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How Protoss can beat Flash - Page 2

Forum Index > BW General
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Pulimuli
Profile Blog Joined February 2007
Sweden2766 Posts
May 12 2010 15:38 GMT
#21
On May 13 2010 00:25 Holgerius wrote:
It is not entirely impossible that someone could pull this off with a little luck. It's not a long term solution though. But it would be sexy as hell if someone did it once (would love to see Flash's face once he realizes his opponent has tanks XD), and I would definitely become a fan of the player who did it.


Pretty sure flash would rape the living daylights out of the protoss before he lets them get an assload of tanks? he's not that dumb
Deleted User 31060
Profile Blog Joined September 2007
3788 Posts
May 12 2010 15:40 GMT
#22
Nothing to see here...
Peaked at C- on ICCUP and proud of it! @Sunyveil
Kuzmorgo
Profile Joined May 2009
Hungary1058 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-05-12 15:48:56
May 12 2010 15:41 GMT
#23
Hahaha fun idea. But then you would have to beat Flash in TvT .. even worse if possible

Edit: Stork captured a drone in a PvZ once. Against ggplay if i remember correctly. But didnt produce too much units unfortunately . But he made zerglings for the (also stolen) defilers to consume .
One of the best games i've ever seen
"No, whine not! Play, or play not! There is no whine."
Pliers
Profile Joined October 2008
Canada42 Posts
May 12 2010 15:43 GMT
#24
Like I said, even the top tier tosses at the moment will need to practice to be able to pull this off. The timing will be in that brief time when toss is on more bases and maxed and terran isn't. Toss needs someway of defending their bases in late game and tanks is certainly the better solution than carriers.
hyst.eric.al
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
United States2332 Posts
May 12 2010 15:44 GMT
#25
flash doesnt let arbiters into his expansions, let alone shuttles. would be alot of fun though.

as promising as this is...its not
Leta , BeSt, Calm fan forever! 김정우, I am sorry I ever lost faith in you.
LegendaryZ
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States1583 Posts
May 12 2010 15:45 GMT
#26
A sledgehammer to the hands is probably the only thing Protoss could do at this point...
Pliers
Profile Joined October 2008
Canada42 Posts
May 12 2010 15:47 GMT
#27
On May 13 2010 00:38 Pulimuli wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 13 2010 00:25 Holgerius wrote:
It is not entirely impossible that someone could pull this off with a little luck. It's not a long term solution though. But it would be sexy as hell if someone did it once (would love to see Flash's face once he realizes his opponent has tanks XD), and I would definitely become a fan of the player who did it.


Pretty sure flash would rape the living daylights out of the protoss before he lets them get an assload of tanks? he's not that dumb


It wont take much longer than carriers switch at which time protoss is maxed and very rich. So instead of having just carriers toss will have a max p ground army and a few tanks.
Zealotdriver
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
United States1557 Posts
May 12 2010 15:48 GMT
#28
Lulz, don't use a shuttle to get the dark archons in. Use an Arbiter to recall them into the T base, spam mind control on the SCVs, then use an Arbiter in your base to recall.

However, it still wouldn't work. Flash would likely kill the archons and any protoss scvs with his defenses. Also, the time and resources required would give flash an opportunity to roflstomp the protoss before anything could be built.
Turn off the radio
The_Australian
Profile Blog Joined December 2007
Australia458 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-05-12 15:52:49
May 12 2010 15:52 GMT
#29
It wont take much longer than carriers switch at which time protoss is maxed and very rich. So instead of having just carriers toss will have a max p ground army and a few tanks.


Flash is really good at pushing right before carrier timing kicks in though. he doesnt let them get a few carriers, he destroys them while they're on the way. Also, wouldnt you think that if a shuttle could fly around to an undefended base then wouldn't protoss be doing this all day with storm or dt drops already?

I like ideas like this but they usually have the same problem

Cool idea --> oh noes, a pitfall, think about other tech to make it work (hallucinated shuttles for instance) --> Can't exist within the metagame --> not viable.
"Nothing should be unstoppable when you see it coming...." - Boxer
lowbright
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
308 Posts
May 12 2010 15:53 GMT
#30
The problem with this strategy is that although you have the resources for the strategy to be viable, flash's timing attack would come before the protoss would have sufficient time to make his way up the terran tech tree and have enough production buildings to make it worth doing. try it in a real game, you have to wait for a command center to build and for a barracks to be built. you would lose even more time since flash would know what you're doing and kill the scv as quickly as possible, which means you would have to waste more money and energy in getting another scv. it's a good idea in theory but would not be tenable in practice. Also, money is not infinite, making your way up the tech tree costs a lot of gas, i dont believe that people havent tried this already in a pro game house without failing.
TeamLiquid CJ Entusman #49
lazz
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
Australia3119 Posts
May 12 2010 15:56 GMT
#31
i think protoss just needs to make more units
RushWifDietCoke
Profile Joined May 2008
United States488 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-05-12 16:15:01
May 12 2010 15:57 GMT
#32
I think a better solution would be more stargates/gateways and more carriers/HTs. Carriers + HT's combination > all terran unit combinations. Getting a dark archon does seem to happen somewhat frequently though. I guess if the opportunity arises to do what you said it would be good but in no way could I see it becoming the new PvT metagame.

