Since there is a good amount of interest in translated pro videos via idea proposed by broodwarisback in thread [previous thread], I figured we should make a thread coordinating it. [Currently broodwarisback and I are co-coordinating it so we might both be sending messages.]
Is there anyone willing to reach out to ask these players for permission to translate their videos? I'm willing to link to their YouTube channel, stream, and donation pages in the video descriptions + whatever they want in the video description.
I'll also assume that translating paid videos are not allowed. [best, sky, snow, zero]. Let me know if anyone has any ideas on how we can work something out with them. [Maybe we can translate the videos and send them to them so we can purchase translated videos from them directly?]
Newest videoes Newbies Be Sure to Watch This! FlaSh's 200% Newbie Tutorial Guide!! Episode 1| TvP Factory FE
Please post if: a) You're willing to translate b) You're willing to help crowdfund for translations c) You have a video that you would like to be translated d) You have a translated video that you would like to add here e) You own the original video and would like a translation to be taken down
b) You're willing to help crowdfund for translations
^^ I don't have the hugest amount I can spare, but a group-pot where lots of people can put in small amounts would probably add up quickly.
I really like the idea of getting in contact with the players in question and seeing if they want to upload the translations to their own channels. Probably nice to let them have their YT views, and would show them some of how much us foreigners appreciate what they do too
b) You're willing to help crowdfund for translations
^^ I don't have the hugest amount I can spare, but a group-pot where lots of people can put in small amounts would probably add up quickly.
I really like the idea of getting in contact with the players in question and seeing if they want to upload the translations to their own channels. Probably nice to let them have their YT views, and would show them some of how much us foreigners appreciate what they do too
I agree. If there is a liaison who will do to this, I would be all for that as well. [Unfortunately I can't speak Korean.]
I think one option would be to run a kick-starter, that way it is public how much money has been submitted to it. Translators can then claim money from it by naming a price for a translation, getting approval from the organizer, and then the organizer sends the money to the translator.
Hey guys I'm at work right now but if I have time this weekend I dont mind translating some I've never put captions into a youtube video but as I'm learning broodwar as a hobby for remastered I dont mind contributing and if I have more time next weekend I might be able to get more done so tell me if you guys need a translator.
On May 13 2017 09:02 emeraldgreenforest wrote: Hey guys I'm at work right now but if I have time this weekend I dont mind translating some I've never put captions into a youtube video but as I'm learning broodwar as a hobby for remastered I dont mind contributing and if I have more time next weekend I might be able to get more done so tell me if you guys need a translator.
PM'd.
Is there korean speaker who is willing to reach out and ask permission? I feel like it's important that we do our due diligence in respecting every pro's wishes.
How well does one have to understand Korean to contribute? I feel like I could translate the bulk of the gameplay for most videos but I'm not confident I can get some of the more technical terms or idioms. I most certainly wouldn't want to get paid for this level of work but I'd be willing to contribute a bit of we don't mind slightly incomplete translations.
On May 13 2017 18:26 ImbaTosS wrote: Someone mentioned that Horang2 had some similar videos? I would 100% contribute for those...
Oh that one's easy: print a dartboard for each of the most commonly played maps. Hang the map you're about to play on a nearby wall, then throw 1-3 darts at it. Finally, start the game and make robos and citadels where the darts landed.
On May 13 2017 16:12 neobowman wrote: How well does one have to understand Korean to contribute? I feel like I could translate the bulk of the gameplay for most videos but I'm not confident I can get some of the more technical terms or idioms. I most certainly wouldn't want to get paid for this level of work but I'd be willing to contribute a bit of we don't mind slightly incomplete translations.
Perhaps you can translate a short video like Hiya's [which is around 10 minutes long] and see how it goes?
On May 13 2017 17:33 Jealous wrote: Most importantly, people who are making captions/subs NEED to post what they are working on, so that there are no overlaps.
I have an internal spreadsheet on who is working on what. Right now Effort's video series is next up to be translated. I'm negotiating prices for Stork and Flash's. Stay tuned!
On May 13 2017 16:12 neobowman wrote: How well does one have to understand Korean to contribute? I feel like I could translate the bulk of the gameplay for most videos but I'm not confident I can get some of the more technical terms or idioms. I most certainly wouldn't want to get paid for this level of work but I'd be willing to contribute a bit of we don't mind slightly incomplete translations.
Perhaps you can translate a short video like Hiya's [which is around 10 minutes long] and see how it goes?
On May 13 2017 17:33 Jealous wrote: Most importantly, people who are making captions/subs NEED to post what they are working on, so that there are no overlaps.
I have an internal spreadsheet on who is working on what. Right now Effort's video series is next up to be translated. I'm negotiating prices for Stork and Flash's. Stay tuned!
hm I rlly don't recommend flash's. Flash is like a comedian whenever he tries do lecture videos. 80% of his lectures has him say "dont get frustrated and you will win!" There's no substance really.. nothing to take away from
I'd help chip in a little cash for this. One of my main interests in this is that translated videos will help in getting to know more about the personalities of the players. It's kind of hard to see that just watching tournaments.
Ok so, translator just hasto translate and then timecode?
If I'm not feeling lazy I'll do some. At some point I want to translate Zeus's 1 hour lecture on probe count and other basics, if I'm not feeling lazy at all.
On May 14 2017 11:31 supernovamaniac wrote: Ok so, translator just hasto translate and then timecode?
If I'm not feeling lazy I'll do some. At some point I want to translate Zeus's 1 hour lecture on probe count and other basics, if I'm not feeling lazy at all.
I added a tutorial in the original post that I wrote on creating subtitles for videos. Linked here for ease of access. Subbing tutorial
Let me know if anything is unclear and I'll update the documentation.
On May 14 2017 14:16 LaStScan wrote: I have a question. Can people like re-record someone elses stream and then post on youtube without the streamers permission?
Korean streamers restream or stream themselves watching someone else's stream sometimes, and then these VODs are a part of their channel as you know... maybe you should ask them since you might have a better connection to them than most of us? It would be interesting to know what they think. Although I might be mistaken because of obs games xP
On May 14 2017 14:16 LaStScan wrote: I have a question. Can people like re-record someone elses stream and then post on youtube without the streamers permission?
Korean streamers restream or stream themselves watching someone else's stream sometimes, and then these VODs are a part of their channel as you know... maybe you should ask them since you might have a better connection to them than most of us? It would be interesting to know what they think. Although I might be mistaken because of obs games xP
What bout taking someones videos from their YT channel n re-uploading it and taking away their viewer count, i know i wouldn't want someone to reupload my videos on their channels :O
On May 14 2017 14:16 LaStScan wrote: I have a question. Can people like re-record someone elses stream and then post on youtube without the streamers permission?
Korean streamers restream or stream themselves watching someone else's stream sometimes, and then these VODs are a part of their channel as you know... maybe you should ask them since you might have a better connection to them than most of us? It would be interesting to know what they think. Although I might be mistaken because of obs games xP
We would have to ask first. If it were up to me, I would translate, contact the player/youtube manager and ask to include the subtitle within the official video.
On May 14 2017 14:16 LaStScan wrote: I have a question. Can people like re-record someone elses stream and then post on youtube without the streamers permission?
Korean streamers restream or stream themselves watching someone else's stream sometimes, and then these VODs are a part of their channel as you know... maybe you should ask them since you might have a better connection to them than most of us? It would be interesting to know what they think. Although I might be mistaken because of obs games xP
We would have to ask first. If it were up to me, I would translate, contact the player/youtube manager and ask to include the subtitle within the official video.
I can't speak korean at all. Is there someone who can do this for me? I'm totally willing to turn over the subs and have them upload it with the official video.
On May 14 2017 14:16 LaStScan wrote: I have a question. Can people like re-record someone elses stream and then post on youtube without the streamers permission?
Korean streamers restream or stream themselves watching someone else's stream sometimes, and then these VODs are a part of their channel as you know... maybe you should ask them since you might have a better connection to them than most of us? It would be interesting to know what they think. Although I might be mistaken because of obs games xP
What bout taking someones videos from their YT channel n re-uploading it and taking away their viewer count, i know i wouldn't want someone to reupload my videos on their channels :O
True, forgot about the money/views aspect of it. As you can tell, I am a very fiscally savvy person.
On May 14 2017 14:16 LaStScan wrote: I have a question. Can people like re-record someone elses stream and then post on youtube without the streamers permission?
Korean streamers restream or stream themselves watching someone else's stream sometimes, and then these VODs are a part of their channel as you know... maybe you should ask them since you might have a better connection to them than most of us? It would be interesting to know what they think. Although I might be mistaken because of obs games xP
What bout taking someones videos from their YT channel n re-uploading it and taking away their viewer count, i know i wouldn't want someone to reupload my videos on their channels :O
Wouldn't they not get those views anyway because of the language barrier? I agree though that it's still good to ask as a matter of respect. The only downside to having the subs be hosted on their channels would be discoverability. Yet, that's what sites like this are for I guess.
If the only thing you add is subtitles, it won't fall under fair use. Recording someone else's stream is allowed but your work has to be transformative.
People that speak korean need to get into contact with the streamers and if they can't we could create a unlisted youtube channel so it doesn't detract from their views.
i highly doubt we are going to run afoul of the streamers for taking a few thousand views. this is english content for people who cant understand korean, its not like were going to watch the afreeca streams live or take any money from him. we will just demonetize the vids. if anything this is just free publicity for them.
if for some strange reason they actually care, we can just give them the subs and they can add them to their videos so we can select it on their youtube videos. the youtube translation thing is really easy to use and its not hard to have multiple sub files for the videos.
On May 16 2017 01:25 Ty2 wrote: I'm pretty sure there's a function on YouTube where you can submit your subtitles onto another person's already uploaded video.
yeah that's what we are going to do most likely if any of the players raise a fuss.
On May 16 2017 12:58 XERX wrote: Lets get translating bois
That's the plan. There will be an initial delay while I work out logistics [should be wrapping up tomorrow then we can start production] but I'm hoping to have one video every 3-5 days or so.
EDIT: By the way, thanks for the work frogmelter putting thread together, thanks to all translators including him.
방플러 which means stream snipers/cheaters.
EDIT: [방]을 보면서 [플]레이 한다 (Playing while watching the room (stream in this case, as koreans refer to stream as 'rooms' in Afreeca (literal translation)) -> 방플 (Bang-Peul). 러 at the end simply means person (in this context, added on to the previous word).
EDIT: By the way, thanks for the work frogmelter putting thread together, thanks to all translators including him.
방플러 which means stream snipers/cheaters.
EDIT: [방]을 보면서 [플]레이 한다 (Playing while watching the room (stream in this case, as koreans refer to stream as 'rooms' in Afreeca (literal translation)) -> 방플 (Bang-Peul). 러 at the end simply means person (in this context, added on to the previous word).
EDIT: By the way, thanks for the work frogmelter putting thread together, thanks to all translators including him.
방플러 which means stream snipers/cheaters.
EDIT: [방]을 보면서 [플]레이 한다 (Playing while watching the room (stream in this case, as koreans refer to stream as 'rooms' in Afreeca (literal translation)) -> 방플 (Bang-Peul). 러 at the end simply means person (in this context, added on to the previous word).
I am 4 mins in so far and I do want to say that the translations are very hard to understand There have been 2-3 cases so far where I legit do not understand what is meant by the sentence.
On May 24 2017 00:32 abuse wrote: Thanks a lot for the vid!
I am 4 mins in so far and I do want to say that the translations are very hard to understand There have been 2-3 cases so far where I legit do not understand what is meant by the sentence.
Yep, my translator doesn't play StarCraft so he gets confused by the slang. I'm working on finding a better translator that might have a little bit more background.
On May 24 2017 00:50 Piste wrote: Protoss: DT build as the only guide...
On May 24 2017 22:33 Bonyth wrote: Thank you so much for translating Stork's tutorials. Damn, progamer's knowladge is just so vast, there is so much to learn from them.
Yeah... "the difference between 2 and 3 probes on gas is 50 minerals when your core warps in"
Although this by itself is not amazing knowledge, it gives a glimpse into how much they know. You KNOW that Stork and other pros have practiced these openings countless times and have found such exact optimizations for them. They probably memorized these small bits of information for hundreds of scenarios and openings.
Four videos posted today for a total of 2 hours of content.
Note on Effort's series: I can't promise that we will translate all of them, since they're quite lengthy and translators are much more expensive than I've initially estimated. That being said, we do have a few more of Effort's video in flight right now. Will post when ready.
Yes he is lolol. Just finished watching the first one, so much trolling. I love how his drone didn't move properly so he said "you need a beating" and attacks it with another drone. Definitely entertaining to watch
Donated 200, prioritized for Terran videos. Posting this here just in case the money disappears others will know (not that it will, I'm just a skeptical guy). Hope to see more sweet Last videos and some by Flash/Hiya! HYPE
On May 29 2017 12:04 CecilSunkure wrote: Donated 200, prioritized for Terran videos. Posting this here just in case the money disappears others will know (not that it will, I'm just a skeptical guy). Hope to see more sweet Last videos and some by Flash/Hiya! HYPE
Wow, that's crazy dude!
And Last has made videos too? Somebody said earlier that Flash isn't really a good teacher though.
On May 29 2017 12:04 CecilSunkure wrote: Donated 200, prioritized for Terran videos. Posting this here just in case the money disappears others will know (not that it will, I'm just a skeptical guy). Hope to see more sweet Last videos and some by Flash/Hiya! HYPE
Received. Thanks a ton dude! I'll contact my translators tonight and prioritize Terran videos.
FYI if anyone else wants to donate just PM frogmelter. He can send you itemization to see where money has currently gone before you donate. Paypal worked really easily for me.
On May 30 2017 22:21 DSK wrote: Donated $50.00 to be used however. I'm following CecilSunkure's suit by posting about it here just in case :>.
Received and confirmed. I believe there is only Effort's videos left, so I'll let my translator start working on the next Effort video after he clears the backlog created by CecilSunkure.
As for my part, I'd love to see more of Stork. As expected from dinosaur of his class, he has infinite knowledge and slow yet very clear apm so it feels like he actually wins through decision making rather than just speed and mechanics.
On May 31 2017 03:28 Bonyth wrote: As for my part, I'd love to see more of Stork. As expected from dinosaur of his class, he has infinite knowledge and slow yet very clear apm so it feels like he actually wins through decision making rather than just speed and mechanics.
On May 11 2017 16:13 Th1rdEye wrote: I feel like you'll definitely be able to pay someone on TL to do this! Remember to keep all agreements private... if not just for tax purposes
On May 31 2017 04:01 bITt.mAN wrote: I'm telling you guys, set up a www.bountysource.com
I'm getting two conflicting pieces of advice here... I think the current system is working? Spreadsheet of finances is available to anyone who wants it, as well as receipts of everything.
On May 31 2017 03:28 Bonyth wrote: As for my part, I'd love to see more of Stork. As expected from dinosaur of his class, he has infinite knowledge and slow yet very clear apm so it feels like he actually wins through decision making rather than just speed and mechanics.
I think Stork is a great teacher as well. I think we translated everything that we have on him though.
On May 31 2017 03:28 Bonyth wrote: As for my part, I'd love to see more of Stork. As expected from dinosaur of his class, he has infinite knowledge and slow yet very clear apm so it feels like he actually wins through decision making rather than just speed and mechanics.
+1
This is a great idea. Stork puts out alot of great content consistently against the very best players. Win or lose..
He also talks alot about his tactics and since he was a SC2 Coach for quite a while, he knows very well how to transition his teaching experience into Brood War.
Its seems like he is starting to get back into good form on BroodWar once again. Its only a matter of time before we see him making Ro.8 and beyond.
I think spreadsheet + email is personable, and worked really well.
Also could you guys find links to the vids and post them? For people like me at least, don't really have time or desire to actually go find a really solid video to translate. I'd rather just throw some money at it, so kinda relying on all your in-depth BW knowledge here.
As a Terran main, I really enjoyed both of Last videos. Thanks to all that contributed to make that happen. (and all the other videos too of course).
In the beginning of the double CC build he mentions that he already made a "Escape from F" series/video. Anywhere to find it the original or is it behind a paywall?
I have a few hours of lecture material by http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft/Just from 2010~2011. Its a bit old and outdated but I can upload it if anyone want to see it.
On May 31 2017 20:35 Fenlock wrote: How much do translations cost? Would be interested in seeing more Zerg videos - mostly ZVP. Effort or any other good Zerg.
Highest quality translator was 50 an hour. Others were cheaper, some like 25 or 30 an hour but much lower quality. These are hours of content, not how long the translator works.
On May 31 2017 20:35 Fenlock wrote: How much do translations cost? Would be interested in seeing more Zerg videos - mostly ZVP. Effort or any other good Zerg.
Highest quality translator was 50 an hour. Others were cheaper, some like 25 or 30 an hour but much lower quality. These are hours of content, not how long the translator works.
Highest quality translator recently raised his prices to 60 [he assured me this will be the final price and it won't raise in the future]. I haven't found anyone who is close to his quality and speed. I have a decent translator at 40 as well and various freelancers that don't play StarCraft so the game specific translations are funky but cheaper [30]. I'm not sure the 30 dollar translations are worth it tbh.
Ouch. I would probably stick to 50. This isn't a profit gig, it's for the community and for fun. Well you have the most experience dealing with the translators, so it's your call.
On June 01 2017 05:20 blade55555 wrote: Damn that's more then I thought it would be. Do you know how long it takes them to translate an hour long video?
On June 01 2017 02:03 CecilSunkure wrote: Highest quality translator was 50 an hour. Others were cheaper, some like 25 or 30 an hour but much lower quality. These are hours of content, not how long the translator works.
Cecil, I read that it costs 50 an hour, but doesn't state how long it takes a translator to do it. I know it's more then an hour but hours could be 3 hours, 8 hours, etc. I would be curious how long it actually takes to do.
Or is it 50$ per hour of video and I am misreading that? I was thinking 50$ per hour of work.
On June 01 2017 04:08 CecilSunkure wrote: Ouch. I would probably stick to 50. This isn't a profit gig, it's for the community and for fun. Well you have the most experience dealing with the translators, so it's your call.
Yeah I was hoping it would be around 25-30 dollars per hour of video, but no one seems to be willing to do it at that price. I'll cover the additional 10 bucks an hour. Unfortunately we only have one good translator so I don't have much leverage to negotiate.
