EPTBut try iccup and tell me if u see enough variance.
The fine art of "cheesing" - Page 2
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sataNik[pG]
Greece722 Posts
But try iccup and tell me if u see enough variance. | ||
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vOdToasT
Sweden2870 Posts
On October 14 2011 06:56 Kiante wrote: a good macro player will block your silly cheese and you'll get stalled at some point. Would be good to see the account you're "going up the ladder" on. But, do you really think you'll improve cheesing? You basically toss a coin and pray they dont scout/are prepared for whatever you're doing His point is that people with bad build orders that are exploited by abusive play call people cheesers and get mad, when they only have themselves to blame for it. If they were really good, their builds would be cheese proof. This guy is a baller by the way, he played vs korean pros in WCG. Also, he's not saying the korean scene is strategically stagnant, he is saying that foreigners on iCCup have stagnated. | ||
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sataNik[pG]
Greece722 Posts
what build was being used. I remember cheesing Yellow[arnc] 20 times in a row (every single one different cheese) and winning more than half of them. Was he mad? no. Was he a better player after those games? yes, more anticipation. Was i a better player? yes because i was categorising builds as effective/ineffective. Then again, kiante will call me a test dummy. | ||
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sataNik[pG]
Greece722 Posts
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TelecoM
United States10700 Posts
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XsebT
Denmark2980 Posts
You always remember some really good cheese! But cheesing would lose all its mystery and all its wow-factor, if it's done too often. It's balancing on a knife's edge. + Show Spoiler + ![[image loading]](http://img.dailygame.co.kr/news/201107/attachments/20110714_cda1107e28029358e846b1c628c2d73a.jpg) | ||
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sataNik[pG]
Greece722 Posts
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TelecoM
United States10700 Posts
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Sayle
United Kingdom3685 Posts
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Zergneedsfood
United States10671 Posts
On October 14 2011 07:59 Sayle wrote: Man I thought this was a troll or a clueless newbie until I saw it was sataNik. Now I'm hoping he'll cheese his way through ISL3. Confirmed so soon? woah woah woah | ||
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XsebT
Denmark2980 Posts
On October 14 2011 07:56 GGzerG wrote: Care to elaborate on that picture XsebT? not sure tbh... Dig deep my friendly G Some may seem to disagree But what's really wrong with a nice brie? Let me introduce to you, Horang2! | ||
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Sayle
United Kingdom3685 Posts
I wish. | ||
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zimp
Hungary958 Posts
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sataNik[pG]
Greece722 Posts
unless i spot greed ofc  | ||
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TelecoM
United States10700 Posts
EDIT : WTF? He did the most wild proxy gateway with DT i've ever seen, that is the most wildest gamble cheese I ever saw I think lol. | ||
ArvickHero
10387 Posts
On October 14 2011 07:20 sataNik[pG] wrote: Excuse me? 9/10 games pvz toss opens up with forge nexus. where are the numerous 1 base strats? or 2 gate exp? 4/5 games tvz terran goes 1 rax cc into mass m&m or mech. Where are the amazing 1 base plays: 1 rax acad fact pushes? 2 rax fact acad? or the 3 rax +1 sunk break timing? or the 2 rax m&m + dropship? or the vessel rush +1 m&m + tanks scoop? if u think these are invalid or weak strategies let me prove you wrong. almost every zerg goes for mutalisks tvz. nuff said excuse me? What you listed are openings, only a fraction of strategies. Openings are mostly mapped out because they're easy to calculate and figure out. The real fine strategy lies in the early-mid/midgame, which is still constantly evolving | ||
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kidd
United States2848 Posts
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Shiragaku
Hong Kong4308 Posts
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sataNik[pG]
Greece722 Posts
On October 14 2011 08:37 kidd wrote: I remember I played you 2 games in iccup. You cheesed in both lol. At least I won 1 game. Cheese is part of the game, but I think once you start doing it every single game it starts to get a little old and people will not like to play you. Boring it would be if it was the same kind of cheese every game. But this will be weak of course. For me it is boring to play 4 out of 5 games standard macrofest game (which also makes you tired). Ideal for me is something like: cheese 1/3 of games, get cheesed 1/3 and normal macro vs macro 1/3. This creates a dynamic balance which may eventually lead to other balances. But if someone is playing greedy, the proper punishment is aggression, which gives advantage, greed gives only equality. Think of it as rock paper scissors: cautious greed cheese cautious beats cheese cheese beats greed greed beats cautious I find that in the current metagame greed is too high and cheese is too low, which makes cautious play weak. This is the case because its often advised that the cure for greed is more greed and if greed gets punished by cheese, cheese doesnt take credit. | ||
2Pacalypse-
Croatia9530 Posts
 I sorta agree. A fine tuned, well prepared cheese is so awesome to watch and I agree that players on ICCup should play more "strategically" every now and then instead of solely working on their mechanics. But I also think that it's more fun to do these kind of things when you're playing against a same opponent for a lot of games, instead of random players on ladder. This way you can see each game how your opponent reacts and adapts to your "strategies". | ||
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