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If you derail this thread to argue about SC2 vs BW in any context other than that of the interview (e.g. saying things like "colosi suck" or "all BW fans are elitist jerks!"), I will ban you for at least a week, if not more. This is your only warning. I added this page 17
You have been warned
~GMarshal |
On May 24 2012 10:37 baubo wrote:Show nested quote +On May 24 2012 10:16 windsupernova wrote:On May 24 2012 10:09 empty.bottle wrote:On May 24 2012 10:05 Release wrote:+ Show Spoiler +this became a shitstorm because some guy came in and said SC2 not that bad, and ... yes it is... Boom This and because an idiot said something like "Stork has subtle motives to make the claims that he did" just not that straight. Well, to be fair(and please correct me if I am wrong) doesn't he? Hasn't it always been an issue that players that are not doing that well will struggle? My guess is that Stork only spoke about it now since an hypothetical SC2 switch endangers his good position in the current BW status Quo. There are two things very wrong with this line of thought. 1. Stork's argument has nothing to do with having an SC2 switch. It has to do with how it's handled, and how players had absolutely no say in it. He's not saying "No to SC2," He's saying "If you're going to make a switch, at least do it in a manner that makes it easier on the players and the fans." 2. Whether or not Stork has a motive does not change the validity of his statement. Everyone always has a motive. Perhaps Stork was speaking for himself. Perhaps on behalf of some of his teammates. Perhaps a lot of them. So what? Is he factually incorrect? If not, why does it matter? It's clear from any BW fan reading interviews over the years that most players are afraid to say anything beyond PC answers. You really need a top player like Stork to raise any sort of awareness of behind the scenes stuff.
But I didn't say nor try to imply any of that. He has a good point, regardless of motives and his statement is more about KESPA treating players opnions as non important.What I was saying is that Stork probably felt the need to say this now because of the stress caused by the SC2 implementation.
But yeah I read the original post by that guy and it was a trollish comment. Dunno why people responded him
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Canada11363 Posts
On May 24 2012 11:29 Absurdly wrote:Show nested quote +On May 23 2012 06:50 Ryo wrote:
It might not matter to players who earn a lot of money but as a whole, if the top players and middle ranking players don't do well at SC2, it is the end for them.
Just this sentence irks me a little. Like he said, it's the fans that allow esports to exist, and with the declining fan base of BW they are switching to SC2 right? So if the BW players can't compete in SC2 what exactly does he expect? Kespa to support them regardless? If the players aren't good enough, that's their own problem.
Well if it's fan bases they are concerned about, they are switching from a relatively large Korean fanbase (if declining) for a considerably smaller Korean fanbase so I dunno why this would irk.
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 kespa
stork's current batte: 
I hope that: 
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wow, stork's passion for the game shines whenever he speaks.
my heart skipped a beat.
stork just became my favorite player. keep on speaking up.
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He is playing senior now. I like this guy. But the problem I think with scbw progamers is that they are too young to validly form a union, I mean most of then are not even high school right?
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I was going to come in and say something callous about it being a little late in the game for all this talk about starting a players association. Maybe make a witty comment about switching to starcraft 2.
But damn, storks pain and guts really made me stop and think. The poor guy sees himself and his teammates who worked so hard being partially abandoned by their own league, as well as former spokesmen like boxer.
I may need to start watching brood war again.
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This thread made me think that there's some serious meme potential pasting BW guys' heads into the Council of Elrond scene in Fellowship of the Ring.
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Such class.
I've always been the biggest Stork fan, back when he was still zitty and awkward. He always seemed to me to be the most gentleman in the TBLS. Bisu might seem petty and distant, Jaedong overly dramatic, and Flash a bit arrogant, but Stork is always level-headed and respectful.
Stork my boy, I volunteer pro bono to represent you in this union or vs. and in your commitments and engagements to Kespa. The issue on the Players' Union has some outright obstacles. One thing is the ages of the players. There have to have a waiver of some in order to be legally represented in the court of law and on their interests. Second, the contracts have to be redrafted since I think the players contracts are drafted on the assumption that exclusivity exists between the teams/kespa and their players, and not the players as an entity separately. There are a lot more, but this is a good start.
Stork initiating this endeavor is only appropriate.
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On May 24 2012 11:29 Absurdly wrote:Show nested quote +On May 23 2012 06:50 Ryo wrote:
It might not matter to players who earn a lot of money but as a whole, if the top players and middle ranking players don't do well at SC2, it is the end for them.
Just this sentence irks me a little. Like he said, it's the fans that allow esports to exist, and with the declining fan base of BW they are switching to SC2 right? So if the BW players can't compete in SC2 what exactly does he expect? Kespa to support them regardless? If the players aren't good enough, that's their own problem.
Because they signed their life away to play BW. Now that Kespa is changing the game, they should at least have the consideration to consult the players on how such a huge change should be brought about. But they didn't, not once. And yet the new format creates a huge burden on the players. They've got less than 5 months to prove how good they are at SC2 but under the current circumstances, the players can't put in their full effort at preparing for SC2. If Proleague had been delayed until OSL ends in late July, then the players would have had more preparation time.