Would be open to other translators willing to compete on price though.
On June 01 2017 06:32 CecilSunkure wrote: Yeah it's confusing ;x
I think it's setup so if the video is an hour long, then it costs 50 dollars to translate. frogmelter, could you possibly confirm?
Correct, if a video is an hour long, then it takes at least 50 dollars to translate.
The actual work of the translator is much longer because they have to keep pausing + re-listening + syncing/lengthening the subs. I don't know the specifics on how long each video takes to translate but it isn't short.
On June 01 2017 07:39 snaypls wrote: I have zero experience in closed captioning, but I do speak both Korean and English. Willing to help the translation process if needed.
Let me know!
Yessss another translator! There's a document in OP on how to do the translation process with youtube
Does anyone have a direct link to Effort's BW lessons on YouTube? (The non-English ones) Also, does anyone have any suggestions for Zerg videos that should be translated? If I can find a good video, I'm down for throwing in money for a translation.
On June 01 2017 10:25 Fenlock wrote: Does anyone have a direct link to Effort's BW lessons on YouTube? (The non-English ones) Also, does anyone have any suggestions for Zerg videos that should be translated? If I can find a good video, I'm down for throwing in money for a translation.
I would really really really love some more P-based videos. I think there is enough T-based stuff to last us for a bit, until the other two races catch up amount of content-wise. (i mean combined with videos available on youtube, not just the ones that were organized here)
Would love to chip in to this, tho I can't really do too much because salary sucks, but hey, hopefully everything helps. Do we just PM frogmelter?
Several videos translated, including two more of Effort and a bunch of Terran videos. Will post sometime tomorrow as it is a bit late today.
On June 01 2017 07:39 snaypls wrote: I have zero experience in closed captioning, but I do speak both Korean and English. Willing to help the translation process if needed.
Let me know!
Currently working out a deal with this translator.
On June 01 2017 09:06 -Frog- wrote: Thanks so much for organizing this, the videos are extremely interesting and helpful (as well as hilarious)
Not a problem! Thanks for watching.
On June 01 2017 14:31 probelife66 wrote: I found a nada TVP guide on youtube the other day. Already had english subs.. Not sure if you want to add it as a resource if someone can find it?
Yep, this thread is for all translated pro content, not just ones that we pay to get translated. I'll add it as a resource if someone finds it.
On June 01 2017 15:32 abuse wrote: I would really really really love some more P-based videos. I think there is enough T-based stuff to last us for a bit, until the other two races catch up amount of content-wise. (i mean combined with videos available on youtube, not just the ones that were organized here)
Would love to chip in to this, tho I can't really do too much because salary sucks, but hey, hopefully everything helps. Do we just PM frogmelter?
PM me, though I would suggest not donating unless you're financially stable. I appreciate the sentiment though.
I'd like to contribute a little bit for Protoss stuff as well. It seems Protoss users have been less active or more trolly (*ahem* Zeus) so I don't even really have a request in particular. With this in mind, I want to know how much I should send and how and etc.
EDIT: Lol just saw pretty much the same thing posted above, my b. Gonna PM now.
On June 02 2017 16:20 CecilSunkure wrote: Thinking tomorrow night hosting a stream to study some of these. Might be fun to chat about them with some of you more knowledgeable folks
I really enjoyed the Stork ones, would love more protoss ones! Gearing up for getting back into RTS for remaster, so excited, been watching BW videos for the past 2 weeks nonstop =]
If any awesome protoss videos need a bit of cash to translate, I might be willing to contribute a bit.
Watching the effort ones, and they're great, but I do have a question...
How much of it is serious, and how much is him trolling? Sometimes he says things like "it's ok to do this, F players are so bad you can get away with it" or "look how easy this game is, I just attack move and win" (sometimes followed by his army dying, although he does eventually win the game). Or like he suggests taking 3 undefended expansions and just hoping the Terran won't notice them all, which seems... not the best plan. So I'm wondering if these are really meant as a tutorial to learn from, or just for fun (or something that might work at F level but never above that).
Sup, was the translator for some of the Effort Videos. Listening to it in Korean, it seems to be half-tutorial, half-trolling. Overall, he isn't giving bad advice, but his tone may be too playful for some I guess.
On June 04 2017 02:03 Luddite wrote: Watching the effort ones, and they're great, but I do have a question...
How much of it is serious, and how much is him trolling? Sometimes he says things like "it's ok to do this, F players are so bad you can get away with it" or "look how easy this game is, I just attack move and win" (sometimes followed by his army dying, although he does eventually win the game). Or like he suggests taking 3 undefended expansions and just hoping the Terran won't notice them all, which seems... not the best plan. So I'm wondering if these are really meant as a tutorial to learn from, or just for fun (or something that might work at F level but never above that).
On June 04 2017 02:33 grandphrase wrote: Sup, was the translator for some of the Effort Videos. Listening to it in Korean, it seems to be half-tutorial, half-trolling. Overall, he isn't giving bad advice, but his tone may be too playful for some I guess.
On June 04 2017 02:03 Luddite wrote: Watching the effort ones, and they're great, but I do have a question...
How much of it is serious, and how much is him trolling? Sometimes he says things like "it's ok to do this, F players are so bad you can get away with it" or "look how easy this game is, I just attack move and win" (sometimes followed by his army dying, although he does eventually win the game). Or like he suggests taking 3 undefended expansions and just hoping the Terran won't notice them all, which seems... not the best plan. So I'm wondering if these are really meant as a tutorial to learn from, or just for fun (or something that might work at F level but never above that).
Thanks for the translation! I don't really mind the tone, I think his trolling is entertaining, I just wanted to make sure i'm not taking bad advice by accident.
Wish I could tell you for certain personally, but I'm probably not at the skill level to tell you otherwise - aka as Effort says, the-player-you-can-get-4-streak-games-from XD
Anyways, I guess it would be better to have at least some kind of entertainment along with the original content - just like how any YouTube tutorial would be better with a little " haha's " mixed in.
[/QUOTE] Thanks for the translation! I don't really mind the tone, I think his trolling is entertaining, I just wanted to make sure i'm not taking bad advice by accident. [/QUOTE]
Has there been any effort to contact some of the protoss pros regarding their pay-walled videos? I love the two videos of stork that we have now, I'm just looking forward for some more.
Effort's 1-1 is in progress now [the 3 hour one] but it will take some time.
On June 05 2017 10:14 Galtath wrote: Has there been any effort to contact some of the protoss pros regarding their pay-walled videos? I love the two videos of stork that we have now, I'm just looking forward for some more.
Nope, I might just buy it and write subs for them. That way people can also purchase the video directly from the pros and use VLC with the sub file that we have.
On June 05 2017 11:04 frogmelter wrote: Nope, I might just buy it and write subs for them. That way people can also purchase the video directly from the pros and use VLC with the sub file that we have.
On June 05 2017 10:14 Galtath wrote: Has there been any effort to contact some of the protoss pros regarding their pay-walled videos? I love the two videos of stork that we have now, I'm just looking forward for some more.
Nope, I might just buy it and write subs for them. That way people can also purchase the video directly from the pros and use VLC with the sub file that we have.
- Successfully kills the protoss nat and goes 5 fact for a second push, while attacking he says "just keep attacking while you are moving" and loses all his units to dragoons and 2 reavers. - Tries vulture runby into enemy main and says "his entrance should be clear", proceeds to meet dragoon on ramp and loses the vulture - After the mistakes he just says keep calm and you will win"
And then after all that he proceeds to win anyway cos he's Flash. Not really helpful but still funny I guess :D
Loving these videos. With all the extra information in sc2 replays it was easy for me in WoL to slow-mo and see every keystroke/control group of pros. Watching bw, players are so fast and without slow-mo replays and control group info it's hard to see when they are using f keys vs regular control group keys, what their hotkey layout is, etc. Some are so fast I can't even see what units they make without rewinding. These videos where pros make an effort to slow down and teach are great. It would be amazing if more of this information will be available in replays once remastered comes out, but I doubt it is a priority for blizzard.
Keep the donations going guys, there is clearly an abundance of great content here.
On June 05 2017 10:14 Galtath wrote: Has there been any effort to contact some of the protoss pros regarding their pay-walled videos? I love the two videos of stork that we have now, I'm just looking forward for some more.
Nope, I might just buy it and write subs for them. That way people can also purchase the video directly from the pros and use VLC with the sub file that we have.
hey frog you forgot to post the other 2 hr effort video. its like the very first 5 videos.
Well we can create a feedback thread for remastered.They already implemented "PoV" in BW replays, to follow a player's camera location at all times. They also show APM. I'm sure they would be open to showing unit selection and control groups! Also the replays certainly store keystroke information, so it would actually be very possible to show an in-game overlay of a keyboard highlighting which buttons are pressed.
This stuff is all very possible, but the SC:R team first needs to be aware that these kinds of feature requests are highly desired. Then they can take the time to prioritize tasks and schedule some time to work on these features.
I think I will start posting on the battle.net forums since they obviously listen there first. We all should, since tl users are clearly much more informed than most bnet forum users.
Effort's 1-1 is in progress now [the 3 hour one] but it will take some time.
On June 05 2017 10:14 Galtath wrote: Has there been any effort to contact some of the protoss pros regarding their pay-walled videos? I love the two videos of stork that we have now, I'm just looking forward for some more.
Nope, I might just buy it and write subs for them. That way people can also purchase the video directly from the pros and use VLC with the sub file that we have.
hey frog you forgot to post the other 2 hr effort video. its like the very first 5 videos.
I think it's missing some subs in the beginning? First subs is 1:27 in and he's talking before that so I think viewers might be a bit confused?
What's the build order for Effort's zvt noob build? Is it: 12 hatch, 12 pool 15 hatch 16 extractor lair, evo chamber, 2nd extractor carapace as soon as evo chamber is done ? den when lair is still building? ? spire when lair is done, just to trick the Terran lair done- build three expos and research lurkers (how does he afford that?) spire done- morph 9 hydras ? early queen's nest, hive, fast ultras
On June 13 2017 11:43 Luddite wrote: What's the build order for Effort's zvt noob build? Is it: 12 hatch, 12 pool 15 hatch 16 extractor lair, evo chamber, 2nd extractor carapace as soon as evo chamber is done ? den when lair is still building? ? spire when lair is done, just to trick the Terran lair done- build three expos and research lurkers (how does he afford that?) spire done- morph 9 hydras ? early queen's nest, hive, fast ultras
something like that?
it's in order of
12 hatch 11pool 13 hatch 15g lair ling speed spire drones and 12 lings until 35 psi 11 mutas + hydra den lurk up + queen's nest hive chamber your style!!
On June 11 2017 00:21 zeta wrote: are there any protoss videos in the backlog that we can look forward to?
Just seconding this request for a bit more Protoss content, now that we have a lot more Z and T. Understand translator may be working on other things right now. Appreciate the content/effort, thanks again .
On June 13 2017 11:43 Luddite wrote: What's the build order for Effort's zvt noob build? Is it: 12 hatch, 12 pool 15 hatch 16 extractor lair, evo chamber, 2nd extractor carapace as soon as evo chamber is done ? den when lair is still building? ? spire when lair is done, just to trick the Terran lair done- build three expos and research lurkers (how does he afford that?) spire done- morph 9 hydras ? early queen's nest, hive, fast ultras
something like that?
it's in order of
12 hatch 11pool 13 hatch 15g lair ling speed spire drones and 12 lings until 35 psi 11 mutas + hydra den lurk up + queen's nest hive chamber your style!!
No yours seems too "normal". I guess I was combining a few in my head, so maybe it's not one specific build order but a multiple things he does to mess with noobs. In 3-1 he built just 1 muta, then after scouting the terran base he took 3 expos, skipped lurkers completely, and defended with just upgraded zerglings. In another video he built the spire in a place where it would get scouted while also building a hydra den, and morphed 9 hydras as soon as it finished to fake out the Terran.
They seem like strategies designed to minimize the necessary micro and get fast ultras.
quite not sure what people are talking about effort zvt noob builds, but here's a recommend video from my lecture of ZvT. This was the trend before FlaSh came back to BW in 2015. It is still relevant b.o(textbook lecture) because if you are constantly doing @2:40 gas, terran can play a different style to torture you down.
12 Hatchery 13 Spawning Pool 14 Hatchery 14 Gas at 16, make ONLY 6 zerglings
Once you started making mutalisks, keep up having a lot of zerglings(Max 24 zerglings). 3 Hydralisks at your 3rd base and 3 Sunken Colonies for your natural.
I saw some of these translated videos. People always talk about that Korean language users know so much more. While they are very cool and surely helpful, I do get a bit of a feeling that the players only win because they outplay mechanically and that their advice translates poorly to lower levels. Especially in one series by Flash or Sea? He kept getting cheesed in different ways while claiming his build was save to the cheese he was facing. And then even with his micro, he lost. And the game he won, he also got outplayed BO/strategy wise, but just made up for it with multitasking.
On June 17 2017 20:20 Kadungon wrote: I saw some of these translated videos. People always talk about that Korean language users know so much more. While they are very cool and surely helpful, I do get a bit of a feeling that the players only win because they outplay mechanically and that their advice translates poorly to lower levels. Especially in one series by Flash or Sea? He kept getting cheesed in different ways while claiming his build was save to the cheese he was facing. And then even with his micro, he lost. And the game he won, he also got outplayed BO/strategy wise, but just made up for it with multitasking.
The point is accumulate knowledge. Only once a player has the knowledge can they actually make use of their mechanics. It's like step 1 and step 2 of git gud.
On June 16 2017 03:24 LaStScan wrote: quite not sure what people are talking about effort zvt noob builds, but here's a recommend video from my lecture of ZvT. This was the trend before FlaSh came back to BW in 2015. It is still relevant b.o(textbook lecture) because if you are constantly doing @2:40 gas, terran can play a different style to torture you down.
12 Hatchery 13 Spawning Pool 14 Hatchery 14 Gas at 16, make ONLY 6 zerglings
Once you started making mutalisks, keep up having a lot of zerglings(Max 24 zerglings). 3 Hydralisks at your 3rd base and 3 Sunken Colonies for your natural.
He made a lot of comments in zvt videos that were translated like:
"With my build, zvt is easy"
"See my build makes it so easy"
"F rank Terrans can't defeat my build"
etc. Maybe him just being cocky/trolling but it made me think he had some specific build order that he was teaching. But looking at it again, he was clearly doing very different builds (sometimes muta, sometimes lurkers, and in one video he just made zerglings and one muta).
The thing they all had in common was a fast +1 carapace, and a simplified midgame (just mutas into hive, or just lurkers into hive, instead of the standard mutas->lurkers->hive). For noobs like me it's really nice to have lings that don't die instantly to marines, and a less complex build order to follow. It gives me a lot more time to just focus on the basics of macro. I'm sure your build is better overall, but for me, following Effort's style turned ZvT from my worst matchup into my best.
On June 17 2017 20:20 Kadungon wrote: I saw some of these translated videos. People always talk about that Korean language users know so much more. While they are very cool and surely helpful, I do get a bit of a feeling that the players only win because they outplay mechanically and that their advice translates poorly to lower levels. Especially in one series by Flash or Sea? He kept getting cheesed in different ways while claiming his build was save to the cheese he was facing. And then even with his micro, he lost. And the game he won, he also got outplayed BO/strategy wise, but just made up for it with multitasking.
They might not have a great sense of what F-rank players know and don't know-they're just used to playing top level players all the time. And some of their opponents are watching them stream, or getting help from the stream viewers...
Effort seems to have the best sense of what lower-level players actually know, and how they think.
Was the terran in Effort's last game in that 1-1 video (the long game) better than average? Or was Effort just showboating too much? I know he's keeping his APM low, but It still seemed really difficult for him to defend and he came awfully close to losing several times.
I guess it's the same opponent as in the other games but for some reason he seemed way better in that one.
Effort kept saying like "you can do this, you can all do this" but... I don't think I can defend an expansion indefinitely like that with near-perfect defiler usage.
I guess it's the same opponent as in the other games but for some reason he seemed way better in that one.
Effort kept saying like "you can do this, you can all do this" but... I don't think I can defend an expansion indefinitely like that with near-perfect defiler usage.
At 2:26:40, there's a subtitle that says the terran had his D-rank brother play for a while that game.
I guess it's the same opponent as in the other games but for some reason he seemed way better in that one.
Effort kept saying like "you can do this, you can all do this" but... I don't think I can defend an expansion indefinitely like that with near-perfect defiler usage.
At 2:26:40, there's a subtitle that says the terran had his D-rank brother play for a while that game.
lol I couldn't believe Effort won that game. I also love how close it is and every time Effort is like "see how easy it is?" Efforts videos legit make me laugh, his trolling is funny.
On June 22 2017 12:58 IShowUMagic wrote: Keep the donations going guys. I would love to see some more protoss content too.
Which videos in particular? I can arrange a specific set of video/videos for you.
On June 22 2017 12:49 -Frog- wrote: Any more in the works? No pressure, these are great and looking forward to more
Apologies, I got super busy with a side business these past few weeks. I'll try to get whatever IShowUMagic wants translated. I'll update with a timeline after I get it commissioned. Thanks for the patience.
Not sure if there is mutual interest between all parties, but there are Director Commentaries from the Boxer DVD with Boxer, Um Jae-kyung and Kim Carry that might be interesting to subtitle? I know a bit of Korean to get the flow of the conversation, but there are a lot of nuances here and there that make it hard to follow.
Would be cool for history buffs such as myself, but not something of urgency.
On June 28 2017 19:26 GTR wrote: Not sure if there is mutual interest between all parties, but there are Director Commentaries from the Boxer DVD with Boxer, Um Jae-kyung and Kim Carry that might be interesting to subtitle? I know a bit of Korean to get the flow of the conversation, but there are a lot of nuances here and there that make it hard to follow.
Would be cool for history buffs such as myself, but not something of urgency.
While that would be great, I really really hope we get a solid base of gameplay vods first. Protoss department is heavily lacking.
I just realized EffOrt talks like jigglebilly. I really like how much he tones down his play to teach (even though he cheats and goes full force when he would be losing an engagement).