On May 13 2010 00:30 adelarge wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 13 2010 00:00 Pliers wrote:
Remember when the universal race imbalance was Protoss>Terran?

That certainly doesn't seem like that case anymore in professional sc. Why? Because terran has found counters and adapted to the array of 'abusive' late game units toss can produce.


http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/leagues/274_Shinhan_09-10_Proleague

PvT: 64-55 (53.8%)

Riiiight.

edit: But that strat does sound quite hilarious. No idea how would that work though.

But I remember there was a game where the toss stole SCV, made tanks and won, if I'm not mistaken.


I remember seeing that game too... ah damn if I could only remember who it was.

Edit: Found it, intotherainbow vs cloud. Great game in general for anyone who hasn't seen it but rainbow does exactly what you're talking about here. If you just want to see the tanks skip to part 3.


Nothing to it but to do it.
Pliers
Profile Joined October 2008
Canada42 Posts
May 12 2010 16:04 GMT
#33
On May 13 2010 00:52 The_Australian wrote:
Show nested quote +
It wont take much longer than carriers switch at which time protoss is maxed and very rich. So instead of having just carriers toss will have a max p ground army and a few tanks.


Flash is really good at pushing right before carrier timing kicks in though. he doesnt let them get a few carriers, he destroys them while they're on the way. Also, wouldnt you think that if a shuttle could fly around to an undefended base then wouldn't protoss be doing this all day with storm or dt drops already?

I like ideas like this but they usually have the same problem

Cool idea --> oh noes, a pitfall, think about other tech to make it work (hallucinated shuttles for instance) --> Can't exist within the metagame --> not viable.


Toss needs to sac some army to start making carriers, so say if you 6 carriers are being made that's 36 supply of 'dead' psi that's not your ground army. Once the carriers are finished (140 build time?) interceptors take more time, upgrades take more time. This large timing is when toss get's rolled because they have less army and can't even make more! With tanks, they can come out one at a time and still provide great defence and toss will not need to sacrifice any army at all.
YPang
Profile Blog Joined April 2007
United States4024 Posts
May 12 2010 16:16 GMT
#34
just accept the fact flash is the new bonjwa.
sMi.Gladstone | BW: B high| SC2: gold T_T
scDeluX
Profile Blog Joined October 2007
Canada1341 Posts
May 12 2010 16:26 GMT
#35
Indeed Hilarious Strats,

If you can manage to drop an expansion why not invest in killing it (or controling the area) instead of stealing an scv....
Brood War is forever
SubtleArt
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
2710 Posts
May 12 2010 16:27 GMT
#36
No....it doesn't work...no....
Morrow on ZvP: "I'm not very confident in general vs Protoss because of the imbalance (Yes its imbalanced, get over it)."
Mykill
Profile Blog Joined February 2009
Canada3402 Posts
May 12 2010 16:29 GMT
#37
If this strategy works...
well you dont even need to win. just do a decent job and you will be a superstar
[~~The Impossible Leads To Invention~~] CJ Entusman #52 The problem with internet quotations is that they are hard to verify -Abraham Lincoln c.1863
50bani
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
Romania480 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-05-12 16:31:40
May 12 2010 16:30 GMT
#38
No man it's simpler than that. You need to hide a citadel somewhere and do a speedlot timing rush cheese. He almost never goes mass vult harass like Fantasy so he will most likely fall the first time

1-0 so far, what next?

edit to add "almost"
I'm posting on twoplustwo because I have always been amazed at the level of talent that populates this site --- it's almost unparalleled on the Internet.
Crimson)S(hadow
Profile Blog Joined July 2007
Philippines631 Posts
May 12 2010 16:52 GMT
#39
all toss needs is T click T click T click T click 1a2a3a4a GG

jk on a more serious note i have a replay of a toss doing this and it worked really well, don't remember what its called though. there are many stray SCVS out there towards late game so you might not even need shuttles, but just like free vs hiya, its hard to avoid the SCV from getting killed by a group of vultures. how can you hide it from scans? once the scvs are gone you have to cancel the CC or wait another 150 seconds for another scv.

i think its just cuz flash is at his own level at the moment, so to beat flash i think protoss just need to kick it up a notch. janbgi storms, bisu multitasking, stork builds, nal_ra micro, the works.
"It's the end of the BW era which i devoted everything to for 10 years. I tried playing sc2, but my BW memories run too deep; I felt like I was playing an entirely different game" -ToSsGirL
tree.hugger
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
Philadelphia, PA10406 Posts
May 12 2010 17:14 GMT
#40
I'd imagine the last thing you'd want to do against (T)Flash as a protoss player is turn the match into a TvT.
ModeratorEffOrt, Snow, GuMiho, and Team Liquid
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