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just to clarify to those who lack reading comprehension,
stork isn't saying he's anti-sc2, he's voicing his disapproval with the way KESPA is handling the transition from bw to sc2, especially with respect to KESPA's disregard for the progamers in this process.
god usually TL standards are much higher than fomos but even fomos seems to be doing better these days GOD DAMN
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just my thoughts
like many other things, i hate how kespa is handling things and kudos to stork for speaking up
playing devil's advocate though, it's as if this is kespa's line of thinking: there's nothing that can be done with bw losing popularity... we can continue with bw, but as it is, who knows how long we can keep going (problem with sponsors, both league and for team8)... to try and salvage what we can, we should take a gamble and go for sc2 asap... as for the players, it's best for their mentality to accept the change... getting upset won't do anything...
for the players, i know it's unfair because they signed up for BW and now kespa is switching to sc2... but kespa thinks though that bw is going to die anyway, they're thinking is that we'll try and keep esports going by switching to sc2, which for them is better than these players outright losing any opportunity to continue with their teams as professional gamers
still, as stork mentioned and many have pointed out... they should at least have had the courtesy to consult the players... especially with the timeline of the switch
i've made a blog before that says that i've realized that for these guys, this is nothing more than a kid's game for them... a very popular kid's game that can be a decent business... they don't treat it as seriously compared to if it's a true adult's sport... sadly it seems this really is true... for kespa, these guys are just kids who don't know what's good for them...
** now whether kespa fucked up in the first place - through alienating fans/players (which caused bw's decline) - that is another matter altogether
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Stork speaking his mind, loving it
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I believe stork has seen better days and this year it isn't one of them...
![[image loading]](http://i56.tinypic.com/6tfloh.jpg)
"Looking forward to a bright future and my passion"
Just compared to op picture and this one and you can see the huge difference .
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/AYw9I.jpg)
"This is like I am putting up a fake smile for the camera and saying I don't know whether I will do well in sc2 and if I don't I have to retire "
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On May 24 2012 19:14 hmmm... wrote:
just to clarify to those who lack reading comprehension,
stork isn't saying he's anti-sc2, he's voicing his disapproval with the way KESPA is handling the transition from bw to sc2, especially with respect to KESPA's disregard for the progamers in this process.
god usually TL standards are much higher than fomos but even fomos seems to be doing better these days GOD DAMN
fyi Stork said months ago, long before the switch, that he prefers LoL to SC2...
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On May 24 2012 20:43 Elroi wrote:Show nested quote +On May 24 2012 19:14 hmmm... wrote:
just to clarify to those who lack reading comprehension,
stork isn't saying he's anti-sc2, he's voicing his disapproval with the way KESPA is handling the transition from bw to sc2, especially with respect to KESPA's disregard for the progamers in this process.
god usually TL standards are much higher than fomos but even fomos seems to be doing better these days GOD DAMN fyi Stork said months ago, long before the switch, that he prefers LoL to SC2...
Yes, but even if that was his silent motive behind his public complain, what he say does makes sense (at least to me).
And the discussion here should be about the legitimacy of what he said, the problem he adresses and possible solutions,
and not why he said it.
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On May 24 2012 20:43 Elroi wrote:Show nested quote +On May 24 2012 19:14 hmmm... wrote:
just to clarify to those who lack reading comprehension,
stork isn't saying he's anti-sc2, he's voicing his disapproval with the way KESPA is handling the transition from bw to sc2, especially with respect to KESPA's disregard for the progamers in this process.
god usually TL standards are much higher than fomos but even fomos seems to be doing better these days GOD DAMN fyi Stork said months ago, long before the switch, that he prefers LoL to SC2...
I will switch to LoL once Stork transition to that game just like how kamikami aka Bisu fan will switch to sc2 once bisu plays sc2.
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+ Show Spoiler +On May 24 2012 19:40 Sawamura wrote:I believe stork has seen better days and this year it isn't one of them... "Looking forward to a bright future and my passion"Just compared to op picture and this one and you can see the huge difference . "This is like I am putting up a fake smile for the camera and saying I don't know whether I will do well in sc2 and if I don't I have to retire "
There's nothing there that isn't explained by photoshop and maybe a good night's sleep. I have noticed that some players, including Jaedong, Fantasy, Stork, and sometimes Flash, tend to look like crap going into important matches. I might be wrong, but I think a lot of these guys half-kill themselves practicing for individual leagues.
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On May 24 2012 20:43 Elroi wrote:Show nested quote +On May 24 2012 19:14 hmmm... wrote:
just to clarify to those who lack reading comprehension,
stork isn't saying he's anti-sc2, he's voicing his disapproval with the way KESPA is handling the transition from bw to sc2, especially with respect to KESPA's disregard for the progamers in this process.
god usually TL standards are much higher than fomos but even fomos seems to be doing better these days GOD DAMN fyi Stork said months ago, long before the switch, that he prefers LoL to SC2...
Source? I don't think he ever said that. A few people attempted to manipulate his words on that OGN show towards their bias, similar to a few posts in this thread (hence the original quote) but he really didn't make a statement of preference. He said something like "If I start to suck I'll just switch to LoL or something" as a response to the OGN guys talking about how he plays so many other games.
I'm pretty sure Stork's point is there's just no avenue for communication with KeSPA about player's concerns, and that didn't just start when they added SC2 otherwise BoxeR wouldn't have been asking people for years to set up some sort of union like Stork is asking for here.
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I think players should have some sort of a union. Things like players getting disqualified for typing pp instead of ppp and getting DQ is really harsh.
The players put in a lot of work and they should get more say in things. Map pool is one of them.
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never was into broodwar but I totally can understand how the bw players feel
seeing how many bw pros are retiring and some are left to continue to fight in SC2, I really hope Kespa would let them have a better way to transition.
Maybe Lol is the better way to go, a growing scene and possibly more internationally popular right now
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EPT