Or maybe it's a secret Zerg plot to take revenge on Terrans, by teaching Protoss how best to bully them. Making Zergs' enemies divided against themselves, so they have less time to focus on XvZ. It's a conspiracy. Moustache-Zerg is probably bankrolling things somewhere.
Or even better, maybe it's UNTRUE PvT information, designed to hurt Protoss and sow confusion amongst the enemies of Zerg. *cough* Hail Hydra *cough* (no, not Hydra)
Just wondering what is the map that Hiya is using where buildings build instantly and you can basically do whatever you want to practice building placement???
On July 23 2017 05:42 -Switch- wrote: Just wondering what is the map that Hiya is using where buildings build instantly and you can basically do whatever you want to practice building placement???
You can have that with normal cheat codes, no custom maps required.
On July 23 2017 05:42 -Switch- wrote: Just wondering what is the map that Hiya is using where buildings build instantly and you can basically do whatever you want to practice building placement???
You can have that with normal cheat codes, no custom maps required.
I put up money for 3 stork videos yesterday with the understanding that they will be translated when my translator has time as he is also busy right now. I'll post them as soon as they're complete.
On July 26 2017 09:18 frogmelter wrote: Apologies for the intermittent updates.
I put up money for 3 stork videos yesterday with the understanding that they will be translated when my translator has time as he is also busy right now. I'll post them as soon as they're complete.
Well done. I'll def donate for some toss/terran videos when I have some free money.
Honestly if we had a volunteer translator, that person should get a special TL title, special user icon and be revered as a god. Translating these high level tutorials would be an incredible contribution to the foreign community.
-After 11 Rax, you scout with 11.5 SCV -7o'clock first- why? overlords go clockwise, so you can tell overlord from 5'oclock base just by going to 7o'clock. In this case, it was first search, but otherwise, you can search 2 place at once. -you can building early bunker by keeping your scv alive- make sure it survives. -in this video, the scv was not able to stay alive for long time- so bunker is built AFTER academy and +1 -@1250 hp , 6 scv to 2nd cc -you can defend vs lings by mineral walking scvs and then attacking with both marines and scvs, which creates a wall. -always build supply at side of bunker to prevent surround -keep building supply but theres a timing where you need to build TWO supply- this is at 50 supply -3 medic @ 12 marine is ideal ratio -take off gas (-2) @250 as that is what you need for range+comsat -build turrets along muta path, 2 mineral line, 1 at rax, more at natural -take 2nd gas with factory -move 1 control group of mnm out -what are you scared of most? getting surrounded and losing the mnm -when surrounded, you need to immidately reinforce with your other group of mnm, and at least get your medic out alive at the very least
-2 starport after factory-> 4 vessel is what you get for late mech -you need to take control of the map when you see 3rd with lurkers -pressure the zerg 3rd so they can't drone off it- opponent will need to make hydra off 3rd instead of making drones -3rd cc after 2 starport -keep pressure up by reinforcing your mnm groups- keep them moving so opponent has to constantly guess where mnm is -@ 50% vessel, get irradiate, maybe with vessels + mine upgrade+vultures -after +1 infantry armor, lift ebay -scan for hive -the most important thing of all in 5rax tvz is to not get surrounded and lose the mnm army -if muta is after your mnm group- reinforce your control group of mnm -if muta is not chasing after your mnm group out in base-defend base - go to 5oclock base with your vulture with your units and vessels-you need to mine up the 5o'clock base to delay 4th -@ 4 vessels, get 3 factories -bring some mnm+scv to 1o'clcook base while expanding 3rd to get 4th up -after sufficient map control, lift rax and get 7 factories. -why I don't put scan asap on 3rd? so I can make more scvs -after lifting rax- you need to be active on map with vultures. -lifted rax floats to give vision to your half of the map from left to right-> from 9 oclock -center- 3 oclock -why? defend drops -you need to defend drops with mnm vessel -upgrade is lifeline of mech- especially 2/1 upgrade. -when 4th is up, gas asap -marines go to drop paths and keep containment with vulture mines. -you can never underestimate zerg since they got lot of bases as well. You need to send 5 tank to your far bases- that can defend most attacks -after you max out with biomech, you need to start throwing away mnm to get supply- but need to do it effectively -put extra factory up at far base -turrets on drop path*** important, dont save resources trying to skip on this -you need to keep mkaing turrets as much as your hands allow. You absolutely cannot skip on them -put pressure with your mech army- but 5 tanks at your far base is mandatory. Consider them permanent -the first line of defence is at right side of the map- the pathway that leads to the 1o'clock base. -the second line of defence is 5 tanks on top of the far base. -you need to throw away vultures just as you would with mnm. Late mech's strength comes off mass tanks- vultures are useless vs ultras -why I didn't go directly attack zerg until 18 minutes into game? Because most of my supply was used up by useless units like MnM, vultures w/o tank. Only when you fill 200/200 with mostly tanks, you can start to attack -when theres defiler-lurker drop, just put 1 tank outside of swarm, focus fire on the defiler and it will take care of it by itself. -when mnm, vulture are thrown away and filled up with tank, its time to attack. -you need to avoid dark swarm to avoid trading inefficiently- terran's production is slower than other races, so its important to keep your units alive. You cannot drop guard just because you won a fight as you simply can't produce enough in time. -Unsieged tank is garbage so you cannot go into fight unsieged -when established a position with tank line, don't try to unsiege->move in with sieged tanks; you move forward with your reinforcement tanks, not your established tanks. -A (sieged tanks)->B (reinforcements siege up little more)-> A (unsiege to leapfrog) -why? Because of dark swarm. -terran wins by protecting their main army and trading efficiently big army of mech- so you cannot lose your army at once. -its both easy to win and lose because of this- if you start getting overwhelmed, you lose. -queens->Its effective to combat queen with valkaryie but no air defence means ultra so you make vessels -keep your eye on your main army.
-20 cc+2 at gas after factory -marine hitting rax that early means pressure, make 2 vultures -vulture vs vulture- its important to focus fire (marine first) -as you saw, its better to target fire and put your focus on important aspects such as precise focus fire, rather than useless micro (vulture patrol) -tank+mine up to get 2 vulture 2 tank -people seem to be mistaken that fancy micro is great micro. But starcraft isn't like that. Having precise and right focus fire is the best form of micro -see my opponent for example: if he focus fired right, he would have won right there due to having more units, but as he tried to overmicro, he lost even though it looks fancier. -put down mines with academy and siege mode -You don't get 2nd gas right away- its important to keep mineral income -when you feel that theres enough mines burrowed and you have advanced sufficiently, you put on add ons+2nd gas -when you see opponent dont have mine upgrade, you dont need to put on scans- use that gas on tanks instead -put mines up at opponent expansion so you can delay theirs. -estimating tank range comes with lot of ingame experience- it doesn't come with just watching tutorial- rather you need to gain it through playing -in tvt, if you manage to siege up and contain opponent first, you have big advantage as you are able to take your expansion safely- as opponent needs to take his expansion while simultaneously defending the front -you get +1 after getting 3rd base -in my situation, you don't take the 9 oclock base but 12 o'clock. Why? he needs to attack into your army to attack that. 9 oclock base needs part of your army there to defend,which subtracts from main tank line -you need to scan for dropship -even if opponent has lot of vultures, the tank count is important since its easy to catch up with vulture count -focus firing on mine is important in case of runby -just like in tvp, when +1 has 30% left, you build starport to prepare for +2 -at this point when you have 3 bases going and sieged up opponent you have few choices @science facility going up -wraith- get add on for starport, get 2 starport, cloak -only get attack upgrade. No armor since gas usage. -double armory vessel- and go up to 7 factory with +2 weapons -people said in past that armor upgrade is useless in tvt; this is not true in modern tvt. -yes, tanks still get 2 shot by sieged tanks after +2, but in vulture vs vulture, theres huge difference. -keep scanning for opponent starport- if no starport, there is no need to defend for drops, therefore, can delay ebay -after you feel that you have sufficient amount of vultures, just research goliath range upgrade- 4 goliaths can handle control group of wraiths by itself. You don't need to make goliaths when there is no starport. In this case, flash makes 2 goliath for safety. -There is no need to rush bases in tvt. when map is split in half, you just need to maintain 1 more base to gain the benefits. -why go ground focused in tvt? Vessel defensive matrix. -After +2 researched, put defensive on vulture while attacking with your ground army. The vulture can soak entire volley from line of tanks so you are able to pierce enemy defensive line easily -when going on offesnive after breaking line, its better to go in with unsieged tanks -its important to understand and digest your build order. In pro level, theres different class between terrans such as S-level, A-level ect. These differences are because of understanding of their build. For example, look at Leta's 2 port wraith. Do you think he just used it because his micro was good? No, its because he understood the build and the concept of build itself. Thast why its important to play a lot and understand the build
TvP Factory FE + Defending vs 2 base Dark Templar Drop + Show Spoiler +
-in 12 gas, you search with your 13-14 supply scv -build depo with scv that was building rax -always take out 2 scv at 88 gas when going fe -make 2 marines -you need to always look for dragoon range upgrade+ 3 pylons -when you see 3 pylon, you can put dark templar out of equation. Even if it is, you can defend it easily -put academy up off 1 factory -if 2 pylon, you need to take it into equation. -its good to make more marines as you make tank. -if you are confident in your micro, when you see 3 pylons, you get mine upgrade with 2 tank. If you are not comfortable with your micro, you get siege up. In this case, I will be getting siege upgrade -if siege mode, keep making tanks. -2 factory->speed upgrade+vulture -when academy is done, get scan asap. -never scan immidiately after getting scan. You don't need to be so curious about what opponent is doing. Get ebay up after 2 factory. -When ebay is 70-80% done, and you have 70-80 scan energy, you scan then for opponent tech. -this way, you have a scan left over, and can build turrets on time. Now if there is dark templar drop, you have a scan to defend as well as turrets up -build armory as you look at opponent's tech. -when dt drop, 3rd cc builds near turret -your vulture needs to be out of the base near your opponents entrance. You prevent contesting for your 3rd by delaying protoss pressure with vultures. -in FS, you can get 3rd by having safe sim-city that prevents dragoon from getting in. -take 2 scv with you when taking 3rd. One makes supply wall, one makes bunker. -add on factory as your money allows. There is no real set time. -Get 3rd gas as you take 3rd. -after 40% +1 upgrade, get a starport and armory -just leave bunker (with 4 marine) and 1 tank at your 3rd. -ideal scv saturation is 1.5 control group -go up to 9 factories. -after establishing 9 factories, you start to inch out of your base and build forward turrets -this is to hide the vulture path. If you don't move out of your base and have forward turrets up, one observer infront of your base can see all the vulture routes. Forward turrets hide vulture route. -before 200/200 fight, you need to see opponent's tech. If arbitor, you need to make 3 turrets per arbitor path as it kills arbitor. -you get goliath+goliath range right before you hit 200/200. Goliath is always last as terran is gas starved. Terran only has gas left over only towards end of 200/200. -Your 200/200 army composition should have 2 control group of tanks,3 control groups of vultures/goliath and vessels. If you don't have 5 control group of army, you have too much scv. -key to good fight is emp (on priority target such as templar/archon/arbitor) and good focus fire with tanks. -Its not over just because you won a fight. As toss has more expansions, its critical to attack to closest expansion. In this case, flash attacks 6oclock base first. - Its important to move in way that you can put mines into attack path so when you engage, youhave mine field infront. -if protoss tries to backstab, you leave 4 tank and vessel attacking opponent expansion and follow protoss army with remainder of your army.
-After 11 Rax, you scout with 11.5 SCV -7o'clock first- why? overlords go clockwise, so you can tell overlord from 5'oclock base just by going to 7o'clock. In this case, it was first search, but otherwise, you can search 2 place at once. -you can building early bunker by keeping your scv alive- make sure it survives. -in this video, the scv was not able to stay alive for long time- so bunker is built AFTER academy and +1 -@1250 hp , 6 scv to 2nd cc -you can defend vs lings by mineral walking scvs and then attacking with both marines and scvs, which creates a wall. -always build supply at side of bunker to prevent surround -keep building supply but theres a timing where you need to build TWO supply- this is at 50 supply -3 medic @ 12 marine is ideal ratio -take off gas (-2) @250 as that is what you need for range+comsat -build turrets along muta path, 2 mineral line, 1 at rax, more at natural -take 2nd gas with factory -move 1 control group of mnm out -what are you scared of most? getting surrounded and losing the mnm -when surrounded, you need to immidately reinforce with your other group of mnm, and at least get your medic out alive at the very least
-2 starport after factory-> 4 vessel is what you get for late mech -you need to take control of the map when you see 3rd with lurkers -pressure the zerg 3rd so they can't drone off it- opponent will need to make hydra off 3rd instead of making drones -3rd cc after 2 starport -keep pressure up by reinforcing your mnm groups- keep them moving so opponent has to constantly guess where mnm is -@ 50% vessel, get irradiate, maybe with vessels + mine upgrade+vultures -after +1 infantry armor, lift ebay -scan for hive -the most important thing of all in 5rax tvz is to not get surrounded and lose the mnm army -if muta is after your mnm group- reinforce your control group of mnm -if muta is not chasing after your mnm group out in base-defend base - go to 5oclock base with your vulture with your units and vessels-you need to mine up the 5o'clock base to delay 4th -@ 4 vessels, get 3 factories -bring some mnm+scv to 1o'clcook base while expanding 3rd to get 4th up -after sufficient map control, lift rax and get 7 factories. -why I don't put scan asap on 3rd? so I can make more scvs -after lifting rax- you need to be active on map with vultures. -lifted rax floats to give vision to your half of the map from left to right-> from 9 oclock -center- 3 oclock -why? defend drops -you need to defend drops with mnm vessel -upgrade is lifeline of mech- especially 2/1 upgrade. -when 4th is up, gas asap -marines go to drop paths and keep containment with vulture mines. -you can never underestimate zerg since they got lot of bases as well. You need to send 5 tank to your far bases- that can defend most attacks -after you max out with biomech, you need to start throwing away mnm to get supply- but need to do it effectively -put extra factory up at far base -turrets on drop path*** important, dont save resources trying to skip on this -you need to keep mkaing turrets as much as your hands allow. You absolutely cannot skip on them -put pressure with your mech army- but 5 tanks at your far base is mandatory. Consider them permanent -the first line of defence is at right side of the map- the pathway that leads to the 1o'clock base. -the second line of defence is 5 tanks on top of the far base. -you need to throw away vultures just as you would with mnm. Late mech's strength comes off mass tanks- vultures are useless vs ultras -why I didn't go directly attack zerg until 18 minutes into game? Because most of my supply was used up by useless units like MnM, vultures w/o tank. Only when you fill 200/200 with mostly tanks, you can start to attack -when theres defiler-lurker drop, just put 1 tank outside of swarm, focus fire on the defiler and it will take care of it by itself. -when mnm, vulture are thrown away and filled up with tank, its time to attack. -you need to avoid dark swarm to avoid trading inefficiently- terran's production is slower than other races, so its important to keep your units alive. You cannot drop guard just because you won a fight as you simply can't produce enough in time. -Unsieged tank is garbage so you cannot go into fight unsieged -when established a position with tank line, don't try to unsiege->move in with sieged tanks; you move forward with your reinforcement tanks, not your established tanks. -A (sieged tanks)->B (reinforcements siege up little more)-> A (unsiege to leapfrog) -why? Because of dark swarm. -terran wins by protecting their main army and trading efficiently big army of mech- so you cannot lose your army at once. -its both easy to win and lose because of this- if you start getting overwhelmed, you lose. -queens->Its effective to combat queen with valkaryie but no air defence means ultra so you make vessels -keep your eye on your main army.
