matchups. If a P ever catches your army mobile, you'll lose to an army half your size. I mean, watch Nony vs. Artosis on the side if you don't believe me. Artosis had it in the bag, but lategame he constantly lost his army to half his army size over and over again. | ||
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IzzyCraft
United States4487 Posts
On May 15 2008 08:03 zer0das wrote: I don't know why Protoss get so much crap. PvZ is not easy... the zerg has so many options and the toss has to react to it and small mistakes can mean the game is over really quickly. Because at like D C level of play on iccup toss is fucked up race that people either tri gate or mass sair dt mass sair shuttle basiclly alot of people dont see toss pros as something hard to play toss usualy is a race that you will build less do less becuase everything is stronger and so by common scence people assoiate that with easier. ZVP is a zerg lively hood good zergs are good at zvp good toss are good at pvt good terrans are good at tvz those are the showmen match ups that any pro usualy should be getting easy wins in no our fault if people practice zvp alot more then pvz | ||
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Darkmole
United States900 Posts
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OneOther
United States10774 Posts
On May 15 2008 08:40 FakeSteve[TPR] wrote: well... pvz is easy hahah play some decent zergs and pvz gets hard ;p seriously though, "pvz is easy" is a pretty ridiculous statement lol | ||
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