-20 cc+2 at gas after factory -marine hitting rax that early means pressure, make 2 vultures -vulture vs vulture- its important to focus fire (marine first) -as you saw, its better to target fire and put your focus on important aspects such as precise focus fire, rather than useless micro (vulture patrol) -tank+mine up to get 2 vulture 2 tank -people seem to be mistaken that fancy micro is great micro. But starcraft isn't like that. Having precise and right focus fire is the best form of micro -see my opponent for example: if he focus fired right, he would have won right there due to having more units, but as he tried to overmicro, he lost even though it looks fancier. -put down mines with academy and siege mode -You don't get 2nd gas right away- its important to keep mineral income -when you feel that theres enough mines burrowed and you have advanced sufficiently, you put on add ons+2nd gas -when you see opponent dont have mine upgrade, you dont need to put on scans- use that gas on tanks instead -put mines up at opponent expansion so you can delay theirs. -estimating tank range comes with lot of ingame experience- it doesn't come with just watching tutorial- rather you need to gain it through playing -in tvt, if you manage to siege up and contain opponent first, you have big advantage as you are able to take your expansion safely- as opponent needs to take his expansion while simultaneously defending the front -you get +1 after getting 3rd base -in my situation, you don't take the 9 oclock base but 12 o'clock. Why? he needs to attack into your army to attack that. 9 oclock base needs part of your army there to defend,which subtracts from main tank line -you need to scan for dropship -even if opponent has lot of vultures, the tank count is important since its easy to catch up with vulture count -focus firing on mine is important in case of runby -just like in tvp, when +1 has 30% left, you build starport to prepare for +2 -at this point when you have 3 bases going and sieged up opponent you have few choices @science facility going up -wraith- get add on for starport, get 2 starport, cloak -only get attack upgrade. No armor since gas usage. -double armory vessel- and go up to 7 factory with +2 weapons -people said in past that armor upgrade is useless in tvt; this is not true in modern tvt. -yes, tanks still get 2 shot by sieged tanks after +2, but in vulture vs vulture, theres huge difference. -keep scanning for opponent starport- if no starport, there is no need to defend for drops, therefore, can delay ebay -after you feel that you have sufficient amount of vultures, just research goliath range upgrade- 4 goliaths can handle control group of wraiths by itself. You don't need to make goliaths when there is no starport. In this case, flash makes 2 goliath for safety. -There is no need to rush bases in tvt. when map is split in half, you just need to maintain 1 more base to gain the benefits. -why go ground focused in tvt? Vessel defensive matrix. -After +2 researched, put defensive on vulture while attacking with your ground army. The vulture can soak entire volley from line of tanks so you are able to pierce enemy defensive line easily -when going on offesnive after breaking line, its better to go in with unsieged tanks -its important to understand and digest your build order. In pro level, theres different class between terrans such as S-level, A-level ect. These differences are because of understanding of their build. For example, look at Leta's 2 port wraith. Do you think he just used it because his micro was good? No, its because he understood the build and the concept of build itself. Thast why its important to play a lot and understand the build
TvP Factory FE + Defending vs 2 base Dark Templar Drop + Show Spoiler +
-in 12 gas, you search with your 13-14 supply scv -build depo with scv that was building rax -always take out 2 scv at 88 gas when going fe -make 2 marines -you need to always look for dragoon range upgrade+ 3 pylons -when you see 3 pylon, you can put dark templar out of equation. Even if it is, you can defend it easily -put academy up off 1 factory -if 2 pylon, you need to take it into equation. -its good to make more marines as you make tank. -if you are confident in your micro, when you see 3 pylons, you get mine upgrade with 2 tank. If you are not comfortable with your micro, you get siege up. In this case, I will be getting siege upgrade -if siege mode, keep making tanks. -2 factory->speed upgrade+vulture -when academy is done, get scan asap. -never scan immidiately after getting scan. You don't need to be so curious about what opponent is doing. Get ebay up after 2 factory. -When ebay is 70-80% done, and you have 70-80 scan energy, you scan then for opponent tech. -this way, you have a scan left over, and can build turrets on time. Now if there is dark templar drop, you have a scan to defend as well as turrets up -build armory as you look at opponent's tech. -when dt drop, 3rd cc builds near turret -your vulture needs to be out of the base near your opponents entrance. You prevent contesting for your 3rd by delaying protoss pressure with vultures. -in FS, you can get 3rd by having safe sim-city that prevents dragoon from getting in. -take 2 scv with you when taking 3rd. One makes supply wall, one makes bunker. -add on factory as your money allows. There is no real set time. -Get 3rd gas as you take 3rd. -after 40% +1 upgrade, get a starport and armory -just leave bunker (with 4 marine) and 1 tank at your 3rd. -ideal scv saturation is 1.5 control group -go up to 9 factories. -after establishing 9 factories, you start to inch out of your base and build forward turrets -this is to hide the vulture path. If you don't move out of your base and have forward turrets up, one observer infront of your base can see all the vulture routes. Forward turrets hide vulture route. -before 200/200 fight, you need to see opponent's tech. If arbitor, you need to make 3 turrets per arbitor path as it kills arbitor. -you get goliath+goliath range right before you hit 200/200. Goliath is always last as terran is gas starved. Terran only has gas left over only towards end of 200/200. -Your 200/200 army composition should have 2 control group of tanks,3 control groups of vultures/goliath and vessels. If you don't have 5 control group of army, you have too much scv. -key to good fight is emp (on priority target such as templar/archon/arbitor) and good focus fire with tanks. -Its not over just because you won a fight. As toss has more expansions, its critical to attack to closest expansion. In this case, flash attacks 6oclock base first. - Its important to move in way that you can put mines into attack path so when you engage, youhave mine field infront. -if protoss tries to backstab, you leave 4 tank and vessel attacking opponent expansion and follow protoss army with remainder of your army.
-After 11 Rax, you scout with 11.5 SCV -7o'clock first- why? overlords go clockwise, so you can tell overlord from 5'oclock base just by going to 7o'clock. In this case, it was first search, but otherwise, you can search 2 place at once. -you can building early bunker by keeping your scv alive- make sure it survives. -in this video, the scv was not able to stay alive for long time- so bunker is built AFTER academy and +1 -@1250 hp , 6 scv to 2nd cc -you can defend vs lings by mineral walking scvs and then attacking with both marines and scvs, which creates a wall. -always build supply at side of bunker to prevent surround -keep building supply but theres a timing where you need to build TWO supply- this is at 50 supply -3 medic @ 12 marine is ideal ratio -take off gas (-2) @250 as that is what you need for range+comsat -build turrets along muta path, 2 mineral line, 1 at rax, more at natural -take 2nd gas with factory -move 1 control group of mnm out -what are you scared of most? getting surrounded and losing the mnm -when surrounded, you need to immidately reinforce with your other group of mnm, and at least get your medic out alive at the very least
-2 starport after factory-> 4 vessel is what you get for late mech -you need to take control of the map when you see 3rd with lurkers -pressure the zerg 3rd so they can't drone off it- opponent will need to make hydra off 3rd instead of making drones -3rd cc after 2 starport -keep pressure up by reinforcing your mnm groups- keep them moving so opponent has to constantly guess where mnm is -@ 50% vessel, get irradiate, maybe with vessels + mine upgrade+vultures -after +1 infantry armor, lift ebay -scan for hive -the most important thing of all in 5rax tvz is to not get surrounded and lose the mnm army -if muta is after your mnm group- reinforce your control group of mnm -if muta is not chasing after your mnm group out in base-defend base - go to 5oclock base with your vulture with your units and vessels-you need to mine up the 5o'clock base to delay 4th -@ 4 vessels, get 3 factories -bring some mnm+scv to 1o'clcook base while expanding 3rd to get 4th up -after sufficient map control, lift rax and get 7 factories. -why I don't put scan asap on 3rd? so I can make more scvs -after lifting rax- you need to be active on map with vultures. -lifted rax floats to give vision to your half of the map from left to right-> from 9 oclock -center- 3 oclock -why? defend drops -you need to defend drops with mnm vessel -upgrade is lifeline of mech- especially 2/1 upgrade. -when 4th is up, gas asap -marines go to drop paths and keep containment with vulture mines. -you can never underestimate zerg since they got lot of bases as well. You need to send 5 tank to your far bases- that can defend most attacks -after you max out with biomech, you need to start throwing away mnm to get supply- but need to do it effectively -put extra factory up at far base -turrets on drop path*** important, dont save resources trying to skip on this -you need to keep mkaing turrets as much as your hands allow. You absolutely cannot skip on them -put pressure with your mech army- but 5 tanks at your far base is mandatory. Consider them permanent -the first line of defence is at right side of the map- the pathway that leads to the 1o'clock base. -the second line of defence is 5 tanks on top of the far base. -you need to throw away vultures just as you would with mnm. Late mech's strength comes off mass tanks- vultures are useless vs ultras -why I didn't go directly attack zerg until 18 minutes into game? Because most of my supply was used up by useless units like MnM, vultures w/o tank. Only when you fill 200/200 with mostly tanks, you can start to attack -when theres defiler-lurker drop, just put 1 tank outside of swarm, focus fire on the defiler and it will take care of it by itself. -when mnm, vulture are thrown away and filled up with tank, its time to attack. -you need to avoid dark swarm to avoid trading inefficiently- terran's production is slower than other races, so its important to keep your units alive. You cannot drop guard just because you won a fight as you simply can't produce enough in time. -Unsieged tank is garbage so you cannot go into fight unsieged -when established a position with tank line, don't try to unsiege->move in with sieged tanks; you move forward with your reinforcement tanks, not your established tanks. -A (sieged tanks)->B (reinforcements siege up little more)-> A (unsiege to leapfrog) -why? Because of dark swarm. -terran wins by protecting their main army and trading efficiently big army of mech- so you cannot lose your army at once. -its both easy to win and lose because of this- if you start getting overwhelmed, you lose. -queens->Its effective to combat queen with valkaryie but no air defence means ultra so you make vessels -keep your eye on your main army.
-20 cc+2 at gas after factory -marine hitting rax that early means pressure, make 2 vultures -vulture vs vulture- its important to focus fire (marine first) -as you saw, its better to target fire and put your focus on important aspects such as precise focus fire, rather than useless micro (vulture patrol) -tank+mine up to get 2 vulture 2 tank -people seem to be mistaken that fancy micro is great micro. But starcraft isn't like that. Having precise and right focus fire is the best form of micro -see my opponent for example: if he focus fired right, he would have won right there due to having more units, but as he tried to overmicro, he lost even though it looks fancier. -put down mines with academy and siege mode -You don't get 2nd gas right away- its important to keep mineral income -when you feel that theres enough mines burrowed and you have advanced sufficiently, you put on add ons+2nd gas -when you see opponent dont have mine upgrade, you dont need to put on scans- use that gas on tanks instead -put mines up at opponent expansion so you can delay theirs. -estimating tank range comes with lot of ingame experience- it doesn't come with just watching tutorial- rather you need to gain it through playing -in tvt, if you manage to siege up and contain opponent first, you have big advantage as you are able to take your expansion safely- as opponent needs to take his expansion while simultaneously defending the front -you get +1 after getting 3rd base -in my situation, you don't take the 9 oclock base but 12 o'clock. Why? he needs to attack into your army to attack that. 9 oclock base needs part of your army there to defend,which subtracts from main tank line -you need to scan for dropship -even if opponent has lot of vultures, the tank count is important since its easy to catch up with vulture count -focus firing on mine is important in case of runby -just like in tvp, when +1 has 30% left, you build starport to prepare for +2 -at this point when you have 3 bases going and sieged up opponent you have few choices @science facility going up -wraith- get add on for starport, get 2 starport, cloak -only get attack upgrade. No armor since gas usage. -double armory vessel- and go up to 7 factory with +2 weapons -people said in past that armor upgrade is useless in tvt; this is not true in modern tvt. -yes, tanks still get 2 shot by sieged tanks after +2, but in vulture vs vulture, theres huge difference. -keep scanning for opponent starport- if no starport, there is no need to defend for drops, therefore, can delay ebay -after you feel that you have sufficient amount of vultures, just research goliath range upgrade- 4 goliaths can handle control group of wraiths by itself. You don't need to make goliaths when there is no starport. In this case, flash makes 2 goliath for safety. -There is no need to rush bases in tvt. when map is split in half, you just need to maintain 1 more base to gain the benefits. -why go ground focused in tvt? Vessel defensive matrix. -After +2 researched, put defensive on vulture while attacking with your ground army. The vulture can soak entire volley from line of tanks so you are able to pierce enemy defensive line easily -when going on offesnive after breaking line, its better to go in with unsieged tanks -its important to understand and digest your build order. In pro level, theres different class between terrans such as S-level, A-level ect. These differences are because of understanding of their build. For example, look at Leta's 2 port wraith. Do you think he just used it because his micro was good? No, its because he understood the build and the concept of build itself. Thast why its important to play a lot and understand the build
TvP Factory FE + Defending vs 2 base Dark Templar Drop + Show Spoiler +
-in 12 gas, you search with your 13-14 supply scv -build depo with scv that was building rax -always take out 2 scv at 88 gas when going fe -make 2 marines -you need to always look for dragoon range upgrade+ 3 pylons -when you see 3 pylon, you can put dark templar out of equation. Even if it is, you can defend it easily -put academy up off 1 factory -if 2 pylon, you need to take it into equation. -its good to make more marines as you make tank. -if you are confident in your micro, when you see 3 pylons, you get mine upgrade with 2 tank. If you are not comfortable with your micro, you get siege up. In this case, I will be getting siege upgrade -if siege mode, keep making tanks. -2 factory->speed upgrade+vulture -when academy is done, get scan asap. -never scan immidiately after getting scan. You don't need to be so curious about what opponent is doing. Get ebay up after 2 factory. -When ebay is 70-80% done, and you have 70-80 scan energy, you scan then for opponent tech. -this way, you have a scan left over, and can build turrets on time. Now if there is dark templar drop, you have a scan to defend as well as turrets up -build armory as you look at opponent's tech. -when dt drop, 3rd cc builds near turret -your vulture needs to be out of the base near your opponents entrance. You prevent contesting for your 3rd by delaying protoss pressure with vultures. -in FS, you can get 3rd by having safe sim-city that prevents dragoon from getting in. -take 2 scv with you when taking 3rd. One makes supply wall, one makes bunker. -add on factory as your money allows. There is no real set time. -Get 3rd gas as you take 3rd. -after 40% +1 upgrade, get a starport and armory -just leave bunker (with 4 marine) and 1 tank at your 3rd. -ideal scv saturation is 1.5 control group -go up to 9 factories. -after establishing 9 factories, you start to inch out of your base and build forward turrets -this is to hide the vulture path. If you don't move out of your base and have forward turrets up, one observer infront of your base can see all the vulture routes. Forward turrets hide vulture route. -before 200/200 fight, you need to see opponent's tech. If arbitor, you need to make 3 turrets per arbitor path as it kills arbitor. -you get goliath+goliath range right before you hit 200/200. Goliath is always last as terran is gas starved. Terran only has gas left over only towards end of 200/200. -Your 200/200 army composition should have 2 control group of tanks,3 control groups of vultures/goliath and vessels. If you don't have 5 control group of army, you have too much scv. -key to good fight is emp (on priority target such as templar/archon/arbitor) and good focus fire with tanks. -Its not over just because you won a fight. As toss has more expansions, its critical to attack to closest expansion. In this case, flash attacks 6oclock base first. - Its important to move in way that you can put mines into attack path so when you engage, youhave mine field infront. -if protoss tries to backstab, you leave 4 tank and vessel attacking opponent expansion and follow protoss army with remainder of your army.
Most of these videos are build orders and stuff, are there any that teaches unit and control group management? Specifically what keys to press and what to do with new units and current groups, if at all, and what routine they follow. I think Ctrl and Shift or its combination are being pressed, but it's still hard to figure out just from 1st person perspective, even if I slow down the video.
I'm interested because I see some players either manage "clean" (only one type of unit in one control group) or "messy" (a clusterfuck of different units in all control groups), and everything in between. Seeing as how I fall into the messy end of the spectrum, I want to try and see if I can learn the other style without losing any speed. Any help?
On August 21 2017 09:47 riotjune wrote: Most of these videos are build orders and stuff, are there any that teaches unit and control group management? Specifically what keys to press and what to do with new units and current groups, if at all, and what routine they follow. I think Ctrl and Shift or its combination are being pressed, but it's still hard to figure out just from 1st person perspective, even if I slow down the video.
I'm interested because I see some players either manage "clean" (only one type of unit in one control group) or "messy" (a clusterfuck of different units in all control groups), and everything in between. Seeing as how I fall into the messy end of the spectrum, I want to try and see if I can learn the other style without losing any speed. Any help?
On August 21 2017 09:47 riotjune wrote: Most of these videos are build orders and stuff, are there any that teaches unit and control group management? Specifically what keys to press and what to do with new units and current groups, if at all, and what routine they follow. I think Ctrl and Shift or its combination are being pressed, but it's still hard to figure out just from 1st person perspective, even if I slow down the video.
I'm interested because I see some players either manage "clean" (only one type of unit in one control group) or "messy" (a clusterfuck of different units in all control groups), and everything in between. Seeing as how I fall into the messy end of the spectrum, I want to try and see if I can learn the other style without losing any speed. Any help?
heya guys. i kinda co-run the project with frogmelter. (it was originally my idea, this is just the coordination thread i haven't communicated with frogmelter in a few weeks. i'll email him and gives you guys sorta an update?
i just wanted to say thankyou to all the donators who have made this project possible. without you, frogmelter would have footed most of the translation cost that went well into the 100's of dollars very quickly.
---FS--- ****style in FS and CB are entirely different so tutorial is split into 2 parts****
-before 10th scv, at 80 mineral, send a scv down before the 10th scv produces -scout @ 12~13 supply -at 15 supply, using the scv that was buliding rax, make 2nd CC -IF first scout, with the 15th scv (16 supply), send it to natural to wall it off. 17 supply, take 1st gas -first scout means that you can delay marine to make scv. -if not first scout, instead of scv at 16, you make a marine first and then scv -using the scv that was making depo at natural, make a bunker. -@1250 hp, send scvs down to natural until there is 9 scv at your main mineral line -as theres 7 mineral nodes at natural, you need to keep sending scv down to your natural until you get 7 scv at natural mineral line to match it. -after 7 scv at natural, you can rally your main scvs to your main mineral line -2 factory after balancing out mineral line -search one more time with scv to check for opponent main while building factories- why? Because you need to choose between academy and ebay. -1) There is no natural nexus: Ebay -2) There is natural nexus: Academy -send scvs to repair bunker: Always match dragoon count. -with the 2 factory, if protoss is playing standard, you make SIEGE TANK LAST. you first: -1) Research siege mode -2) Put add on at 2nd factory -3) make a Siege tank. -why? Siege mode research time takes the longest, and you want to get add on faster since you can research vulture tech -4) Research Vulture speed+Mine upgrade when 2nd add on is complete -when academy is complete, add 1 scanner sweep add-on, then build an ebay. -with the first sieged, tank, focus fire on the lowest hp dragoon. If there isn't low hp one, focus on the middle -After vulture speed+Mine upgrade is being researched, add the second scanner sweep add on. -this is to utilize the gas to produce 1 tank+vultures+upgrades by delaying the 2nd scanner sweep. -Flash scans and sees standard play. However, if it is reaver, you put up the FS 4 turret ring (back of natural, infront of natural, 2 at edge of bases) -after making 3rd cc, take the 2nd gas, then armory. -in this case, the vulture was supposed to be able to get out, but the opponent did well containing him with dragoons. But at a cost: His 3rd expansion is late due to him focusing on getting enough army to contain his vultures -since his vultures were not able to get out of the contain, he needs to focus on taking the 3rd. -even if you are forced to take a small trade, in order to establish 3rd, you need to block the entrance bridge with sim city while getting 4 factories up. -if the entrance is sim-city'd, you can take 3rd with just 1 defensive tank at the bridge. -when taking 3rd, take 8 scv from main+8 scv from natural. -in this case, he already pulled 4 scv up defending his bridge, so he brought 8 from main, 4 from natural -when armory is over ~30% +1, you make starport* -scan at 3rd goes up as late as possible for optimization. -tvp is all about optimization, so putting up scan last on 3rd in order to make scv is the best course of action -having too much scv isn't a good thing either,so you need to control scv production -if templar archive is up at 10th min, (around this time), it is not carrier, so you don't need to worry about it -if it is, you can just walk across map and win. -when the 3rd is safe and operating, you increase your factory count from 5 to 9 all at once. -you put on starport add on at this time as well as well as 2/1 upgrade. -when 9 factory is built, you need to start pushing out of your natural to claim the territory infront of the bridge -why? Because there were dragoon at 11'oclock bridge (protoss expansion) -you should never have supply block. If you get supply blocked, its incredibly hard to win. -when there is spare gas, make a vessel -when there is spare gas after making vessel, get goliath range -goliath production is gotten last, it should be the last production cycle from factory before hitting 200. -FS is different than CB. In CB, its fine to contest with vultures, but in FS, its incredibly hard to take 4th. Its so hard that most terrans need to take 4th right beside the protoss main (3'oclock) -Q:then what do you do since its so hard to take 4th? -A: You need to get 200 as soon as possible and finish it all at once. -in FS, you MUST go out before 2/1 is complete with 200/200. -you need to reduce the lost loss as much as possible while moving out as soon as possible -during battle, you need to ALWAYS be sieged. Even if I was bit careless during this fight, it is imperative that your tanks are sieged. -always focus fire templar first. -In FS, its important that you win the 200/200 fight. If you can't, you can not establish the 4th expansion as it is towards the protoss expansion/main. -even if you win the 200/200 fight and pushed up to protoss natural, you can not be careless. This is one of places that you can throw the game, even if it seems like you have already won the game. -your vultures always need to be used effectively: they need to be moving to constantly protect siege tanks from zealots or focus firing on templars. -put mines and some tanks at protoss natural to contain the protoss: By doing this, you limit protoss's ability to harass your 4th. -you wont be able to use all the vulture's mines, but use it as much as possible. -you need to be able to defend protoss's attempt to break your contain at his nat while sending as least army as possible to break protoss's outer expansions. -your goal after winning the 200/200 fight is to push up to opponent's natural, break it and then breaking protoss's other expansion. -in other words, your main goal is to break 2 expansions after winning fight. -although it looks easy to win with mech, its extremely importan tto maintain the unit ratio. if there is too much of one type of unit and your ratio becomes unbalanced, its incredibly easy to lose with mech.
---CB--- FlaSh's standard Terran vs standard Protoss -12 scout. -in CB, you need to scout the middle first for proxy gates first, and scout horizontal natural first for nexus first as horizontal is closer. Then you search the vertical base, the cross position last. -this is to punish nexus first by pumping marines -wait until 15 cc to make marine -16 supply, 17+18 SCV+marine-> This is to kill nexus first. If you search horizontal natural and there isn't nexus first, you cancle the 2nd marine and build gas -even if the nexus first is the cross position on cb, if you can succeed with rax FE, you aren't at a bad position at all. So it does not matter as much if protoss is going nexus first in cross position at CB. -its 21 nexus in this game, so you can build tanks bit slowly this game. -academy after 2 factory (as you saw the 2nd nexus) -you need to build supply depo ahead of time. -***Add-on before tank*** -Terran is always scared of DT or Reaver drop. But when protoss is hitting the bunker with range, you can be assured. -if it is ranged dragoon, you have the scan. Reason you don't use the first scan is to block dragoon range+DT -with 4th vulture getting out, you can get 3rd cc+2nd gas+armory -as it is cross position, you can get away with being bit greedy. -in cross position at CB, as the distance is large, you get less pressure from protoss. However, at the same time, you are weaker to carriers -you can negate this weakness by taking 4th cc at low ground and taking ebay at same time. -you dont need to be afraid of 4th being overrun by protoss. Since you already have 3rd up, hou can take your time taking 4th. If taking the 4th pays off, you benefit. If you can't protect it, you don't take much loss. -In cb, you need to be always be aware of protoss's army movement and contain him using mines. -having fast 4th command will alow you to get the 3rd gas up asap. -***30% +1 = getting starport up*** -after getting 4 cc up, and you have confirmed beforehadn with scan that protoss is not going reaver or dt, you start putting turrets up. -armory+science facility after starport -you need to layer up with supply on the 4th and leave at least 2 tanks at 4th. -in CB, unlike FS, you need to keep making factories as you have much more bank left over. FS, you are limited as your resources are extremely limited, but in CB, you can get 4 bases up and running easily, so you can afford to make more production buildings -you cant maintain, say 20 factories, but it can be said that you keep making factories with 2 scv as it gets done. (much like supply depo) -you need to keep check of protoss composition at all times. in this case, you see that protoss produced zealots even if he is straining his resources. In this case, he is trying to do war of attrition, so you need to put mines at entrance of your bridge as well as you can't negate the posibilty of him overrunning the bridge -in cross position cb, you can always assume protoss took the 3 o'clock base. No need to scan there. -when theres left overgas: vessel+goliath range. -if opponent went arbitor, you need to make turret at natural and at 4th. -since you haven'ttaken much loss, you can keep making factory in cb. -you need to leave defensive tank at 4th while taking 9 o'clock base -since protoss was not goign arbitor, its important to focus fire templar with vultures. After templars are taken care of, you can just look away from fight to focus on producing out of your massive amount of factories. -see: when you have 2 layers of depo wall at 4th, it buys much needed time. You just need to surround the protoss backstab with your main army since double layer of supply depo buys so much time. -in cb, unlike in FS, there is very high chance that the game will go on extremely long time, so 3/2 upgrade is very important. Armory needs to be constantly researching -in cb, you need to go for protoss 3rd first as it allows you to contest 4th at same time.
If anyone wants more vids translated, really I think the thing to do would be to start coordinating in place of frogmelter (since he's mia). As long as a translated video is made we can eventually get it onto the youtube page with the rest of them (youtube page is ran by frog). I'm sure frog will eventually stop by, and if the hard work is done I'm sure he'll have no problem quickly transferring a finished video into the youtube channel.
The process for getting a video translated is: - Find video to translate - Find a translator that agrees to a price. Typically this is per hour of content translated - Use the OP for resources for the translator. There are actual steps linked to by the OP that can be linked to translators so they can understand how to upload a video and type in translations into youtube's captions (link: https://docs.google.com/document/d/13Iv9gMyNn2nBzxcnRshZdWaKCOSHZG6kREEebUHgdIg/edit?usp=sharing) - Post the translated video here. It can be on your personal channel for now since frog is mia, at least until frog gets back or someone gets access to the youtube channel's login credentials
Sorry for the late updates. I have paid one of my translators for some Stork Protoss videos a month ago but he has been busy recently. I just sent him an email to ask for updates.
I'm not accepting any crowdfunding until I get a consistent translator.
On August 20 2017 01:47 Alpha-NP- wrote: The OP is probably busy with school or something .
Sorry dude. I'm actually working as an engineer right now and not in school. I just started a side business so time has been super limited now that I have investors to answer to.
On August 23 2017 11:36 broodwarisback wrote: i run the youtube page with frogmelter, i can update anything you guys need ^^^
Its been pleasure to translate this. FlaSh really makes it detailed and step by step here and as a newer BW player, I genuinely learned a lot about the build I previously did not know before.
I genuinely believe its one of best guides for beginners like me to watch, along with FirebatHero's guides.
if you think title is clickbaity, that was how flaSh named his guides so I directly translated the title. Description is by me tho.
On August 28 2017 14:09 mLtySC wrote: any chance that there is some more zerg content coming soon? I'd be willing to put in some money for that.
Not any in the pipeline. Top priority right now is finding a consistent translator.
The other one is still working on the Stork videos until you find a new one, right?
Because I need those in my life
Yep, he said he will get those done over labor day weekend.
I want to give a special thank you to jinjin5000 who translated a video with no expectations of being compensated. Thank you so much for your hard work.
Its been pleasure to translate this. FlaSh really makes it detailed and step by step here and as a newer BW player, I genuinely learned a lot about the build I previously did not know before.
I genuinely believe its one of best guides for beginners like me to watch, along with FirebatHero's guides.
if you think title is clickbaity, that was how flaSh named his guides so I directly translated the title. Description is by me tho.
OMFG JINJIN5000 YOU'RE THE BEST! And of course other translators too, you're all cool
Its been pleasure to translate this. FlaSh really makes it detailed and step by step here and as a newer BW player, I genuinely learned a lot about the build I previously did not know before.
I genuinely believe its one of best guides for beginners like me to watch, along with FirebatHero's guides.
if you think title is clickbaity, that was how flaSh named his guides so I directly translated the title. Description is by me tho.
Jinjin thank you so much. I watched that video after work last night and it was amazing. So many helpful tips. And I saw it had 500 views. Hope you can do more. It was incredible. Thanks.
thank you jinjin, these videos have been getting me back into bw even more than remastered has been. I'm hopeful more protoss ones are en route soon too, i am getting jealous of all of these zerg and terrans >
Its been pleasure to translate this. FlaSh really makes it detailed and step by step here and as a newer BW player, I genuinely learned a lot about the build I previously did not know before.
I genuinely believe its one of best guides for beginners like me to watch, along with FirebatHero's guides.
if you think title is clickbaity, that was how flaSh named his guides so I directly translated the title. Description is by me tho.
Thanks for the translation, that was very educational. I guess I still qualify as a noob at the Korean level. I noticed there seems to be missing a sentence in the translation at 7:15 when Flash puts SCVs back on gas and you can hear him say gas, but there is no subtitle at that time.
Its been pleasure to translate this. FlaSh really makes it detailed and step by step here and as a newer BW player, I genuinely learned a lot about the build I previously did not know before.
I genuinely believe its one of best guides for beginners like me to watch, along with FirebatHero's guides.
if you think title is clickbaity, that was how flaSh named his guides so I directly translated the title. Description is by me tho.
dude...you're legend. The video/translation was incredible.
I will start working on factory FE this weekend: Just in case someone else is planning to do it in future, I will take the episode 1 of flash newbie guide
jinjin thank you for translating FlaSh's video , it's truly awesome to understand his reasoning ( game sense , build , transition into mid/late game ) because when you only see the video for the build , it's really hard to get a hold of what flash's current idea are ! His video are like a goldmine for korean viewers ! I wish I could learn korean to understand what he says !
I wish they had some niche strategy videos like Sair-Reaver or Archon-Zealots PvZ. Even like an unorthox game where they use Ghosts to Lockdown carriers.
On August 30 2017 11:54 jinjin5000 wrote: I will start working on factory FE this weekend: Just in case someone else is planning to do it in future, I will take the episode 1 of flash newbie guide
Thank you so much jin, the 5 rax into late mech video helped me so much. I appreciate it a lot.
Woah jinjin5000 delivers again! Thanks so much and good luck with class. Even if you never do a translation again those you have done are incredible contributions to the foreign scene
Since there's a lack of protoss videos I'll be making an offer to fund the translation for more.if you are willing to please dm me with your asking price
Hi , would it be possible to have some TvT translated guide? It's a real pain to do TvT , can't enjoy it that much since i'm so bad in this matchup Thanks in advance !
On September 13 2017 04:39 Xpres wrote: Hi , would it be possible to have some TvT translated guide? It's a real pain to do TvT , can't enjoy it that much since i'm so bad in this matchup Thanks in advance !
Wow I didn't notice that despite having 10+ videos for Terran, there is literally no TvT guide. I'll keep that in mind. Thanks.
On September 13 2017 04:39 Xpres wrote: Hi , would it be possible to have some TvT translated guide? It's a real pain to do TvT , can't enjoy it that much since i'm so bad in this matchup Thanks in advance !
Wow I didn't notice that despite having 10+ videos for Terran, there is literally no TvT guide. I'll keep that in mind. Thanks.
Maybe people should chip in and it would continue. I didn't give alot but I gave what I could. We only have one protoss video of a cheese DT rush and everyone wants more terran?
Flash is also creating a lot of guides recently. I think this could be very very good resource for our foreigner terrans to help them improve significantly. He plays on his standard high APM in those guides but he shares a lot of knowledge and tips are shown on right side of the screen.
On September 13 2017 04:39 Xpres wrote: Hi , would it be possible to have some TvT translated guide? It's a real pain to do TvT , can't enjoy it that much since i'm so bad in this matchup Thanks in advance !
Wow I didn't notice that despite having 10+ videos for Terran, there is literally no TvT guide. I'll keep that in mind. Thanks.
TvT guides are rare, even in korean.
Same with ZvZ only chulgu and pose[name] made long zvz lectures.
Hello, Flash recently upload his analysis of his semi-final match vs Bisu, hope someone can give insight to what he was talking about during specific moments of the match:
Damn I realized this project is dead... From desperation I decided to try and download auto-generated Korean CCs and plug them into Google translate... Pretty weird shit, sounds like a Donald Trump speech
138 00: 08: 06,599 -> 00: 08: 09,689 Problems with Africa in the Middle East Ramadan.
139 00: 08: 10,839 -> 00: 08: 15,349 Competition to enter yogurt I decided to punish. In addition,
140 00: 08: 15,349 -> 00: 08: 18,639 Dr. Mullah last April Abdullah is involved.
141 00: 08: 19,470 -> 00: 08: 20,840 I'm trying. Jeonnam Suncheon city has been the last
142 00: 08: 23,750 -> 00: 08: 27,090 And at the end of Foreign antidote.
feel like flash's latest guides are... lesser in quality than previous ones? He seems to have reverted to his old guide approach. More action, less talk.
His recent guides like 1/1/1, 5 fact timing, 4 rax, is really a timing guide instead of detailed ones that he presented before for real noobs.
On November 02 2017 03:35 orvinreyes wrote: Hello, Flash recently upload his analysis of his semi-final match vs Bisu, hope someone can give insight to what he was talking about during specific moments of the match:
tl;dr: Bisu seemed more tensed/paniced, Flash's game plan went as planned mostly
he says that in BO, first game is where 70% of effort is put into as it can dictate rest of the series. After flash changed his rax FE to fact FE and still won, he got burst of confidence and felt that he would be winning. If he hadn't, he felt that he would have most likely lost. If bisu's reaver had fired instead of dudding twice and even one of them connected, he would have defended the push and won, but flash says he was lucky (this wasn't a bug, but flash moving his tanks backwards as soon as bisu tried to target the said moving tank. It was lucky. First shot dudding was because bisu loaded up too fast since flash was target firing reaver)
Second game, Flash didn't know at the time that he was in disadvantageous position. he said that he lost a lot at beginning, since bisu's dragoon control was amazing. The attack at 3rd with double depo was huge as it got rid of 20 zealots. Flash said he knew that Bisu would try that since theres no reason not to, as it would be extremely advantageous if bisu could have broken into the 3rd. If he hadn't bisu would be trying to recall into flash's main after the attack on 3rd. FlaSh foresaw this, and put goliaths between his main and 3rd, so he could deny that arbitor recall as thats the obvious choice Bisu would have. Bisu seemed to be startled/paniced after this. The reason why flash was able to trade so well during the main 200 vs 200 fight was because bisu froze the frontal force and created a wall. If Bisu had stasised the smaller number of tanks at back, flash's frontal forces woudl have been surrounded and it would have been instant loss for Flash. Since this entire engagement was done right before flash's 2/1 was completed (flash checked the upgrades during the fight), if Bisu froze the back tanks behind the bridge, flash would have been crushed. But it was hard decision since arbitor stasis is instantaneous decision on top of Bisu not being able to see his back army to make correct decision. Since protoss normally stasis the larger amount of tanks as default decision, this decision was really hard to make, but turned out to be incorrect choice to stasis the frontal forces with more tanks. Flash said he knew what Bisu's game plan was due to him knowing Bisu's playstyle inside out. After the engagement, Bisu seemed very paniced and fought extremely poorly in the second 200/200 fight and flash was able to trade extremely well with unsieged tanks and won the game there. (BIsu's forces were at 200, but his actual army wasn't even 150 as most of the army as in production phase)
Third game, Flash wasn't expecting bisu to pull out no reaver carrier build, but Flash knew he lost when Bisu's carrier went straight to his main instead of the back 3rd. Reason for that is because Bisu was suspecting biomech build in first place, as normally, carrier would go straight to 3rd to harass. This clearly meant that Bisu was confident in blocking Flash's biomech with the carrier build. Flash knew that he lost right there when bisu went ahead with carrier build anyway, and Bisu had been able to defend biomech with carrier build during practice games. Flash had another build in mind vs Bisu on game 3, but because Bisu did no reaver carrier build, Flash couldn't do it as that build cannot deal with carriers that early. The original build Flash had in mind was SK terran vs Protoss, fast vessel EMP off 9 barracks, with 2 starports, same as TvZ build. Flash lost the game here because flash couldn't rally his production to protoss main. He said unlike practice, his hand didn't really follow up and he couldn't do what he could have done offline. If you watch his game, his forces come in waves, as much as 2 production cycle waves.
Fourth game, Flash predicted what Bisu would do in that game 100%. Thats why flash went with fast armory build. The Fast +1 before 3rd would completely counter the fast shuttle play that Bisu would do. Best helped flash with the exact same build, with harassment at main while trying to pierce the frontal line, and Bisu did the exact same thing 100%. Flash just predicted Bisu went fast shuttle reaver and didn't even get/delayed comsat stations to be as greedy as possible. Flash notes that from now on, to defend against shuttles and drops, he would be getting goliath range from now. Flash said he predicted Bisu trying to break his armory, so he made it so that it wouldn't have mattered if Bisu got his armory with reaver. The fast +1 build had Flash's +1 already done by time bisu dropped his reaver, and Flash canceled his upgrade going on his upper armory, to get the +2 going on the bottom, second armory. For the main Bisu's engagement and breaking in attempt, all flash was doing was focus firing on dragoon because he knew he could block it.
Flash will be buying pizza for everyone who helped him practice and Larva offered to help him practice for finals.
On November 02 2017 03:35 orvinreyes wrote: Hello, Flash recently upload his analysis of his semi-final match vs Bisu, hope someone can give insight to what he was talking about during specific moments of the match:
tl;dr: Bisu seemed more tensed/paniced, Flash's game plan went as planned mostly
he says that in BO, first game is where 70% of effort is put into as it can dictate rest of the series. After flash changed his rax FE to fact FE and still won, he got burst of confidence and felt that he would be winning. If he hadn't, he felt that he would have most likely lost. If bisu's reaver had fired instead of dudding twice and even one of them connected, he would have defended the push and won, but flash says he was lucky (this wasn't a bug, but flash moving his tanks backwards as soon as bisu tried to target the said moving tank. It was lucky. First shot dudding was because bisu loaded up too fast since flash was target firing reaver)
Second game, Flash didn't know at the time that he was in disadvantageous position. he said that he lost a lot at beginning, since bisu's dragoon control was amazing. The attack at 3rd with double depo was huge as it got rid of 20 zealots. Flash said he knew that Bisu would try that since theres no reason not to, as it would be extremely advantageous if bisu could have broken into the 3rd. If he hadn't bisu would be trying to recall into flash's main after the attack on 3rd. FlaSh foresaw this, and put goliaths between his main and 3rd, so he could deny that arbitor recall as thats the obvious choice Bisu would have. Bisu seemed to be startled/paniced after this. The reason why flash was able to trade so well during the main 200 vs 200 fight was because bisu froze the frontal force and created a wall. If Bisu had stasised the smaller number of tanks at back, flash's frontal forces woudl have been surrounded and it would have been instant loss for Flash. Since this entire engagement was done right before flash's 2/1 was completed (flash checked the upgrades during the fight), if Bisu froze the back tanks behind the bridge, flash would have been crushed. But it was hard decision since arbitor stasis is instantaneous decision on top of Bisu not being able to see his back army to make correct decision. Since protoss normally stasis the larger amount of tanks as default decision, this decision was really hard to make, but turned out to be incorrect choice to stasis the frontal forces with more tanks. Flash said he knew what Bisu's game plan was due to him knowing Bisu's playstyle inside out. After the engagement, Bisu seemed very paniced and fought extremely poorly in the second 200/200 fight and flash was able to trade extremely well with unsieged tanks and won the game there. (BIsu's forces were at 200, but his actual army wasn't even 150 as most of the army as in production phase)
Third game, Flash wasn't expecting bisu to pull out no reaver carrier build, but Flash knew he lost when Bisu's carrier went straight to his main instead of the back 3rd. Reason for that is because Bisu was suspecting biomech build in first place, as normally, carrier would go straight to 3rd to harass. This clearly meant that Bisu was confident in blocking Flash's biomech with the carrier build. Flash knew that he lost right there when bisu went ahead with carrier build anyway, and Bisu had been able to defend biomech with carrier build during practice games. Flash had another build in mind vs Bisu on game 3, but because Bisu did no reaver carrier build, Flash couldn't do it as that build cannot deal with carriers that early. The original build Flash had in mind was SK terran vs Protoss, fast vessel EMP off 9 barracks, with 2 starports, same as TvZ build. Flash lost the game here because flash couldn't rally his production to protoss main. He said unlike practice, his hand didn't really follow up and he couldn't do what he could have done offline. If you watch his game, his forces come in waves, as much as 2 production cycle waves.
Fourth game, Flash predicted what Bisu would do in that game 100%. Thats why flash went with fast armory build. The Fast +1 before 3rd would completely counter the fast shuttle play that Bisu would do. Best helped flash with the exact same build, with harassment at main while trying to pierce the frontal line, and Bisu did the exact same thing 100%. Flash just predicted Bisu went fast shuttle reaver and didn't even get/delayed comsat stations to be as greedy as possible. Flash notes that from now on, to defend against shuttles and drops, he would be getting goliath range from now. Flash said he predicted Bisu trying to break his armory, so he made it so that it wouldn't have mattered if Bisu got his armory with reaver. The fast +1 build had Flash's +1 already done by time bisu dropped his reaver, and Flash canceled his upgrade going on his upper armory, to get the +2 going on the bottom, second armory. For the main Bisu's engagement and breaking in attempt, all flash was doing was focus firing on dragoon because he knew he could block it.
Flash will be buying pizza for everyone who helped him practice and Larva offered to help him practice for finals.
Jinjin, this is MASSIVELY appreciated!! Thank you!!
2 week before final, when it was determined flash would face hero, after he had some lamb skewers with hero, he decided while going back home that he will use 8rax. Why? Depends on position. Flash never played on that particular spawn he got in crossing field, so he used 8rax to guraentee win w/o long macro game. Flash planned out that if the games were to go to gladiator and he was 0-2 down, it would end bad for him as he always lost on gladiator. so flash was determined to drag the series out to at least Fighting spirit, so that he would at least win 1 game. flash felt that the 8 rax in particular would work 100%. Flash went into series with determination to break hero's mentality from very first game.
but if hero went pool first? Flash would have typed in gg as soon as he saw the lings. But he was 100% sure that hero would go 12 hatch. But he never imagined hero would hae gone 3 hatch before pool.
Flash quickly scouted to check for hatch, and went in after gathering up marine count. When flash saw that hero opted to cancle the front hatch instead of trying to defend with drone pull, he was suspicious. He never ever saw hero cancle his hatch once. flash also never went against 3 hatch before pool as 8 rax either. so the game was 100% won then. Flash had felt that if hero made the first game hard, the series would have been incredibly difficult and dragged on. But flash was able to win incredibly easily this game.
but hero didn't quit until very end to warm his hands up, so flash felt that hero came into the series incredibly determined. flash was bit tempted to go fast nuke the first game (since he was so ahead), but held back because he was friends with hero
For 2nd game, flash prayed that he wouldnt get 12 o'clock spawn, but flash ended up getting 12 o'clock right there. (4 pool to 12 o'clock base is outright GG, but opponent wouldnt do that since its the accumulation of all games played before the final) Why? 12 oclock base is really disadvantageous in that there is incredibly large area to defend, marines come from wrong side of the rax, and the resources are unoptimized there. It is the worst spawn. On top of that, theres awkward drop defence due to minerals, ect.
Mind game part: First game one was won with 8 rax, so hero was down mentality wise. So flash did something he never really did, which was wallling off the front large chokepoint while going factory first. Since flash knew hero would go 2 hatch 100%, he knew that it was really dangerous for terran to go into the game without walling off front vs 2 hatch. But by walling off the front at very start, he was able to bypass the big weakness terran had vs 2 hatch. Gold rush is incredible map for zerg. 2 hatch is already good in gold rush, but it was good against factory play as well. So flash knew that hero's preferred build of choice would be 2 hatch. In the end, flash predicted hero's build in 2nd game 100%.
Flash believes that if you are not able to predict what opponent would do in finals, you won't be able to win in the finals. If he wasn't able to predict what hero did, he would have lost. If hero predicted what flash would do and planned accordingly, flash would have lost. But flash was able to predict in advance what hero would be doing. In the finals, flash believes that both pros are in largely same platform to win, its just that it depends on the mindgames and ability to predict opponent's builds choice.
flash's initial build plan for the 2nd game at gold rush was supposed to be cc first into sk terran play. But flash didn't do it because a fan sent him a whisper during his practice. The fan revealed that flash's build for 2nd game, which was CC first into SK terran had been leaked. So when flash saw that and went into the website (starlog.gg) to check, it turned out that his builds were leaked after all, right down to 8rax. but even with that, since 14cc is counter to 2 hatch on gold rush, he would have won build wise anyway. But since his builds were leaked, he wouldn't be able to use it
So flash thought: How would he go against 2 hatch vs zerg in gold rush? Factory first? You cant win like that. CC first? Its been leaked. So flash was in quite a dillema But why 1 vulture FE with walling off the natural? Because if hero did 2 hatch and did lings, you have to go 3 vulture before taking the natural. But if you did fact FE with natural wall off, you can get away with 1 vulture. Thats the difference.
But what hero did have in edge was that flash never anticipated that hero would use 2 hatch hydra. so theres that. He thought there would be 2 hatch muta.
The initial hydra pressure wasn't all in, so flash didn't feel much pressure at all by hero's attack since tank was already out and all.
Flash never would have been able to predict hero would take 11 oclock base. This is first time flash ever went against zerg taking base right next to his base. but hero seemed to be very nervous/pressured, so he was very late on breaking the egg to the 3rd. Seems like hero wasn't able to bring his 100% of his prepared build into his games in the final. but to heros defence, flash said that even he gets nervous during finals, noone can really be 100% in finals, especially in live stage really.
Reason why flash never went 1/1/1 against zerg: flash felt that he could never win against zerg using 1/1/1 on gold rush
flash was pretty much all in with that attempt to bust zerg's 3rd at 11 oclock base, but he was able to win
hero seems to have been affected by first game: hero couldnt get the first search done as he was scouting for 8rax. flash doesn't know for sure if hero saw his leaked builds, but his original preparation for gladiator game was 8rax. So since hero was searching for 8rax on game 3, he would like to thank "ace" for alerting flash about leaked games. flash really doesn't like starlog it seems.
even if hero had won this game and flash had changed his build around in second+third game , hero seemed to have flash's builds in mind as evidenced by the 8 rax search at start.
flash was in incredible position this game and knew that hero's drop was coming from start as he scanned it ahead of time and saw overlords loading army up. but even with preparation, the drop went through successfully, so flash felt ashamed of himself. hero did well to break his defence, but flash was upset that he wasnt able to defend drop even when he saw it coming way ahead of time. While hero did amazingly well sending in scourge to tank the turret fire, Flash should have been able to block it 100% but flash's play was lacking.
Because of hero's ability to choose the best decision even when he was so behind, flash felt pressured during the 4th game.
After hero's first drop, hero's second drop is what sealed the game, and flash felt that while playing that hero did come into game extremely prepared and that was a great move. Flash felt initially that he had won when he scanned the drop coming, but hero's play with scourge tanking was brilliant.Flash did not see that coming at all.
flash prepared medic optic flare/blind for game 3, but he wasn't able to since hero put up sunkens at 3rd.
Flash felt that this game in particular, he was ahead by 7:3, and as he denied zerg's 1o'clock base, zerg had nothing to do other than drop. But hero was able to overcome that odds and snatched that game.
flash feels that the praise on the scanning of on hold lurker wasn't all that special, since all flash needed to do was to pass that ledge to pressure zerg natural.
flash was caught off guard by the mutalisks after lurker move from hero.
side talk: Stuff about sea making it to gstar tournement beating JD (8raxes), how starcraft streamers dont play much starcraft nowadays (variety games, terror ditching SC, battlegrounds)
Also, flash met hero before finals, but hero felt that people weren't really cheering for him, but rather just rooting against flash. Viewers would come into his stream, not to cheer for him, but to root against flash. Flash notes that this is a common sentiment. but flash acklowledges this since he had won 3 asls in row, and everyone's favorite progamers were knocked out before final. There is nowhere really for those fans to go. flash doesnt hold any grudges over this since its an ackowledgement by people that flash is performing well. People were cheering for him when he returned to BW as well, and now since he is dominating, its only natural people will cheer against. But flash feels that criticism on him is unfair, since only thing crime he has done is working hard. (talks about how people said that he would never win against bisu when he returned 2 years ago and that he built up his skill back through sheer effort)
after flash denied hero's 1oclock and scanned his overlords, flash felt that hero had nothing to do other than to drop. 2nd drop was where the real damage was done, with 1st drop opening up the base. Flash wasnt aware that even after the 2 drops, he was ahead by 60 supply. He felt that he played it poorly as even with 2nd drop, if he held on, he 100% won. But he wasn't able to.
Flash acklowedges that he lost a 9:1 game this time around.
Flash couldnt get ahold of himself during this game. hero's multipronged attack was just too much for him to handle.
flash began to have flashbacks to his korean air OSL days where he lost after being 2-0 up and had to slap himself with ruler to get him back in focus, because when he went outside after he had lost this game, the site of trophy kept pummeling him.
flash prayed to whoever above to please let him spawn on 1 o'clock, promising to play to his fullest and not underestimate his opponent. And he got it. 1 oclock is best spawn for FS out of 4 possible spawns.
Flash had special tactic in mind: He had medic blind build that delayed marine range to research medic blind upgrade. But he didn't have opportunity to use that sadly. For his overall game plan, unlike Larva who tends to make big groups of lurkers, flaSh noted that hero tended to skip out on lurker and dont tend to make more than 1 control group of lurker.
hero didn't seem to have prepared any sort of 11muta play, flash noted that was abnormal but he also knew 100% that hero wouldn't prepare that sort of build. flash wasnt aware that hero was mining only 2 gas at natural. He says that if something like that happens, even if you start out with 3 mining intiially, its a big loss for zerg, and thats why hero lost that game. The tech was way too slow. flash wasn't aware that time that hero's build was 7 muta lurker intiially, but after he sent scv to 11o'clock, he knew. When he was trying to bust sunken intiially, he thought he was being too crazy. He only tried to bust sunken because he thought hero went lurker first, but then he saw mutas pop up right then.
When flash was able to kill most of the initial 7 mutalisks off, he knew he won there and went to bust the lurker with blind, but only 1 medic had enough energy, so he wasnt able to pull it off (other was 35)
Flash faked hero out with his marine movement to bait hero's mutalisks to 9 oclock, but by then, flash was already shift clicking to 11 o'clock to bust hero's lurker. Flash says you can't avoid that as zerg because its habitual to pull mutas out to defend marine movement, so he exploited that.
flash knew the game was done and dusted when he busted the 3rd.
[screaming about donation]
TL;DR: Potential nuke rush Build leaked, starlog is to blame hero's brilliant play in 3rd won a lost game hero wasn't 100%
2 week before final, when it was determined flash would face hero, after he had some lamb skewers with hero, he decided while going back home that he will use 8rax. Why? Depends on position. Flash never played on that particular spawn he got in crossing field, so he used 8rax to guraentee win w/o long macro game. Flash planned out that if the games were to go to gladiator and he was 0-2 down, it would end bad for him as he always lost on gladiator. so flash was determined to drag the series out to at least Fighting spirit, so that he would at least win 1 game. flash felt that the 8 rax in particular would work 100%. Flash went into series with determination to break hero's mentality from very first game.
but if hero went pool first? Flash would have typed in gg as soon as he saw the lings. But he was 100% sure that hero would go 12 hatch. But he never imagined hero would hae gone 3 hatch before pool.
Flash quickly scouted to check for hatch, and went in after gathering up marine count. When flash saw that hero opted to cancle the front hatch instead of trying to defend with drone pull, he was suspicious. He never ever saw hero cancle his hatch once. flash also never went against 3 hatch before pool as 8 rax either. so the game was 100% won then. Flash had felt that if hero made the first game hard, the series would have been incredibly difficult and dragged on. But flash was able to win incredibly easily this game.
but hero didn't quit until very end to warm his hands up, so flash felt that hero came into the series incredibly determined. flash was bit tempted to go fast nuke the first game (since he was so ahead), but held back because he was friends with hero
For 2nd game, flash prayed that he wouldnt get 12 o'clock spawn, but flash ended up getting 12 o'clock right there. (4 pool to 12 o'clock base is outright GG, but opponent wouldnt do that since its the accumulation of all games played before the final) Why? 12 oclock base is really disadvantageous in that there is incredibly large area to defend, marines come from wrong side of the rax, and the resources are unoptimized there. It is the worst spawn. On top of that, theres awkward drop defence due to minerals, ect.
Mind game part: First game one was won with 8 rax, so hero was down mentality wise. So flash did something he never really did, which was wallling off the front large chokepoint while going factory first. Since flash knew hero would go 2 hatch 100%, he knew that it was really dangerous for terran to go into the game without walling off front vs 2 hatch. But by walling off the front at very start, he was able to bypass the big weakness terran had vs 2 hatch. Gold rush is incredible map for zerg. 2 hatch is already good in gold rush, but it was good against factory play as well. So flash knew that hero's preferred build of choice would be 2 hatch. In the end, flash predicted hero's build in 2nd game 100%.
Flash believes that if you are not able to predict what opponent would do in finals, you won't be able to win in the finals. If he wasn't able to predict what hero did, he would have lost. If hero predicted what flash would do and planned accordingly, flash would have lost. But flash was able to predict in advance what hero would be doing. In the finals, flash believes that both pros are in largely same platform to win, its just that it depends on the mindgames and ability to predict opponent's builds choice.
flash's initial build plan for the 2nd game at gold rush was supposed to be cc first into sk terran play. But flash didn't do it because a fan sent him a whisper during his practice. The fan revealed that flash's build for 2nd game, which was CC first into SK terran had been leaked. So when flash saw that and went into the website (starlog.gg) to check, it turned out that his builds were leaked after all, right down to 8rax. but even with that, since 14cc is counter to 2 hatch on gold rush, he would have won build wise anyway. But since his builds were leaked, he wouldn't be able to use it
So flash thought: How would he go against 2 hatch vs zerg in gold rush? Factory first? You cant win like that. CC first? Its been leaked. So flash was in quite a dillema But why 1 vulture FE with walling off the natural? Because if hero did 2 hatch and did lings, you have to go 3 vulture before taking the natural. But if you did fact FE with natural wall off, you can get away with 1 vulture. Thats the difference.
But what hero did have in edge was that flash never anticipated that hero would use 2 hatch hydra. so theres that. He thought there would be 2 hatch muta.
The initial hydra pressure wasn't all in, so flash didn't feel much pressure at all by hero's attack since tank was already out and all.
Flash never would have been able to predict hero would take 11 oclock base. This is first time flash ever went against zerg taking base right next to his base. but hero seemed to be very nervous/pressured, so he was very late on breaking the egg to the 3rd. Seems like hero wasn't able to bring his 100% of his prepared build into his games in the final. but to heros defence, flash said that even he gets nervous during finals, noone can really be 100% in finals, especially in live stage really.
Reason why flash never went 1/1/1 against zerg: flash felt that he could never win against zerg using 1/1/1 on gold rush
flash was pretty much all in with that attempt to bust zerg's 3rd at 11 oclock base, but he was able to win
hero seems to have been affected by first game: hero couldnt get the first search done as he was scouting for 8rax. flash doesn't know for sure if hero saw his leaked builds, but his original preparation for gladiator game was 8rax. So since hero was searching for 8rax on game 3, he would like to thank "ace" for alerting flash about leaked games. flash really doesn't like starlog it seems.
even if hero won the game and flash changed his build around, hero seems to have flash's builds in mind, with the 8 rax search at start and all.
flash was in incredible position this game and knew that hero's drop was coming from start as he scanned it ahead of time and saw overlords loading army up. but even with preparation, the drop went through successfully, so flash felt ashamed of himself. hero did well to break his defence, but flash was upset that he wasnt able to defend drop even when he saw it coming way ahead of time. While hero did amazingly well sending in scourge to tank the turret fire, Flash should have been able to block it 100% but flash's play was lacking.
Because of hero's ability to choose the best decision even when he was so behind, flash felt pressured during the 4th game.
After hero's first drop, hero's second drop is what sealed the game, and flash felt that while playing that hero did come into game extremely prepared and that was a great move. Flash felt initially that he had won when he scanned the drop coming, but hero's play with scourge tanking was brilliant.Flash did not see that coming at all.
flash prepared medic optic flare/blind for game 3, but he wasn't able to since hero put up sunkens at 3rd.
Flash felt that this game in particular, he was ahead by 7:3, and as he denied zerg's 1o'clock base, zerg had nothing to do other than drop. But hero was able to overcome that odds and snatched that game.
flash feels that the praise on the scanning of on hold lurker wasn't all that special, since all flash needed to do was to pass that ledge to pressure zerg natural.
flash was caught off guard by the mutalisks after lurker move from hero.
side talk: Stuff about sea making it to gstar tournement beating JD (8raxes), how starcraft streamers dont play much starcraft nowadays (variety games, terror ditching SC, battlegrounds)
Also, flash met hero before finals, but hero felt that people weren't really cheering for him, but rather just rooting against flash. Viewers would come into his stream, not to cheer for him, but to root against flash. Flash notes that this is a common sentiment. but flash acklowledges this since he had won 3 asls in row, and everyone's favorite progamers were knocked out before final. There is nowhere really for those fans to go. flash doesnt hold any grudges over this since its an ackowledgement by people that flash is performing well. People were cheering for him when he returned to BW as well, and now since he is dominating, its only natural people will cheer against. But flash feels that criticism on him is unfair, since only thing crime he has done is working hard. (talks about how people said that he would never win against bisu when he returned 2 years ago and that he built up his skill back through sheer effort)
after flash denied hero's 1oclock and scanned his overlords, flash felt that hero had nothing to do other than to drop. 2nd drop was where the real damage was done, with 1st drop opening up the base. Flash wasnt aware that even after the 2 drops, he was ahead by 60 supply. He felt that he played it poorly as even with 2nd drop, if he held on, he 100% won. But he wasn't able to.
Flash acklowedges that he lost a 9:1 game this time around.
Flash couldnt get ahold of himself during this game. hero's multipronged attack was just too much for him to handle.
flash began to have flashbacks to his korean air OSL days where he lost after being 2-0 up and had to slap himself with ruler to get him back in focus, because when he went outside after he had lost this game, the site of trophy kept pummeling him.
flash prayed to whoever above to please let him spawn on 1 o'clock, promising to play to his fullest and not underestimate his opponent. And he got it. 1 oclock is best spawn for FS out of 4 possible spawns.
Flash had special tactic in mind: He had medic blind build that delayed marine range to research medic blind upgrade. But he didn't have opportunity to use that sadly. For his overall game plan, unlike Larva who tends to make big groups of lurkers, flaSh noted that hero tended to skip out on lurker and dont tend to make more than 1 control group of lurker.
hero didn't seem to have prepared any sort of 11muta play, flash noted that was abnormal but he also knew 100% that hero wouldn't prepare that sort of build. flash wasnt aware that hero was mining only 2 gas at natural. He says that if something like that happens, even if you start out with 3 mining intiially, its a big loss for zerg, and thats why hero lost that game. The tech was way too slow. flash wasn't aware that time that hero's build was 7 muta lurker intiially, but after he sent scv to 11o'clock, he knew. When he was trying to bust sunken intiially, he thought he was being too crazy. He only tried to bust sunken because he thought hero went lurker first, but then he saw mutas pop up right then.
When flash was able to kill most of the initial 7 mutalisks off, he knew he won there and went to bust the lurker with blind, but only 1 medic had enough energy, so he wasnt able to pull it off (other was 35)
Flash faked hero out with his marine movement to bait hero's mutalisks to 9 oclock, but by then, flash was already shift clicking to 11 o'clock to bust hero's lurker. Flash says you can't avoid that as zerg because its habitual to pull mutas out to defend marine movement, so he exploited that.
flash knew the game was done and dusted when he busted the 3rd.
[screaming about donation]
TL;DR: Potential nuke rush Build leaked, starlog is to blame hero's brilliant play in 3rd won a lost game hero wasn't 100%
thanks a lot! This was a great read into Flash's thoughts about the games.
On November 15 2017 03:49 Cryoc wrote: Regarding the starlog.gg, does anyone know why only some accounts in the leaderboard have a profile where you can look up the used build orders?
They mask top two hundred rankings for asl i believe, or if you didn't link starlog account.
but problem could be when you practice vs accounts which are lower than top two hundred or so or are unlisted mmr. Then build can leak.
On November 15 2017 05:49 Starlightsun wrote: Thanks so much jinjin... I love the image of Flash slapping himself with ruler after game 3 to regain focus lol.
Now he has a golden ruler to slap himself with haha
Q. 스타크래프트가 리마스터 버전이 나오면서 뜰 것 같은 기대가 컸어요. 그런데 오히려 인기가 줄어들었다는 말이 많이 나오고 있습니다.
Q: There was a lot of excitement about remastered and its implication on growing the scene. But instead, theres a lot of talk on the popularity decreasing instead.
솔직히, 저는 리마스터 이전으로 돌아가고 싶어요. 그때는 아프리카tv BJ들이 모두 흥했거든요. 함께 팀 배틀을 활발하게 진행할 수 있었죠. 제 방송은 이전이나 지금이나 똑같아요. 그런데, 리마스터가 나오면서 서버가 불안해지기 시작했어요. 팀 배틀 진행을 못하면서 힘들어진 BJ들이 많더라고요. 그 분들한테는 팀 배틀에서 몇 번의 승리가 굉장히 중요하거든요. 한 2-3달 동안 팀 배틀을 서버 때문에 못하게 되니까 방송을 제대로 못하게 되는 경우가 생겼습니다.
Flash: To be completely honest, I want to go back to time before remaster release. Then, all the Afreeca streamers were lively. The scene was able to do lively team battles together. My stream, on other hand, has been the same as then and now. However, the servers began to be unstable when remaster first came out. There was also lot of streamers who were in difficult situation due to not being able to continue on with the team battles. To those people, wins in team battles were very important. Since they were not able to do team battle for around 2-3 months due to server instability, there were lot of cases where they were not able to stream properly due to it.
현재 서버 문제는 해결됐어요. 그런데 당시 여파가 지금까지 이어지는 분들이 있더라고요. 예전에는 다 같이 잘 됐다면, 지금은 특정 방으로 시청자들이 몰리는 현상이 나타났죠. 물론, 블리자드의 사정도 있겠지만, 너무 늦게 해결된 게 아닌가... 스타크래프트를 좋아하는 팬으로서 리마스터에 정말 큰 기대를 했는데 아쉬움이 컸습니다. 그래도 요새 다시 팀 배틀이 활성화되면서 다시 살아나는 분위기가 형성됐어요.
Flash: As for now, server problems are solved. But the aftermath from then could be felt until today. Before this, everyone did well together, but now, the most viewers tend to congregate into a specific stream instead. Well, Blizzard has their own reasons, but I feel like that the issues were solved too late… As a fan of StarCraft, I looked forward to Remastered a lot, but it was a huge letdown. But even then, the team battles are revived a bit nowadays, and there is an atmosphere of revival. ------ notes: Interview had other points such as big talk about the issue of Tesagi and how it boomed into bw scene when sea won vs bisu 3:0. Will touch it later if nobody touches it but i have finals week.
team battles are sort of like clan wars, with multiple people obsing in 1 room full of clan members. Included teams such as Moo, Neox, ect. The lagging of the room with multiple people is rather bigger issue than people give credit for, as well as breaking clan system and clan rooms. (Rather minor, but still takes away part of customization)
On November 28 2017 01:48 Deimos wrote: This is the video on Iris youtube channel about SAviOr Return .. a translation will be great, but i think is only to create controversy
Q. 스타크래프트가 리마스터 버전이 나오면서 뜰 것 같은 기대가 컸어요. 그런데 오히려 인기가 줄어들었다는 말이 많이 나오고 있습니다.
Q: There was a lot of excitement about remastered and its implication on growing the scene. But instead, theres a lot of talk on the popularity decreasing instead.
솔직히, 저는 리마스터 이전으로 돌아가고 싶어요. 그때는 아프리카tv BJ들이 모두 흥했거든요. 함께 팀 배틀을 활발하게 진행할 수 있었죠. 제 방송은 이전이나 지금이나 똑같아요. 그런데, 리마스터가 나오면서 서버가 불안해지기 시작했어요. 팀 배틀 진행을 못하면서 힘들어진 BJ들이 많더라고요. 그 분들한테는 팀 배틀에서 몇 번의 승리가 굉장히 중요하거든요. 한 2-3달 동안 팀 배틀을 서버 때문에 못하게 되니까 방송을 제대로 못하게 되는 경우가 생겼습니다.
Flash: To be completely honest, I want to go back to time before remaster release. Then, all the Afreeca streamers were lively. The scene was able to do lively team battles together. My stream, on other hand, has been the same as then and now. However, the servers began to be unstable when remaster first came out. There was also lot of streamers who were in difficult situation due to not being able to continue on with the team battles. To those people, wins in team battles were very important. Since they were not able to do team battle for around 2-3 months due to server instability, there were lot of cases where they were not able to stream properly due to it.
현재 서버 문제는 해결됐어요. 그런데 당시 여파가 지금까지 이어지는 분들이 있더라고요. 예전에는 다 같이 잘 됐다면, 지금은 특정 방으로 시청자들이 몰리는 현상이 나타났죠. 물론, 블리자드의 사정도 있겠지만, 너무 늦게 해결된 게 아닌가... 스타크래프트를 좋아하는 팬으로서 리마스터에 정말 큰 기대를 했는데 아쉬움이 컸습니다. 그래도 요새 다시 팀 배틀이 활성화되면서 다시 살아나는 분위기가 형성됐어요.
Flash: As for now, server problems are solved. But the aftermath from then could be felt until today. Before this, everyone did well together, but now, the most viewers tend to congregate into a specific stream instead. Well, Blizzard has their own reasons, but I feel like that the issues were solved too late… As a fan of StarCraft, I looked forward to Remastered a lot, but it was a huge letdown. But even then, the team battles are revived a bit nowadays, and there is an atmosphere of revival. ------ notes: Interview had other points such as big talk about the issue of Tesagi and how it boomed into bw scene when sea won vs bisu 3:0. Will touch it later if nobody touches it but i have finals week.
team battles are sort of like clan wars, with multiple people obsing in 1 room full of clan members. Included teams such as Moo, Neox, ect. The lagging of the room with multiple people is rather bigger issue than people give credit for, as well as breaking clan system and clan rooms. (Rather minor, but still takes away part of customization)
BJ=broadcast jockey=Streamers
Thanks for the translation. Good luck with your finals! I hope someone translates the talk about tesagi. Tinyland had a translation video of pros discussing it but it wasn't very deep and seemed kind of like they were joking, maybe. A number of people have been complaining regardless, but I just don't see it myself. It'd be nice to hear what Flash thinks.
^ that tinyland video was pretty bad because it indirectly helped spark tesagi talks. The pros were making jokes and laughing at the complaints yet so many people took it as a serious video and started complaining every time a terran won, not realizing that it's only Flash that seems to go far and win from all the terrans out there.
On November 28 2017 07:37 BigFan wrote: ^ that tinyland video was pretty bad because it indirectly helped spark tesagi talks. The pros were making jokes and laughing at the complaints yet so many people took it as a serious video and started complaining every time a terran won, not realizing that it's only Flash that seems to go far and win from all the terrans out there.
Thanks jinjin for the translation!
it wasn't the tiny land video that affected korean tesagi spam tho. It was sea talking about it after he won vs bisu and "acknowledging" Tesagi
On November 28 2017 07:37 BigFan wrote: ^ that tinyland video was pretty bad because it indirectly helped spark tesagi talks. The pros were making jokes and laughing at the complaints yet so many people took it as a serious video and started complaining every time a terran won, not realizing that it's only Flash that seems to go far and win from all the terrans out there.
Thanks jinjin for the translation!
it wasn't the tiny land video that affected korean tesagi spam tho. It was sea talking about it after he won vs bisu and "acknowledging" Tesagi
Not sure about the KR side but for the foreign scene, I believe that video was the spark here.
On November 28 2017 07:37 BigFan wrote: ^ that tinyland video was pretty bad because it indirectly helped spark tesagi talks. The pros were making jokes and laughing at the complaints yet so many people took it as a serious video and started complaining every time a terran won, not realizing that it's only Flash that seems to go far and win from all the terrans out there.
Thanks jinjin for the translation!
it wasn't the tiny land video that affected korean tesagi spam tho. It was sea talking about it after he won vs bisu and "acknowledging" Tesagi
Not sure about the KR side but for the foreign scene, I believe that video was the spark here.
That is true. But tesagi meme has been prevalent in korea scene since Sea brought that word up
It is indeed disgusting how far people are willing to go just to harass Flash, and it is mostly just a means to get him riled up. Memes about terran being over-powered has been around since forever, but the fact that Flash reacts so emotionally to this jibe did make matters somewhat worse. He gave life to an old, tired meme by adding the element of trolling to it, because his reactions to the comments were a spectacle in itself to the trolls.
Further more, I don't think Flash has been wise with words like Jaedong or Bisu, despite having similar levels of repercussion for every little thing he says. Stork is another icon who created unnecessary drama for himself by being too open with his personal opinions, instead of taking a second to avert avoidable hassle.
I think this issue is more of a dynamic Flash has created between himself and his anti-fans, than anything that is truly related to the actual balance of the game itself. Every legend of the game gets undeserved provocation from their followers, and it is part of being a public figure. Not everyone deals with it in the most prudent manner, and with greater opportunities of the constant back and forth that comes with streaming, every little possible interaction that could go wrong gets amplified to a greater degree. I personally think this has been one of those cases.
On November 28 2017 10:53 Letmelose wrote: It is indeed disgusting how far people are willing to go just to harass Flash, and it is mostly just a means to get him riled up. Memes about terran being over-powered has been around since forever, but the fact that Flash reacts so emotionally to this jibe did make matters somewhat worse. He gave life to an old, tired meme by adding the element of trolling to it, because his reactions to the comments were a spectacle in itself to the trolls.
Further more, I don't think Flash has been wise with words like Jaedong or Bisu, despite having similar levels of repercussion for every little thing he says. Stork is another icon who created unnecessary drama for himself by being too open with his personal opinions, instead of taking a second to avert avoidable hassle.
I think this issue is more of a dynamic Flash has created between himself and his anti-fans, than anything that is truly related to the actual balance of the game itself. Every legend of the game gets undeserved provocation from their followers, and it is part of being a public figure. Not everyone deals with it in the most prudent manner, and with greater opportunities of the constant back and forth that comes with streaming, every little possible interaction that could go wrong gets amplified to a greater degree. I personally think this has been one of those cases.
I see 뱅피셜 every day lmao. I like stork's open book policy but it fuels meme train so hard.
On November 29 2017 05:44 NoS-Craig wrote: Damn, I didn't think that Tinyland video did that much damage. I've liked his videos so far to.
I thought it was fun and reflective of what was going on in korea
trust me, this tesagi meme is hot as fuck in korea. Its not tinyland video doing damage, its just showing glimpse of monster of what Sea's tesagi meme became
On November 28 2017 01:48 Deimos wrote: This is the video on Iris youtube channel about SAviOr Return .. a translation will be great, but i think is only to create controversy
savior is streaming on a platform designed for 18+ cam girls lololol its the only broadcasting service that hasn't blocked him from streaming apparently the pros on afreeca who hit savior on ladder just leave the game
Iris said on his YouTube channel that this is likely hoax anyway since in order to promote site, saviOr would be broadcasting immediately but haven't yet since it's inception.
Iris said on his YouTube channel that this is likely hoax anyway since in order to promote site, saviOr would be broadcasting immediately but haven't yet since it's inception.
On December 09 2017 07:53 Jingered wrote: Is anyone still interested in having videos translated? I'm interested in working on some and making some cash on the side while I'm on my break.
Jingered wow that's great! Of course everyone is interested in having videos translated Please sub the protoss videos, just look on the first page there are so so many zerg and terran videos translated and almost none of protoss... I saw there are a lot of stork videos but only 2-3 are translated
Today I found out that Last, one of the top Terrans from Korea is also making some guides which are uploaded to his youtube channel, and he also translated some of the videos to English ON HIS OWN I think it is great that he is thinking about foreign fans, hopefully more koreans will reach out to foreign community. Also we should support their youtube channels as much as we can so they will start noticing us~!
Here are videos translated to English (I found 5): + Show Spoiler +
If these videos were linked in this thread then I am sorry, but they aren't in opening post and I didn't bother to search thorugh whole thread. BTW. I think someone should take over this thread and at least update the main post, because a lot of great translated videos are being linked but then get lost in all those pages.
BTW2: Last is also streaming his games on twitch, so it is easier for foreigners to support him. You can watch it here https://www.twitch.tv/last1225
On December 11 2017 22:00 Netto. wrote: Today I found out that Last, one of the top Terrans from Korea is also making some guides which are uploaded to his youtube channel, and he also translated some of the videos to English ON HIS OWN I think it is great that he is thinking about foreign fans, hopefully more koreans will reach out to foreign community. Also we should support their youtube channels as much as we can so they will start noticing us~!
Uhm what do you mean? All those vids are in korean. Or do you mean that he translated the title of some of the videos? o.O
On January 09 2018 16:22 Netto. wrote: No, in my post I linked 5 videos that are translated. They have english subs. Maybe you have to turn subtitles in youtube player to see them.
Oh my bad. Thanks, awesome.
Need to subscribe and send thank you messages so he keeps doing them.
When watching Flash's guide, he keeps saying that he's going to make lots of them. It would be really awesome to get them translated.
Given that it takes quite a lot of work to translate, maybe we could pool some money together and donate to translator or something? I'd be willing to chip in, but I don't think I'm the right person to organize it.
Similar to how people pool donations for various tournaments, we should start something for translations of guides. Suggestions?
On January 17 2018 21:13 StylishVODs wrote: When watching Flash's guide, he keeps saying that he's going to make lots of them. It would be really awesome to get them translated.
Given that it takes quite a lot of work to translate, maybe we could pool some money together and donate to translator or something? I'd be willing to chip in, but I don't think I'm the right person to organize it.
Similar to how people pool donations for various tournaments, we should start something for translations of guides. Suggestions?
I would be willing to do more if it wasn't for midn numbing subbing process
Translating itself takes 40-50 minutes, subbing takes like legit 3-4 hours. I hate it.
On January 17 2018 21:13 StylishVODs wrote: When watching Flash's guide, he keeps saying that he's going to make lots of them. It would be really awesome to get them translated.
Given that it takes quite a lot of work to translate, maybe we could pool some money together and donate to translator or something? I'd be willing to chip in, but I don't think I'm the right person to organize it.
Similar to how people pool donations for various tournaments, we should start something for translations of guides. Suggestions?
I would be willing to do more if it wasn't for midn numbing subbing process
Translating itself takes 40-50 minutes, subbing takes like legit 3-4 hours. I hate it.
Maybe voice translate with some pauses if needed and some else can at some point turn it into subtitles?
As for Flash's last vid, that's his respone to DT drop. Getting some more gems like this about various responses with standard play would be invaluable to the foreign community.
On January 17 2018 21:13 StylishVODs wrote: When watching Flash's guide, he keeps saying that he's going to make lots of them. It would be really awesome to get them translated.
Given that it takes quite a lot of work to translate, maybe we could pool some money together and donate to translator or something? I'd be willing to chip in, but I don't think I'm the right person to organize it.
Similar to how people pool donations for various tournaments, we should start something for translations of guides. Suggestions?
He has about 23 so far of the newbie tutorial series
Not all of them are on par with first 2 I translated but a lot of them keep up the standard.
I'm not too sure about voice thing. I think subs are way to go but it's just that subbing process itself sucks ass
He has about 23 so far of the newbie tutorial series
Not all of them are on par with first 2 I translated but a lot of them keep up the standard.
I'm not too sure about voice thing. I think subs are way to go but it's just that subbing process itself sucks ass
That info needs to reach foreign bw community! So whats the easiest way to do this then?
Can anyone volanteer to organize donations? I don't know how to do it but I'd be willing to donate.
Also, do you know if he has any guides for experienced players? One can learn a lot from just watching their streams, but it would help so much to be able to understand their thought process and exactly what they're reacting to etc. One can not copy everything of course but I feel that if anyone know the accurate responses to almost anything during standard play its Flash.
He has about 23 so far of the newbie tutorial series
Not all of them are on par with first 2 I translated but a lot of them keep up the standard.
I'm not too sure about voice thing. I think subs are way to go but it's just that subbing process itself sucks ass
That info needs to reach foreign bw community! So whats the easiest way to do this then?
Can anyone volanteer to organize donations? I don't know how to do it but I'd be willing to donate.
Also, do you know if he has any guides for experienced players? One can learn a lot from just watching their streams, but it would help so much to be able to understand their thought process and exactly what they're reacting to etc. One can not copy everything of course but I feel that if anyone know the accurate responses to almost anything during standard play its Flash.
Fellow progamers have come out and said flash's guide taught them something new watching them over.
Majority part of flash's guides are movements and is line of thinking where his armies are as well as optimization and focus. It should help people of all skill I think.
I am sure people will be willing to put together subbing here. Voice recording would probably be really easy for you. Can post a voice recording and then community members here can upload a sub version of the video based off of the voice recording
On January 17 2018 21:13 StylishVODs wrote: When watching Flash's guide, he keeps saying that he's going to make lots of them. It would be really awesome to get them translated.
Given that it takes quite a lot of work to translate, maybe we could pool some money together and donate to translator or something? I'd be willing to chip in, but I don't think I'm the right person to organize it.
Similar to how people pool donations for various tournaments, we should start something for translations of guides. Suggestions?
He has about 23 so far of the newbie tutorial series
Not all of them are on par with first 2 I translated but a lot of them keep up the standard.
I'm not too sure about voice thing. I think subs are way to go but it's just that subbing process itself sucks ass
Me, and I think quite a few people would chip in for having something like that translated. How about something like kickstarter or anything
On January 17 2018 21:13 StylishVODs wrote: When watching Flash's guide, he keeps saying that he's going to make lots of them. It would be really awesome to get them translated.
Given that it takes quite a lot of work to translate, maybe we could pool some money together and donate to translator or something? I'd be willing to chip in, but I don't think I'm the right person to organize it.
Similar to how people pool donations for various tournaments, we should start something for translations of guides. Suggestions?
He has about 23 so far of the newbie tutorial series
Not all of them are on par with first 2 I translated but a lot of them keep up the standard.
I'm not too sure about voice thing. I think subs are way to go but it's just that subbing process itself sucks ass
Me, and I think quite a few people would chip in for having something like that translated. How about something like kickstarter or anything
This thread already has some kind of system like that with set rate.
Problem I face is hardsubbing/whatever subbing after on any form takes more time than actual translating tho. Voice or not, it's all similiar process finding x time to y time
I sent a thank you message to Last's YouTube account for his English translations and he answered thanks. So he definitely reads his messages. I would suggest you all go thank him for his English translations and maybe he will make more =)
Yes it absolutely awesome;) Imagine if we had this in like 2008. I just wish I knew korean so I could help translate for the community. But it feels a bit late picking it up from start now o.O I aslo sent messages to FlaSh, lets hope he responds!
Foreign terrans need it though, haven't seen much foreign terran domination in a while heh Specially for TvP
I didn't saw that VODs so I decide to put the links here. These VODs are already with translated and they have english subs. The 1st one is TvZ +1 5rax build by Last. + Show Spoiler +
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nE3PtaQedR8
The second one is as he calls "OP (Blizzard pls nerf) build" Double Command Center straight into 5 Factory Goliaths! + Show Spoiler +
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bkDAYLBvgLA
As long as you know this build, you'll be able to beat Zerg who are one tier better than you! Enjoy!
On January 30 2018 08:20 Alpha-NP- wrote: We really need a new project manager to step up and takeover this awesome project. I respect that the original is busy with real life.
Can't really go ahead if there isn t any participants tho.
On February 08 2018 02:43 orvinreyes wrote: 2/6/18 Flash loses to Z when attempting 1/1/1 then explains something in detail... would be interesting to know his thoughts
He says that 1-1-1 has the zerg guessing as to either Wraith or Dropship from the Starport, but on the flipside wether Zerg is making Drones, Lings, or fast Mutas it's also a guessing game for the Terran. He says thet he misjudged the Z's intentions, and should have had Wraith on standby. Also in this scenario he needs 3 turrets instead of 2, but in case the Zerg in fact makes Drones and not attacking units, is puts the Terran behind.
Sadly what you probably want to know is the Larva management theory he explains around the 14 minute mark, both my SC and Korean language knowladge are not enough for that, I'm sorry I only got that it's some play from 2009, 2 hatch Lair with a delayed 3rd Hatch at 18, so not really a 2 hatch, makes Mutas come out faster
Sorry to post this here, but I was really curious about what Stork, Sea and Larva said about the matchfixing issue, I saw this on the day the news broke out. I just want to understand the general things that they said. Thank you!
On March 20 2018 00:28 Kawal wrote: Sorry to post this here, but I was really curious about what Stork, Sea and Larva said about the matchfixing issue, I saw this on the day the news broke out. I just want to understand the general things that they said. Thank you!
it was just discussing general matchfixing procedures, how brokers go to progamers, and how progamers made profit beyond the initial payment ect.
savior and other matchfixers most likely did NOT only get 2k/4k for their troubles. Theres so much potential of making money in utilizing betting sites and knowledge of matchfixing.
Hello, would be great to know Flash's thoughts on hero vs Mind especially games 1 and 5 on Third World, seeing how much struggle Terran had vs zerg. Thank you!
FBH explains some really cool micro trick with flying units. This should be essential for ZvZ. Is that a new thing? If so, would be really valuable to translate it
On August 02 2018 22:53 angrypofke wrote: FBH explains some really cool micro trick with flying units. This should be essential for ZvZ. Is that a new thing? If so, would be really valuable to translate it
I’ve had this a lot of times totally unintentional myself and I wondered why some of my air units didn’t accelerate but instead had full speed instantly xD I can’t imagine that this is useful in an actual melee game. It seems to take a few extra clicks in order to get it done and by that time your units accelerated naturally and are up to full speed by the time you abused that trick while you can spend apm somewhere else.
you right click on the ground with your scourge then at a different location from where you just clicked you shift click 3times without moving your cursor between the 3 clicks, then the next time that unit moves it moves at full speed.
I shared this on fbw but I'm gonna post here as well
So if you guys arent aware yet, meta for tvp has been for past half a year been BUNKER FE with factory and fast armory. The build was made in response to fast expanding protoss while maintaining ability to punish nexus first that has become popular, unlike rax re, that could not. It then focuses on getting fast armory and second factory up while going goliaths to defend vs reavers and drops as well as to safely take 3rd against bulldog attempts.
It then sacrifices map control in order to push out with as fast of 200 as possivle with fast 2/1
It also has 1 factort 1 starport variation where it involves 4 vulture drop with fast armory
Flashs official tutorial:
. Bunker FE vs expanding protoss
2. Bunker FE vs no-natural protoss 3. Bunker FE fakeout into 2 factory
tvp- bunker FE vs standard 9 depo 11 rax 12 gas 13 scout (N search) 15 depo(with rax scv) @88 gas -2 scv 17 factory-> start marine (total 3, 2 if cross pos) 22 CC (low ground)+ add on + 1 gas (2 on gas) /// 23 CC if 3 marine 23 bunker /// after depo if 3 marine 24 depo+1 gas (total 3) 27 aca -2nd tank checkpoint- 32 armory @2nd tank 2nd gas @ 2nd tank 38 2x scan asap 2nd factory +1 when armory done siege mode after 2nd factory scan @ 7 minute (first goliath) - 3 gate=not reaver - 2 gate=cannot rule out reaver 3rd cc starport @ 50% +1+ebay (~72) After 4 goliaths-> 3rd factory, start vulture science facility @ 100% starport+ 2nd armory Vulture speed after 3rd save up gas for 9 factories as soon as gas allows ~~ begin building depo 3 at a time, produce 8 vulture, 1 tank constantly) After 9 factory built->add on+vessel After vessel->mine upgrade push out as vessel pops, 4th and 5th cc, +1 addon
TvP bunker fe vs nonstandard (dont see natural) 9 depo 11 rax 12 gas 13 scout (N search) 15 depo(with rax scv) @88 gas -2 scv 17 factory-> start marine (total 3, 2 if cross pos) 22 CC (low ground)+ add on + 1 gas (2 on gas) /// 23 CC if 3 marine 23 bunker /// after depo if 3 marine 24 depo+1 gas (total 3) 27 ebay ///29 if 3 marine ------- INSTEAD OF ACA 30 siege mode -dragoon range or not range?- A. If dragoon range and hitting bunker Get academy B. If dragoon is not hitting bunker Get Turret 35 Academy 41 supply depo 41 armory 43 factory 2nd gas 2x scan 46 3rd cc after scanning -Scan decisions- A. Reaver -Turret at natural to delay until goliath comes out -Goliath range -get 3rd off of 2 fact goliath tank (~6 goliath) -Turret ring after 3rd CC B. Fast arbitor (2 base arbitor) -2x factory add on after 1 goliath + mine upgrade -go up to 4 factory -speed upgrade -starport @ 50% +1 - get 6 goliath - goliath range after mines
On January 07 2019 19:43 jinjin5000 wrote: I shared this on fbw but I'm gonna post here as well
So if you guys arent aware yet, meta for tvp has been for past half a year been BUNKER FE with factory and fast armory. The build was made in response to fast expanding protoss while maintaining ability to punish nexus first that has become popular, unlike rax re, that could not. It then focuses on getting fast armory and second factory up while going goliaths to defend vs reavers and drops as well as to safely take 3rd against bulldog attempts.
It then sacrifices map control in order to push out with as fast of 200 as possivle with fast 2/1
It also has 1 factort 1 starport variation where it involves 4 vulture drop with fast armory
tvp- bunker FE vs standard 9 depo 11 rax 12 gas 13 scout (N search) 15 depo(with rax scv) @88 gas -2 scv 17 factory-> start marine (total 3, 2 if cross pos) 22 CC (low ground)+ add on + 1 gas (2 on gas) /// 23 CC if 3 marine 23 bunker /// after depo if 3 marine 24 depo+1 gas (total 3) 27 aca -2nd tank checkpoint- 32 armory @2nd tank 2nd gas @ 2nd tank 38 2x scan asap 2nd factory +1 when armory done siege mode after 2nd factory scan @ 7 minute (first goliath) - 3 gate=not reaver - 2 gate=cannot rule out reaver 3rd cc starport @ 50% +1+ebay (~72) After 4 goliaths-> 3rd factory, start vulture science facility @ 100% starport+ 2nd armory Vulture speed after 3rd save up gas for 9 factories as soon as gas allows ~~ begin building depo 3 at a time, produce 8 vulture, 1 tank constantly) After 9 factory built->add on+vessel After vessel->mine upgrade push out as vessel pops, 4th and 5th cc, +1 addon
TvP bunker fe vs nonstandard (dont see natural) 9 depo 11 rax 12 gas 13 scout (N search) 15 depo(with rax scv) @88 gas -2 scv 17 factory-> start marine (total 3, 2 if cross pos) 22 CC (low ground)+ add on + 1 gas (2 on gas) /// 23 CC if 3 marine 23 bunker /// after depo if 3 marine 24 depo+1 gas (total 3) 27 ebay ///29 if 3 marine ------- INSTEAD OF ACA 30 siege mode -dragoon range or not range?- A. If dragoon range and hitting bunker Get academy B. If dragoon is not hitting bunker Get Turret 35 Academy 41 supply depo 41 armory 43 factory 2nd gas 2x scan 46 3rd cc after scanning -Scan decisions- A. Reaver -Turret at natural to delay until goliath comes out -Goliath range -get 3rd off of 2 fact goliath tank (~6 goliath) -Turret ring after 3rd CC B. Fast arbitor (2 base arbitor) -2x factory add on after 1 goliath + mine upgrade -go up to 4 factory -speed upgrade -starport @ 50% +1 - get 6 goliath - goliath range after mines
A bit late but thanks for the write-up dude. Helped me a lot
On January 07 2019 19:43 jinjin5000 wrote: I shared this on fbw but I'm gonna post here as well
So if you guys arent aware yet, meta for tvp has been for past half a year been BUNKER FE with factory and fast armory. The build was made in response to fast expanding protoss while maintaining ability to punish nexus first that has become popular, unlike rax re, that could not. It then focuses on getting fast armory and second factory up while going goliaths to defend vs reavers and drops as well as to safely take 3rd against bulldog attempts.
It then sacrifices map control in order to push out with as fast of 200 as possivle with fast 2/1
It also has 1 factort 1 starport variation where it involves 4 vulture drop with fast armory
tvp- bunker FE vs standard 9 depo 11 rax 12 gas 13 scout (N search) 15 depo(with rax scv) @88 gas -2 scv 17 factory-> start marine (total 3, 2 if cross pos) 22 CC (low ground)+ add on + 1 gas (2 on gas) /// 23 CC if 3 marine 23 bunker /// after depo if 3 marine 24 depo+1 gas (total 3) 27 aca -2nd tank checkpoint- 32 armory @2nd tank 2nd gas @ 2nd tank 38 2x scan asap 2nd factory +1 when armory done siege mode after 2nd factory scan @ 7 minute (first goliath) - 3 gate=not reaver - 2 gate=cannot rule out reaver 3rd cc starport @ 50% +1+ebay (~72) After 4 goliaths-> 3rd factory, start vulture science facility @ 100% starport+ 2nd armory Vulture speed after 3rd save up gas for 9 factories as soon as gas allows ~~ begin building depo 3 at a time, produce 8 vulture, 1 tank constantly) After 9 factory built->add on+vessel After vessel->mine upgrade push out as vessel pops, 4th and 5th cc, +1 addon
TvP bunker fe vs nonstandard (dont see natural) 9 depo 11 rax 12 gas 13 scout (N search) 15 depo(with rax scv) @88 gas -2 scv 17 factory-> start marine (total 3, 2 if cross pos) 22 CC (low ground)+ add on + 1 gas (2 on gas) /// 23 CC if 3 marine 23 bunker /// after depo if 3 marine 24 depo+1 gas (total 3) 27 ebay ///29 if 3 marine ------- INSTEAD OF ACA 30 siege mode -dragoon range or not range?- A. If dragoon range and hitting bunker Get academy B. If dragoon is not hitting bunker Get Turret 35 Academy 41 supply depo 41 armory 43 factory 2nd gas 2x scan 46 3rd cc after scanning -Scan decisions- A. Reaver -Turret at natural to delay until goliath comes out -Goliath range -get 3rd off of 2 fact goliath tank (~6 goliath) -Turret ring after 3rd CC B. Fast arbitor (2 base arbitor) -2x factory add on after 1 goliath + mine upgrade -go up to 4 factory -speed upgrade -starport @ 50% +1 - get 6 goliath - goliath range after mines
I'm wondering what kind of trash talk is yellow doing about elky? Seems like he was imitating elky's bad accent or smth? lol would be interesting to know
Just letting you guys I am pretty much done on trying to subtitle Snow guides and will be posting links on discord and here just so you guys can see it I guess.
I've waited 3+ weeks on lastest video submission and it hasn't been accepted yet, and other 2 video submission has been on limbo since August. It's same since I planned to do way more than 3 videos and at least 2+ videos subbed per week if Snow did accept my subs since Snow pumps out really good stuff, but I do have to say I am giving up after it being on limbo for months.
It's not Snow's fault per say, since he is aware of situation and did accept subs and communicated with me that he sent the files over to his youtube manager multiple times. It's just that it's been stuck i nthis limbo for months on getting through to his youtube video manager, and that's understandable since video editor is probably swamped with work and is busy full on with korean side of things.
These videos are unlisted so that it will minimize damage from Snow's youtube perspective.
so here they are: #1: StarCraft's "2nd Golden Age"... Will Blizzard Take Action? [Pros Talk]
#2: How was the food in BW Progaming Teamhouse?
#3: Why Pros Aren't Allowed to "Enjoy" the Game [subbed]
--- Also on other note, Least is trying to get started on translating protoss guides project, and is hoping to recruit people who are interested in funding private guides. He's asking if anyone in community is interested in contribution/suggestions/watching protoss guides.
EPT
It would be interesting to know what they think. Although I might be mistaken because of obs games xP
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